Mini Normal 2035 : Duck Mafia Part 1 : GAME OVER

[Tchill13]

This isn't my scum game it's my I don't care game.

[Tchill13]

Why would boon check someone who he thinks is scum last night phase?

Make the case for town Dave this game.

Tell me why this is scum me. You know my scum game. Point to a game where I was this unactive the entire time.

[Tchill13]

I'm what world do I play FA going down like I did as his scum partner?

[Tchill13]

You said you had no ego then continue to talk about your flawless record of me.

You almost give up on the game, then you reread and determine I'm scum because you don't have a good reason to believe anything as factual.

My agenda of associating myself with one player just so he's lynched after me is bad. I never play to get lynched.

[Tchill13]

Tchill, are you very active as town too? I looked at mini normal 2021 and you had over 500 posts despite dying on day 2. If you aren't really playing like you normally would, why should previous meta be considered?

I'm usually active as both alignments.

If you want to throw meta out the window then so be it. I understand the process. I'm just trying to get through to una.

[Tchill13]

Hey Dave, congratulations. You're gonna win.

WHY IS DAVE TOWN? FOR THE LOVE SOMEONE ANSWER THAT. IF I WASN'T PUSHING HIM YOU WOULDN'T BE DETERMINED TO MAKE HIM TOWN.

[Tchill13]

I hope your scum. I hope your scum I hope you scum.


WHY IS DAVE TOWN. HOW IS DAVE TOWN.

[Tchill13]

I want Dave lynched. Then we go from there. The issue is that if una is town and doesn't vote with us scum have to bus to get Dave lynched.

[Tchill13]

The only way Dave is town is due to setup spec. That's it. That's all he's got.

[Tchill13]

Una. If you're truly convinced I'm scum and that I still tried to kill boon even though the claimed protective stated he would protect boon.

Then you are determined to believe I'm scum and will do what's necessary to make that fit. I have major issues with you taking the blame because it'll be the blame of a town loss.

Anyone here who votes me as scum believes I'm extremely stupid not only in the way that I handled the FA lynch but also in my attempt to night kill boon. So thanks.

[Tchill13]

WHY
IS
DAVE
TOWN.

Answer this before you place a vote. Answer that with no relation to me pushing him. Answer it with at least 3 reasons.

[Tchill13]

Why were you worried about the FA lynch anyways? I thought you said he was really scummy?

Honestly. From what I can remember I was worried about wilky because he was lurking as scum once when I played with him.

As for FA I literally don't know why. I thought it was a mislynch. I had bigger fish to fry. Then someone said something about the deadline and I just said screw it.

[Tchill13]

Good lord.

Practicality ppl. Yall need to learn the definition of it.

If Dave is town. Scum either no killed or they shot at boon.

It's very well documented I'm a player of logic. Usually the thing that makes the most sense logically is the thing I tend to lead toward.

Other than setup spec. There is no reason to believe Dave is town. The possibilities of the night action would mean scum are stupid or scum are smart.

Why can't scum be average? That's what I'm assuming. Not too dumb to attempt to kill boon. Not too smart to no kill.

And the no kill being "smart" is debatable. Sure there's wifom. The game is also in lylo atm if scum killed Dave last night and boon visited scum (which is a popular assumption atm). It'd be very difficult to find a situation where scum would rather be in mylo than lylo due to the fact at the end of the day, town can ultimately decide to no lynch and play out another day phase. Had scum killed Dave this wouldn't be an option.

And from every perspective there would be scum teams that still make sense even with Dave dead such as (tchill/CT) (reundo/anyone honestly) (nonny has been scummy as hell and if not for Dave being obv scum I'd probably scum read nonny).

So this idea that the no kill was a genius move is bogus anyways.

And using only setup spec to clear Dave is not optimal due to the fact ppl can clearly disagree with setup spec (and be right to do so) and the setup just not be what players think are balanced.

All I'm asking you ppl is to believe that the most likely outcome is probably what happened.

Yall can't because of 2 things. Una believes they can never read me wrong. So not being able to solve the game as resulted in una settling on a tchill Sr. Which I've given valid reason to SR but the situation doesn't point to scum tchill. "Outside the box" could very well mean that reundo was checked, like Dave said, as much as it could mean boon re-checked me. DO NOT act like boon revisiting me is written in stone.

2nd, CT believes scum are purposefully leaving PR's alive as lynch bait. Now this theory has substantial help from his FAKE CLAIM which is already damaging to town. If he chooses to only believe this theory then he will do what he has to to refuse to SR Dave.

This is a scenario where CONFBIAS is being used over PRACTICALLITY. For both players.

[Tchill13]

Here are the reasons why I believe Davesaz might be town:
His claim fits the setup(there is usually a protective role) and I think there might be two scum PR's.
FA shaded him during day three
I know the scumteam left two townies who were claiming PR's on night 2 alive so they could say them surviving meant one of them was scum based on 577, so I think the scumteam in this game is quite clever.
In 602, Dave gave an explanation for the nightkill I hadn't thought of yet. Since I know the scum were pushing me because my survival was scummy, this doesn't fit the scum agenda since it provides a good explanation for my survival.
I know Dave likes to question people from my previous game with him, so his questions to Reundo don't seem that odd to me. The only thing I'm really suspicious of at this point is why he choose Nonny and Wilky over Reundo and FA. I would like him to answer that.

Overall, I still think there is a good chance Dave is scum. However, I have enough reasons to doubt his guilt at the moment to consider the possibility that the scumteam is trying to play everyone. Especially since nobody came out as a role that can prevent a death after I asked for claims.

