Mini Normal 2009: Day 6

[HeWhoSwims]

VOTE: Beefster

Counter wagon.

How did you guys let him get away with starting a counterwagon just like that?

VOTE: Beefster

Also hi everyone I've played with before! My last mini normal feels long ago sorta. Good luck and let's have a good game.

[HeWhoSwims]

I ran it by my bookies and they say it's L-1

[HeWhoSwims]

Oh right. Time to fire some people then.

How serious is this vote, Tex?

[HeWhoSwims]

I don't think 55 is all that bad. I'm also of the opinion D1 should definitely be a thing and I wouldn't really see scum attacking town for something like this early on. There's no scum motivation for that I think. Attacking as cumbuddy maybe but it's a bit early to call a team lol

The defense in 62 is a bit much yes but she has to defend herself. I'll not be bothered by it for now.

I don't see how a dice based RVS vote is bad or scummy... Seems NAI to me.

[HeWhoSwims]

Currently townleaning Beef, profil, wilky (slightly), and DDS.

Scumleaning UnaBombaH.

Hmmm I'm not feeling too well about that scumread I don't really see the reason too much. Tiny tiny tiny bit of omgus but idk whether it's something to look into right now. Didn't feel the post right before your vote was that bad? What exactly causes your townreads esp. wilky?

Doesn't seem like our friend Gustavo is interested in explain it, anyways.

Explain what? Maybe I’m just confused or something but I have answered you question twice. Once before you asked and once after you asked. If you want something additional please let me know. I’m an open book

It's about speeding D1. What's the benefit from a town perspective? You lynch half random. You have less to go off on future days. So according to you what exactly is the town motivation in passing the day quickly?

Yes I did. Did you not read where I said that was naive thinking?

You imply texcat isn't giving motivation. She did. You say you said it was naive thinking. Sure you did but is it like that because you say so...?

I find giving scum motivation more... binary, objective than you claiming it's naive thinking, don't think your counterargument is really comparable if that makes sense. Weak defense.

[HeWhoSwims]

Spoiler: Many quotes

You have nothing to go off of. Literally nothing. Even in games where we have lynched scum day 1, it’s taken days for town to find the partners. I can’t speak to town motivation as a whole but for me my motivation is to bypass a statistically useless phase and move on to statistically more useful phases. I’m definitely not the only person who hates day 1. Idk why everyone is acting like I am or acting like my opinion of day 1 is so bad.

Yeah but if you don't plant seeds you can't grow trees And I'd guess any interaction helps the game but eh

texcat is scum

Hmm 10/10 post

It doesn’t matter how many anti-town reasons you give, that still doesn’t mean I’m scum

Doesn't scum usually do nontown things =)

I don't see it as null. Not liking d1 is null, actively expressing you'd like a quick lynch in d1 without much info is not.

QFT

(1) Like despite all my hatred of day 1, I’m actively participating in it. I’ve given reads and I’m voting people I’m suspicious of. (2) I’m not pushing for a quick lynch. I just said I’d be ok if the mod randomly chose somebody. That’s a scenario that would never actually happen and anyone with experience knows that so to actually use my opinion of day one against me isn’t town thinking

(3)Whenever I get lynched or killed, I’ll flip town and you and text will look bad if you are town because you actually think something non alignment indicative is somehow.

While (1) is a good point, (2) I don't really buy, you said you'd be fine with it and that attitude I consider bad. As for (3) it somewhat sounds like a threat.

Wilky's reaction to his wagon was pretty bad.

How?

Cause I’m going to flip town and you’ll have pushed my lynch because of something that you shouldn’t have.

So? I feel his reasons were valid. There are gonna be at least 4 townies on a D1 mislynch who all suspect the lynchee somehow. "Because of something you shouldn't have" is subjective.

Wilky, you could quite easily have been lynched from your wagon. ESPECIALLY with both NM and Boon in this game - I suspect you didn't react to it because you believe that's how town is 'supposed' to react to a 'RVS' wagon.

How do you know how town is supposed to react? I didn't find it particularly scummy. I mean I doubt how I myself would react to an RVS wagon as town. I'd imagine it feels awkward and you don't know what to say in fear of being lynched or heavily suspected as town or even a town PR.

Firstly, it’s not my job to convince you I’m town.

Well if you are town it would certainly be a damn help to actually act towny

You can’t see a possibility where town hates day one.

Not wilky but certainly I can see that. Can't you see that having a foundation formed on D1 might help the game? We are certainly producing content and reads, aren't we?

I'm willing to lynch either of Tex, Wilky it Profii.

You barely mention Gusavo, what's your opinion there?

I mean, you're very clearly voting him for not liking D1s and wanting it over as soon as possible.

Is he really though? As far as I understand - and as far as I think myself - it's because he expressed he'd be semi-fine with it if we just lolwagon somewhere and roll into day 2. Disliking D1 != Putting your dislike in the thread and wanting it to be over asap.

Point me to where I said anti town means scum?

See you keep saying that it is NAI yet I have provided examples of anti town reasons behind it. Things that have anti town reasons definitely is not NAI

This and the post following it are good catches but it doesn't take my concerns away from Gustavo, despite my feeling this isn't a scum-scum interaction.

I feel we have a good town block forming. Me/bbt/nm. Probably need 1/2 more.

