Heroes Wanted! (Game Over)

[Sando]

FA, who did you vote for as leader and why?

After she answers, I think everyone else should also answer that pair of questions.

I think everyone should just claim who they voted for. I think this is a fairly predictable outcome though and we probably won't get much from it, but hey more info is good info.

[Sando]

I think that the marginal scum equity mentioned by TW makes the optimal claiming order begin with the selected leader for any given day.

Oh I agree, I'm actually more interested in your question of scumchat pre-game though, since without that then that changes the calculations. I doubt it matters who goes first, but meh, I doubt it matters so go for it, I won't argue

Actually this is also important and this is ambiguous, could mean yes there's daychat and we know that, or just that scum know it.

3. The existence of Daychat is known.

@Mod - do scum have daychat?

[Sando]

I agree with FA claiming first.

And, duck, why didn't you read the thread before posting when Cerb had already posted his idea?

With confirmed daychat I no longer agree that FA should be first, info out quickly imo.

I voted duckling.

[Sando]

If they find out that without their set of votes, their selected teammate would not have won, they can deliberately distance by only having the requisite number of them claim to have voted for that individual. This is, of course, assuming FA is actually scum, or at the least a choice scum decided to make for whatever reasons.

Kinda.

Either we just crapshoot the reveal and rely on the fact that scum want to see that info before they post to determine scumminess or, we set an order and hope we get scum early to nail them on forcing them to be truthful in their votes.

I don't see why one is necessarily better than the other.

Meh to your "give reasons", I'll give my reasons (he's basically the only person I play with a reasonable amount and I'm confident I can read into his actions as leader), but it's not time sensitive like the actual person is.

[Sando]

no-one should correlate these votes yet either, don't make scums job easier than it is.

[Sando]

One thing before anyone else reveals:

Should we force all the FA voters to reveal themselves first? Then they have zero info on how many they need to provide to make sure we can't see the lie.

[Sando]

I voted FA cause she is awesome. is that useful to town? is any response useful to town, really?

Now? Not really. Later, maybe. Can't see how it hurts.

[Sando]

rvs and fence-sittery

"Because it's RVS and because of this other real reason" - wat?

[Sando]

you should explain your reasons in clear manner so everyone knows what your mindset really is instead of playing mysteriously like your read is so relevant it should be left for later because of reasons. IDK what fence-sittery means and rather have it spelled it out for me and the thread.

I understand what fence-sitting means, basically lack of commitment to reads.

But you can't say:
This is an RVS vote oh and by the way you're also fence-sitting which is scummy.

RVS is random, it does not pair well with a legitimate read.

[Sando]

In post 10, Cerberus v666 wrote:
Will the superhero team selected be publicly known?

I will not publicly reveal any Superhero Team.

@Mod will the superhero team know who else is in the team or does only the leader know?

pedit, I messed that quote up, but whatevs.

[Sando]

Nope, that aint me, I only play here.

[Sando]

FA I think for now you're someone who flat out shouldn't post their votee.

I can see the point of forcing you to generate a list of people to vote-claim in though. But that might be busy work and understandably tedious, dunno if anyone agrees with me on this point.

[Sando]

should we ask the people who I think voted me first or the rest

My only thought outside of random was just saying no-one to claim anymore until everyone has posted and claimed to vote you (if they did). This means anyone who voted you and doesn't want us to know that can't know that they won't be caught out in a lie because the numbers on non-winner aren't known.

[Sando]

should we ask the people who I think voted me first or the rest

My only thought outside of random was just saying no-one to claim anymore until everyone has posted and claimed to vote you (if they did). This means anyone who voted you and doesn't want us to know that can't know that they won't be caught out in a lie because the numbers on non-winner aren't known.

yeah lets actually do that

My only problem is if you're right about the 8-9, then scum have chat and can just coordinate to keep the fake-votes on people who clearly aren't going to get more than 1 or 2.

Basically if scum coordinated a little bit then it's best to get your voters to post first. But if scum coordinated a shitload like you're suggesting, then it's best to just leave it random or force an order.

Hence I'm happy to not be making this decision

[Sando]

If they have pre-game chat, they would have coordinated.

Would they?

Man finding scum is gonna be a cinch, we just have to find and lynch a large group of ppl that all voted for the same person!

Man i bet scum never thought we'd think they'd all vote for the same person!

Coordination doesn't mean they all voted the same person. They could have coordinated to all vote someone different, or guess that only 2-3 on a certain person would get them over the line. There's lots they could have coordinated to do.

[Sando]

If you think scum did some sort of plan for whom they voted, you need to figure out the "why" and the "how", and so you can use this info to figure out who's scum and who isn't, as is, this seems like an exercise in futility because anything could have happened, even worse than NKA in terms of figuring out what went on with scum's vote. Not going to stop you, just giving my opinion, if you think you can find scum by it then all the more power to you.

Because at current, i see you asking for info, because information helps the town, but i dont see you figuring out anything out of said information, and ill reserve my judgement for when you do (or dont).

Is this directed at me?

Because
Why = manipulating the leader is good for scum
How = by doing this new-fangled thing called "talking", in this case "typing", I'll give you that

I haven't figured anything out and I've specifically said that for now it's fairly useless information that in the future may be of use.

[Sando]

Thoughts on super-hero team mechanics all?

FA can choose up to EOD yeah?

Do we control it ourselves and tell FA who to do
Do we let FA do it as long as it's announced (pre/post overnight)
Do we let FA do it and not announce it
Should the heroes themselves announce their choice (assuming we decide to out who they are)
Should we tell the heroes what to choose
Should we get FA to tell the heroes what to choose (is this allowed? It would require out of game comms I think? So probably not?)

[Sando]

from my understanding of it FA should choose and announce it before night is called, and I think if the heroes can choose their abilities they should actually not instantly claim cause then wolves know what people they should PR hunt first.

but I'll leave the mechanics for those who have read the things properly instead of lazily skimming it.

Not seeing the advantage of FA telling us before nightfall? FA is immune from NKs overnight correct? She can tell us tomorrow unquestioningly I believe and give the scum no info on the heroes she chose. Am I missing something?

Does FA get a power herself or just the people she chooses?

[Sando]

Does FA get a power herself or just the people she chooses?

NVM, found it, yes.

[Sando]

ok 3 people claimed they voted me That is way under than what I thought I had

either scum really didn't have a pregame chat - they decided to split vote and allow town to choose people - or they voted me cause they think they can control me

FA assuming you're town, do you think scum would have seen you as a big enough threat as leader to try and get someone else leader, town or scum? Do you think there's anyone in the player pool that scum might have wanted to NOT be leader?

Regarding the picks, you can semi-hide and still force them if we want. FA can pick 5 people, so they can outline 5 groups of ~4 (I think there's 22 not including FA) and say they'll pick one person in each group, and they can even define the power they should pick.

FA can also potentially pick Impenetrable skin, assuming scum only have the one NK for now, should get her through N2 and allow us to hold off claiming powers an extra day.

[Sando]

Sando thank you so much for rolling town with me

You're welcome.

FA can also potentially pick Impenetrable skin, assuming scum only have the one NK for now, should get her through N2 and allow us to hold off claiming powers an extra day.

Just a follow up on this one, don't commit to this today, wait for tomorrow to say whether you've done this or not to see how many kills come out. Worst case scum fake you out by not using their 2nd (3rd, 4th, shit they might all have one!!!!) kills to kill you N2 through your BP, which is still a town-win.

[Sando]

this is also a good point. Though, it means they probably shoot someone else... which is fine either way.

Oh yeah, I'm assuming scum want FA dead N2 if she's still around (ie we haven't decided to lynch her) since she has ALL THE KNOWLEDGE. Not outing our PRs is great for town, but only until FA is dead...getting her through to D3 would be a nice compromise at least. I assume this structure will continue through the game, where scum want the leaders dead asap to mess with the PR knowledge for town.

@Mod

- do any of the superpowers interact with the leaders choice of superhero team? For example, if you targeted the leader with Sirens Call would that move their superhero team choice onto you instead?

[Sando]

BUT but but but but. We don't have to and shouldn't out them today if FA takes the nightkill stopping power.

FA has complete immunity tonight afaik, bulletproof is to protect N2 onwards.

We also should consider setting up a townie huddle of protection/investigation. We don't have docs or investigative yet, but we could tell everyone to take BP (it's not very useful on scum anyway I don't think) and start building a defensive cadre. Use future day powers to hopefully investigate into the cadre and then start piling powers onto the cleared people and protect them with docs etc.

Either that or we decide that spread out is best and we get try to stay ahead of scum NKs by spreading powers far and wide and rely on overwhelming them with uncounterable powers.

[Sando]

@Sando: universal BP is probably safest, but the fact that it exists does imply some degree of ease at bypassing it. The redirection is better as universal protection(or whatever you call it when you make actions that target you go elsewhere), but ONLY if the people using it only target consensus scum and/or lynchbait lurker types+we don't grab investigatives going forward. Sakura is correct that we have no way to test for someone taking BP, so any sort of plan we'd make with powers would have to assume that scum will not be following orders.

If we wanted to make this START as a functionally vanilla game, if we lynch town today everyone could pick the medium power, use that on the lynchee, and that would create a network of pts with a town center that would confirm everyone picked and used that power. That play sets up for some potentially very strong plays in the future, with repeated hero teams able to use that pt network to privately coordinate power selection, but it's dependent on the trust the dead slot has for the people it's communicating with, as well as the leaders ability to select a town group. There's also vulnerability to scum roleblocking used as a framing tool, but that would largely be a crapshoot.

I think the medium line has the greatest potential upside if executed perfectly, but is probably impractical.

So the reason for BP was mostly that it's fairly benign and protective, so giving it to scum isn't a big deal, and scum are always going to do whatever they want and lie about it, so "but scum might lie" is the basis for any system we establish. We can also do something like establish 6 BPs, then somehow get investigate clears on say 3 of them and protect the hell out of them while piling powers onto them. One of those protections might be something like a redirect onto one of the other BPs. If they lied about it, well they're going to die, if they didn't lie then they're helping town with their power. The other advantage of BP is it takes effect straight away, making scums ability to kill PRs really hard...

