Gunner Mafia [Endgame]

[Hopkirk]

Idk if you remember, but discussion that was about wagon composition (scummy people on it).

I remember. I just wanted to add this on to my previous response when you asked me 'why do you keep pushing me for my

light townread

?'.

The resistance thing is either a scumslip, or easily explained at a ratio of maybe 90:10. In other news, it's two days to deadline and I've said i probably won't be online tomorrow. Given this, what would you expect me to do in this scenario? Not vote anybody, stay on a wagon that I don't like as much? This is a legitimate question.

I'm pretty sure srceen's comment was mostly about Pan's AtE. I don't think there's any correlation between that and

this

game or how it's a scumslip for

this

game.

So I'm very curious as to what your point here is.

You're claiming here the same thing Grey did, that I've just gone onto his wagon. I direct your attention to where I responded to Grey quoting that he's been one of my top two scumreads for a long time. I very much want to hear how you'll explain this position if it isn't a mistake.
The fact that you're able to miss that makes me very concerned about you now :/

Congratulations! You're voting someone you've already stated a scumread on.

What does this have to do with anything I just said?

-ever played resistance irl? There's a point. It's actually mechanically impossible to play without looking at your role pm due to part of how the game works.
-you just said that I was trying to justify it today, despite holding the read for almost a week. Do you seriously see no issue with Grey claiming I've only just jumped on him?

[Hopkirk]

-ever played resistance irl? There's a point. It's actually mechanically impossible to play without looking at your role pm due to part of how the game works.

I've never played Resistance, no.

Are you calling him a liar? There's currently a wagon on him and your vote isn't on it.

Otherwise, it's not directly related to this game, so what's your point?

-you just said that I was trying to justify it today, despite holding the read for almost a week. Do you seriously see no issue with Grey claiming I've only just jumped on him?

My issue isn't with you just voting Grey.

My issue is your interaction with srceen here and then going 'oh hey, let's forget about this potential scumtell and just push to end the day.' As well as potential correlations you may be trying to draw up between srceen and Grey here.

It's a scumslip or there's a reasonable explination.
It's fine to end the day before I hear since I expect GI to flip scum, and I expect me/screen to not be killed by scum.

[Hopkirk]

Screen isn't a townread anymore Thor.
Phone posting is hard.

Someone should meta me. I have a couple of obvious scumtells.

[Hopkirk]

Screen isn't a townread anymore Thor.
Phone posting is hard.

Someone should meta me. I have a couple of obvious scumtells.

> aware of meta
> tells us to look for scumtells to prove towniness

....wat

Absence.

@Brian- preferably your thoughts.

[Hopkirk]

3/3 so far, albeit late to each.

Ausuka kill is obviously not a multiball kill.

Claims and stuff likely break the game now imo.

Pan is confirmed town rather than a top townread now since Screen's scumslip was to attack Pan.
Intended to vote Screen but he'd been hammered when I got online.

[Hopkirk]

VOTE: The Worst
Tchill or Cheey look ok too.

[Hopkirk]

Pan being scum is not possible any more.

[Hopkirk]

roughly 2 scum vs 15 town prs including daykills and nightkills is game over.

[Hopkirk]

Although maybe not Tchill, I haven't reread him/Ausuka yet.

[Hopkirk]

More IC than he already was*

[Hopkirk]

I played resistance last night.
Didn't really want to play.
but
I said I'm not looking at my card. Everyone blew me off except one person. He made a big deal about it. I called him out as scum. He was scum.


Kind of funny i see it here in this iso.

Screen talking about Pan.
Unless Screen had some other explination, which I assume he would have said since i think i said I'd vote him if he couldn't explain it.

[Hopkirk]

Cheeky I'd lynch.
Chick I should reread interactions.
Brian's switch from you to Screen changing majority was a good point for town.

[Hopkirk]

VOTE: Cheeky

Small pool then maybe a deep.

[Hopkirk]

rceen, can you respond to these:
In post 3321, Hopkirk wrote:
In post 3210, Srceenplay wrote:
I played resistance last night.
Didn't really want to play.
but
I said I'm not looking at my card. Everyone blew me off except one person. He made a big deal about it. I called him out as scum. He was scum.


There's a pretty central mechanic that impossible if you mean what you sound like you mean. Please explain in your next post how you could play resistance without looking at your card.

Part of the way to win is to make others believe you are town. So it doesn’t matter if what your card says per say. Just play as town. Your team would still be playing to their win con. They would also know who you are by deduction.

In the simplest terms, Resistance involves two phases.
1.) Picking people to go on missions/voting on these.
2.) Going on missions.
Scum wins by failing 3/5 missions, town by passing 3/5.
Scum can put in a pass or fail during the mission, town must put in a pass.
It isn't possible to play without knowing your role as town must put in a pass card. Scum cannot win without knowing they are scum.
It's different to mafia in that regard.
Screen missed the vital aspect of the game that makes it impossible not view your role card.

