Micro 819: THE LAB 3 - What Does This Button Do? (Game Over)

[Inferno390]

Hey guys
How was your N0?
The most productive thing I did was flip my device off tbh.

[Inferno390]

Hey guys
How was your N0?
The most productive thing I did was flip my device off tbh.

I can actually flip people off using my device lmao

VOTE: Arkham

“Flip people off”
Means
“Kill people off”

Scumtells.
VOTE: CJ

[Inferno390]

Also, I have decided to be open about my device. It’s this really cool suit that allows me to turn into The Flying Pumpkin That Shoots Lazer Beams Out of Its Ass. But only if I don’t die N1.
Please don’t shoot me scum.

[Inferno390]

That’s only four votes, not 5. N_M and Giygas were both already on the wagon. It is L-1 tho.
Also, what the frick are you all actually doing?

[Inferno390]

First, everyone stop reciting the person they were already voting, it’s really confusing. Kthxbye.
Second, I would probably say that there is at least 1 scum on this wagon. Wouldn’t put RVS bussing out of the equation yet tho, so I want to have a little more info before Icstart throwing names around based on that.
Third, on one hand post 24(horror) feels forced and tries too hard imo. On the other, Enigma’s shitposting does not have a natural feel to it at all.

[Inferno390]

VOTE: Inferno

Explain.

26 is only partly shitposting

Explain.

[Inferno390]

At this point horror is basically confirmed town and any hammer is a scum claim.

That wagon up to L-1 is garbage and not even active enough for it to be reaction testing. Fail.

This feels LAMIST. How is an RVS wagon at L-1 in any way AI?

[Inferno390]

Don’t put words in my mouth.
I never said I thought Horror was scum.
I asked why a wagon in RVS was alignment indicative.

Because it’s not. And the fact that you’re trying to sell this so hard is super LAMIST.
VOTE: Oath
Srs vote.

[Inferno390]

Wat
Why is Oath being “replaced” out?
And what do you mean by “replaced”?
UNVOTE:
Confusion.

[Inferno390]

Oh ok
VOTE: glowball

1) But I don’t believe horror is scum. Heck, I don’t “believe” anything about horror right now (barring this post); the slot is null. So what is the point of bringing it up?
2) A wagon full of random voting is no indication of the players on the wagon or the wagonee. It’s quite simply voting for voting’s sake. If you think scum wouldn’t bus in RVS, you’re crazy; they know that an RVS is not actually going to be a lynch barring lolhammer (which, tbh, I almost though happened, which is dumb). If I was scum, I wouldn’t think twice about bussing my partner with my entrance vote, and I highly doubt others would. So the fact that you are trying to paint this as AI for anyone involved is super LAMIST. Heck, the bussin could have been the first vote on the wagon. How would scum know at that point that it was going to go to L-1? What you’re saying confirms nothing.
3) Yes, you are selling this too hard. It would be one thing if you had said, “I doubt scum would bus a partner to L-1 this early.” Great. I’d disagree with you, but that not an unreasonable take on the matter. But what did was say, “let’s look at a hypothetical situation and examine all the possible scenarios...”
No. You’re trying to sell me on town!horror too hard.

Also, I don’t think you’re scum defending anything. I just think you’re scum trying to look like you’re hunting.

[Inferno390]

Also, I know from personal experience that the “give replacements no doubt” is 510% wrong. Don’t even get me started on it.

[Inferno390]

Ah, the old White Flag Gsmbit.
Which is how I know that glowball is spewing wrong.
Wiki is great btw. I suggest everyone read up on it at least once in their playing career.

[Inferno390]

Gosh, glowball. Do you always play this bad as scum?

[Inferno390]

*Ahem*
Tho I do agree that CJ’s example is flawed, the point we are making is that despite what you are saying, scum DOES bus in less than optimal situations (hell, there’s a gambit for it), so to make any assumptions on an RVS wagon is foolish.

[Inferno390]

I don’t care what if you think horror is Town. I agree with you on that.
What I’m saying is that what you are judging his townieness on is very much so flawed (so conftown is a stretch), and when I pushed you on it, you tried way too hard to sell it to me.

[Inferno390]

Enigma: It means literally nothing imo.

