Open 737: Stack the Deck (Game Over)

[Gamma Emerald]

As you walk towards the casino, you can’t help but feel a rush of adrenaline course through your body from anticipation. Feeling energized, you strut into the building with thoughts of glory and prize money on your mind.

A tall, stern-looking man greets you as you walk in, but instead of leading you to a table, he quickly ushers you away from the floor and into a small, nondescript side room. You recognize some of your other competitors, sitting in silence and looking determined to avoid making eye contact with one another.

The same man walks to the front of the room and says, “I appreciate your patience. You must be wondering why we have brought you here today.

We have video footage of three masked figures breaking into the casino stockroom yesterday evening. Due to the high stakes nature of this event, we have suspended the competition until the perpetrators can be identified. As competitors with motive, you are now our primary suspects in this investigation.”

A few unintelligible murmurs resonate throughout the room, but the man clears his throat and continues, “Luckily, we can narrow down the pool of suspects a bit further. I have already questioned Creature, and he was able to provide a solid alibi for his whereabouts last night.”

---

Creature has been revealed as the Innocent Child.

THIS IS STUPID

[Gamma Emerald]

on balnace i don't think it's worth it for scum to take prs when they don't know which prs town will get or how those prs stack up against scum's prs

like i think any 4 of {tracker/bg/ic/rb/vig/goon cop} is kinda weak against scum joat from a scum perspective, as is 5 of the town prs against joat + daytalk

huh? I don't get whether you're saying they would or wouldn't go for joat

[Gamma Emerald]

Also how about we stop talking about how many prs we think scum can claim

whoa what's your damage
scum would know this anyway

[Gamma Emerald]

Suppose you're a scum at L1 and you have to decide what to claim, you have information that town will probably believe n+1 PRs existing, so you claim PR

Let me reiterate.
If scum are thinking of claiming PR, it's based on whether they picked modifiers, not what setup spec is done. So your paranoia is unfounded.

[Gamma Emerald]

im assuming that creature just gets obvtowned early on?

yeah if creature doesn't fall into lurkerdom, he's town so kind of a waste of IC but thems the breaks

i like ruru's entrance

a50's not so much

VOTE: a50

why

[Gamma Emerald]

Sky's entrance to the game is alarming. Everything she said so far "could" be interpreted as a mere joke. However -in my experience- joking about lynching the IC always comes from scum. And her last post/joke is even more alarming. I feel like it's been made for the sole purpose of declaring herself as the true traitor. It's as if she took ruru's earlier post about the traitor as an inquiry and is responding to it in fashion.

So,

my case on Sky is she is the Traitor

Sir, don't do this to me. I will not hesitate to tell the class why I think this is wrong, especially from you.

[Gamma Emerald]

It's also awkward that I've ended those last 2 post's with "for now"... I'm tired, goodnight.

no one cares. Why do you care?

[Gamma Emerald]

also sky, y change your profile to include "im town" in it?
just now noticed that

I also notice that's a turtle duck the face is on
that's some class

[Gamma Emerald]

VOTE: Almost50
this feels right

[Gamma Emerald]

Sky's entrance to the game is alarming. Everything she said so far "could" be interpreted as a mere joke. However -in my experience- joking about lynching the IC always comes from scum. And her last post/joke is even more alarming. I feel like it's been made for the sole purpose of declaring herself as the true traitor. It's as if she took ruru's earlier post about the traitor as an inquiry and is responding to it in fashion.

So,

my case on Sky is she is the Traitor

Sir, don't do this to me. I will not hesitate to tell the class why I think this is wrong, especially from you.

idt i see it
care to explain?

It's a meta read, but I prefer not to give it unless necessary because it involves outing an alt

[Gamma Emerald]

i have some preliminary reads going on but id like to get more posts from everyone else before i post it
half of u are null because u havent posted a lot
also gamma can u explain without outing an alt?

Maybe, but even then I want A50 to respond first

[Gamma Emerald]

As you walk towards the casino, you can’t help but feel a rush of adrenaline course through your body from anticipation. Feeling energized, you strut into the building with thoughts of glory and prize money on your mind.

A tall, stern-looking man greets you as you walk in, but instead of leading you to a table, he quickly ushers you away from the floor and into a small, nondescript side room. You recognize some of your other competitors, sitting in silence and looking determined to avoid making eye contact with one another.

The same man walks to the front of the room and says, “I appreciate your patience. You must be wondering why we have brought you here today.

We have video footage of three masked figures breaking into the casino stockroom yesterday evening. Due to the high stakes nature of this event, we have suspended the competition until the perpetrators can be identified. As competitors with motive, you are now our primary suspects in this investigation.”

A few unintelligible murmurs resonate throughout the room, but the man clears his throat and continues, “Luckily, we can narrow down the pool of suspects a bit further. I have already questioned Creature, and he was able to provide a solid alibi for his whereabouts last night.”

---

Creature has been revealed as the Innocent Child.

THIS IS STUPID

Me being IC or the font?

both

[Gamma Emerald]

i think scum were very likely to take:daytalk, joat and rolecop if they took three

I'd just do recruit mafia traitor, at most do daytalk too.

that just gives goon cop more guilties, along with greater chance of it being rolled

[Gamma Emerald]

It's a meta read, but I prefer not to give it unless necessary because it involves outing an alt

Both of my alts are outed to most players I play regularly with. I have been referred to as "AP" in this very game too, so go ahead if you wish to..

So you don't choose to respond to my actual read, but the possibility of me outing your alt?

[Gamma Emerald]

It's also awkward that I've ended those last 2 post's with "for now"... I'm tired, goodnight.

no one cares. Why do you care?

