Gunner Mafia [Endgame]

[Brian Skies]

VOTE: SCREENPLAY

CheekyTeeky(2) ~ Nero Cain(2)

That typo in the username.

What a flawless defense.

[Brian Skies]

VOTE: CheekyTeeky

[Brian Skies]

awww I was hoping my vote would redirect to a player.

Why would you think this would happen?

[Brian Skies]

early reads are that creature is town, brian probably is too.

I think I'm being buddied.

[Brian Skies]

What is parity?

[Brian Skies]

early reads are that creature is town, brian probably is too.

I think I'm being buddied.

was I wrong, Brian?

I'm town, I just don't think I've done anything worthy of a townread.

[Brian Skies]

awww I was hoping my vote would redirect to a player.

Why would you think this would happen?

scumpost

VOTE: brian

These are good.

Why is this good?

[Brian Skies]

early reads are that creature is town, brian probably is too.

I think I'm being buddied.

was I wrong, Brian?

I'm town, I just don't think I've done anything worthy of a townread.

then why are you making remarks instead of voting me?

Should I be voting you?

[Brian Skies]

early reads are that creature is town, brian probably is too.

I think I'm being buddied.

was I wrong, Brian?

I'm town, I just don't think I've done anything worthy of a townread.

then why are you making remarks instead of voting me?

Should I be voting you?

if you scumread me, which you claim to, it follows you should be voting me.

I only said I thought you were buddying me, which I'm unsure of.

I don't think buddying is strictly something scum do. Even if I did, I don't actually know the reason(s) you're townreading me. I also don't know you, but that doesn't mean you couldn't know me (not that it really matters).

[Brian Skies]

VOTE: Bins

If only because I find this amusing.

[Brian Skies]

Both words are 4 letters long and share a common letter, must be the closest match~!

Wolf and Bins don't have a common letter though. What do you have to say to that?

[Brian Skies]

Is anyone else bothered by the fact mafia are flavored as wolves this game, but it's a mafia gunner and not a wolf gunner?

[Brian Skies]

Maybe the gunners automatically kill those who claim?

[Brian Skies]

I feel like there's going to be mafia and werewolves and when mafia flips people will say 'it's multiball' and other people will say 'they're clearly the same team due to mafia gunner'.

Other win conditions may or may not exist.

You may be onto something here.

But I'd rather not think about stuff like this unless we actually have a reason to.

[Brian Skies]

Spoiler:

awww I was hoping my vote would redirect to a player.

Why would you think this would happen?

scumpost

VOTE: brian

These are good.

Why is this good?

Yes.

Not following up here is why I voted brian btw. Gave minor impression he was asking qs without followng up.

You were clearly trolling me. How should I have followed up when there was nothing in your response to me to make me want to bother to continue talking to you?

[Brian Skies]

awww I was hoping my vote would redirect to a player.

Why would you think this would happen?

scumpost

VOTE: brian

awww I was hoping my vote would redirect to a player.

Why would you think this would happen?

scumpost

VOTE: brian

These are good.

awww I was hoping my vote would redirect to a player.

Why would you think this would happen?

very wolfy

Why is my post wolfy?

[Brian Skies]

Ok I'm all caught up

Brian Skies is easily the scummiest player in the game and should be wagoned/lynched

Why does 67 come from scum?

asking questions that don't really go anywhere

asking questions without really looking for a meaningful answer

Mafia Gunner
You control the account “Mafia Gunner” that’s in the game. It can’t be lynched, or targeted.

It counts for parity

, can vote, and during the first 5 minutes of every day can take a 20% dayvig at someone. It will be announced who it is shooting at. It will be announced during the start of the game that mafia have this role and it counts for parity and can’t be voted or targeted. You can vote with it twice per day- just let me know. If you die, it dies.

Town Gunner
You control the account “Town Gunner” that’s in the game. It can’t be lynched, or targeted.

It counts for parity

, can vote, and during the first 5 minutes of every day can take a 20% dayvig at someone. It will be announced who it is shooting at. It will be announced during the start of the game that a towns person has this role and it counts for parity and can’t be voted or targeted. You can vote with it twice per day- just let me know. If you die, it dies.

So these are the gunner role pms when amrock last modded this game.

5. The players named Town Gunner and Mafia Gunner cannot be voted or targetted.

They do not count for parity.

Town Gunner is a villager, and Mafia Gunner is a wolf.

The reason why I asked about parity is because the role PM's Beeboy quoted state the gunners count for parity. However, the rules for this game state that they don't. There is a difference between the two games, and I was curious if this was important.

I've heard of a parity cop, but I have no idea what parity is, and I couldn't find anything on the Wiki.

[Brian Skies]

@Cheeky:

In addendum to the above, why do you think me asking about parity is a towntell?

[Brian Skies]

VOTE: Brian skies

i lied i can buy the entry

Give me a reason that I should be voting Brian over Quick.

~The Observer

Is anyone else bothered by the fact mafia are flavored as wolves this game, but it's a mafia gunner and not a wolf gunner?

5. The players named Town Gunner and Mafia Gunner cannot be voted or targetted. They do not count for parity. Town Gunner is a villager, and

Mafia Gunner is a wolf.

willful misdirection?

y in the world would anyone think 162 was fluff?

I was making a joke regarding the Mafia Gunner's name. I think this is blatantly obvious by what I wrote and how I said it and Panopticon managed to figure out what I meant here.

Also yes, that is actually me fluff posting because I'm only in this game to enjoy myself (and if I can't do that, I'd rather not play).

I don't really understand what you mean by willful misdirection, unless you think I'm insinuating multiball, to which I've already made a response regarding that here:

I feel like there's going to be mafia and werewolves and when mafia flips people will say 'it's multiball' and other people will say 'they're clearly the same team due to mafia gunner'.

Other win conditions may or may not exist.

You may be onto something here.

But I'd rather not think about stuff like this unless we actually have a reason to.

[Brian Skies]

Ok I'm all caught up

Brian Skies is easily the scummiest player in the game and should be wagoned/lynched

You did the same thing in Gay Mafia and we were both town. Learn a new trick or I'm voteparking you.

[Brian Skies]

VOTE: mulch

actually this is boring.
VOTE: brian skies

and now this. I don't like ausuka's progression. calls brian town, brian wonders if he is being pocketed, which is inherently a towny thought to have, and after an interaction in which brian does not appear particularly wolfy ausuka is voting brian? that's something now isn't it. not that I like brian's posts otherwise, but this ausuka progression is wolfy. townreads from nowhere, OMGUSing when convenient. kinda wolfy?

I like this because I felt similarly regarding my interactions with her.

I didn't see anything from my posting up until that point that was worthy of a townread from someone, and I've never played with her before so I doubt it was a meta read. I also think that if she really had a reason to think I was town, there would either have been some sort of explanation as to why she was townreading me or that she wouldn't have been so quick to 180 her read and vote me.

I believe Cheeky also had a similarish progression.

[Brian Skies]

Town
Beeboy
Creature
Toranaga
Nero
Gork
Grey

Less Town
The Worst
Maybe Quick - I could easily make a case against this slot, but I don't really believe this will flip scum.

No Idea
Everyone Else

Slight Scumlean
Srceen - My gut says otherwise, but I feel like this post is unnecessarily nitpicky (and I feel like that's more of something scum might do). I'm also not getting good vibes from his hardtunnel on the Quick slot. So it's probably more appropriate to put him here even though

Sketchy
Ausuka
Cheeky

Scumleans
Brigand
Hopkirk - I'm not confident on this being scum, but I do get the placating, and I didn't really get the greatest vibes in his push on me (he didn't even answer my question to him). Feels a lot like 'poking and running away', if that makes any sense.

VOTE: Hopkirk

[Brian Skies]

Why do I feel like Brain is Mathdino?

Probably because my avatar is based on his.

[Brian Skies]

early reads are that creature is town, brian probably is too.

I think I'm being buddied.

was I wrong, Brian?

I'm town, I just don't think I've done anything worthy of a townread.

then why are you making remarks instead of voting me?