Glowball is apparently either failing or refusing to grasp the reality of the situation, instead trying to make mine line of logic sound as bad as possible. Even though, you know, three people have now said “what the frick is this”. I’m also noticing a change in the line of attack from him with that last post, and it smell suspiciously like an attempt at straw man. Not making me feel better about the slot.

@Glowball: It has absolutely NOTHING to do with your reads. It has to do with he fact that mechanically calling someone conf-anything based on a L-1 RVS wagon doesn’t actually make sense. Which three people have more or less said now.

[Inferno390]

I have no more words to say to glowball.
He is obviously not going to understand what I am saying. I don’t know if it’s intentional or not anymore, and I honestly don’t care anymore, because I don’t want to talk in circles rn.
So I’m just going to scumread you and move on to other things.

[Inferno390]

Ooh, a few posts to parse!

72:
-I like you fine. I just feel like we’re talking past each other, intentionally or not, and so I’m disengaging to let other people have words. Not sure if this a straight up AtE or a misrep on me as AtE, but I neither understand why this was needed to be said nor like it.
-Q1: Please notice in that post that you just kindly bolded, “barring this post.” Meaning, what AI am currently saying reflects the viewpoint from my previous posts and has no bearing on my current ones. Kthxbye. The reason I have horror as Town is because his posting does not feel like it come from scum, and honestly, with you being my only scumread atm, horror doesn’t make sense to me. Consider it more of a guy read than anything.
-Q2: This is a misrep of my entire point. You’re not scum because you have horror as conftown; you’re scum because you’re trying way too hard to sell a NAI incident as AI, despite several other people disagreeing with you. Plus the deflection to different points, the AtE, the fact that you are just discrediting my read instead of actually giving me reasons to think you’re Town... think my point should be clear by now.
-The reason I am disengaging is because I feel that what we are doing right now is less beneficial to town than letting other people show up and talk while I back off. A giant 1v1 this early is just going to kill town motivation, not help them. Another situation I know of from personal experience. So I am going to stop talking to you from now and let this discussion continue without me, and start looking at other people and things. Kthxbye.

73:
-Your “questions” in 65 are actually one asking about my read change (a topic change for deflection) and a bunch of philosophical Mafia stuff that actually serves no purpose than to evade my points while simultaneously making them look as stupid as possible.
-The funny thing about your logic here is that if you are actually town, you also have to admit a scenario where horror is scum and YOU are just being bull-headed. So there’s that.
-There’s also a lot of the way that this is phrased that makes me think here is some setup info that you have. Which only comes from scum.
-Again, this post is mainly being used to just make me look as stupid as possible. I have played against that scum tactic before, and trust me, IT DOES NOT WORK. So I suggest you look for a different way to defend yourself.

76:
-@Arkhan: Post 33 is frustrated? Really? I think you’re the only one reaching here bud

[Inferno390]

@Giygas & CJ: Would you mind going ahead and explaining those reads?

[Inferno390]

Kk
How do you feel about Enigma and Horror?

[Inferno390]

I was asking CJ, not youz

[Inferno390]

Oof
There’s a lot of bad in that post.
I have no motivation to parse that right now, but on that last paragraph, I want you to know that I have posted everything from my phone so far this game. The last time I had the ability to make a post like my previous (on my phone, no less) was at 10 PM last night, when I had neither the time or the energy to sort that much information. So to paint the timing of my post as “oh, he wasn’t going to respond because scum” under the excuse that someone showed up and voted me in a 14 hour interval is an outrageous assumption. So stop.

[Inferno390]

You’re right, I said I was going to stop interacting with you. And then you obviously thought it was a bad idea and pitched a fit about it.
Do you want me to interact with you or not?
If you do, don’t call me out for doing it.
If you don’t, don’t keep saying stuff at me and don’t complain when I say I’m not going to respond to you anymore.

[Inferno390]

Done responding to glowball.
Going to start hunting for his partner now.

@Giygas: No, I’m not happy. Elaborate on what exactly makes sense.
I also don’t understand the the need to shade me when all I did was ask you to elaborate.

[Inferno390]

I'm L-1? Okay then.

[Inferno390]

@Horror: Ehat do you think of Arkham and Giygas’ votes on me?

[Inferno390]

Oh, I’m reading everything that’s going on in the thread, glowball.
I’m just done responding to you.