Wilky/Tex can’t be trusted and should probably be lynched. I do realize lying doesn’t mean scum but I am having trouble seeing the town motivation for wilky repeated lying. I also expect more from experienced players. Their naivety seems fake. They should know that difference of opinions aren’t AI

1- putting yourself in a townblock to me feels like a very swift way to get yourself townread. Also, how did NM get in there? Don't think I've seen you comment on him but I may be wrong. "Wilky+Tex can't be trusted" seems weird to me, it sounds like you are outright wanting to block them from discussion, how is that ever good? You aren't conftown by any means. The last part about experienced players has a hint of AtE: "They should agree with me, or they're naive/scum".

AtE really? Grow up

Is irony the right word for this?

Wilky. If you think I’m scum state your reasons for it. One caveat is you can’t use my opinion of day one at all.

This is kinda hard when the D1 discussion is like 75% of your ISO.

The difference is similar to you claiming a role vs showing your role-PM. Or even better - quoting a post from a PT vs referencing it.
If you say your vote is random, based on a diceroll made IRL, there's still a chance for people to question you on it, and debate whether that was really the reason.

And think of it like this: if EVERYONE voted with a dice in RvS, what starts the discussion then?

Good post, good reasoning.

[HeWhoSwims]

I mean what did stop you from bringing up other things? Granted, nearly the entire game is guilty of this, but not just wilky.

[HeWhoSwims]

If Gustavo is really town, then one of the people buddying him might be scum.

Seems like a fair assessment.

I too feel I'm not convinced enough to vote Tex.

[HeWhoSwims]

I completely forgot the HeWhoSwims slot even existed so more content there too please.

Ya I doubt anyone even commented on my earlier posts up until now. Gustavo scumread has lessened. I don't find anyone particularly scummy at this point, still not convinced of Tex scum.

[HeWhoSwims]

Morality/wilky isn't unlikely with that post.
I think scum!CoA also seems even more likely now.

Like, the last two or three times Morality has "mistakenly scumread" me, he has been scum himself..
So something close to 1/10 we have town!Morality here..

This seems like a very quick conclusion to me and I don't quite see the COA link? How does a read like this help town in any way?

well I guess time will tell but so far what I have seen, i don't see a good player. The things he says don't make sense from a good player and his reads are pretty terrible. hopefully this is a case where he is scum because if he is town, he is probably going to hurt us in the long run.

Scum!me has played with town!Boon to me and well he drove an 18 wheeler over me 6 times before lynching me... He's not bad for town per se

[HeWhoSwims]

What exactly are you aiming at there

Mind you we can't discuss ongoing games

[HeWhoSwims]

Not Mafia and Texcat are both mislynch bait. I’m not like town reading either of them, but yeah, just want that out there.

Sorry, been busy today. Had to pull a double at my side job.

From what I've heard NM is usually like this yeah..? I think the tex wagon is just weak atm

No one is discussing the chance morality could be scum. He could quite well be

Yes. So can you and me... I'm not scumreading morality and no one seems to really be. Sell me.

[HeWhoSwims]

Back in the morning sorry.

[HeWhoSwims]

Im legit sorry but I'm way too busy. Catching up in a few hours . Gotta mention that I did play a game of pick your poison with a scumteam of me Tex and COA but I'm not the one to go to for meta based on that... I wouldn't remember what "defines" their scum playstyle.

[HeWhoSwims]

Actually, that’s what’s happening.

Not Mafia is scum. Texcat town.

VOTE: Not Mafia

@Texcat - DO NOT commute tonight. Allow yourself to be investigated by potential investigative. If scum kill you, good. They won’t.

What exactly is the scum motivation? I'd say his big push but as far as I've seen people say that's his playstyle? Weak argument I'd say but still.

(snip)
Btw Morality - this is the next scum - N_m flipping scum means we tunnel this day 2 should 1 of us die I think

This seems really quickly said... Profii why does that incriminate him? I'd say it shows some critical thinking on Una's side no? Certainly scum can very well be off the initial tex wagon here, but there will be more than 2 people off that wagon no? I'm also not really seeing the connection to you/boon dying, explain?

Yeah, just lynch NM. Texcat can just be investigated, and I feel that’s a safe bet.

If someone gets a No result on Tex, lynch her

Hmm this seems like a fair assessment. Tex investigated --> Clarity. Tex killed --> It is no more issue for the town to deal with. I doubt scum would want to push this? Wouldn't they be better off with someone like VT!NM (assuming he's town and VT, yes) on Day 2, meaning an investigation doesn't really mean crap for the town?

[HeWhoSwims]

Also welcome Voyc.

Adding to my final paragraph why does no result = lynch?

[HeWhoSwims]

VOTE: NotMafia

He's given us absolutely nothing except for his broken record cry for my lynch.

Yeah this feels really grasping-last-straw-y

VOTE: NotMafia

He's given us absolutely nothing except for his broken record cry for my lynch.

same could be said about you. at least he is consistent with his push

I mean you're not wrong

Pretty sure NM will flip town. I'm not really sold on this idea. I'm not sure where the sudden 180 turn came from if everyone is reading it as his playstyle? I'm not following.
I'm not opposed to lynching NM only for the sake of seeing anything else then a "lynch x" *gifs.*

Tex doesn't make sense either. We're going to listen to a guy that just says "Lynch this dude, lol." Why in the world would anyone follow this?

I'll wait for the official VC, I'd rather not unint hammer, even if D1's end is around the corner.

Fp'ed

No

Here’s the NM scum partner.

That's uh quick

I’m not listening to you remember? You are a liar and untrustworthy

VOTE: morality

Both of these make me clench my teeth and cringe. How is any of this protown? Enlighten me.

VOTE: morality

THANK YOU. Finally moved off of Texcat. Damn.

