Micro 803: The Coalition

[Wisdom]

/confirm

[Wisdom]

HEAL: math
HEAL: tw

[Wisdom]

Just heal whoever you get townvibes from like youd vote whoever youd get scumvibes from
Should be a decent rvs replacement

[Wisdom]

its HEAL: and HURT: , hiraki

[Wisdom]

HEAL: invisibility

[Wisdom]

hahaha that was adorable indeed

[Wisdom]

Why do you guys HURT people who arent in your coalition

Is it meant to signify you scumread someone or?

[Wisdom]

You, math, invisibility town

[Wisdom]

Do you think ausuka is town?

[Wisdom]

Try reading again

[Wisdom]

How do you feel about ausuka?

[Wisdom]

Because she HURT you or?

[Wisdom]

HURT: invisibility

[Wisdom]

dont feel as good about having her in my block

[Wisdom]

him*

[Wisdom]

I cant reliably read anyone in this playerlist

[Wisdom]

mylo why is the worst town to you?

[Wisdom]

I dont agree with ausuka but shes probably town

HEAL: ausuka

[Wisdom]

I thought you didn't like her, what changed?

[Wisdom]

idk
but whoever scumreads you isnt automatically scum

[Wisdom]

sure
Why is she "definitely town" now

[Wisdom]

you are not hiraki and thus you cannot know what pings him and what doesnt
tell me what scum motivation scum-hiraki has for expressing that scumread

[Wisdom]

Hiraki i don't think what ausuka is doing is scum motivated either
She feels like shes trying to use what little is in the thread to get a scumread

[Wisdom]

HEAL: hiraki
HURT: math

[Wisdom]

Then why hasn't she asked me why I'm scumreading her?

You're both put off by the other not doing what you expect them to
It doesn't work like that

[Wisdom]

mylo, invsibility and neenie; talk to us about the rest of your reads

[Wisdom]

sure but that doesnt help me read you
I want to know your thoughts

[Wisdom]

what do you mean by info coalition
if we fail to win we get info from it regardless

[Wisdom]

i dont get it
if someone is hard to read and good as scum they should just stay outside the coalition

[Wisdom]

the way i see it;
town play like town
other town identify them
scum are forced to tryhard and will likely slip up if theyre not very good scum
we go for the win and if we miss we see who's most likely to be scum in the coalition

[Wisdom]

alright
we have a margin of two townies being outside
along with two scumreads we could have those two be people who will be best at the game afterwards

[Wisdom]

though idk
i suppose whether youre town inside a failed coalition or town outside
you need to be someone who can be read
ie if we put the easily readable town outside and the harder inside we might have less of a chance succeeding at lynching the scum in a failed coalition

[Wisdom]

i think we should just go for 5 most town and work it from there if it fails

[Wisdom]

if we only put one scum in the coalition and we lynch them last we're in 5:1 with people we townread

how is that any better

not to mention that deletes any possibility of winning d1

[Wisdom]

4:1*

[Wisdom]

eh whatever
if people want to do math's thing i dont mind
just consider it a waste when we have the chance to instantly win

[Wisdom]

The coalition is basically a group guilty if we fail it
We know theres at least one scum in there and we have 3 lynches to get it
Its not that bad considering we'll have mostly widely townread people in it

[Wisdom]

here

[Wisdom]

That theyre likely both town

[Wisdom]

scum dont have much incentive to invest on a scumread in this game
they care more about how they appear
Its not like hiraki will get a lynch on ausuka today or the opposite
So it felt like someone with no knowlege trying to get somewhere, on both sides

[Wisdom]

I mean you know you are town so you should want to be in the block as its one less scum that will be in it
But that will be more relevant towards the end of the day, right now im more interested in people who youd like to place in the block other than yourself

@mylo

[Wisdom]

Phonepost
Hiraki is scum

explain

[Wisdom]

regarding math i have this feeling that hes intentionally not playing very protown because that's whats expected from scum him

[Wisdom]

but idk how scum math is and if he tries to play to townmeta or not
I just feel like wed be normally be at the samelength here about townies best interest being to be strongly town and we arent

[Wisdom]

same wavelength*

[Wisdom]

HEAL: mylo
HEAL: wisdom

this is a good block for now

[Wisdom]

but 2 players have basically not checked in and i detest handing out town badges when 1/4 of the rest of the game has no content

what do lurkers have to do with you expressing if someone is town or not

[Wisdom]

Unless everyone is a pushover and the entire group is just some dumb shit like Mylo-sheeping-Duck-sheeping-Wisdom.

