Long term health of mafiascum

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Post Post #754 (isolation #0) » Wed Apr 04, 2018 5:22 am

Post by Kison »

I think this is a great discussion to have. It's a topic I've recently been honing in on & working to make improvements towards.

It's difficult to pinpoint any one thing as a cause for the slowdown. My theory is it's a combination of:
1) More people use mobile devices. The site itself is not very mobile-friendly from a UI perspective & forum mafia is not easily played on a phone.
2) Alternatives. For the longest time, we were the goto place for forum mafia. Even though other communities played the game, it wasn't their niche. We've fallen behind a bit here with other sites offering better game automation.
3) SEO - it's not as strong as it once was. This is likely due to the first two points as well as Wiki falling out of date. Out of date info means fewer people link to us. Fewer people linking to us means lower search rankings.

There's a whole slew of things we can do to make improvements:
1) We need to upgrade the board. We're currently on a very-outdated 3.0.x version of phpBB. Upgrading to 3.2.x gives us a nice mobile responsive layout out of the box & allows us to make modifications much more easily.
2) Automating the queues to some extent - makes it easier to see what's coming up & allows us to begin tracking some stats, and also opens the door for...
3) Moderator tools. Even if we merely automated vote counts, the gameplay experience is greatly improved & eases the burden on the supply-strained moderator pool.

Just getting those 3 things done will put us in a much better place.

Beyond that, there are a lot of other things we can do:
- Fix up the home page. I've been watching things like a hawk lately, and a lot of people drop off either right there, or on the graphic. I say put the info from the graphic right onto the home page.
- Fix up the Wiki. T-Bone has recently taken point on this, so . :)
- Automated PM to new users explaining what to do. We lose a lot of people right after they activate their account. I have no proof for why, but my suspicion is they're overwhelmed with what to do next.
- Email/PM users who don't return after X days. This could just help retain people who have forgotten about us.
- Better social presence. We've had next to nothing here up to now. We've recently started ramping up our & accounts. Again, keeps people engaged if they don't visit the site for a while.
- Email newsletters: Maybe every 1-3 months. Keeps people engaged.

Longer term goals: Our main offering here is forum mafia, but if we expand to other areas, it gives us a new pool of players to tap into:
- Implosion had the idea of building a "xylbot" type tool right into sitechat, allowing people to play games in there. I think this is a great "low hanging fruit" project we can tackle relatively easily.
- Other realtime app - building an app out on an entirely different part of the website.

Anyways, that's just what's been going through my head for the past month or so on this topic & the path I think we need to take. But obviously I've been in the trenches so it's great to see what other people view as problem areas.
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Post Post #758 (isolation #1) » Wed Apr 04, 2018 8:22 am

Post by Kison »

I'm happy to look at what you have & work with you to integrate it into the site if you think it'll work. I think we need to get to a point where we're not relying on 3rd party tools that scrape the board, but instead build them right into the site.
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Post Post #763 (isolation #2) » Wed Apr 04, 2018 6:00 pm

Post by Kison »

In post 761, Flubbernugget wrote:Is the site's source on any sort of a public git/svn/etc repository? I've always wanted to take a look out of morbid curiosity
Yeah, everything is here: https://github.com/mafiascum

You can see the existing code as well as everything we've done towards the upgrade.
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Post Post #786 (isolation #3) » Mon Apr 09, 2018 4:19 am

Post by Kison »

New users coming in
is
an issue. I'm not just guessing on that one(or on the SEO decline) - we review numbers at the start of each month.

Retention could also be an issue, but I haven't found a solid way to track that yet.
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Post Post #791 (isolation #4) » Mon Apr 09, 2018 9:57 am

Post by Kison »

Would love to hear your ideas! :)
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Post Post #800 (isolation #5) » Tue Apr 10, 2018 5:04 am

Post by Kison »

While we haven't ruled out any sort of ranked system, I don't see that as a low hanging fruit. If we were to go that route we'd likely do so once game automation - or at least game tracking - is first in place.
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Post Post #809 (isolation #6) » Thu Apr 12, 2018 11:25 am

Post by Kison »

In post 801, GreyICE wrote:Low hanging fruit is probably a better start page and a better newbie queue. The entire splash page screams "early on 2000s"
I certainly agree on the home page and would like to tackle that at some point soon. I think the main goal should be to explain the site better & do away with the graphic. While the latter is informative, it's a bit overwhelming & having to view it on a completely separate page is not very friendly. We should probably link directly to the registration page as well.

