Mini Normal 2033: Dolphins (Game Over)

[Doughboy]

VOTE: tommy
Clsssic mafia name.

[Doughboy]

VOTE: dva
Sheeping the hawk

[Doughboy]

So what kind of setup do we expect from an 11P? 2 or 3 mafia?

[Doughboy]

Thanks. Helps go read the rules.

[Doughboy]

VOTE: saudade

I’ll call your bluff.

[Doughboy]

Lets play a game,

Maybe it's because I've been playing too much Dead By Daylight but this made me think of Jigsaw.

What do you think about the current DVA wagon?

I’m showing my age. It sort of reminds me of war games.

Let’s play thermonuclear war

[Doughboy]

Ok. Mine was serious though. I honestly think it's likely that Scioness saw a red role PM and replaced out in the pre-game, and I feel like the others who also voted that slot feel the same way as I do.

[Doughboy]

Congratulations on winning the game though, you'll be free of this game soon enough

Now let’s see you get everyone else to lynch me cause “he was the first to vote me”

[Doughboy]

por que roll of the eyes?

It is a really bad reason to scumnread somebody. I scum read somebody who was getting some pressure, logged in multiple times but didn’t post and I thought he was afraid he didn’t know how to respond. He flipped town.

[Doughboy]

Rage does typically vote who he thinks he is scummy so that comment does raise concerns with me.

[Doughboy]

that seems a little over the top.

[Doughboy]

How do we know scioness read his role pm?

[Doughboy]

You make this statement like we have played in a number of games.

No I made a statement based off my experience of you. 1 game is still better than no games.

[Doughboy]

You make this statement like we have played in a number of games.

No I made a statement based off my experience of you. 1 game is still better than no games.

Provide proof, otherwise this reads to me like you were trying to add fire to a wagon.

The game we played together where you thought I was scummy and basically wouldn’t vote elsewhere or even unvote when asked.

Do I need to link it?

[Doughboy]

My problem is your wording. It’s very misleading. If you said I played 1 game with rage and he seemed to vote scummy. I would’ve corrected you on the seem part.

Using typically to me implies you have a good range of data to go on,certainly more than one game.

If I go to the casino once and win 2k, I can’t go typically I win 2k at the casino, because I haven’t been enuff times to say that.

That’s on you. If you interpreted one way I can’t control that.

[Doughboy]

And I provided proof

[Doughboy]

He was partly responsible for town losing cause he couldn’t get past somebody he found scummy to the point he defended scum which I pointed out already ye I can barely provide an example?

I’ll ignore him for now but if a wagon forms I’ll be happy to hammer

[Doughboy]

Saudade is a good Lynch.

He’s most likely scum here since he isn’t trying to find scum.

[Doughboy]

The fact you’re trying to bait me into an argument is prett bad. You literally just admitted that’s what you’re doing. I’m actually going to learn from my mistakes. If that means people think I’m scum so be it.

[Doughboy]

I'm a little null on doughboy. He's sheeping me, which is great but also worrying

I’m not sheeping you.

[Doughboy]

Well keep waiting. I don’t need to link you to things we both know are true.

[Doughboy]

Or we can agree to disagree and don’t worry about it.

You want to start a fight. I want to avoid one. Best thing to do is ignore you I guess.

If you want to talk about anything else lmk. If you want to argue cause you disagree with me, Good day sir.

[Doughboy]

viewtopic.php?f=11&t=77128

I don’t know how it’s going to help though.

[Doughboy]

My answer to all 3 is that he’s the stubborn type who doesn’t really know what he’s doing.

[Doughboy]

Why did he bring it up to make me look suspicious?
Why is he willing to hammer a vote on me based on it?
Why is he unwilling to provide proof on anything he said?

This is my last post on this stupid topic.

1. I brought it up cause I feel your playing different this game compared to that game.

2. I’m happy to hammer you cause you are a player who was partially responsible for town losing the last game. This game you are doing things not helpful to town. You’re either scum (which I’m not sure of yet) or bad town (which I already know is true based on last gme)

3. Because I don’t have to provide proof of my opinions. You either agree or disagree and move on. Different opinions aren’t alignment indicative.

[Doughboy]

Great you’ve got that out of your system. Now don’t bring it up again cause I’m not responding to anything else related to it.

[Doughboy]

You really shouldn’t lie. It’s antitown.

[Doughboy]

Yes this can and probably will go on for pages if we let it. Hearing for the quiet ones isn’t a bad idea. It’s easy to hide when people are fighting.

[Doughboy]

While I want more content. That’s a good vote.

[Doughboy]

By the way, can somebody explain, why there is such a large focus on what has been done in a previous game(s)? Reads from previous games are mostly subjective, additionally, you are relying on person x playing the same way as they did in previous games. Can somebody explain why this is efficient? Or is it just to get the ball rolling? I see no point in it.

Gonna have to ask rage. He’s the one being super defensive about my opinions of his play.

[Doughboy]

As far as im concerned, previous games shouldn't be brought up,

Meta can be a very useful tool in mafia so unfortunately you’ll have to get used to it.

[Doughboy]

Please dont play the victim role, it doesnt suit you.

Not playing the victim. You did get overly defensive because of my opinion. That’s a fact. You are basically FF

[Doughboy]

Which brings me to this post.
In post 57, Doughboy wrote:
Rage does typically vote who he thinks he is scummy so that comment does raise concerns with me.

You make this statement like we have played in a number of games.
You worded it in a way to make me seem like im playing differently/scummy.

We have played 1 game together, my first game on this board.

In that game I voted day 1 because Lafayette asked for votes, I obliged.

Day 2 I voted you because I had a theory on you and didn’t like your hammer.

Day 3 where I basically made it me vs ff as the lynch, i attacked ff thru most of the day phase and never voted him, even though the lynch was guaranteed to be me vs him. When I did vote, I voted myself.

Throughout that game I made posts on how I thought something Lafayette did appeared scummy. On more than one occasion Lafayette called me out for not voting him. Again I explained I hold my votes.