I dont get what youre trying to say here

[Wisdom]

HURT: wisdom

the only thing i agreed with is we need no lolhammers here

[Wisdom]

Ausuka vs Hiraki. Hiraki was very scummy in that interaction.

yeah i obviously disagree so could you be more specific

[Wisdom]

Votes for oneself are valid.

@neenie

[Wisdom]

i like neenie too

[Wisdom]

tw who are the four people youd keep out as of now

[Wisdom]

Why mylo?

[Wisdom]

HURT: hiraki
HEAL: neenie

this is better

[Wisdom]

you mean invisibility's scumread on hiraki? Because i dont remember hiraki shading invisibility

idk, waiting to hear what invisibility is seeing there

[Wisdom]

@Wisdom - how sure are you on Neenie? I want you to read his posts for substance not character.

she felt genuine enough

[Wisdom]

What is confusing?

[Wisdom]

lol ausuka pls dont

[Wisdom]

lol ausuka pls dont

What did Ausuka do?

And what if you thoughts on Ausuka right now?

iso and see her avatar

[Wisdom]

why nm?

[Wisdom]

I'm town

who else is town

[Wisdom]

I still asked another question.

shes still town

[Wisdom]

how do you have a townread on nm over literally anyone else

[Wisdom]

why not neenie?

[Wisdom]

i guess
it depends on what each player's idea of town game is

[Wisdom]

math/invisibility/nm

2 of these three imo

[Wisdom]

yes, neenie is town @hiraki

[Wisdom]

idk
his posts dont make much sense to me and i constantly feel like he should be playing differently than he is

[Wisdom]

yeah but see thats what expected from scum-him, so maybe he doesnt powertown so as not to draw suspicion

this playerlist has many people who are familiar with him

[Wisdom]

hiraki youre worrying me
nm has done nothing town
your reasons for not townreading people are bad

[Wisdom]

oh now youre shading me as well

[Wisdom]

no, i mean on top of you being scummy now youve begun to shade me as well

why do you immediately jump to scum-wisdom here, math? youve seen town-me enough and recently to know this is it

[Wisdom]

btw i 100% dont antagonize you here as scum
assuming id play to a powertown meta id absolutely buddy you and even work with you
so where are you getting the idea im not town here, math? what's my master plan here?

[Wisdom]

whats confusing about this game
why are you having cold feet

[Wisdom]

orchestrated how?

[Wisdom]

what do you think my narrative is here

[Wisdom]

for what?
you were supposedly waiting for nm and neenie
theyve both posted
now what are you waiting for

[Wisdom]

Invis is scum btw right?

yes

[Wisdom]

ok
i think its invisibility and math
im okay with not_mafia and hiraki being the other two out of the block since people are divided on them
the other 5 are a block that should win this

[Wisdom]

nah
tw doesnt feel like hes opportunistically trying to shade me here, unlike math

[Wisdom]

not that youll care about selfmeta, but you havent actually seen me being confident of a townread yet

[Wisdom]

not that youll care about selfmeta, but you havent actually seen me being confident of a townread yet

Is that talking to me? You sound confident enough.

Im way more confident than this when im actually confident

[Wisdom]

i suppose thats fair
if its math/invisibility math would probably try a little more
not losing d1 is more important than how hes meta read

[Wisdom]

why?

[Wisdom]

math why are you townreading me now when you were spreading shade on me earlier?

[Wisdom]

In my ideal world, I would take wisdom, Hiraki, Mylo, and invisibility
And lynch invisibility if things went wrong

...i am not getting my ideal world however

How the hell do you have invisibility in an ideal block
It seems like you yourself know this block will fail

[Wisdom]

there you go again with assuming i cant fake things as scum

and what tell? there are people way townier than invisibility and you say it yourself than hes likely scum with mylo
how the hell can he be in your ideal townblock

unless you are still going for something different than a townblock

[Wisdom]

so null on neenie, null on tw, null on ausuka
yet invisibility is better than those because..?