[Hopkirk]

I played resistance last night.
Didn't really want to play.
but
I said I'm not looking at my card. Everyone blew me off except one person. He made a big deal about it. I called him out as scum. He was scum.


Kind of funny i see it here in this iso.

Screen talking about Pan.
Unless Screen had some other explination, which I assume he would have said since i think i said I'd vote him if he couldn't explain it.

He did explain it. What about it was a scumtell? If you thought it was a scumtell, why not pursue this over Grey?

Grey seemed legitimately scummy.
Screen was a lynchpool lurker with two small things I liked. Would have been ok with the lynch if a harder scummy player wasn't lynchable.
Other reads I had based on associations made Grey more likely than Screen.
Screen scum/Grey scum give competing views of the game.
I intended to switch to Screen if he didn't answer me, or if he answered badly on that point. He was hammered by the time I got online next.

[Hopkirk]

Oh Chick is Quick, I got that mixed up. She's town.

[Hopkirk]

Scum who never puts in a fail card is functionally equivilent to an extra town.
Town who put in a fail card are breaking core game rules.

Screen claimed it was possible to do something it's not possible to do in game to attack Pan, likely hoping nobody would realize it couldn't be done.

It's possible he could have said 'oh, I meant I was playing online and I'd look at the role after a couple of nights'. I would have doubted that because:
- I checked on site, and he wasn't playing there.
- It sounded like he meant playing irl.
- Checking your role card irl would be a lot trickier than online due to the fact you can see people/body language and stuff.
- Talking about people getting annoyed d1 is different to not checking d1/intent to check later.

-He didn't say that when I asked him, he dodged the question (or gave an answer that didn't explain things).

[Hopkirk]

Hmm. Idk. I don't think you ever checked back in so I'm not buying this response about 'would have moved over and lynched srceen.'

I have work, but I checked the thread (not sure if it was at lunch or end of the day), and there was a hammer down and thread was 'locked'

It doesn't actually matter whether you buy it or not since it's only a lie if I'm scum, so it becomes circular.

- If I'm town I'm telling the truth because why not.
- If I'm scum I'm lying for whatever reason (or telling the truth, which is a functional lie anyway in that scenario since the motive is different)

[Hopkirk]

Probably wouldn't have switched if GI was bigger.
Hammer was at 5.30 my time. Checked in when I got home from work and there'd been a hammer.
Although looks like deadline was earlier than I thought and I might have missed the opportunity anyway. Didn't check the timer.

[Hopkirk]

'Justing playing as a townie' is part of the problem.
It's equivilent to removing a scum and adding an extra town instead.
Unless it just meant looking at it at the start of the mission phase if there were two passes already, but that's also really stupid.

Plus, in practice unless with complete newbies, scum would assume someone misread their card and stop the game during the pregame identification stage.

[Hopkirk]

Can we wait until people give opinions on me before putting votes down there?

[Hopkirk]

Voting scum isn't a good way to find scum.
We've already found scum.
The problem is voting them.

Could you self vote and speed things up?

You are 100% confirmed scum to me right now. We need to 1v1. Anyone who votes outside of us from this point on is confirmed wolf. On a scale of one to infinity, you are infinitly scum. You need to flip to death and I will

pillage

your corpse for the towncred that will naturally follow from me being so so right about how terrible a thing you are. That's right, a thing, not a person. You can try and hide it all you want, but everyone with

eyes

can BLATENTLY see exactly what you are doing here. It makes me sick to even be having to case you for being obvious scum here. Anyone who isn't voting for Grey here should take a moment to consider whether they read their role pms wrong, because being scum is literally the only way you couldn't see exactly what kind of

SICK

game Greyice is trying to play here. The scum/wolf stench is so strong I can bearly bear actually voting with him. The association with that much scum in one place makes me feel like scum too. You are the scum

abyss

and even a glance makes me feel worse, let alone a gaze. The scumminess radiating from you in every direction makes me want to lynch you, and the people above and below you in the playerlist. I am shocked and appalled that you haven't been either lynched, or vigged already. It is simply inconcievable that you, scum incarnate, are still here right now.

They'll never suspect this

really is

a mutual hard bus.

Just quoting this. Please ignore.

[Hopkirk]

Not talk about who?

[Hopkirk]

Creature is obv town because he posted a word he only posts as town. It's not a specific word, but it's got ten thousand letters so it's close enough.

@Brian: just because I

could

post doesn't mean I will. For example, I'm perfectly able to post today but i haven't. If your argument relies on someone you've haven't met being the kind of person who catches up on and posts in all their mafia games the moment they get up then it's a bad argument. Some of us have lives. Not me, I'm just lazy, but the point still stands. If you can tell me what the point is it'd be very much appreciated.
(I was busy that evening)

[Hopkirk]

Are there obvious reasons that Spiffeh and Brigand are town?

@The Worst: why aren't you playing by your town meta here :/

[Hopkirk]

Cheeky, why aren't you pushing me if you're voting me? You aren't mentioning me.