Should I be voting you?

if you scumread me, which you claim to, it follows you should be voting me.

that depends on your other reads.

OK sure...

I'm guessing you have the worst ISO in the game on a cursory search.

VOTE: Ausuka

I'm fine with the different responses because I feel like the circumstances for the two situations are different.

[Brian Skies]

Assuming roles are randomly distributed, surely you have as much chance of drawing scum as I do

This is particular seems like a weird thing to say.

[Brian Skies]

yes, including brian.

Wth? Why do you say this as if I don't deserve it or something?

[Brian Skies]

My role PM was also given to me in a spoiler tag, which I didn't realize for some reason. Don't know if this means anything, but I agree that playing without knowing your alignment goes against the integrity of this game since you can't play to your win condition if you don't even know what it is.

[Brian Skies]

Ok I'm all caught up

Brian Skies is easily the scummiest player in the game and should be wagoned/lynched

You did the same thing in Gay Mafia and we were both town. Learn a new trick or I'm voteparking you.

Maybe you should do town things if you're town

Also interesting that you'd vote park me for behaving similarly to a game where I was town

Just because you did something as town before doesn't mean you're town for doing the same thing here. That's not how this game works and I don't think you really believe this should be the case.

And it's not like you were doing anything outside of just hardpushing me and calling me scum that I don't think you could just fake as scum. Even your push on me seems pretty mechanical.

[Brian Skies]

Maybe you should do town things if you're town

Also your opinion that I'm not doing town things is a pretty subjective one and I don't even think that's the case here? Like, this feels like you're just making a throwaway comment to overgeneralize my play and shade me or that you're just not reading my posts.

[Brian Skies]

I agree with Toranaga awhile back who said that your immediate jump to "I'm being buddied" sounded like fake paranoia

I don't really understand why that was your thought process rather than Ausuka just sharing some of her early reads. It's not like her town read on you looked all that confident. The way you reacted seems like an easy way for scum to look like they're "suspicious" of someone and I don't see why you'd jump to that conclusion so early over something so trivial as town.

I already explained why I didn't believe she'd be townreading me there, and her quick 180 without explaining why she did furthers my point.

Why do you disagree?

If I feel like someone is townreading me and they shouldn't be, I'm going to question the sentiment. I could have asked her why she was townreading me, yes, but my immediate thought was that she was trying to buddy me and I felt like sharing it. It's not like I haven't given her ample opportunity to explain what her read was based on.

[Brian Skies]

weak townlean from ISO

could really be anything, but feel is town.

I think... ausuka/greyice/centipede are the scummiest, and then 0 posters are probably scumheavy.

so this is game so far. I'm basically townreading everyone that posted anything reasonable outside of these 3. yes, including brian.

p much agree /w this except i would be comfortable lynching brian and screenplay

there's so much noise to parse through reading quick is giving me seizures

I'm scumreading this slot. Tell me why I'm wrong.

[Brian Skies]

If everyone could give their stance on me that would be great, thanks.

Lynchbait.

I have a nagging fear that you were trying to fake townclear yourself in a similar manner as Mulch from Beneath the Mask. But I've also done stupid things and gotten lambasted for it only to realize that someone or something else contributed to my poor decision (your realization that Centipede's posting may have influenced you gives me good feelings about you). And your posting thus far hasn't really given me scummy vibes.

[Brian Skies]

Don't really get this vote.
1.) please explain where you think I'm placating in a mixture of your own words and my words (quotes of how). Most interested in why I'd push someone to say they scumread me, then 'placate' them when they aren't making the read independently.
2.) I explained my read on you and my intention and sort of answered that question. What didn't you like with my explination?
Why sketchy on Ausuka/Cheeky?

1) Because your accusations on Nero and I weren't that developed and the instant we both pushed back and engaged you, you backed off and just said we were town (or in my case just indicated that you thought I was). This is what I mean by poking and running away.
2) When did you explain your read on me? All I got from you was 'this is the reaction I was expecting so it wasn't entirely useless' which neither explains your original read of me (or my post) nor does it answer my original question of why you thought Brigand's post was good.

[Brian Skies]

I don't like how you went out of your way to avoid mentioning us. You really must not like us or something.

I just don't like to read through quote walls.

[Brian Skies]

Notes so far;
38 from Maria is really reachy.
44 feels pretty scummy too. 59/63 is a huge overreaction to the push at that point.
I townread Cedrick and katherine.
Creature hasn't really posted enough to be sorted yet. If this keeps going for a while he can be town.
What kts did can come from either alignment and I haven't found anything to sort him with.

Extra-Special Townbloc of Happy Friends

Ausuka, Cedrick

Candidates For Promotion

Katherine

Watchlist For Meaniness

brassherald, Creature, Gamma Emerald, Mumble, Killthestory, implosion

Wanted for Bullying and General Sad Crimes

MariaR, Tchill13

VOTE: Tchill

This is Scum.

Took me literally less than a minute to meta dive this read.

Ausuka, are you an alt?

[Brian Skies]

felt like you were trying to be pro-town without trying to look pro-town.
no idea why you're trying to hold my page 2 reads to this high of a standard.

I actually don't really care about your early townread of me. It's become less about you and more about other people, like Spiffeh.

[Brian Skies]

well, this is the account I use permanently now, but yeah.

That posting style Quick quoted looks familiar to me. Would I be accurate if I said we've played together before?

[Brian Skies]

well, this is the account I use permanently now, but yeah.

That posting style Quick quoted looks familiar to me. Would I be accurate if I said we've played together before?

Yeah. We played together in alisae's beneath the mask game, where I was in the chikoritas hydra with echovision, and we were masons with davesaz.

Heh. Not my first guess but I'll take it.

[Brian Skies]

1.) Why does scum me push people then 'back off'? What do I gain there? Think about actual scum motivation before saying it's scummy since scum have no incentive to do that. You're scumreading style rather than motive.
Why can't town me like responses? Why do I not move on to other people when I'm happy with what I have?

2.) The initial engagement wasn't leading anywhere. Not sure why you think it's scummy to try and make it something meaningful.

1) Because it makes it seem look like you're engaging and trying to sort people. Or that maybe they should townread you or ignore you when you back off before risking any serious pushback or engagement when they interact with you.

2) I don't understand what you're talking about here. And you still haven't explained A) Why Brigand's post was townish or B) Your previous read of me.

[Brian Skies]

well, this is the account I use permanently now, but yeah.

That posting style Quick quoted looks familiar to me. Would I be accurate if I said we've played together before?

Yeah. We played together in alisae's beneath the mask game, where I was in the chikoritas hydra with echovision, and we were masons with davesaz.

Heh. Not my first guess but I'll take it.

just out of curiosity, who was your first guess?

Alisae, but I'm not sure why.

[Brian Skies]

VOTE: srceenplay

[Brian Skies]

Scum me doesn't bother wasting time trying to get scumread.

Uhhh, you know this doesn't make sense from the side you're arguing right? Like, if scum you doesn't want to risk getting scumread, then it would make sense for scum you to back off before a discussion gets serious.

I also haven't claimed I was hardpushing you, so...?

Even if it happened 40 pages ago, you should still be able to explain what you were thinking instead of dodging and dancing around it.

[Brian Skies]

VOTE: Gork
Doubt I'll get people to vote here but worth a shot

Never know unless you try.

Any particular reason?

[Brian Skies]

@Brian: I don't want to answer questions that should be super easy, so let's try again later.

:/

[Brian Skies]

I feel if you were unsatisfied with my answers then you'll be unsatisfied with the same thing but with more words.

I have no idea why my early townlean on Brigand matters whatsoever? I said at the time it was very light and there's actually relevant stuff to talk about.

I think the entire reason was because I liked 53.

Scumreading you initially was because... nope it was less than ten pages in. Why do you think it had solid logic.

I gave the entire reason a while back in 190. You didn't follow up on something. That made you a decent person to push. 222, that ended with a read formed and I moved on.

Not sure what you're looking for, my motivation is literally just what's obvious from using ctrl f in my iso for your name and stopping at 222. Nothing else to it there.

