In post 1471, Ircher wrote:Not much tbh. Basically, your playstyle is incompatible with the way I tend to read people (based on their reads and their reasons for those reads).
So... you're not going to give Lovebird the proper chance to claim because you don't like their playstyle?
1) This has nothing to do with their playstyle
2) They can claim now
Links: User Page | GTKAS
Do you have questions, ideas, or feedback for the Scummies? Please pm me!
To clarify, many others in this game scumread Lovebird, some of whom I townread and as previously mentioned, I am definitely not opposed to their Lynch.
Links: User Page | GTKAS
Do you have questions, ideas, or feedback for the Scummies? Please pm me!
In post 1471, Ircher wrote:Not much tbh. Basically, your playstyle is incompatible with the way I tend to read people (based on their reads and their reasons for those reads).
So... you're not going to give Lovebird the proper chance to claim because you don't like their playstyle?
1) This has nothing to do with their playstyle
2) They can claim now
"Ima need to buy at least Josh a fucking tarot card reading because this dude is scary at picking up on scum before they even post what the fuck type of Ms. Cleo ass psychic ass mothafucka did yall allow to sign up for this site"
In post 1354, Taly wrote:And I do believe the reasons for my assessment are AI, you're around when it's to divert some form of attention off of you. You don't defend what you think could be town, or even give reasons for such, and you don't really push your scumreads aside from saying a post is scum and throwing a vote down because... you most likely think the person you're voting is scum, but you don't give reasoning to build a case?
Why do you expect everyone to play same way you do as town?
Yeah, because I'm totally scumreading you and everyone else that does not post or gamesolve like I do, and especially the several people that seem to have an issue with it.
You do not back up your reads; your gameplay is apathetic, and your responses seem like you're minimizing my reasons against you by saying
"why do you expect so much from me" - "there's no reason to scumread or lynch me"
In post 1354, Taly wrote:I disagree with your assessment because I've played multiple games with Ausuka and there's nothing about her that strikes me as awkward in this game, or what's in the scope of her town-game.
I don't know why it's hard to believe that I disagree with you when you don't explain how something is awkward, or the reasons behind your reads.
Not taking about ausuka specifically, just in general. You said syntax can't be scummy.
Are you going to address my other points onto you or are you going to respond to 1 thing I've stated and not the questions I've asked?
Maybe I will.
...So I completely don't understand your
Ausuka
scumread or why you're deflecting and defensively ignoring any point or question I respond to you with.
In post 1302, Taly wrote:So... you call an opening vote scummy, and then say the reason behind it is awkward when it was pledged to be a serious vote...
This looks to me like you're trying to place WIFOM or suspicion on Iconeum without really creating or backing up a certain stance. If you explained half of your assessments that would make it much easier to read you.
I called the wording awkward, not the reason.
Is that really hard to clarify?
In post 1360, Lovebird wrote:How could I not be taking a stance when I say "scummy"
Well, considering the wording is awkward to you, you're not providing a read there. Unless you think syntax is scummy?
In post 1302, Taly wrote:EVERYTHING in this post in meant to be read by EVERYONE.
wow. its almost like we are playing a group game.
-
I read half-most of the post. Honestly Taly, I would recommend you go back into your games and check how accurate your reads are because to me it looks like you're the type of super logical player that will never be anything above meh because every one of your 50 microanalyses is surface level. I'm VI reading you tbqh. Your scumreads aren't awful, but I don't really care for your stuff in general.
I'm not sitting here and saying
"Sheep
Taly
, no questions! He's got the gamesolved!"
I'm usually not confident in general D1, and my reads are a coinflip with accuracy.
But I
AM
confident in my
Lovebird
scumread, and out of all the wagons so far I feel like this lynch will most likely flip scum. This is my most townread wagon, and there is a valid case for
Lovebird
-scum.
How about you explain your thoughts and analysis instead of shading mine? Again, I don't know why I'm treated like a dumbass in this thread.
