James Brafin's mini normal review, August 2018

[Something_Smart]

Ego

Thoughts tonight

[Something_Smart]

On first glance I don't think town has enough power. Tracker is useless for all intents and purposes. Vig, babysitter and vengeful together will probably cause 2 extra deaths which isn't bad but it's super unpredictable.

Compulsive visitor is basically useless.

Weak babysitter is just mean, because you want to target town but if you target town the night you die it screws town over royally.

First thought is remove the scum roleblocker completely and it may be balanced. Will have to think about it more in depth though.

[Something_Smart]

And I agree with Ircher that 24-hour nights is gonna lead to a lot of missed actions. Would probably recommend 7 days/48 hours; is there a reason you wanted it shorter?

[Something_Smart]

True, I forgot about the multitasking rule since I don't really like it at all.

RB is still way too strong though, and now it's also swingy since it loses most of its strength if it's the only maf alive-- unless tracker is still alive in which case it is either still weak or a godfather.

[Something_Smart]

any suggestions on how we could knock this down a peg? I think there's enough shenanigans that a mafia manipulative role isn't too out of place, but maybe something less powerful?

A mafia manipulative role wouldn't be out of place, but it would be too scumsided without giving town more power. Town will probably have enough difficulty getting their shit in order as it is.

Either you or James can answer this, but why is the vigilante novice? Is it just to limit the number of potential kills early on?

[Something_Smart]

You shouldn't depend on tracker to be useful in a 3-scum game.

And even two roleblock shots is a lot in a game that can literally end by N2. I don't really see the need for a roleblock (given that scum can counter PR's by killing them and town's protective power is sketchy at best) or a ninja (tracker is weak enough to not need a counter).

If you really like the ninja/roleblock idea, then I'd recommend replacing the tracker with a watcher. That might bring the game into the realm of balanced, although I might want to upgrade the watcher to some kind of weak investigative like motion detector as well.

That said, I am the secondary reviewer and you are not obligated to listen to me, but I think that most likely either the town PR's will have good reads and make scum feel like they never had a chance, or the town will eat itself alive and then complain about the lack of investigative power.

[Something_Smart]

Weak can't produce a hard inno with a roleblocker either. But the odds of the weak's inno being town are good enough that it's probably worth it to just treat it as such.

I think I would probably pass this. I do think 2-shot ninja roleblocker is confusing though.

I'm trying to wrap my head around how exactly ninja works with another role and I'm having trouble, actually. A 2-shot ninja roleblocker sounds like they can roleblock someone in a way that can't be seen, but it says that a ninja applies to ALL actions taken so it's weird that a scum ninja would not be able to make a ninja kill, and there's no normal precedent to have a modifier only apply to a specific action: for instance, you couldn't have a 2-shot bulletproof roleblocker that was only bulletproof when it used its roleblock. You'd have to make it a 2-shot bulletproof 2-shot roleblocker, but if you try to apply that to ninja then you end up with a 2-shot ninja 2-shot roleblocker which can either ninja or roleblock each night, since it's not multitasking. I think.

What did you INTEND for the ninja roleblocker to be able to do? Hopefully we can work out the correct name from there.

[Something_Smart]

If the ninja can be used every night then the watcher should probably be ungated, since the scum having a full ninja ought to expect a watcher and play accordingly (and because watcher can't get innos). Ninja 2-shot roleblocker is very clear, if that's the way you want it to be.

The difference between loud 2-shot doctor and 2-shot loud doctor, I think, is that the former is also loud when they commit the mafia kill. That's a scenario that's very unlikely to come up (would require a babysitter save), but which do you want it to be?

[Something_Smart]

Is there a better way to do weak babysitter that I’m not thinking about? The point of him is he’s trying to trade with scum pretty much without PGO (which I wanted). And they can conftown people, which is nice.

I mean... weak babysitter is an investigative that also has several ways to get screwed over. It's very unlikely to trade with scum (you have to be killed the first night you target scum). If you want something that can trade with scum, I'd go for a regular babysitter, but I wouldn't have that along with vig.

Unless you mean that they soft their actions and then if they die, the scum gets outed. Then I don't see why it's not a weak something else-- even just a weak visitor if you wanted to bring back the visitor idea.

[Something_Smart]

I don't think that's how it works. On the weak page it doesn't say the weak person is "killed", only that they "die", but for babysitter they have to be "killed".

Definitely a judgement call. Maybe we should ask implosion.

[Something_Smart]

Flavor does, but that doesn't mean all causes of death are equivalent.

For instance, a doctor can stop a mafia kill but not a weak role dying due to visiting mafia.

[Something_Smart]

You need to see role PM's first, don't you?

I want to see them, especially for the RB.

[Something_Smart]

The RB PM is written for a ninja 2-shot roleblocker. Is that how you wanted it to work? (Because if so, the role name needs to be that I think.)

[Something_Smart]

My recommendations, in order to be completely accurate and clear:
Visitor: "If you target an anti-town player at night, you will die." -> "If you

successfully visit

an anti-town player at night, you will die."
Vengeful: "When you are lynched, you may target another player in the game to attempt to kill them." -> "When you are lynched, you may

kill another player in the game.

" (

pretty

sure vengeful kill can't be stopped)
Watcher: "You will not be informed what the abilities were." -> "You will not be informed what

actions those players took.

"
Ninja: "All actions you take will show up as no action to any hypothetical tracker, watcher or similar investigative role who targets you." -> EITHER "All actions you take will

not be detectable by a Tracker, Watcher, Follower, Voyeur, or Motion Detector.

" OR "All actions you take will

not be seen as visiting for any investigative roles.

"

And it might not be a bad idea to put a reminder in the mafia role PM's (or if not, at least in the OP of the mafia topic) that they can't kill and action.

Of course all these are minor, but I think they'll probably help to cut down on misinterpretations, at least.

[Something_Smart]

the VT PM has a comma splice

okay I'm done nitpicking, looks good

not that it actually matters, but /approve

[Something_Smart]

you don't put an Oxford comma if there are only two elements in the list, though...