That said, as I mentioned, the other option I see is to just spread our powers as widely and thinly as possible so scum can't keep up with killing all the heroes, safety in numbers. That way we're basically putting huge amounts of data out there for us to sift through, sure some of it will be lies, but it's gonna be damn hard for scum to keep the lies straight, probably...

The bulletproof only protects from one kill?

I was reading as one kill per night, I think you're probably right though from what's been posted since then, making the BP plan not so great.

[Sando]

Just a follow up on this one, don't commit to this today, wait for tomorrow to say whether you've done this or not to see how many kills come out. Worst case scum fake you out by not using their 2nd (3rd, 4th, shit they might all have one!!!!) kills to kill you N2 through your BP, which is still a town-win.

2 questions.
1: Why are you thinking scum would ever have multiple factional kills as a standard thing?
2: Why do you seem to believe there's 5 scum (you jump from 4 to all)?

I was figuring that with 1 scumfaction and 23 people there'd be more than 1 NK possibility, especially as the leader is the only known quantity to scum and immune to them. I'm really just saying that I very much doubt the BP is protection against a determined scumfaction.

Isn't the setup 5 scum? I was just doing the fairly common "1,2,3...lots!" type of linguistic post. Beyond the ability to get through some BPs I haven't got much more theories on what they might have. My guess is they have a few 1-shot extra kills, or 1-shot strongmen etc. But having extra kills seems more likely than strongmen to me, given BP status and numbers of players.

I think the strongest long term option is probably the 6x medium for the coordination it will offer

Oh that poor poor dead person, this will create 6 one-on-one conversations for that dead person won't it, not a single 6-7 person "medium thread"? Also basically means we'd have to lynch town today since you'd need to be confident that the dead person is relaying messages correctly.

Responses to my Sando question as well as the spirit medium circle option would be much appreciated.

Is this a question to me or a question about me?

[Sando]

the worst is not looking good to me, he's another I have a good record of reading and I don't know how involved he actually is in the Marathon weekend, but he's been evasive here. In fact VOTE: the worst

this is as bad as you know it is brass

Uncool. You know that no matter how distracted you are with other games/marathon, you deserve the read from Brass.

[Sando]

you think I've been evasive Sando?
do you think me not being here is scum indicative?

I think you've been pretty much ignoring this game up until today RL and that Gamma is not wrong to point that out.

I think it's NAI for you, but calling Gamma out for saying it is not reasonable, it's a fair point from him.

[Sando]

Brass* that is, not Gamma

[Sando]

I agree, but why the vote? it's like he got half way through reading me for not being here then stopped and voted it for no reason

It'd be weird coming from me, I tend not to throw my vote out there.

Is it weird from Brass? You're generally a hyper-engaged player, and I personally see why you're not yet hyper engaged into this game due to seeing you playing marathons and like 5 other games and modding a game...but does he realise that?

[Sando]

So my current TRs are FA, duckling and Sakura (who doesn't pick a mechanical fight with me as scum imo). I normally build a "Town list", a "not to be lynched today list", a "yeah ok you can lynch them list" and a "scum list". That said, are we coordinating the next leader openly? Cause while I think we should obviously go for as townie as possible in our leader list, there's some townies that I don't feel completely comfortable picking as leader (although still better choices than anyone not in townie list).

How exactly is it scum-motivated? Or rather, why are you jumping the gun here?

Scum have daychat correct? Otherwise I'd say as a means of coded messages.

Oh so alisae is switching like the way ufo was in nintendo game

and probably is doing it to help scum

I don’t see how either of the given abilities help scum. They look likely help town more tbqh.

I don't understand FAs post, what was UFO doing in nintendo?

[Sando]

Oh, so you think Katsuki’s videos are coded messages? I hadn’t thought of that. Hmmmm . . . I don’t understand the nintendo reference either and what it has to do with Alsae.

I mean I doubt it due to scum having daychat, but then it might be something different (hell it could be Alisae giving them the videos to post or something). Basically it wouldn't surprise me if it's coded, but I very much doubt it's scum-coded, hence I very much doubt we'll work it out today or should read very much into it.

[Sando]

So pretty decent scum want to mess with our leader pick yeah, most likely by just killing them before we can vote them in? That does that kind of force us to do something like make them a superhero today and they can pick BP, or nominating someone else to do redirects on the proposed leader so kills go elsewhere?

[Sando]

just force people to vote in those two names and claim it before the day ends so there's a roughly even split (e.g. 10ish people on each name), but this can be kinda iffy if theyre not both universal town reads (and i don't think i've seen someone that's actually a universal town read yet)

I think we either force everyone to vote inside, or force anyone voting outside of it who scumreads both to vote something like the person after them in the player list. That way we know we cannot end up with more than a single vote on someone not nominated without scum interference.

[Sando]

So ummm

If a person hypothetically SRs both candidates, why would they be forced to play in a suboptimal manner so that one of their SRs is guaranteed leader next?

I mean I SR cerb, rn, but that seems to be what everyone wants to lead.

Because analysing and using known outcomes is more valuable to town than a single persons SR, at least that's the theory.

[Sando]

It is really bad that you are deciding to go along with Sando's conspiracy theory here, and I think you are scum for it. Sando gets a pass because they asked the question about daytalk.

If you want to insist that any theorising is scummy...you're gonna have a bad time. This is a complex game, people gonna theorise yo. Also I only "asked" to provide context, ie the fact that scum have daychat says it's not scum-scum communication. If you want to say it is scum-scum comms, you need to show why I'm wrong about daychat, since that's the basis for my theory.

[Sando]

(on another note, this is why I think all this talk about claiming vote targets and especially why was useless)

Useless or anti-town?

Cause this whole "zomg I can't see the direct scumlink in this right now and therefore it's bad" is just getting super old. There's gonna be speculation on mechanics that is wrong, there's going to be erroneous information posted that doesn't help town, that happens in literally every game.

Unless something is anti-town, then this whole "zomg look at this useless info" is just people trying to make themselves appear more useful than they are, it contributes nothing whilst complaining about lack of contribution.

[Sando]

Useless or anti-town?

what's the difference

One hurts town, one neither hurts nor helps...

How is this hard to understand as a concept?

[Sando]

nothing does...nothing... if that makes sense? The fact that it serves zero purpose means that people put time in energy into a waste of time and space.

idk how to make you get this. It's like saying plastic "neither hurts nor helps".

You're acting as if it was an absolute known that it would be useless...

[Sando]

UNVOTE:

nothing does...nothing... if that makes sense? The fact that it serves zero purpose means that people put time in energy into a waste of time and space.

idk how to make you get this. It's like saying plastic "neither hurts nor helps".

You're acting as if it was an absolute known that it would be useless...

fmpov it was useless from the beginning and it was very apparent to me.

Thinking that is one thing, knowing it is another.

[Sando]

the most impressive thing about this game is that sando has 39 posts, not a shred of scum hunting in

any

of them and i still think he seems town

kudos, sir

It's a gift.

My D1 scumreads typically suck balls. My TRs tend to be better.

My TRs are FA, duckling, Sakura
My no-lynchees for today are Gamma, Muffin, 129, Tora, Cerb, Hebi

I'm not particularly impressed with Human, Ank or Nos. Human is mostly gut, but hasn't done anything to really earn non-lynch status. Ank and Nos have basically decided to have a whinge about all the useless content whilst providing, well, whinges.

[Sando]

do you have a read on titus?

Actively Null. I think the posts gut-strike me as town, but I'm not all that happy about content of some posts. Whilst I like the idea of recording things like leader-votes vs wagons, I think it's too early to actually glean anything from it, especially at those numbers. I also can't see how she's come to the conclusion that scum helped FA without thinking they lied about the votes. FA seems to have "won" by 1 vote at 4 votes. That's a small margin and exactly the number of scum. Either all-scum voted FA and no-one else, or they threw one or two votes on her to try and tip the scales (well judged if so scum) without blowing it out, or they all voted FA and are lying about it. If scum did want FA as leader then my guess is the last as that's the most logical, in which case this should prompt investigation of the vote-claim order.

[Sando]

There are 5 scum per the opening posts of this game.
I like 129, that's almost as good as ASDPI(Which I'll keep referring to you as, so long as you keep spamming the thread with single quote post replies).

Is this referring to me?

You can't vote for yourself as leader per rules post, so assuming scum coordinated onto one other scum, the max votes they can put on someone is 4.

[Sando]

Oh. I took Titus' post as being more concerned with the scum team selecting someone who *isn't* on their team.

Maybe, my 4 was merely an indicator that that's the max scum-votes they can put on scum, and it's how many FA seems to have gotten.

But assuming scum coordinated (I assume they coordinated in some degree) they:
Conspired to ensure their votes were split
Conspired to elect someone they wanted to elect

If they conspired to split their votes then I don't see us getting any out of it today, so I'm assuming Titus is looking at conspiring to elect someone (town or scum). If they conspired to elect, they either put 1-2 people on a popular person, figuring that'd push them over the edge, or they piled on figuring they could lie about it today.

If they're lying (which seems a reasonable bet if you think they conspired to get FA elected, regardless of her alignment) then the biggest tell for that is going to be when they declared. Doubt they wanted us to KNOW they were lying, so they likely wanted FA to appear as having the most votes, without giving away everyone that voted her. So they needed to know 2nd places number of votes and the number of town votes on FA before knowing how much they needed to prop it up.

Basically, of the people that declared for FA, the most likely ones to be scum are the late declarers.

Titus has started the speculation but not actually dug into it, which I don't like.

[Sando]

I am pretty sure leader votes were popularity thing since the start of the game.

I'm fairly confident scum coordinated, but everyone seems to assume that means they coordinated to elect FA. I just think they coordinated to only vote one person each and minimise the risk, however small, that we nail em with it.