To the first point about 'backing off', it's shooting as much stuff out as possible and trying to form as many reads as possible on as many people as possible as quickly as possible. That's how I'm trying to approach games atm. That's why I listed I think 6 townreads pretty quickly. 100% playstyle.

Spoiler:

awww I was hoping my vote would redirect to a player.

Why would you think this would happen?

scumpost

VOTE: brian

These are good.

Why is this good?

Yes.

Not following up here is why I voted brian btw. Gave minor impression he was asking qs without followng up.

VOTE: Quick

Spoiler:

awww I was hoping my vote would redirect to a player.

Why would you think this would happen?

scumpost

VOTE: brian

These are good.

Why is this good?

Yes.

Not following up here is why I voted brian btw. Gave minor impression he was asking qs without followng up.

You were clearly trolling me. How should I have followed up when there was nothing in your response to me to make me want to bother to continue talking to you?

This is the town response I was imagining.
My response was selfish, but useful I think.

Look, dude.

I'm not asking you why you were townreading Brigand. I asked you why you liked his 53 (and possibly your opinion on 40, to which I also asked you here). Your response to this is you liked 53, which doesn't even answer the original question. ??? It's like you just made up a new question and answered that instead. It's only going in a circle because you, for whatever reason, don't even acknowledge what I'm asking you.

Secondly, you're saying that you already answered my question in 190 and ended it in 222. These are your posts, to which you explained why you responded 'Yes' to me instead of answering my question and what you got out of it. Which, once again, doesn't actually address what I originally asked you.

[Brian Skies]

I kind of agreed with 53 at the time so I liked it.

Why was this so hard for you?

[Brian Skies]

I'm not really feeling a Thor wagon. How do you feel about srceen?

[Brian Skies]

sheep me then loltor

when I'm wrong

. how easy is that? it won't even be your fault.

No thanks.
Seems like you're baiting me into a mislynch.

VOTE: Toranga

-V

If tchill is somehow town this post is tmi af

Nah, I like that post.

[Brian Skies]

Also why me doesn't equal fry me or else nobody would say why me.

that's the eloquence I expect from a lannister

This is way funnier than it should be.

[Brian Skies]

What exactly am I cheerleading?

[Brian Skies]

Slight Scumlean
Srceen - My gut says otherwise, but I feel like this post is unnecessarily nitpicky (and I feel like that's more of something scum might do). I'm also not getting good vibes from his hardtunnel on the Quick slot. So it's probably more appropriate to put him here even though

I'm also not a fan of his immediate reaction to Thor.

Not really sure what I could be engaging or interacting with him on, so...?

[Brian Skies]

Because I think he's scum.

[Brian Skies]

Because I think he's scum.

sigh

Why do you think he's scum? Surely there is a reason or two, and that is

something you could ask him about

.

AKA: What you could be engaging or interacting with him about.

So why do you seem to think you have

nothing

to engage or interact with him about?

All he's done is push Quick and called Thor's push on him 'bs'. So...?

I've also already given all my thoughts on him and Thor is already engaging him (but won't vote him because...?).

So I'm not really understanding your issue here.

Unless you just really don't want me to vote him, in which case, why not?

Like, you're all for me voting Hopkirk (which I have), but don't understand why I'd want to vote someone else I'm suspicious of? Not really getting this. It's not even like you think Hopkirk is that much scummier than Srceen or anything.

[Brian Skies]

What exactly am I cheerleading?

Your iso would seem to indicate that you'd like to vote Hopkirk but you're actually voting....srceenplay? right now?

But you haven't interacted with him at all for a while unless I'm fuckin blind.

~The Observer

This also isn't cheerleading?

[Brian Skies]

Hey Tchill, I asked you one question and you didn’t answer it. I dislike it when people don’t answer my questions. (ok Brian)

I regret nothing.

[Brian Skies]

OK, so yesterday I was thinking Ausuka, cheeky, Hop, Nero, and beeboy were all in a hood.

Gork has a good point on counterwagons.
UNVOTE: Pan

???

[Brian Skies]

I mean maybe he was bussing Tchill and it threw me off but as soon as something else pops up he's all for it while trying to goad me into voting Tchill. No way this is town.

How does this make sense to you?

[Brian Skies]

VOTE: TChill

[Brian Skies]

The 'or maybe' looks like an addendum to a previous post. Why wasn't that post included in your analysis?

[Brian Skies]

I guess I could be wrong and this is SCFTWR but I still feel like the reasons for said wagon were kinda lame but I agree that his reactions aren't great though.

or maybe I'm right and the Sith that deals in absolutes (Grey) is sheeping a horrible wagon.

Both of these look like one thought process, so not understanding Quick's argument.

[Brian Skies]

I'm just going to pretend the Centipede doesn't exist.

[Brian Skies]

Am I allowed to do that?

[Brian Skies]

I don't care.

[Brian Skies]

pedit: you can if you want. didn't realize you disliked me so much, Brian.

Which head is this?

[Brian Skies]

Alright, so, here's my thing.

I don't have anything against you or Elli.

I do have an issue with you guys dropping by as the TChill wagon starts gaining steam to drop off scumreads without reasons like we're rabbits chasing a carrot on a stick.

I think, with the current gamestate, and the people who are stubbornly fixated on TChill being scum, it would make sense for you (or Elli, idrc) to focus on the TChill slot, no? Has he looked at that slot yet? Does he even have an opinion?

Because I have no reason to believe that your scumreads are anything other than a distraction from what is going on right now.

[Brian Skies]

UNVOTE: TChill

Since this wagon will undoubtedly go to L-1 once Grey wakes up.

[Brian Skies]

vote:tchill

What triggered you?

[Brian Skies]

Brian what do you think about ausuka?

It's a conflicted read because I want to believe that I was right she was buddying me in the beginning of the game since I don't believe I did anything worthy of a townread at that stage of the game, even for people who are familiar with me. Her explanation that I was 'being protown without trying to look like it' is reasonable, but I don't really buy it. I don't really buy that Hopkirk's post gives off this major 'uninformed' feeling (like, what even is this? is that even a thing?). And her explanation for it is pretty ???. She also seems to be going for 'easy targets' (Quick/Centipede/Tchill).

I actually liked her being around despite not wanting to catch up. I also can't read for tone very well and her posts kinda sorta look like gamesolving to me (a lot of people do though), so it's a difficult read for me to feel good about.

I think she's scummy, but my confidence in it is pretty low.

[Brian Skies]

You are correct. I have no idea why I thought she voted Centipede.

I just don't see anything that leaps out to me that says 'wow, this is definitely scum.'

[Brian Skies]

seriously though, tchill is a hard logic-based player from my experience in floral. feels hard to believe that he would hop on the wagon like that. i mean, the wagon hop still scummy in and of itself, but that makes tchill scummier.

She did have this to say about you though.

[Brian Skies]

I question my ability to count.

[Brian Skies]

VOTE: TChill

Votecount 1.33

Tchill13(8)

~ randomidget(175), Ausuka(69), Beeboy(66), CheekyTeeky(78), Panopticon(71), Gorkington(104), Brian Skies(60), Spiffeh(55)

vote:tchill

Quick(2)

~ Srceenplay(38), Nero Cain(111)

I don't understand this votecounter. But at least I know my count wasn't

supposed

to be wrong.

[Brian Skies]

TChill, do you have reads on Maria and/or Srceen?

[Brian Skies]

I like Gork's case on Panop. Even more so because I felt like they were trying to fan the flames between me/Spiffeh and me/Hopkirk.

[Brian Skies]

OK, so yesterday I was thinking Ausuka, cheeky, Hop, Nero, and beeboy were all in a hood.

Gork has a good point on counterwagons.
UNVOTE: Pan

???

Seems good to let Tchill play out.

Yeah, I can understand this sentiment.

[Brian Skies]

What are the choices? I'm like 6 pages behind.

[Brian Skies]

VOTE: Maria

[Brian Skies]

brig is just bad town if there's scum in Grey/Quick (and there is)

I'm townreading all four of you.

[Brian Skies]

I'm a skeptic at heart.

