In post 8761, Nero Cain wrote:I've been thinking on that. It makes a fuck ton of sense for a Drixxscum to kill Cerb who was misreading him as town. Of course, it's just WIFOM but yeah....
This is horrible logic Nero. The very first person Cerb would suspect when he dies is me. I think I flat out said that a scum me would kill Cerb out of the game pretty much all the time. (I mean ... probably not night one because it's shitty to die night one when you play the way he and I do but... point stands).
I'm not sure Cerb was actually town reading me on day one while he was alive. I was like not really around much at all on day one. Wedding anniversary and such. Day ended literally while I was reading through pages and putting thoughts in notepad to post.
My sense of things is that Cerb made the thing with Shiro so difficult (refusing to answer my questions which confirmed that HE was relaying info as well as confirming Shiro as SM in a situation where the night events were confusing) because he wanted to see how I would respond to it. He wouldn't need to waste energy on Shiro because Shiro was going to be relaying Cerb accurately if there really was an SM connection going on. The moment I chose to ask questions that only Cerb could possible answer, Shiro could never afford to do anything other than accurately relay what Cerb wanted us to see.
You should also look into the interaction I had with Titus. She tried to get the question for Cerb to be a reference to a game that She, Cerb, Varsoon and myself are (off and on) working on. With Shiro being dead, that seems like an intentional move on her part to try and get me really suspicious of Shiro. It also now puts me in a situation where there's an interaction there which could be viewed as Titus distancing from me via some classic scum theatre.
At some point (thought I quoted it but I guess not) you expressed some kind of idea that me trying to confirm Shiro was the point of my posting at that stage in the game ... as if that were a BAD thing. There was literally zero reason to even consider what was being represented as coming from Cerb until it was actually confirmed that Shiro was relaying info from Cerb. In order to do that, Shiro would have had to have taken SM. If Shiro took SM, then that removed Shiro as a possibility to explain someone who should have been BP dying.
Like ... what exactly is wrong with that? That was precisely what we needed to know to move forward. Why on earth wouldn't I want to confirm it was actually Cerb and at the same time get more info to reduce the possibility space for what had gone on at night? I'm legitimately confused at what you were going for there.
In post 8390, Nero Cain wrote:2136 Is the reason I
'd at Drixx.
In post 2136, Drixx wrote:This went on for way too much. As someone who is friend to both of you:
I kinda didn't like this that much. Like I could see him try to diffuse this fight between FA and Titus. He also kinda fencesits on her.
In post 2136, Drixx wrote:This post makes it look like you don't actually want to be playing forum mafia. Like ... if you think content coming from a certain slot is worthless to you, then just scroll right on by. No need for this crap.
This ends up making me wonder if you're just making posts like this for LAMIST or something
.
I didn't really like how he scolds at ZZ here. It doesn't really feel like scumhunting. I also feel like the bolded is ridiculously dumb and buzzword heat and not a town thought process.
In post 2136, Drixx wrote:That would be a really good way to get me (and probably others) to decide you need to eat rope. You cannot wind someone up and keep pushing them and then invoke policy lynch on them because they took your bait. It's dirty play.
This is what made me really suspicious, he's threatening ZZ with a lynch for pushing a Titus lynch.
In post 2136, Drixx wrote:This post feels like so much hedging from someone who is informed. Gut doesn't like.
fusses @ Tor for fussing @ Titus.
In post 2141, Drixx wrote:
The sad part is that you probably think you have some kind of "gotcha!" here. Whom I voted for is self-evident. You shouldn't have to ask because you should already know.
b/c he voted for Titus?
In post 1832, Drixx wrote:I guess I need to go diving on Titus now. I could see her doing this as scum and turning the WiFoM to her favor. I could also see several players in this list who would know putting Titus as leader right now would introduce a ton of confusion.
And it has
.
more fence sit.
Could someone explain th bold, how did electing Titus as leader cause confusion? Is this scumDrixx that knows scum is the leader and it will cause confusion.
In post 2146, Drixx wrote:But seriously ... Cerb being night killed early is literally always a reason to suspect me.
Does scumDrixx WIFOM a kill like this?