I’ve obviously been softing an investigative, so this is interesting to me as the choice he went

Obviously?...YMMV but okay.

I do think Morality has a point in that lynching NM-->Tex is better than Tex-->NM so investigative!Morality can investigate there... But Morality needs to be town for that to be a valid investigation don't forget. I'm townreading him for now but voicing my concerns can't hurt can it really

[HeWhoSwims]

End of D1 votecount:

Votecount 1.3

.

texcat: LA Galaxy, N_M, BlueBloodedToffee, wilky, Gustavo, UnaBombaH, profii

(L-3)

wilky: Crush
UnaBombaH: Voyc
Voyc: Beefster
Crush: HeWhoSwims
N_M: Morality, texcat

Not Voting: None

.

Day 1 ends in (expired on 2018-05-12 10:35:45)

With 13 alive, it takes 7 to lynch.

Let's hope mod picks this back up. But he himself is on V/La it seems. During the deadline period, but oh well. Let's just hope for the best even if I'm not too convinced.

[HeWhoSwims]

Checking in to say I'm still alive, and trying to read along, but I have a chemistry final around the corner.

That said, I'm curious as to how they found LA as a mason, since I don't see how they would kill him if it weren't a PR hunt.

More stuff hopefully happening later!

[HeWhoSwims]

Yeah sorry but I feel it's too much to catch up on right now. I'll try to see what I can do from phone tonight. If I don't pop up, I'll make time tomorrow afternoon.

[HeWhoSwims]

It's funny because scum always think a good contribution from them is to provide some sort of reads list to let people know where they're at and that they're 'evaluating' the game. Contrary to that though, I have caught so many scum from posting god awful reads-lists and this feels like one of them.

Can I just get a quick hands up for who would be down for lynching CoA/Voyc?

While I agree with the fact the reads list seems weak to me I do think we should at least let Voyc catch up. Sure, if she(?) just lurks it out and is just as inactive, I'd find wanting to lynch there more justifiable, right now I think waiting is they key since we don't have a lot of info on the slot no matter what.

Gus meet boon, boon meet gus

If it turns out he lied I’m lynching him

Eh, I've seen him pull this shit before, I think, in a game with me. Not sure of the specifics, but he softed a PR while he wasn't one, but was sorta powertown. I don't wanna lynch him today.

UnaBomba or Voyc seem really good choices Today.

VOTE: UnaBomba

I didn’t see your analysis of the wagon that you said you were going to do. You seem to be going off morality’s read. Please post your analysis.

Actually kinda agree here - don't see a lot of progression or comments on Una. Nor on some other people. Sure BBT is very actively busy with the COA/Voyc jazz but the rest lacks at points.

Gustavo's lack of defence for my scum read on CoA/Voyc should point you all where to vote Tomorrow after we lynch Voyc.

Hmmm... I don't like the fact that you seem to say Gustavo is scum for not agreeing with you, or am I misinterpreting you? the slot hasn't had a shitton of posts and I see why Gustavo wants to wait it out, as do I.

Re: wagon, I don't see why scum would be hesitant to at least be partially on the wagon - especially near day end it was a viable wagon, it had enough support and hey it did get hammered in the end.

Townreads, for now: Gus/Boon/wilky/profii town I think and NM of course. Crush, DDS, Voyc null/neutral, BBT neutral. Una... not sure, he hasn't been stellar this gameday exactly - I think he still needs to answer Boon? - but I'm a bit hesitant to call it a scumread/lean.

[HeWhoSwims]

Was that to me, or to Voyc? Chronologically, I'm caught up as in I've read anything, but for more solid reads I might want to do some ISOdiving which I'll try to make happen over the weekend.

Edit: guess it was to me

[HeWhoSwims]

I did read your reads, I guess it makes sense that the more inactive people are harder to sort. I was gonna say some townreads had very thin reasoning such as Wilky - but a control+F in your ISO shows for example 367 with pretty good reasoning on wilky, but I didn't read that post today and guess I'd forgotten about it. So yeah that and your progression on profii seem like, fair? I'm curious why you stepped off of Una though as to me it seems you only let Coa/Voyc take priority over Una but later you said you wouldn't lynch him at all.

I put reads in my last post:

Gus townread because he's very actively participating and not at all afraid to go against the current, question all kinds of stuff, even people (Boon) who others seem to townread more than scumread and that behaviour is never not attracting attention and suspicion. Boon seems townie and participating - even if his signature on other accounts says "Yes, I

would

do that as scum" it might be good to have him around here for now since at the very least, even if scum after all, he's participating and posting and I think you even said you'd catch him if he really were scum (might've been someone else)

Wilky is I think the weakest out of the townreads I listed but he doesn't come off as scummy and I doubt scum would have gone on the D1 tirade like he did, but that's somewhat more WIFOMy. As for profii, I found that on D1 he was pushing for a vig shot on NM upon a textownflip and then after the night he's all for Town NM. If he's scum why wouldn't he start to townread NM earlier on? Or make less of a 180? I feel that this 180 came from either a PR or picking up on a masontell, idk which.

[HeWhoSwims]

Both COA and Voyc are inactive so I find it hard to pin a read there to pinpoint a read right now. I do agree though that COA's readlist seemed lazy/weird/whatever to me. Of the active players, Una gives me the least townie vibes and I'm a teeny tiny bit wary of Boon since he seems to be a good player who isn't afraid to act as scum. As said I find it hard to just say town/scum on the inactive people. Do want to hear more there.

Voyc' post on this page was not too amazing so no, I'm no big fan, but let's see where it goes.

