Open 737: Stack the Deck (Game Over)

[skitter30]

i don't even know how to read that

[Almost50]

i'm not entirely sure how i feel about a50 right now

my gut's kinda telling me he doesn't really act like this as scum unless he was trying to get bussed or somethiing

And why the freak would I want to be bussed on D1? What about the modifiers we picked?

[skitter30]

i feel like you're almost trying to get wagoned .... ?

you're not dumb as scum so i don't get what you're trying to do here as either alignment

[skitter30]

i don't know what the vc is but i kinda want to vote you now

[skitter30]

i'm really confused because you're pretty good as scum and know when people are perceiving you as being scummy so i don't know why you're trying to be *more* scummy right now

unless you're just traitor and are trying to signal but i think if you are you'd have accomplished that already so the point of the self-vote is ... ????

[Almost50]

or trying to get vigged as bp but i don't know why scum would like aim for that ...

he could be traitor signaling to groupscum maybe?

like unless he had some sort of ulterior motive that i'm not entirely seeing right now i don't think this is how he really plays scum

tbf i don't really follow of his moonlogic or follow it so it's possible he does have some sort motive/plan that i don't really see here

My advice is to just assume I'm Town (and you'd be correct ) and let it be.

Also, nobody needs booze or grass to have a good time. All you need to do is put yourself in the mood for having fun, let loose and you will have your fun without ingesting any harmful stuff.

[Almost50]

why would town!a50 try to bait vigi shot into him in the first place?

Why do you think I'm baiting the Vig shot at all? What gave you the impression that I am?? HOW DO YOU KNOW there is a Vig in the first place?

[Almost50]

Like, I simply mentioned POSSIBILITIES, and everybody seems to have just "accepted" there is a Vig in play. How about the RB? What about the Goon Cop? Why not the Tracker????

[ruru]

Getting yourself lynched d1 is hardly optimal traitor play, especially not if you're a50 and have a strong scumgame

We should also just agree to never vig or gc jestery players (sky, a50) and use the lynch on them instead if they're widely scumread

[skitter30]

Now, reread and recalculate.. does SCUM!ALMOST50 know all this, and still do what he is doing?? Why would scum!me be baiting the Vig shot at all????

because you wrote a whole post explaining why it's dumb for scum!you to bait a vig shot when nobody had brought that up in the first place

[Almost50]

he can try to act scummy and bait mafia kill into him

Why would MAFIA shoot a SCUMMY person they can easily lynch????????

[skitter30]

Getting yourself lynched d1 is hardly optimal traitor play, especially not if you're a50 and have a strong scumgame

We should also just agree to never vig or gc jestery players (sky, a50) and use the lynch on them instead if they're widely scumread

this post feels wrong and i need to think about why

[Almost50]

couple that with the fact that he's refusing to answer my questions

Hello, Eragon. Is that you? "It's his fault anyway, because I'm never wrong!"

And when did I become the center of your universe? Do you realize your one and only obsession has become A50? Are you not looking for 3 scums? Are you not interested in sorting anyone else???

[Almost50]

doesn't town start with 3tprs?

TWO. With 2 Goons and a Traitor the Town gets 2 random PRs

[ruru]

because i was skimming some of your other games this morning that i wasn't in and you were town in all of them and you were pretty focused on organizing optimal pr/mechanical play from pretty early on and here you feel more lackadaisical about it which is uncharacteristic of you imo

Okay, so first of all

- I'm not looking forward to it because this town doesn't seem very receptive to optimal mechanical play and I don't actually enjoy arguing with people
- It feels approximately two days into d1 even though I just realized it isn't because we can't seem to form a non-rvs wagon. There is no sense of urgency at all about needing to pick a vig shot
- I like winning but I also like working together with people I know and enjoy playing with. Unfortunately skygazer isn't playing and has only voted the IC and you're calling me scum so that lowers my engagement level significantly

Second of all, I think I've towntold since we last talked about your scumread on me so I don't really like that your read hasn't changed at all

Like I basically think of your recent post toward me as a leading question / generic shading and absolutely useless to sorting me

What's the scum motivation of "leaving out" a pro-town plan while mentioning in passing that I'm going to execute said plan today?

I also don't like that you're still nullscum-reading me after I made it clear that confidently scumreading me would get you lynched: in a bayesian sense, this is more likely to come from scum

So basically my townread on you is kind of wearing out

[ofrhz]

VOTE COUNT 1.5

Almost50 (4)(L-3):

Antihero, Gamma Emerald, Vex Vience, Almost50

HeWhoSwims (2):

ManWithNoName, ruru

Skygazer (1):

skitter30

ruru (0):

Antihero (0):

ManWithNoName (0):

Enigma (0):

FrankJaeger (0):

Creature (0):

Gamma Emerald (1):

HeWhoSwims

skitter30 (0):

Vex Vience (1):

Enigma

Not Voting (3):

FrankJaeger, Creature, Skygazer

With

12

alive, it takes

7

to lynch.
Day 1 ends in (expired on 2018-09-10 09:40:00)

Other

:
- skitter30 V/LA Fridays and Saturdays
- Creature still needs to respond to his prod

[Almost50]

but if he's traitor signalling ... he's doing a pretty bad job of it and he thinks he just made himself a vig target so why isn't he modulating his behavior here?

You reminded me with your first game with me. I was pushed as what?? EXACTLY! So, you might as well take that into consideration and rule out the Traitor possibility, because when someone thinks I'm signalling being the Traitor chances are I'm signalling something totally different.

[ruru]

Getting yourself lynched d1 is hardly optimal traitor play, especially not if you're a50 and have a strong scumgame

We should also just agree to never vig or gc jestery players (sky, a50) and use the lynch on them instead if they're widely scumread

this post feels wrong and i need to think about why

This is also generic shading and it's literally for the opposite thing that you just shaded me for (not pushing my mechanical ideas vs pushing them), so I need you to explain the why

[Almost50]

Can someone point me to the start of this vig talk?

