Mini 2025: Sneks & Noodles [Game Over]

[LaserGuy]

Aloha! Long time no see

Haven't read the thread so I have no idea what's going on yet.

[LaserGuy]

Catch up part 1:

Post 8/11 - These posts from horror pair a bit weirdly.
Post 16 - Alchemist feels kind of LAMIST to me.
Post 29 - gut Town on skitter
Post 36 - gut Town on NSG
Post 39 - I like this post
Post 42 - I don't like this post from wgeurts
Post 43 - gut Town on Invis
Post 44 - +1 Town point for Invis
Post 45 - skitter = obvtown
Post 51 - this feels a little off to me. buddy points to sky/viz

Is wgeurts wagon a meme wagon? They have one bad post but I don't get the pressure here.

Post 64 - Not sure what to make of RC's trolling yet
Post 76 - This post also feels a bit weird to me. Scum leaning on horrordude.
Post 85 and similar - I am amused about the discussion of my predecessor is related to pineapple pizza. I give townpoints to NSG for this.
Post 91 - Had to go back and figure out who rando is. I don't get this read from implosion at all.
Post 95 - This is bad. Also voting wgeurts here is double bad. implosion Scummy.
Post 105 - horrordude's reaction to invis' fake vote in 103 seems a bit over-the-top.
Post 114 - Don't care for this defense.
Post 120 - Buddy points to implosion and Invis
Post 121 - Agree that most likely wgeurtz is Town, though if he flips scum, I expect buddies were on this meme wagon pretty early.
Post 124 - Town lean on popo for this.
Post 132/133/135/136 - I get a bad vibe from these posts by implosion.
Post 140 - Don't care for this post, though I agree with 143. popo Town.
Post 147 - skitter continues to be good Town.
Post 152/153 - Invis read on horror looks solid to me.
Post 157/159 - Invis backtrack and then revote on horror is a bit weird. Gut is probably townie though.
Post 158/160 - Liking popo and Alchemist.
Post 161 - Meh.
Post 167 - Implosion's voting patterns make no sense to me.
Post 179 - Not loving Skygazer content atm
Post 184 - This post from rando is bad.
Post 196 - This is the first townie post I've seen out of horror.
Post 199 - skitter continues to be the voice of reason. I'm seriously baffled that she's getting scumreads this game.
Post 200 - "i forgot i was scumreading horror". This is such a weird sentiment I don't know how to place it.
Post 205 - I like this post from alchemist. 212 is good too.
Post 207 - Classy, NM.
Post 213 - Nice to see RC finally deciding to start playing.
Post 218 - I forgot BBT was in this game.
Post 242 - Randommidget continues to not impress me.
Post 268 - This post from RC is hilarious. I feel the need to townread this even before reading the actual reads.
Post 270 - I agree with half of this read. Unfortunately, I don't have time to go through this giant wall right now, so I'm going to stop here, post what I have and pick this up hopefully tonight.

As of post 269, my reads are:

Towns: skitter, RC, alchemist, popo, Invis
Null: NM, Alonzo, BBT
scum: Implosion, horror, randommidget, Skygazer

[LaserGuy]

wait why does 44 give me a town point

Independent confirmation of your meta. You/skitter/Sky are all very unlikely to be scum together so it improves the chance that the meta read is accurate.

also
i get the post from skygazer that skitter doesnt like
sky is saying its townie for skitter to townread me when i could be set up as lynchbait later in the game due to my lynchbait meta
wait what townpoints for being funny?

Not sure specifically which comments this is referring to.

120: uh what. how is that supposed to work

Implosion is defending you from questions you really ought to be answering yourself.

124: why

I share more or less the same sentiments.

157/159: why. i unvoted because i didnt think he was scum, then somebody presented a new point so i revoted

It's basically the same point you had already made in 152, just worded differently.

167: what why, he had a reason

Not really, he had been bandwagoning wgeurtz without really any good reason since 95.

179: why

Very wishy-washy posting.

[LaserGuy]

laserguy may not be adam

but can we call him adam anyway

But what if I am Adam? :cool

*so adam ur scumreads r 4 o' the biggest wagons so far?

I guess? I wasn't really paying attention to the VCs as I was reading through. The only wagons that seemed notable to me were wgurts and now implosion.

[LaserGuy]

i kinda like laserguy's catchup, but i'm wondering how much of that is influenced by the fact that he's calling me obvtown and his observations are matching my own

==

@laserguy: can you talk a little bit more about your rc + horror + random reads when you have a chance?

RC I have as town mostly on tone. If nothing else, while I was sort of joking in my commentary on this, in all seriousness, the guy who says makes a big production out of catching the whole scumteam on D1 is almost always Town.

Horror has given me some weird vibes since his first post, and I didn't care for his reactions in the whole sequence following Invis' joke vote.

randommidget's content is a mix of kind of bad posts and kind of fluff posts. Probably my weakest scumread, but there's nothing of substance there.

[LaserGuy]

Post 91 - Had to go back and figure out who rando is. I don't get this read from implosion at all.
Post 95 - This is bad. Also voting wgeurts here is double bad. implosion Scummy.

I think you're misreading these posts as more serious than they are. Why is voting wgeurts scummy? Just because I'd said random had scumclaimed?

Yes, you were just talking about scumreading random and then went and voted somebody else entirely that you hadn't talked about or interact with at all.

I think you need to meta me some if you think this is scummy; all of the things you listed about me in your post are pretty typical of my towngame, and you'll probably find similar vibes as well.

I'll try to look into this if I have time, though I generally don't trust people's evaluations of their own meta.

[LaserGuy]

Picking up from 270...

270 - I agree with a lot of the commentary on implosion, and I'll agree that there's a lot of associatives there. Going to put a sticky to come back to this one after I've had a chance to skim some of skitter's more recent games and see if her meta has changed since we played a several months ago.
281 and similar - Marking this series of posts from Alonzo and RC talking about Not_Mafia as mostly NAI. I think every game I've played with him somebody has been trying to policy NM.
311-333ish - Not really getting a lot of this without seeing the history of these skitter/RC. Still leaning Town on both.
344 - I like this post by Invis.
346 - This is a memepost from NM I think. Otherwise I'm just noting his existence here. I think he's usually much busier.
353 - I'm a bit troubled by the fact that Alonzo is actually apparently reading NM as scum rather than pushing policy.
362 - This might be a towntell since Alonzo has played very few non-newbie games.
363 - Noting that implosion is claiming the skitter vote at 135 is a reaction test, but changes vote to ws at 167 without skitter ever even posting, so it seems unlikely to me that this is the case.
364 - At least one buddy is bussing at this point if Implosion is scum.
365 - These reads by implosion are very lazy/bad.

Slow going in this secton. I'm current as of 375, plus pages since I joined, but that's as far as I can go today.