In other news, just a few days ago we launched an automatic "welcome PM" that is sent to non-alt users on their first login:

Spoiler:
Welcome to MafiaScum, NewUser! We're glad to have you!

To sign up for your first newbie game, visit the and post
/in
. You will be added to the queue & receive a private message when your game begins.

If you're a more experienced player, you can find more games in the forum.

Good luck & we hope you have fun!

I'm sure the messaging can be improved, but several new users have already clicked through to the queue from the message itself.
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Post Post #816 (isolation #7) » Thu Apr 12, 2018 6:32 pm

Post by Kison »

- List of games currently in signups (this is HUGE - but requires some work to automate queues more)
- List of games in need of replacements (optional, might not be our best foot forward)
- List of newbie queue games currently in signups

I'd love it if signups were automated, and could send out a specific email when the queue popped. Or maybe even the option for a text message? Is a text too complex?
These are all things we'll be doing immediately after we upgrade the board. Which is getting fairly close, by the way(if you're good with CSS, let me know as you'll speed up the process quite a bit).

Text notifications would be simple. If the demand is there, we could figure something out.

As for Marathons, I've dug into it a bit. It looks like we used to do them multiple times a year until about 2015. As far as I can tell, there's no real coordination for when the next one will be. I'll see if we can come up with some kind of schedule, or at the very least announce the next one well in advance.
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Post Post #845 (isolation #8) » Wed Apr 18, 2018 3:51 pm

Post by Kison »

Ranking queue
: I'd be fine with things like win/loss stats & have always thought that would be great. I definitely agree with those who say figuring out an actual "rank" would be very difficult. I'm sure we could figure it out but (1) there are many prerequisites to getting there, (2) whether it would actually be beneficial isn't guaranteed and (3) even if we were sure it'd be beneficial, I personally think there are many other more beneficial projects to tackle, so would leave that to someone else to figure out.

SEO
: I've been playing around with this a lot this month. I was able to increase our rank for the search term
mafia roles
just by modifying the title of the to "
Mafia Roles - MafiaWiki
". This brought us from position 3 to 2. Changed the home page title & meta description, our rank for
play mafia online
moved from 7 to 3.

This is proof to me that a low hanging fruit is optimizing content on the site.

Terms I know bring in some decent volume:
mafia card game
mafia online
mafia party game

We can & should create pages to fulfill clicks originating from those searches & optimize them for those specific keywords. That should help us rank better & also improve engagement for people who actually click through.

Otherwise, I think we just need to do some research on what terms would make sense to target.

Upgrade / Automation
: Still my main priority. We made some more progress on upgrading this weekend, knocking out a few more tough features. I probably won't have time to do much on it myself for another week, but we're getting there.
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Post Post #848 (isolation #9) » Mon Apr 23, 2018 4:56 am

Post by Kison »

Well, if anyone is interested in writing content for pages that are relevant for any such search terms, let me know & I'll work with you to get the pages created. We should offer more than useless fluff though. For example, since we have our own Mafiascum Cards, it's a topic on which we can offer content for someone searching "mafia card game".
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Post Post #850 (isolation #10) » Mon Apr 23, 2018 6:57 am

Post by Kison »

Yep, exactly. Relevant, useful content.
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Post Post #852 (isolation #11) » Mon Apr 30, 2018 6:20 pm

Post by Kison »

I usually track SEO at the start of the month. Figured there's no reason not to share this here. Low numbers are better:

Spoiler:
Mar 1 2017
Mar 6 2017
Mar 9 2017
Mar 14 2017
Mar 17 2017
Mar 20 2017
Apr 1 2017
Nov 13 2017
Mar 4 2018
Apr 1 2018
May 2018
mafia
35
19
43
33
33
35
30
35
78
-
17
forum mafia
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
mafia game
14
14
20
8
20
17
18
30
22
43
23
mafia party game
21
29
25
18
15
14
14
32
58
61
56
play mafia
14
16
8
11
-
10
8
7
20
20
5
play mafia online
4
6
-
3
4
4
5
4
4
7
3
werewolf
-
-
10
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
forum werewolf
13
-
-
11
10
15
10
10
90
29
75
werewolf game
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
werewolf party game
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
play werewolf
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
177
-
-
-
play werewolf online
48
47
-
45
45
48
44
60
69
76
50
mafia roles
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
3
2
mafia strategy
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
3
2
mafia setups
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
1
1
mafia online
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
5
mafia game online
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
10
mafia card game
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
72
how to play mafia
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
20
werewolf game online
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
mafia card game online
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
8
online mafia
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
9
mafia party game online
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
8
how to play mafia card game
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
39
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Post Post #860 (isolation #12) » Fri May 04, 2018 4:36 am

Post by Kison »

Which shot-down ideas are you referring to exactly, GreyICE? I can't speak for anyone else, but I haven't shot anything down.