@Horror:
Talk to me more about my glowball read. What parts of it are a stretch? You say that you think only some parts are; do you agree with anything I’m saying? And what about 65 makes sense to you? Is that the only thing you agree with from glowball? Or are there other things?
To expand more on your thoughts:
If I was going to flip town, you agree that Arkham would be the scummiest vote. Who would you pair him with as scum in that scenario? Who would you NOT pair him with? Would you look st anyone else in regards to my flip?
And what if I was to flip scum? Who would my partner? Why?

[Inferno390]

Prod dodge
I came so close to backing off my read on glow under the assumption of confbias.
SO CLOSE.

I guess I’ll sit down and do a post by post case plus Q&A session on/with him tonight after school.
Until then, words from anyone other than him?

[Inferno390]

Ebwop: Her. I meant her!

[Inferno390]

Wow.
Not only are you scum, but you’re one of those haughty condescending scum. Good to know.
Just because I am going to post a case on you does not make me think that I am 100 percent right, nor do I think everyone else is wrong. Nowhere have I ever implied that. If someone else (not you, never you) shows up and can talk with me on what I’m saying and show me where my thinking is bad, then by all means, I’m willing to listen and reevaluate my reads.
But so far, no one has done that and I feel that you have given me no actual reason to believe you are Town. I am allowed to think there are some seriously scummy things in your play, and that does NOT mean I have confbias. If you have nothing productive to say and are going to just belittle something you haven’t even read yet, then it shouldn’t be a wonder why I don’t want to respond to you anymore.

NOW
Would you go kindly take your trash somewhere else?
Thanks.

[Inferno390]

With that out of the way,

@Everyone else

I had a little bit of time around lunch to start working on a case, but it’s a lot of words, so I’ll give you my work so far.

31: The first section, while I understand what glowball is getting at here (scum is not going to bring a partner to L-1), the extreme confidence in the statement is offputting. I also don’t believe that she actually thinks that someone is going to hammer here, so I’m not sure of the point of bringing it up. The second section I don’t understand the point of? What is glowball trying to convey with this statement? All in all, I’m getting a major “Look at me guys, I’m figuring stuff out, you all should listen to me because I’m figuring stuff out” vibe from this post, which is what I found LAMIST originally.
33: This post is what really bothers me with glowball early on. Like, I never suggested Horror was scum. I never suggested anything at all. So what’s the point of saying “If you think horror is scum?” Then we go into this whole hypothetical system where we discuss what scum would and would not do in a certain scenario and what happened with the wagon... it’s just not necessary. Glowball could have just said that he thinks scum wouldn’t bus to L-1 this early. I would have bought that. That’s reasonable. But now glowball is trying way too hard to justify his read with all this hypothetical thinking. That’s the part that reads so LAMIST.
On top of this, glowball is talking very much in absolutes here. As Town, she should not be working in absolutes. Town can never be ABSOLUTELY sure of anything until after a flip. Only scum can know with absolute certainty the alignment of anybody. And even glowball says, and I quote, “....it’s much more likely that an opportunistic wagon formed...” This is important because this is definite proof that glowball’s claim is not necessarily accurate, and she even to some extent subconsciously admits that. So this reliance on the absolute is a soft contrast to what she’s been saying. And while there’s an argument for this that says that glowball is hyperbole prone town, given other aspects of her play, I’m willing to bet on scum with setup spec.
36:
Point 1. I’m not sure how to take this. On one hand, the narrative of glowball saying “horror is conftown because X” and me saying “why is X AI” followed by her saying “If you think horror is scum” reads like shading me as reading horror as scum imo, but I could be taking it the wrong way. On the other, aren’t those situations given by glowball entirely plausible? So how is this wagon AI again? How is horror conftown?
Point 2: See, this is just words. I doesn’t mean anything. And saying “I believe” leads me again to the point that it it is contrary to the stance of absolutes that she is taking.
Point 3: This is skirting the point. It’s not the fact itself that she explained something that strikes me as selling too hard. It’s HOW she is explaining it that is the problem, if this case so far is any indication.
37: As I’ve said, I don’t think glowball is scum defending anything. She’s not being defensive at all; she’s being super aggressive about her reads, which imo is her trying to jockey her way into a town position. This question is a type of false dilemma or loaded question, because it is implying something that I don’t find true: that glowball is “defending.” This bothers me because it reads like she is trying to force me in a direction that I don’t necessarily want to go and/or she can attack or refute easily. If I think she is scum defending Town, then I agree with her read and therefore look fake. If I think she is scum defending scum, glowball already has “shown” that horror is Town and so therefore makes me look fake. All around, it’s just a bad question designed to make me look stupid.