[LaserGuy]

Catch-up part 3:

381-384 - This sequence of posts makes implosion look kind of bad, but I note that they all happen within the same minute, so, charitably, implosion may not have seen these posts before voting and was responding to 377/378. OTOH, implosion's skygazer vote is unsupported since to this point he's been townreading sky.
390 - I don't understand why implosion doesn't feel the need to explain the vote. I get not voting with your scumreads, but why move to sky, who has been a solid townread, rather than NM or BBT or somebody?
392-399 - I have a hard time believing either player in this conversation is scum.
404 - RC changing read on skitter is surprising. Making a note to come back to this section later.
407 - RC feels very genuine here.
448 - BBT is in the game. Even though I like the implosion wagon, this vote is bad.
451 - Alonzo tunnel on NM still kind of bothers me for lack of substance. NM is due for prod/replace I think anyway.
452 - I like this post from Sky.
457 - Would like to know more about Invis' read here.

Hey, I'm caught up!

[LaserGuy]

EBWOP: Oops, forgot to add in the post links.

381-384 - This sequence of posts makes implosion look kind of bad, but I note that they all happen within the same minute, so, charitably, implosion may not have seen these posts before voting and was responding to 377/378. OTOH, implosion's skygazer vote is unsupported since to this point he's been townreading sky.
390 - I don't understand why implosion doesn't feel the need to explain the vote. I get not voting with your scumreads, but why move to sky, who has been a solid townread, rather than NM or BBT or somebody?
392-399 - I have a hard time believing either player in this conversation is scum.
404 - RC changing read on skitter is surprising. Making a note to come back to this section later.
407 - RC feels very genuine here.
448 - BBT is in the game. Even though I like the implosion wagon, this vote is bad.
451 - Alonzo tunnel on NM still kind of bothers me for lack of substance. NM is due for prod/replace I think anyway.
452 - I like this post from Sky.
457 - Would like to know more about Invis' read here.

Hey, I'm caught up!

[LaserGuy]

Yes, you were just talking about scumreading random and then went and voted somebody else entirely that you hadn't talked about or interact with at all.

Saying he'd basically scumclaimed at that point in the game was sarcasm/a feeler.

I do not get that impression at all from this:

Invisibility/skygazer town.

Rando has practically claimed scum though.

[LaserGuy]

363 - Noting that implosion is claiming the skitter vote at 135 is a reaction test, but changes vote to ws at 167 without skitter ever even posting, so it seems unlikely to me that this is the case.

She did post between me voting her and me switching to wgeurts? And I explicitly cited that post when I unvoted her?

You're right. My mistake.

I'm a bit troubled by the fact that Alonzo is actually apparently reading NM as scum rather than pushing policy.

Porque no los dos?

Could be both. NM just hasn't done anything this game and wgeurts didn't really either, so I'm not really sure where this is coming from.

[LaserGuy]

Post 8/11 - These posts from horror pair a bit weirdly.

How are they weird?

They're out of order. In the first post you immediately vote for someone you recognize for a definite reason. In the second post, you explain that you haven't been around in awhile and but maybe recognize some names. I don't know if it's AI, but it gives me a weird vibe, so I noted it.

Post 76 - This post also feels a bit weird to me. Scum leaning on horrordude.

Again with "weird", a vague buzzword. What about it is weird, and how is it scum AI?[/quote]

This read doesn't feel genuine to me.

Post 114 - Don't care for this defense.

I don't care if you don't care for it, it was a genuine thought at the time. I would be more likely to put a fakevote as scum ai based on my experience with "if I think it's a vote, it counts" rules. Once it was clarified that wasn't the case in this game, I stopped pushing it.[/quote]

It is fairly obvious to me both that Invis' vote was a joke and "accidentally" pushing through a lynch in this manner is something that I would honestly never expect to see scum doing anyway.

(Just a note I was making these comments as I read them sequentially, so if I mention something and then you later explained/changed it, it wouldn't show up in my commentary until the point where you explain it).

Also, I like this whole post 519 of yours.

[LaserGuy]

UNVOTE: Not_Mafia

@mod: Has Not_Mafia been prodded? He hasn't posted in over 3 days.

[LaserGuy]

Wow, was just ninjad as I was about to vote. Okay. I think that's L-1?

Intent to hammer sometime this evening when I get back to this game.

[LaserGuy]

VOTE: implosion

L-1

[LaserGuy]

A little weird that the thread just kind of sat there for a couple hours then two people immediately jumped in to hammer after me

[LaserGuy]

also that flip very very strongly points to town!rc imo; i kinda doubt that bbt was scum's nk last night and i think that he guards rc after yesterday

That was my first thought on seeing that flip as well.

364 - At least one buddy is bussing at this point if Implosion is scum.

Checking from my notes here, I see one scum in {Alchemist, Skygazer, Invisibility} (excluding RC from the count). I dunno, maybe scum says this truthfully about a wagon on them, but I'd very surprised if there wasn't a buddy here. Cross-referencing these...

Invisibility/skygazer town.

I also do want to hear more from popo about the vote. Both popo->horror and horror->invisibility sort of look like lazy scum votes

I'll reassess on sky but invisibility is still really really solidly town.

{invisibility, Alch, horror, skitter}
{laserguy, rc, skygazer, randomidget, alonzo}
{popo, BBT, N_M}

Repeated pairing of sky/invis makes me think one of them is probably a partner. Putting partner!invis on the top of townreads feels ballsy but not impossible. 136 feels more like a partner defense though. Alchemist is barely mentioned by implosion at all, which could go either way depending on meta. Need to cross-reference this last point.

VOTE: skygazer

I think it's more likely this is a real counterwagon.

VOTE: popo

VOTE: skygazer

Either of these votes are late enough in the day to be a bus, IMHO. Writing was already on the wall here.

there remains time to flashwagon popo

I think sky is probably more likely the real counterwagon and popo is the partner being bussed.

[LaserGuy]

ya same

i don't think i can comfortably townread rc on *his* play right now but i'm comfortable calling him town for other factors - namely implosion's associatives with him and the bbt bg flip

why do you think popopo is a bus and sky is the cw? i'm tending more towards the other way around

popopo vote felt like it really came out of nowhere, very late after implosion lynch was pretty much settled. I'm leaning toward popo/invis on associatives right now.

i liked some of alchemists *very* early posts (like just around rvs-ish) but most of his posts since then are kinda nai and i don't really have any thoughts on them

like i don't townread him and i don't scumread him; he just kinda is

Yeah, I sort of have a similar vibe on him. I liked most of his posts up to 212 or so, and his vote is well-positioned. Not much in the latter half of D1. Doesn't really interact with implosion either way. I'd probably put him at maybe Town lean except for that ping I have on 364 which bumps him down a bit. I don't really get this wagon.

May go with this for now.