In post 3090, Drixx wrote:Sando you got voted because you were literally intentionally winding Titus up to no possible town purpose.
voting someone for attacking Titus. Anyone notice a pattern yet?
kinda skimmed the rest of his ISO but I'm not really seeing much (any?) scumhunting. Mostly just defending himself and trying to figure out if Shiro had some wich I could see scum trying to do b/c it informs them about the setup. Part of me wants to say "Titus pushing back on Drixx makes a Titus/Drixx team not a thing" but that whole "anyone thats means to Titus or scumreads her I'll lynch" kinda irks me. Is that too obvious for scumbuddies? But then Toog is getting plenty of heat for defending Titus but Drixx isn't, so is Toog a scum led wagon?
There were a few kinda other sketchy things like he keeps telling ppl good post and stuff and kinda buddies his way through the game.
But defiantly our limited back and forth did play a huge role in my scum read.
7690 -ignore this guy, he can't read me
7691-is this true?
7692-Nero is lying/being selective
7693-look at all this evidence that proves this isn't
exactly
true.
7745-haha, I was just joking. Don't be so serious.
Nero after reading that-
1.) You really should go look at Space Dandy 2 if you want to understand why I would try and calm shit down when Titus is being wound up. That shit was unpleasant. None of us are playing this hobby to add stress to our life. I'm quite aware that many scum use that kind of thing as a technique but if you go looking I think you're going to find I have a pretty solid ethical line when it comes to abusing "personal" or "real life" things for gain when I'm scum. I find it pretty distasteful and have not at all enjoyed when stuff that wasn't really part of the game (or shouldn't have been) was used by scum against me. I try not to do it. You can take my word for that or go do some research.
2.) I'm not generally a buzzwords player. It's also amusing and perhaps a bit ironic to see you refer to LAMIST as a buzzword coming from me. As far as I'm aware, nobody knew what that meant the first half dozen times I used it when I first migrated to this site. Is it a "buzzword" if it came to the site from me?
3.) It's asinine to suggest I voted for Titus. Everyone else instantly understood that I was saying "of course I voted for Cerb again".
4.) Titus being elected was an unexpected result. It did actually cause confusion. It's precisely the kind of move Titus makes as scum. She put in a huge effort to make it seem like she had been set up.
5.) It's not even WiFoM. It's just the obvious truth. Like anyone alive in game who knows Cerb and I will tell you that I absolutely would kill him as scum. Pretty sure he would kill me also (although he may be cocky enough to try and mislynch me instead or try and sell me a half truth like when he was in a rare hydra with someone else and pulled out a 3P solo win by telling most of a truth). I would say that as any alignment so it's NAI.
6.) Again: ask anyone who plays with me regularly how I feel about abuse in forum mafia and how I respond when I see it. Or go look at games which had toxicity. Whether it is aimed at me or involves me or not I will basically ALWAYS stand up and say something about it. Drixx don't play that shit. Attack the play, not the player. -- So much so that I am blacklisted from playing games one of my favorite mods runs because I absolutely wouldn't let some jackhole get away with just abushing the shit out of everyone in the game (said game actually ended up abandoned by said mod because of how toxic it got).
7.) I never went after anyone for scumreading Titus. Read my ISO and you'll see me just point out that Titus was essentially logically lockscum when the vote claims for day 2 came out in such a way that scum obviously lied. Townies would have been honest about voting her so the fact that we didn't end up with a clear understanding of who elected her and why was pretty much rock solid reason to have her pretty heavily scum read. Her reaction to the situation was like 99% confirmation she was scum. Scum!Titus tries to handwave things away. Look at SU when Cerb and I caught her slip and she tried to say she was speaking with certainty about a VARSOON mechanic because she had seen the precise role before. Like ... lol. She tried to pull the same kind of thing here. She was "being framed".
I absolutely can like someone and defend them from abuse and still scum read them at the same time. Friendship and a general principle of advocating for less personal abuse in mafia games are not mutually exclusive from realizing a friend/target of abuse is scum and needs to be lynched.
8.) I'm pretty sure the most natural reading of my first post quoting you is that it's a joke. At most you could maybe misread it as a reaction test. When I'm actually suggesting someone is scum I tend to do it in something more significant than a one liner of snark.
And ... OF COURSE I argued the point with you when you responded. That's what I do. Like ... that doesn't have any bearing on the fact that I was just being snarky with you. I mean ... you even say that's the "meat" of your read. If that's your meat ... don't rely on it to get you through the winter friend.