*tries not to cry*

I meant you seemed self conscious, sorry

[Gamma Emerald]

I meant you seemed self conscious, sorry

ok....... but it doesn't feel scummy or even remarkable to me. to steal skitter's terminology, frank's entrance seems kind of "just is" to me.

the only interesting thing you've done so far is vote a50. why are you doing that?

I don't think A50's perspective on those voting the IC seems real.

[Gamma Emerald]

So you don't choose to respond to my actual read, but the possibility of me outing your alt?

I'm not quite sure what you expect me to say. If you have an argument you are welcome to use it. I do recall faking a guilty on someone who flipped townie (and I presume that's the game you're referring to) but I don't recall voting a confirmed IC while I was fully aware of their status.

I'm not saying you did it, I'm saying I'm pretty sure you've born witness to town doing it.

[Gamma Emerald]

im not sure on a50
im currently scumleaning him

i find the scumreading the vla player

the scummiest out of all of them tho
also @a50, only use latter for two people

yeah i think this is kinda scummy too

Well I think he would have a valid point if MWNN weren't VLA

[Gamma Emerald]

i dont like these posts
"ill explain y its wrong"
"haha jk i dont wanna out an alt"
please explain the reasoning and for future reference, if it involving outting an alt, dont say u have reasoning unless the alts been outed already

It makes sense to me
Don't make me have to give the explanation on why this is wrong > I don't want to out your alt
Does that not seem logical?
As for the actual logic I remember a game where someone joked about lynching the IC, A50's alt didn't comment on it as far as I remember, but it definitely was brought to everyone's attention for a little bit and the person who made the joke is someone who I definitely remember being town that game, so it's wrong for A50 to be acting like this here.

[Gamma Emerald]

i'm not entirely sure why you won't source this ...

Because the game is slowing down and I don't want to fall into apathy so I decided to pick a fight. Do you want to fight with me?

why not fight with me

[Gamma Emerald]

i dont like these posts
"ill explain y its wrong"
"haha jk i dont wanna out an alt"
please explain the reasoning and for future reference, if it involving outting an alt, dont say u have reasoning unless the alts been outed already

It makes sense to me
Don't make me have to give the explanation on why this is wrong > I don't want to out your alt
Does that not seem logical?
As for the actual logic I remember a game where someone joked about lynching the IC, A50's alt didn't comment on it as far as I remember, but it definitely was brought to everyone's attention for a little bit and the person who made the joke is someone who I definitely remember being town that game, so it's wrong for A50 to be acting like this here.

ur logic doesnt make sense to me, so please, enlighten me

Since I didn't want to have to out the alt, I didn't want to have to give the full reasoning.
DO YOU GET IT?

[Gamma Emerald]

I don't think that one is? He can tell me whether it is, he should know which game I'm talking about. I'm going to drop a name from the game, he should be able to locate it with that.
Frederick A Campbell
PEdit: I gave a fairly clear explanation and you STILL didn't get it. Yeah I got miffed.

[Gamma Emerald]

A50, verify that the alt I'm referencing is or is not outed.

[Gamma Emerald]

no godfather mod for scum to take

goon cop only gets guilties on mafia goons

[Gamma Emerald]

I don't think that one is? He can tell me whether it is, he should know which game I'm talking about. I'm going to drop a name from the game, he should be able to locate it with that.

I know the game but I;m not sure I want to check back, Anyway, I am "AP" and I am "Judge Joseph Dredd" (I believe the latter is the one in question?)

P.S. I used "latter" correctly!

Yes
And to make things 100% clear at this point, the game is Open 717

[Gamma Emerald]

I don't think that one is? He can tell me whether it is, he should know which game I'm talking about. I'm going to drop a name from the game, he should be able to locate it with that.

I know the game but I;m not sure I want to check back, Anyway, I am "AP" and

I am "Judge Joseph Dredd" (I believe the latter is the one in question?)

P.S. I used "latter" correctly!

wait this is you ???

Hahahaha forgot you two also had a game together (Splatoon Mafia)

[Gamma Emerald]

OK wtf is all this vig talk, I missed something

[Gamma Emerald]

Can someone point me to the start of this vig talk?

[Gamma Emerald]

Why would scum!me be baiting the Vig shot at all????

Was this brought up before this point, because this made me think this WASN'T the start.

[Gamma Emerald]

Now I kind of want to lynch frank and lynch hws if he reds

GE might be designated mislynch?

lolwut
only Frank has expressed serious suspicion of me as of yet?

[Gamma Emerald]

Thing A

We're voting on vig shots

This is a good thing because:

• PRs can claim so they don't get shot (note: if you are a PR lined up to be vigged and either you're vig or feel there is a low chance of vig existing, you can and possibly should claim vt)
  
• Individuals are biased and have varying levels of competence and therefore tend to have worse reads than the majority on average
  
• More associative reads

Thing B

1. Please read this if you haven't

https://www.mafiauniverse.com/forums/th ... (by-Yates)

2. We're doing it starting tomorrow

And I'm policy lynching you if you don't, even if you're a cute baby monkey!

3. We're doing it right

How to pick cop/hypocop targets:

• Unlikely lynch
  
• Unlikely nightkill
  
• Useful if town
  
• Dangerous if scum
  
• Hard to read

DO NOT TRY TO LYNCH YOUR HYPO-INNO

GC can give false negatives but if you think someone is lockscum such that you will read them as scum PR or traitor despite a GC inno, you probably shouldn't be copping them which means you probably shouldn't be hypocopping them

Occasionally hypoclaiming "either I was roleblocked or I investigated a dead player" is also worthwhile as it could happen to the real GC (and scum don't know who was roleblocked anyway)

IDK about either of these
especially the latter because we may not even have cop
hypocop is used to get cop results out without the cop being outed, that way if they die by bad luck, town isn't screwed. I do at least like your awareness of roleblocking happening.