In post 1376, Mathdino wrote:please don't put me in a position to have to hard-defend lovebird and lalendra of all slots though
Hi
Mathdino
, I exist.
I don't understand your reads on
Lovebird
and
Lalendra
when you bring them up in being potential scum by PoE, but you put them in a
As I mentioned previously, Janitor has picked up his pace and I townread him more now. He still has his bad early game, but for now I don't want to push this. I am interested in Math's reasoning for wanting the janitor lynch though.
I wanted to 'pretend' to look at other lynches because the worst and me were out of sync. I was trying to see if we had common ground somewhere.
On Ausuka, I called out what I did not like. Hesitant to push because Ausuka is sharing my scumread on Lovebird and the worst's read on Lalendra.
My lovebird scumread is based on the fact that Lovebird is using EXTREMELY weak reasons to scumread myself (so a bit OMGUS, sure), and refusing to talk/reconsider when called out on it. If you read ISO of Lovebird, it's really bad too. No effort in building town circle, no effort in pushing own cases. Just bad.
BUT, as I just wrote previously, it could just be a troll playing town-dickhead.
The worst can be town. I sometimes tunnel like that myself as town, but i've not seen the worst do it (as any allignment). This is why I've put so much effort in trying to get him sorted.
I share some of your reads for
Lovebird
scum, but why is
Lovebird's
scumread to you OMGUS? ...Egh, that buzzword doesn't help pcerception.
The biggest thing I've seen so far for
Ausuka-scum
is the associative with
Ircher
revolving around her reads/waffling directed to him, but no specific interaction with him in relation to her... so I don't find it to be a very strong associative case.
Is there anything beyond that that makes you hesitant about her?
222 to 224 does not seem really interesting much at all, I like the question for why we should lynch vengeful; but I'm pretty sure vengeful would be better served as a scum utility than a town who could use a vig.
In post 409, Ircher wrote:That’s super irrelevant; when did you think I thought MathDino was MathBlade?
VOTE: Ircher
You've been tingling my scum sensors ever since your second post but I decided not to vote you because I wanted to see where the janitor wagon would go.
This post bothers me because it reacts to brass' comment as though it was supposed to be game solving. Furthermore, the question here is phrased in a way that tries to appear like its game solving itself. Honestly, this just feels like scum trying to look busy.
Add that to how Ircher seems intent on shutting down any form of setup spec and seems to focus too much on other people's reads (in my opinion) and judge them based on that. That makes me comfortable with this vote.
I am inclined to agree with everything Mutant says here but holding off on voting til I finish catching up.
Since you agree with
Mutant
((this question can also go to him))
on
Ircher's
earliest posts pinged you, what about it bothered you?
Also, what's odd about placing emphasis on other people's reads?
In post 419, Ausuka wrote:I can read Ircher well and I think this is his scumgame. The way I read Ircher is simple; he has an unique personality as town, which he doesn't really emulate as scum; additionally, as town he is generally a good player who makes sense and has good reads but can do odd things; as scum, he is often quite nickpicky and flat. I think this game shows the latter. (Although now that I've said this I probably can't use it in future games with him... oh well)
VOTE: Ircher
This is really helpful and definitely reinforces my Ircher scumlean.
Holy shit <post>429</post> sucks to read.
...You literally posted an entire wall (much of which was "fair enough, null") and then two posts later everyone is either null or neutral (not sure I understand the need to separate those) except you (shocking) and one person whose "posts continue to not really be good". That's it?
I like the independent assessment here and I'm getting a better idea of
Lalendra's
viewpoint, she's asserting some of her own thinking beyond her agreeing with
In post 550, Taly wrote:I'm sorry, can you mindread people and why they'd pick numbers they did for the draft?
There is a comically large difference between "the numbers are randomized" and "the numbers were carefully chosen by individual players in accordance with logic I'm just not privy to."