So can you provide proof about how I “typically” vote who I think is scummy so early? I provided examples on how that is not the case at all.

See? Overly defensive.

[Doughboy]

Now I’m begging you. Don’t bring this shit us again

[Doughboy]

up*

[Doughboy]

now vote Tommy because he's a filthy scum

You can’t show up after being at l-1 and start caring about finding scum. It has to start from the beginning. Sorry you rolled scum and got caught so easily.

[Doughboy]

Side note. Is arguing common on this site? It seems like every game I play some stupid arguments happen.

[Doughboy]

Saudade is a good Lynch.

He’s most likely scum here since he isn’t trying to find scum.

This is going to a long game
Not contributing doesn’t mean he’s scum ffs

Sure. That can literally be said about anything. It’s a good start though.

[Doughboy]

Arguing is what this entire game is about. Sometimes the arguments are stupid; sometimes they’re not.

I mean sure arguing happens sometimes but it’s usually over something with substance. Not what happened last game or this game.

[Doughboy]

Your my scummiest read. That’s why I’m voting you.

[Doughboy]

I don’t need a pass.

[Doughboy]

Can’t really take anyone seriously when they say somebody who says “it’s probably town v town” is a scumslip. Also can’t take somebody seriously when their only useful content is play “let’s look for the scum on my wagon”’ but doesn’t even do it genuinely.

This is lazy scum play in an attempt to appear like lazy town play.

I haven’t seen anything else from saude that looks or sounds like town.

[Doughboy]

I see saudade still isn’t scum hunting. Why are people town reading him?

His bravado doesn’t sway me. That’s easy to fake as scum. Scum hunting isn’t easy to fake and it’s clear here since he’s done a bad job faking it.

@saudade please read this - viewtopic.php?f=49&t=30907

Thank you.

[Doughboy]

Bring back the saudade wagon since hes probably scum, he’s not scum hunting and he’s kind of being rude

[Doughboy]

Can’t really take anyone seriously when they say somebody who says “it’s probably town v town” is a scumslip. Also can’t take somebody seriously when their only useful content is play “let’s look for the scum on my wagon”’ but doesn’t even do it genuinely.

This is lazy scum play in an attempt to appear like lazy town play.

I haven’t seen anything else from saude that looks or sounds like town.

This summarized what saudade did. That’s not scum hunting.

At best those reasons are null. His strong desire to lynch tommy for them dont seem sincere.

[Doughboy]

Bring back the saudade wagon since hes probably scum, he’s not scum hunting and he’s kind of being rude

No. Thank wagon was very likely scum driven.

Who were the scum pushing it?

[Doughboy]

Saudade (5) - Doughboy, LTVNGambit, Tommy, GuerillaWoo, DVa
The peak of the wagon
I think it’s probably at least one of LTVNGambit or DVa, with Tommy also under consideration

3/4 of the low posters. I’m more worried about a high poster who doesn’t post anything useful.

Dva is playing too obvious to be scum imo.
Tommy is meh but saud’s reasons were pretty bad and haven’t seen anyone else provide anything so until I see something glaring, saud looks bad.
LTVN I need to spend time reading his posts. I tried earlier and couldn’t get a read.


Problem with saud is if he happens to be town, he’s not willing to be a team player. Threatening to get me to replace out is inexcusable. So was his referencing an ongoing game.

He needs to go

[Doughboy]

Oh and him thinking I’m scum reading him because of something other than his play here is also an anti town attitude. He’s toxic really.

[Doughboy]

@Doughboy what do you think of these recent posts by Saudade? he was re-evaluating reads and it kinda seemed a little townie but idk, then he went right back to fluffposting

They don’t seem genuine to me.

[Doughboy]

Just throwing it out three that until we get a town flip on saud, the only person who has grounds to look at his wagon for scum is saude which he’s done. Nobody else can or should do that because they don’t know if he’s town or not especially since he’s not obvious town.

If you scum read somebody on that wagon for other reasons, that’s fine but how gamma was looking for scum on the wagon, that is no good to me.

[Doughboy]

Alchie. Quick summary of why he’s scum.

[Doughboy]

Thanks alchie. I did remember he did a weird shift in calm to rage which felt fake.


VOTE: guerilla

[Doughboy]

4 votes on Gorilla? Really?
some scum on that wagon for sure

Some implies more than one and you’re only shading the guy who thinks you are scum?

Seems legit.

Hopefully people see through you. Clearly it won’t be today but it’ll happen.

[Doughboy]

Doughboy is the only one left...........
ignored everyone in this entire thread except for me and Gorilla

I haven’t ignored everyone actually.

[Doughboy]

Not a fan of rage lurking once his fake argument with me didn’t go his way

[Doughboy]

Nothing he’s done makes sense. That’s why I scum read him. It’s possible he’s just bad town but idk. I’d rather deal with him today than lylo

[Doughboy]

Anyways. Until he’s gone I’ll probably not be very interested in the game. He played dirty and nothing was done about it and unfortunately even reading his posts annoy me.

[Doughboy]

Not going to vote park on a wagon that isn’t going anywhere. I’m suspicious of Guerilla so I’m good with that vote. I’ll go back to checking the game once a day

[Doughboy]

Yes. I openly admit that you’ve played like scum and I scum read you for it. It’s not a grudge vote like you think it is.

If you were town you’d have done shit before you got to l-1 and when you got there you’d have done more than you did. I also don’t think you would bring up outside influences and try to bait me if you were town.

[Doughboy]

VOTE: Doughboy
oh no no no
I'm not giving you an excuse to coast through this entire game just because i'm in it

Good luck with that. As long as you’re in the game idgaf what happens to me.

[Doughboy]

Hey guys. We should really vote the guy I think is scum but I’ll just hop on to the same wagon he’s one.

[Doughboy]

On*

[Doughboy]

And I’m sorry if you feel I lied rage but I never did. I stated MY OPINIONS about your play. Just cause you disagree with my opinions, doesn’t mean I lied.