[Gamma Emerald]

What standards are those so we can get a little more specific

I dunno. You're NOT using any.

Also,

IF SOMEONE CLAIMS A PR TODAY

DO NOT CC

Spoiler: Here's why:

Generally speaking, doomed scum will fake a claim to out the most dangerous PR (if exists) according to the modifications (or lack thereof) they picked. If that PR isn't in the game then there will be no CC anyway. Now let me not go into too much details and go straight to the point:

- Claiming Vigilante when a Town Vig does exist = Just shoot the claimer. If they're BP we'll deal with it on D2, but there is always a chance the Vig will kill the scum w.o. the need to out themselves.

- Claiming Bodyguard: Chances are he BG will flip sometime during the game anyway, so we will know it was a fake claim. (Actually this one "may claim if they want to", since they're dying anyway, and most probably protecting the IC, so I'll leave it to your best judgement)

- Claiming Tracker: Obviously we want results from the Tracker, and the longer they live the more reliable their results will be, so no need to eat a bullet on N1 in exchange of lynching a scumster on D1. I hope you know what to do in this case though.

- Claiming Roleblocker: Also more valuable towards the game end. Best play is to block the fake claimer thus forcing scum to use someone else to do the kill AND making them lose their modification if they have one.

- Claiming Goon Cop: This role is intended to find us at least one scum if it could. If the fake claimer is a goon (and the only one) then you should claim, but how do we know that? Best play is to try and find others (if any) and if you get shot we will know whom to lynch anyway, but if you do get a guilty on someone else then that's when you claim and you give us TWO scums instead of just one.

If you disagree with any of this, feel free to do what you will, but

please

don't discuss alternative strategies. Discussing certain details may still give your role away w.o. even the need for scum to fake claim anything.

Thanks for your attention.

2/10

UNVOTE:

VOTE: Almost50

You can't yell don't talk spec after this lol.
Your vote stinks too

I think the analysis works fine

[Gamma Emerald]

Someone entertain me

how?

[Gamma Emerald]

I feel like Vex is definitely town from his efforts, not sure about anyone else

[Gamma Emerald]

I feel like Vex is definitely town from his efforts, not sure about anyone else

"Effort is alignment indicative, but only for Vex"

Its not the effort itself, but it's directed towards that I townread. He seems dedicated to advancing the game in a pro town way

[Gamma Emerald]

I feel like Vex is definitely town from his efforts, not sure about anyone else

"Effort is alignment indicative, but only for Vex"

Its not the effort itself, but it's directed towards that I townread. He seems dedicated to advancing the game in a pro town way

And I'm not?

First off when did effort become a thing in how I read you? Secondly you haven't seemed too dedicated to that motive, but I know that won't really help me read you, you have your own way of doing things.

[Gamma Emerald]

This is going over my head you guys

[Gamma Emerald]

Because in the universe where you think exactly the same way as me it would make you.me townread me.me except that's not actually how logic works so whatever

Ok I like this insight into ruru's own personal bias

[Gamma Emerald]

No
Your awareness of you trying to apply your way of thinking to skitter impresses me

[Gamma Emerald]

VOTE: Enigma

I'd actually forgotten he was in the game

[Gamma Emerald]

1. Don't CC any fake claims
2. Vote for who you want to (hypo) vig with hurt tags
3. Hypo cop results tomorrow

UNVOTE:
Waiting a bit

whoa, you're just running with ruru's plan?

[Gamma Emerald]

1. Don't CC any fake claims
2. Vote for who you want to (hypo) vig with hurt tags
3. Hypo cop results tomorrow

UNVOTE:
Waiting a bit

whoa, you're just running with ruru's plan?

Yeh? It benefits town?

well no one has responded to my reservations yet.

[Gamma Emerald]

Your reservation about there not being a cop in the game? Well if there is no cop, then there is little benefit but if there is a cop it is helpful. Plus it forces scum to put something on the table and potential discussions about choice of targets, so thats is a benefit regardless of cop/no cop. I mean do you have any reservations about downsides?

Well if there is no cop, scum could deduce that from hypo results and determine that it's a safe fakeclaim. Plus homesite meta generally makes me uneasy about hypocop except when it's proven effective (like in cop 13Ps on MU)

[Gamma Emerald]

Your reservation about there not being a cop in the game? Well if there is no cop, then there is little benefit but if there is a cop it is helpful. Plus it forces scum to put something on the table and potential discussions about choice of targets, so thats is a benefit regardless of cop/no cop. I mean do you have any reservations about downsides?

Well if there is no cop, scum could deduce that from hypo results and determine that it's a safe fakeclaim. Plus homesite meta generally makes me uneasy about hypocop except when it's proven effective (like in cop 13Ps on MU)

Well I think its quite difficult for scum to deduce the existence of a cop from hypo-claims because they have to POE all the town slots which could potentially have it and that is something they can't do very easily early game, and by late game we have already got most the benefits if a real cop exists.

I think you might have a point given the role isn't like a regular cop
gfdi where's Mathdino when you need him

[Gamma Emerald]

I think you might have a point given the role isn't like a regular cop

That's why I said this skitter
because of the way it works, hypoing is a little different

[Gamma Emerald]

1. Don't CC any fake claims
2. Vote for who you want to (hypo) vig with hurt tags
3. Hypo cop results tomorrow

UNVOTE:
Waiting a bit

whoa, you're just running with ruru's plan?

It's actually best this way. If there a vig they could still do their own thing at their own risk though.