I just don't think it makes a lot of sense; anybody regardless of alignment could actively work toward getting a PR because it benefits their alignment.
I get that repeated numbers are probably not going to come from scum, but I don't see the draft being a strong way to discern someone's alignment without solid flip information.
In post 555, Mathdino wrote:Not Voting: The only one not voting that I'm actually townreading is Taly. Lalendra's ISO goes so far beyond "lynchbaity Lalendra" into the realm of "I am actively not doing anything this game".
This is a busy month for me, plus I had rehearsals Friday night and all day Saturday. I'm gonna try to make up for it now though \o/
Ausuka's <post>568</post> is super waffly in terms of a read on Ircher. I've never seen someone flip-flop that much on one person in one post.
Do you feel there's an associative between
Ircher
and
Ausuka
?
In post 1206, Lalendra wrote:And yeah, the self-meta in my sig is something that would help me as scum. But since I never roll scum (which sucks because I love it) it's mostly just there to say "anything you're thinking about me based on my tone, interactions, reads, or anything else is less likely because I'm scum and more likely because you don't like my playstyle."
I sympathize with this, but that's not the full reason behind my push on you.
A lot of your posting and responses don't feel very strong in one direction or another; you agree with other people's stances in regards to Ircher, and while you do state your reasons for your read there, and your reads, a lot of your posts seem like fluff.
1274 and 1275 are examples, above the other posts I've already linked about in this ISO dig.
In post 1254, Ircher wrote:And yes, there is a good reason to separate them: a null read indicates generally no read or a very conflicted read; a neutral read is a mixed read, but it is not a conflicted read; there is generally a clear leaning toward town or scum in a neutral read, just not a very confident one.
Ok, that seems to be the issue here then. You say "neutral" when I would say "town/scum lean." This makes more sense now.
OK yeah, this cleared up some things for me as well when reading
Ircher's
explanation here.
Does that change your thinking on him?
Lalendra wrote:Current readslist, since multiple people have asked:
Town:
Mathdino - His play is a little different than what I am used to here, but I think it's largely due to him not being super confident on who's scum. Usually he picks someone and runs them over like a truck, and while he's not doing that here, it still strikes me as town!Math.
Mutantdevle - Feeling pretty confident in town!Mutant here, largely because I agree with his reasoning and like the way he is presenting his thoughts. Seems like he's actively trying to gamesolve.
Simyk - I don't have any meta experience with Simyk, but they seem invested in gamesolving, are trying to advance the gamestate, and their tone is very towny.
Townlean:
davesaz - I wasn't sure how I felt about A50 but davesaz has moved this slot from null to townlean for me. Not as confident as I am with the townbloc above, but good vibes.
Eddie Cane - Again, not confident enough to say town for certain, but good vibes.
Myloninja13 - There really hasn't been enough from this slot to say for certain, but I'm feeling town.
Iconeum - I like what I've seen from them but need to see more active participation.
Taly - This seems like town!Taly from my meta experience.
Null:
the worst - Honestly not sure about this slot, I want to say town but feel like I can't make an unbiased opinion. Their tunneling of me could be town-motivated but I'm not crazy about the reasoning behind it; then again, I could just be mad they're tunneling me. I can't be impartial enough to figure it out yet.
The Janitor - I don't hate their posting but I'm having trouble determining whether it's a playstyle thing or actual scumminess.
Lovebird - I can't make sense of this slot either way.
Scumlean:
Ausuka - Nothing I've seen from Ausuka has struck me as particularly towny, especially the waffling/soft defense of Ircher and the defensiveness in their tone.
Scum:
Ircher - For the reasons I outlined in my last few posts.
Ehhh... just like a lot of people, there's not a lot of scumreads at the moment.
It is good that you made the readslist, it's helping progress the gamestate as I feel like it's slowing down a bit.