You are a bad player who needs to get better. while I think this very well could be fake, I don’t think you have that ability yet so you’re probably bad town like you were the last game.

Dva I feel is also town. He’s done some things most scum wouldn’t unless they were very experienced and I’m not sold he has that kind of experience.

Saudade is still the best lynch for the game state imo. I’m good with a Guerilla one especially of the only options are him and dva.

I do personally love this setup. It’s like a newbie but you get more chances to be wrong. It’s also harder to survive as scum because it’s more time to narrow it down.

See y’all tomorrow

[Doughboy]

lying isn’t a scumtell. People need to get over the “omg he lied so he must be scum”.

lies are usually lies. They are opinions or misrememberings or something else completely. Town and scummbith do it and stupid fights break out about it. Look for true scum motivation.

Also if somebody doesn’t post for a entire day, it’s not the end of the world.

[Doughboy]

Flubber, you have said 3 people are lynch bait counter wagons.

1. Counter wagons to who exactly?

2. How can saudade, dva, guerilla all be lynchbait?

[Doughboy]

I don't think neither dva or gorilla are scum then
what do boys time for ya'll to unvote

Db would make for a good lynch *shrug*

Why exactly? Because I have a different opinion of your play than you do? And because of that I somehow lied?

Grow up and get your head in the game. You’re doing the same dumb shit you did that game. You’re playing terrible. I want to win and don’t need you to cost me another game.

[Doughboy]

Please lynch me rage. Go ahead and do it. I want you to realize that’s it’s always you. It’s never me. You’ll have misread me twice cause you suck at mafia.

[Doughboy]

Nah fuck that.

VOTE: dva

Strategic replacement

[Doughboy]

Am I missing something here? At the last vote count dva (or me) wasn't the leading wagon and I looked at dvas iso too and nothing makes me assume that my slot was being heavily pushed by anyone can you point me to the posts that make you think this?

Dva was the closest to l-1, somebody even said he was at l-1. After his last post of the game it was revealed he was tied with 4 but he was still the one under more pressure. There were 2 competing wagons. He also replaced out via pm and not by a post in the game thread.

That’s suspicious to me

[Doughboy]

This game you lied about me on multiple accounts

I haven’t lied about you once. My opinion is not a lie. Its my fucking opinion. You call me bad orntoxic but you don’t even know what a Fucking opinion means.

Everything I’ve said about your play that game is how I perceived it. Like what the Fuck dude? Please get your head out of your ass

[Doughboy]

I defended scum in that game, which is an outright lie.

Let’s address the “lies”.

After begging you or anyone to unvote cause I didn’t want to claim my Pr, you laughed at me and then scum cc’d me and then you went on to vote me instead of scum. You made other posts that implied you wanted me over scum. This is why you were lynched the next day, everyone thought you were scum with him cause of how you wouldn’t vote him and wanted to vote me.

That is defending scum over the claimed Pr wether you want to admit it or not. It’s literally why you got lynched.

My other opinion. You voted a player after lurking and put them l-1. That’s somebody who’s confident with their voting who they think is scum. You then go on to basically tunnel me cause you think I’m scum. Clearly you were confident in voting who you think I’m scum from my POV.

That’s not a lie either.

So what other “lies” have I supposedly told? Huh?

Get lost

[Doughboy]

Like I said, you have nothing else to say.

Also I’m not the one keeping the 1v1 going. Db is the one continuing it.

Realy? Cause all I did is ask you want you wanted to lynch me outside of lies I never told.

Make a case on me that doesn’t include me lying since I didn’t.

[Doughboy]

But that doesn’t change DB being wrong about the meta in the first place

And because I didn’t want to deal with it at the time, this isn’t correct either. My interpretation of his meta is spot on. He was a very confident voter and he did try to lynch me over scum.

[Doughboy]

I don't think neither dva or gorilla are scum then
what do boys time for ya'll to unvote

Db would make for a good lynch *shrug*

And this is you basically continuing it since the only reason you scum read me is for “it”.

[Doughboy]

This game is terrible. Nobody is playing good.

[Doughboy]

@doughboy instead of accusing EVERY player of playing badly can you give me that read list please....

Saudade, guerilla, you scum reads.
Gamma don’t trust
Rage and alchemist lean town
Null everyone else.

[Doughboy]

Prove I defended scum over you.

You just did it for me. Voting me over scum because of non game related reasons is basically defending scum. It’s literally why you were lynched.

[Doughboy]

Unvoted you

Yet your very next post was looking for my scum buddy.

[Doughboy]

Why don't you trust Gamma?

Idk I just don’t. He’d be in my scum pile if I didn’t already have 3

[Doughboy]

@rage. This is what I was talking about with regards to opinions.

I think you defended scum and pushed me. That game is over and I still think that. Regardless if you agree with it, that’s what I think.

That’s not a lie no matter how you try to spin it. It’s.... are you ready for it?


MY FUCKING OPINION

[Doughboy]

If you read the iso there was a point where I said I would ignore him because I see that he wont respond(so i could defend myself) and is just trolling.

This is the same kind of issue Ff got into that game also.

You don’t need to defend yourself from everything. I wasn’t calling you scum and I wasn’t voting you. Why did you make it a big deal?

It’s like when I said I thought ff needed to post more or whatever, that set him off and he started defending himself and it turned into an argument.

I don’t need to provide proof of my opinion because it’s subjective. I just proved my opinions and you’re still disagreeing with me.

Am I really scum cause you don’t agree with me? No

[Doughboy]

Why don't you trust Gamma?

Idk I just don’t. He’d be in my scum pile if I didn’t already have 3

So it's just a gut thing then? Let's say hypothetically Gamma was run up to L-1 would you hammer the slot?

Yes and yes

[Doughboy]

I really hate arguing over stupid things. That’s why I’ve dialed back my contributions this game. Rage scum reads me cause he doesn’t agree with my opinions of his play in another game. Saudade has broken site rules and didn’t get punished and then threatened to start an argument with me so I’d replace out.