HURT: Antihero

P.S. I'm assuming Frank is today's lynch though. If not then HURT: Frank

I'd love to get Mathdino's opinion on this but A50 is a good option too
not sure who I'd want vigged rn

[Gamma Emerald]

I meant your opinion on the strategy, did you not read the second line

[Gamma Emerald]

Mathdino's playing?

No, but I wish he was, he'd break this setup in no time flat

[Gamma Emerald]

Some peoe form reads differently/at different rates

[Gamma Emerald]

This game's awful

How about you interact with other slots?

[Gamma Emerald]

Actually how about this

VOTE: Skygazer
HURT: Frank

ellitell and frank needs to die but sky is more likely to be bp I think

Who are you calling ellitell on
If it's mwnn then you may have something since last time someone call that on him they were right

[Gamma Emerald]

a50 what are your thoughts on sky ellitelling

Ok how did sky ellitell

[Gamma Emerald]

Nvm
I can get behind the analysis presented rn

[Gamma Emerald]

@GE

the slots that I'm most interested in right now (hws/sky/cjv) are all afk

well I guess I'm interested in this: how are you reading frank/hws/sky/antihero/enigma?

I'm actually pretty interested in your answer here

Frank I'm not sure on, I don't really get the hate
hws kinda feels like something is amiss
sky I think the inactivity is not really indicative of anything, but I don't really know what to make of their content yet
antihero I haven't seen a reason to be skeptical of yet
Enigma has felt lurky, I'd forgotten h was in the game until someone else mentioned him and he seems to have slipped back away.

[Gamma Emerald]

Scum should worry about me is if we end up flipping scum.

wat

[Gamma Emerald]

u, urself screwed urself over by saying those reads were rushed, but yet u had a couple of hours to answer questions.
last i checked, if people are happy with ur lynch because u arent posting content, ud focus more time on actually making the reads, not trying to look productive by posting rushed reads, and then saying that u had a couple of hours to answer questions.

had u not said that those reads were rushed, id probably have dismissed it, yet by the fact u said they were rushed, it proves to me u are scum.

this makes sense to me

[Gamma Emerald]

I want to move my vote off A50 but I don't recall him responding to my actually presentation of the game that should counter his philosophy about how scum interact with ICs

[Gamma Emerald]

Null. His posting can might as well come from both alignments. I had trouble imagining him as either town or scum because it doesn't matter if his posts are genuine or not, it's still true.

I need to read more.

Only thing that look town to me so far is his meta read on A50. I think he really believed in it.

So your saying you agree with all the things I'm saying?

[Gamma Emerald]

also, for main, i looked back through your alts, uve only played in one game of mine, (that was under AP). i thought u had played in another game i had modded unless ur hiding another alt on me. that one is just on me then

I figured it out i think; ive only seen the wall o' reads like that once before but I didnt think it was you given that the town and overall posting style are drastically different; would never have guessed that tbh

:3

im gonna assume a few things here:
i'm assuming you're talking about MD's jungle republic, namely, post 229, made by Korina when you say "the wall o' reads", which would mean, you're thinking my main is Korina.

which, yea, you're right on that. i am korina.
i just needed the right motivation to actually sit down and play knowing i wont get instantly pl'd just for being in the game.
the wonders of not pling me are amazing because you get towngames like this from me where i put forth serious amounts of effort into gamesolving.

anyways, yea, i'm korina. my reads list was the post i was thinking would certainly give me away, and to a lesser degree, calling a50 "monkey-boye", (something in my sig, plus only 7 other posts, (excluding this one) have the word "boye" in them.)

im an amazing player when i have motivation to play well.

I'm gonna read you back then because you should have input on my A50 read in that case

[Gamma Emerald]

wall coming with my full case on sky later tonight

pedit: that was the goal monkey boye, try to make sure people dont realize its me until i said it was me.

so, one of the major reasons why i was hesitant on posting this case in the first place is because i was drawing from my own scum-meta, which meant i had to out myself first. you guys can see why i would be kinda hesitating on doing that, mainly since im playing under an alt.
so, whats my case on sky and why does it involve my meta?

a lot of it comes from skys posting, namely elsewhere on the forums. (im also getting close to the "dont talk about on-going games" rule with this post)
looking through skys posts, ive noticed a lot more posts in other games, but not in this one. that means a lot to me.
what does that mean?

it means sky is avoiding this game to some degree.

what motivation does town really have to try to avoid a game they're in? barely any, if town even does.
what motivation does scum really have to try to avoid a game they're in? a lot of motivation actually.

this is where my own self-meta comes into play here: as scum, i tend to stay quiet and try to lurk as much as possible only because it helps minimize the chances of me scumslipping and plus i'm always waiting for something i can turn around on the others to frame them. it also feels very natural for me to lurk as scum, versus town which just feels like "why am i even in this game rn" if i try to lurk out

i see the same logic here as to why sky would put forth more posts in other games but not so much in this game.
now, before anyone tries to say "what if sky is demotivated?", sky could always replace-out if that was the case. yet, i havent seen any requests to replace-out from sky yet.

because sky is lurking so much in this game, yet is active in other games, (making post 620 a bold-faced lie), it really makes me believe that sky is intentionally trying to lurk the entire game as sort of a "i dont know how to play this role" type thing in a hope to try to not get lynched.
i forgot who said the same thing, presuming that sky was the traitor, but whoever did, yea, that's the point i'm going at with this. i think sky is certainly scum and doesn't know how to play traitor.

sky has a total of twenty posts. none of them feel like they have anything to contribute. they all feel like (to me at least) they all are just rehashing the same things we already know. a lot of her posts feel hollow. they dont have anything to them, its just an empty shell. nothing more. now, could it be that sky is just pulling a nm here and just being a jester? yes, but that means sky should get hung or vig'd at some point sooner rather than later.