It's Titus' seeming confidence that they coordinated to elect FA

and

then not taking that to its logical conclusion that has me worried.

[Sando]

Sorry not feeling up to more catch up today

that's fine lovely, come up with a few days to make a convincing story up. we'll be waiting. :3

Did we find out whose head was the first?

[Sando]

I think they just said for the first day vote naturally as if you were town.

They already have a chance of getting powers without having to worry about being found out, plus look how paranoid it made some people. By doing nothing other than acting naturally they only win.
Thing is by voting on likeness they also raise their chance of being picked because if someone likes you more your chances of being picked are better imo
Sooo

Again, I'm not saying that scum did X or Y, or saying that anyone assuming scum did X or Y is scummy.

What I'm saying is that Titus seems to assume scum coordinated to elect FA and then does not follow that assumption through to it's logical conclusion.

It's the not following through that I find scummy/worrying, not the underlying assumption.

[Sando]

She won't be leader day two.

But that leaves us where day 1?

Same predicament. I try to sort my theory. Get jumped. Try to create ideas that remove scum advantage. Get jumped. Like I get disagreeing with mh random theory and wanting to sort me but at least sort me and try to bring something better than out the PRs d2. It does nothing to solve d1.

I don't understand what you're even trying to argue here

FA has no accountability D1. If I try to find who might be scum buddying FA, I get voted by all those who selected FA as leader. Thus negating my ability to find who it is. I get voted for being "incompetent" for trying to find a solution to scum possibily buddying FA.

The forcing FA to claim day 2 does nothing for Day 1. Scum already likely get their hooks in.

So what's your idea to stop FA from giving PRs to scum that are charismatic?

I think it's likely numbers because of the major pushback there.

UFO is just basically being UFO. Cerb was second place according to claimed votes, so he's probably buddied. That leaves numbers.

Wat?

Why do you need something for D1? For starters, this is the best chance for us to scumhunt, afaik we can't string up a town PR since they don't exist yet, and you could string up a scum PR since they might exist. That's great for town! Only scum should be scared of D1 lynches.

Scum!FA giving scum powers is going to have to justify that in the coming days, for example, giving it to you when you're being reasonably widely scumread and not really townread...if you turn out to be scum then FA is on the chopping block.
Town!FA is just as motivated as anyone else to give it to townie, making it open firstly gives scum a say that they otherwise wouldn't, and narrows down the scum-kill to guaranteed PRs.

FA claiming D2 is flat out better than D1, D3 would be nice if we think we can get that far, we'll see.

[Sando]

Ank why is Tora townier than me? Like in what world is buddying up to me an indication that I'm scum? Also why is no-one asking Tora whether he lock-clears me? He's quoted a few readlists that have me as weaktown to weakscum and never questioned those reads, but "with reservations" got a question. Surely in a world where I lock-clear Tora for agreeing with him, he lock-clears me too.

VOTE: Titus

It's my GFs birthday today and I'll be VLA from another couple of hours until probably EOD.

[Sando]

Worst there are no excuses anymore

You need to substantiate that read

I mean this is from someone scumreading me who basically never provides anything of note as to why or how...hard not to read this is hypocritical

[Sando]

sando seems town but i kind of want him to just stop talking about the setup altogether

Nah.

@Ankamius: Just to clarify here, you're suspicious of Titus, but *very* suspicious of ASDPI? Is that what I should conclude from everything you've been saying and where your vote is currently located?

Reading is helpful, guys

How does this go against the idea that you're pushing against your partner?

[Sando]

ok bye

I didnt even know you were doing it lol

but yeah she is... my strongest townread? possibly

Wait haven't you townlocked me?

[Sando]

she is leaving a better impression right now

are you jealous?

No I'm starting to think the others had a point with your comment about me townlocking you.

[Sando]

Everyone else sees it as null though.

Everyone else sees it as an exercise in futility given the sheer amount of it done by all alignments, sadly.

[Sando]

I'm confused here, we got 129 and Titus, and we also think Scum!129 = scum!ank, and we need a lynch like naow, is that all correct?

VOTE: 123456789

[Sando]

If you work it out lmk Mylo

Get someone to vote you for stupid reasons, works for me.

VOTE: sando

hammer vote sucked o/

Nos seems keen on that sort of thing, see if he'll help you out.

Titus is still talking about mechanics in a particularly bad and self serving manner, so that's D3 lynch sorted.

I'm second last or something in the list for vote-claim yeah?

I'm not sure I see a decent situation where scum manipulate the vote to give it to Titus, is a D3 mislynch really worth giving the choice to town? Only thing it makes me think is FA and Titus are not the same faction, scum don't give townie a second nights power-choice just for the chance of a D3 mislynch. Regardless of how scummy you think Titus is, you can assume she'll act in towns interests overnight if she's town. If FA is scum, maybe they throw it to a townie.

I can see scum voting Cerb and killing him, gives them plausible deniability and leaves the leader vote falling somewhat randomly. Decent plan for scum, but I can't see town voting Titus up, even with Cerb dead, but let's see the vote claims.

I really don't see how Titus gets leader without scum influence (beyond the Cerb kill).

I also think the single kill overnight when BP was an option says those complaining about speculation yesterday should be treated with significant suspicion. Leaving our leader choice open to scum NKs is opening the door to fuckery, but with BP on the table and seemingly confirmed single-kill, it was a good option for us to have declared our vote target(s) last night. Only scum knew that though.

[Sando]

from that point of view zMuff's plan is mechanically sound. I'd say pick 3 people we should split votes between I guess.

Wait the muff of Z came up with a plan?

VOTE: zMuffin

Yeah...dis, dis is gud.

[Sando]

from that point of view zMuff's plan is mechanically sound. I'd say pick 3 people we should split votes between I guess.

Found it, yeah that's a scum plan right thar.

[Sando]

Reading the powers, it's not as bad as I first thought, we have another BP, which is the precondition to "the plan". But still, complaining about me setup speculating then complaining Titus got elected due to lack of town coordination...

[Sando]

I'm not sure I see a decent situation where scum manipulate the vote to give it to Titus, is a D3 mislynch really worth giving the choice to town? Only thing it makes me think is FA and Titus are not the same faction, scum don't give townie a second nights power-choice just for the chance of a D3 mislynch. Regardless of how scummy you think Titus is, you can assume she'll act in towns interests overnight if she's town. If FA is scum, maybe they throw it to a townie.

I can't understand this part of your post at all can you explain it again?

Urgh, I pulled a Trump, that's what I get for posting after a 14 hour day. That should be that I

don't

see a situation where scum didn't manipulate to get Titus leader, and I don't see them doing that to Town!Titus unless you're (FA) scum.

Basically anything not involving scum voting Titus pretty obviously relies on town voting her, and that's really what I can't see, (enough of) town doing that. There is another option, but it's super slim and vote-claims will confirm/deny it.

[Sando]

Get someone to vote you for stupid reasons, works for me.

i mean you hammered while stipulating a scum team that makes exactly 0 sense but hey i guess its dumb that you lined up lynches after a day of totally useless posts

The posts literally before me was Nancy basically accusing Ank of partnering with 129 to push attention onto other people, like Titus. I was trying to confirm that was what their theory was. How does me trying to confirm another persons theory evidence of me stipulating a scumteam?

[Sando]

first off why is that plan bad
second why the heck is Muffins becoming a suspect all of a sudden? Like I don't recall tw saying anything of the sort.
third Sando's tone here seems mildly forced

keep reading:

Reading the powers, it's not as bad as I first thought, we have another BP, which is the precondition to "the plan". But still, complaining about me setup speculating then complaining Titus got elected due to lack of town coordination...

[Sando]

yes, me complaining about you doing absolutely nothing but talking about the setup and me suggesting that it's stupid for someone like titus to have been elected due to a complete lack of co-ordination are things that are comparable

you're truly a spectacular player

God you're bad. I mean keep saying I did nothing but speculate on setup, but talking setup to show why someone (Titus) is scum is not the same as "talking setup".

You TR'd me all yesterday, you bitched about setup talk while ignoring actual alignment posts I was making about people, and then today want to bitch about lack of coordination.

[Sando]

weird sass, idk what to make of it. Only other real note is didn't Sando spec about multiple scum kills earlier? Sando why do you think that's ever a thing?

Number of players, how many mislynches and NKs do we need to lose? Seems like a lot, and I wasn't seeing any other killing roles, but BP was being handed out like candy. I don't play many theme games though, so I'm looking at it through an Open games light.

[Sando]

5 day perfect town win with lynches only, 5 day perfect scum win one death per day or night phase seems like reasonable speed, plus vigs are possible

5 days of mislynches+NKs with 23/5 is 13 with 5, 6 days is 11 with 5 and mylo. So they need 7 mislynches by my count to get the win, assuming no other kills.

[Sando]

I had something else I wanted to say, but the pissing contest is too much of a turn off. Stahp it.

Is this the "I voted you and was gonna post a case or even just a reason then decided this was all that was necessary" post?

[Sando]

If you weren't looking down your nose so often, your eyes might not hurt so much.

You know what you should do, have a pissing contest! Oh wait...

[Sando]

i just called him scum multiple times for the exact same reason

Ahhh me? You came in D2 and said my hammer was scummy and voted me. How is that multiple times of the same reason?

[Sando]

In the meantime, ISO my recent posts for the leader vote tallys

Am I meant to claim my N1 leader vote yet or still waiting for my turn?

[Sando]

Oh we’re going in turns? :/

It was mentioned, I was back of the line, but I'm not sure we're actually following it.

[Sando]

Why isn't lynching Titus tomorrow enough of a test of the claim? Am I missing something here? People have claimed mason+result on someone that we wanted to lynch anyway. Is it just because we can't lynch Titus today and so we want to test the claim today?