These 2 have basically ruined the fun I was having and The only reason I haven’t replaced out is because I’m not letting rage and saudade troll me out of the game.

[Doughboy]

I havent been trolling.

When you call something a lie that isn’t and continue to say it’s a lie even after I’ve explained multiple times it’s a different opinion, yes you are trolling. A lie is an intentional statement meant to deceive. My opinion isn’t an intentional statement meant to deceive.

[Doughboy]

All you've been doing is yelling "Your bad town" "OMG Your so bad!!!!"

I say this because last game you were bad town. You tunneled on me (town) for things that weren’t alignment related type things. You just had a problem with my play and as you admitted, you didn't like me.

This game you are doing the exact same thing. You are calling me scum for things that you dislike, not things that’s are tied to an alignment.

I asked you last game to step back and reconsider. You refused

I asked you this game to step back and reconsider, and you still basically refused. Sure you moved your vote but you still scum read me for things you shouldn’t.

[Doughboy]

I’m seriously about the replace out. Rage is going to cost us a win and I can’t stand by and be a part of it.

[Doughboy]

Im calling you scum cuz I felt like you lied on me.

Town lie. Lying isn’t a scumtell.

Dude like I’ve already asked you earlier. Start taking this game seriously.

[Doughboy]

I don’t like the vote by wilky. Even if I wasn’t town reading rage, there are way better votes

[Doughboy]

because only one of those players I thought was lynchbait. Sauade is definitely not. I don’t think guerrilla is either.

[Doughboy]

I originally thought dva was lynch bait. So I see that one. Sauade knows what he’s doing. He’s doing it intentionally which means he isn’t lynchbait. Guerilla I fee is being coached to do what he’s doing.

[Doughboy]

Sure it’s an out there idea but it is also day 1. I’ve seen some crazy things happen in mafia before including that. I’ve seen scum death tunnel each other even. I really wish a sauade wagon would have gone through. He’s the best possible lynch imo.

[Doughboy]

That’s actually not weak reasoning at all. Town want to stop arguing. Scum want it to fan the flames.

[Doughboy]

It’s more reliable than scum reading somebody for lying.

[Doughboy]

Seems Woo skipped the lynch step and wanted to question the ppl who voted.

Rage, why don’t you scum read gamma for doing the same thing?

Saudade (5) - Doughboy, LTVNGambit, Tommy, GuerillaWoo, DVa
The peak of the wagon
I think it’s probably at least one of LTVNGambit or DVa, with Tommy also under consideration

You haven’t mentioned gamma once. The only time he appears in your iso is recently quoting posts from wilky.

If you felt skipping the lynch is scummy then gamma should have received a mention.

Also I was the first to say nobody should be examining the sauade wagon since we don’t know his alignment, now you're basically using my earlier idea for yourself while still scum reading me.

[Doughboy]

And you still want to take shots. Yea, your delusional. Crying like a baby threatening to replace out, go ahead.

At this point you just want to argue with me about any little thing.Not going to respond to you anymore this game, since there is no reasoning with you in any topic.

UNVOTE: woo
VOTE: doughboy

No. I literally want you to learn how to play mafia so we can win. When I’m dead you’ll blame me for “lying” when I’ve told you lying is done by both alignments. Any good mafia player will tell you that.

I pointed out that wilky’s Reason is hands down better than yours AND asked you a very good question and you want to start the fight again?

As long as you scum me for “lying“, I literally have no choice but to bring it up.

And where is this “you just want to argue with me about any little thing” coming from? I’m arguing with you about 1 main thing. It’s not “little” because it’s literally the only reason you are scum reading me. If it’s “little” you wouldn’t be death tunneling.

Please answer my question. Why didn’t gamma earn a scum read for doing what guerilla did?

Why don’t I get any credit for being the first to say looking at saude’s wagon before a lynch is bad?

[Doughboy]

Wilky- the reason I called the reasoning weak is due to using your reasoning the same argument can be made for db. He just has shorter responses compared to me.

Actually he can’t and I just explained why. If I want to engage with you to try and change your mind about me, I literally have no choice but to bring up the “lying” accusation.

Why can’t you just step back for a second and realize that this “lie” in the big scheme of things is not that big of a deal. It wasn’t even a lie. It’s a difference of opinion.

I didn’t make an intentionally false statement about you. I made an opinionated statement about you. One that’s biased by my opinion on how you played the first game.


Please for the sake of salvaging this game, drop this ridiculous reason for scum reading me. I’m
Begging you.

[Doughboy]

VOTE: prohawk

Flashwagon?

After a quick iso, I’ll hammer if he gets to l-1. He’s done less sorting than sauade which I thought was impossible

[Doughboy]

Also I'm glazing over any post that has the word "lying" in it

Why is that? We’ve had many accusations of lying. Explain why you are ignoring them.

[Doughboy]

Who said you weren't? You've been about as active and participating about as much as I have.

The difference is he nearly site flaked and you didn’t. You are still voting your rvs vote which somehow became serious because his “posts have been scummy”.

What kind of reason is that anyway?

[Doughboy]

VOTE: prohawk

Flashwagon?

After a quick iso, I’ll hammer if he gets to l-1. He’s done less sorting than sauade which I thought was impossible

What exactly do you want me to sort? Your personal vendetta from past games you've brought over?

1. I don’t have a personal vendetta against anyone. Rage started this bullshit and I’ve been trying to end it.
2. I want you to sort players in the game. I want you to scum hunt and be useful. Right now you look like lurking scum hoping to fly under the radar. You definitely don’t look like town who wants to find scum and win. If you are town, do something to change that please.

[Doughboy]

Why would you lie on him as town?

I wouldn’t. I haven’t but he doesn’t agree.

[Doughboy]

That’s actually not weak reasoning at all. Town want to stop arguing. Scum want it to fan the flames.