[Hopkirk]

Are there obvious reasons that Spiffeh and Brigand are town?

@The Worst: why aren't you playing by your town meta here :/

I only really play my town meta as scum.
wincon > survivalism.

energy better spent.

fight me.

This doesn't really make sense unless you mean scum you is just town you but harder. What do you think I'm looking at in your meta?

[Hopkirk]

Cheeky, why aren't you pushing me if you're voting me? You aren't mentioning me.

I did when I voted you, you've still not explained your vote on me. Feel free to do so at any point.

'Your vote on me was terrible' isn't pushing very hard.

[Hopkirk]

@brian- just look at my read trajectory on grey. It isn't a vote I made out of nowhere.

Still good with checky.

[Hopkirk]

I should reread bee when I have time though.
Who said earlier about wagon on cheeky building quick probably meant scum. Didn't like that as not many scum so that meant like 6 town there minimum.

[Hopkirk]

@Brian- can you interact with specific people in regard to your read on me. Preferably someone you townread who townreads me. You'll just dismiss whatever I say here from confirm.bias

[Hopkirk]

For all we know the results is one shot. Dayvig/vig would also usually sir scum here. Maybe 6 but not more imo

[Hopkirk]

Resurrect*

Need to reread Nero sometime too

[Hopkirk]

Why's that at all worrying? You think mega bussing?

[Hopkirk]

I need a list of your townread since half of the requirements to be in that group is your townread on then

[Hopkirk]

I need to actually read Cheeky, Tchill, and Beeboy again and I will do that now.

[Hopkirk]

UNVOTE: Cheeky
Actually she's town here. 1562 especially is very townie (if i remember the right number).

[Hopkirk]

Tchill is probably town too.
I'd look at The Worst/Beeboy but mafiascum isn't working well right now.

[Hopkirk]

@Creature: could you save me time and explain why TW is crossed off?

[Hopkirk]

I'm only a lynch option to people who don't look for amazing soft claiming.

[Hopkirk]

Might try to look through The/brig/Brian tonight.

[Hopkirk]

Good point on 2.

Bins wagon isn't a good idea.
Brian is less town on a reread.

[Hopkirk]

Brian is less town on a reread.

Give reasons or this is nothing more than opportunism.

Your interactions with Screen/Ausuka aren't quite as I remember. Your trajectory on me is pretty meh.

Brigand seems legit.

[Hopkirk]

Still to read includes TW,Nero,Spiffeh.

[Hopkirk]

That's specifically what changed. Not everything.

[Hopkirk]

I am pretty sure Hopkirk is now calling Cheeky town, don't remember where his vote is, so;

@Hopkirk - if your current vote was exciting I feel I'd remember where it was, you better be voting Beeboy or you also need to pull out a drum and make yourself useful.

I unvoted (to read) in the post I called Cheeky town. Haven't revoted yet.

Thought BB claimed towngunner actually so need to reread there still I guess.

[Hopkirk]

Your interactions with Screen/Ausuka aren't quite as I remember. Your trajectory on me is pretty meh.

Be more specific? This feels more like you posturing a read change me as my lynch candidacy grows rather than you actually contributing worthwhile thoughts about me.

Didn't you refuse the last thing I asked you?


Council of Creature/Centipede/Gork decides who claims?

[Hopkirk]

Your interactions with Screen/Ausuka aren't quite as I remember. Your trajectory on me is pretty meh.

Be more specific? This feels more like you posturing a read change me as my lynch candidacy grows rather than you actually contributing worthwhile thoughts about me.

Didn't you refuse the last thing I asked you?

Why does him refusing to give info justify you doing so?
Either it was bad when he did it - in which case you shouldn't do it.
Or you should just openly claim you think it's fine not to explain your reads.

Pick one?

There's a pretty big difference between 'it' in regards to someone you're pushing and trying to get others to join you in lynching, and 'it' in regards to a read that I'm not voting.
I'm trying to review my reads right now. I think I've made that obvious.

[Hopkirk]

Like, I even said 'less town'. That doesn't necesarily mean scum, and however I intended it, you both took it one way.
Why was Thor town again?

[Hopkirk]

Fine no idea why we're lynching a lurker everyone town read at the start, when Hopkirk just scum claimed with his read shift on me AGAIN opportunistically following the crowds opinions of me.

Thor have you made a case on beebs yet? Link me please.

I was the second vote on you earlier I think?
There's still clear wagon potential on you. No need to throw that away.

[Hopkirk]

Not doing something isn't the same as being unable to do it.

[Hopkirk]

He/you aren't seeming interesting in my change on Cheeky or Tchill.

[Hopkirk]

Sorry AP. I was planning on shooting CT but she got lynched.
I should have put more effort into this d2 but game seemed close to over anyway.

[Hopkirk]

I was starting to townread Cheeky because it felt like things couldn't be this obvious and scum must be tricking us.