@ct. One of your reasons to believe Dave is town is that FA shaded him day 3.

There is absolutely no interaction between FA and Nonny. Does that mean nonny is scum?

[Tchill13]

That is a LOT of flailing coming from CT trying to use conjecture to justify why he is still alive. And he has really not been pushed on it either.

Scum is ct/una

CT this is scum taking advantage of a dumb fake claim. You've thrown around the idea that gamaa was Role copped n1. Who's to say you weren't role copped n1? And scum KNEW you were lying?

I don't believe this to be the case, I'm using your own argument against you. So please answer it.

[Tchill13]

You also state that you know scum would push you because you were scummy. What's going to keep town from pushing you because you were scummy? Is town supposed to be able to read your mind and know you're not scum?

[Tchill13]

Why would boon check someone who he thinks is scum last night phase?

Because we finally nailed scum last day.
And, you know...

@Unah - how many games have we played together recently? 7-8 games This Year, I’d say?

You should know I like to play risky....

..just something Boon yet again said.

This still doesn't make sense. Why would boon "risk" visiting scum which could be a direct effect on town being in lylo the next day phase?

From boons perspective he could have cleared another player while heading into mylo, since he'd be protected by Dave, or he could kill himself and leave town with an indirect crumb while he knows Dave is the most likely to die, leaving town in lylo.

Sure boon is crazy. He's not dumb though. He would never willingly put town in lylo unless he knew town would win. Obviously he didn't. Because town is about as torn as can be in mylo atm.

[Tchill13]

Replace Nonny for Dave, I guess in my thing.

I understand that and loud is kinda bleh right there for scum.

And UNA I never missed this. I clearly, clearly stated I believed boon got paranoid and backed that up by providing his quote of Dave remembering to interact with his scum mates and also pointing out that boon clearly stated not to blame the game on him. Showing hesitancy.

[Tchill13]

I think scum here, any scum team here, would have killed Dave. It's a sure fire kill correct? Not only that but

if scum were to purposely kill boon it validates his night action.

I think your perspective is a bit flawed here. (the bolded)

Let's assume scum know where Boon is targeting.
Like, for certain KNOW where he is targeting.
If it's a visit on scum, they kill someone else (likely dave) to make it a LyLo, OR leave dave alive for the WIFOM of why he's not dead. (MyLo)
They win with just one mislynch on either scenario, so it doesn't matter from their perspective.
The only trusted town and the best "detective" is dead too.
All they need to do, is to make sure there isn't a one sure-fire way to read Boons "riddle" (I bet there really wasn't), and then just ARGUE ABOUT THE INTERPRETATION IF ANYONE SAYS BOON VISITED ONE OF THEM.

We really could be living through this scenario here.

If it's a visit on town, they want to kill that townie to give 0 actual confirmations AND they can still kill Boon the night after since dave will be out of shots. (we obviously know this didn't happen, but this was the alternative IF scum knew who Boon was about to target.)

oh i missed this. You're gonna blatantly disregard the fact that the diffference between mylo and lylo means something to scum. That giving town an out opposed to making sure this day phase is the last one isn't valuable to scum. Let me ask you something una, if im really smart enough to set this up for dave, Whats keeping me from going to lylo and painting the picture of a scum team consisteing of (nonny/reundo/CT)? Because only ONE of those players could be my scum partner from your perspective in that scenario. You don't think i'd be able to make a convincing case out of a mixture of 2 low content players and someone who im pretty sure fake claimed as town?

I understand the thought process. Tchill is an evil genius who wanted to ML Dave in mylo, not lylo. I'm glad you think that highly of me, I really am. This doesn't explain why i handled the FA lynch in the manner that I did. This doesn't explain why dave not only was on the 2 mislynches, but also didn't help lynch FA and made sure NOT to put FA for vengekill shortly after calling FA a scum lean.

[Tchill13]

speaking of setup balance. There's a world in which we lose 3 townies n1 and 2 townies n2. due to novice vig n2 and boon visiting scum n1. the novice modifier stops the possibility of 4 townies from dying n1.

[Tchill13]

I'm abandoning the no kill theory for now. I initially thought the scumteam might have included someone who figured out what Flavor's crumb meant and therefore knew that he was probably visiting scum. Since nobody, even Una, is entirely sure what Flavor meant at this point, I think that's unlikely now. So at this point, I think there are two real possibilities. Dave is scum or the scumteam have a second power role.

Dave, why did you select Wilky and Nonny as vengekill targets in 491?

why can't dave BE the 2nd PR? As a loud role as scum, which we know him to be loud at least, he would have to fake claim obviously.

[Tchill13]

This is ridiculous. I'll be damned if someone who fake claimed an even night doctor AND NEVER GOT NK'D gets me lynched.

You've gotten a pass from others but that's scummy has hell man. You're just flinging shit at me to see if it'll stick at this point.

I actually fully agree with you on this.
No matter what FA flips, if I ever wake up to a D4 I'm still going after CT.
I'm willing to give my life into Boons hands for today, but I'm a bit worried he has given a pass to some players too soon..

One of Chill/CT is scum, I can still feel it in my bones.

Yeah, I’m starting to feel that way. Don’t put it all in my hands, haha.

@Unah - Join my mind and think outside the box.

who boon visited doesn't matter to me due to the fact i believe boon died regardless of visiting town or scum since scum shot him.

"outside the box".761 quote is the box. 773 quote is outside the main box, which in my mind means he attempted to visit CT due to "no matter what FA flips, if i ever wake up to d4 im going after CT."

the main reason he'd visit CT is because you basically admit that you're planning on tunneling CT. So if he can clear CT isn't that a huge advantage in his eyes? To keep someone he strongly TR's from tunneling someone he believes to be town due to boons 2 propositions not including CT?