[Brian Skies]

If you're going to listen to Eli do it tomorrow I'm too important to die
yet can't believe I have to stop lurking for this
The gunner can shoot me all you like
but 1 day is ,100% needed

This is incomprehensible.

[Brian Skies]

I got that part. But the post is still hilarious to read through.

[Brian Skies]

She says she's too important to die, but that it's okay if the gunner shoots her? Which gunner? And then she tacks on that she needs one more day?

Then she says she's too important to die, but she can't believe she has to stop lurking for this?

It's just lol.

[Brian Skies]

Dying right now for me is really bad rn but if I have to waste mafia resources to d it I will

Well this makes more sense, even though you didn't really specify.

[Brian Skies]

What's your read on Centipede?

[Brian Skies]

Dying right now for me is really bad rn

Also pretty sure this can be said for like...

everyone

?

[Brian Skies]

I like Gork's case on Panop. Even more so because I felt like they were trying to fan the flames between me/Spiffeh and me/Hopkirk.

A good part of Girls case on me is varsoon mending about scumclaiming with a gif. You read that right, he's reading me based in part on what someone else said.

~tn5421

You mean how it was actually said by...wait for it...

your hydra partner

? The horror.

I get that he's associating it with you in particular, but it's still your slot.

Not to mention he's also calling out other things that have been said by you (or your hydra partner):

do you believe any scumread that tn has been pushing this game?
his reasoning for tchill is basically the following:
i) "Do something to help town if you ever want to get off this list"
ii) "I've fully scumclaimed with gif related before, so, ah, I'm really feeling like there's scum between tortuga and nochill." - which basically means because tora posted a gif joking about scumclaiming, that means for some reason one of tchill and tora is scum? which really makes absolutely no sense.
iii) "I mean, I wanna lynch it just for this kinda thing lol
anyone who ends a post with lol is scum in my book lol"

for him to then say:

No. tchill is today's wagon, no deviation allowed, absent a literal scum claim.

just feels like such a ridiculous level of confidence for someone who is pushing someone based on them not doing enough, tora doing something which is 100% independent of tchill which should not be influencing his read whatsoever and an awkward post. i just dont really believe that he would be that confident and i feel like ii) and iii) are probably just complete scum bullshit.

Scumreads
11. GreyICE (largely based on personal dislike, but is also based in difference in behavior between this game and games where GreyICE replaced into townslots)

Strong Scumreads
9. Quick (kicking up a huge fuss in the thread over nothing and being a distraction from any and all play, trying to claim towncred by pretending to not notice Mafia Gunner's inability to be voted, and overall annoyance with playstyle)

its also really weird that his main justification for both of these reads is openly "i dislike both of these players".

i feel like i could pick apart a ton of other things if i had more time.
but i also feel like his reaction to centipede is really likely scum and probably links him to maria.
i think he would protest more as town if the link was wrong once it was pointed out too. instead he just kind of awkwardly shrugged it off when he was pretty overly annoyed by the premise of the maria read in the first place.

[Brian Skies]

Why does this matter?

[Brian Skies]

I get that he's associating it with you in particular, but it's still your slot.

[Brian Skies]

Not really.

Instead of complaining about which head is getting blamed for which statement, why don't you (or Varsoon) address the actual case, which is that the reasoning for your scumread are weak and offputting.

[Brian Skies]

As well as the whole 'only Tchill no other wagon' thing. That was scummy too.

[Brian Skies]

I did vote screenplay. No one was interested.

[Brian Skies]

I think you've got an agenda and that it doesn't have towns best interests in mind.

What agenda would this be?

[Brian Skies]

So you're just throwing that out there for no reason.

Got it.

[Brian Skies]

Why keep pushing me on something you know to be false, unless you have something to hide, hmm?

Because you're trying to handwave a case made against your slot under the premise 'well my hydra partner said this and not me so Gork is full of shit'.

If you don't like being treated as one entity with another player, then don't hydra.

Also, I highly doubt that anyone really cares whether Gork said 'tn' or 'panopticon.'

[Brian Skies]

The first 80 pages were overrated.

Just meme and inflate your post count and you should be alright.

[Brian Skies]

why are you not looking at the horrible reasons for the chill wagon @Thor?

Because I don't think it looks, nor looked gross.
Now you can read me in association with your thoughts on the wagon and my willingness to join it.

Is there anything in particular that made/makes you like the Tchill wagon? Do you there's a good chance he'll flip scum (if so, why)?

Because I can have no issue with a wagon (or the people on it), but that doesn't mean it's going to land on scum.

[Brian Skies]

I'll be over here on the counter wagon washing my hands

Are you fighting this wagon on principle or just don't want to deal with blowback? I don't understand why this is even a concern for you.

[Brian Skies]

The idea is that he wouldn't know if he had any special abilities (vanilla) and that he wouldn't know who the scumteam was (uninformed).

[Brian Skies]

?

I'm just explaining why you said he'd be playing like a VT. What is this former/latter stuff?

[Brian Skies]

lol where did randomidget get 188 posts?

Toranaga. The votecounter sums the total posts of everyone that occupied the slot.

[Brian Skies]

Like fuck, he wants to nutpunch people for this dumbshittery as bad as I do, but he's trying. No way in fuck I'm lynching that.

Their whole deal was that I was cheerleading (I wasnt and what they described wasnt even cheerleading). If they wanted to nutpunch me, they could've explained why Tchill was the best vote instead of complaining that I was voting Srceenplay instead of Hopkirk (the latter of which I had already voted and pushed).

[Brian Skies]

And you dropping the playerlist as a lynchlist isn't supposed to insult us?

[Brian Skies]

I mean, my state was ranked near the bottom in terms of education, so I can't really argue against whatever point you're making against me.

However, I had already stated my reasons for suspecting screen and he isn't exactly the most transparent player in this game, and a quick search could have shown that for them. Their outburst also seemed misplaced to me.

Not to mention their reads on me and Spiffeh in their aforementioned readslist seemed to indicate that they wanted to spur a 1v1 between me and Spiffeh without actually taking a hard position either eay on it. It felt like they were just trying to give Spiffeh ammunition to push me (and I already explained why their accusation was wrong).

Their response that I should have been voting and pushing Hopkirk was also out of place. They weren't scumreading him that hard or even voting him, and I had just been pushing him to the point that others told me to back off, so them insinuating that I hadn't pushed him in a while and that I should have been just felt like them trying to fan the flames between us.

[Brian Skies]

And you dropping the playerlist as a lynchlist isn't supposed to insult us?

considering im on it do you not realize its a joke

I already knew it was a joke. Just making a point about your response to creature.

[Brian Skies]

VOTE: srceenplay

[Brian Skies]

What about srceenplay?

[Brian Skies]

Because...?

[Brian Skies]

What does that have to do with his alignment?

[Brian Skies]

but real talk, I think they are a red herring and Grey is scum so like why would I vote anyone over Grey?

Real talk. Why would anyone listen to you if you scumread anyone that won't vote Grey with you?

[Brian Skies]

How is screenplay a red herring?

[Brian Skies]

No one even talks about him. He just floats along and voteparks Quick and makes arguments based on semantics.

[Brian Skies]

Because...?

We're aiming for important scum, not scum that definitely won't live to endgame like Srceenplay.

A scumflip is a scumflip to me. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

[Brian Skies]

Are you asking me what it is or what I'm basing it on? If the former, town. If the latter, mostly just demeanor.

[Brian Skies]

We can't agree on a lynch.

Just do what you want.

[Brian Skies]

And, hey, I put my best casing out there--I'm still of the mind that there's scum in (CheekyTeeky, tchill,

Toranaga

).

I remember this. You only said that something didn't feel right about Toranaga to you.

Can you elaborate on this read of yours or do you not remember or...?

[Brian Skies]

The first 80 pages were overrated.

Just meme and inflate your post count and you should be alright.

I know I said this, but I was joking and regret it now.

Please don't do this anymore.

[Brian Skies]

Pretty sure that was Toranaga calling people potatoes, not Panopticon.

[Brian Skies]

What about srceenplay?