[HeWhoSwims]

So for what percentage of the game do you just disregard people as inactive? Do you let them live to D3 unquestioned? D4? LyLo? When do people stop being 'inactive' and become potential scum?

What did you make of CoA's readslist? You keep responding with generic comments and it makes it very difficult to actually understand what your thoughts/reads are. What does lazy/weird/whatever mean? Null? Scummy? Townie? What does it mean?

There are other active people in this game who you have yet to give a read on as well.

Where are you expecting Voyc to go? They voted Una and I would assume that means they are caught up and have said everything that they need to say, no?

Note: Voyc comes in and votes the second most suspected player in the game in the hopes of creating a counter-wagon to him. No reasoning for the read, just throws a vote out there.

Of course they have to get active at some point. It's a bit of a catch 22, on one hand

I

can't put a solid scumread/lean on them because of lack of content but then again you don't want to let them be a burden for long. I was meaning I agreed with your points. On a quick glance the reads list seemed to have a lot of "flubbery" reads / fencesitting / very very wobbly and as you said it might be a try to get in town's graces by effortposting / producing reads - but Cult's effort seems like, too much, so tryhard to form reads that it just comes off as grasping at straws to be town.

Who do you need me to give a read on still?

idk where Voyc goes, as said I'm not too big a fan of COA nor of Voyc's catchup post... she's missed an entire game and there's more to comment on. Sure she's voting Una but I don't really townread the guy. Could be bussing, could be town hunting scum, I wouldn't be able to tell right nowl. But yes the vote could/should have more reasoning, naked votes are very eh imo.

[HeWhoSwims]

I know. I'm more of a lurker this game than I'd have wanted. Still, the first COA posts are about the dice tags. She's rather defensive but I guess I can see that since usage of dice tags seems like a weird and weak reason to really scumread someone although Una did have a point about it taking away the RVS that usually starts the game I'm not sure if I really see the whole as a reason to scumread someone. As for Voyc, I've made it clear that she should post more (I know, so do I...) before I can place a read there.

[HeWhoSwims]

HWS' posts are very wishy washy - am I the only person struggling to understand his reads/position in the game?

HWS, would you be willing to lynch Voyc?

Not now, but if stuff continues to be like this, yes.

Also quick note regarding Profii's VCA - I think it's entirely plausible that Tex was an all town wagon - I'm town reading everyone on the wagon at different strengths myself. I need to revisit a couple of things but I'm much happier lynching off the wagon Today. I have seen so many games thrown away with the logic of 'OMG there must be scum on that wagon!'

Still want more from HWS, Crush and DDS as well.

do us a favour though, look at Wilky's ISO - off the top of my head posts #150 and lower ish.

If you read it with the scum narrative that Wilky is defending the CoA wagon to setup a Gus push, I think it's got something

even if you don't think that's the case, can you see what I'm thinking?

The reasoning an sich checks out but I honestly doubt scum!wilky would want to push while probably knowing it's barely ever gonna translate in a lynch. I don't think it's defense per se as the COA wagon seems like half-RVS to me. Sure could be WIFOM but the risks are real here I'd say

I think the wagon has scum on it.

It also has 2 halves.

{

LA - NM

- Gus - BBT } - the stubborn half

{ Wilky - Una - Profii } - the reluctant late joiners

We've cleared 2 from the first half which is good, but is the scum in that half? I'd guess BBT if anyone but I don't think so.
The latter half, obviously I know I'm town but you lot don't- I think maybe Wilky over Una for reasons earlier described.

I guess the question I need to ask everyone is look at where I decided BBT was town - I said the gist of it was he was pushing me quite hard, therefore a TMI scum player would know if he got my lynch through, there would be questions asked tomorrow. BBT also turned around on me pretty quick and town read me. The question is, did BBT see a chance to pocket me?

IDK it's hard to tell from my own perspective.

First part - I'd say Gus is town and there is at least one scum between [BBT/Wilky/Una] with my suspicions going Una>Wilky>BBT. I wouldn't really be able to pinpoint which part scum would want to be in.

Second part - I don't exactly see what you mean. You have a fair reason to townread, good progression there but what exactly are you asking? Surely BBT could have pocketed you there, but that'd require him to be scum again. Now that you bring it up, I can't really find his progression on you. It might be possible but I feel scum would be inclined to actually give at least somewhat of a progression, or sheep, and it seems BBT is doing neither?

[HeWhoSwims]

BBT is pushing Voyc hard, which lets the on the wagon convo come back later in the game after a mislynch. Wilky/Unah have been getting pushed. BBT brings up people will probably try to start a counterwagon on Unah to protect Voyc, which doesn’t directly tie BBT and Unah together, but it does in fact protect Unah a bit if people tried to push him because BBT had already called it out as scum pushing Unah, not Unah being pushed by scum, if that makes sense; the subject is different, which was clever.

BBT then states that Wilky could be scum on the wagon, which if we pushed Wilky today, that could be a potential mislynch on Wilky, then a “told you, Voyc is scum” comes out, and then that would come up to 7p lylo, where they would be in a good spot.

Voyc gets lynched, he goes Wilky tomorrow, again saving himself and Unah in a non direct way.

BBT and Unah are the scum on the wagon. BBT insisting there wasn’t makes sense as it preserves those mislynches for later when he can set himself up to mislynch there better and safer.

This also makes sense the way Unah changes his read on me anytime i shaded that way. Worst case scenario, he still had BBT in his corner, and BBT hyper pushing protects Unah from anything I’d push mixed in with the write up of “Boon should know I’m town here means he’s scum” without any other reasoning. He’s playing it politically with me, and they’ve been keeping me in check.

