mini normal 2027: advice mafia (endgrame)

[FA_Q2]

VOTE: horrordude0215

Clowns. Really?

Clearly scum. Who else but scum would have a CLOWN as an avi...

[FA_Q2]

VOTE: CT

you know what u did

What did he do?

[FA_Q2]

I doubt Radiant Cowbells is lying,since claiming in an unusual way like this could cause investigative roles to come after him at night. If he is scum, then that would be really bad for him. I don't know whether or not he's pulling some type of gambit though, I've read through a few games of his and he was always someone difficult to read.

How so?

There is no cop in this game. By drawing any other investigative roles to him, he can waste N1 investigative actions as all he has to do is not be the one doing the targeting. If there is a jail keeper, he has effectively made that role useless - trying to force the jail keeper to a known target gives the scum a free hand. That does not even take into account if the scum has a tracker which would make the claim a disaster. He does not even take this into account with his claim making this feel like he is not coming at this from a town mindset. How does he know that scum does not have a tracker? Hell, most scum roles will have a large advantage knowing likely town targets. All and all, this is a shit claim. I cant even see this as a gambit as VT trying to draw the night kill as claiming JK enabler would be the worst claim to make as you are directly asking to be made unkillable and lessening the chance that you are the target.

Hell, the only thing you might possibly get from this claim is more WIFOM which is, again, bad for town - it is such a bullshit claim.

So... If you doubt the claim, what alignment do you think I am and why did I make the claim when I did?

I think you are scum and are role fishing and/or trying to pull town night actions.

I can not really think of a solid town reason to make this claim when you are under NO DURESS at all. You are not likely to be the night one target (1/10) of a chance with no claim at all if you really were the JK enabler.

VOTE: RadiantCowbells

Can anyone point to a prow town reason for this claim?

The only other read I have at this point is town for Completly Trustworthy. He basically pulled us out of RVS and is actively engaging people.

[FA_Q2]

Nice to see you again Skygazer.
Also, Wh4t, why did you change your vote?

From what little I can discern so far garmr seems fine. FA and yourself have the most awkward entrances imo.

Not sure what you expect from RVS. There was nothing scummy to go off at that point. RVS is always a shit show.

What is a 'natural' entrance than. How is my 'reason' different than horrors vote on CT?

[FA_Q2]

I Am Innocent, why don't you get the Saudade wagon? Both Havo and texcat explained their reasons for voting him in 75 and 71. Do you not agree with their reasoning? If so, then please explain why. As for me, I found Saudade's entrance very weird and would like to know why he felt the need to declare he was town right off the bat.


Now I have some questions to ask people
1. Please provide a link to completed games with you as scum and town
2. What do you believe is the optimal scumhunting strategy? What scumtells do you think are overrated?
3. How would you describe your playstyle as scum?
4. Do you enjoy being scum or town more?

My answers
1. I cannot provide links since I have only played one other game on this site and its ongoing
2. It's best to pay attention to what people have to say about others and whether their actions match up with their words. The ways in which players treat each other contains far more information than that which can be gained through observing the playstyles of individual players, which are all different and can be hard to read. Radiant Cowbells is an example of a player who is often mislynched due to acting really scummy(at least in the games I have read through.)
3. As scum, I try to get people who I think can be mislynched to create content which puts them further into trouble or allows me to present a case against them later. I always want a member of the town to be on the defensive, since that means little attention is paid to me. In addition, I try to post a lot, but prefer to avoid fluff. If I keep saying productive things or elaborate on my opinions, then eventually someone else will mess up naturally and I can capitalize on the opportunity.
4. I prefer being scum or third party the most because you are the active force in the game that everyone else is trying to stop, it is very fun to try to try and outwit all your competitors.

1. Just do a search on me. Handing you links certainly is not optimal - then I would get to chose the games that you are looking at. Bad idea if I were scum.
2. Don't think that there is an 'optimal' strat. Just engage people. The most overrated strat IMHO is meta. Meta is to easy to change and/or misinterpret. Another overrated strat here is activity. I find activity to tell very little if not combined with something more.
3. Considering that my goal has always been to play exactly the same (and I think that is most people's goal) so I would say the same. I think the only real difference in my scum game and my town game is that as scum I have to protect my team so my interactions will be fake with those players/less likely to engage with them.
4. I like scum WAY better. It is fun trying to deceive town. As town I feel like there is a lot of stabbing in the dark. Town is also far more likely so it is more like the 'average' role. Also, there is ALWAYS something scum can do - as a VT night phases are boring.