Srceenplay isn't really someone I've taken a hard look at, can you explain why you're scum reading them?

The only thing that really leaps out to me in his scumread of Quick is him attacking Quick's semantics, although in both cases I've gotten the feeling Srceen's either tonedeaf or missed the context. I think attacking semantics is really easy for scum to attack because it's easier to justify than trying to fake natural feelings or legitimate concerns or paranoia. I also didn't like his reaction to Thor, who was mostly fielding a response to Srceen when Srceen answered questions that weren't even directed toward him.

[Brian Skies]

Screen is townie and the wagon composition there is awful.

Because...?

[Brian Skies]

Oh right, I forgot he he was mad about you pushing him.

Kinda makes sense I guess if you think his main gripe with the wagon is the composition.

Still doesn't explain why he thinks Srceen is town.

[Brian Skies]

Ye I thought Quick was town.

[Brian Skies]

Nevermind, you were townreading him.

[Brian Skies]

I’m not moving.

Now, I can see you still thinking that's scummy, but...

1. Has he done nothing else worth voting over since?
2. Why aren't you advocating for him if you believe in the vote strong enough to park on it while the rest of the game is clearly ignoring him as an option now (and, indeed, some are starting to town sort him while you sit there silently)
3. You really have no *stronger* scum read on anyone else for any reason? (<--this is the part making me curl my toes at your play slightly)

Is this toward me?


1: Idk. I’m 10-ish pages behind.
2: I did ask for their lynch. It’s not my style to make elaborate cases. I can’t do that. I see weird shit that pings me and I go vote it.
3: Not really. Brian pinged me earlier but I don’t remember why. I would have to iso.

VOTE: quick

What are you waiting for?
You've ducked explaining your deep reads, and now you don't want to weigh in on some sexy wagon competition?
This is the point you yell at me again for suggesting you're not helping town.

Haven’t ducked anything. You just haven’t read.
Tchill13 is probably town.
I don’t have an opinion on Maria.

I like how he interacts with following Quick (even if I like Quick), Interactions with Thor, and his neutral stance on MariaR.

Tone reads as pretty legitimate throughout.

Is there anything specific about his interactions that you like?

I'm also going to second Shad's inquiry on why you think his neutral stance on Maria is town indicative for you.

I also don't really care for his random 'Brian pinged me but I can't explain where this came from or what gave me this feeling,' since I feel like that's an easy thing to just say and I was being floated out by several people as a viable wagon option.

[Brian Skies]

@Shad: Not bussing or doing anything against it (in fact, being on a dead wagon while it happens) when it's starting, picking up speed, or peaking seems good to me.

Actually, I noticed you did respond to it, but Maria was softing a PR and even stated she wanted us to wait for a hammer before lynching someone.

Maria's play makes me think she was looking to rely on her claim to get her out of trouble, so I don't agree with your assessment of Srceen's neutral stance here since that could have just been him waiting for the wagon to blow over or for him to bank on Maria's decision to soft lie detector.

[Brian Skies]

Yes. The bit you crossed out is why I liked it. I'm not sure you can objectively like tone.
Specifically: Thor's attacking felt kind of nitpicky, already covered MariaR, and sticking to his Quick read seems more town than scum.

Why do you feel that Thor's nitpickiness is more likely to come from scum, but not Srceen's?

Also, I'm starting to get the feeling that your stance on Srceen has to do more with Thor than actually you having an objective read on Srceen (Thor did push both of you).

I also don't think Srceen's tone/attitude was warranted in relation to Thor. Why do you?

[Brian Skies]

@Shad: Not bussing or doing anything against it (in fact, being on a dead wagon while it happens) when it's starting, picking up speed, or peaking seems good to me.

Actually, I noticed you did respond to it, but Maria was softing a PR and even stated she wanted us to wait for a hammer before lynching someone.

Maria's play makes me think she was looking to rely on her claim to get her out of trouble, so I don't agree with your assessment of Srceen's neutral stance here since that could have just been him waiting for the wagon to blow over or for him to bank on Maria's decision to soft lie detector.

If this was the case, that would likely mean multiple bussing was already occuring. If the plan was to claim her way out of trouble then it'd be a good time for partners to pick up some town cred with bussing. The issue with that is that I like the wagon composition a lot.

I like the wagon composition as well.

Scum were probably bussing. Maybe they weren't. Idrc.

She also got shot in the face, so...?

I still don't think this is a good reason to townread him for. There are probably a good handful of other players that had a null stance on her. So what? Also, he went through the trouble to continually ask Centipede if they were sure on their read on Maria. So for someone who was taking a nonstance on a scumflip, he was still concerned about it to at least some degree, no?

[Brian Skies]

I kinda hope Pan flips town so I can laugh at you guys for letting Grey slip by. I guess if Pan flips scum then you guys get to do the opposite.

it's funny cause both are town


probably more likely Pan scum then Grey, i'd say

???

I'm not understanding why you felt the need to say the bottom line here if you think they're both town.

[Brian Skies]

Who vig Maria?

Why did you ask this?

[Brian Skies]

Also @Brian: Screen isn’t a hard townread- as shown by him being in the light town section on my readlists. I don’t get why you’re asking so many questions/pushing me to defend him.

I'm trying to either get you to vote him or convince me that I'm wrong.

[Brian Skies]

Eh, if Hopkirk is saying that, then screen isn't a buddy.

Vote: Hopkirk

?

[Brian Skies]

Screen is townie and the wagon composition there is awful.
Tchill is a worse wagon.
Grey is a fine wagon.

I was just reminded that Hopkirk openly decried the Srceen wagon, which is another reason I've been pushing him on that read.

I don't like Hop pushing srceenplay for the resistance thing and demanding for a response in his next post before jumping onto the Grey wagon. I think if he seriously had somewhere to go with that, he wouldn't have been so eager to push Grey closer to a lynch. Idk, it kinda feels like a slimy setup post to justify his later Grey vote (in that Grey has also claimed to not look at his role, except these are two different games and srceen isn't even claiming to have done that this game, so...?).

I can sort of see what Grey means regarding Hop and his srceen stance, but I still just want to lynch srceen. We can add rolefishing to the list of crimes, that most of you probably didn't even notice because most of you are avoiding or ignoring him this game.

[Brian Skies]

Gorkington, srceen read, go!

[Brian Skies]

Idk if you remember, but discussion that was about wagon composition (scummy people on it).

I remember. I just wanted to add this on to my previous response when you asked me 'why do you keep pushing me for my

light townread

?'.

The resistance thing is either a scumslip, or easily explained at a ratio of maybe 90:10. In other news, it's two days to deadline and I've said i probably won't be online tomorrow. Given this, what would you expect me to do in this scenario? Not vote anybody, stay on a wagon that I don't like as much? This is a legitimate question.

I'm pretty sure srceen's comment was mostly about Pan's AtE. I don't think there's any correlation between that and

this

game or how it's a scumslip for

this

game.

So I'm very curious as to what your point here is.

You're claiming here the same thing Grey did, that I've just gone onto his wagon. I direct your attention to where I responded to Grey quoting that he's been one of my top two scumreads for a long time. I very much want to hear how you'll explain this position if it isn't a mistake.
The fact that you're able to miss that makes me very concerned about you now :/

Congratulations! You're voting someone you've already stated a scumread on.

What does this have to do with anything I just said?

[Brian Skies]

@Grey
@Brian

I'm hardly enamored by Hopkirk's play - but you're telling me that how he got on the MariaR wagon isn't at least a clever enough of a buss to make him not a good Day 1 lynch?

I don't understand the question. Please rephrase.

[Brian Skies]

I'm also not really sure I could call Hop getting onto the Maria

clever

as either alignment, since a quick search of Maria in his iso only brings up 'powerful algorithm' and 'good wagon composition'.

So?

[Brian Skies]

-ever played resistance irl? There's a point. It's actually mechanically impossible to play without looking at your role pm due to part of how the game works.

I've never played Resistance, no.

Are you calling him a liar? There's currently a wagon on him and your vote isn't on it.

Otherwise, it's not directly related to this game, so what's your point?