These are good arguments and I'd be willing to lynch in [Una, Voyc] after a little time... I'm guessing not BBT yet.

[HeWhoSwims]

Gus I agree it's risky but I've seen him do it as town and he feels town to me this game.

[HeWhoSwims]

HWS, how are you planning on proceeding in this game?

Pay close attention to the game during exam period to prevent falling behind. Try to ISO people for more solid reads. Then just go with the game and form and evaluate reads.

[HeWhoSwims]

I see the reasons for scumreading the slot... But I want stuff to happen there first. I'm no wizard with interaction based teamhunting but without info we don't get far even if we lynch scum.

I liked Boobs arguments against BBT but I've seen him do things today (earlier today) that seemed townish so I'm guessing I'm gonna wait that out for now and put it high on my iso priority list

@bbt what's left that you need me to address then?

[HeWhoSwims]

Una, as his posts aren't giving me town vibes like all the other active posters at least partially do. Voyc, due to COA slot and inactivity. If Una is scum, I'm inclined to believe Boon that you are too. If not... I can't get further than inactives but I may easily be wrong there. My most solid town reads are Profii and Gustavo I'd say. The latter just needs to believe people more like on the boon thing

[HeWhoSwims]

@HWS - So you think myself/Una/Voyc is the scum team?

I think that's hilarious.

PEdit - Gus, you were town reading me before the Voyc vote. The other two should be in your town list because one is confirmed town and the other has claimed a PR.

This feels a bit AtE ish I'm not sure if it's the right term. Why are you calling me stupid for my own reads? You're asking me to produce reads, but they're only enough for you if they townread you? Doesn't sit too well with me.

Gustavo/BBT was probably TvT

@Profii Why don't you wanna clear up why you were so sure on NM being town??
Is the fact that my predecessor made a 'quick fire' readslist the only reason why you think I'm scum?

I'm gonna VOTE: Una

Boon, you understand you're voting with this, right?

Someone who has made 3 posts with barely any game content between the 3 of them.

2 were prod posts whilst noting deadline has passed and then this one. At this post Voyc thinks these things are most important to sort;

Gustavo vs BBT (which wasn't a thing)

Prodding Profii for his full claim

Asking why he is being scum read

Then voting Una with absolutely no reasoning whatsoever.

How are you missing that Voyc is scum?

I agree that Voyc is probably scum and all that but we likely have 3 scum here. I think Boon gave reasons for scumreading Una too, why are you talking like this? You said you'd catch scum!Boon if he is here, so you are town on him (which you said)... Explain to me why you aren't considering a Una lynch, even if Voyc is scum? At this point I'm fine with a voyc lynch after we get some content out of there but it feels weird that you need to call Boon out like this. Why exactly was Una in your do-not-lynch pile today?

@HWS, who are you planning to ISO, specifically?

BBT / Wilky first of all and hopefully some other people to be fully caught up.

[HeWhoSwims]

right

I'd like to lynch Voyc

failing that, wilky.

How exactly was NM obvtown pre-flip

Tex was a popular wagon, and I was no fan of it, but at least hammering it got a situation out of the way. I'm not scumreading profii for that. Townreading the good man actually. BBT/Wilky/Una are all scum sooner than him for me.

Yes, people may expect Boon to copy his towngame.. it kinda worries me, because he seems to be mostly townread. And when I did play with him previously someone was like "Never carry this guy to LYLO" and honestly idk how I feel about it. I wouldn't want to lynch him today.

[HeWhoSwims]

I'm here, but didn't find anything I wanted to really say after my last post. Gustavo is still town for me and idk what to make of the hypothetical stuff Boon and Una are throwing around, soooo :shrug:

Agree mod stuff has got to happen.

Crush/DDS/Voyc/Wilky ALL need prods, BBT has requested a replace out

(and NM is V/La) that's 5/11 people who aren't here. C'mon.

[HeWhoSwims]

Vote count because meh. Fixed order of the votes as well.

UnaBombaH (2)

: wilky, Voyc

Voyc (4):

UnaBombaH, Not_Mafia, BlueBloodedToffee, Morality

L-2

wilky

(1): profii

HeWhoSwims

(1): Morality

Not voting (3):

Gustavo, Crush, HeWhoSwims

@Mod

1) Crush, DirtyDishSoap, Voyc and Wilky

all

need prods. The first two may need to be replaced.
2) BlueBloodedToffee has requested replacement a good while ago.
3) I don't mind making a VC but this isn't why I joined the game. We know you may be busy, but a votecount every 24h at the least should be feasible.

[HeWhoSwims]

What happened to lynching Voyc?

[HeWhoSwims]

This one has a good reason though.

[HeWhoSwims]

Oh right. Time to fire some people then.

How serious is this vote, Tex?

No follow up here? Not to be annoying and prod you about thoughts from basically a month ago but not only was the answer pretty obvious there was literally no follow-up or effort to care about this question. Why bother asking?

I wanted to know at the time... and forgot about asking it I'm guessing.

You've literally never voted this entire game, how do you expect to get scum lynched playing like that?

VOTE: HeWhoScums

Make a case for why I should swing over to Voyc if you don't want to eat rope.

They've been given. COA's readlist was crappy. Both COA and Voyc are lurking really bad. Voyc I feel has not had that much contribution to the game seeing how long she's been in while I feel that while yes, my post count is low, I'm trying at the very least.

As for the lack of votes... It's just a thing of mine and I'm getting shit for it every single game regardless of alignment so I should probably do something about it.