VOTE: Invisibility

[LaserGuy]

what do you think about 160? it kinda feels like svs to me a bit, from the 'yeah exactly'

Reading that whole sequence in context I don't get strong buddy vibes from the two of them, myself.

this is every post randomidget has made this game
the one position he has taken was that RC was town
he has not given a scumread
the only vote he has made was his RVS
when attacked yesterday he said "im always scummy day one" which i dont know how he got away with
seriously read that ISO and tell me one post that looks like town trying to find mafia

and on the implosion lynch - "i dont want to put implo at l-1 but my vote would be there in spirit"
need i say more

I like this case.
VOTE: random


Speaking of poor content, this is Not_Mafia's only post this day phase:

lol

Request Prod on Not_Mafia

[LaserGuy]

I like this case.

U dont think it could be coached??

Well, I don't know most of the players in this game, but my impression from what I've seen so far is that there's probably only 2-3 people in this field (RC, skitter, maybe horrordude) that are likely to be super busy behind the scenes in their scumplay. Most other players I feel are pretty passive... and scum is more likely to be passive team given that D1 lynch was scum anyway. So probably not coached unless buddy is horrordude (RC/skitter I believe are Town).

I like that popo is actually trying to advance the game here. I get the impression a lot of people are just sitting around waiting for RC to tell us who the next lynch is going to be.

[LaserGuy]

oh and rando makes sense for scum here too obv

If we're talkin reads,

I think you (skitter) would likely bus implosion as scum there rather than remain on my counterwagon pushed by implo who's scum flip is imminent. I think your read on me is genuine here.

I think Alonzo's push on NM is weird and they have scum equity for not being on implo.

RC is town. horror is town. NM is likely town. Alch is likely town imo but I feel like I should trust RC's judgement over my own.

Don't have solid reads on anyone else but I'm still diggin through some stuff

@sky: What's changed between 626 and 753 that has made you go from rando making sense for scum to being null?

106
Not_Mafia: Alchemist21, LaserGuy,

BlueBloodedToffee

, popopopopopopo,

implosion

(L-2)

RC, I don't think NM could be scum with implo and Alch because of this early wagon, I think it points towards NM town especially with implo's placement on the wagon.

Why do you think implosion wouldn't bus here? This was a page 4 wagon and the front two votes (maybe three since BBT was naked vote with no commentary) were RVS... Was never going to lynch unless someone lolhammered.

[LaserGuy]

VOTE: SKITTER

#560 was it, the agenda filled one... I wanna find out more about this agenda...

What agenda do you see skitter pushing here? Why didn't you follow-up on this when skitter asked you about it in 678?

Aside from NM, who do you read as scum? Or, if you prefer, who is NM's likely buddy?

[LaserGuy]

vote:alchemist

works for me

Can you explain this vote? You had Alchemist as "the towniest townie" back at 225 and haven't commented on him since.

[LaserGuy]

I know when I know things and I also know when I don't and right now I don't know things

I need halp

Who are you having trouble sorting, in particular?

[LaserGuy]

All your posts have been extremely shallow and I don't expect that from town!you

How? Wagon dynamics are pretty telling imo, and I wouldn’t say my reason for Townreading you is anywhere near shallow.

sorry, i didn't mean that in like a personal-sense; i hope you didn't take it that way and if you did i apologize

i meant that in a 'do your posts seem to be contributing to a town wincon' sense

like besides horrordude i don't know who you think is scum

i don't really know who you think is town beyond like sky and maybe random

like i feel like you're active and responsive and have a lot of posts but despite that i don't have a good sense for where you're standing in this game

I mean I am kinda stuck on my reads right now because yeah my focus wasn’t all there during the later part of D1. That should change as this Day continues and I get into the swing of things.

Also replace random with rc and add a hint of Invisibility.

Also there’s 1 slot I’m mildly scumreading right now but I’m not gonna say who it is at the moment because I think they’re more likely to give themselves away if they’re not on guard about it.

Why is Invisibility Town?

[LaserGuy]

can people on that wagon explain why they were on it and what they thought about it building so quickly on a lurker

I liked popo's case and had suspicions of rando for much of the game myself. Clearing out some of the deadwood after D1 scum lynch makes sense anyway, especially in a game as low energy as this one was in D2. The wagon going from two votes to lynch within 5 hours was quite surprising. A lot of the votes there look very opportunistic.

@Laser: Rando has played so forgettably that I forgot to list them in 753

VOTE: Rando

why not

This vote is okay. sky has good progression on rando and her comment in 820 feels genuine. The fact that she unvoted later when the wagon took off suddenly also looks townie to me.

btw VOTE: rando

This vote is kind of bad. Invis was tunneling popo for awhile and suddenly starts supporting his wagon without commentary.

L-2 is plenty enough pressure rn considering we're 6 days from deadline.

popo trying to bait an NM lolhammer confirmed

Not just these posts in particular, but in general I think skygazer and horror come off as pretty townie in this sequence.

VOTE: RANDOM MIDGET

Whats a NM lolhammer?

Like Alonzo how do you tunnel NM all game and then try to goad a quickhammer from him and then not unvote when NM puts a wagon you're on at L-1

This vote is bad. Alonzo has no progression here and the comment by Skygazer is on point.

VOTE: rando

This is borderline NAI for Not_Mafia. I would expect him to bandwagon in any case.

In one ten minute phase of the game I was able to garner accurate reads on about 4 different slots, so forgive me If blood had to be spilled for town to bounceback more focused.

FWIW, I actually agree that this lynch is probably a net positive for Town. Random was going to be needed to be lynched at some point. Better now than have him kicking around near/at LYLO.

[LaserGuy]

@popo, can you comment on this:

vote:alchemist

works for me

Can you explain this vote? You had Alchemist as "the towniest townie" back at 225 and haven't commented on him since.

[LaserGuy]

I like this case.

U dont think it could be coached??

Popop made a great case On RM, what was wrong with it?

@Alonzo: These statements together feel very strange to me. You seemed to have reservations about the case in 719, but then claimed it was great in 856 and didn't see anything wrong with it. Why were you worried about popo being coached? Why the enthusiastic support of the same case later?

[LaserGuy]

Alonzo/Alch interactions give me an SvS vibe.

[LaserGuy]

What exactly did you find suspicious of randomidget? What made his lynch a net benefit in your opinion?

His content was fluffy and insubstantial. 184 in particular pinged me just kind of speculative shade throwing without really anything backing it up. 242 is just awful. I also was suspicious of the interaction of 91 and 100 between him and implosion (see, e.g. 514).

I think lynch is a net benefit because, as I alluded to above, Random was the kind of player that was going to need to be lynched before LYLO anyway, and given that we're ahead a lynch as it is, it wasn't a bad time for it. The way that this wagon developed is also, IMHO, very alignment indicative for a number of players that were kind of wishy-washy nulls before this point, so in terms of information value from the lynch, it's pretty decent compensation for losing a lurker VT.