[Sando]

we were arguing about the sakura + katsuki mason claim, sando

Yeah I thought that was the case, but it's a claim of mason AND a guilty on Titus isn't it? Fake-claiming mason is one thing, but fake-claiming a mason+guilty is instantly lynchable imo. Why aren't we just waiting for Titus flip to tell us?

[Sando]

Is there anything particularly wrong with the idea of a {

Sando, Titus

, Shiro, BBmolla} team?

Yes, this is silly. You can say I hammered my buddy, or you can say I spent most of D1 with a safe-ish vote on Titus, but the idea that I spent all day distancing from Titus only to hammer my other buddy for a 129/Titus/Sando trio is just silly. Pick me or Titus if you want, but thinking we made a trio is just insanity.

[Sando]

Drixx doesn’t play traditionally d1. He is more concerned with blocking and communication than reads day one.

You know it's D2 right? See up there next to the game name, in brackets, it says "(Day 2)".

If you can find his reasoning for the vote on me, maybe you'd have a point?

[Sando]

Yes I am aware it is day two. It is day one for Drixx’s existence I believe.

Far as I can tell he had a problem with your wall. He also had some other well developed points but this one could have been and imho should have had a bit more from him. He is still town this just reads like bad town play.

Wait so we're saying that no matter what day Drixx replaces in on he'll play like D1? So if he replaces in at Lylo he won't be concerned with reads?

Why are you quoting Gamma regarding Drixx's case?

[Sando]

2) I am quoting Gamma to demonstrate while that specific point was underdeveloped, he has had several good contributions and many people see that and I am trying to show you how Drixx is town.

You do have a valid point that that vote was underdeveloped however in the grand scheme of things Drixx is town and does expand on things when he feels confident enough to do so.

Ok...but you're quoting things where (I think) he and Gamma are agreeing that Titus' game-setup logic is bad, and thus they're also in agreement on the read on me. This ignores that I spent most of D1 going after Titus for bad game-setup logic. Surely if that's what you're in vehement agreement about, you don't then just automatically agree that one of the main people deriding Titus' game-setup logic, is scum?

[Sando]

I think they just said for the first day vote naturally as if you were town.

They already have a chance of getting powers without having to worry about being found out, plus look how paranoid it made some people. By doing nothing other than acting naturally they only win.
Thing is by voting on likeness they also raise their chance of being picked because if someone likes you more your chances of being picked are better imo
Sooo

Again, I'm not saying that scum did X or Y, or saying that anyone assuming scum did X or Y is scummy.

What I'm saying is that Titus seems to assume scum coordinated to elect FA and then does not follow that assumption through to it's logical conclusion.

It's the not following through that I find scummy/worrying, not the underlying assumption.

I wasn't saying that being bad at the logic was scummy, I was saying that not following through with the bad logic to actually scumhunt was scummy.

[Sando]

Like I don’t understand how this connects with Drixx. I have known Drixx a long while. When Drixx gets fired up you’ll know it and see it. Like I see him scumhunting but that point was underdeveloped and I see him trying to form a town block. So I see your point (a tree) but I don’t see the forest

My point was I wasn't just disagreeing with Titus on setup, I was SRing her due to her follow up to that setup. I don't think it's valid as a defence of Drixx's vote on me, for Drixx and Gamma to agree about Titus' bad setup spec, and thus turn their gaze towards me.

I'm not saying Drixx is scum, I'm saying your reasoning for TRing him is faulty, and thus I also think SRing Drixx's accusers is faulty (for that, SR them for other stuff all you want).

[Sando]

This means we have to make it appealing enough for Titus to do if scum while at the same time minimizing impact to town.

I'm not sure how you plan to do this. The only carrot we have is not insta-lynching her tomorrow, and the only way we can believably say that is to direct the super-hero team and lynch/no-lynch based on her following that list. I don't see how scum-Titus looks at us not directing the hero team and just gives us the finger overnight and tomorrow by giving all-scum powers or throwing a giant fucking WIFOM bomb into us.

Only realistic option I see is "here's your superpower team, deviate and die tomorrow", if she's scum she can go along with it and hope to live, or say "fuck you" like she was always going to.

[Sando]

People have until like midnight to say they hate the Frozen Angel leader choice if they do.

I hate the leader FA pick, it's unnecessarily dangerous.

The assumption is Cerb just failed to pick BP or redirect, when it also provides the easy cover for FA to claim she picked Cerb and pick someone else while killing Cerb.

[Sando]

I hate the leader FA pick, it's unnecessarily dangerous.

Note, I'm not saying she's scum, and I'm also fairly sanguine about her being in the superhero group tonight, just think it's unnecessarily dangerous to double up on a leader who's anon pick who had 2 protection picks available died overnight.

[Sando]

This assumption fails because there's no way FA can predict whether Cerberus will be mediumed tonight or not.

Good point!

[Sando]

?? It’s not FA picks another leader. It’s that she picks between the two people we vote between.

A universal townread (doesn’t have to be FA if you scumread her but why?) then picks the second.

It’s arguably a two town leader plan which makes sure scum can’t override it.

So it’s all public. If she claimed to pick another person and then kills them then

Ok let's slow this down MB. Process we should be doing:
1) Pick 2 people who are designated leader-votees tonight, everyone commits to voting within then 2 people
2) We designate 5 people for Titus to make as her superhero team tonight

If you want FA to pick those 2 people I'm not 100% against that, I'm (was, Ank points out my mistake) saying FA shouldn't be 1 of the 2.

There's nothing for FA to actually do as leader or to become leader or to assign leader to anyone.

[Sando]

Actually
Cant scum just use power negation on Cerb to prevent any spirit medium from targeting them?

They'd have to target Cerb wouldn't they?

@MOD - Other than the spiritual mediumship, can any other powers be targeted at dead players and work?

[Sando]

I was thinking FA continuous BP and powers makes for a nice combo. But if that is a bad idea then sorry :/ Been working on a clock but the main idea is there

No I think it's a decent idea, I even suggested it as an option yesterday. But there was also decent amount of talk about Cerb being NKd yesterday, and if he'd picked BP he'd be alive presumably, and a town redirector can very safely redicrect onto the leader overnight, so he had two safe options and seemingly took neither, oh and scum correctly read a superhero team member pick. The other (paranoid) option is FA is lying to us about picking Cerb and killed him while picking a scumpartner.

[Sando]

That assumption still fails unless you also assume that scum would know D2's powers before the end of D1

But, that possibility I didn't think of. Did you ask the mod about it?

They could redirect onto themselves, it fails at that point, I just checked and it's in the Day1 FAQ.

[Sando]

That assumption still fails unless you also assume that scum would know D2's powers before the end of D1

But, that possibility I didn't think of. Did you ask the mod about it?

They could redirect onto themselves, it fails at that point, I just checked and it's in the Day1 FAQ.

mm...

That's actually concerning, yeah.

I'm getting a headache trying to parse this into my head. My initial reaction is that pushing for this specifically is a really bizarre gambit that doesn't seem worth the risk this early in the game (even with a dead scum D1), but it's hard to tell without sitting down and mapping it out.

Wait what? Someone summarize this for me. I am lost a bit

Redirector?

So:
FA could be scum and lying about giving Cerb a power choice and killed him instead. This would be instantly outed by a town PR who picked the medium power linking up with Cerb tonight and outing the fact that FA is lying. However scum could have picked redirect last night and redirect the townPR->Cerb to themselves, at which point the medium power fails and we can no longer get the confirmation from Cerb.

Also of note, the medium can only target Cerb tonight, after that, he's not an option.

[Sando]

So does power distribution come before or after kills? If this game follows NAR is that after or before?

I dunno exactly where, but I'm pretty sure somewhere we confirmed you could use powers same night you got them. This seems to confirm that kills come after new-power use, but I can see some wiggle room there.

Also there were 2 deadlines overnight, leader vote and actions, so it seems actions and power-choice is rolled up into one deadline, for whatever that is worth.

[Sando]

That could end up with a fake guilty without the redirector necessary

We're assuming the redirector will target Cerb tonight, not last night (where they'd redirect the kill onto themselves). Town medium didn't know who was dead, so unless they wanted to strike up a convo with scum they probably didn't use the power if they chose it.

[Sando]

Btw please do remember while choosing teams that a player may only use ONE super power per night.

Dis a good point.

@Mod: Is Duplication considered a "night" ability? Ie does the PR use the power at night for the following day, or is it a daytime ability that therefore doesn't count against the single power per night.

[Sando]

And yeah ... you got the vote for reasons I thought I developed enough to be obvious. I'm posting more stuff each post and less frequently than before my break, which is mostly a function of the changes in my time at the computer. If you don't think something is clear you can ask.

You didn't develop them at all, you've said literally nothing about me directly that I can see

[Sando]

You don’t do it until you’re 100% sure or damn near close to it.
Very rarely if ever do you use it for a reaction test.

Cool, thanks

VOTE: Drixx

[Sando]

You don’t do it until you’re 100% sure or damn near close to it.
Very rarely if ever do you use it for a reaction test.

Cool, thanks

VOTE: Drixx

*facepalm*

Nah seriously, I'm done with this bullshit. He's been offered MANY opportunities to lay out even the barest of reasoning for the vote on me, and utterly refused to do so. Multiple people are saying things along the lines of his vote meaning a strong read, yet he won't back it up.

Beyond that, you're demonstrating a distinct lack of understanding for the mechanics of this game, I'm unsure if you're muddying the water or can't be bothered reading, but I'm done playing, deadline looms and I don't want another Titus elected.

[Sando]

Ok this discussion has to happen, this is stupid, but we have to do this. I'm nominating 2 people for leader for town to vote between, if you disagree on the 2 say so with you you'd replace with what. I'm saying 5 people for hero-team, again say who you want to replace, be aware you can't use more than 1 power per night when you decide this. By default your superhero team should include you leaders for protection sake.

Leaders:
Sando
Ankanimus

Superhero:
Sando
Ankanimus
Gamma
Hebichan
Brandi

[Sando]

Yes I have asked some questions that Sakura teased me that were already asked in thread.