I’m going to let you all digest this while I go work on school and continue working on my analysis afterwards. I will not be accepting any questions at this time. Thank you.

[Inferno390]

Wait.
Can some devices be used during he day?
I was under the impression that they could only be used at night.

@Enigma: I am more than willing to talk to you about Giygas between working on my case.

@All: I am in a writing mood, so this next post is going to be a bit more creative. You have been warned. Kudos to RC for the inspiration.

[Inferno390]

Scene: The Mafiascum District Courthouse. Within the main courtroom lies one of the greatest legal battles of the little community as to date. The room is packed with the likes of vonflare and Mathdino and... hey, is that mith sitting in the back in a trench coat? Overseeing the proceedings is the honorable Judge Prof. Fridays, who now takes the bench after a recess of a few hours.

The Accused: The defendant is glowball, also known to the community as Oath, is under charges of being dirty scum. The defendant has, as is customary, pled not guilty to all charges.
The Prosecutor: The legal team is led by the rookie Inferno390.

Prof. Fridays: The court is now in session!
Inferno390, I have deliberated over you previous points and would now like for you to continue. Are your statements fully prepared?
Inferno390: Yes, Your Honor.
PF: Very well. You may begin.
I390: Thank you, Your Honor. Now, in the previous session of the court I have shown exhibit that while not necessarily indicate guilt, do call into question the innocence of the accused. I will now move forward to the next section of the exhibits, where I will show how this behavior becomes indicative when compared to previous information.

=====
44: glowball says I haven’t read anything she’s written. This is blatantly not true. Not only do I read what she’s saying, I point by point address it. This is a weak excuse to not respond to my points.

48: This is a really telling post because 1) I actually did respond to this, all the way back in point 2 of post 42. 2) only 2 scum is not a valid reason to say that scum wouldn’t bus each other to L-1 in RVS. Otherwise, it would be a given rule in any game with two scum. This is quite simply not the case.
Also has some condescending points in this post that are very offputting.
54: The problem with what glowball is saying here that his little chain of events here requires scum to actually get lynched. Off of an RVS wagon. That’s obviously a troll wagon anyways. This ends up being a really reachy argument under scrutiny.
50-55 from glowball also miss the entire point of what I’m saying. My point is not what is or is not helpful to scum. My point is that his argument is invalid because there is no basis to assume that scum would not bus in RVS in this scenario. Her entire argument revolves around the fact that early bussing likes this hurts scum, so they wouldn’t do it. But unless there’s a quicklynch (which she has made very clear she does not think would have happened) it doesn’t hurt scum at all. This gets lost in all the details and technicalities, so I want to clear that up.
59: Suggesting that CJ and I both just “don’t like her read” is a major misrep of the situation. What my problem is is that I think that while what she’s saying is reasonable, there are major flaws with it, and when I applied pressure, she reacted in a completely inorganic way.

=====

Here the prosecution is interrupted by the lawyers of the defendant.

Giygas: OBJECTION!!!! Your Honor, this is foolish. What glowball has been saying makes sense. I fail to see what this inaccurate parsing of events—
I390: Your Honor, if I may.
PF: Go ahead. The prosecution has the floor.
I390: Thank you, Your Honor. You see, jury members, herein lies the exact intricacy of the situation. For, as we all know, scum does a lot of lying and deceit to get what they want. But scum can’t say just anything. They have to sound plausible. They have to make sense. After all, if they say completely outrageous or unrealistic things, it will be easy for town to catch on and sniff them out. This is the classic example of a scumslip. So therefore, scum has to craft their arguments in the most reasonable or compelling way possible, so as to have Town believe what they are saying. Using a vague general term such as “this makes sense” is not a true analysis of the situation, as anyone can say that something does or does not make sense. In conclusion, the amount of sense a person makes is not an alignment indicative point on its own. And simply saying someone’s arguments make sense does not implicitly mean they are Town.