[LaserGuy]

But what exactly made him the kind of player that needed to be lynched? Because he lurked or because a bunch of people suspected him?

Because his contributions were mostly useless. Scum isn't going to shoot a slot like that if they're Town and we don't have a vig to get rid of the bad slots otherwise.

[LaserGuy]

Sorry guys, I was really busy today and didn't really have any time to look at this game, so this is just kind of a pre-empetive prod-dodge.

Both wagons look kind of ugly based on the VC at 1000. I have Scum/Town/Null on both

Alchemist and especially popopo feel like they've kind of ghosted today. NM's content is much worse than usual. I can usually get a decent read on him by this point in the game but he's giving us nothing to work with.

More tomorrow, hopefully.

[LaserGuy]

i don't really like ither of the alonzo or alchemist wagons

i don't have enough townreads for the stage of the game we're in i feel like

Can you talk to me a bit about where you are at as your reads are concerned? Who do you think is most likely scum at this point?

[LaserGuy]

I'm not sure what exactly to make of this:

Spoiler: Alch Associative Commentary

also i think the two of you [sky and alch] have partner-like associatives btw

Alonzo/Alch interactions give me an SvS vibe.

Im pretty sure Alch/Skitter Lynches is a town win here.

Some interesting associatives here [alch/popo], actually.
They seemed very buddy buddy during their push on me with the "This exactly" comment, and aside from Alch coming to random's defense from popo's attack (which he never gives any indication he finds scummy), there is no implication of any suspicion/scumreads on each other at all... especially from popo's side.

After Day 1 back and forths regarding me and random, we get some major Day 2 distancing. Popo gives no reasoning for his sudden 180 on Alch except for sheeping RC, which makes no sense given his "Towniest townie" comment at the end of Day 1. I included 783 on this because of Alch's 1027, but that looks as vague a comment as you could get as it could apply to literally anyone in the game.

This doesn't exactly inspire confidence in any of the associatives on Alch at this point; he seems to pair well with almost anyone. FWIW, I like horrordude's argument here, but I can see some of the others reading back as well.

Look at implo's case on popo and tell me that's SvS because im not seeing it at all

[/quote]
The timing kind of made me think it might be SvS. implosion made that case with a bunch of votes already on him very close to deadline. Wagon was never going to form there, and you were already a close second as a counterwagon. The whole exercise feels kind of pointless as SvT to me.

[LaserGuy]

i don't really like ither of the alonzo or alchemist wagons

i don't have enough townreads for the stage of the game we're in i feel like

Can you talk to me a bit about where you are at as your reads are concerned? Who do you think is most likely scum at this point?

you're town

alonzo is probably town; and i think i was maybe wrong on sky; i'm going to call her town for now becauase i don't really have enough townreads and her eod2 feels kinda townie to me

everyone else is a muddled mess of somewhere between scumlean and nullscum which is why i'm unhappy with the gamestate

Any particular reason you have horrordude in the scumlean-to-nullscum group? I've been liking how he's been working through the game for the most part. I do agree there's too many people that all kind of fit awkwardly together. Having N_M as a hard null doesn't help.

[LaserGuy]

Kind of want to go with this. A lot of his voting has felt very opportunistic to me. Implosion also had a hard townread on him that didn't seem to really make sense to me.

VOTE: Invisibility

Only other wagon that really interests me at this point is Alch.

[LaserGuy]

That is bizarre That game finished 10 days ago.

[LaserGuy]

I haven’t seen much else from him aside from the RM case he made, but there’s a problem with that too. It boiled down to “he’s lurking” despite me linking to multiple hames showing RM is just like that. He acknowledged my post with the links but then later went back to RM for lurking anyway. I don’t think he looked into the links or cared about sorting RM anyway.

Together it reads like opportunistic scum.

VOTE: popo

Because there’s no actual case against him other than what Lazerguy said, and I don’t think his votes have been opportunistic. People voted Invis after his post about popo because...? Popo’s 10x scummier and is a better wagon.

Why do you feel popo was opportunistic on the RM wagon but Invis was not?

[LaserGuy]

The day has gone on way too long, end this

Maybe don't vote for a vanity wagon then? Alonzo is not getting lynched today.

[LaserGuy]

also maybe popo doesnt get cleared?

actually i think popo might just be town here

hi i dont really know what i was thinking when i called popo town

This whole sequence of posts is very strange.

@Invis, what do you make of the fact that popo apparently didn't remember that you were scum with him in Micro 817?

[LaserGuy]

UNVOTE:

Going to tentatively accept that claim at least to the point that I don't think we can lynch Invis today. I think it's very likely that Invis probably is the tracker unless there's a CC in the remaining few players that haven't commented; remains to be seen whether he's Town but I think this will get sorted out one way or another for us.

Okay this day really needs to end. I don't know how much more we're going to get.

Skitter/Sky/Laser - help?

Well, assuming Invis is Town, my Town group is now {Horror, skitter, sky, Alonzo, Invis}, so I'm happy to consider any of Alch/NM/popo at this point. I don't think we can really go wrong lynching from this latter group.

Assuming everyone on the popo/Alch wagons are already voting their first choice, I think it probably makes sense for skitter and I to vote together rather than let NM decide the lynch. At this point, that's probably Alch unless people have a sudden urge to move to NM.

[LaserGuy]

I always keep talking about how NM should be sorted through PoE and only just now realized that my PoE points towards a healthy chance of NM flipping scum

The logic being you don't think that popo/Alch are buddies together and therefore NM is the PoE most likely buddy for either?

[LaserGuy]

Kind of thinking we should just lynch Alch today and NM tomorrow and see where we stand after that.

[LaserGuy]

Nobody else is in the hood right now. I was going to neighborize BBT N1 but he died.

Why BBT? I don't really recall him doing much of anything.

Also this:

why did you neighborizer vizzy?

neighborizer is like net-null for town pretty much; it doesn't really have much town utility

it does have some scum-utility in that scum can use it to pocket people

I've seen it both as a Town role and a scum role, so I agree it's more or less NAI. I'll give a bit of townie credit from a balance point of view I guess... All of the PRs in this game are pretty weak so I'd expect Town to have the majority, if not all, of them (assuming none are duplicated).

[LaserGuy]

dont belive the justification for neighboring BBT, dont believe that he actually did it

incredibly convenient that he neighborized the one dude that died n1.

lynch pls

I kind of agree with this. Something feels off here. I think I'm ready to end the day.

VOTE: Alch

[LaserGuy]

vote:laserguy

late on both scum wagons
dont like his jump on the rando wagon

Lazylump's last post was 96. My first post was 473. I finished catchup at 543 and voted at 595. I'm not sure how I could have been on the implosion wagon earlier without violating causality.