I think Ezekiel is calling the use of “this play is like my scumplay” weak, which I think is fair

I know what he was doing and it isn’t fair. He’s just going to disagree with anyone who says anything negative about him. What he is doing absolutely is more likely to come from scum. He keeps fanning the flames while continuing to do jack shit

[Doughboy]

Im calling you scum cuz I felt like you lied on me.

Town lie. Lying isn’t a scumtell.

Dude like I’ve already asked you earlier. Start taking this game seriously.

Wait I'm sorry, what did you lie about??

Absolutely nothing. He says my opinions about his play are lies.

[Doughboy]

Winner Winner, chicken dinner.

He didn’t win anything. That statement doesn’t change the fact that whether you want to admit it or not, town does lie.

imo, everything he said about me in regards to last game.

If I use your definition of lying. This is a lie. You don’t get to express your opinions if I don’t get the same courtesy

Why are you ignoring my game related questions? I am trying to get you to discuss something other than me supposedly lying, why don’t you move on already and answer that?

[Doughboy]

Ezekel if I were interested in your opinion I'd have asked you

Frustrated and snappy because you were almost lynched. I can understand.

No. He didn’t ask you a fucking question. You shouldn’t speak for others. That’s not on him, it’s on you.

We all know according to you my opinion is a lie.
Well your opinion is also a lie using your own definition of lies and not the actual definition.

[Doughboy]

uhm, other than me and db its been largely ignored. Nice try though.

As it should. It literally should have been dropped a long time ago. You can’t drop it. I’ve fucji begged you, you keep it going.

Do me a favor. Answer me honestly here.

Did the fight between ff and myself hurt or help town that game?

I ask cause we literally fought over a difference of opinion.

Sound familiar?

Please stop

[Doughboy]

Jfc you're insufferable

He really is. Last game my opinion of another player led to a 2 game day phase argument and we were both town.

He should know this argument is stupid and detrimental to the game yet he’s too hard headed to care.

Or maybe he actually is scum faking this whole thing. Idk but it needs to end already

[Doughboy]

Tommy - Not a fan of his recent comment re: Saudade, sounded like a fabricated reason to get off Saudade. Could be scum.
DVa - Posts have been scummy, very probable scum - I'm voting here.
GuerillaWoo - I like his engagement, town read
Saudade - I looked back at his scum-game early on, granted it was his first scum game, but he is definitely a lot less crass than he is here. Leaning town
Flubbernugget - Need more.
LTVNGambit - Leaning town, haven't seen anything jumping out at me.
Alchemist21 - No real read here yet.... setting this in the null/sort pile
Gamma Emerald - No real read here either... setting this in the null/sort pile
Doughboy - Early town read. Still town.
EzekelRAGE - Posts feel town.

Majority of reads are from the gut, hard for me to engage stuff with all of the fighting going on in the thread.

its mostly this post because I share similar reads

That wasn’t a good post tho...

[Doughboy]

and the fact that i read everything else by him and nothing pinged me as too odd

His lack of scum hunting wasn’t odd? His lack of actual reasons for scum reading dva wasn’t either?

Yeah you are scum.

VOTE: saudade

[Doughboy]

I don't even know what you accused me of and honestly I don't care lol, you don't seem like the kind to be reasoned with. Keep your vote on me.

He basically accused you of trying to find scum on saudade’s wagon without actually Lynching him.

He actually seemed mad that we didn’t lynch him which is weird.

My issue which I pointed it out is gamma did that also but he doesn’t mention that. Unless he’s scum reading both of you (which he’s not) he can’t use that reason for you.

He also completely ignored the fact that I was the first person to say that nobody should be doing that because we don’t know saudade is town.

[Doughboy]

You haven't even voted ProHawk once this game lmao

What was the point of this? I never said he’s scum so why would I vote him?

[Doughboy]

Actually one of us needs to die today.

VOTE: rage

I’m begging town to please lynch one of us. Keeping us both alive is a guaranteed loss. He won’t ever move on nobody what anyone else says.

Also major fos toward gamma. Instead of confirming what I said is true about town lying, he chose to fan the flame. I guarantee if I took the time to go through gamma’s games I could find examples of town lying.

[Doughboy]

Honestly I can't even get a beat on Ezekel. He's gone on with this so long I can't make heads or tails of him. I understand you're frustrated but I'd rather hold off on lynching him right. I get the sense that this D1 is barreling towards a lynch just out of frustration.

If he’s not going to move on l, I’m going to policy lynch him

[Doughboy]

You haven't even voted ProHawk once this game lmao

What was the point of this? I never said he’s scum so why would I vote him?

\

and the fact that i read everything else by him and nothing pinged me as too odd

His lack of scum hunting wasn’t odd? His lack of actual reasons for scum reading dva wasn’t either?

Yeah you are scum.

VOTE: saudade

???

Use your words

[Doughboy]

make take a break of the site its hurting you

No it’s not. I’m good. I do want to win though and rage’s stubbornness isn’t going to ruin another game.

We’re on page 29 and he’s still arguing that because he doesn’t agree with my opinion of him, I’m scum who lied when I’m not scum and I never lied.

He was a big part of outing a Pr that game and I’m not letting him ruin this one anymore.

Today should be him or me. I’ll self vote if have to but I really don’t want to be lynched. I like my role and I was having fun. The idea of 29 more pages of “he lied” isn’t going to be fun and he refuses to move on.

[Doughboy]

Prohawk only recently came on my radar. If you actually read the game 3 times like you said, you would have noticed that. The stuff I said about him is stuff I said recently. I haven’t voted him cause I scum read others more. I’d lynch him if a wagon formed on him though.

You saying that post was good, when imo it was terrible and that you see his actions as good, when again I disagree, is just more confirmation you have to be scum. No town looks at his iso and comes away with a town read imo.

[Doughboy]

You wrong

Possibly but you could be too, if you are even town which I don’t think you are.

[Doughboy]

I’m not switching my vote. As long as rage is alive I’m leaving my vote on him. I gave him many chances to back off. I begged many times.

Fuck him

[Doughboy]

Meh. Can both if you drop this now pretty please...