I didn't like that he was so against setup speccing. It didn't make sense, from a town perspective, to try to shut down any attempt at gamesolving. There's nothing inherently wrong with focusing on other people's reads, unless you are doing so to the exclusion of forming your own, which is what it seemed like he was doing.
I understand your point about the draft, however, it's really important to note that scum are not likely to pick duplicate numbers. You really can use the draft numbers to theorize about alignment because yes, while both alignments are trying to get power roles, scum are the only ones able to make a concerted effort not to step on one another's toes.
Re: your walls - your posts tend to be extremely lengthy and I have a hard time motivating myself to read them as a result. However, the one game I played with you before, you played the same way, so I don't think it's AI for you; it's just how you play.
Yes, I definitely see an associative between Ircher and Ausuka.
The explanation of his readslist doesn't really change my thinking, because a) I wasn't really basing my read on that to begin with and b) he still didn't have any strong reads, just nulls and leans. Not a problem in and of itself, but waffly, and not really that different from my original interpretation of a readslist that is largely useless.
Are there any more reasons behind an associative with
Ircher-Ausuka
?
Also,
Math
has stated that
Lovebird
and
Ausuka
cannot be scum together, and you're voting
Lovebird.
Do you think
Lovebird-Ircher-Ausuka
is a likely scumteam, then?
Ehhh.... I bold a lot to make reading my posts easier.
"Taly is going to be a hot mess all game and I am entertained" ~ Gammagooey
"The human race is bad at reading Taly." ~the worst
"Taly I knew your slot was scum and I still struggled to find arguments to SR your play lol" ~Infinity 324
"Taly wins for the most fence-sitty reads in a game ever" ~Battle Mage
Yeah, the 10-posts-a-day thing is not going to work when we're 72 hours from the deadline.
"Taly is going to be a hot mess all game and I am entertained" ~ Gammagooey
"The human race is bad at reading Taly." ~the worst
"Taly I knew your slot was scum and I still struggled to find arguments to SR your play lol" ~Infinity 324
"Taly wins for the most fence-sitty reads in a game ever" ~Battle Mage
- or starting sometime next week - for an entire week.
I'll still be posting, but it will be from my phone and it won't be the typical
Taly-walls
"Taly is going to be a hot mess all game and I am entertained" ~ Gammagooey
"The human race is bad at reading Taly." ~the worst
"Taly I knew your slot was scum and I still struggled to find arguments to SR your play lol" ~Infinity 324
"Taly wins for the most fence-sitty reads in a game ever" ~Battle Mage
In post 1483, Ircher wrote:This game state is exactly why we need a lynch.
Also, I know Lalendra is on V/LA (and they'll think I'm jerk a for stating this), but I would rather
not
wait til Monday (with 1-2 days before deadline left) to decide on a lynch.
I know its shitty to hate but I hate the timing of her VLA.
actually really really keen to lynch this. none of my townreads have come in and told me I'm being dumb since I cased her so
Well, town needs to be in sync ASAP with both the nature of this game and how quickly we are to the deadline; so it would help for you to both post links to your reasons on
Lalendra
-scum, and also compile a well-coherent case in a post.
I'm not as keen on the
Lalendra
lynch as I am with
Lovebird
, and the lack of response of my questions directed to
Lalendra
,
Iconeum
, and
Mathdino
so far have not changed my opinion.
I'm also about to go to bed. I hope I wake up and log on tomorrow to see more than 15 posts for an entire day... I'm not liking the growing sense of apathy happening. :/
"Taly is going to be a hot mess all game and I am entertained" ~ Gammagooey
"The human race is bad at reading Taly." ~the worst
"Taly I knew your slot was scum and I still struggled to find arguments to SR your play lol" ~Infinity 324
"Taly wins for the most fence-sitty reads in a game ever" ~Battle Mage
In post 221, Lalendra wrote:Inclined to sheep you because you're always power-town and better at this game than I'll ever be
But curious - If you have Beefster/Taly in the same bracket in terms of probability of being scum, why did you choose one over the other?