What don't you like about my vote for rando?

Spoiler: Votecounts To EOD3

50
Not_Mafia:

Alchemist21

, LaserGuy
LaserGuy:

Invisibility

:

BlueBloodedToffee

:

RadiantCowbells

, horrordude0215,

implosion

Alchemist21

:
Alonzo:

implosion

: skitter30

randomidget

: Skygazer, Not_Mafia

RadiantCowbells

:
popopopopopopo:

Invisibility

skitter30:
Skygazer:

randomidget

horrordude0215: Alonzo, popopopopopopo
Not Voting:

BlueBloodedToffee

106
Not_Mafia:

Alchemist21

, LaserGuy,

BlueBloodedToffee

, popopopopopopo,

implosion

(L-2)
LaserGuy: Alonzo

Invisibility

: horrordude0215

BlueBloodedToffee

:

Alchemist21

:
Alonzo:

implosion

: skitter30

randomidget

: Skygazer, Not_Mafia

RadiantCowbells

:
popopopopopopo:

Invisibility

skitter30:

RadiantCowbells

Skygazer:

randomidget

horrordude0215:
Not Voting:

150
Not_Mafia: LaserGuy,

BlueBloodedToffee

,
LaserGuy: Alonzo

Invisibility

: horrordude0215

BlueBloodedToffee

:

Alchemist21

:
Alonzo:

implosion

:

randomidget

: Skygazer, Not_Mafia

RadiantCowbells

:
popopopopopopo:

Invisibility

skitter30:

RadiantCowbells

,

implosion

Skygazer:

randomidget

, skitter30
horrordude0215: popopopopopopo
Not Voting:

Alchemist21

191
Not_Mafia: LaserGuy,

BlueBloodedToffee

,

implosion

LaserGuy: Alonzo

Invisibility

:

BlueBloodedToffee

:

Alchemist21

:
Alonzo:

implosion

:

randomidget

: Not_Mafia, Skygazer, popopopopopopo, horrordude0215

RadiantCowbells

:
popopopopopopo:
skitter30:

RadiantCowbells

,
Skygazer:

randomidget

, skitter30
horrordude0215:

Alchemist21

,

Invisibility

,
Not Voting:

246
Not_Mafia: LaserGuy,

BlueBloodedToffee

,

implosion

, Alonzo
LaserGuy Slot:

Invisibility

:

BlueBloodedToffee

:

Alchemist21

:
Alonzo:

implosion

:

randomidget

: Not_Mafia, Skygazer, popopopopopopo, horrordude0215

RadiantCowbells

:
popopopopopopo:
skitter30:

RadiantCowbells

,
Skygazer:

randomidget

, skitter30
horrordude0215:

Alchemist21

Not Voting:

Invisibility

350
Not_Mafia: LaserGuy,

BlueBloodedToffee

,

implosion

, Alonzo
LaserGuy:

Invisibility

:

BlueBloodedToffee

:

Alchemist21

:
Alonzo:

implosion

:

RadiantCowbells

, Skygazer,

Invisibility

randomidget

: Not_Mafia, popopopopopopo, horrordude0215

RadiantCowbells

:
popopopopopopo:
skitter30:
Skygazer:

randomidget

, skitter30
horrordude0215:

Alchemist21

Not Voting:

424
Not_Mafia: LaserGuy,

BlueBloodedToffee

, Alonzo
LaserGuy:

Invisibility

:

BlueBloodedToffee

:

Alchemist21

:
Alonzo:

implosion

:

RadiantCowbells

, Skygazer,

Invisibility

,

Alchemist21

randomidget

: Not_Mafia, popopopopopopo, horrordude0215

RadiantCowbells

:
popopopopopopo:
skitter30:
Skygazer:

randomidget

, skitter30,

implosion

horrordude0215:
Extend the Deadline:
Not Voting:

450
Not_Mafia: LaserGuy, Alonzo
LaserGuy:

Invisibility

:

BlueBloodedToffee

:

Alchemist21

:
Alonzo:

implosion

:

RadiantCowbells

, Skygazer,

Invisibility

,

Alchemist21

,

BlueBloodedToffee

(L-2)

randomidget

: Not_Mafia, popopopopopopo, horrordude0215

RadiantCowbells

:
popopopopopopo:
skitter30:
Skygazer:

randomidget

, skitter30,

implosion

horrordude0215:
Extend the Deadline:
Not Voting:

475
Not_Mafia: LaserGuy
LaserGuy:

Invisibility

:

BlueBloodedToffee

:

Alchemist21

:
Alonzo:

implosion

:

RadiantCowbells

, Skygazer,

Invisibility

,

Alchemist21

,

BlueBloodedToffee

(L-2)

randomidget

: Not_Mafia, popopopopopopo, horrordude0215

RadiantCowbells

:
popopopopopopo:
skitter30:
Skygazer:

randomidget

,

implosion

horrordude0215:
Extend the Deadline: Alonzo, skitter30
Not Voting:

520
Not_Mafia: LaserGuy
LaserGuy:

Invisibility

:

BlueBloodedToffee

:

Alchemist21

:
Alonzo:

implosion

:

RadiantCowbells

,

Invisibility

,

Alchemist21

,

BlueBloodedToffee

randomidget

: Not_Mafia, popopopopopopo

RadiantCowbells

:
popopopopopopo:
skitter30:
Skygazer:

randomidget

,

implosion

, horrordude0215
horrordude0215:
Extend the Deadline: Alonzo, skitter30, Skygazer
Not Voting:

550
Not_Mafia: LaserGuy, Alonzo
LaserGuy:

Invisibility

:

BlueBloodedToffee

:

Alchemist21

:
Alonzo:

implosion

:

RadiantCowbells

,

Invisibility

,

Alchemist21

,

BlueBloodedToffee

randomidget

: Not_Mafia, popopopopopopo

RadiantCowbells

:
popopopopopopo:

implosion

skitter30:
Skygazer:

randomidget

, horrordude0215, skitter30
horrordude0215:
Extend the Deadline: Skygazer
Not Voting:

575
Not_Mafia:
LaserGuy:

Invisibility

:

BlueBloodedToffee

:

Alchemist21

:
Alonzo:

implosion

:

RadiantCowbells

,

Alchemist21

,

BlueBloodedToffee

, Not_Mafia,

Invisibility

randomidget

: popopopopopopo

RadiantCowbells

:
popopopopopopo:
skitter30:
Skygazer:

randomidget

, horrordude0215, skitter30,

implosion

horrordude0215:
Extend the Deadline: Skygazer
Not Voting: LaserGuy, Alonzo

611
Not_Mafia:
LaserGuy:

Invisibility

:

BlueBloodedToffee

:

Alchemist21

:
Alonzo:

implosion

:

RadiantCowbells

,

Alchemist21

,

BlueBloodedToffee

, Not_Mafia,

Invisibility

, LaserGuy, popopopopopopo [Hammer]

randomidget

:

RadiantCowbells

:
popopopopopopo:
skitter30:
Skygazer:

randomidget

, horrordude0215, skitter30,

implosion

horrordude0215:
Extend the Deadline: Skygazer
Not Voting: Alonzo

658
Not_Mafia:
LaserGuy:

Invisibility

:

Alchemist21

:
Alonzo:

randomidget

:

RadiantCowbells

:
popopopopopopo:

Invisibility

skitter30: Alonzo
Skygazer: skitter30
horrordude0215:

Alchemist21

Not Voting: Not_Mafia, LaserGuy,

randomidget

,

RadiantCowbells

, popopopopopopo, Skygazer, horrordude0215
Extend the Deadline:

700
Not_Mafia:
LaserGuy:

Invisibility

: LaserGuy

Alchemist21

:

RadiantCowbells

, horrordude0215, popopopopopopo
Alonzo:

randomidget

:

RadiantCowbells

:
popopopopopopo:

Invisibility

skitter30: Alonzo
Skygazer: skitter30
horrordude0215:

Alchemist21

Not Voting: Not_Mafia,

randomidget

, Skygazer
Extend the Deadline:

725
Not_Mafia:
LaserGuy:

Invisibility

:

Alchemist21

:

RadiantCowbells

, horrordude0215,
Alonzo:

randomidget

: popopopopopopo, LaserGuy,

RadiantCowbells

:
popopopopopopo:

Invisibility

skitter30: Alonzo
Skygazer: skitter30
horrordude0215:

Alchemist21

Not Voting: Not_Mafia,

randomidget

, Skygazer
Extend the Deadline:

800
Not_Mafia:
LaserGuy:

Invisibility

:

Alchemist21

:

RadiantCowbells

, horrordude0215,
Alonzo:

randomidget

: popopopopopopo, LaserGuy,

RadiantCowbells

:
popopopopopopo:

Invisibility

skitter30: Alonzo
Skygazer: skitter30
horrordude0215:

Alchemist21

Not Voting: Not_Mafia,

randomidget

, Skygazer
Extend the Deadline:

848
Not_Mafia:
LaserGuy:

Invisibility

:

Alchemist21

:

RadiantCowbells

, horrordude0215, Skygazer
Alonzo:

randomidget

: popopopopopopo, LaserGuy,

Invisibility

, Alonzo

RadiantCowbells

:
popopopopopopo:
skitter30:
Skygazer: skitter30
horrordude0215:

Alchemist21

Not Voting: Not_Mafia,

randomidget

Extend the Deadline:

859
Not_Mafia:
LaserGuy:

Invisibility

:

Alchemist21

:

RadiantCowbells

, horrordude0215, Skygazer
Alonzo:

randomidget

: popopopopopopo, LaserGuy,

Invisibility

, Alonzo, Not_Mafia [L-1]

RadiantCowbells

:
popopopopopopo:
skitter30:
Skygazer: skitter30
horrordude0215:

Alchemist21

Not Voting:

randomidget

Extend the Deadline:

883
Not_Mafia:
LaserGuy:

Invisibility

:

Alchemist21

:

RadiantCowbells

, horrordude0215, Skygazer
Alonzo:

randomidget

: popopopopopopo, LaserGuy,

Invisibility

, Alonzo, Not_Mafia,

RadiantCowbells

[Hammer]

RadiantCowbells

:
popopopopopopo:
skitter30:
Skygazer: skitter30
horrordude0215:

Alchemist21

Not Voting:

randomidget

Extend the Deadline:

944
Not_Mafia:
LaserGuy:

Invisibility

:

Alchemist21

: Alonzo,
Alonzo:

Alchemist21

, horrordude0215,
popopopopopopo:
skitter30:
Skygazer:
horrordude0215:
Not Voting: Not_Mafia, LaserGuy,

Invisibility

, popopopopopopo, Skygazer, skitter30
Extend the Deadline:

975
Not_Mafia:
LaserGuy:

Invisibility

:

Alchemist21

: Alonzo, Skygazer, Not_Mafia,
Alonzo:

Alchemist21

, horrordude0215,
popopopopopopo:
skitter30:
Skygazer:
horrordude0215:
Not Voting: LaserGuy,

Invisibility

, popopopopopopo, skitter30
Extend the Deadline:

988
Not_Mafia:
LaserGuy:

Invisibility

:

Alchemist21

: Alonzo, Skygazer, popopopopopopo,
Alonzo:

Alchemist21

, horrordude0215, skitter30, Not_Mafia [L-1]
popopopopopopo:
skitter30:
Skygazer:
horrordude0215:
Not Voting: LaserGuy,

Invisibility

Extend the Deadline:

1000
Not_Mafia:
LaserGuy:

Invisibility

:

Alchemist21

: Alonzo, Skygazer, popopopopopopo,
Alonzo:

Alchemist21

, skitter30, Not_Mafia,
popopopopopopo:
skitter30:
Skygazer:
horrordude0215:
Not Voting: LaserGuy,

Invisibility

, horrordude0215
Extend the Deadline:

1050
Not_Mafia:
LaserGuy:

Invisibility

:

Alchemist21

: Skygazer, popopopopopopo,
Alonzo: Not_Mafia,
popopopopopopo:

Alchemist21

,
skitter30:
Skygazer:
horrordude0215:
Not Voting: LaserGuy, horrordude0215, skitter30, Alonzo,

Invisibility

1098
Not_Mafia:
LaserGuy:

Invisibility

: LaserGuy

Alchemist21

: Skygazer, popopopopopopo,
Alonzo: Not_Mafia,
popopopopopopo:

Alchemist21

, Alonzo
skitter30:
Skygazer:
horrordude0215:
Not Voting: horrordude0215, skitter30,

Invisibility

Extend the Deadline:

1128
Not_Mafia:
LaserGuy:

Invisibility

: LaserGuy

Alchemist21

: Skygazer, popopopopopopo,
Alonzo: Not_Mafia,
popopopopopopo:

Alchemist21

, Alonzo, horrordude0215
skitter30:
Skygazer:
horrordude0215:
Not Voting: skitter30,

Invisibility

Extend the Deadline:

1169
Not_Mafia: Alonzo
LaserGuy:

Invisibility

: LaserGuy, skitter30, horrordude0215, Not_Mafia [L-1]

Alchemist21

: Skygazer, popopopopopopo,
Alonzo:
popopopopopopo:

Alchemist21

skitter30:
Skygazer:
horrordude0215:
Not Voting:

Invisibility

Extend the Deadline:

1205
Not_Mafia:
LaserGuy:

Invisibility

: LaserGuy, skitter30, Not_Mafia

Alchemist21

: Skygazer, popopopopopopo, horrordude0215
Alonzo:
popopopopopopo:

Alchemist21

, Alonzo,

Invisibility

skitter30:
Skygazer:
horrordude0215:
Not Voting:
Extend the Deadline:

1247
Not_Mafia:
LaserGuy:

Invisibility

: Not_Mafia

Alchemist21

: Skygazer, popopopopopopo, horrordude0215
Alonzo:
popopopopopopo:

Alchemist21

,

Invisibility

skitter30:
Skygazer:
horrordude0215:
Not Voting: skitter30, LaserGuy, Alonzo
Extend the Deadline:

1281
Not_Mafia:
LaserGuy:

Invisibility

: Not_Mafia

Alchemist21

: Skygazer, popopopopopopo, horrordude0215
Alonzo:
popopopopopopo:

Alchemist21

,

Invisibility

skitter30:
Skygazer:
horrordude0215:
Not Voting: skitter30, LaserGuy, Alonzo
Extend the Deadline:

1296
Not_Mafia:
LaserGuy:

Invisibility

: Not_Mafia

Alchemist21

: Skygazer, popopopopopopo, horrordude0215, LaserGuy, Skitter [Hammer]
Alonzo:
popopopopopopo:

Alchemist21

,

Invisibility

skitter30:
Skygazer:
horrordude0215:
Not Voting: Alonzo
Extend the Deadline:

Alonzo, skitter and horrordude have been on a lot of bad wagons. Sky, popo probably Town since I don't expect Alch buddy would hard bus all of D4.

106: lol if two scum wagoned the third scum to L-1

106 is L-2? I've seen this happen before, but I'll agree it's somewhat unlikely.

TOWN

SKYGAZER

SKITTER
POPO

ALONZO
NM

LASER
HORROR

SCUM

I don't see where this is coming from at all compared to your earlier analysis. Why are Alonzo and skitter so high up? How did I go from Town in 1337 to scum here?

[pedit]Thread is fast this evening. I see you've addressed this last bit already.

[LaserGuy]

This is roughly where I'm at:

Skygazer

- I think the tracker clear is solid here. Town.

popo

- On review, I'm not convinced that both Alch and implo would be bussing so aggressively here, and popo would be bussing in return. Likely Town on associatives.

skitter

- Been reading her as Town for awhile, and tracker result is more likely pointing Town. OTOH her voting record is not great and is consistent with being buddies with Alch/implo. Making a note to review RC's case on her sometime today. Putting her at Town lean.

Not_Mafia

- Is Not_Mafia. I'm still of the opinion that NM is a good lynch for today. PoE he has a reasonably good chance of being buddies with Alch/implo. Although I'm not usually a big fan of policy lynches, given that we're two mislynches from LYLO, I think this is probably an ideal position to policy check him anyway since it's not going to be any more attractive to lynch him next day if we mislynch today, and I would really rather not have him reach 3P LYLO. I don't think that the wagon at 106 clears him, as he was voted up to L-2 by implosion at 95 and unvoted by Alch only a few hours later at 121.

Alonzo

- Was soft-defending Alch some D3 and his voting record is not great. He's been putting in a lot of effort the last couple of Days and tonally his play feels townie. Making a note to review some of his scum games before the end of Day to see what his play looks like. Marking as scum lean for now.

horrordude

- Some interesting stuff here. There's a really interesting interaction between horror/Invis/Alch/implo from 105 through 167 related to Invis' fake vote. I found this interaction weird the first time around and I still find it a bit strange, now wondering if maybe it was a bit of scum theatre. Implo also spent a lot of time sort of soft defending horror, e.g. 547. Alch and horror were pushing each other off-and-on throughout D2-D3, but were often diverted to other wagons. On tone horror comes across as pretty townie, but there's enough in the associatives for me to be a bit suspicious. Moving to scum lean.


I think I'd be tentatively okay with a horrordude wagon, but would really prefer NM for the lynch today.

VOTE: Not_Mafia

[LaserGuy]

does anyone actually think nm will flip red?

I put him at like ~30-40% mafia here. Better than chance, but not obvscum.

[LaserGuy]

Who put you in charge of the viability of a NM lynch?!

wasn't someone gonna sort him by now?

looks from my POV that this is the optimal point to push NM from a scum perspective.

Nobody has shown me anything viable on NM all game one way or the other...

Didn't he Push Alch all day yesterday? You think that's in his scumrange?

Who's played and won alongside town! NM before?

To late to late will be the cry when the man with the Not Maf wagon has passed you by...

Your cross to bear if you want it.

VOTE: NOT MAF

@Alonzo: Can you talk to me about your progression here? For most of D4 you were opposed to wagoning NM and seemed to have at least... vaguely positive feelings for him. Why did you decide to hammer him?

Also, do you have any completed scum games? I couldn't find any when I was looking back through your older stuff.

[LaserGuy]

A) when the seagulls follow the trawler, it is because they think sardines will be thrown into the sea.

Can you pretend that I'm an idiot with no understanding of subtly or metaphor and try explaining this again?

B) yes one of my first ones

Which one?

[LaserGuy]

maybe we mass claim here >.>

I would be okay with doing this.

[LaserGuy]

A) when the seagulls follow the trawler, it is because they think sardines will be thrown into the sea.

Can you pretend that I'm an idiot with no understanding of subtly or metaphor and try explaining this again?

I could explain it in a thousand different ways, the TLDR was always NM needed to go.

I don't disagree with this. It's just that for most of D4 you seemed to believe the opposite, so I am trying to figure out the reason for the sudden flip on him.

[LaserGuy]

Dont you trust everyone thats TR'd me so far...?

Do you agree with those Who SR me?

I'd have to check; I don't crowdsource my reads in this manner. My most up to date reads are in 1402. At this point I'm looking at horror > Alonzo > skitter > popo.

[LaserGuy]

you were townreading me up until like just before this post; i don't understand why you're scumreading me this strongly

basically what i was getting at earlier is that your reads yesterday are very ... trendy is a good word

your alonzo push at the end of the day yesterday was also on the heels of sky questioning why alonzo stopped pushing nm, and you kinda followed up with that line of questioning after she raised it

In fairness here, I think everyone has had to re-evaluate their reads in recent days. horrordude had alonzo at scum or nullscum for most of the game from the looks of it. His progression there is fine. I agree that his read on you is a much more dramatic shift.

[LaserGuy]

How do you feel about me now you know I'm largely useless as either alignment?

I don't agree with this assessment of you. Don't sell yourself short.

On the whole I guess read your meta. Tonally you're pretty similar between your Town and scum games, and I don't see any obvious pings. With only one scum game that's pretty dated anyway, it's hard to draw any really strong conclusions.

more like laserguy hasn't had to do as much to earn his TR as some other slots, his big wallposts of earlygame have evaporated now.. and hes chasing shadows still asking questions about my stance on not maf...

