Open 734: Paris Mafia (13-player variation) - Game Over

[lane0168]

I should add I generally am mobile, so I comment on things that stick out, especially when catching up the way I had to. So I didn't initially dive deeper into it. If you're wondering why I said anything before I had a more informed stance

[lane0168]

VOTE: a50

Aggressively serious vote, am caught up, can discuss when not mobile.

Good vote! I also suspect this guy, but I've been a victim of conf!bias before so I'm reluctant to vote there myself.

Agreed

[Almost50]

Oh yay!

Are you going to cheer from the sidelines all game or do you intend to do something useful??

[Nero Cain]

Do you have any suggestions?

umvote me or I'll join Jingle.

[Almost50]

Do you have any suggestions?

umvote me or I'll join Jingle.

Now, I know you know me as much as I know you. Do you think that was the best way you could have phrased it??

And

you still haven't given me an alternative target

to vote for, so I am on you because I -at least- know you're not a Mime (bc DT replaced out while being wagoned).

[Kmd4390]

Vote Count

Sesq - 5 - RockyHorror, lane0168, innocentvillager, GuiltyLion, FA_Q2
Nero Cain - 3 - Thor665, Almost50, sesq
Almost50 - 2 - Eragon, Jingle
FA_Q2 - 1 - Nero Cain
GuiltyLion - 1 - Fink

Not Voting - Aristophanes

With 13 alive, it takes 7 to lynch

Deadline is Sunday September 2 at 10pm EST

[Nero Cain]

you still haven't given me an alternative target

Why do you need me to feed you information? Since when do you need hand holding in scumhunting?

so I am on you because I -at least- know you're not a Mime (bc DT replaced out while being wagoned).

Doesn't make me mafia either.

[Almost50]

Why do you need me to feed you information?

Because if you are town then we're a team.

Since when do you need hand holding in scumhunting?

Every now and then I do need advice and especially so when we have a game like this where almost everybody is holding their cards too close to their chests.

Doesn't make me mafia either.

Not necessarily, no. But it if it's between you and Sesq then I'd rather lynch you, because lynching Mime!Sesq is giving her 50% of her win con on a silver platter, while lynching you (assuming you are a townie) doesn't hurt us that much.

Unless you prefer to live and lose over getting lynched and win.

[Jingle]

Do you have any suggestions?

umvote me or I'll join Jingle.

Now, I know you know me as much as I know you. Do you think that was the best way you could have phrased it??

And

you still haven't given me an alternative target

to vote for, so I am on you because I -at least- know you're not a Mime (bc DT replaced out while being wagoned).

This post is the perfect explanation of why A50 is mafia, btw.

[Jingle]

Do you have any suggestions?

umvote me or I'll join Jingle.

Do it. Do it. Do it. Do it. Do it.

Just think of how much more towncred you'll get when you join me

before

I explain myself.

[Almost50]

Just think of how much more towncred you'll get when you join me before I explain myself.

And you have an explanation too!! SWEET!

[Jingle]

Okay, I can't remember and it isn't made explicit in this game's OP, so I'll ask here.

@mod: Do Mimes endgame town if both mafia and the vig die? If not, what is the resolution?

Town would win in that case.

[Jingle]

Just think of how much more towncred you'll get when you join me before I explain myself.

And you have an explanation too!! SWEET!

Aye.

What are your townreads?

[Nero Cain]

vote:A50

[Jingle]

Excellent.

Thor, my wagon has just as much steam as yours, a loud mouthed asshole who actually cares about pushing it through, and managed to destroy two vanity wagons. Can I interest you in the sweet smell of actually progressing the game?

[Almost50]

What are your townreads?

I thought you said you were all caught up!

[Almost50]

@Jingle: Thor won't vote me w/o a case. Try Sesq and -maybe- lane!

[Almost50]

OR... feel free to present your case already.

[Jingle]

A50, btw, is scum because he's a setup speccy player who is actively spouting plans that are only viable for town if scum plays along. Town doesn't expect scum to act in it's best interest. Further, A50 isn't looking for scum, he's looking for mimes despite being one of the most active players. Looking for mimes is a waste of time D1 for all but 3 players. The two mafiates and the vig. The vig, of these three wants to search for mimes without making such obvious. A50 on the other hand is very very clearly only threatening the less important scum faction. The faction we can defeat literally 100% of the time in this setup.

[Nero Cain]

Why do you need me to feed you information?

Because if you are town then we're a team.