WHICH MEANS... From boons perspective he'd plan on going to mylo (due to "dave the doc" protecting him but being killed by scum) With a town block of (Boon, CT, Una) against tchill (town lean) and nonny/reundo (his LAST proposed scum mates with FA)

I'm pretty sure this was boon's thought process. Definitely better interpretation and reasoning than what has been proposed so far.

[Tchill13]

If I die anyways, it’s confirmed there is a roleblocker and Tchill can’t necessarily be considered town. If I die, and someone else dies, I expect Unah to figure out who i targeted.

he said this before FA flipped Role blocker. While this could mean he meant the possibility he was role blocked while checking me.

I believe he means there's a role blocker due to dave being RB'd and Boon dying because of a lack of protection. He had just switched dave to town shortly before this post. This post was made before Boon knew the RB was about to flip.

[Tchill13]

Shit, that was a very good page. Don’t wholly disagree with anything when laid out that way. I’m still more confidant in Dave though so will keep vote there for now.

Which also explains this post. Picks the townie of the three that i proposed.

Yeah, that fits nicely.

Nonny, Reundo, FA.

I’m going FA first.

and if you pair this with my explanation of the crumb, I think he checked CT guys. Checking CT is where he has the most to gain if he trult beilieves una to be town, along with CT, which he did obviously because they're not a part of the proposed scum team.

[Tchill13]

this concludes tchill's epidemic of not only the case for scum dave, but the idealogy of boon visiting Ct

Please flip the CD over to side 2 to find out who tchill believes is dave's partner...

[Tchill13]

I recognize Dave and Popo, but I haven't played with anyone else here.
VOTE: Profili

VOTE: Completly Trustworthy

Lies in the first post. I have played with you before.

Like..he says that Carca IS scum, I can see that in conjuction with his gambit, but then Chill/Gamma/Me?

That is the part that bothers me the most.

The three that would have known I’d have been gambiting from the get go, and I was trying to see if I could find any correlation in regards to communication towards the scum team had any of you been scum.

I was kinda trying to force communication within the scum team to potentially make one of the other players Freudian slip through insider knowledge only one of the three of you would know well.

To be fair, players like Dave/FA are also aware of how I play, but not to the extent you guys are.

I am but never thought you would gambit like this.

Did you even remotely consider the fact that you could have hard outed town pr roles and did give scum more information than they should have? This was a terrible gambit - even for you boon.

That said, car responded to that like garbage.

VOTE: Carcalilly

Why try and undermine FL and throw shade at what he was doing when it was almost complete? Further, why claim that you cannot target anyone? Does that have a single town motivation? Looks to me like you were tryharding to sound town.

On that same token: una does the same shit in 292 - the entire second statement:
"I'd also like to point out that I knew for a near certainty that it was a gambit from the get go. Mainly because I was asked to be the last one, and there's absolutely no result Boon could have that would suggest me doing anything last night."

^ that statement serves no purpose other than tryharding to be town. tchill does something simular but he comes off much more genuine than una and much more constant. Tchill also does not just throw out information on what he did or did not do in night actions. Una does it just here and it looks to me only because boon put him at the end.

Finally, Gamma attacks FL for a good reason in my opinion BUT jumps right off. What was that about? Scum lean here as well.

Those are my top 3 at this point.

That is a LOT of flailing coming from CT trying to use conjecture to justify why he is still alive. And he has really not been pushed on it either.

Scum is ct/una

VOTE: Completly Trustworthy

this is FA's vote history, with a SR of CT there in the middle.

He only had 24 post. So using practically a 3rd of them to push CT shouldn't be considered distancing imo. This, among other things, leads to a town lock of CT for me.

CT has been consistent in one thing. Ego. A fake claim to save himself as town along with Refusing to remove his confbias of the scum agenda screams egotistical town imo. i've never been one to read tone, but thats the vibe im getting there. So that plus FA's iso almost clears him completely for me.

[Tchill13]

Need to catch up. Won’t happen tonight, had a crazy work week.

FAQ2 hasn’t even stood out so need to iso there.
Is an even night doc even confirmable?

not only is there not a single mention of nonny from FA...

there's not a single mention of Reundo either. Now if we were to go down this rabbit hole. It'd mean that a scum team of nonny/fa/reundo could be feasible. now THAT is a team i wouldn't be surpised to learn they shot boon anyways, after the protective announced he'd be on boon.

This would also validate the "outside the box, round, reundo" crumb. Now i just talked myself into Boon visiting CT.... But i gotta admit this team is at least feasible. The only thing is reundo has consistently pushed nonny. reundo even has FA and nonny at the bottom of a readslist together.

would also explain why town is pulling in opposite ways. It'd explain the shade reundo is throwing at dave atm.

[Tchill13]

"outside the box".761 quote is the box. 773 quote is outside the main box, which in my mind means he attempted to visit CT due to "no matter what FA flips, if i ever wake up to d4 im going after CT."

Believe it or not, I had this written down yesterday before I went to sleep, but decided I was just getting too excited and saw things that weren't there!
I still think this could point to you, however, but I'm not gonna phonepost about it now.

i think boon had real reason to check CT.

[Tchill13]

im not sure who dave's partner is. CT and Una are conftown which would mean it has to be one of nonny and reundo.

[Tchill13]

Who would be partner for scum!cr Tchill?

Fa literally didn't mention reundo or nonny not once.

this gives us good setup spec in Dave actually being the doc.

[Tchill13]

can someone tell me if they feel that reundo or nonny have sorted much this game?

