Open 739: Epic Duel [Game Over]

[Irrelephant11]

I’ve been skimming and will start here
VOTE: BrightEyedFish

I’m not around as much on the weekends so if I need my vote somewhere else I’ll figure that out Monday

[Irrelephant11]

I guess I should start putting effort now.

Irrelephant, you around? Let's discuss the game?

Not usually on weekends, but I'm here now! You?

That was garbage.

VOTE: Shoshin

lol
shoshin is ~80% likely to be town here, move your vote

That was garbage.

I agree

Who did Light Ethos replace?

Too lazy to check for yourself?
Too obvious.
VOTE: Shoshin

This is also crap
Like in what world is it scum motivated to ask a question for which the answer is in the OP? She's, what, trying to play lazy town?

Eh I actually see what you might see here, but I still think this is a bad vote

[Irrelephant11]

If those were the same they would all just read "scum"
Having some familiarity with Shoshin's meta, including how she plays around RC, I think her lack of interest in this game makes perfect sense coming from town!her. She joined to enjoy RC dueling with other players and to try to gamesolve with him. RC played poorly early on; Shoshin lost interest. I don't think she's played a game that has scum motivation, unless her scum motivation is to be active enough to be remembered and lurky enough to get lynched..?

[Irrelephant11]

I've skimmed the whole game
I was reading along to try to continue practicing reading you and RC and also because the setup was interesting
I wasn't reading as someone with investment in the outcome but I have some idea what has happened so far

[Irrelephant11]

Oh I don't remember, I just started with RC's thing
But his posts last page aren't stellar
Wait isn't Io now BrightEyed? Yeah
He can still be my vote while I really catch up

Where would you put my vote?

[Irrelephant11]

Why does townshoshin lose interest like this but scum shoshin not? If the driving factor is RC, then it would be NAI.

Right, which is why I'm only 80% sure she's town instead of my usual 98% when we play a game together from D1

NC? Let me ISO to remind myself of their play

[Irrelephant11]

[Irrelephant11]

It seems like you're trying to poison the well based on Io's outdated speculation about how scum would treat the early wagon to prevent PP votes tbh

Either you're scum or you're going for some really shit reasoning. I'm not going to say you aren't capable of reasoning this shitty as town, but I'm inclined to give you the benefit of the doubt and say you're just scum.

Sorry not trash shit at the game. I let it slide in 620 and then gave a snarky reply to 635 which deserved it. Honestly I could of been right with a majority of reads yet your fine with portraying me as shit.

Right, I never said you were shit, at the time I was saying you were "either shit or scum" and went with scum because you seemed to be 1/3 in your top three. Of course you took that as me calling you shit because FYPOV you know you are not scum.

I saw you hard pushing RC as scum, who seemed like pretty likely town based on the amount of effort he was putting in after being very likely to get lynched, and you also seemed to want to scumread me when I know I am town, so it seemed to me like you were at most 1/3 for your top three. The problem was that Penguin was not and is not obviously scum, but he sorta just cruised through that duel, and I think you getting ragetilted over what RC was saying toward you helped scum push RC through even though of the two he was the worse lynch. (imo)

Still doesn't make Penguin scum, but I do still think your lack of push on Penguin is one reason he remains pretty null. We had two players dueling and one of them remains null... that shouldn't really happen. But the reason it happened, in fairness to you, has a lot more to do with RC than with you.

To be clear, I don't think you're shit at this game, or shit as a person, but I do think you can be needlessly hostile and tend to escalate hostility very quickly.

idk you do seem legitimately temperamental but FA_Q does not. His anger seems fakier to me, whereas you seem to have really thought I was calling you shit (since I said "shit or scum") when imo I was just calling you scum. Whereas FA_Q I really did only say he was scum and then he seemed to get really angry for no reason other than being scumread. Like that OMGUS felt really weak to me. He should get roped. I know my case was not like, pulitzer prize winning. This game still doesn't have like a ton of dope material to work with. But his reaction was pretty bad. 715 is scummy, even if you agree my case was shitty

idk what NC is but maybe what I bolded is a scumslip, so
Nothing he posted came across as super towny imo
His case on tw was weak and I think the slot was/is green based on tw's posting
So like, from 1-10, 10 being town, he's like a 4
Also whoever said sheeping RC is a bad idea: how familiar are you with RC's meta?