the "im watching avatar" post is the one that pings me the most, (followed by her reads, which (i forgot who said it but), feel really

really

safe imo.) she only said she was watching avatar in here, coupled with the fact shes said that she'll do things, but in actuality she never has, (135), makes her slot feel incredibly weird to me. ik based on her activity in other games, she can do better than what she currently is doing, but yet, seemingly is actively refusing to do better, making her slot feel very very weird to me.

i dont see sky really putting any effort into gamesolving. posts 288 and 289 also feel really really weird with that in mind. we already know that Creature is the ic, and if she had a group of people (or is pro-town), why

wouldn't

she list another name that wasn't creature, unless shes scum and didnt have them ready and was stalling for time?

with all of this being said, i think {frank, sky} are scum. we hang frank today, shoot sky tonight (if we have a vig), if not, we can hang her tomorrow

I think I'd prefer to hang sky, shoot frank, but even then I'm tentative on Frank
VOTE: Skygazer
HURT: frank

[Gamma Emerald]

i like ruru's entrance

Explain?

also ....
pedit: sigh

(☞ ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)☞

Sky's entrance to the game is alarming. Everything she said so far "could" be interpreted as a mere joke. However -in my experience- joking about lynching the IC always comes from scum. And her last post/joke is even more alarming. I feel like it's been made for the sole purpose of declaring herself as the true traitor. It's as if she took ruru's earlier post about the traitor as an inquiry and is responding to it in fashion.

So,

my case on Sky is she is the Traitor

how confident are you in sky being the traitor?

pageget

VOTE: Vex

o i c this escalated very quickly

Yeah so you should honestly get pinged more by A50's logic imo, you were in the game that I was referring to, you were in fact the IC that game

[Gamma Emerald]

Gamma why are you focusing so much on the 'town doesnt joke about voting tje ic' point from a50; it's one thing he said in RVS and you're talking about it almost to the exclusion of everything else that's happened in this game, and you've voteparked him over it

Like your response to what he did feels overblown given that you're not interacting with like any other part of the game really

Well it's something that is burned into my mind, and I like trying to interact with people via getting them to think about relevance to previous games
Recall how I pressed certain people in American Presidents mafia about connections to another game? Same idea as this.

[Gamma Emerald]

Yeah so you should honestly get pinged more by A50's logic imo, you were in the game that I was referring to, you were in fact the IC that game

im not really seeing what you're getting at here with a50s logic.
care to explain?

I went to explain this and then I realized where the split in what I'm seeing and reality is. I forgot OK Nyeo's vote on you in the C9++ wasn't really joking

[Gamma Emerald]

I'm holding off voting for a Vig shot. My choice would greatly depend on the CJV flip AND who is on/off the wagon then.

That said, I'd recommend leaving Frank alone for tonight. Tomorrow we can pursue our quest in light of the flip(s) of both CJV and the night kill(s).

I don't like the vig plan anymore
traitor is bp right? so that means trying to vig the traitor probably isn't smart play, and that also means a lack of vig kill may lead to bad speculation about the setup.

[Gamma Emerald]

like does this affect your read on a50 at all?

Yeah actually, it completely negates the point

[Gamma Emerald]

like does this affect your read on a50 at all?

Yeah actually, it completely negates the point

right, that's my point - if it negates your point, why am i dragging out of you how this realization affects your read on him?

I'd already pretty much come to that conclusion. Is my vote still on him, if not why go this far?

[Gamma Emerald]

I think I'd prefer to hang sky, shoot frank, but even then I'm tentative on Frank
VOTE: Skygazer
HURT: frank

I'm not counting this vote, since Skygazer has been replaced.

VOTE: the worst

[Gamma Emerald]

i mean, for d1, what better information do we really have to work off of apart from hanging the scummiest one?
i agree, hanging the scummiest one each day isnt very optimal, but we dont know if sky is traitor.
i think sky is certainly scum, im not sure if shes traitor, but it would make sense on this if she is

my major thing for wanting frank lynch over sky lynch is that if we hang sky (the presumed traitor), we still have two groupscum left alive.
if we hang frank (the presumed groupscum member), we have a presumed traitor, and a groupscum still alive.
id much rather lose a potential vig kill n1 to ensure we get a vig kill n2 versus having two groupscum alive, and getting no vig kill n1/2 if that makes sense

this is the post that made me not on board with the vig plan anymore btw

[Gamma Emerald]

i also think that skys replaceout was tactical

Check Ban/Restrictions Announcement thread postgame then.

huh?

[Gamma Emerald]

FOS Buj as well but despite being a friend I don't have as strong a feel for his scumgame

skitter is pinging town on second impressions but I will only have a good read on her when I read the game chronologically T_T

explain the Bu fos?

[Gamma Emerald]

I'm holding off voting for a Vig shot. My choice would greatly depend on the CJV flip AND who is on/off the wagon then.

That said, I'd recommend leaving Frank alone for tonight. Tomorrow we can pursue our quest in light of the flip(s) of both CJV and the night kill(s).

I don't like the vig plan anymore
traitor is bp right? so that means trying to vig the traitor probably isn't smart play, and that also means a lack of vig kill may lead to bad speculation about the setup.

So who do you think is the traitor then? And what makes you think the traitor exists?
You are voting sky based on vex's case, which said that sky/tw is probably the traitor - you are voting for this slot, which is the optimal play if that is correct. If you believe sky/tw is the traitor, then why disagree with the vig plan?

Any comments on tw's entrance and play so far?