[Tchill13]

so where i currently sit is dave is scum with (nonny/ruendo)

or the scum team is (nonny/Ruendo)

CT and Una are lock town. I'm doing my best to weigh all my options here. That's the only 2 scenarios i can believe to be true.

My gut says dave is scum because boon checked CT last night (had the most to gain from checking CT due to boons lock town status of Una and his lean town status of CT and surviving to mylo if dave is actually town) which would mean it's literally 50/50 between nonny and reundo. Nonny has pushed Dave the whole game. Reundo has pushed nonny consistently.

Dave is scum with reundo. Boon checked CT last night. I'm putting this here to celebrate by myself when town loses this game.

had Boon not had the most to gain from checking CT (seen from a crumb even una admits to have seen) then I'd go full tilt towards nonny/reundo. BUT, i believe boon checked a town CT. Which by default means Dave must be scum.

[Tchill13]

una was locktown. CT was a town lean boon wanted to have cleared in mylo due to Una stating una would tunnel CT day 4.

Una/CT/Boon against a town lean in tchill and the rest of

Shit, that was a very good page. Don’t wholly disagree with anything when laid out that way. I’m still more confidant in Dave though so will keep vote there for now.

Which also explains this post. Picks the townie of the three that i proposed.

Yeah, that fits nicely.

Nonny, Reundo, FA.

I’m going FA first.

How could Boon die if CT is town? If dave was scum of course, which boon originally thought.

This being said, dave also made sure to state that Tchill would stay available as a mislynch option.

This gives us TownCT, TownUnah, TownTchill, TownLeaf (I like to think I’m blatantly town, which is why Nonny is kinda of scummy, but i think Nonny is mislynch bait.)

I think it’s FA, Dave, Reundo.

and boon had caught dave red handed. Even calling him out for interacting with his scum partners.

This is Dave making sure he interacts with both FA and Reundo, in a rather NAI, pointless kind of way, to be honest.

Spoiler:

I don't think it should be her choice.

Why?

If she really is town vengeful then why give scum the opening to try and control the shot? What scenario do you think it is better that a revenge shot completely controlled by town should be not be so?

This is a good point, but I have a question about it -- do you think there is scum you think is trying to direct the shot? Or is this just a general principle you're talking about?

Reundo threw shade at me that whole post then voted someone else lol.

What's your point here? Is voting you a requirement for "throwing shade at you"? I can point out things I don't like from players without automatically placing them as my #1 pick for scum. There's other players I'd much rather see lynched today that are also much more likely to actually be lynched today.

Yes but do you have an actual reason for your vote? More to the point, you say other players but it's not clear who they are.

Now, here, he labels both Reundo and FA as scum, right? Looking at previous posts, you couldn’t ever think that.
HOWEVER, when he goes and votes Carca, he says the venge candidates should be Nonny and Wilky. The two people already being brought up that aren’t FA/Reundo.

Spoiler:

Going mostly from memory because I didn't get time to do that deep re-read, and most of this is low quality unless stated otherwise.

nonny - lurker
FA_Q2 - weak scum
Unabombah - saw a couple things I thought probably came from town
davesaz - role pm says town
Completly Trustworthy - Doesn't seem to be stretching for scumreads quite as much as the last game we played together, probably town
TheHolySpirit - I copied and pasted the list from the OP and when I got to this one I went WTF? Is this player even in the game? replace by someone? I don't want to open another tab so I'll figure out where the issue was later.
Reundo - lurker and scummy
Flavor Leaf - town for the gambit
Carcalilly - vengeful claim, don't have an independent read on the slot
Tchill13 - isn't doing the normal leaping about and jumping to conclusions that I normally scumread him for when he's town. I see the post explaining that. I think I'll wait for some replies to decide
wilky - dunno, scum side of null I think

Somethings's wrong with my list because too many of the possible scum are lurkers.

A very "aware" notion imo.. while good, I havent seen anything like this from you ever before, so feels a bit weird though?

But I'll try to turn this into a question now -

in this specific game, don't you think we could actually, for once, have a full lurkerteam of scum?

I have my own thoughts on this, and will share them in full if dave first gives his in-depth answer..

I think I question my own reads often, if that’s what you’re talking about in the first part.

It’s seeming more likely that at least 2 scum are lurking. We don’t see anywhere near as much agenda pushing as normal imo. No time for a wagon switch, my candidates for venge if it’s real would be nonny and wilky I think.

VOTE: carcalilly

Work day don’t know if I’ll be back before eod.

i'm not sure what else to tell you guys. Boon hesitated due to pressure of the game being blamed on him. THE MAIN REASON I BELIEVE DAVE TO BE SCUM IS BECAUSE BOON DIED. Boon was right to hesitate. Without last night phase i wouldn't be this sure that dave was scum. It makes sense for boon to check CT if he believes he'll be around for mylo. Which he clearly does. In boons eyes theres only one way he isn't since he believes dave is the town protective.

If I die anyways, it’s confirmed there is a roleblocker and Tchill can’t necessarily be considered town. If I die, and someone else dies, I expect Unah to figure out who i targeted.

he believes the role blocker would block the doc and kill boon. Boon didn't know that The scum role blocker was about to flip. This statement is made with the idea that scum would be able to RB the doc during the night phase since boon fully believed dave was the doc at this point. This is not a statement saying TCHILL IS SCUM. it's a statement saying the RB merely exist because it wasn't confirmed at that point.

[Tchill13]

if i am wrong about dave and reundo i will buy a ticket, fly to finland and personally apologize to you face to face una.