[HeWhoSwims]

N_M's playstyle as I've seen it is a bit troll-ish. I've never played with him, but have skimmed games with him in it, and heard others about him, so I was personally hardly surprised someone like him would jump from wagon to wagon especially in RVS. That's why I was asking Tex, because if Tex was really serious about that vote, I'd find it an overreaction.

Without heading back right now what I recall the readlist like, was that it had a shitton of null reads, and reads that seemed based on nothing or very little. As someone, I think BBT, said, this can very well be scum trying to look like amazing town with so called "effortposting"; sure there's a read list, but does it really help the town? Is there any valuable content, or is it just a lot of hot air?" I too played my first scum game a bit like that. And it was a vibe I and others got from Coa.

[HeWhoSwims]

I'd see a vote like tex's, if it were serious, as a bit nervous-y and tex isn't exactly newbscum who I'd see do that. The other vote, on DDS, I found less weird.

The thing for me is that there was no call at all for reads and/or a readslist... And if you want to mention reads, your town/scumreads would have sufficed, or a quick 5-tier like readslist could've been okay, it was early. Combine it with the fact that there was already some pressure on COA and I'd think it's plausible that it's grasping for a straw to stay alive.

Re: list. Morality/Beef/Me/BBT/LA Galaxy/wilky/DDS/ all have really shifty reads or even town/scumleans based on what even COA herself says is nearly nothing. Combine this with the other stuff about the slot et voila.

(Welcome to the site, by the way!)

pedit: it certainly doesn't have to be wrong to be scummy, but what I described above are my issues with it. Surely I townread Morality too, among others.

[HeWhoSwims]

That's my point, it was not necessary at all. 35 felt like scum!Tex could be grasping a very weak reason to vote someone, like scum wanting to pin a mislynch subtly (while inadvertedly doing it not-so-subtly)

My top scumreads here are COA/Voyc, and your slot was a very soft one but I'm liking you so far. Inactive people need to step up, and I'm really undecided on wilky atm and I'm far from town on Una. The other active players - Boon, profii, Gustavo - I have a townread on.

[HeWhoSwims]

Do you want a claim?

I appreciate your dedication MWNN but there are easier ways than a play. If we go with a play, then perhaps we should gun for the actor who plays a tree, silent throughout the entire thing.

[HeWhoSwims]

BBT is pushing Voyc hard, which lets the on the wagon convo come back later in the game after a mislynch. Wilky/Unah have been getting pushed. BBT brings up people will probably try to start a counterwagon on Unah to protect Voyc, which doesn’t directly tie BBT and Unah together, but it does in fact protect Unah a bit if people tried to push him because BBT had already called it out as scum pushing Unah, not Unah being pushed by scum, if that makes sense; the subject is different, which was clever.

BBT then states that Wilky could be scum on the wagon, which if we pushed Wilky today, that could be a potential mislynch on Wilky, then a “told you, Voyc is scum” comes out, and then that would come up to 7p lylo, where they would be in a good spot.

Voyc gets lynched, he goes Wilky tomorrow, again saving himself and Unah in a non direct way.

BBT and Unah are the scum on the wagon. BBT insisting there wasn’t makes sense as it preserves those mislynches for later when he can set himself up to mislynch there better and safer.

This also makes sense the way Unah changes his read on me anytime i shaded that way. Worst case scenario, he still had BBT in his corner, and BBT hyper pushing protects Unah from anything I’d push mixed in with the write up of “Boon should know I’m town here means he’s scum” without any other reasoning. He’s playing it politically with me, and they’ve been keeping me in check.

These posts are good arguments for Una, @MC

Also, I have my doubts about Wilky wanting to go 1v1 over a trivial thing like Gustavo's D1 behavior.

[HeWhoSwims]

I'm VT

Interesting, are you an alt?

[HeWhoSwims]

Ya I was put to L-1 on page 2. I was encryptor yes.

[HeWhoSwims]

idk if you can talk 6 people to join you? But you've been all over the place today

Was this at me? I haven’t been all over the place. People don’t want to lynch who I want so I have to move on

yes - interesting way to justify yourself

I mean he has a point, it barely makes sense to sit crying in a corner screaming for someone's lynch which isnt happening.

can we lynch morality?

Where's this coming from? My thoughts are lining up a lot with his, I would think that's generally town indicative.

I wouldn't say it is, scum may want to bus, or buddy up to you.

And again

BOON DOES THIS FAKE-CRUMB JAZZ AS TOWN

Even though he by his own account would be sorta reckless as scum this is also stuff he does when townie. So can we just stop scumreading him for it? Thanks.

[HeWhoSwims]

Look. I'm town. What can I even do at this point? I'm reading. I'm posting. I'm giving reads. Explain what the hell screams scum to you.

[HeWhoSwims]

Look. I'm town. What can I even do at this point? I'm reading. I'm posting. I'm giving reads. Explain what the hell screams scum to you.

vote profii and you're town.

eh... I'm unsure. I went in with a townread on him and it's not quite gone. Last game with profii he screwed up D2 yet was town. I don't see very horrendous stuff in his ISO lately,he's still posting and reading and re evaluating morality for example...

Think with me. I've been told before that you don't let Boon come to lylo (if you have any scumlean on him I'd think) and especially now that he's getting heat - wouldn't scum just looove to keep town!boon alive to a LYLO situation? Is that a fair assessment or just a shitty thought

[HeWhoSwims]

More like lynch not_mafia

Nope

Yah

VOTE: Not_Mafia

When tex flips town, vig shoot N_M please

We then lynch Una.