As long as I’m being scum read for “lying” which I didn’t do, I can’t drop it.

Him ignoring me but still scum reading me for it doesn’t actually solve anything either.

If he REALLY thinks my opinion is a intentional deceptive lie, then he has to deal with those consequences.

All I’m trying to do is teach him that not all lies are scum aligned. Also that a personal opinion isn’t a lie.


What would be helpful is if every other player told him the same thing, but nobody has so far.

Gamma is actually throwing gasoline on the fire by encouraging him which is why he gets a major fos. He doesn’t want the fighting to stop. That’s suspicious as hell because this fighting is no good for the game.

Jfc, two games somebody picks a fight with me, I try to end it and I get shit on. Such bullshit

[Doughboy]

Will not address anything db has to post about me for remainder of the game. For the betterment of the game.

This doesn’t solve the problem. Ignoring me isn’t the solution.

Answer my question about gamma/guerilla please.

[Doughboy]

Jfc you're insufferable

He really is. Last game my opinion of another player led to a 2 game day phase argument and we were both town.

He should know this argument is stupid and detrimental to the game yet he’s too hard headed to care.

Or maybe he actually is scum faking this whole thing. Idk but it needs to end already

t this point I think you’re baiting him here

No I’m not. This entire time I’ve been trying to explain to him his reasons for scum reading me is wrong and quite frankly stupid. You should know this yet you keep taking his side.

Why aren’t you telling him that him thinking my opinion of his play isn’t actually a lie?
Why aren’t you telling him that death tunneling me for this “lie” isn’t a good idea?

I have to conclude it’s because you don’t want him to. I refuse to believe it’s because you actually agree with him.

[Doughboy]

viewtopic.php?f=2&t=76139

@tommy thus is the game here.

I jump on Gus's d1 opinion and exaggerated how much I disagreed with it. I then argued about it for a bit whilst insisting that Gus was misrepping me. The insisting of the misrep is like how Ezekel is persisting with the lying push. I also escaped having to post much of my own content d1 using this tactic and dragged bbt into it again insisting he was misrepping me

Haven’t read the game yet but does sound like what’s happening here.

Can somebody else ask rage why he’s not holding gamma to the same standard as woo?

They both looked at saude’s wagon for scum but only woo gets scum read for it and gamma stays null?

Doesn’t make sense to me.

[Doughboy]

Im calling you scum cuz I felt like you lied on me.

Town lie. Lying isn’t a scumtell.

Dude like I’ve already asked you earlier. Start taking this game seriously.

Why would you lie on him as town?

Hello mr. gasoline man.

Throwing gas on the fire. This post doesn’t seem like you want him to stop. I never once said I lied, so why would you ask me why I did if not to get a reaction out of me/rage?

[Doughboy]

Welcome Toranga.

@doughboy that last post has me thinking that Gamma's right. Ezekel seems happy to move on but you're baiting him as gamma said.

I tried to stop the fight. I got pushed passed my breaking point and I don’t give a crap anymore. I’ll drop it when he admits I didn’t lie and he rescinds his scumread on me.

[Doughboy]

Dude you can’t say “I never said I lied” when you call it a lie there

sorry, you clearly misread. I never admitted to lying because I never lied.

I was explaining to him that lies aren't scumtells. town and scum both lie for whatever reasons, just because a player lies, that doesn't make them scum. He thinks I lied remember?

[Doughboy]

Like I agree that it’s probably a difference of opinion but you called it a lie right there

show me where I admitted I lied.

[Doughboy]

Can somebody else ask rage why he’s not holding gamma to the same standard as woo?

[Doughboy]

yeah this is what i said

Town lie. Lying isn’t a scumtell.

it was basically me bringing this post back up again

lying isn’t a scumtell. People need to get over the “omg he lied so he must be scum”.

lies are usually lies. They are opinions or misrememberings or something else completely. Town and scummbith do it and stupid fights break out about it. Look for true scum motivation.

I didn't admit to lying, I don't think i did. Do I have a different opinion of his play than he has of his own? absolutely but that doesn't make me a liar and it certainly doesn't make me scum. Maybe it makes me a shitty dude with a bad memory which is probably closer to the truth.

[Doughboy]

and that should be "lies aren't usually lies"

I really wish rage would take a step back and regroup. That is all I haved wanted from him the entire game. He doesn't want to do that, that's fine but now he wants to completely ignore me like I don't exist and that isn't fine.

I have questions I would like answered.

[Doughboy]

i'm going back to posting once a day. That seemed to be better for everyone.

[Doughboy]

and that should be "lies aren't usually lies"

I really wish rage would take a step back and regroup. That is all I haved wanted from him the entire game. He doesn't want to do that, that's fine but now he wants to completely ignore me like I don't exist and that isn't fine.

I have questions I would like answered.

Ezekiel just said he’d ignore you
This is why I think you’re baiting him

But he shouldn’t be. He shouldn’t be ignoring anyone. What he should be doing is admitting his reason for pushing me was weak, because it is.

He should also explain why yet again he’s holding people to different standards. Guerilla gets a scum read for analyzing saudade’s wagon yet you get a null read?

I get a scum read for lying but gambit gets a null read when he was accused of lying?

He’s clearly pushing an agenda. Things can’t be scumtells for one person and not for the other.

I’m not baiting him, I’m trying to engage him on something other than the lies. I asked him a serious question which deserves a serious response. Ignoring it isn’t an option.

He can replace out if he can’t play well in the sandbox.

Can somebody else PLEASE FOR THE LOVE OF GOD ask rage why it’s scummy for guerilla to look at saude’s wagon but it isn’t for gamma?

Here’s another one. Ask him why gambit is null when he lied also? Guerilla accuses gambit of lying and lying to him is a scumtell.

Cmon peeps. Let’s hold useless people accountable and get them to answer some god damn questions.

Hawk isn’t the only useless player.