[Tchill13]

sure una im a mastermind as scum thx. I could not have orchestrated boon playing into my hand THAT WELL. thats a bit ridiculous.

[Tchill13]

OK what else do you think lol

[Tchill13]

Only person I'm lynching not named Dave is reundo. I've done literally every break down possible.

I'm disappointed una still doesn't agree with me enough to lynch Dave. Extremely actually. Only because of paranoia.

[Tchill13]

If I'm scum then boon would have been played so bad this game. I would literally have to be a scum mastermind.

[Tchill13]

You can't dispute that boon visited CT imo. That's almost locked down.

[Tchill13]

Nonny has pushed Dave consistently.

Reundo hasn't sorted at all. Hasn't done too much besides a huge wall here and there and only has pushed nonny.

[Tchill13]

I honestly don't have anything else to say. I'll answer questions but I'm done with this. I'll begin to repeat myself.

[Tchill13]

Reundo and nonny. It's either Dave and reundo or reundo and nonny.

My only issue with THAT is you're fighting the Dave lynch so hard...

[Tchill13]

Ues# because from the get go I didn't know who Dave's partner was. I just knew Dave was sum. Wasn't until a deep dive of every player I began to look from Dave's partner.

[Tchill13]

Let's try this one point at a time. I'm not gonna blow up the thread so we can go through each point.

Who did boon visit and why? Do we believe who boon visited is town and why?

I've already given my CT argument. Others should provide their thoughts. Boon had the most to gain by visiting CT because una said they'd tunnel CT and had CT been cleared that's a town block of CT, UNA, boon. Which also leaves the rest of boons scum team in the game.

[Tchill13]

And the reason Dave visits boon is because he already knew he'd claim loud doc and he'd use boon to validate his claim. Which worked, because boon believed he was town.

Why WOULDN'T you visit a claimed role as a loud scum role if you already decided you'd claim loud doc? Sounds like it gives you a player that can validate your fake claim to me?

Boon visited CT.

Dave is scum.

Dave visited boon to validate his future doc claim.

(Just keeping up with everything I'll be right about post-game.) The scum thread should confirm that last point.

[Tchill13]

CT, please tell me I'm at least making sense.

[Tchill13]

As long as you're beginning to agree, I don't care about the details as to why.

Other than setup spec there is no reason to believe Dave is town.

[Tchill13]

CT's assumption that scum knew Gamma's role is horrible. We have no information suggesting that's the case, and it's a totally valid strategy to kill someone who is townread. FL carried some scum equity from the gamibt so if he's town I could see scum leaving him alive. I'm very much a possible ML target for lurking so scum have no reason to kill me. Lurkers in general are ML targets if they're town, so leave out Reundo and Nonny too. Once you start identifying kills that are potentially worse than Gamma, the more it seems unlikely that scum knew his role and more likely he was just a priority to NK because there are better mislynches available.

What would take more reading would be finding out

why

CT's making that assumption. The stated reasons don't make a lot of sense to me.

I do dig the idea of VT trying to draw a nk for a possible watcher / tracker. And claiming to attempt to avoid lynch is something that I can see fitting CT's apparent personality from the previous game. So if the even night doc -> VT claim is real it's likely to be town motivation. Not enough to conftown but likely.

Because I'm pretty sure Dave is a scum loud Rolecop. So he immediately shuts down any belief of a role cop scum role for his protection. He then explains why gamma was night killed. He calls himself a mislynch opportunity once again to explain why he's alive. He throws shade at you in the form of you know too much too soon.

To be frank with you. If scum thought you were fake claiming. Then you win scum the game if they can get you to lylo. Scum know that. Remember what I said earlier about Dave being determined to TR you because he TR'd you for the fake claim and then he TR'd you for the retraction? Sounds to me like scum knew who they wanted in lylo.

[Tchill13]

And like I said, the only other real possibility in my eyes is an FA, nonny, reundo team.

Reundo voted nonny most of the game though, and if I believe that CT is town. Then I believe that nonny and reundo either shot boon anyways or just no killed. Neither possibilities are the most practical scenario.

[Tchill13]

I'm not understanding why I'm the one being forced to explain every little detail when I'm the person that believes the most logical thing to explain the night phase is what actually happened.

[Tchill13]

There is one thing I would like you to address Tchill however, why would a scum Dave make 602? In that post, he says my motivations for fakeclaiming were probably town-indicative and provides an explanation for the nightkill. FA pushed me on surviving in 577 and said the motivations for my claim were scummy in 669. What would Dave gain by helping out a mislynch which his scummate was pushing?

FA didn't exactly do much and neither has reundo.

Why wouldn't Dave take it into his own hands as far as the scum agenda goes? Would you work with your scum partners if they only knew how to lurk as scum?

I do see your points, I really do and it does cause me to hesitate a little.

Why wouldn't town have a protective? Why would Dave NOT WORK with FA?

Those are good questions and they do have weight. I'm sure I'm coming off as a guy that's just refusing to weigh the options. I've weighed them.

Nothing, nothing is crazier than scum no killing, and leaving town in mylo not lylo. Or scum killing boon even though the SECOND town protective claim said he would protect boon.

Let me ask you this. As scum, you've had 2 doc town claims, don't you think you'd take advantage of that? Don't you think you'd try to steer a mislynch in that direction? Did you or Dave ever even reach L-2?

Now look at what Dave did. Dave laid the groundwork for town to believe in 2 separate doc claims. Then, after you retracted, he TR'd you anyway. Doesn't that seem odd? That he was determined to TR you? That neither protective claim even reached L-2?

[Tchill13]

Well why not vote Dave?

[Tchill13]

Who is ct's partner?