There is a brief moment of uncomfortable silence as the defendant’s representative sits down.

PF: These are interesting points that you have brought to the jury’s attention. It will require some time to fully process them. The court will adjourn for a recess to think over the matter.
I390: Thank you, Your Honor.
PF: the court is adjourned.

Slowly the jury files out, followed by the honorable judge. Once they are gone, the room’s silence becomes filled with whispers and conversation.

=====

Will have more up later. I am still not taking any questions or comments at this time. Thank you.

[Inferno390]

<3

[Inferno390]

@Giygas: I will allow questions when I wrap up my my entire case. I just don’t want to deal with a dozen questions while I’m working on it, because then what I’m trying to say will get lost in my answers.
Also, that is not what I find LAMIST. I don’t understand what’s so hard about this.

[Inferno390]

Oh just realised this game is on shortened deadlines. Highly suggest a non inferno lynch today. Also recall the hammer voter gets the device so we should consider that as well ....

We have no choice but to lynch Inferno

Umm
We should lynch the frick out of this?

[Inferno390]

I’m down for either Arkham or N_M atp.

[Inferno390]

VOTE: Vote
Let’s throw some pressure this way and see what happens.
Meantime, I’ll keep working on my glowball case. With school and life and everything, I can’t promise it by deadline, but it should be done sometime next day phase latest.

[Inferno390]

Fuck

[Inferno390]

VOTE: Arkham
I don’t even know how I did that.
Please don’t accuse me of voting for voting’s sake now lol

[Inferno390]

woof

meow

fuck

[Inferno390]

but inferno needs to stop confbiasing

No. Do you even understand what you are asking of me?
All joking aside, I am more than willing to table this read. I am going to finish my case tho because 1) I hate to leave thoughts unresolved like that and 2) glowball is going to keep harassing me if I don’t ever answer her questions.

[Inferno390]

Cool
Now that this is out of the way, can we wagon teh bat plz?

[Inferno390]

Why would my answers ever not be honest as Town?

[Inferno390]

Touché

[Inferno390]

I would honestly love to hammer.
But I’m sure there are mixed feelings on that, and I’m on the wagon already anyways, so...

[Inferno390]

My device detected nothing... which is odd.
Back to glowball as soon as I sit down at a computer.

[Inferno390]

Hmmmm
HMMMMM

I can unfortunately see cases for everyone as scum rn. Glowball’s is definitely the weakest.
Gonna VOTE: N_M for now.

[Inferno390]

Actually, where does Invis fall in all of this? Could that be the solution?

[Inferno390]

So apparently scum lives in {Enigma/N_M/Invis}

I would say lynch in that order, but there’s obviously not enough time to do that considering MyLo is tomorrow
Thoughts?

[Inferno390]

No
I refuse

[Inferno390]

Okay then
VOTE: Enigma

[Inferno390]

Well I mean
That’s not a hammer, so
Great flail tho

[Inferno390]

No
Only Invis and All are Voting you

[Inferno390]

Me, not all

[Inferno390]

Oh
My bad

[Inferno390]

Well, we’re going into MyLo.
Thoughts?

[Inferno390]

I have a purple printer that I’m pretty positive performs the project of printing information.

I thin Invis is most likely scum.
I can also see scum cases for everyone in the game rn. Ironically, glowball is my weakest of those.

[Inferno390]

Wait
Giygas didn’t get a device from the Arkham lynch
And CJ lost his vig device already
So how the fudge does he have two devices?

[Inferno390]

Yes my printer is purple.
No, I am not scum.

[Inferno390]

So here’s my thoughts:
Scum is looking at winning in one of two ways:
Either Lynching today, or no lynching, shooting either glowball or I, and controlling the lynch tomorrow.
If glowball is scum, it would actually make more sense for her to push the latter, given how active she is/how much of a Town presence she’s been. No Lynch plus shoot the other voice in the game is the best way to win here.
So that leaves Invis and CJ.

[Inferno390]

My printer keeps printing “Nothing Detected.”

[Inferno390]

It doesn’t target. I just hit a button and it prints stuff.