[Doughboy]

@LTVNGambit Now that you pointed it out, it is odd that Guerilla hoped off that Suade train, especially with the post saying whether Suad is town or not, they have no problem with them Suade being lynched.

it's really not, it's just a pro-town unvote when the moment calls for it. guerilla could stay on that wagon hiding behind a grudge if he wanted to, and nobody would bat an eye at that. he unvoted cause he wants to avoid the very short gameday. guerilla is almost definitely town regardless of saudade's alignment.

425 I further looked at it. That posts outlines my thoughts on the unvote. I sided with it being more town move.

Great since he mentions the post here.

@toranga.

Now ask him why he found guerilla scummy for analyzing the saude wagon but didn’t find gamma scummy for it.

[Doughboy]

you're not toxic at all

Incorrect. He became toxic when he violated site rules by discussing an ongoing game and threatening to bully me into replacing out.

[Doughboy]

Can people who aren't on either of the two main wagons either switch votes or convince three or four others to join them?

what the fuck is this

I actually don’t have an issue with this post. It was clear town was locked on those 2 and nobody was making a good argument for anyone else.

[Doughboy]

it's probably guerilla and prohawk

Idk how you can narrow it down so quickly. Gamma/Saudade/rage/dva all are legit possibilities also.

[Doughboy]

so is ezekel

Why? He’s avoided playing the game

[Doughboy]

saudade is towny too

Another player who hasn’t done anything

[Doughboy]

Can you please ask rage why he scumreads guerilla for scum hunting off saudade’s wagon ( which is sort of a180 from an earlier post) but doesn’t scum read gamma for the same thing?

[Doughboy]

I mean sure doughboy, I can be wrong about everything, it's just where I'm leaning rn

I disagree that saudade didn't do anything. he has actually done a lot and has pretty nuanced/smart takes on most slots which is what I expect from him as town

His pushes/votes are bad. He does nothing until he’s at l-1 and then does minimal scum hunting. It’s easy to have good reads when you are informed and that is what it looks like. He’s definitely informed.

He tried to say tommy scum slipped for saying me v rage was probably t v t. That’s ridiculous

[Doughboy]

you're having a great game outside of being clearly pissed with ezekel before the game even started and that's letting you go off rails with garbage no one needs to read tbh

I don't care about your grudge and I'm not asking ezekel dick, alright? IDK why that's even relevant anyway. sometimes the WAY people do things is scummy outside of just the actions. guerilla's posting is different than gamma's posting. gamma is nuanced, calm, smart. guerilla is not those things x10.

I actually cane into this game with no ill will towards anyone. Rage is new and clearly inexperienced. He went off the rails because he didn’t agree with my opinion of him. He did something this game that seemed different then the other game and I said something cause it was noteworthy

[Doughboy]

I think I’m about done with this game.

[Doughboy]

you're having a great game outside of being clearly pissed with ezekel before the game even started and that's letting you go off rails with garbage no one needs to read tbh

I don't care about your grudge and I'm not asking ezekel dick, alright? IDK why that's even relevant anyway. sometimes the WAY people do things is scummy outside of just the actions. guerilla's posting is different than gamma's posting. gamma is nuanced, calm, smart. guerilla is not those things x10.

I actually cane into this game with no ill will towards anyone. Rage is new and clearly inexperienced. He went off the rails because he didn’t agree with my opinion of him. He did something this game that seemed different then the other game and I said something cause it was noteworthy

you don't think a new inexperienced player like him would be scum here, do you?

Actually I do. But I can’t go into it without referencing the other game which I’m not allowed to do even if it’s over.

[Doughboy]

I’ve been instructed by the mod not the bring up anything from other games as it relates to rage. That’s the 2nd game where the mod has influenced my play. I’ll still talk about the lying cause that’s actually not about that game, but I won’t talk about anything else regarding it.

[Doughboy]

Paraphrasing of course. Can’t quote the mod directly

[Doughboy]

Although I believe I touched on it earlier when rage started his push on me. Feel free to look through my iso. I don’t care to do it

[Doughboy]

mod vote count please.

[Doughboy]

I’m definitely not saying anything about his play ever again. After this game I’m not even going to mention his name.

Nothing about that game has any bearing over my scum read this game so it’s irrelevant. I just could see a scenario where scum rage picks a fight with me so he gets written off as town. That’s all.

[Doughboy]

wait, what? you can't talk specifically about what you perceive as different play from town!ezekel to thisgame!ezekel? if that game is finished you should be allowed to say it. unless there's something I'm missing or something you're misinterpreting, there's absolutely nothing wrong about you talking about ezekel's play in a finished game.

The mod told me via pm not to continue fighting about outside issues. Which is laughable because this fight was never about outside issues but anyway, I take that to mean don’t bring up shit from that game anymore so I won’t.

[Doughboy]

Gambit vs Guerilla(Saudade voting) – I can see both sides of this. While I did find it odd that Woo would unvote the Saud lynch because he stated he didn’t care if he got lynched or not. I myself wouldn’t have questioned the lynch since there are only 2 scum this game. Meaning most of the ppl voting Saudade were town. It’s day 1, not much to go on. So let Saudade lynch happen, check flip, question those who did driveby votes the next day phase.

Seems Woo skipped the lynch step and wanted to question the ppl who voted.
I can read that as town actually wondering how the wagon formed. I wondered the same, but would’ve went about It differently.
I can read it as a play from scum.

Slightly reading it as a town action path reading up til that point.

I don’t know how to read Saudade and his play style.

Will read up on everything after that.

Toranga. Help me out for a second. Am I misreading this or is rage saying he slightly town reads guerilla for his actions.

[Doughboy]

you're being a little grumpy though

ausuka didn't tell you not to bring up meta, just don't have a fight about his mistakes in that game

you're totally doing this, right? I read this game today, I know how you've been dealing with ezekel and it feels like outside the game grudge that no one but the two of you care about. that's what she doesn't want happening here probably. you can bring up past games just fine. she is not modding your right to case people.

You’re clearly misreading it. I had no ill will towards rage until he started accusing me of lying. He effectively shut down scum hunting all together and tunneled me because I “lied” and I spent the day trying to get him to stop.