I mentioned the possibility and little did I know that it will become a fad, and now everybody's taking it for a fact that

there is

a Vig in play.

[ruru]

Also I don't really think a50 is scum here, and if he's traitor trying to identify himself it's weird that he left a third party tell when he wagoned skygazer

If I were scum I would probably assume he wasn't traitor based off that? So maybe he shouldn't be in the jestery pile either

[Almost50]

i think it's dumb to use the nk to confirm the existance of a traitor; decent scum ought to be able to find them on play and the nk can be used better killing those peskies townies imo

i haven't done the math or anything but traitors don't know how many mods there are (assuming they weren't recruited, which we're assuming here) but for all the traitor knows there are 5 tprs in play and there's a fairly decent chance one of them is a vig

like i don't know if the traitor would gamble on there not being a vig

they're only 1sbp iirc so if the vig doesn't die the same night they shot them they can always say that their target didn't die the next day (of course there's the chance of rbs, i know)

Everybody knows there's bit only one mod and that's ofrhz with mutantdevle acting as the co-mod. What are you talking about??

[skitter30]

because i was skimming some of your other games this morning that i wasn't in and you were town in all of them and you were pretty focused on organizing optimal pr/mechanical play from pretty early on and here you feel more lackadaisical about it which is uncharacteristic of you imo

Okay, so first of all

- I'm not looking forward to it because this town doesn't seem very receptive to optimal mechanical play and I don't actually enjoy arguing with people
- It feels approximately two days into d1 even though I just realized it isn't because we can't seem to form a non-rvs wagon. There is no sense of urgency at all about needing to pick a vig shot
- I like winning but I also like working together with people I know and enjoy playing with. Unfortunately skygazer isn't playing and has only voted the IC and you're calling me scum so that lowers my engagement level significantly

Second of all, I think I've towntold since we last talked about your scumread on me so I don't really like that your read hasn't changed at all

Like I basically think of your recent post toward me as a leading question / generic shading and absolutely useless to sorting me

What's the scum motivation of "leaving out" a pro-town plan while mentioning in passing that I'm going to execute said plan today?

I also don't like that you're still nullscum-reading me after I made it clear that confidently scumreading me would get you lynched: in a bayesian sense, this is more likely to come from scum

So basically my townread on you is kind of wearing out

i don't really think you've towntold tbh

at least not in ways that i know how to read

i basically townread you for engagement + persistance in gamesolving + not feeling forced + good tone + general interest in what's going on + having a general pro-townie *presence* that's trying to move the game along + pushing mechanical ideas that will optimize town's chance of winning

and i don't really see most of those things right now

if you're not feeling engaged right now in general i guess it's probably not ai but that's a major component of how i read you and it's lacking right now

like i don't really know how to townread you if you're not doing those things and i think it's kinda unreasonable of you to expect me to townread you when you're not behaving in the way that makes me townread you (and i'm pretty sure you know what i townread you for? we talked about it a lot in 721)

where do you think you've towntold?

i don't know if there's inherent scum motivation in not starting the vig thing but again not pushing for that makes me feel like you're less engaged/less interested in optimizing the mechanics which feels kinda uncharacteristic of town!you

also wrt to the bolded:

you're conflating scumreading you with lynching you - i almost feel like you're trying to nudge me away from scumreading you by saying that if a scumread you (and thus lynch you!) i will be in trouble the next day, almost like you're trying to deter me from scumreading you by saying that i'll be scumread if i do. not like you're threatening me exactly but trying to frame that scumreading you is against my own best interest sort of

like why do i bother calling you scummy at all if i believe that calling you scummy is going to get me lynched tomorrow? like if i actually believe that's going to happen why don't i just switch to townreading you and drop the whole thing entirely?

(i also don't really think that's a thing tbh)

[Almost50]

i don't know what the vc is but i kinda want to vote you now

Mine was the 4th (I'm @L-3) so you can put me to @L-2 if you want. I'd just be a little disappointed and all, but it would also have put "someone" @L-2, so MISSION ACCOMPLISHED and let's see what happens.

[skitter30]

but if he's traitor signalling ... he's doing a pretty bad job of it and he thinks he just made himself a vig target so why isn't he modulating his behavior here?

You reminded me with your first game with me. I was pushed as what?? EXACTLY! So, you might as well take that into consideration and rule out the Traitor possibility, because when someone thinks I'm signalling being the Traitor chances are I'm signalling something totally different.

right, that's kinda what i'm saying; i'm not really good at understanding your thought processes a lot of the time

sometimes there's obvious scum motivation - see last jungle republic

but i don't see what you're doing here and i had a similar line of thinking in math's stack-the-deck iirc was correctly

like none of what you're doing has scum motivation unless you're like deliberately trying to get yourself shot or lynched but i don't know why you'd do either as scum

and it feels kinda reach-y too to say you'd do this as traitor

don't get me wrong, there's like legit no town motivation either as far as i can tell

but i can't really tell what you're getting out of this as scum either and like ... you're not dumb as scum usually

[Almost50]

Now, reread and recalculate.. does SCUM!ALMOST50 know all this, and still do what he is doing?? Why would scum!me be baiting the Vig shot at all????

because you wrote a whole post explaining why it's dumb for scum!you to bait a vig shot when nobody had brought that up in the first place

Find that post and reread it. I mention ALL TPRs and explained how my play would affect their action(s) towards my slot. You and Vex just focussed on the Vig bit and ignored the rest, while someone like ruru responded to the GC/RB bit. I didn't just say "Vig" and ignore all other possible PRs.