I believe CT is town because if I don't believe that, there are too many possibilities and nothing really makes sense.

[Tchill13]

Can you not see how CT could be egotistical town here?

For you to believe CT is scum and Dave is town...

YOU should be the one with the burden of proof after that last night phase.

[Tchill13]

Ppl who are town NEED TO PLAY. A rushed lynch is Scums best weapon this day phase.

Come on ppl. Keep the questions coming to me about Dave and CT. I 48 hours and I intend to use them if I have to.

[Tchill13]

Dave town read CT FOR CLAIMING DOC AND FOR ALSO RETRACTING THE CLAIM.

He town read CT for 2 completely, opposite reasons. That looks like a forced read.

[Tchill13]

somebody just make sense of the night action.

"why dave this, why CT that"

somebody tell me why scum either no kills which means town isnt in lylo.

somebody tells me why scum shoots boon after the protective declares he will protect boon.

the idea that scum shot boon in hopes that dave was "lying" is Bullshit.

[Tchill13]

"scum just need a ML either way."

why give town the option to no lynch which would force scum to make one more kill when scum can just kill the claimed town PR?

the wifom of leaving town PR"s alive? Look at how many town PR's have died already. They didn't leave profii alive.

[Tchill13]

No. All scum have to do is get one lynch. So if scum were to distance while a decision was being made. Not only would there vote not actually put their partner in danger, but it also causes confusion on deciding who the last 2 scum are.

Why do you think reundo hasn't pushed Dave this game until now?

[Tchill13]

CT if you're town (you will obviously say that regardless) then Dave must be scum because boon VISITED YOU. There's no explanation why he would have visited anyone else and while una believes there is, I think from an objective standpoint my explanation of why boon visited you, CT, can't even be challenged.

[Tchill13]

Wait a second... CT should have jumped on this theory of mine immediately if CT was town shouldn't he?

[Tchill13]

You think scum would have a 2 shot ninja RB and a godfather? That's ridiculous imo.

[Tchill13]

I already said I believe it's either Dave/reundo or nonny/reundo.

So from a technicality reundo would be the best option.

My issue is the two guys I'd like to lock town are fighting a Dave lynch harder than any lynch I've ever seen fought on this site.

[Tchill13]

Exactly. You nor Dave have reached L-2. You both claimed doc of some sort. For some reason scum decided not to take advantage of this.

But DAVE was very adamant about people believing both existed.

[Tchill13]

And another thing. If scum know both CT and Dave are TOWN. Then HOW THE HELL did neither if them reach L-2?

[Tchill13]

Honestly, I've never looked at someone's past games. If CT has ever fake claimed as town to survive... He's definitely town here.

[Tchill13]

If scum no kill there's a chance boon clears another townie and nobody dies. Wouldn't even be in mylo with a conf town. Scum aren't gonna risk that after just losing a PR.

[Tchill13]

Same goes for if scum attempt to kill boon obviously due to the protective claim.

[Tchill13]

Both scenarios are almost a auto loss for scum.

[Tchill13]

Speaking statistically boon had a better chance of hitting town.

[Tchill13]

A no kill or boon kill attempt isn't the difference in mylo or lylo. It's the difference in just another day phase and mylo (statistically speaking due to 5 players from boon to choose from and 2 scum left)

We all know it would have been in boons best interest to town clear someone and make it back to mylo

We all know scum aren't gonna risk this being just another day phase after losing their STRONG PR.

We all know the only way I'm wrong in anything is if CT is scum. Even if that is true the rest I've said this post remains true.

[Tchill13]

Do you agree with my most recent points about scum risking another conf townie in a regular day phase if they were to no kill or try and kill Boon anyway?

[Tchill13]

Come on people.

[Tchill13]

Yes, I think I said earlier that the no kill theory was getting more unlikely to me since the scumteam probably didn't know for sure who Flavor was visiting.

The kill Boon theory would be just as unlikely due to the fact it would result in the same exact thing.

[Tchill13]

It's more likely Boon doesn't die. Which means it's more likely that we have an additional conf townie in a regular day phase if scum were to no kill or try and kill Boon if town had a protective. Town doesn't have a protective. Dave is scum.

[Tchill13]

VOTE: dave

[Tchill13]

If reundo flips scum we rush lynch Dave correct?

[Tchill13]

My suspensions aren't valid because my name is tchill lol. That's all it is.

[Tchill13]

If reundo isn't scum, then scum are making sure Dave doesn't get lynched. Lynch Dave. My break down of the night phase is crystal clear. Of course this fight back will be seen as not pro town but Idc. I will no lynch before I lynch anyone not named Dave. Since this is Mylo.

[Tchill13]

I'll lynch reundo if someone town clears nonny for me. That's it. And I've already looked at every player as thuroughly as possible. It ain't happening.

[Tchill13]

Oh hi there Dave.

[Tchill13]

Any reason you think reundo is scum over nonny Dave?

[Tchill13]

If you're town it's in your best interest that Dave answers that question. Totally and completely using his own thoughts.

[Tchill13]

If I'm not gonna vote Dave then scum will have to bus to achieve a scum lynch. This is a good distancing opportunity for scum here.

[Tchill13]

Yep. Mass confusion on who Dave's teammate is. Theres an actual possibility it's not reundo and it's nonny and I'm not risking that. Which means I'll no lynch before I lynch anyone not named Dave.

[Tchill13]

I've never tried to town clear anyone harder with less info than I have CT this game and I'm still on his radar as scum lol.

[Tchill13]

Yeah no, this changes nothing.

VOTE: reundo

You really don't give a damn if their name isn't tchill

[Tchill13]

If you vote reundo that means you think scum would risk Boon confirming a townie and an additional day phase that's not even Mylo.