-you just said that I was trying to justify it today, despite holding the read for almost a week. Do you seriously see no issue with Grey claiming I've only just jumped on him?

My issue isn't with you just voting Grey.

My issue is your interaction with srceen here and then going 'oh hey, let's forget about this potential scumtell and just push to end the day.' As well as potential correlations you may be trying to draw up between srceen and Grey here.

[Brian Skies]

I think Hopkirk's vote on MariaR looks enough like "not a bus" to qualify for not lynching him today - why do you disagree, and if you don't disagree, do something else"

I'm voting srceen and advocating srceen's lynch?

Also curious why you think that Hop's vote looks like 'not a bus' when he never joined it until the second time it came around and left it once she claimed.

[Brian Skies]

My bad, for some reason I thought you were posting again and again attacking Hopkirk and making a case on him distracting us all while the Grey wagon builds steam and the Srceen one dies.

I feel like I've made it abundantly clear that I want to lynch srceen.

Also, yes, I'm attacking Hop because I'm questioning his motives. Let's say you're right on both your Grey and srceen reads. Do you have any way of figuring out if Hop is protecting a buddy to survive at least to the night phase while setting him up for a bus down the road? I honestly have no idea how I would be able to make this distinction unless I challenged him on it as it happens, as if I wait until tomorrow to do So, he can just go 'well I was scumreading him yesterday, why not just ask me yesterday?' or some variation thereof.

Like if you seriously think the Grey wagon is a wagon based on nothingness, then why are you not curious about Hop jumping over there despite super awesome scumtell on srceen?

Curious why you think he unvoted considering he was voting her at the time she died.
Maybe you should go back and read his votes again?

For a guy that has had Maria (and I guess Centipede) in his FOS/scum/to lynch pile, he has shockingly little to no conviction on the Maria lynch.

Now I guess this sort of supports your point that it would make more sense for scum to make a bigger deal out of the Maria lynch and soak up as much townread as possible. But how often do scum do this, especially since one of the first things people look for is 'who is the busser on the wagon?'

Furthermore, they way he talked about the Maria lynch mostly just puts responsibility elsewhere (algorithm, townread on it) and gives him room to move on and off as he finds it most convenient for him.

my concern is that she pushed Gork then townread him after the sort of time where scum-MariaR would have invented the fakeclaim

My issue with this is that it's just such a softball read (Not to mention Maria softclaimed in like her fourth post and before she really did anything) and he says it in a way that still leaves him open to going either way on the Maria lynch. There isn't really anything else that makes me believe he has the conviction in that read that his reads throughout the game should indicate.

Now if you still believe that is more likely to come from town, then I'm not sure what to tell you as don't think it's town indicative at all, and it's not like I want to lynch him right now anyway.

[Brian Skies]

Screen isn't a townread anymore Thor.
Phone posting is hard.

Someone should meta me. I have a couple of obvious scumtells.

> aware of meta
> tells us to look for scumtells to prove towniness

....wat

Absence.

@Brian- preferably your thoughts.

?

I don't really like meta, even less so when the person is aware of their own tells.

[Brian Skies]

That brings us all the way back around to the initial reason for the dust up - me suggesting that you should spend more time/energy/posts on getting Srceen lynched.

[Brian Skies]

Srceen, can you respond to these:

I played resistance last night.
Didn't really want to play.
but
I said I'm not looking at my card. Everyone blew me off except one person. He made a big deal about it. I called him out as scum. He was scum.

There's a pretty central mechanic that impossible if you mean what you sound like you mean. Please explain in your next post how you could play resistance without looking at your card.

Who vig Maria?

Why did you ask this?

[Brian Skies]

UNVOTE: Srceenplay

[Brian Skies]

Yeah sure.

VOTE: GreyIce

[Brian Skies]

L-1 I believe.

[Brian Skies]

I have returned.

I'm not fully convinced by the vig claim, however, Ausuka does raise a good point and one I was thinking when I unvoted:

Then he's dead if he's not the real killer, and we don't need to lynch him anyway? I don't get your point here.

I guess we could just lynch him anyway and speed things along? But regardless of whether I think he's telling the truth here, I feel like he's pretty much dead anyway.

[Brian Skies]

VOTE: Srceenplay

[Brian Skies]

VOTE: Hopkirk

[Brian Skies]

My other scumread is Pan.

[Brian Skies]

I played resistance last night.
Didn't really want to play.
but
I said I'm not looking at my card. Everyone blew me off except one person. He made a big deal about it. I called him out as scum. He was scum.


Kind of funny i see it here in this iso.

Screen talking about Pan.
Unless Screen had some other explination, which I assume he would have said since i think i said I'd vote him if he couldn't explain it.

He did explain it. What about it was a scumtell? If you thought it was a scumtell, why not pursue this over Grey?

[Brian Skies]

For starters MariaR tried to push a really sketchy case on him out of the gate.

I don't remember this.

[Brian Skies]

rceen, can you respond to these:
In post 3321, Hopkirk wrote:
In post 3210, Srceenplay wrote:
I played resistance last night.
Didn't really want to play.
but
I said I'm not looking at my card. Everyone blew me off except one person. He made a big deal about it. I called him out as scum. He was scum.


There's a pretty central mechanic that impossible if you mean what you sound like you mean. Please explain in your next post how you could play resistance without looking at your card.

Part of the way to win is to make others believe you are town. So it doesn’t matter if what your card says per say. Just play as town. Your team would still be playing to their win con. They would also know who you are by deduction.

In the simplest terms, Resistance involves two phases.
1.) Picking people to go on missions/voting on these.
2.) Going on missions.
Scum wins by failing 3/5 missions, town by passing 3/5.
Scum can put in a pass or fail during the mission, town must put in a pass.
It isn't possible to play without knowing your role as town must put in a pass card. Scum cannot win without knowing they are scum.
It's different to mafia in that regard.
Screen missed the vital aspect of the game that makes it impossible not view your role card.

I actually watched a video on the games rules after he responded to me. And I got the feeling that while it would not be helpful if he were indeed scum, there were no rules against it and it would just put more pressure on his partner to carry him.

What was it's relevance to this game? I don't see how him recounting a past experience was alignment indicative to this game here. Unless you just thought he was lying, in which case, still could have voted Srceen.

Still didn't explain why you chose to pursue Grey over this scumtell.

[Brian Skies]

Oh wait nevermind you did.

[Brian Skies]

Hmm. Idk. I don't think you ever checked back in so I'm not buying this response about 'would have moved over and lynched srceen.'

[Brian Skies]

Screen isn't a townread anymore Thor.
Phone posting is hard.

Someone should meta me. I have a couple of obvious scumtells.

> aware of meta
> tells us to look for scumtells to prove towniness

....wat

Absence.

@Brian- preferably your thoughts.

This was your last post before the day ended.

You said he was hammered by the time you got on next. We didn't actually get a lynch till the last 30 minutes or so of the deadline. Were you waiting until last minute to check in or...?

[Brian Skies]

Okay I see you've already responded to me. I'll think about it.

[Brian Skies]

I kind of just want to lynch Hopkirk for Ausuka's 'he looks genuinely uninformed' defense.

What are people's reads on Pan?

[Brian Skies]

I was more negative about Pan until Hopkirk pointed out Srceen's limp wrist attack.

I'm not really interested in the limp wrist attack because I feel like both were being pressured pretty heavily up to that point and felt like a good time for one or both of them to distance or bus if they're buddies.

I think it's interesting to not that when I pushed them for calling me out as cheerleading, they took a snipe at me for voting srceen (who I had been scumreading at the time, and they were pushing TChill at the time, so them having a gripe over me voting srceen over Hopkirk was very ??? to me).

The second time I pushed them, they took a shot at me for not voting srceen (I was voting Maria at the time). And then it was followed up by this weird 'Maria or Elli is scum' which was just very :/ to me.

I still think they were trying to fan the flames with either me/Spiffeh or me/Hopkirk. And I still didn't like the way they tried to defend against Gork with 'how dare you scumread me for something my other head did.'