Well, you certainly aren't playing like my team member.

Since when do you need hand holding in scumhunting?

Every now and then I do need advice and especially so when we have a game like this where almost everybody is holding their cards too close to their chests.

Why would you want advice from someone you want lynched?

Doesn't make me mafia either.

Not necessarily, no. But it if it's between you and Sesq then I'd rather lynch you, because lynching Mime!Sesq is giving her 50% of her win con on a silver platter, while lynching you (assuming you are a townie) doesn't hurt us that much.

Unless you prefer to live and lose over getting lynched and win.

Not lynching town is always the best course. If you don't think I'm mafia then you should go find them. This lynching between me and Sesq is very very lazy and not town motivated.

Also the "if you live we'll lose and if we lynch you we'll win." is very much

A

t

E

y fearmongering bullshit.

[Almost50]

@Nero: Oh, well. At least I tried.

@Jingle: Mimes are the "less important" faction of the two? Tell me more. Also, tell the crowd something they don't know already, because I already said I was explicitly hunting for Mimes on D1.

Like the only "fresh news"/new perspective you brought to the game so far is TOWN STILL WINS if all killer roles are dead. That bit I didn't know of, and will have to think about overnight.

[innocentvillager]

ope will get to this

[Nero Cain]

@MOD: Does the game end or not if both Mimes get lynched?

this is also mafia that's asking if their wincon can still be achieved if the mimes is first.

145 feels fake as fuck.

It's hilariously bad that he's attempting to subscribe scum motivation to DT's replace out. I mean, I know he's wrong and that DT was town thus he was being sincere. I've never had oral surgery, I've had a tooth pulled and even that hurts but my dad has had oral surgery he says that hurts like a son of a bitch. And he said he was starting school so like isn't that the OR? He's up Thor's ass and he promised to sheep him and his vote being the third vote on the wagon After Thor is just a continuation of that. He doesn't seem to particularly think that my slot is mafia and seems more than content to lets Sesq and I be the main/only wagons today.

[Jingle]

@Jingle: Mimes are the "less important" faction of the two? Tell me more. Also, tell the crowd something they don't know already, because I already said I was explicitly hunting for Mimes on D1.

Setup spec with Jingle time!

First of all, the mimes, like in actual Paris, are a distraction. Their faction literally cannot win with an intelligent playerlist. (Whoops, broke the setup. Sorry!)

If we lynch one mime, we then stop lynching and rely on Vig v Mafia. Annoying as this setup is, it's much better EV than risking an entire game loss on a single mislynch.

Now, as for the threat that mimes would present had I not just invalidated their wincondition (Don't worry, I intend to fix that with a hotfix suggestion to the mod so that we can still play an enjoyable game) it is lesser than that of mafia. Mimes cannot kill, but can roleblock. Mafia can kill. That means mafia has more opportunity to trim the accuracy of town's reads. Further, Mafia actively want to Mimehunt while Mimes don't give a shit about Mafia hunting. This means that there are more voices to be heard looking at who not to lynch than who to lynch.

Mimes, additionally, have the hamper that once their wincondition is a real threat (one of them has been lynched) we can mine that player's ISO for hints as to the other mime. It's not quite the same skillset as associative tells with a flipped mafia player, but similar enough that we will be working from a position of increased information BEFORE there is an opportunity for them to win.

Further, there are players in this game that if town will just be shot by the mafia at some point because of their reputation and scumhunting ability. (Thor, me, GL) Remember, mafia doesn't know those players aren't town, so if any of us is a mime a win is virtually impossible to pull off anyway.

tl;dr Mimes winning is A. Not even possible given the playstate we have right now and B. Incredibly unlikely even without me cracking the setup.

@mod: I would like to suggest you append the rules to disallow no lynching, on the basis that it becomes a breaking town strategy that invalidates the wincondition of an entire faction and kills the fun of the setup. You could do so by simply lynching a random player if there is no wagon at EoD and instituting plurality lynching otherwise. If you are uncomfortable making such a large change to the setup mid game, I would suggest that you take a poll of the players by PM so as not to contaminate the game with this discussion. I would bet that the players themselves would be more than happy to agree to this change, small though it may be.

[Jingle]

Thank god for true hero's like jingle

I am the Hero that Arkham deserves.

Jingle replaces UnrealSeal.

Here's for hoping this is a Town slot though (otherwise, we're in deep deep trouble).

The super funny bit is: This post is going to be used to justify a scumread on me in 3... 2... 1...