However that demonstrates that I am trying to piece this together and some of my questions helped us to get a leash and helped us to make sure town is a leader. I am fine if I am not chosen for leader or powers. However your overreach of “distinct lack of understanding or trying to muddy the waters” is false. I am trying to catch up on a hundred page game and still provide reads. If you expect perfection of a replacement do something else because when I am perfect I am scum.

Drixx is hunting just not how you or I would hunt.

You're trying to catch up on a game where 95% of the setup is in the first 3-4 posts of the game. Not knowing how the leader/hero-team works in at least a vague overview sense isn't a factor of struggling to catch up on 100+ pages, it's a factor of not reading the first couple of posts.

Drixx is current "hunting" by voting a townie and utterly refusing to provide reads...that's shit hunting by anyone's standard. The fact that town don't know he's currently voting town doesn't change the fact that it's utter shit.

[Sando]

People have until like midnight to say they hate the Frozen Angel leader choice if they do.

I hate the leader FA pick, it's unnecessarily dangerous.

Difference of 30 minutes on my count, fuck off with your "didn't say so by midnight".

[Sando]

Problem 1: You can't pick yourself as a teammate

Hmmm? The superhero team is to leash Titus, not tomorrows leaders.

[Sando]

2) Ank doesn’t trust Gamma so there is no way that is a universal read and if Ank votes Gamma there is no way in hell she doesn’t veto that pick

Congrats on not understanding what's going on...

[Sando]

2) Ank doesn’t trust Gamma so there is no way that is a universal read and if Ank votes Gamma there is no way in hell she doesn’t veto that pick

Congrats on not understanding what's going on...

The plan is 5 universal town for Titus to give powers to.

By definition that cannot be Gamma if Ank does not townread Gamma.

Wtf?

EOD Titus nominates up to 5 people to have powers, those are the people in my list.

Tonight, we vote for a leader, those are the 2 people in my leader list.

The leader we vote tonight do absolutely fucking nothing as leaders until tomorrow EOD.

Ank SRing one of the people who gets on the superhero team tonight matters sweet fuck all, whether or not Ank becomes the leader, because it's Titus that nominates them.

[Sando]

Gamma and Brandi are not townread and have zero business being on Titus’s list. We are supposed to give PRs to town or not at all.

Ank who is a universal townreads someone in that list so they don’t get powers period.
That’s how the plan is as was. It’s universal townreads get powers.

That's the discussion I'm trying to generate...if you don't like my list, cool, make your own and progress the conversation. Just note that I'm avoiding people from FA's list since doubling up powers seems like a waste. I'm not totally sold on that, just...it's a thing.

[Sando]

We are supposed to give PRs to town or not at all.

Given Titus is largely SR'd, I feel we should give a list of 5. Scum!Titus given a list of less than 5 is going to very happily just give the remaining powers to their buddies.

[Sando]

Sando

Can you go into your townreads on Gamma and Hebi?

I don't really have an opinion of Hebichan either way, but Gamma's really bizarre push on me and then immediately dropping it was gross.

Not really...Hebi is a townlean to me, but there's not a huge amount of content there. Gamma really epitomises the problem we have here, a distinct lack of TRs. I figured for leader I'd pick whoever I strongest TR'd amongst the heroes, hence you. I'd really have liked to pick anyone but me, but honestly I'm super struggling for TRs this game. After that I didn't want to pick any of the superheroes, and Gamma was the last on my list. Gamma is well and truly into my neutral list, I'm into my neutral list a long time before you get to Gamma on that list.

I dove into the mason claim bullshit enough to get told to piss off, so I'm leaving that alone. I don't TR duckling, which to me says he's PR or scum, and he aint PR. I don't like BB and Mylo, Mylo is just flat out a bad leader pick regardless of your alignment thoughts. Human I was unsure of, they're fairly neutral to me.

Who am I missing that needs to be in there? Do you think I'm wrong to avoid doubling up powers?

[Sando]

We are supposed to give PRs to town or not at all.

Given Titus is largely SR'd, I feel we should give a list of 5. Scum!Titus given a list of less than 5 is going to very happily just give the remaining powers to their buddies.

And if she did that would be a scum claim all the same and would put her buddies if they ever claimed it. One or two is acceptable because then we also get a buddy and GG we win.

The moment five people don't claim, a huge target goes on my back. If I give to someone who I said was scum, it's autolynch. I am going to be submitting my list later today.

The intimation from MB was that we direct you to give powers to less than 5 people. If we gave you 3 people to give powers to, as scum, from what I can tell there's no way for us to know whether you gave it to more than 3 players. Hence, us nominating 5, even if we're not sure on towniness, is better than not nominating 5.

[Sando]

We are supposed to give PRs to town or not at all.

Given Titus is largely SR'd, I feel we should give a list of 5. Scum!Titus given a list of less than 5 is going to very happily just give the remaining powers to their buddies.

And if she did that would be a scum claim all the same and would put her buddies if they ever claimed it. One or two is acceptable because then we also get a buddy and GG we win.

What?

We say to Titus, give powers to Sando, Ank, Math.

Titus gives powers to Sando, Ank, Math and 2 scum. Tomorrow Titus says, yep, gave powers to those 3.

How on earth do we know Titus is lying? I guess if we lynch one of the other two we also get Titus?

[Sando]

Why should for scum voting a possible town!titus to become a leader I should be scum in your theory?

Because I don't see scum voting to elect two townies in a row. Regardless of how mislynchable Titus is and how much we shit on her, scum should assume she'll act in towns interest tonight if she's town.

[Sando]

The inference is that I am honest about the three that claim. The others are legit question marks. Yet if I don't state five names and have at least 4 claim powers, I am auto dead soooo

Wat? If you're scum and give say 2 unclaimed powers to your scumbuddies, they're not going to just say "yo Titus gave me powers last night". How are we going to know?

Now correct me if I'm wrong, but one of the superhero team members confirmed they're not told of the rest of the team, which would make your argument valid.

[Sando]

Why should for scum voting a possible town!titus to become a leader I should be scum in your theory?

Because I don't see scum voting to elect two townies in a row. Regardless of how mislynchable Titus is and how much we shit on her, scum should assume she'll act in towns interest tonight if she's town.

oh

that actually makes sense

or that scum wanted us to think that way for double bluff/framing but I find that less likely

I know I'd have 100% lynched Titus today if not for leader, so they're giving us a town-leader for a slightly increased mislynch chance D3?

[Sando]

If we get 3 power claims, then we'd suppose at that point I gave 2 scumbuddies powers in that setup and just lynch me.

Not if we'd told you to only give 3 people powers...which was what MB was intimating.

"Hey Titus give X, Y, Z superhero powers"
X, Y, Z confirm they got powers
Cool! You're free to go Titus!

[Sando]

Well I'm not following a plan that says give to less than 5. I am not suicidal.

That's literally what I was saying to MB, that we should give you a 5 person list.

[Sando]

Pretty sure Sando's town now.

On another note, Siren's call is kind of unreliable, FA notified us of 5 people she selected for her team, on a supposed FA scum that lied, we have 2 scum with potential Siren's call and 4 towns that may or may not have Spiritual Mediumship. If there's 3 town that chose Siren's Call, then at least 1 will succeed, so trying to go via the angle of FA lied and killed cerb doesnt seem feasible?

Yeah I've been misreading the power I think, I thought Sirens Call could Target Cerb and redirect the mediums directed at him to alive scum and invalidate them. It looks like it needs to be targeted at the medium instead, much harder for scum to reliably pull off.

[Sando]

Siren's Call

: Target another player. That player's actions will be redirected to target you instead of their original target until the next Night Phase.

Not... really?

I'm agreeing with you? Scum Sirens call requires them to target the super-hero with medium power. I misread it as them being able to target Cerb and get the mediums actions redirected from Cerb to them.

Am I wrong about being wrong?

[Sando]

Ok this discussion has to happen, this is stupid, but we have to do this. I'm nominating 2 people for leader for town to vote between, if you disagree on the 2 say so with you you'd replace with what.

I'm saying 5 people for hero-team, again say who you want to replace, be aware you can't use more than 1 power per night when you decide this.

By default your superhero team should include you leaders for protection sake.

Leaders:
Sando
Ankanimus

Superhero:
Sando
Ankanimus
Gamma
Hebichan
Brandi

This is a real garbage list and a grabage thing to consider. Distributing power is extremly bad for town here. WE WANT to keep the power in trustable circle that is what we should do not just going wild and giving everyone something just so they all can use it together.

I agree but does it really hurt town if we can find ways of possibly widening that a bit - our “trustable town circle” - I mean?

I mean if the mechanics were different and the superheroes could choose more than one power a night, I’d 100% agree with you. I agree that we have to be very careful with whom we give those sh powers to but I do think it is in town’s interest to do our best to try and solve more people, in order to widen that list and strengthen town’s effectiveness. Do you not think that makes sense?

Literally suggested a town-circle yesterday and got SRd for it, god damn I hate this site and it's reflexive knee jerk reactions to setup ideation.

It's difficult the create the circle due to only being able to use a single ability though per night. I note you guys not exactly proposing any solutions there...

A redirector targeting dead?

Are you nuts?

Given it's specifically mentioned in the FAQ about getting the medium power redirected onto the living and thus cancelling it, no I don't think I'm nuts for considering it.

What happens if someone using the Spiritual Mediumship Superpower is redirected to a living slot?
Spiritual Mediumship fails on living players.

That said, I got the way the medium power worked mixed up the wrong way and it's super hard for scum to pull off what I suggested you would need to do as scum.

[Sando]

Apparently this somehow wasn't clear before - Sando you got voted because you were literally intentionally winding Titus up to no possible town purpose. There was no good motivation to do what you were doing. It was toxic to the game state and so you are either scum and you were doing it to try and get Titus chasing in circles (which would merit re-evaluating Titus) or you were town doing it and just not giving a shit that you were making the game toxic.