[FA_Q2]

you wouldnt know what's forced even if it hit you
VOTE: Skygazer

An OMGUS vote?

This is bullshit. I can get behind a Saudade wagon once RC is sorted. That claim is to scummy to let stand.

[FA_Q2]

3 bote wagon already! How interesting!

What is interesting is that you felt the need to comment on the wagon w/o taking a stance.

Active lurking...

[FA_Q2]

FA have you played with RC before?

Yes I have. I find him a pretty a chaotic player and generally he does play anti-town if I remember correctly - as well as wild ass claims. That was years ago though so my experience is pretty irrelevant. I doubt that his play is going to remain utterly constant over that time.

He is almost always N1 NK or D1 mislynch. If the claim is legit then is it not optimal to claim it when you are someone who is very paranoid about being killed N1? You coming in with such certainty about the claim being false is slightly worrying. The JK doesn't have to protect him but he could and that WIFOM could be enough to keep RC from being targeted.

Again, what town mindset/goal comes from claiming that role. I cant think of a single pro town reason. If he pulled that role it would absolutely be anti-town to claim like that. Further, I cannot think of a town gambit (like drawing the NK) that would work with that claim.

Nothing of that claim comes from a town mindset IMHO. There is a LOT there that I can see coming from a scum mindset.

I disagree with your CT read completely, rushing out of RVS is not AI and in fact scum would most likely want to look proactive to get towncred.

Most of his posts feel like posturing more than anything, like why would someone genuinely believe that players will post links to games for you instead of you doing the work yourself? It reads as LAMIST busy work to me.

If all he did was move on from RVS then it would be totally neutral. What has he done that is posturing other than asking for links? Sure, asking for links is dumb and the other questions are pretty weak but questions generate content. Look at what we are doing now.

So far IAI and CT are scumreads for me.
Null on pretty much everyone else but I want to believe RC is town.

VOTE: IAI

You avoided my question to you and you seem to have only said things that you think make me scummy but then null read me. Why?

[FA_Q2]

You avoided my question to you and you seem to have only said things that you think make me scummy but then null read me. Why?

I said you had one of the two most awkward entrances to me. I'm not sure what you wanted me to answer? I avoided moving my vote from you until you reentered the thread and you appear to be pushing your scum reads which elevated you back to null and so I moved onto my next suspect.

I don't recall having said things about you being scummy otherwise?

I want to know what was 'awkward' about it and what constitutes an entrance that would not be awkward.

[FA_Q2]

You avoided my question to you and you seem to have only said things that you think make me scummy but then null read me. Why?

I said you had one of the two most awkward entrances to me. I'm not sure what you wanted me to answer? I avoided moving my vote from you until you reentered the thread and you appear to be pushing your scum reads which elevated you back to null and so I moved onto my next suspect.

I don't recall having said things about you being scummy otherwise?

I want to know what was 'awkward' about it and what constitutes an entrance that would not be awkward.

As you said yourself, RVS is RVS so trying to find something that stands out I scanned the posts with my gut feel and your one stood out as trying too hard to be casual, so I pushed to find out. An entrance that would not be awkward would be one that just seems like a natural thing to post, not overly thought out or with some potential underlying agenda. How are these questions helping you?

Because reasoning is important. Scum has to fake their reasoning. Your reasoning felt somewhat forced.

[FA_Q2]

FA have you played with RC before?

Yes I have. I find him a pretty a chaotic player and generally he does play anti-town if I remember correctly - as well as wild ass claims. That was years ago though so my experience is pretty irrelevant. I doubt that his play is going to remain utterly constant over that time.

He is almost always N1 NK or D1 mislynch. If the claim is legit then is it not optimal to claim it when you are someone who is very paranoid about being killed N1? You coming in with such certainty about the claim being false is slightly worrying. The JK doesn't have to protect him but he could and that WIFOM could be enough to keep RC from being targeted.