Things have been done / are in progress, but coding is hard & everyone helping out is volunteering their time. I've tried to list out some things
non-coders
can do, because, well, I just don't have time to do them myself.
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Post Post #862 (isolation #13) » Fri May 04, 2018 10:27 am

Post by Kison »

Admittedly I missed most of the conversation in this thread when it happened. I was insanely busy with life for years and not around much. So, sorry about that. Anyways, I'm here now with what time I can spare. I definitely understand your frustration that not much changes. Pitch an idea and I'll hear it out. But realize I'm not a magician(I wish I was!) and only have so much time, so I have to choose carefully what I spend my time on. :)

I posted an outline of what I think we should work towards in . Not sure if you've read it. A lot of it
is
"the same, but better", but that's because those are things we really need. Everyone who wants the "win / loss" stats, for example, we need certain things built before we can get there in a reasonable way. We can get there faster if people are willing to help.

There are other ideas there too. I want to move us beyond just forum mafia into more realtime apps(site chat, something standalone). Again though, these things take a lot of work.

I'm not sure if your complaint is more with changing policy in how the site operates.
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Post Post #883 (isolation #14) » Tue May 08, 2018 12:47 pm

Post by Kison »

In post 865, davesaz wrote:I have back end and design skills. No experience at all in the web page coding/generating and UI part, but if you need conceptual user experience story design or data storage/processing/retrieval just say the word. The site needs a way to identify volunteers who have the skills it needs. And accept help...
I can add you to the coding group / Slack team if you'd like. The skillset of the people currently in the group includes(but isn't limited to) designers, professional programmers & hobby programmers. Just shoot me a PM.
In post 864, MathBlade wrote:A sitechat bot is not a simple task due to the networking and PHP ick (I hate PHP but understand it is a requirement with vbulletin) not to mention scum chat etc that would be needed.
I'm not sure how you envisioned a bot working, but I see it as being a feature of site chat itself, not a separate, external service. Site Chat's back end is Java. No PHP at all.
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Post Post #887 (isolation #15) » Wed May 23, 2018 9:28 am

Post by Kison »

Added. :)
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Post Post #946 (isolation #16) » Tue Jun 26, 2018 5:14 pm

Post by Kison »

In case anyone is confused where the above came from, I provided the data, so it is accurate.
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Post Post #953 (isolation #17) » Wed Jun 27, 2018 5:13 am

Post by Kison »

I'd say it's worrying but not depressing. The first step towards fixing anything is being aware of the problem rather than being complacent & denying it.
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Post Post #967 (isolation #18) » Wed Jun 27, 2018 4:36 pm

Post by Kison »

There's an absolute ton that can be done. Fewer people are coming in likely as a combination of these reasons:

1) Very little has progressed in the past 5 years. This has allowed other sites to become compelling in ways we aren't, so we must catch back up. I like moving fast, so we will catch up no problem.
2) Lack of mobile support. Wasn't as important 5 years ago as it is now.
3) SEO decline. Because of the above mostly.

It is very clear that the following needs to happen:

1) Upgrade the board. This provides a ton of benefit, primarily improved search performance & superior mobile support. This is slated to be done sometime in July.
2) Improved game signup queues. Game signups can be made
far
more navigable & visible(right on the index page if we wanted to). But it also allows us to begin tracking important data to do #3. Once the upgrade is done, the plan is for chamber, myself & whoever else I can persuade to wrap this project up. I'm going to take over a queue to use as a testing ground.
3) Game automation. Doubtful we'll ever automate everything, with some theme games having super weird mechanics, but if we can automate the most cumbersome aspects of moderating it will (1) improve the playing experience and (2) ease the strain on moderator supply.

The above path is a no brainer. It makes the site a lot more compelling and should organically draw people in. It's just scratching the surface, though. I (and I'm sure others) have an endless supply of ideas for things that could be built or improved upon. So my #1 focus is really just myself programming & giving other programmers what they need to keep moving. Everything else is secondary for now.

A lot of non technical things can be done as well & I've suggested a few I think are incredibly important like SEO content. I think there's a lot of other stuff. I'm impressed by how excited people are for something like SUPP. It'd be great to have more events like that, but they need someone to come up with the idea & run it. If we have a flaw as a team, I think it is that we sometimes spend too much time on things that really don't matter all that much.
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