[Doughboy]

Whatever. Y’all think what you want. I know the truth and that’s all that matters.

[Doughboy]

yeah he does. you find it scummy that he does? you think he is scum with guerilla?

Do an iso of him starting at that post. Look how many posts he makes before calling him scum and putting him at l-1.

[Doughboy]

[Doughboy]

Can you explain what you mean by confirmation bias there?

In this particular context it's that I'm town and scum is jumping on my lynch which was originally pushed by Flubber

that isn't what confirmation bias means...

if I wasn't locked on rage, i'd vote you also. You have done nothing and now you are under pressure you respond aggressively while still doing nothing.

[Doughboy]

Can you explain what you mean by confirmation bias there?

In this particular context it's that I'm town and scum is jumping on my lynch which was originally pushed by Flubber

that isn't what confirmation bias means...

if I wasn't locked on rage, i'd vote you also. You have done nothing and now you are under pressure you respond aggressively while still doing nothing.

[Doughboy]

VOTE: Tommy

966 is the scummiest post in the whole game imo.

no it isn't. not by a long shot.

you have never had a paranoia moment before? While I don't think his scenario is actually what is going on, it very well could be a possibility. Toranga backing off after making very good points to lynch hawk does seem weird.


You were one of my strongest town reads and with 1 post you flushed it all down the drain. such a shame.

[Doughboy]

You should keep an open mind

[Doughboy]

You were one of my strongest town reads and with 1 post you flushed it all down the drain. such a shame.

Funny because with a single post Tommy managed to make me shift away from Guerilla. That should tell you just how scummy I find that post.

[Doughboy]

I think prohawk's attitude is a towny one. he is daring people to vote him. it's not something I see scum do that often on d1.

I have actually seen scum do this a few times. It's a scare tactic. makes people think exactly what you are thinking.

[Doughboy]

to me it seems like he is saying you are rather defensive, I can't wait to see what he actually meant...

[Doughboy]

A question is not an attack, and yes the natural response to an attack is fight or flight.

calling you scum isn't an attack.

when I mentioned you weren't sorting people, you took a cheap shot at me/rage by mentioning the fight.

sorting people means scum hunting, asking questions, trying to solve the game. your response to me was completely unacceptable if you are town. You have basically lurked most of the game and then compared yourself to somebody who supposedly didn't know he was in the game (obviously we can't verify this but his lack of activity on site makes me lean to being truthful)

Once people started noticing how little you have done to help town find scum, people started voting you or saying they could see you as scum. Instead of ignoring these people and getting down to business, you reply with very aggressive posts.

nobody is attacking you. we are calling you scum because you have played scummy. The most interesting that stood out is when somebody mentioned you, you showed up within 15 minutes. That to me looks like active lurking which is more often done by scum.

You also made a comment about being "lost in the aggressiveness" but here you are dialing it up.


if you can't take being called scum, take up checkers

[Doughboy]

side note, I thank the mod for the recent VC, but this site doesn't have an automated VC? That seems like it would be very easy to implement. Sort of like how mafia universie has?

a VC on every page top automatically would be awesome.

[Doughboy]

Brb learning programming.

[Doughboy]

An attack on my effort in this game, which granted hasn't been top-notch, but also hasn't been nothing either. - No scum calling here.

A pretty factual statement about your effort. You’ve done nothing this game. You can protest all you want but not a lot of people are disagreeing.

An attack on my reads which are being discredited as false.

As far as reads lists goes, this is a very weak attempt. I made a point earlier about how you could have done a better job. “So and so made a bunch of scummy posts so he’s probably scum” paraphrasing of course. A real reads list has some substance behind it. At least link 3/4 really scummy posts and explain why you think they are scummy.

An attack again on my effort.

Factual statement about your effort. You have done jack fucking squat all game. Active lurking and now you’ve been caught doing it, you claim people are attacking you which is bullshit.

People giving their opinions of your play this game, is not and never will be an attack

People have to give reasons why they think you are scum, or could be scum. Those things you just quoted were those reasons.

Feel free to do the same for my posts, I’ll be more than happy to school you some more.

[Doughboy]

I can handle people calling me scum, it's part of the game. What I dislike is people being assholes.

Nobody has been an asshole to you yet. I can start if you’d like.

[Doughboy]

Somebody put him to l-1 and I’ll hammer

[Doughboy]

Aww you got my hopes up.

[Doughboy]

didn't you find wilky's last post a little weird? why is he quoting that post if all he did was talk about prod dodging?

Sure but I’ve accidentally quoted things before. Let’s wait and see what he says

[Doughboy]

Fuck he was at l-1 this whole time? Smh. I wanted the hammer.

[Doughboy]

Good riddance imo. He did nothing and got pissed when called out on it. Lurkers suck

[Doughboy]

well I did just hammer that guy btw, he wasn't l-2 cause gamma voted him

I just somehow trusted you weren't saying l-2 when it was l-1

I forgot gamma voted. That’s my bad.

[Doughboy]

Yes you did

[Doughboy]

You like to argue don't you?

I really don’t but when people say things that aren’t true, I’ll correct them.

[Doughboy]

Who was going to give me that dictionary? Pretty sure Doughboy just defined asshole for me right there...

a stupid, annoying, or detestable person

So half the player list are assholes including you.

Now don’t lurk anymore

[Doughboy]

That was Merriam Webster’s definition

[Doughboy]

Dude it’s just a game. Sorry if you are actually town.

[Doughboy]

I’m down for a gamma lynch at some point but I think rage will be confirmed scum tomorrow.

[Doughboy]

Interesting reaction from rage...

[Doughboy]

Smh

[Doughboy]

You were one of my strongest town reads and with 1 post you flushed it all down the drain. such a shame.

Funny because with a single post Tommy managed to make me shift away from Guerilla. That should tell you just how scummy I find that post.

At least I was right to facepalm this.

Had dva not replaced out we could have lynched gurellia day 1.