[Tchill13]

This is actually stupid.

I'm glad yall have been skeptical of 3/5 remaining players.

[Tchill13]

Why not be skeptical of 5/5. Scums gotta be in that. Maybe.

[Tchill13]

If I had 2 vig shots I'd shoot Dave twice. Throw the gun at him. Pick the gun back up and throw it again.

[Tchill13]

Lmao... As long as it doesn't effect night actions.

Ppl. Dave is scum.

[Tchill13]

Reundo also unvoted Dave to vote nonny. Just so that's clear.

[Tchill13]

So you idiots don't think Dave is scum? Yall are unbelievable. Seriously. Una if you're not scum with Dave I'm gonna be terribly disappointed. I'm not voting anyone but Dave this day phase.

[Tchill13]

Reundo also unvoted Dave to vote nonny. Just so that's clear.

Is this you trying to say that they are buddies?

That's me saying reundo probably unvoted his buddy to vote nonny. Because there was a bussing opportunity because of my ultra push on Dave that atm reundo voted Dave looked like it could pisk up steam.

Get you're head out of your ass and stop acting like everything I do is scum motivated. I'm not trying to clear reundo of anything. Yall have failed to provide any reasoning that nonny is lock town compared to reundo but I have PROVIDED A GOLDEN CASE AS TO WHY DAVE IS SCUM. it's just ignored though. Most frustrating thing I've ever dealt with on this site.

[Tchill13]

I'm somehow responsible for ruendos words F### yall. There's literally nothing I can do to help town here due to an inability of other players to work with me or be reasonable on any level.

Scum would not risk giving town an extra day phase with another confirmed townie. Scum would simply never do that.

[Tchill13]

Loud role cop.

[Tchill13]

You're asking me why I have to lynch Dave but the first chance you had to call me scum with reundo you took it. I'm not an idiot. Ik what happens when reundo flips scum because he's Dave's partner. I get lynched instead of Dave. That loses town the game.

[Tchill13]

And on top of that nobody, NOBODY has town cleared nonny compared to una. We just started calling reundo scum, if not for the awful claim, I'd still be fighting that. If I was to lynch reundo here then I have to be sure nonny is town (I'm not) and that Dave gets lynched afterwards (as you and nonny jump the gun to call me scum with reundo) and if you look at the POSSIBILITY I'M ACTUALLY TOWN you'll see that in the scenario I'm town, this actually makes sense from my perspective.

[Tchill13]

Compared to reundo

[Tchill13]

Loud role cop.

Based on what?
Compared to scum having a Strongman, AND dave being Town!Doc, why do you think them having a Rolecop is more likely?

Based on Boon saying so. Based on the fact loud doc is a good claim for a loud scum role and he visited a claimed PR to validate his loud role. I think it's more believable to have a ninja rb and a loud role cop than a ninja rb and a strongman.

[Tchill13]

And on top of that nobody, NOBODY has town cleared nonny compared to una. We just started calling reundo scum, if not for the awful claim, I'd still be fighting that. If I was to lynch reundo here then I have to be sure nonny is town (I'm not) and that Dave gets lynched afterwards (as you and nonny jump the gun to call me scum with reundo) and if you look at the POSSIBILITY I'M ACTUALLY TOWN you'll see that in the scenario I'm town, this actually makes sense from my perspective.

I'm thinking you might be town, yes.
I'm thinking CT+reundo works as well.
Let's just do this step by step and see if we still disagree on things.

If you won't vote Dave then we won't agree long story short. You can continue though.

[Tchill13]

You can't make an argument as to why scum would risk giving town an extra day phase with a conf townie opposed to putting town in lylo. You can't validate that. Nobody can.

[Tchill13]

You're throwing the game away because a strongman could merely exist...

With a 2 shot ninja RB and with towns only investigative being able to kill themselves night 1 Lmao. Okay una. Sounds great.

[Tchill13]

Yes I can. Boon claimed. If Dave knew he was going to claim loud doc that's why he visited Boon.

He didn't visit CT when CT claimed because it was a fake protective claim and that wouldn't have worked with Dave's fake claim. He claimed to protect Boon and was going to win the game off lynching whoever we decided Boon protected due to Boon being able to kill himself if he visited scum.

You opened the day phase accusing me to be the one Boon visited.

[Tchill13]

THAT'S WHAT I'M FUCKING SAYING. HE VISITED CT. I'VE LAID OUT WHY. HE HAS MORE TO GAIN FROM VISITING CT THAN TCHILL. 2 OF HIS MAJOR TRs SHADED CT HARD AT THE END OF THE DAY.

THIS IS WHY DAVE SAID HE PROTECTED BOON. BECAUSE IF HE CAN GET MULTIPLE PEOPLE TO BELIEVE BOON VISITED TCHILL THEN DAVE'S NAME IS CLEARED IN EVERYONE'S EYES. YOU CAN'T SEE WHY HE'D DO SOMETHING BECAUSE IT'S WORKING ON YOU YOU DINGUS. MY LORD.

[Tchill13]

Just because you think role cop is poop doesn't mean a strongman exist. You have the to prove a strongman exist if that's what you believe. It's literally the only way to clear Dave.

[Tchill13]

prove to me dave isn't on a team with nonny.

[Tchill13]

and when dave's scummate flips. I'll be the one to flip next. We scum lynch dave today, im no longer a ML option.

[Tchill13]

you're scared to death you'll read me wrong for the first time. You don't have a good idea of what's going on and you're falling back on a SR tchill read because its conveniant for you. Because SR'ing me once when im town won't hurt you as much as TR'ing me when im scum and losing the game. THAT ts why you're being so difficult and THAT is why im losing my mind.