Again, what town mindset/goal comes from claiming that role. I cant think of a single pro town reason. If he pulled that role it would absolutely be anti-town to claim like that. Further, I cannot think of a town gambit (like drawing the NK) that would work with that claim.

Nothing of that claim comes from a town mindset IMHO. There is a LOT there that I can see coming from a scum mindset.

I disagree with your CT read completely, rushing out of RVS is not AI and in fact scum would most likely want to look proactive to get towncred.

Most of his posts feel like posturing more than anything, like why would someone genuinely believe that players will post links to games for you instead of you doing the work yourself? It reads as LAMIST busy work to me.

If all he did was move on from RVS then it would be totally neutral. What has he done that is posturing other than asking for links? Sure, asking for links is dumb and the other questions are pretty weak but questions generate content. Look at what we are doing now.

So far IAI and CT are scumreads for me.
Null on pretty much everyone else but I want to believe RC is town.

VOTE: IAI

You avoided my question to you and you seem to have only said things that you think make me scummy but then null read me. Why?

So you acknowledge I have a history of doing stuff you feel is wild/anti-town (your words: I disagree) and you vote me for doing something that's... wild/anti-town

I will eat the bullet tonight with incredible consistency, me not claiming would have been awful for town. This isn't even a gambit it's just the objectively correct play.

I acknowledge you are a chaotic and tend to be an anti-town player.

The problem I have with your claim is that there is not a single logical reason for it. It is not the 'objectively' correct play - it is objectively the worst thing you could have done as outlined by my post. Further, you want a PL on me - not once did I see you claim that I am scum just that you want a PL. Your play is utterly centered around self preservation. Town is not going for self preservation - scum is.

[FA_Q2]

Actually thinking about it FA can be a scum read. I found his entrance awkward, he then froze only to appear later pushing RC for his claim in a totally nonsensical way. He then continues to scumread RC for wanting to policy lynch him in a way that makes me feel like he knows RCs alignment. RC and FA are not SvS unless this is some dramatic scum theatre but I don't see why FA would inflate the suspicion already on RC this early.

Also, now instead of assessing my play as a whole to get a read on me he just nitpicks the post where I found him scummy in a way that feels defensive. If you were objective town you wouldn't feel the need to ask me designed questions to throw shade on me, when I'm cleary a threat to scum by being a player who easily obv.towns. I also dislike that your push on me is half-hearted, with no conclusion and no vote.

VOTE: FA_q2

asking for reasoning is nitpicking?

We have reached a new level of silly.

[FA_Q2]

Clearly RC is not going to be sorted today. I don't like the Havo and garmr wagons at all. What the hell is up with all the damn OMGUS going on. The interaction from Havo responding to DT looks town to me. Not sure how to sort DT from it though. Both him and sau seem to be just trowing shit around and OMGUS.

I think CT case on IAI is decent for this early as well not to mention CT and havo are my only townreads atm. Looking back through his ISO I cant find a reason he is voting CT either other than it is a bigger wagon. He also disappeared as soon as CT laid his case out and has not replied since. Then his wagon melts away...
VOTE: IAI

Where the hell is horrordude? He has yet to post anything of actual substance. Reads? Same at you skygazer. You are still voting for the

amazing

reason of 'entrance' and that was just straight out stolen from wh4t. That was crap reasoning then, even worse reasoning now.


Still not liking sau but liking IAI much less. Could easily vote gazer as well.

[FA_Q2]

@texcat then why not put the pressure there?

[FA_Q2]

I am here and I will do some catch up soon. I am sick as a dog today though and can barely function.

[FA_Q2]

I can get behind a texcat wagon. Your ISO is utterly blank texcat - you are essentially actively lurking and have not responded to anything, You come back right away with an OMGUS vote and still no actual comments on anything.

Almost to scummy to be scum - almost but not quite. Not sure about the garmr wagon - I don't see what is particularly scummy there. Sure, the claim was garbage but it was a vt claim - essentially the same thing as stating town. It does not narrow scum search for pr roles because there is no reason to think that he is a vt over a pr if not scum - prs would make the same statement at that point. I do not know about the enormous amount of budding going on either.