The vig plan has nothig to do with what I believe may be in the setup, it has to do with what may be in the setup. Let's say we don't have a vig. That means it's very possible we may conclude wrongly the vig target is a traitor. Now this depends on the town assuming this, but given how everyone's been playing, I have no faith in this town to not go apeshit.

[Gamma Emerald]

Gamma comment on the worst plss

I don't see anything exceptional from him

[Gamma Emerald]

OK that makes sense wrt vig plan. As for duckling, I'm voting him because he has to actually work to get my suspicion off him. I already said I didn't think anything he'd posted up to now has been good enough to make me reconsider.

[Gamma Emerald]

Almost50 (3): BuJaber, Gamma Emerald, FrankJaeger

s k e t c h y
funnily enough i'm actually scrolling through open 711 right now and a50 was pretty 'out there' that game but i don't think any scum actually ever voted him before his n1 demise
i'm more invested in skitter/me interactions rn, I don't think there's a whole lot to read into it

but yeah the a50 wagon sucks and all 3 of these guys should feel bad for not voting for an actual scumfuck

Read the full vc you wingnut

[Gamma Emerald]

What do you think about BuJaber?

I had a SR on Antihero, and BiJ didn't post much to make me change my mind tbh

Yeah I think Bu prolly needs death
Can we CFD Bu?

[Gamma Emerald]

Can we just lynch one of CJ and frank, and move onto other stuff the next day? There is no plurality this game. This day is nearly two weeks already....
If Frank/CJ flip town, my bet is on at least one scum in the lurkers/non-voters HWS, GE, BuJ

How an I a lurker/non-voter, my vote has been in play most of the game, and I have been active for the most part, sorry I can't keep up with some of you spamfucks.

[Gamma Emerald]

OK that makes sense wrt vig plan. As for duckling, I'm voting him because he has to actually work to get my suspicion off him. I already said I didn't think anything he'd posted up to now has been good enough to make me reconsider.

why are you considering that slot in the first place .... ?

i asked you this already and you didn't answer ....

I think the ellitell actually may mean something. And I'm pretty sure I explained it somewhere. At this point you look like you're asking questions but don't care one bit for answers.

[Gamma Emerald]

I guess something along these lines:

{Creature, me}
{Vex}
{A50, skitter}
{Ruru, TW}
-----null line----
{Gamma, cjv}
{Enigma}
{HWS, Frank}

Lol who puts themselves in their own readlist

Several people. Why does it matter?

[Gamma Emerald]

sky I think the inactivity is not really indicative of anything, but I don't really know what to make of their content yet

last time you mentioned sky before you voted her

That was when the suspicion started
ruru posted a case that actually swayed me later

[Gamma Emerald]

your conclusion after ruru made her case is that 'i think the inactiviy is not really indicative of anything'

and then didn't mention the slot until you voted her after she repped out

Keep in mind I said I could get behind it as well, I just didn't really think it meant much at that moment

[Gamma Emerald]

All I want is for the day to end to get a flip that I can work on. BuJaber's wall does feel town though and he did put some great effort in it. I still don't see Enigma as scum here, but many of my TRs are skeptical about him which should give me pause, but -again- I need a flip to be bale to reevaluate my reads efficiently.

As of now the scum team is probably Frank+CJV+HWS (for some reason I want Gamma to be Town in this game).

explain hws? I mean he hasn't done much either way but he's voting me rather than someone who might reasonably be lynched today so he's not helping, which makes me amenable to the idea

[Gamma Emerald]

VOTE COUNT 1.21

Almost50 (1):

FrankJaeger

HeWhoSwims (0):

the worst (2):

Gamma Emerald, Creature

ruru (0):

BuJaber (0):

ceejayvinoya (1):

the worst

Enigma (0):

FrankJaeger (5):

Enigma, skitter30, ruru, Almost50, Vex Vience

(L-2)

Creature (0):

Gamma Emerald (1):

HeWhoSwims

skitter30 (0):

Vex Vience (0):

Not Voting (2):

ceejayvinoya, BuJaber

With

12

alive, it takes

7

to lynch.

Deadline paused until FrankJaeger is replaced

Other

:
- skitter30 V/LA Fridays and Saturdays
- skitter30 also V/LA Sunday night - Tuesday night (9/11)

I don't think wagoning someone getting replaced is good with our current plan, they're better as a vig imo

[Gamma Emerald]

ok, got a few minutes now

this is the post that made me not on board with the vig plan anymore btw

how so?

I disliked the level of assumption I perceived in the post and figured that everyone would follow the plan like lemmings

Now this depends on the town assuming this,

but given how everyone's been playing, I have no faith in this town to not go apeshit.

wdym gamma?

The way everyone assumed there was a vig made me think they'd continue making assumption, however someone presented a good counter so I'm fine with the plan now

What do you think about BuJaber?

I had a SR on Antihero, and BiJ didn't post much to make me change my mind tbh

Yeah I think Bu prolly needs death
Can we CFD Bu?

to hang him or to get him to claim?
im personally more fine with a frank / frank replacement lynch rn rather than a buj lynch

to hang, I don't like how in the background he is, his town meta is more active

[Gamma Emerald]

I was thinking him getting replaced would likely lead to the replacement having to read, which would likely result in deadline lynching. So the only sensible options are lynch without replacement or vig, or leave him for d2

[Gamma Emerald]

yeah I just realized I also seriously proposed leaving him as an option when I hit submit
I think that idea is good

[Gamma Emerald]

meh
VOTE: Frank
HURT: ceejay

[Gamma Emerald]

Is it bad to mention that I think the Vex Frank argument was sorta stupid and that I think scum in general would be bad off arguing against it as hard as Frank did? Except if it's bussing?