Your response to being voted over it was the entire point of the exercise. Let's say I'm not exactly feeling great about your response.

This is just pure BS from you.

[Sando]

Go back and read you and Titus in ISO from start of day 2. You are legitimately winding Titus up with no goal that I can discern. It's not only NOT BS, it's precisely how I always operate.

I don't think I've ever actually directed anything towards Titus D2. All I really said was that she's continued along the lines of D1 and done self serving speculation, and I've pointed out that I think it fairly likely scum voted for Titus to be leader.

That's not winding up...

[Sando]

It's over guys, scum are probably all getting powers tonight, including that power negation thingy.

We should've stopped this from happening day 1, as

zMuffinMan

suggested, but no one helped.

I suggested it and got scumread for it.

I then more forcefully suggested it today and got scumread for it again.

Town are stupid when it comes to setup, get used to it.

I'm off overseas for 2 days.

[Sando]

voted fa

VOTE: Sando

got a result on sando that said "not town"

so go ahead and lynch that when you want

Which power exactly gave you that ability?

Nos is flat out scum here, and his posts on me D2 show blatant misrepping anyway.

Anyone who got traction said I might be town at some point.

do you have a read on titus?

I think the posts gut-strike me as town.

can we get some traction on this ^^

So he takes a single line of my post and turns it into me strong-townreading Titus. When if you read the full post, I'm pretty clearly saying gut says town, content says scum.

do you have a read on titus?

Actively Null.

I think the posts gut-strike me as town

, but I'm not all that happy about content of some posts. Whilst I like the idea of recording things like leader-votes vs wagons, I think it's too early to actually glean anything from it, especially at those numbers. I also can't see how she's come to the conclusion that scum helped FA without thinking they lied about the votes. FA seems to have "won" by 1 vote at 4 votes. That's a small margin and exactly the number of scum. Either all-scum voted FA and no-one else, or they threw one or two votes on her to try and tip the scales (well judged if so scum) without blowing it out, or they all voted FA and are lying about it. If scum did want FA as leader then my guess is the last as that's the most logical, in which case this should prompt investigation of the vote-claim order.

[Sando]

As for FA's little push yesterday, god that was bad.

Then medium was mentioned and for him to be able to keep his paranoia he started making up new scenarios so he suggested that scum me can redirect the medium out of a dead player by targeting the dead player with redirector ability without asking the mod

this stubbornness in sticking to paranoia and NOT evaluating my slot for anything else is NOT normal at all. This is not a town mindset

Except I did ask the mod.

@MOD - Other than the spiritual mediumship, can any other powers be targeted at dead players and work?

Also why you didn't try to evaluate anything about me if you had concerns and you claim My pick on cerb might be fake? This is the "devil's proof" and the burden is on you if you want to accuse I'm scummy.

VOTE: Sando

Here blatantly lies that I'm accusing her of scumminess, when I specifically said:

I hate the leader FA pick, it's unnecessarily dangerous.

Note, I'm not saying she's scum, and I'm also fairly sanguine about her being in the superhero group tonight, just think it's unnecessarily dangerous to double up on a leader who's anon pick who had 2 protection picks available died overnight.

FA is either really, really shit at reading an ISO, or is blatantly misrepping here.

THIS IS A VERY SCUMMY Vote Out of absoloutly nowhere on scum Sando Should definitely die just for this post alone and how thats in contradiction with his no lynch today stance that was also out of nowhere!

Also in what fucking world is hammering D1 scum when we only have vanilla's cause for "definite death". I haven't asked for credit, but what the actual fuck how is THIS what you think is worth definitive death.

[Sando]

No, I have an urge to vote Titus.
But if she kept her promise then maybe she's not scum... maybe.

A leader candidate died who should have gotten powers and knew they'd be a top target and thus had every reason to pick BP...apparently either didn't get powers or didn't pick BP. Unless they already had some protection that failed, I don't find it likely that Ank chose anything other than BP.

[Sando]

definitely would beg to differ here. he tends to get townread too easily when he’s scum.

His meta is scum-lurks, town-actives. Some games are low activity enough for him to succeed at it as scum...I don't think the 150+ page D3 game is going to be one of those for some reason.

[Sando]

Anyone mind-meld with Cerb and can confirm he got powered by FA?

Anyone try to mind-meld with Cerb and fail?

[Sando]

No, I have an urge to vote Titus.
But if she kept her promise then maybe she's not scum... maybe.

A leader candidate died who should have gotten powers and knew they'd be a top target and thus had every reason to pick BP...apparently either didn't get powers or didn't pick BP. Unless they already had some protection that failed, I don't find it likely that Ank chose anything other than BP.

Oh never mind, scum probably picked up Power Negation last night, so there's definitively scum within the Titus hero-team, but it's not necessarily Titus.

[Sando]

Mine is pretty self evident as well. I played the long game yo. Didn't want to obvtown either in case I die. Now we have Cerb to talk to ^_^

Hi Cerb. I'm assuming he did get a power notification N1?

You got a N2 power then as well?

[Sando]

Mine is pretty self evident as well. I played the long game yo. Didn't want to obvtown either in case I die. Now we have Cerb to talk to ^_^

Hi Cerb. I'm assuming he did get a power notification N1?

You got a N2 power then as well?

I did indeed.

And Cerb got powered N1? Or you haven't asked/been answered?

[Sando]

@Mod - Will we be notified of petrification happening explicitly?

[Sando]

you did ask the mod in a manner that mod confirmed they won't answer it. YOU COULD ASK privately instead couldn't you?

Seriously? You're saying "I could have just asked the mod" and when I point out that I did, you turn around with "you could have asked privately so I couldn't have possibly seen it and then my accusation would hold some water". You're accusing me of not bothering to ask the mod, the fact that I did it in thread vs publicly doesn't change the fact that you're wrong, except for the fact that doing it publicly proves you wrong.

you are keeping the middle ground here, shading me as a leader choice without evaluating anything I did in the game. Tell me how is that a misrepresentation in any form?

You're saying I need "devils proof", when that is only required when I'm accusing you of scumminess.

I (was) saying that putting all our eggs in the FA basket is too dangerous. Given your atrocious reading here, along with previously outlined reasoning, I'm sticking with that.

And that vote was scummy cause the last time you mentioned 1-9 they were in your "No lynch" pool and you had 0 evaluation to put them there in first place or to change that to a hammer vote.

You didn't just say it was scummy, you said that in isolation that single action was enough to have me lynched.

[Sando]

Frozen why are you arguing with conf scum lol

because of nos cop claim?

I see no reason for him to lie

Other than being scum?

There's no cop powers in N1 or N2.

[Sando]

I can't imagine a world were ank didn't choose bp two nights in row. either titus lied and did'nt give her abilities last night and they chose something else night 1 or scum has strongman kills

Ehhhhhhh........

Idk, I have a theory floating up in my head.

Power negation would work.

Most obvious option is scum in the Titus superhero team chose it and used on Ank for dat kill.

[Sando]

Can't really see a world where ankamius didnt try to link Cerb last night.

Ank was also the person to point out the spiritual guidance problem with my FA paranoia.

On the other hand I don't think Ank corrected me about how the redirect would have to occur when I was theorising.

Ank with confidence in FA town would probably still BP themselves N2 though, knowing they'd be a scum-target as future-leader.

[Sando]

It's just ridiculous that you didn't pause there before thinking a redirection could target a dead to redirect all actions out of dead instead of all other things you could do with your paranoia. Like what kind of player will think they can target a dead player to remove all actions from them and will not ask the mod directly about that instantly-will not contact the mod?

I did...I had a discussion with Sakura about it:

Pretty sure Sando's town now.

On another note, Siren's call is kind of unreliable, FA notified us of 5 people she selected for her team, on a supposed FA scum that lied, we have 2 scum with potential Siren's call and 4 towns that may or may not have Spiritual Mediumship. If there's 3 town that chose Siren's Call, then at least 1 will succeed, so trying to go via the angle of FA lied and killed cerb doesnt seem feasible?

Yeah I've been misreading the power I think, I thought Sirens Call could Target Cerb and redirect the mediums directed at him to alive scum and invalidate them. It looks like it needs to be targeted at the medium instead, much harder for scum to reliably pull off.

Siren's Call

: Target another player. That player's actions will be redirected to target you instead of their original target until the next Night Phase.

Not... really?

I'm agreeing with you? Scum Sirens call requires them to target the super-hero with medium power. I misread it as them being able to target Cerb and get the mediums actions redirected from Cerb to them.

Am I wrong about being wrong?

[Sando]

Well, As far as i remember spiritual mediumship cant be used on Cerb next night no? Did Ank have any reason to believe someone else would link?

No to both.

But Ank was left with being one of two leaders and no protection power, they could:

Pick up any power and link with Cerb - getting them a link to guaranteed town, figuring that FA is town and scum can't kill both the leader options.
Pick up BP and use it - thus ensuring town get one of their leader picks

I would assume the choice would depend on confidence in FA, if you're sanguine about it being yourself or FA, you go for the power-play. If you're worried about FA, you go BP. That said, could have seen the Power Negation and figured scum could kill through BP, so may as well go for the power play.

[Sando]

"Sando how comes you object on nos obvious lie but didn't on Sakura's yesterday?

I did, I said Titus flip would be indicative of the lie.

Also, am I really meant to treat a lie I can verify as a lie the same as one that I can't 100% verify? Wat?

[Sando]

Oh, one thing I noticed, we don't get flip-results of powers.

[Sando]

Both were verifiable since katsuki claimed a guilty on Titus soo. Yea.

Wat?

Both are verifiable false in that the powers don't exist.
But I can pretty damn obviously say that Nos is false about the result, more than anyone else can, given I know my own damn alignment.

So yeah...I can verify one more than the other.

[Sando]

The mod already said we dont.

Oh I missed that. This is gonna get deep.

[Sando]

Furthermore he voted Titus for day 2 leader.