[Tchill13]

IVE PROVEN IT. YOU REFUSE TO BELIEVE IT BECAUSE OF A ROLE THAT COULD, COULD, COULD EXIST. I WILL NEVER LYNCH ANYONE IN THIS GAME EXCEPT DAVE. I WILL NO LYNCH FROM HERE ON OUT UNTIL DAVE IS LYNCHED.

YOU ARE DOING ANYTHING YOU CAN TO PUT DAVE AS POSSIBLE TOWN. ANYTHING. THIS IS THE BEST CASE IVE HAD AGAINST ANYONE ON THIS SITE AND YOU REFUSE TO BELIEVE IT. IT'S LITERALLY AS SIMPLE AS 2+2=4.

[Tchill13]

you'll never play with me again if i effect your ability to properly play a game. i can guarantee that.

you better be scum. Which is why i won't lynch anyone but dave. Because you being scum is possible if its with dave. Other than ego there's no reason for you to fight it like this.

[Tchill13]

i guess we're no lynching. Fine with me. See yall in a few days.

[Tchill13]

reundo, you help me lynch dave and we can work together to lynch whomever we agree on last day phase. You as well CT. We only need 4 votes.

[Tchill13]

I guess nobody is gonna play. I'm done talking to una. This is fun.

[Tchill13]

Good deal. One more.

[Tchill13]

my attitude towards lynching ruendo isnt the same.

you can't town clear nonny from being dave's partner. Thats a fact.

you don't understand why dave is scum here. It's much more concrete than why you believe reundo is scum.

i'm more than happy for you to resign asap after how difficult you've been even though i've used pretty damn good logic. Even admitting its because of your egotistical fear of reading me wrong.

and its very obvious the route you'll be taking whenever dave's partner is lynched. I will be lynched immediately.

You were locktown to begin with but you're fighting good, great logic tooth and nail and the only leg you have left to stand on is that maybe, MAYBE there's a Godfather that you have no proof of being in this setup. You're arguing the possibility of a role rather than the possibility that dave lied (which would give an explanation, one that doesn't require scum to risk boon entering an additional day phase before lylo or mylo FOR THE SOLE PURPOSE OF GENERATING WIFOM, which is your argument. Because we both know that i as scum wouldn't be stupid enough to attempt to kill boon after the protective claimed he would protect boon.)

sure i've been enfuriated. It's due to you playing illogically because you're "OMG i read tchill right every time" record is at risk here. I'm fine with losing as town when scum earn the win. When they pull off something so brilliant that it would be my last guess they did whatever they did. You play the odds here. Thats how you win consistently. If you're not man enough to handle a loss when scum earn it you'll second, third and fourth guess yourself every time. Scum COULD HAVE no lynched. Risked Boon coming back with a conf townie for the sole purpose of incriminating Dave. That sounds wild doesn't it? I'd be willing to give that scum team a bravo and move on. GG scum you took that risk and it won you the game.

[Tchill13]

the odds of scum taking said risk is astronomically whether its a good team or a bad team, because you're risking the entire game after one scum death on ONE night phase.

[Tchill13]

only reason this game isn't over is because apparently i keep una up at night. I mean this is ridiculous. Do you brag about reading me correctly on other sites too? I mean don't get me wrong its cool and all but i'm not a mafia legend and i never claimed to be. Stop letting that arrogance affect your play here. sheesh. You're a better player than that.

[Tchill13]

and i want to make this REAL clear. In what world does a claimed PR make like 2 post the last day phase where he believes he's being incriminated?

all game scum have just let town eat town alive. It's the same damn thing this day phase. If dave/reundo/FA/Nonny is a mixture of the scum team I LOSE TO. THE WAY THEY PLAYED THIS GAME.

[Tchill13]

then it just goes to show town loses games here, scum do not win them.

[Tchill13]

Glad more than just me can see that.

[Tchill13]

Good points on the claimed town doc not even attempting to solve btw.

Dave is scum and he's just hoping we screw up and don't lynch him. Una almost got that done.

[Tchill13]

Who wants to say just screw it and lynch CT? Any takers?

[Tchill13]

I'm still thinking scum!Rolecop is poop.
Just because Gamma was killed, people even started to speculate the chance of a Rolecop.
I still think Gamma was a reasonable kill for scum if Gamma was potentially going to push in the right direction the following day.
..anyone check what that direction was going to be?

It's coming off as gross due to the fact that nobody understands why Dave being scum here makes sense.

[Tchill13]

Lol.

[Tchill13]

I'm about as irritated as una is happy atm. Of course I literally only put in effort one day phase so my irritation probably isn't valid. That said... I almost lost all respect for una lolol. So congrats on the win. I'm happy to see I don't have to black list you. I'm never going to just tr someone off of someone else's opinion. No offense to Boon at all, that's just bad practice on my part. Una actually scum slipped, a real one, and nobody mentioned it. I would have had I not realized I'd be NK'd. Una mentioned he'd resign from the game after Dave's flip. As if to say he knew the game would still continue.

Town this game... Meh (including me to an extent)

Scum this game... Well that's why I'm pissed. Other than una. 2 scum combined for like 70 content related posts this game.

Mod flavor... Honestly my favorite so far lol.

[Tchill13]

The Boon babies will play together forever lol.

[Tchill13]

I would love to roll the same alignment as you TW. I feel like I need. To play scum more to be better at it. If I ever roll scum with ppl I'm comfortable with its pretty fun.

[Tchill13]

Lmao. So the questions begin.