[Inferno390]

I’m thinking it’s reflexive, like it detects when someone targets me with something?

[Inferno390]

Hi
prod dodge

[Inferno390]

If you weren’t aware, I’m reading through
And I’m starting to lean scum again on glowball

[Inferno390]

You know what glowball. I'll buy that case on CJ.
The reason I was leaning on you was because it looked like you were using all of this setup spec stuff to look like you were being active and therefore scummy, but you're posting has been too town toned to ignore.

[Inferno390]

Scum is probs inferno. He has more than one device.

What
No I don’t
Nowhere have I ever said I had more than one device
This kind of flaily accusation is the convincer for me
VOTE: CJ

[Inferno390]

You trying to pin me up as scum like this is BS and you know it, bub.

[Inferno390]

My printer has a button, not a switch. A purple button.
I don’t turn it on or off. Every night I just hit the button and print results.
And no. That was not trying to be clever. I actually flippped off my device. Rapidly. With both hands. Because I was really struggling with trying to figure out what it did, so for banter, I gave it the middle finger.

I’m coming after CJ because his case be shit and I think he knows it, so I’m calling him out on it.

[Inferno390]

I think he’s flailing scum trying to pass the bucket off on me

[Inferno390]

UNVOTE:

[Inferno390]

So the D-1 lynch was a bus
Interesting
I have to choose between apathetic player and the flailer from D3
Gonna run a quick VCA and see what I find

[Inferno390]

So with a VCA
I found nothing
great

[Inferno390]

Invis, would you kindly link me to some of your scum games and some of your Town games?

[Inferno390]

Hmm
Interesting
CJ, can you do the same?

[Inferno390]

Ooh you are
Interesting
So you two have some sort of meta read on each other
Tell me about them

[Inferno390]

But you’ve obviously played with Town!cj
So knowing that he was Town, do you think his play here is similar to his townplay or no?

[Inferno390]

Hmm
I think I’ve solved
But since it’s Lylo and I don’t trust myself
I’m going to attempt something
I need everyone on tho

[Inferno390]

Oh fudge
Gonna leave it all to me huh?
What if I’m scum, huh?

[Inferno390]

it’s left to me to end the game
Great whoever the other town is. Thanks a lot.
So I’m going to take a minute to barf my thoughts out.


So
On VCA, I learned that you two were on the same wagons every single day. Which is frustrating.
But it does tell me this: Scum for sure bussed D1.
So now I have to ask the question: Which one of you two is more likely to bus D1?

On one hand, CJ has some odd interactions with Ark and openly admits to bussing in similar situations.
On the other, Invis sheeps the wagon way too hard imo.
The way CJ talks about Ark/NM late in the day feels like wagon derailing...
But he had plenty of opportunity to pull out and he never did.

I dunno guys, I’m stumped

[Inferno390]

Whoops
I misread your early posts
I thought you said that you bussed your partners, not the other way around

[Inferno390]

I just don’t know anymore
I’d go with my gut, but my gut says that both of you could be scum

You need you both to write a three page essay on how you’re Town and the other one is scum

[Inferno390]

Hi
Just reminding you all that I am still alive
And reading

[Inferno390]

VOTE: CJ
If I’m wrong, GG Invis.

[Inferno390]

Gonna be honest
That would be a hilarious way to end the game
But I’m not scum
So

[Inferno390]

Dunno
Are you playing pranks on me as scum?

[Inferno390]

Fuck fuck fuck fuck fuck
Sorry Ceej. Gg Invis.

[Inferno390]

I think gadgets need to be just a little more straightforward.
Like, I think trying to figure out an ability stretched over two devices makes it really hard to figure out what either one does. And if scum gets their hand on one, it kind of fucks over the other half for town.
Also, reflexive gadgets are meh. The fact that mine never got used simply because it was reflexive was very detrimental to town and made the game less fun for me to play.

[Inferno390]

Nice
So I have 2 games with sky under my belt

[Inferno390]

Though tbh, this game was lost solely to me being a shithead.
The meta was RIGHT FRICKING THERE
I just got paranoid about glowball’s comment on scum having a killing gadget D2.
Gonna slap myself on that play for a long time.

P-edit: yeah that would have been obvious from setup spec. Ironically one of the worst aspects of my play rn.