He also wants to remind you not to ask questions cause mod will only answer PM's.

Wait what? Mod ONLY answers PMs? I thought they opened it to PMs as well.

Shit, my bad.

[Sando]

But I can pretty damn obviously say that Nos is

false

correct about the result, more than anyone else can, given I know my own damn alignment.

almost made a big mistake there didn't ya

Yeah I know right, really wish there was some button to get rid of text I've accidentally written instead of having to use strikethrough and hope noone notices. I'd probably call it something like "delete", but "backspace" could be a good backup.

[Sando]

that means titus had 2 votes yes?

can someone bring back the vote claims from yesterday?

It never got to my turn to say afaik, but I voted Cerb N1.

[Sando]

@Drixx @Mathblade @Titus I really want your opinion on if this is actually titus contacting shiro or not. ask questions that only cerb can answer or the answers will help you to evaluate him.

Wait how do you think it's Titus to Shiro? Even assuming they can fake it, it's established that mediuming an alive person results in failure, not neighbour (the rhyme was too good to pass up).

[Sando]

that means titus had 2 votes yes?

can someone bring back the vote claims from yesterday?

It never got to my turn to say afaik, but I voted Cerb N1.

And Ank last night, would have done regardless of direction.

[Sando]

The mod already said we dont.

Oh I missed that. This is gonna get deep.

Wait...where Sakura?

[Sando]

Furthermore he voted Titus for day 2 leader.

He also wants to remind you not to ask questions cause mod will only answer PM's.

Wait what? Mod ONLY answers PMs? I thought they opened it to PMs as well.

Shit, my bad.

I actually want to believe this derp to a level. Have to iso your d2 again with this in mind

I was super confused by your accusation that I could write a question in such a way that the mod wouldn't be able to answer it...I'm not NOT crafty with my wording. This makes sense.

[Sando]

Titus is mafia. cerb died cause he chose another power, ank died cause titus didn't picked her.

Scum got power negation N2 potentially, kill is not a power from scum and therefore they can bypass Anks presumed BP.

[Sando]

That would imply there's 1 scum in Titus team.

Also says Shiro didn't since they used medium last night and can't use multiple.

[Sando]

If you were scum leader yesterday, what would you do.
Would you lie about giving power to FA and kill her with power negation.
Would you lie about giving power to Ank and kill her with power negation.
Or would you tell the truth about who you're going to give power and use the power negation yourself.

Depends on what happened N0-N1 in terms of scummers. FA is a relatively known quantity and pretty clearly on the "dump multiple powers onto low numbers of people" bandwagon. If that was working for me as scum I'd leave FA alive kill Ank. Ank was more of a wildcard in terms of team, so if FA's is working against me as scum I'd probs shoot FA and give it to Ank. Only reason to leave both alive is if Titus is scum trying to look town I think.

That's assuming they're both town, if one was scum I'd either kill the townie or leave both alive, I'm not entirely sure what I'd do there tbh.

Basically I think FA being the alive one says that scum got a pretty decent deal out of her choices N1, or they're confident that stacking powers will benefit them.

[Sando]

So, here's what i wonder.

Assuming both FA/Titus town and scum never got power N2, would they risk hitting Ank? This goes back to my previous theory of Ank wanting to get that spirit medium power D1

P-Edit: If ank wasnt chosen it would imply Titus scum lying, so that fits with that theory still.

No, if FA and Titus got say less than 1 or 2 scums, they don't want to risk FA being leader again when she's shown she'll pick similar people to stack and picks well.

What just occurred to me though, is that they could probably guess Ank took medium N1, and if FA is right about the redirect, then that makes Ank the only reliable kill.

[Sando]

Cerb is still fairly certain as I said that Titus is town. He demands a VCA fro her.

I could speak with ank tommorow.

Dis is why I don't think we need to worry overly much about the Shiro claim, scum aren't gonna let Shiro power up indefinitely, they're on the chopping block.

[Sando]

Sando they didn't know I had the redirect or if ank didn't have it.

They can't know you did have it, but they could guess from Anks chats that Ank picked Spi Medium, thus at best Ank had a BP which can be negated.

Certainly between the two of you, Ank is the safer kill if you just want one dead.

[Sando]

I also hinted on having spirit medium tbh

Yeah but you weren't up for leadership position.

[Sando]

I'm at gym, but just remember, scum have 4 or so people to do a search if shiro is scum.

[Sando]

Shiro 2 questions for Cerb/fake-Cerb:

What does he make of the people who have voted you? Probs wanna copy/paste his answer

Did anyone else Medium him last night? No need to say who, yet.

[Sando]

OH crap

If ank was using medium there was no need for power neglation as he was already a fresh meat regardless

Isnt that what i said like several pages ago.

I also talked about this, I would have thought Ank would pick and use N2's BP power unless 100% sure of FAs alignment and thus uncaring of which of them got leader.

[Sando]

I would suggest yes. There was actual discussion and people seriously wondering if the mason claim was genuine and legit. One of the best mods on site (if not outright the best, no disrespect to present company) has made mistakes before where their info/rules posts and answers made it seem like a player was lying about their role and the only choice the mod had was to step in and clarify (which would have taken a likely mislynch and made it essentially WotM Conftown) or to say nothing and avoid making the mistake worse.

The line is probably pretty easy I think. If the lie creates absolutely no confusion whatsoever ... feel free to disregard it. The moment it brings confusion/doubt into the game it matters. There's a reason LAL was/is a thing. There's also a reason why basically every great mafia player will say that you shouldn't lie as town unless you and the lie both meet a high bar in terms of expected value (i.e. you need to be a good enough player to actually get positive utility from it and counteract whatever damage it does).

I think part of what made me suspicious of Sakura yesterday was that the lie was kept going long past when it should have stopped.

I disagree, and fucken hell, I'm town and just did it, trying to tell me it's a scumtell is pretty fucking lol, but I'll humour it.

I have a claim of mason+cop when there's no masons or cops with a guilty on a player many people think is guilty.
I have a claim of cop when there's no cops with a guilty on a player I know is 100% innocent.

I don't expect you all to react differently, I'm not even voting him, but holy hell, do you honestly believe that town would react the same in those circumstances?

On top of that, he posted it first thing the day after going a gross misrepresentation of me. Seriously meant to just say "oh what a silly joker Nos is, with his fakeclaims of guilties on townies". Seriously?

[Sando]

@Thread Can I please go to bed now? Omg

Yeah go to bed

[Sando]

So, you can ask something only you and Cerb know. Like a comment in a hydra pt. Remove me from the equation.

He has...Cerb is refusing to answer...apparently

[Sando]

Yes. Which then makes Drixx whole I'm coaching Shiro by Cyrano absurd so I decided when he does talk, just remove me from the equation to reduce noise.

That's...not how this works. He's pointing out a reason for Shiro to do what he's doing as scum, which includes you. It's an associative read from what I can tell, you don't just get to remove yourself from the equation.

[Sando]

It’d be a Titus gambit...
What did I tell you all was the one rule about Titus scum?

Fuck, you went to bed.

Explain please if you see this, repeat the one rule if necessary.

[Sando]

As for being mediumed by anyone else, he says he would never answer such a question, especially if he was suspicious of me.

This makes no sense, you can't twist his words without giving yourself away to him.

The utility of not answering the initial question would be to put you, Shiro, in the position of saving your own hide by looking it up yourself, thus scumconfirming you to him. You've now, twice, said this wasn't his intention.

[Sando]

It doesn't confirm Shiro as town even.

Would Cerb ever be silly enough to think you/others are silly enough to think it does?

[Sando]

Like ... if the world we're in has a town!Shiro who is a medium who is really talking to Cerb ... then scum either can or cannot do anything about it. Cerb confirming it doesn't impact that in any way.

And Cerb is way beyond smart enough to know that.

QED: Cerb isn't talking to Shiro.

Or he's talking to Cerb who is pretty sure Shiro is scum. But then Cerb can't have any more info on Shiro than we do?

[Sando]

Ok, why does Scum!Shiro lie here?

Theory: Scum!Shiro isn't lying, is talking to Cerb, who took his opportunity to get us information by being an unreasonable dick to get Shiro lynched.

[Sando]

Ok, why does Scum!Shiro lie here?

Theory: Scum!Shiro isn't lying, is talking to Cerb, who took his opportunity to get us information by being an unreasonable dick to get Shiro lynched.

Also if this is true, holy fuck well played Cerb.

[Sando]

As for being mediumed by anyone else, he says he would never answer such a question, especially if he was suspicious of me.

This makes zero sense, even if you wanted to, you can't lie about it, you'll get CC'd and die. I didn't ask for who else was medium with him, just if they existed.

[Sando]

Nah ... Cerb would just give the wrong answers if he was in convo with Shiro and wanted us to rope Shiro.

Fair.

Why can't we deal with this midday as suggested?

[Sando]

what do you think about it and where is your vca before asking others about it?

My answer is primed and ready though!

[Sando]

He even answered maths question and specifically told me not to relay it because he isn't about to give her easy town cred via a dumb question.

He hasn't answered your question yet no.

what the fuck? how that would give math any cred?!!!

The only person I've considered giving cred to so far is FA, and that's just making me more paranoid. Giving cred to Shiro or Math should not be a concern, and town wanting to verify the veracity of the claim is exactly what town should do.

[Sando]

yeah but I'm used to see town!titus not caring about others reads and doing her own vcas and pushes. Seeing her asking someone else to vca instead of giving out her thoughts is unsettling af

Fine, I'll leave it in another tab, you've got about two days before I accidentally close my browser and lose it.

[Sando]

it makes no sense for these many people to miss the deadline and stuff and for titus to win with 2 votes when scum had 4 votes available.

I've never seen Duckling miss a deadline and he's an energiser bunny 90% of the time, I think scummers "forgot" there.

[Sando]

it makes no sense for these many people to miss the deadline and stuff and for titus to win with 2 votes when scum had 4 votes available.