[Brian Skies]

There was a progression to my votes in that I moved my vote to Srceen because I thought he was scummy in his interactions with Thor. Thor wasn't even voting him and there were a lot of people voting TChill (and a lot of people weren't even paying attention to Srceen, which remained true all the way until we lynched him), so I pushed the TChill wagon to push the game along. I unvoted TChill because the wagon blew up and I didn't really think he was that scummy. I moved to Maria because Cheeky was like, 'come vote Maria with us' and I was like, sure, that looks like a decent avenue to pursue, and I stayed on Maria because her responses to me were very underwhelming and I didn't like them.

[Brian Skies]

>was voting srceen despite not scumreading him

Slight Scumlean
Srceen - My gut says otherwise, but I feel like this post is unnecessarily nitpicky (and I feel like that's more of something scum might do). I'm also not getting good vibes from his hardtunnel on the Quick slot. So it's probably more appropriate to put him here even though

VOTE: srceenplay

Let me know whether or not 603 comes before 1006.

[Brian Skies]

This is not only an accurate summary of the game, it's an accurate summary of why Lynch All Liars (no matter how irrelevant the lie seems) is great play.

Except he didn't even do this?

[Brian Skies]

>was voting srceen despite not scumreading him

Slight Scumlean
Srceen - My gut says otherwise, but I feel like this post is unnecessarily nitpicky (and I feel like that's more of something scum might do). I'm also not getting good vibes from his hardtunnel on the Quick slot. So it's probably more appropriate to put him here even though

VOTE: srceenplay

Let me know whether or not 603 comes before 1006.

Ignoring the part where you sat him back to null in the meantime.

When did this ever happen? Quote it.

[Brian Skies]

Neutrals
15. Spiffeh (Liked a few of your posts but I'd like to see you consider voting someone besides Brian, at least for day 1. Even if he is cheerleading atm.)
6. Ausuka [Scumlean -> Neutral]
11. GreyICE [Scumread -> Neutral] (I'll admit this one stings my pride)
14. Srceenplay [Townlean -> Neutral]
20. Brian Skies [Townlean -> Neutral] (You're cheerleading, not scumhunting)

You know who did sit him down as a nullread? You two did.

[Brian Skies]

early reads are that creature is town, brian probably is too.

I think I'm being buddied.

was I wrong, Brian?

Scum/scum interaction?

Is there more to this? Because I'm not understanding your flipped stance on me.

[Brian Skies]

Scum who never puts in a fail card is functionally equivilent to an extra town.
Town who put in a fail card are breaking core game rules.

Screen claimed it was possible to do something it's not possible to do in game to attack Pan, likely hoping nobody would realize it couldn't be done.

It's possible he could have said 'oh, I meant I was playing online and I'd look at the role after a couple of nights'. I would have doubted that because:
- I checked on site, and he wasn't playing there.
- It sounded like he meant playing irl.
- Checking your role card irl would be a lot trickier than online due to the fact you can see people/body language and stuff.
- Talking about people getting annoyed d1 is different to not checking d1/intent to check later.

-He didn't say that when I asked him, he dodged the question (or gave an answer that didn't explain things).

The issue I have with this is that srceenplay posted here (which is his first post

after

your last post from Day 1 here).

His next post after that comes here, which is almost a

14 hour difference

between posts.

The hammer came in this post, which puts the difference between Screen's first post after your last post and the hammer at approximately

18 hours

(idk, check my math here).

I don't really know Britain's time zones, but I'm having trouble accepting that you couldn't check in at least once in this 18 hour window (either before you went to work or whatever). Not to mention that I had to be the one to follow up on your 'scumtell' question for you.

Also, if you're saying you did see Srceen dodge the question yesterday, then it begs the question of why you didn't follow up with your question to him yourself or why you didn't vote him for the 'scumtell' like you said you were going to do.

[Brian Skies]

Hmm. Idk. I don't think you ever checked back in so I'm not buying this response about 'would have moved over and lynched srceen.'

I have work, but I checked the thread (not sure if it was at lunch or end of the day), and there was a hammer down and thread was 'locked'

It doesn't actually matter whether you buy it or not since it's only a lie if I'm scum, so it becomes circular.

- If I'm town I'm telling the truth because why not.
- If I'm scum I'm lying for whatever reason (or telling the truth, which is a functional lie anyway in that scenario since the motive is different)

I meant to quote this post, but yeah.

[Brian Skies]

This post is an indication that I'm either busy or contemplating on how to convince you all that Hopkirk is scum. Or that I'm busy contemplating on how to convince you all that Hopkirk is scum.

They're all the same really.

[Brian Skies]

Define useless.

[Brian Skies]

I'm offended. I've been like the opposite of useless.

You're probably closer to useless than I am.

[Brian Skies]

I'm incredibly disappointed by this playerlist because I feel like Hopkirk's jump onto the Grey wagon was a blatant scumvote.

If you believe in the lipservice he gave you today about the reasoning for his 'scumtell' being a valid reason to scumread Srceenplay, then you should also believe he had every reason to vote Srceen yesterday and not Grey. The nonsense he gave about being given two differing views of the gamestate regarding Grey-scum and Srceen-scum is just that, nonsense, and it's not like he gave any definitive reasoning to believe Grey's scum or that he was a better wagon. It still just feels like him looking for an excuse to push the Grey wagon and keep Srceen alive to the next Night Phase while keeping himself open to picking up towncred if he flips scum or bussing Srceen today if he was still alive to get wagoned.

I wish I had more to go off of, and I probably would have if Thor hadn't so rudely interrupted my push on him.

Like, Hopkirk literally sets up his scumread on Srceen in one post and votes Srceen's counterwagon in the next one.

Also, I straight up told Hopkirk that if he was calling Hopkirk a liar that he should just vote him here. But it's not like anyone in this game reads my posts or listens to me, so...

Anyone who townreads Hopkirk is bad and should feel bad.

[Brian Skies]

I wasn't being serious, obv but I mean I feel like your reaction is a bit defensive.

I bet you can't tell me anything Cheeky or Beeboy have done this game (without an ISO read) and I'm not at all sure why you'd challenge that bee and cheeky haven't been useless.

I already knew you were probably joking.

You're right I couldn't. I actually had to iso them. But why does that make them a good wagon?

I don't think Cheeky is scummy. I'm not really opposed to a Beeboy wagon, since I feel like he's kind of disappeared after his Quick push, but I don't really think the Quick push was scummy.

[Brian Skies]

But why does that make them a good wagon?

b/c lurking and being useless is a half-way decent scum strat. Although slight nitpick, you weren't asking what made them a good wagon. You asked how they were useless.

I can still ask other questions.

[Brian Skies]

I also wouldn't really consider Cheeky a lurker.

Even if I did, what makes one lurker more likely to flip scum than the small handful of other players that are seemingly just sheeping or w/e.

[Brian Skies]

I'm not saying this is what you said. I'm asking the question.

[Brian Skies]

I like lynching scum.

Who're your scumreads?

[Brian Skies]

You're scumreading me? Why?

Also, if you think Hop is scummy, why not talk to me about that read or join my wagon? Thor isn't really pushing a scumread, so you shouldn't feel obligated to sheep him right now.

Is there any particular reason for the others? Or do they mostly fall into the useless or lurky category for you?

[Brian Skies]

TOWN GUNNER IS TAKING A SHOT AT CHEEKYTEEKY

TOWN GUNNER IS TAKING A SHOT AT CHEEKYTEEKY

Missed!

Lol. Part of me feels bad and kinda wants Cheekys flip if only because the Town Gunner wanted it.

The other part of me still doesn't like the wagon and am kinda glad it missed.

I'm interested in why people think Cheekys scum or want her flip.

[Brian Skies]

@brian- just look at my read trajectory on grey. It isn't a vote I made out of nowhere.

Still good with checky.

Still think you're scum.

[Brian Skies]

@Brian- can you interact with specific people in regard to your read on me. Preferably someone you townread who townreads me. You'll just dismiss whatever I say here from confirm.bias

Sure. Who are these people?

I won't seek them out, but if they think you're town and have good reasoning for it, they can leave their thoughts in thread and we can have a discussion on why they're wrong.