Don't like the gazer or w4at slots but cannot really put my finger on why. Going to have to go through their iso a few times again.

[FA_Q2]

VOTE: texcat[/unvote]

[FA_Q2]

oops

VOTE: texcat

[FA_Q2]

I can get behind a texcat wagon. Your ISO is utterly blank texcat - you are essentially actively lurking and have not responded to anything, You come back right away with an OMGUS vote and still no actual comments on anything.

Almost to scummy to be scum - almost but not quite. Not sure about the garmr wagon - I don't see what is particularly scummy there. Sure, the claim was garbage but it was a vt claim - essentially the same thing as stating town. It does not narrow scum search for pr roles because there is no reason to think that he is a vt over a pr if not scum - prs would make the same statement at that point. I do not know about the enormous amount of budding going on either.

Don't like the gazer or w4at slots but cannot really put my finger on why. Going to have to go through their iso a few times again.

I disagree that my iso is totally blank. And wtf do you think I have not responded to? This is total bullshit. Are you chainsawing for TheWorst?

Anyone can read your ISO.

I don't really care what you think of it, there is almost nothing there. Then there is little content like in 352 that is a bunch of wish washy nonsense. You were justifying a read and then launching into an explanation of why it really was not a solid read. Plying the middle.

And how do you think that I am chainsawing anyone?

As far as not responding, you have not responded to the game in general. I really have no idea who you actually are scum reading and who you are town reading. I can see who you OMGUS though.

[FA_Q2]

And I have confirmed knowledge of Jk so preumably I can live into the game

You're stupid, you're in the NRG and aren't aware of the possibility of enabler without the accompanying role?

He claims knowledge that the JK exists...

[FA_Q2]

And I have confirmed knowledge of Jk so preumably I can live into the game

*sigh*

[FA_Q2]

FA, why do you think there is an enormous amount of buddying going on? Also, who do you think the scumteam is trying to pocket if that is the case?

enormous is the wrong term. Blatant is more like it. RC/Gazer, sau/dt.

As I said, I don't know what to make of it. Mostly because it is so blatant. I would expect to see possibly 1 attempt that was veiled. We have a few slots outright stating it and no comments on the interactions. I find it odd.

[FA_Q2]

Texcat is a better. Gazer and W4at Are also scum. I am good with any of these 3. TW does not come off as scummy to me.

[FA_Q2]

Fa, why does the Worst not come of as scummy to you? Also, can you please elaborate on why you think Wh4t and Texcat are both members of the scumteam? They have hardly any significant interactions with each other.

Those are the three most scummy to me. Pre-flip associations are idiotic - particularly on day one when a mislynch is more likely than on any other day.

[FA_Q2]

Fa, why does the Worst not come of as scummy to you? Also, can you please elaborate on why you think Wh4t and Texcat are both members of the scumteam? They have hardly any significant interactions with each other.

Nothing has really pinged either way with TW yes. That slot is pretty empty on content but it does feel like it is a posting style rather than a try and hide style. Right now TW is pretty null. Texcat is almost as empty but those posts read much more like scum trying to look like they are trying without really contributing. Even texcat's reaction to my post was 'nu-uh' rather than 'here is useful content.'

[FA_Q2]

also FA has been around and just hasn't posted here and I think he's given up so, let's get on this.

I have not given up but there is nothing for me to post here. My entire wagon is based on a bunch of people blindly seeping your vote - a vote that started with you wanting to PL me without cause, from a slot that has lied several times blatantly so, tunnels me for no damn reason, blatantly states will not vote for SCUMREADS, and then bases all their posts around a shit pre-associative flip on day one. And yes, my wagon materialized and shot up. You did not work for it, you just asked town to blindly follow you off a cliff.

Newsflash RC, I am town.

[FA_Q2]

It is because we are masons.

[FA_Q2]

RC you fucking dolt.

I am done. Someone just fucking hammer me already so that I can flip over town mason and RC can just fuck off. I don't think you have ever read me correctly RC.