I've never seen Duckling miss a deadline and he's an energiser bunny 90% of the time, I think scummers "forgot" there.

Also if ANY of the "forgeters" are lying, the only possible explanation is they voted Titus.

Scum voted Titus, it's about as strong a lock as we can have on the mechanics this game. Doesn't make Titus scum necessarily, but still, they voted her.

[Sando]

123456789 (4): zMuffinMan, Sakura Hana, Human Sequencer, Titus
zMuffinMan (4): BBmolla, Katsuki, Frozen Angel, Nancy Drew 39

Human Sequencer ZzMuffin Up Nancy Down

123456789 (6): zMuffinMan, Sakura Hana, Human Sequencer, Titus, Katsuki, Nosferatu

Titus (3): 123456789, Gamma Emerald, Ankamius

Shiro (2): Toranaga, the worst
zMuffinMan (2): BBmolla, Nancy Drew 39

Katsuki and Nos review for bussing

123456789 (7): zMuffinMan, Sakura Hana, Human Sequencer, Titus, Katsuki, Nosferatu, Ankamius

Titus (5): 123456789, Gamma Emerald, Sando, Frozen Angel, hebichan

Shiro (2): Toranaga, the worst
zMuffinMan (2): BBmolla, Nancy Drew 39

Hebi down, Ank closes bus window or starts race

123456789 (8): zMuffinMan, Sakura Hana, Human Sequencer, Titus, Katsuki, Nosferatu, Nancy Drew 39, the worst

Titus (6): 123456789, Gamma Emerald, Sando, Frozen Angel, hebichan, Ankamius


Bus race not likely when Ank swaps wagons closer to EoD, Sando possible bus

Is this what we were waiting for with "zomg VCA"? Also why only D1?

[Sando]

Hopefully it's a wip

From Nos? Lol, he's tunnelled me all game with the barest of reasoning, and when that failed decides to misrep me, and when that fails decides to fake-claim a guilty on me. GL getting anything useful from him.

[Sando]

@Toogeloo read yesterday EOD now if you have time. I want your opinion on the failed CFD (Chinese fire drill - last minute wagoning) on Sando and what do you think about the people actions there.

Are we done waiting for the VCA from Titus then?

[Sando]

needs some some stats involved and proof and perhaps i’d reconsider, but i’ll refuse to encourage a crapshoot type of system myself. to me these type of posts read like paranoia-spreading scum agenda, and that inherently bothers me.

The vast majority of Titus' play has been really, really poor game theory, the idea that Titus is advocating "optimal" play is laughable.

Math feels that Titus is typically a god of the game-theory, and that being bad here is scum indicative. I think it's scum indicative due to not actually using the game theory to scumhunt.

[Sando]

VOTE: Titus

Entire game has been bad and self serving

[Sando]

if you know what I mean? it's just not a kill I would've expected.... FA is super widely townread plus clearly has a superpower plus is hyperengaged with the game vs. Anka who was fixing an eeehhhhh slot didn't have a power and I guess her engagement was solid too but y'know

Ank had the same number of powers as FA presumably.

[Sando]

I mean, i didnt want to be leader anyway, so i paid no mind to it, but wouldnt it have been a better play to put the player without a PR at risk of Night kill for being a leader candidate?

For N2 I think it was pretty universally agreed that the leader options would also be in Titus' superhero team to get powers and use them (presumably for protection). I was of the opinion the pool should start expanding, apparently that makes me scum.

[Sando]

@sando, where do you stand on toogeloo’s alignment atm and why?

Scumlean.

I don't mind the analysis of 129 leading to me, but if your strongest two scumreads are for the same reason and a cursory glance at D2 would show we're not partners, you either need to re-evaluate your read or delve into us in-depth to justify one over the other. Toog aint doing that, is lazy way to read only a very subsection of the player base. Also, the reasoning that I was strongly suspected D1 but not mentioned by 129 doesn't really stand, I wasn't particularly scumread D1, that was a D2 thing onwards.

[Sando]

the statement that she was pressuring me to confirm while not thinking I am scum is BS.

FA wanted you confirmed in comms with Cerb to clear herself of yesterdays accusations/paranoia.

[Sando]

Duckling is scum here btw, and that vote was disgustingly obvious there buddy

[Sando]

Duckling is scum here btw, and that vote was disgustingly obvious there buddy

why is worst's vote scummy but not mine?

Iso both of you, ctrl-F "Sando" and it's really, really fucking obvious

[Sando]

He also said that he doesn't want fa elected leader ever again in the game because of ank dying over her and each time scum kill someone else over her it is valuable info.

Careful Cerb, this kind of paranoia will get you scumread!

[Sando]

If sando flips scum, the worst should come after, this screams distancing

He's scum, Iso him and read progression on me.

[Sando]

Duckling is scum here btw, and that vote was disgustingly obvious there buddy

why is worst's vote scummy but not mine?

Iso both of you, ctrl-F "Sando" and it's really, really fucking obvious

oh are my reads not allowed to change

fuck my bad, I might be on the wrong forum

Opportunistically jump onto a wagon of a person you've been TRing all game who has been the most vocal SRer of you...nah that was poor scumplay, you need to improve on that.

[Sando]

Cerb says care with sando votes cause he is reaching lynch threshold.

Even if you think I'm scum, lynching me before you sort out leader votes is just retarded right now.

[Sando]

How come no one's even asking me why i switched from Titus to Sando?

why did you switch from Titus to Sando?

Too Late!

In all seriousness tho, that's a blatant 180 there with a naked vote, i'd expected people to be raising a few eyebrows over the switch, but instead apparently duckling's scum, and no one seems to care why i switched.

But the reason is simple, I realized that Shiro's town, there's also the fact that Titus kept her promise, when the sacrifice of her own to give scum power negation was a possibility, Titus is probably not scum, and so I decided to vote the person that escaped rope yesterday.

There's a big difference between shading me for a while and a naked vote 180...you also went from one wagon to another, duckling decided that was the time to pile in on me. You've also contributed, duckling is scum in isolation, hell I've been saying so most of today.

[Sando]

i'm happy to call myself one of the most lynchable players itt but scum? i don't get it

Lol nice troll

[Sando]

i didn't expect you to get flustered and go for lynchbait sando :{
maybe i expected better?

Lol no you didn't.

Also, has anyone voted you ever this game?

[Sando]

maybe? idrc to look

why's that?

Lol, claiming you're lynchbait with 0 votes ever is pretty much the definition of troll

Also I've called 1 of the 7 votes on me opportunistically scum, funnily enough it's the person I know best on the player base.

[Sando]

Yeah like when you click and drag over text, it has always worked for me tho, but it ignores formating of the post you're quoting.

It also won't work over multiple quotes, so if you want to pull out two of the three in a quote pyramid for context, you gotta go into the full quote and mess around with it.

[Sando]

ya but I think you've seen and heard enough about me that you shouldn't.....be jumping to the assumption that i'm scum here? like i can't find any way to parse why you have arrived at the conclusion that you believe i'm aligned with the mafia lmao

I've seen and heard more than enough to have concluded well before the opportunistic jump onto me that you're scum.

Also...well played turning around the fact that you have provided zero reasoning for your vote onto me into a discussion about how scummy you are.

I'm being ignored right now, but you're dead post-flip, town aren't THAT bad this game.

Bee-tee-dubs, for post-game, was it you that got your scumteam to make the push on me D2 when you knew I was over in NZ and wasn't going to be able to respond? The D2 wagon on me post-flip is gonna be much more interesting than the D3 one I think.

[Sando]

@Nancy:



Highlight like that, then hit the quote, you get:

quote minus the pyramid

[Sando]

there's not much to discern by me flipping town. all you're making me think here is that you've been heavily speculating on this and not sharing with the class which feels more like a push for a lynch than a push which you think is on scum )x

You know me well enough to know I'm not scum, and you wouldn't vote me like that even if you did.

[Sando]

show me what i should be seeing

I'm not really interested in showing the one person here who knows my meta and why it matches my town, given you're scum and it's pointless.

You're an energiser bunny in games, you never stop, and you take any opportunity to riff. I gave you 2 days given the player count and difference in theme vs Open, but you're still not interested in actually contributing. You're also not the type to blindly jump onto wagons at all, the fact that you'd do it to me is well and truly out of character.

[Sando]

and out of character = ____?

Rofl

[Sando]

stop half assin this

Hahahahahahahahaha, holy shit you do make you laugh Duckling, I'll give you that

Yep, still no actual reasoning from Duckling about why I'm scum, only wants to talk about how I think he's scum.

[Sando]

VOTE: the worst

I can't see any lynch but me going through unless something comes out of left field, so I'll make this super easy for town to see tomorrow.

Duckling doesn't coast through games like he has and not engage with people
The idea that because other people have voted me he shouldn't have to post reasoning is pretty lol
Duckling has played with me quite a bit on open-queues, he doesn't naked vote me out of no-where and play dumb like this

The true paranoid part of me also notes that the D2 push on me was while I happened to be overseas and couldn't read/respond to anything. Only one person on site knew that definitively, duckling.

[Sando]

this is why i think you're scum here. your reasoning on actual players' alignment is just lacking a layer or two that i've come to expect from you

Sup pot, I'm kettle

[Sando]

just because your name is Kettle Sanderson does not mean I'm not going to lynch you

I'm cool with that, 1 for 1 is a pretty good deal.

[Sando]

I’m thinking Sakura/Math and we do the whole coodnated vote thing again.

FA is on board that any leaders need to be in the superhero team yeah?

[Sando]

But we need to choose one leader and a backup, you know - in case the leader can’t finish their reign or something.

Ya ya, but both should be given powers to at least force the scum to use their power negation for the kill. Even if I'm scum, I haven't been in a superhero team, you definitely have to deal with the power negation tonight.

[Sando]

lol@people thinking sando is scum

Don't worry duckling, zMM isn't laughing at you here, you don't

think

I'm scum

[Sando]

Oh do I know you're scum?

no dice