[Wisdom]

ausuka how are you townreading math here

[Wisdom]

so what? this is ridiculously shallow

[Wisdom]

and why did you heal invisibility wtf

HURT: ausuka

[Wisdom]

HEAL: hiraki

[Wisdom]

replace nm with neenie
i dont feel good with him in the block

[Wisdom]

why is nm town?

[Wisdom]

why though? This feels like youre just mindlessly sheeping

And what do you mean you can confirm it?

@mylo

[Wisdom]

Because if it fails, we've probably caught the scum.

except we dont want it to fail

[Wisdom]

I dont like 519
Its like neenie is echoing the opinions of everyone else

HURT: neenie
HEAL: nm

[Wisdom]

Like, i hurt ausuka, she doesnt like ausuka
Math doubts tw, she doubts tw
I heal hiraki but im hesistant on nm, she says the same thing
And even the way she treats the coalition feels like a math sheep

[Wisdom]

Because if it fails, we've probably caught the scum.

except we dont want it to fail

^
This is the way math has approached this

[Wisdom]

Speaking of, if you are okay with math adding invisibility, why are you not okay with ausuka doing it?

[Wisdom]

I was

never

entirely sure waht I thought of the Duck. I mean I sort of townread him, but not quite enough to add him to my block.

I do not know what to make of the Duck

now

.

See the bold?

[Wisdom]

yes her "was i so bad" answer shows guilty conscience but thats secondary

[Wisdom]

interesting
*goes althunting*

[Wisdom]

got it

[Wisdom]

Yeh, its brie

And this is the game she was referencing, where i caught her d1

[Wisdom]

It doesn't help that everyone not in Hiraki's group is being scummy as fuck

tho I think I might put Neenie back in. It doesn't make much sense to point me to her scumgame if she's scum here

[Wisdom]

I don't think scumteams are necessarily playing ideally though

I just got burned in a game because I tried to outguess scum and they didn't do what I was expecting

Like, do you expect a team of, say, mylo and Invisibility, to figure that out and make it work?

@math

[Wisdom]

what's WIM

[Wisdom]

you think tw is scum here?

[Wisdom]

It just hasn't been to my advantage to be shouting that because what the fuck can i do about it

I dont get it
If you scumread tw you can shout about it so we don't include him in the block
How is not doing anything better

[Wisdom]

i suppose
let's assume Hiraki/NM/Mylo/tw/Wisdom is the block
and let's assume it fails, who do we lynch then
I'd prolly vote Mylo and pressure there

[Wisdom]

it would probably be nicer if the coalition was a side thing and we could vote for the D1 lynch normally, with the coalition taking effect when we got a lynch

i suppose we could achieve the same with pseudovoting, but would everyone care to do it?

[Wisdom]

like we all vote normally and keep count of an unofficial vc ourselves, mod can just ignore it

[Wisdom]

but we'd all have to agree that when we get a (pseudo)hammer the coalition that's most voted at that point goes through, no questions asked

[Wisdom]

i mean, thats part of what Im saying

[Wisdom]

If we have majority on someone by pseudos then we obviously also have majority on blocks that dont include that person

then we can just work it out between those blocks

[Wisdom]

hiraki i want to heal neenie
who should i remove

[Wisdom]

HURT: tw
HEAL: neenie

[Wisdom]

because that's for myself

[Wisdom]

this has already been discussed
we heal ourselves when we're ready for a hammer

[Wisdom]

i feel like this is going nowhere

can we just agree on a wisdom/mylo/hiraki/nm/neenie coalition and see what happens?

[Wisdom]

hes hard to read but him having the same reads as i do means hes probably town
and hiraki seems to think so as well and maybe he can read him better than i can

[Wisdom]

eh i feel better about mylo recently

[Wisdom]

tw feels town in every game until youre familiar with his scum meta
In Stack The Deck I was townreading him until this was pointed out to me and only then I figured out he was scum
Math was also who figured tw-scum there so him not liking tw here also makes me wary

[Wisdom]

I didnt say im seeing similarities with stack the deck

[Wisdom]

why? Cant they be both town?

[Wisdom]

Having confident reads when there's no actual pressure is hard.

this
Thats why i want to move on

[Wisdom]

Does anyone here know how to read Not_Mafia?

Yes, he's likely scum

explain?