Until then, your flip is the one I want. I would also accept Pan's, but I don't see that happening anytime soon.

[Brian Skies]

I need a list of your townread since half of the requirements to be in that group is your townread on then

Anyone would suffice. I don't really think me having a townread on them is necessary if they have a good reason to townread you (or at the very least not lynch you).

[Brian Skies]

I'm not even campaigning for her lynch right now and I can tell you it's 'lurk and lack of impact in the face of actual town reads'.

I'm not understanding this.

A lot of the town is currently sorted as town - so we're going to be killing less town people for a bit of a spell until someone can present an exciting scum case on someone (no, your Hopkirk read is not that exciting, though I will agree with you he is in the potentially lynchable reads pile, if that excites you).

I'm disappointed that I don't have anything strong enough to strongarm the lynch I want, but that is to be expected.

Him being in the lynchable reads pile is very exciting though.

Also, why are you asking this when Beeboy is apparently on the ropes and the only town who is clearly and painfully gunning for a Cheeky flip, pun intended, is not one who you should be trying to draw attention to.

Sell Hopkirk lynch better or explain why Beeboy is town - those are the plays for today.

I mean, I was kind of expecting there to me more than just the Gunner that would explain why they were interested in her flip since her wagon seemed to blow up so fast. But I do get your point.

I don't have a strong reason to townread Beeboy or deter his wagon (outside of me just wanting to lynch my scumreads), so I'll pass.

[Brian Skies]

You fucks need to learn to not worry when you're winning.

I just watched a town lose a game to me when they were winning, so lol?

[Brian Skies]

<<<<There are no third parties in this game >>>>

[Brian Skies]

Sufficiently paranoid lol

what if Gork was incorrectly resurrected and is now evil

That would be considered bastard and this game is confirmed not bastard, or at least to not have this mechanic.

[Brian Skies]

I could be convinced in lynching anyone who suggests Multiball.

[Brian Skies]

Like, PHUCK EVERYONE who says this is single ball. Ausuka's role says "Every night, you can target a player and

learn their alignment.

"

Now why would scum, need to learn of the alignment(s) in a bloody single ball with no SK??

Ausuka's first ability is "you can target someone to learn their rolecard,

including their name

". What name? My role card simply tells me I'm a villager, but I have no name.

This actually got me interested so I went back to read srceen's role, and he seems to both motivate AND roleblock the same person on the same night? This -to me- means someone has a strongman modifier to overcome the RB. Otherwise it's meaningless.

Maria's lie-detector was borderline on it's own. It could apply to single ball as a check on roles, but then it could be used in multi ball to find the other team as well.

So don't you dare assert it must be single ball here. Not unless the game was copied from another site and the rephrasing of the roles was poor and let some traces of the original game slip past proper modification.

--You are a

wolf

[redacted]
-Once per game, you can send me a link to a post someone made. I will tell you if it is a truth, a lie, or inconclusive.
-Once per game, you can show me a post where someone is claiming or CLEARLY hinting their role. To the best of my ability, if this is valid, or the part they are claiming is mostly/partly valid, they will die. This kill cannot be stopped in any way and will be marked as an anti claim kill. You cannot use this on a vanilla townie equivalent.
-Once per game, you can show me a post where someone is claiming or CLEARLY hinting their role. To the best of my ability, if this is valid, or the part they are claiming is mostly/partly valid, they will be vanillized. This vanillization cannot be stopped in any way, but they will be notified if they are vanillized. You cannot use this on a vanilla townie equivalent.

-You are a

wolf

[redacted]
-Every day, you can target a player. They will be motivated for the night (they can use one of their actions that night twice with the exception of a factional kill) and notified of this at the end of the day. However, they will be roleblocked for that night and the following day. For example, if you motivated someone day1, they would be motivated for night 1, and be roleblocked on night 1 and day2.

-You are a

wolf

[redacted]
- Every night, you can target someone to learn their rolecard, including their name.
- Every night, you can target a player and learn their alignment. The night results will be sent to a random player in the game at the start of the next day, in the form of "You have received a night result of mafia" or "You have received night result of 'not mafia'."

I don't 100% think this game has to be singleball. But I'm treating it that way because I don't see any reason why it can't. So until something happens that conclusively points toward this game being Multiball, I will consider any and all Multiball discussion as distracting and unproductive. It gives off an air that you're trying to seem uninformed, and I find it very scummy.

These are the aforementioned Scum Role PM's.

Maria claimed to be a Lie Detector, which is her actual role. This could both be a confirmable role and have protown utility. However, it also has proscum utility in that it allows the scumteam to vanillarize or outright kill someone who claims their role.

Srceenplay's role is a motivater. I'm assuming this is confirmable and seems to have protown utility on the surface. However, it's mostly proscum utility in that it also roleblocks its target.

Ausuka's role seems to be a combination Rolecop (usually proscum but could be confirmable) as well as Amnesiac Cop (also could be confirmable). Except the scumteam gets to choose the target, but not who receives the result. The name thing is weird, but could just be an indication of a named role, of any alignment, and not necessarily an indicator of another faction, and could quite possibly just be a red herring.

None of these indicate there has to be the existence of another faction and mostly just indicates that we shouldn't take a claim at face value.

[Brian Skies]

@Brian: I'm OK with this assessment. This much friendlier than your earlier call to lynch anyone who promotes the possibility to begin with. I think we can now agree that it's am existing possibility that you do not wish to pursue unless here's further evidence o it being the case. Yes?

Yes.

Although I wasn't saying I would lynch anyone who promoted the possibility of multiball, just that I'd be willing to consider it.

[Brian Skies]

VOTE: Beeboy

[Brian Skies]

Sorry for being disengaged this game I prolly shouldn't just fuck over the town cause Mulch isn't the mod anymore.

If you're barely keeping up, why'd you take a shot at Cheeky?

[Brian Skies]

However, I'll unvote for safety.

UNVOTE:

So here's the deal: If Beeboy is faking, the Town Gunner can shoot him. If he dies, that's fine. If not, we know he's lying anyway and we can lynch him still.

town gunner already took a shot at cheeky

2 things:

1- They can do it tomorrow
2- We don't know if they can only shoot once per day

Can we draw the line on this discussion here, please? I mean, what's the worst case? The player controlling the Town Gunner dies overnight and they don't get to shoot anyone on D3? Do you think we wouldn't notice that, assuming the flip doesn't tell us they are who they are?

kind of feel like beeboy would have claimed the other shot if he were actually the gunner?

kind of feel like beeboy would have claimed the other shot if he were actually the gunner?

Gunner is publicly announced, wasnt Maria a dayvig?

Waiting to see what happens regarding the Gunner is a perfectly valid safe play.

I was also under the impression that the Gunner shots were publicly announced today because they

missed

. Maybe I'm wrong?

However, Gork is right that Beeboy didn't claim the Cheeky shot, and 4137 doesn't really give off the impression that he was scumreading her or wanted that flip. I at the very least want to lock down what Bee's claiming here before we go off doing other things.

[Brian Skies]

Probably.

[Brian Skies]

VOTE: Panopticon

[Brian Skies]

Oh Hopkirk is a lynch option.

Decisions

.

Why am I a lynch candidate?

[Brian Skies]

because youre not a townread

Your words cut very deep.

[Brian Skies]

Brian is less town on a reread.

Give reasons or this is nothing more than opportunism.

[Brian Skies]

Your interactions with Screen/Ausuka aren't quite as I remember. Your trajectory on me is pretty meh.

Be more specific? This feels more like you posturing a read change me as my lynch candidacy grows rather than you actually contributing worthwhile thoughts about me.

[Brian Skies]

Didn't you refuse the last thing I asked you?

Idk. What did you ask me to do?

[Brian Skies]

You can explain those too if you'd like.

Pretty sure Cheeky called your read change on her opportunistic.

[Brian Skies]

Weren't they told to big AP?

[Brian Skies]

I think Grey said to vig him.

[Brian Skies]

He did shoot Aus. And Nero shot Cheeky. So pretty good or decent play by the gunmen.