Activity is pretty NAI for me. Skimming through my ISO, this doesn't appear anyway to be true except for toDay, when we had five players with two on V/LAs, which is hardly conducive to discussion. For the latter, I asked you one question about N_M and followed up when you gave me a non-answer. This does not feel like a genuine attempt to analyse my content.

Speaking of inactivity, where is horrordude?

[LaserGuy]

On the whole I guess read your meta. Tonally you're pretty similar between your Town and scum games, and I don't see any obvious pings. With only one scum game that's pretty dated anyway, it's hard to draw any really strong conclusions.

Should be "null read your meta".

[LaserGuy]

i feel like skitter today, horrordude tomorrow nets us the win over 50% of the time

maybe we mass claim here >.>

Since you've already claimed, how about you start popcorn for mass claim?

[LaserGuy]

Interesting. I'm VT.

I need to think about this. More in a bit.

[LaserGuy]

It is feels strange to me that there would be a Vanilla Cop listed in the setup spec but not have there one be in the game. I guess the wording allows for this, but I don't understand what the point of doing so would be.

It's possible that the Vanilla Cop is in the game and for some reason is lying about their role. I'm having a hard time coming up with a good motivation for either alignment doing this though.

[LaserGuy]

POPOPo next?

VOTE:SKITTER

VOTE : HORRORDUDE

200+ posts to score half what NM did on my math test?

I don't care for this progression at all. You've been on basically everybody today. This vote is very weird because it's, if I'm reading this right, an OMGUS vote based on horrordude's reads in D4? Which you already commented on in 1473 and proceeded to vote skitter at the time

Going to put this down for now.

VOTE: Alonzo

[LaserGuy]

I was also scum in Micro 815, but this will probably not be a super useful game as I was dayvigged on Page 3

[LaserGuy]

Probably the biggest difference when it comes down to it is that I don't like playing scum very much. As Town I enjoy solving the puzzle and figuring things out and being able to improve my ability to make good reads and whatnot. As scum I don't really feel that there's the same level of... I don't know what the right phrasing should be... gameplay value, maybe? It just doesn't have the same sense of achievement for me.

I can probably give you some WIFOMy self-meta beyond that, but I haven't played a lot of scum recently so I don't even know how accurate it would be.

[LaserGuy]

@mod: popo is voting for horrordude, not skitter

- Corrected. Thanks for noticing!

[LaserGuy]

Whatya thinking now laseyguy?

I have Town on popo/skitter. I can see it going either way between you and horrordude. Still leaning more toward scum!Alonzo and Town!horror at the moment.

im also worried about alonzo because i think northsidegal replacing out might be a scumtell for her

I think RC said she flaked out sitewide and that's more likely NAI. I'll see if I can dig up the post.

[LaserGuy]

ordinarily?

absolutely her flaking is scum indicative for her.

but she's site flaked entirely which I don't think is especially scum indicative for her. I wish I had something to read her off of before she site flaked but I don't.

Here.

[LaserGuy]

Though it doesn't look like she actually site flaked since she was playing again a couple days later so I dunno.

[LaserGuy]

I hate making reads based on activity, but looking back, I'm really not liking that horrordude has been ghosting pretty hard since the Alch lynch

[LaserGuy]

His activity has been noticeably lower since the start of D4, not just in the last few RL days. Dunno, maybe that is sitewide too, haven't looked too closely.

[LaserGuy]

Just skimmed through horrordude's content and still getting stuck on how weird that interaction with implosion is in 113 and the posts that follow. I don't know, I think I may just go for it at this point since we don't seem to be getting anywhere.

VOTE: horrordude

Sorry a bit terse. On phone.

[LaserGuy]

I'm currently still thinking Town popo and scum Alonzo. Will do some rereading later today to see if I've missed anything important.

[LaserGuy]

Laser/Popopo should I sheep the rest of town here who tell me POPOPo is innocent by association?

Curious that you're suddenly thinking about dropping your suspicions of popo as soon as I said that I was still leaning scum on you.

[LaserGuy]

Okay, so here's some bits on Alonzo. This is all stuff we've talked about before, but I'm just going to put it all in one place.

1. NSG flake is scum-indicative. RC notes this in 171 and again in 368. Tell is independently corroborated by skitter in 1557 and popo in 1559, though skitter believes this is NAI (1562). In 368 RC indicates that he isn't sure because he believed that it was a site flake, but this doesn't appear to be the case as (see 1563 and 1564[/post]).

2. D2 wagon. Alonzo baits the NM lolhammer on Random in 841, which is the counterwagon to the all-Town Alch wagon (848). This despite his very noticeable stance on NM. Skitter talks about this in 888. Skygazer notes that Alonzo was concerned about avoiding a lolhammer on implosion (567), but not on RM (see 898). Alonzo's defense of this vote is a bit weird. In 856, he says popo's case was "great", but earlier he had some reservations about the case maybe being coached (721), which doesn't seem consistent with thinking the case is great.

3. Alch interactions. There's a weird interaction between Alch and Alonzo where they vote each other for no particular reason (905 and 938) then kind of randomly chat without reference to this at all (919, 940, 943, 945, 966, 970, 971). Alch and Alonzo then both swing their votes to popo (1027, 1033). Both continue to push popo (Alonzo 1057, Alch 1062, Alonzo 1092), Alonzo 1116). I noted SvS vibes between the two in 950, but this whole sequence is pretty . 247 is also very weird and needlessly aggressive.

4. Alch defense. Alonzo spends a lot of time defending Alch: 843, 1151, 1155, 1253. This is despite finding him scummy enough to vote in the sequence above.

5. skitter kill. Alonzo has been pushing skitter as scum for most of the game (642, 1415, 1474). popo seemed receptive to this for quite awhile as well (983, 1071, 1105, 1318, 1481). However, at end of the D5, popo moves skitter to Town (1556) and is worried about me 1575. Alonzo can't shoot popo because skitter and I had been reading each other as solid Town for the whole game, so his only path to victory is to set up the kill on whichever of me/skitter popo is most likely to vote for. As of EoD5, that was me.

I think at this point I'm just going to vote this. If popo is scum, I tip my metaphorical hat to you.

VOTE: Alonzo

[LaserGuy]

@mod: V/LA from Friday until Sunday. I'll try to phone post but I don't know what my connectivity is going to be like for most of the time I'm away.

[LaserGuy]

@popo:

You should vote your best read. Realistically everything from Alonzo and I today should be treated as WIFOM from your point of view.

I'm happy to answer questions or respond to anything you'd like, but I don't think swamping you with more content is super productive. Hopefully you have enough to work with to make the right choice.

[LaserGuy]

GG everyone!

I'm fine releasing the PT as well.

[LaserGuy]

Thanks