Hardcore buddying/TMI vibes on Math if he's town. This is a response to POST ELEVEN.
In post 409, Ircher wrote:That’s super irrelevant; when did you think I thought MathDino was MathBlade?
VOTE: Ircher
You've been tingling my scum sensors ever since your second post but I decided not to vote you because I wanted to see where the janitor wagon would go.
This post bothers me because it reacts to brass' comment as though it was supposed to be game solving. Furthermore, the question here is phrased in a way that tries to appear like its game solving itself. Honestly, this just feels like scum trying to look busy.
Add that to how Ircher seems intent on shutting down any form of setup spec and seems to focus too much on other people's reads (in my opinion) and judge them based on that. That makes me comfortable with this vote.
I am inclined to agree with everything Mutant says here but holding off on voting til I finish catching up.
Needlessly self consciously sheeping the obvious consensus
Fluffs until catchup posts, catchup posts contain nothing but randomly sheeping popular opinion and stating random non analytical things about game state
Constant buddying of Math, constant "active lurking", super generic reads
thats pretty much my issue with the random comments about gamestate (nothing analytical just like ..... facts and useless opinions?) and active lurking too
In post 1422, the worst wrote:so reads list is bad bc it mega generically sheeps math/eddie/simyk/taly type townreads for the most part
highly overexplains itself with incredibly shallow reasoning
poe's ausuka and ircher as their only two scum reads which like
....
if anyone thinks ausuka and ircher are scum together let's throw down a bet rn
if the day's still going, i'll write my post again tomorrow hopefully. work went too late today don't really feel it.
"Ima need to buy at least Josh a fucking tarot card reading because this dude is scary at picking up on scum before they even post what the fuck type of Ms. Cleo ass psychic ass mothafucka did yall allow to sign up for this site"
In post 1480, Taly wrote:How about you explain your thoughts and analysis instead of shading mine? Again, I don't know why I'm treated like a dumbass in this thread.
i think i've explained my thoughts plenty~
"Ima need to buy at least Josh a fucking tarot card reading because this dude is scary at picking up on scum before they even post what the fuck type of Ms. Cleo ass psychic ass mothafucka did yall allow to sign up for this site"
In post 1483, Ircher wrote:This game state is exactly why we need a lynch.
Also, I know Lalendra is on V/LA (and they'll think I'm jerk a for stating this), but I would rather
not
wait til Monday (with 1-2 days before deadline left) to decide on a lynch.
I know its shitty to hate but I hate the timing of her VLA.
actually really really keen to lynch this. none of my townreads have come in and told me I'm being dumb since I cased her so
shrug
shrug
i half called you dumb
"Ima need to buy at least Josh a fucking tarot card reading because this dude is scary at picking up on scum before they even post what the fuck type of Ms. Cleo ass psychic ass mothafucka did yall allow to sign up for this site"
Ausuka-chan, what do you SUPPOSE scum are doing if your scumreads are both Lalendra and Lovebird? With dueling counterwagons the universe where they are BOTH scum is puzzling to me but personally I am letting FLIPS sort it out
"I feel like you were probably what your slot needed. A powerful, respectful, and unwavering voice. Good job." - Gamma Emerald
"I have long since closed my eyes. My only goal is in the darkness." - Saske
For the purposes of the RECORD, Ahiru-tan, I do agree that Lalendra's posting is BAD, I do not find it as SCUMMY as Lovebird's posting.
I think generic reads and weak reasoning are much BETTER than DETACHED, ALIEN reasoning - to me it's entirely possible that Lalendra just FELT the same way as most of town and just THINKS like that, while Lovebird's read on Ausuka-chan does NOT make sense from a NEUTRAL standpoint ┐( ˘_˘)┌
"I feel like you were probably what your slot needed. A powerful, respectful, and unwavering voice. Good job." - Gamma Emerald
"I have long since closed my eyes. My only goal is in the darkness." - Saske
2 is one of the scummiest numbers in this setup, this was a valid question to ask. I can see this as scum if scum with Janitor (chainsaw defending his draft pick) but then we should probably fucking flip Janitor (the scummier player) first, no?