I think that’s a fair statement to make coming back into the thread actually

[Gamma Emerald]

I currently have magikarp as a pet

though if I ever decide to make psyduck my pet I could name it after you

Ducklett works better imo

[Gamma Emerald]

Start of page 6, going to sleep

I think you should claim first then

If I don't need to, then I wouldn't want to claim. That's not meant to be a soft btw
┐(￣ヘ￣)┌
Regardless of my role, I'm town, so giving out my role as VT would only make it easier for scum to PR-hunt (if there are any additional PRs) and I obviously shouldn't claim as a PR.

I don't really care how scummy my previous slot owner was, if I manage to save the slot without having to claim, then it's obviously more beneficial than if I do claim

so nah

I think this mindset is town-oriented, I replaced into a newbie with a similar mindset (was SE/IC level replacing a newb slot iirc)

[Gamma Emerald]

UNVOTE: Ejjinami

[Gamma Emerald]

I’d expect them to be more slippery about it
Ejjinami seems to be taking the burden on his shoulders

[Gamma Emerald]

well, more like he couldn't remember who he replaced; i think he'd know who replaced his partner

it doesn't feel faked to me, idk if i can explain that better

do you think hws is viggable? maybe lynch ceejay vig hws

unless you think we have enough time before ceejay replaces that we should be using that time

I would be down with this

[Gamma Emerald]

Skitter quote not meant to be there

[Gamma Emerald]

um not sure what 'radioactive wagon for scum' means so idk

he's just so nice and awesome and damn good at town and we mindmeld as tvt that i don't really want to lynch him and be wrong especially not day1

this is really wolfy actually

Y

[Gamma Emerald]

Hello!

I think this is the optimal vig shot

HURT: not mafia

Yes.
HURT: Not Mafia

[Gamma Emerald]

Hm tw could be Town

[Gamma Emerald]

so why are we not just lynching tw

why defend me like that as scum?

[Gamma Emerald]

VOTE: Not_Mafia
HURT: the worst

you know what, i think that works for me too

VOTE: notmafia
HURT: duckling

We all agree we’re trying to lynch people whose scumflip can give meaningful associations right? So why NM?

[Gamma Emerald]

I myself have considered replacing out but I joined specifically because I wanted to have a fun time so I’m gonna stick this one out

[Gamma Emerald]

this game will get funner
it's got a good list
= part of the problem with d1 xD

Huh?

[Gamma Emerald]

Hypo-inno ruru
Idk what skitter is asking about what I think of my posts

[Gamma Emerald]

Wait where would I have forgotten a partner?

[Gamma Emerald]

well, more like he couldn't remember who he replaced; i think he'd know who replaced his partner

it doesn't feel faked to me, idk if i can explain that better

do you think hws is viggable? maybe lynch ceejay vig hws

unless you think we have enough time before ceejay replaces that we should be using that time

I would be down with this

VOTE: Not_Mafia
HURT: the worst

you know what, i think that works for me too

VOTE: notmafia
HURT: duckling

We all agree we’re trying to lynch people whose scumflip can give meaningful associations right? So why NM?

also these two posts don't read like a partner to me it's like he forgot they were even the same slot

I don’t see how this equals me forgetting who’s in the same slot
Was ceejay interacting with the other slots in a meaningful way?

[Gamma Emerald]

Were you aware Vex is Korina
Does that change anything

[Gamma Emerald]

I think skitter said it better than I could rn so just find his reaction to that fact

[Gamma Emerald]

VOTE: the worst

[Gamma Emerald]

On a naked vote? Sure, sound batshit insane

[Gamma Emerald]

wtf is a fnord

[Gamma Emerald]

HWS was TOWNY AF

A50... mostly clown shoes..

Hws suspicion was well founded despite what you say captain hindsight. Also Im pretty sure HWS wasn't the only one sus of A50...

Towny how lmao

[Gamma Emerald]

You know what that’s a fair response
I also like how you took my guff with substantial rebuff
You can be Town

[Gamma Emerald]

I voted tw as a joke vote
But I think he’s a decent vote anyway, ruru’s case is pretty hefty

[Gamma Emerald]

Gamma Emerald (4): Creature, Bujaber, Alonzo, the worst (L-2)

this is an icky wagon

At least two town are on there (both mechanically and via my reads)
Do you think Bu, tw, Alonzo, or any combination of those are scum?

[Gamma Emerald]

How am I not in your townreads in that case?

[Gamma Emerald]

no

[Gamma Emerald]

@ofrhz gamma is due for prodding

Yeah I think there isn’t much new being presented
We need a lynch

[Gamma Emerald]

Wait tw claimed a guilty where

[Gamma Emerald]

@Alonzo can you give one-word reads on {tw, bujaber, gamma, ejji, enigma}? just post them asap if you can and explain later

TLDR
sky/TW null-scum
bluJ/AH- Town lean
Gamma-scum lean
Frank/Ejji-Slow start but null-town
enigma-Town lean

While im here

ruru-Town lean
VV town lean

Wanna rr skitter before I complete that read.