[Wisdom]

Like regardless of scum inside the bloc Neenie is easily the best bet for scum outside it

Which bloc is "bloc"
Because she is inside mine

[Wisdom]

I'm going with the hiraki/NM version which seems to be the one people agree on the most.

what people are those? I see nobody agreeing with that specific bloc other than hiraki and nm

[Wisdom]

My argument there is basically

If the townbloc is correct it has to be Math/Invis, Math/Neenie or Invis/Neenie fmpov. Based on resistance

from those players

I don't really think scum is one of those pairs, i.e that bloc is correct.

Considering tw is fine with the version without him and the same goes for Neenie, I don't think anything changes there, unless I'm missing something.

Okay, define resistance then
Because i see none of those three players agreeing with the bloc

[Wisdom]

That depends on playstyle
Not everyone can plausibly fake strong resistance

[Wisdom]

I'll give you that its probably not math+someone outside the block because math would try more

[Wisdom]

Invis/neenie or invis/tw have decent chances though
I dont see any of those aggressively going against popular opinion and not being suspected

[Wisdom]

This phase is going on way too long, just pick a coalition that has none of Math, Invis and Ausuka and we’re golden

so vote for mine
swap tw for neenie

[Wisdom]

when my scumreads are more willing to sheep me than my townreads

Youre not trying to make me sheep you
I asked you why nm is scum

[Wisdom]

how is his town game then?

[Wisdom]

also i dont particularly see him trying to be in the bloc

[Wisdom]

math why are you so different
In stack the deck i enjoyed reading your posts and found myself wanting to explore anything you came up with
Here i constantly just feel you make little sense if any, its like I'm playing with someone else

[Wisdom]

okay then we agree

vote for my block so we can move on finally

[Wisdom]

HEAL: wisdom

[Wisdom]

I even took out tw because i value your doubts on him
I cant agree with your nm read though

[Wisdom]

you just said you want to move on to lynching
you can speed that up with your vote
how does your vote not matter

[Wisdom]

yeah and i repeat, you want to leave this thing and move on to lynching
which you can help speed up with your vote
And youre not doing that because?

@math

[Wisdom]

Wisdom, with what you said about the Duck's scum meta, do you mean to say he is scummy here?

nah im more leaning town than scum

[Wisdom]

WHAT CAN I TYPE THAT WILL SPEED ANYTHING UP

LITERALLY WRITE THE POST FOR ME

heal the 5 players im healing

[Wisdom]

Code: Select all

[hurt]invisibility[/hurt]
[heal]nm[/heal]
[heal]neenie[/heal]

there

[Wisdom]

good
Hiraki and nm; make the swap pls

[Wisdom]

well too bad
You said numerous times you dont trust your reads to offer a better coalition
so now youll go with mine

[Wisdom]

why is invisibility town?

[Wisdom]

that didnt sound like a townread
more like you still want to put scummy people in there

[Wisdom]

i dont see anything town motivated
Just pointless questions
Youre telling me thats what he does as town?

[Wisdom]

come on
we will get nowhere like this

@hiraki

[Wisdom]

no i prefer neenie

[Wisdom]

Which potentially leaves me with a Math/Ausuka scumteam

considering what math is doing, very unlikely

[Wisdom]

why is there so much rush?
we have 12 days

lmao

[Wisdom]

come on
we will get nowhere like this

@hiraki

Why should I switch to a coalition that I think has scum?

because we have to move on
compromise

[Wisdom]

because this phase does nothing to help get reads
its hard to get confident reads when theres no pressure

[Wisdom]

HURT: neenie
HEAL: tw

[Wisdom]

i feel like scum would only want to rush if they had a buddy or themselves in their wagon

you dont say

[Wisdom]

welp

VOTE: tw

[Wisdom]

if we end up losing because of tw instead of neenie i swear

[Wisdom]

He said he was okay with my bloc but didnt vote it
Maybe he thought it wasnt really happening and he was safe

[Wisdom]

VOTE: invisibility
can we lynch this first

[Wisdom]

I'm not voting hiraki
if youre town youre tunneling and it's boring

[Wisdom]

No you have to keep reevaluating posts from zero instead of reading them with bias because otherwise youll just see scum motivation where it doesn't exist

[Wisdom]

Like, what has hiraki done that on your opinion absolutely can't be town motivated?