N_M is town

To repeat and make clear

n_m town

let's not speculate over potential PR claims.

I either:
have a result
spotted a mason link
have TMI (thus scum)

if you think the first 2, town bin me. If you think the latter I'm in the scum bin.

But I wont confirm any more than that for today.

Above progress made me feel as though profii were town. If he's scum knowing NM is town why would he have such a big turnaround from "Kill NM" to "NM is locktown"? I think the first 2 options in the last quoted post are very plausible. The only way this could be scum, I think, is if he's a mafia rolecop but if he got a mason result on NM then why would he still make the turnaround?

... and then on second thought I thought that the first 2 options in his post were not exclusively town at all - see what I mean? Having a result or spotting a link ain't town per se. I think it's very plausible that scum!profii might be wifoming here ? Discuss.

I also doubt why a townie knowing of someone's innocence would out it like this if NM can do that himself except to create wifom about having a PR. Townpr!profii had better stayed under the radar.

I'm still no fan of Voyc either.

[HeWhoSwims]

@HWS - if i was scum, why would i role cop the player i was openly going to death tunnel?

surely scum!profii would try and play for that mislynch and use a PR elsewhere to assist the next NK?

i suppose you could argue, scum!profii killed LA, that revealed a mason existence to everyone, i then possibly spotted a mason link so had to super retreat on N_M as i knew i couldnt death tunnel because it would surely come out.

idk

That's exactly my reasoning, surely NM is an easy-ish mislynch if it really comes down to it.

I don’t have a case for HWS. I have a POE for HWS. And I’m not even pushing for a HWS lynch today. I’m pushing for a Profii lynch.

I’ve chosen not to engage with Gustavo because he doesn’t want answers. He wants his way or the highway, and I just don’t play that surface level, so i’m not going to engage there. I think he’s town, so I really don’t have to worry about him at all anymore.

I want Profii dead.

I can't wait for the day we are both town and don't want to end each other in a game.

[HeWhoSwims]

Even if it's not AI then activity is certainly very damning if you haven't been able to produce stuff for a week.

Interesting that you do have time and energy to jump in at this very moment.

Even if catch cup is 50 pages you could iso or react to recent events.

[HeWhoSwims]

Not to mention the people you replaced had atrocious activity too...

[HeWhoSwims]

Even if it's not AI then activity is certainly very damning if you haven't been able to produce stuff for a week.

Interesting that you do have time and energy to jump in at this very moment.

Even if catch cup is 50 pages you could iso or react to recent events.

That's because a false wagon created on me and i want to fight for town. I am not going to give up to scum without a fight.

Hows that an excuse to not post

[HeWhoSwims]

I ask why you're not posting appropriately.

You say because there's a fake wagon ? Bad reason to me. If anything, more reason to post and help town around.

Also you knew how many pages this had before entering right? Ya. And then still, you could've skimmed. The majority of your posts seems to be from the last few hours. There's barely any reads aside from Gus scum who I townread.

[HeWhoSwims]

I barely use votes and I know it's a shitty thing yada yada but it creeps into my play every time.

I mean Arc is being weird. Regardless of whether I'm a CW or not that's being weird.

I don't mind lynching in profile/wilky to solve this and I'd lean towards lynching the former but am unsure.

Still Voyc and Arc... C'mon.

I miss MC Adore

[HeWhoSwims]

Do I get boonpoints by saying role pm?

[HeWhoSwims]

VOTE: Voyc

Contribute.

[HeWhoSwims]

VOTE: Voyc

Contribute.

Why voyc, without mentioning activity?

Their posts so far are lacking the content I feel they should have, plus stuff from COA herself i.e. reads list and defensiveness

[HeWhoSwims]

VOTE: Voyc

Contribute.

Voyc may be town. Whats is your point on him?

And Voyc may also be scum. Reasons stated in the post before yours.

[HeWhoSwims]

Gus, MC Adobe, (NM) town
Boon town but a lower tier
Profii and you need to be sorted I feel
Una is sorta neutral but doesn't stand out as town at all to me.
Voyc, Arc both being scummy.

The fact I can't remember the 10th person is telling enough lol

[HeWhoSwims]

Oh MWNN is the 10th. Idk about DDS but MWNN is good so far and seems to be progressing in most posts as per a quick iso scan. Soft morality level townread there.

[HeWhoSwims]

Gus, MC Adobe, (NM) town
Boon town but a lower tier
Profii and you need to be sorted I feel
Una is sorta neutral but doesn't stand out as town at all to me.
Voyc, Arc both being scummy.

The fact I can't remember the 10th person is telling enough lol

VOTE: HeWhoSwims

This post is an open claim that you're scum with Gus!!

Lmfao

My townread on the BBT slot is based on MC adore... BBT I found hard to place and I was neutral as opposed to null on him if you catch my drift. MC seems town to me.

[HeWhoSwims]

If Profii is scum then "I townread Tex but I hammered that mislynch to help the town from falling for the same problems again on D1" is a great narrative for that team no?

Idk how to say it exactly wilky but like she seems to have her head solidly on her shoulders and is useful to the thread whenever she's here.

[HeWhoSwims]

i suppose you could argue, scum!profii killed LA, that revealed a mason existence to everyone, i then possibly spotted a mason link so had to super retreat on N_M as i knew i couldnt death tunnel because it would surely come out.

idk

This is also very much a thing for me.