Why do you have no strong reads

[Gamma Emerald]

problem I got is I always scumread Alonzo for shite like this and it's such a cliche scum play

like it'd be heaps easy for him to go "I'm p sure the worst is a wolf" and ride that train with y'all

but yeah I guess we should lynch him anyway if he doesn't start playing hard

Same
I want to scumread it but it’s a weak point, plus it’s playstyle related

[Gamma Emerald]

Part of me wants to NK spec
The other part is too lazy to do it

[Gamma Emerald]

Occum's razor would put scum in {you, hws} from the a50 flip but it's stupid as shit. he was just a good kill--he was not going to let the mislynch on me go through, had fast-moving reads and was set to reevaluate after d1 so

just a generally solid kill I think

Fair to suspect me for an a50 kill on principle
But I don’t think he was on my ass, which is generally why I’d kill him as scum
I do enjoy his company and honestly he has a bit of veteran’s curse

[Gamma Emerald]

@skitter that’s probably because idk what to think either
The only think keeping me from replacing out is me being dedicated to see this game through
I honestly wouldn’t mind being lynched but I still won’t take it lying down

[Gamma Emerald]

I named my larvitar in pokemon go after creature lmaooo but his IVs are lit so I wanna use him for slaughter

Fam that’s awesome

[Gamma Emerald]

Spoiler:

highest cp dude rn

Didn’t know Go had developed that much in that stats side
I may need to try it again
Problem is it over heats my phone, which in Florida is a compounded problem

[Gamma Emerald]

who plays scum self-sacrificially what

I'll need more than gut on enigma to townread him
Or at least I'll need enigma to come make my gut feel it too

fair point re:HWS but I think that if he was scum that makes it more likely the other scum tries to hop on the wagon, knowing that if they don't it'll be a pure wagon. Either way I think a scum on the wagon is likely, and that if I'm right on that it's either enigma or someone widely townread like vex or skitter
Leaning the former because of the fact that town functioned well enough to hit scum
What was the case on the red slot? Lurkiness? Or like a real case someone put forward?

Me sometimes

[Gamma Emerald]

gamma, whos next...?

Why are you fucking asking me, you’re scumreading me right? Plus I don’t really have any good suggestions because I don’t really care about this game

[Gamma Emerald]

Dont hate the player! I been rooting for you forever!

What does the second part mean?

[Gamma Emerald]

That’s not a very effective way to say that

[Gamma Emerald]

gamma, thoughts on bujaber please

Thinking Bu is town
Solving looks genuine imo

[Gamma Emerald]

Who's scum

tw and maybe enigma

[Gamma Emerald]

your progression on enigma feels kinda scummy, like you questioned a bunch of his posts before but never actually called him scum until he's getting pushed now

I actually suspected him D1 so that’s incorrect

[Gamma Emerald]

Thought I posted this before but at this point

VOTE: Enigma

I'd actually forgotten he was in the game

I was thinking Rnigma’s play was a bit UTR

[Gamma Emerald]

speaking of which,

HURT: the worst

I think this is correct regardless of how people are reading tw; if a vig exists, he's probably scum

I agree
VOTE: Enigma
HURT: the worst

[Gamma Emerald]

Yep, feeling like duck is scum bp, and if so GE is probably his scumbuddy.
VOTE: tw
HURT: tw

Yeah no this logic is extremely shitty on multiple levels

[Gamma Emerald]

Keep in mind traitor doesn’t get a choice

[Gamma Emerald]

I also highly doubt that Buj is that good to the point where he can play the exact same way as town or scum.

That's actually why I've been forcing myself to vary my play a little as town.

For what it's worth irrelephant seems townie atm. Better entrance than both his predecessors by miles at the very least.

I feel like tw should be easier to townread by now. I'm getting paranoid because imo his strength lies in knowing how to not appear scummy moreso than trying to look townie. That's my impression from giyga's curse. He won because people didn't really have a reason to suspect him.

Hm that makes my gears turn cos tw and bm were both scum there

[Gamma Emerald]

The way quotes just appear in my posts is like dark magic
Who has cursed me

That wasn't supposed to be there

Happens to me sometimes
Are you on mobile? It happens a lot there.

[Gamma Emerald]

Hey tw
I don’t think what you’re calling WIFOM is WIFOM

[Gamma Emerald]

maybe tw should also be lynched in lylo if we don't have a 2nd scumflip

Why all the conditionals?

[Gamma Emerald]

I'm no mafia mastermind but believing TW/Gamma/Enigma is TvTvT is a little beyond me.

And I need to see some real evidence before I consider a Nig lynch today...

Please write that differently from now on

[Gamma Emerald]

I think it’s slow but bound to get something done right eventually

[Gamma Emerald]

my case on gamma is that he has okay scum equity and that

he should be policy lynched for copping me.

I think it’s slow but bound to get something done right eventually

he's also done a few things that seem outside of blackstar-tell territory and this post is one of them

Excuse me? How does that work?

[Gamma Emerald]

First wtf is redacted
Second what about Enigma? You say lynching bu isn’t a good idea but you dodge the actual leading lynch

[Gamma Emerald]

Gamma Emerald (4): Creature, Bujaber, Alonzo, the worst (L-2)

this is an icky wagon

the people i townread are: vex, ruru, enigma, creature

the people i don't are: buj, alonzo, tw, ge, ejji

and three of them are on that wagon

Also that gamma wagon is has really good composition; im happy ending ending the day with a gamma lynch

This pinged me for a second but it’s consistent

[Gamma Emerald]

VT
The fuck did you think I was?

[Gamma Emerald]

Honestly Alonzo intent posting despite my claim being obv VT seems a bit scum rolefishy

[Gamma Emerald]

VOTE: Gamma
is this a wolf? ¯\(°_o)/¯
am I more likely wrong on Gamma than anyone else I'm TRing? d=(´▽｀)=b
do we need this phase to end? ＼（○＾ω＾○）／

No
No
Yes
Also I still think Enigma is scum, but vig should still target tw tonight

[Gamma Emerald]

Yay I get at least one Town victory amomg a slew of crap losses

[Gamma Emerald]

Also I think I’m done with this setup for good
I came in hoping it would be fun, it wasn’t, and then I discovered the mess yndwrneatb and I’m just over this setup