[Wisdom]

in*

[Wisdom]

Wisdom, why did Invisibility turn from town to scum? In 64 you called him town but later was pretty sure he was mafia?

he felt newbtown to gut at first
Then he just continued doing nothing and the pass ended

[Wisdom]

because he's done nothing but ask pointless questions
when asked to explain his reads his answers are bad

[Wisdom]

and now hes even voting me for some reason

[Wisdom]

tell us your decision

[Wisdom]

if youre scumreading nm how were you ok with the coalition

[Wisdom]

and don't cite math
math was clear about not agreeing but voting just cause he had to

[Wisdom]

whats wrong with his vote? Who did you expect him to vote?

[Wisdom]

sure? The coalition failed, meaning, from his pov, someone in {wisdom, hiraki, mylo, tw} is scum
Do you think youve been townier than the former three

[Wisdom]

you know hurt removes scumreads from the bloc and otherwise does nothing, right?
Not hurting doesnt equal not having scumreads

[Wisdom]

ill just let nm answer and meanwhile ill do this

VOTE: tw

[Wisdom]

Wisdom is town but i'm going to keep voting Wisdom for a next few posts because i'm still mad

mad for what?

[Wisdom]

yeah we should have gone in circles for two more weeks

not to mention the deadline stayed for this phase so we'd have less time for this phase if we took too long

[Wisdom]

so who is actual scum, invisibility?

[Wisdom]

so scum in the block is NM for you?

[Wisdom]

if anyone is lowering morale its you with this defeatist attitude
you said you wanted to move on because the previous phase didnt appeal to your strengths
now whats your excuse for continuing this bullshit

[Wisdom]

I don't have the energy to continually call half the game shit for tryna lynch outside the bloc

I really do not know who it is

Preference for Not_Mafia

the only one trying to lynch outside the block at the moment is Invisibility and even he has declared preference for NM
so how is this frustration warranted

[Wisdom]

can we not lynch nm

i dont feel comfortable given tw, math AND invisibility support it

[Wisdom]

im talking to whoever is town

math is weird as fuck
tw is most likely the scum in the coalition
invisibility is just scummy

theres no way this is a town wagon

nm has done nothing outside of his usual town meta for them to scumread

[Wisdom]

i'm not going to lynch a V/LA duck after i just got strongarmed into dropping him into a coalition against his will, dude

i dont even

[Wisdom]

vla is a bs excuse
hes clearly capable of answering

[Wisdom]

ebwop: I meant math is using it as an excuse as if him being vla means we shouldnt pressure or lynch him, not that tw is faking vla

[Wisdom]

i dont understand this "randomly pinning it on the duck" argument

Again, from his pov, one of the rest of us in the coalition is scum

Hiraki, Mylo and myself are way townier than tw

It's natural to think tw is the reason it failed

[Wisdom]

neenie who do you see as scum with nm? everyone seems to be okay with his lynch

[Wisdom]

or we can lynch tw and then invisibility and win
math if it isnt invisibility

[Wisdom]

ok but this is d1 why are we discussing associatives and not lynching the most conspicuously scummy as fuck player and sorting out their partner tomorrow?

anyone who thinks NM treats his partner the way NM has treated my slot is absolutely nuts or needs to read NM in ISO with more critical thinking. we've been scum together before and it was a fucking blast. this ain't it. if I were scum with NM how fucking easily could I have dug in my heals and insisted that one of us were not in the coalition? wonky access and lack of energy for mafia aside, I never to into d1 phase 2 as scum with a 2/5 chance of one of us being lynched.

this entire situation is actually steaming bullshit and uncomfortably I feel like Wisdom should know better than how he's acting

where the fuck did i argue that youre scum with NM?

[Wisdom]

my stance cant be more fucking clear
i think nm is flipping town and i think that youre scum with invisibility or math
so how the fuck are you twisting that into "wtf wisdom cant be possibly thinking im scum with nm"?

[Wisdom]

everyone is ok with his lynch???? I only see myself Math and Ausuka here? there is active counterwagoning? what are you even angling at?

what? Literally everyone other than Hiraki and myself have stated being comfortable with lynching NM

[Wisdom]

I still think you're town you're just playing at like a tenth of your IQ here bro. I'm fighting every urge not to turn this thread into a massive unnecessary TvT shitfight.

yeah you better make this appear like tvt by belittling me
totally the first time scum do it to me

[Wisdom]

958 is nai are you kidding me

[Wisdom]

^this is still scum

[Wisdom]

lmao are you still making it look like im pushing youre scum with nm?