[HeWhoSwims]

@wilky I feel like MC is (was) progressing left and right inpretty much all her posts upon entrance and everything feels as though it really comes from a neutral perspective of someone having just entered the game without any knowledge. And if she were here now that we are all talking i feel she could be super helpful.

Profii if we lynch in you/wilky today I'd let wilky alive.

[HeWhoSwims]

If Profii is scum then "I townread Tex but I hammered that mislynch to help the town from falling for the same problems again on D1" is a great narrative for that team no?

Idk how to say it exactly wilky but like she seems to have her head solidly on her shoulders and is useful to the thread whenever she's here.

Is that you saying I’m scum? It’s really not clear

Sorta kinda. It does strengthen my scumlean on you.

[HeWhoSwims]

Arc... I've been defending Gus since nearly the start of the game I feel and I wasn't a wagon then I think.

You grasp at arguments that don't make sense to me

For now that warrants VOTE: ArcAngel but I'm open to lynch in Voyc, Arc, Profii, maybe Una

[HeWhoSwims]

HeWhoSwims (4) - Voyc, Not_Mafia, MC Adore, ArcAngel
ArcAngel9 (3)- UnaBombaH, Gustavo, HeWhoSwims
profii (3)- ManWithNoName, Morality, wilky
UnaBombaH (1) - profii

Not Voting (0)

[HeWhoSwims]

Profii perhaps I'm agreeing with wilky not because we're a team but because I'm scumreading you

No big townread on wilky but I've been clear in my reasons for my scumread/lean on you.

Arc you are talking now but you were disgustingly inactive so to speak. I think all of us agree on it.

Why isn't Voyc happening according to you arc?

[HeWhoSwims]

Interesting wagon with 3 semi inacts and 2 people I highly scumread.

I was talking about choosing between the 2 of you because if we lynch 1 of you it may help clear the air since y'all are fighting.

[HeWhoSwims]

Arc

For a millionth time

to you

How do you excuse replacing into a game you know is long, with your predecessors being inactive as fuck, then not posting anything until you get heat?

[HeWhoSwims]

Arc your iso shows almost nothing on Voyc. Quote the part with reasons for not lynching her.

[HeWhoSwims]

Small moment of calmness in between... Let's discuss obviously but let's not lynch anyone before the others have read up on all this I propose.

Pedit: lolarc

[HeWhoSwims]

Honestly at least Arc and Profii are talking as opposed to Voyc (and NM and MC but I do townread them)

[HeWhoSwims]

I mean I don't disagree.

Arc... Care to explain the Voyc stuff?

Telling people to GET LOST!!! during a totally valid discussion (you

knew

about the page count and had a week) is usually not a very townie thing.

[HeWhoSwims]

I missed that arc. Shit happens. Still that's a read built upon 2 posts? I'd find that weak.

I can lynch Profii but we should probably wait for the others.

[HeWhoSwims]

HWS doesn’t know this existence of the mason.

This isn’t true at all. He knows masons exsist. He even comments on it

The fucking identity of the mason.

He flat out stated a read on NM with confusion.

Holy shit. SURFACE LEVEL PLAYER just move on from this god damn conversation. It doesn’t matter.

Comment in passing by: of course I caught this which is why I put NM with my townreads, but I put him between brackets because it's not so much a read... Moreso a mechanically not fakeable claim (unless we have 1 mason lol)

[HeWhoSwims]

Anyone down to policy Gustavo? I’m at that point. He’s gonna flip green, but I’ll lynch there over ScumProfii.

C'mon you guys if you just both work together for now it might help a lot.

Boon I'd agree that I'd want more reasoning for the townread on Arc since I felt she was reaaaally scummy during our session last night. Plus I understand that he wants more reason for you to TR me. And what's your read on Voyc? Who needs to get active regardless of alignment... Which is gonna be hard with overnight catch-ups like this

[HeWhoSwims]

Still lol at my wagon being inactives and people I'm suspecting

Don't think I'm leaving L-1 anytime soon

[HeWhoSwims]

It's almost as if reads change over time huh

[HeWhoSwims]

VOTE: profii

think I need not explain

[HeWhoSwims]

In post 1183, MC Adore wrote:
In post 1174, Gustavo wrote:
can we lynch morality?


Where's this coming from? My thoughts are lining up a lot with his, I would think that's generally town indicative.

I wouldn't say it is, scum may want to bus, or buddy up to you.

And again

BOON DOES THIS FAKE-CRUMB JAZZ AS TOWN

So
You seem to discourage MC from townreading Morality
and then turn around and defend Morality from Gus
??

Anyways HWS > Profii
But I'd be willing to get on the Profii wagon tbh
My townread on them has gone down, and depending on the flip it'd help sort Wilky who's still a really weird slot for me

I think Arc is probably townie, it's not a very strong read but it's there

This still pings me as scum

I never did or wanted MC to not-townread Boon, I think he's town and/or should be left alive here.

Top it off with "oh yeah sure I'll get on the wagon haha " and a bit of potential buddying if Voyc is actual scum and ayy perfect scum post.

Profii is my preferred lynch today but this is probably next on my radar.

[HeWhoSwims]

I think I pretty much gave my reasons recently did I not

[HeWhoSwims]

lmaoooooooooo what

what does it have to do with the tex lynch

NM was in shitposting heaven regardless of what name was in texcat's place

[HeWhoSwims]

Loved it as long as I was here!

Profii you really turned around after our d2 fiasco. Props.

[HeWhoSwims]

If you are who I think you are, and are on an alt to prevent toxicity, then try harder

Anyway. I forgot to thank Nexus for stepping in. Thanks dude. You're a saint.