[Irrelephant11]

No I've just played multiple games with both of them in it, including Friemds mafia where Shoshin and I were friemds and talked about RC some in our pt
I didn't know about the PM but I saw Shoshin signed up after RC and I assumed (correctly) that his presence was part of why she did

I'm basically here to sort Shoshin for y'all and then sheep her and RC to victory
Seemed like a fun and easy way to get a town win which is why I signed up even though I'm overgamed

[Irrelephant11]

Actually, yeah, I guess I wouldn't have

I think it's against the spirit of the setup
It's probably strictly pro-town in terms of EV but idk if I like it personally
I won't argue for or against it if most players do/don't want it

[Irrelephant11]

Is LE scum? I want him to be scum
@shoshin and @bujaber

Also,

fascinating

that NC was one of RC's hard townreads
I need to do more reading here I guess

pedit: "Of course you thought I was insulting you because fypov

you know you're town

" implies both that NC doesn't actually believe his own Garmr scumread AND that he knows Garmr is town (TMI)

[Irrelephant11]

No it's not the wording, it's how understanding he was that Garmr felt insulted
"Oh of course you took it as an insult, you're town"
which directly contradicts Cage's read of Garmr as scum

[Irrelephant11]

Yeah no you're still getting caught up in the words

It's about the emotions

Garmr was only insulted because he was town (or so he would have us believe)
Cage apologized because "of course you felt that way, you being town would obviously not take my comment as a scumread, you'd take it as an insult, that makes sense"
which Cage would only think makes sense if he knew Garmr was town, or at least he'd have to think he's town now
Otherwise "of course you thought that" doesn't make sense; it's not "of course" if Garmr is scum, it'd be "Your scum agenda included pretending"


Whatever sometimes I get too caught up in scumslips
It worked really well to catch scum one time and then didn't work twice since then so I'll drop it for now

[Irrelephant11]

Okay, yes, good
correct answer
NC, RC really wanted us all to believe you're town
What are your reads? I just ISO'd you and only got like three reads out of it.

[Irrelephant11]

FA_Q2 replaced the worst? That was a scum slot, for sure.

I have thought the same about FAQ2 but I forget what I thought about tw

Hey Irrelephant, take a look at the worst's posts here. Thoughts?

Thoughts to come in another post

Even with the replacements, I think we need to follow RC's reads. I don't like the townreads from NC on either Io (BEF) or Ejji (teh Elephant).

I like teh Elephant though...too bad not town.

When you say you "don't like the townreads" what do you mean?
Also hi I like you too
(o)>
//\ <3
V_/

[Irrelephant11]

Spoiler: the worst was probably scum and FAQ2 even moreso

I feel this like
darkness welling up inside me

it was too much.
I had to embrace the edge.

this made me laugh though

i'm not asking you to sort me

i'm asking you to work with me on other people

surely you realise I'm gonna be frustrated as shit working thru stuff w me when I can't even tell why you guaranteed your own lynch this game

this was pointless and comes across as "AtE don't scumread me for having an opposing agenda to you"

just going to be the worst for a moment

I'm maybe townreading RC a little more strongly than PP atm

this was also pointless since tw himself admits in another post that RC is always dying here
Reads as setting up for later PP vote or something
or maybe just literally posting for posting's sake
anyway

RC saying I'm scum is by far the towniest thing he's said all game. I'd be concerned if he wasn't saying that.

I actually agree with this comment. I'm holding my carts pretty close wrt my read on you at the moment, and I like RC's indignance that you're scum.

This is something I would townread if like skitter maybe? Said it
But from tw it feels faker
Like maybe honestly he thought to himself "how would skitter get on shoshin's good side?" and this was the answer lol

That was garbage.

VOTE: Shoshin

And this was bad too

Why can't we lynch Io slot now? Seems like that's what we should do.

[Irrelephant11]

Although...I may be wrong because I like what teh Elephant is pushing as I catchup.

like what specifically do you like

[Irrelephant11]

what do you think of the fact that I scumread NC for having a weak case on town!tw and then scumcased tw like a page later

[Irrelephant11]

same

[Irrelephant11]

shoshin do you have game solve yet or

[Irrelephant11]

shoshin do you have game solve yet or

I haven't read anything, so no.

You?

I mean I never game solve D1 but
Are we lynching Io/BEF for strong reasons you have or mostly for RC reasons?

[Irrelephant11]

Garmr how do you read ele and ele how do you read garmr?

I think ele trusting shoshin and joining the game with that mentality is more indicative of town!sho than it is AI for ele.

Correct. Shoshin either will or won't vouch for me being town at some point though, which will give you a good idea of my alignment probably?

I'll be honest I stopped reading Garmr posts at some point when spectating because they were so unpleasant. I mostly haven't read them since replacing in for the same reason. How important is it that I get a firm Garmr read?
I remember RC saying Garmr is being more toxic than he normally would be as town so maybe that's a thing? I also remember Io saying "no one is townreading you because you so unpleasant they don't want to townread you" which sounded sort of buddy-y. Actually that's more of a scumread of Io thing than anything AI for Garmr I guess.
Oh and then there's the "oh of course you were offended" thing that is a slight reason to townread Garmr I guess.

Overall I come away with a tiny townlean without reading his posts much at all.

So, same question. Is my answer important enough that I like,

have

to dive in to his posts?

[Irrelephant11]

Garmr how do you read ele and ele how do you read garmr?