In post 9, Lovebird wrote:Btw, I asked a friend if I should pick 6 or 7. I thought 7, but she said 6. Annoying.
The scumteam coordinated the draft picks. They've done so in every iteration of this setup. Lovebird as scum would not be the one to coordinate everything.
I don't think Lovebird out of the blue comes up with a great idea to lie about where she got her number from. She was the first one to do this, and this is why she was town originally.
In post 302, SaskeIsMyYaoiKismesis wrote:LOVEBIRD can you TALK TO ME about WHY this sort of reasoning is MORE likely to come from scum? Σ(-᷅_-᷄๑)
[snip]
Also where do YOU think Math-sensei's townread of you is coming from? (ﾉ^ヮ^)ﾉ*:・ﾟ✧
Just, scummy way of talking. Nervousness, skittish.
Idk, I tricked math as scum before. Fine with him townreading me, though
And Lovebird did have reasons the whole time. Scum-Lovebird makes an effort to actually show that she's doing work instead of just plopping a vote on someone. If Lovebird were scum,
you would be townreading her.
And ffs she dismantled my townread of her by bragging about having tricked me, which is something that I never brought up. (key: she tricked me by just acting like powertown)
Me dropping the ball on defending her is part of why she's in this position. This is literally an anti-scum move if she's scum.
This was after I suggested policyvigging Lovebird.
Dying is worse for your alignment as scum than it is as town. Lovebird-scum is entirely capable of towning it up, instead she gives up.
The reason the "woe is me" doesn't fly with me usually is because scum use it for AtE. The question is whether Lovebird in particular just gives up on the game
WITH A DAYTALK SCUMTEAM
.
No, she fucking doesn't. She's town who doesn't give a shit.
In post 974, Lovebird wrote:Not explainging things isn't my scum style. Everyone just always townreads big walls and explanations anyways.
Proof that Lovebird is fully aware of how to be townread in a game like this.
These votes are suicidal. Lovebird is practically asking to be lynched here. If she were a Vengeful, then sure, but she wouldn't be demotivated about me asking her to be vigged if she were literally the vig/vengeful.
In post 1345, Lovebird wrote:Only taking out eddie and mutant because I think ausuka is scum.
I don't get the correlation?
You and ausuka both picked six. So, don't townread you, but if ausuka is scum then you'd be town. Think mutant is scum if you're scum, if you're town then your read probably right on him
This is nuanced reasoning and it actually makes sense from her POV. But again, she didn't make a show of it like she does as scum. She's holding her cards close.
Lovebird is town. I will only accept her death on an Ausuka townflip.
"I just want to play mafia, not Economics Wonderland." - cytheflyguy
This is a town motivated wagon. Eddie, SIMYK, Taly all likely town. Scum are hopping on near the end most likely. Guaranteed scum in {Lalendra, Ausuka}.
Wouldn't be surprised if Lalendra is getting bussed in the hopes that powertown pushes through Lovebird either.
But also note that Lalendra is a more important target for scum (if she's town) than Lovebird, as LB's almost certainly a VT.
So town, get your asses off Lovebird. If you don't like Lalendra's wagon, fine, we lynch Ausuka and vig Lovebird on a scumflip. I prefer The Janitor but Lalendra is a liability at this point anyway.
"I just want to play mafia, not Economics Wonderland." - cytheflyguy
Yeah, because I'm totally scumreading you and everyone else that does not post or gamesolve like I do, and especially the several people that seem to have an issue with it.
I'm not sitting here and saying 
I hope I wake up and log on tomorrow to see more than 15 posts for an entire day... I'm not liking the growing sense of apathy happening. :/