I think ele trusting shoshin and joining the game with that mentality is more indicative of town!sho than it is AI for ele.

Correct. Shoshin either will or won't vouch for me being town at some point though, which will give you a good idea of my alignment probably?

I'll be honest I stopped reading Garmr posts at some point when spectating because they were so unpleasant. I mostly haven't read them since replacing in for the same reason. How important is it that I get a firm Garmr read?
I remember RC saying Garmr is being more toxic than he normally would be as town so maybe that's a thing? I also remember Io saying "no one is townreading you because you so unpleasant they don't want to townread you" which sounded sort of buddy-y. Actually that's more of a scumread of Io thing than anything AI for Garmr I guess.
Oh and then there's the "oh of course you were offended" thing that is a slight reason to townread Garmr I guess.

Overall I come away with a tiny townlean without reading his posts much at all.

So, same question. Is my answer important enough that I like,

have

to dive in to his posts?

Well yes .. sorting you is a big deal. So is making sure my read on garmr continues to make sense.

Ejji was a little scummy and garmr SR'd him strongly. Figured this is a good way to check your slot and see how garmr sees his replacement.

*grumble grumble*
fine I'll do that today

@PenguinPower, BuJaber, Irrelephant11, Shoshin, Garmr

Deadline is approaching. Please don't make this mistake...

lol

D2 will bring much needed information if I am alive to share it.

lolllll what
I don't even need anything else this post never comes from town
what do you think this setup is??? you can't soft PR
lolllll

[Irrelephant11]

oops I didn't ISO Garmr yet
I guess the deadline is the deadline so I still have time

@BEF I wish you'd do more to sort the remaining player list. Your lynch does seem like it was fated long ago, but that doesn't mean you can't help town at all

[Irrelephant11]

oops I didn't ISO Garmr yet
I guess the deadline is the deadline so I still have time

@BEF I wish you'd do more to sort the remaining player list. Your lynch does seem like it was fated long ago, but that doesn't mean you can't help town at all

The deadline is in 7 hours. You had better hurry.

I do better with tight deadlines

[Irrelephant11]

hey shoshin

[Irrelephant11]

we only have a few hours left
wanna ISO dive garmr with me

[Irrelephant11]

oof so many posts I just couldn't bring myself to want to read

Shoshin let's discuss everything below
You go first
Pick a quote and talk to me about it, then I'll go

Spoiler:

Well i'm running two scenario's in my head. Normally I decide on one but last game (the one with IO) I came to the conclusion it worth mentioning my other idea.

Rc-town
1.has regrets about duelling after a fun person replaces into the slot
2.Rc would do stupid quick duels like this and that's why everyone loves rc

Rc is scum-
1.RC picked a policy duel over a scum read duel.
2.RC Would also be brave enough to do gambits.


Other reads.
Io-I have a slight town read on her. The only reason is only slight is because I feel she is a strong enough player to pull her current game style as scum. Also I feel like she's probing me a little by challenging the situation I set up which I like. I mean it's entirely possible that I'm setting up a situation where scum would benefit(which I wasn't) So it's good to enquire.

ejjinami-Says a whole of nothing a big fluff poster but the fluff isn't the joke game but the kind that looks like they are doing something. Can anyone confirm this is their playstyle/meta. Otherwise scum read.

Bujaber-I like the slot so far null-townie. I just think they are to quick to rush a town read on me.

walt- I don't scum read this slot. I can understand the reaction to rc. That being said the only post I don't like from him through is post 143 it seems like it's supposed to be emotional but comes off as fake. I also don't think that RC-scum/town would dis-include walt from being the same alignment.


If your not on the list you aren't interesting enough yet. Get to it.



P:edit I think penguin power was a mod and not a player in the game in the list of players I played with derp.

I'd rather talk to town than scum.

Seems like to me your trying to bait me into voting you to rush the day. I'm not going to fall that shit.

not a viewpoint town garmr ever has.

Yeah because you know me so well. You and I both know what happened when you assumed what was and what wasn't town garmrs thought process. Hint you were wrong.

ate ate ate ate ate ate ate ate ate ate ate

garmr/bujaber/shoshin lynches wins the game.

shhh

I know this is superficial of me, but Walt why no comment on me. You haven't once commented on any of my posts or commented on rc vs me situation. Reading what you post is like I don't exist at all.



I was going to do a post about shosin. But their jumpy nature around rc has got me confused so I will leave them as null. So I decided to give them more time to figure out the slot

Penguin's good at giving basic reads, but not very good at making himself readable.
I'm a bit unsure about him though, since I'm torn on how to read 336.
I'm leaning more scum though because like the rest of his posts he lacks any substance at all. They are bare-bone reads with no real reasoning behind them.
Most of his posts are also reactionary it seems rather than trying to promote discussion he is just reacting to whatever is brought up and as I said he doesn't even really add anything at all. He says things, but not actually having meaning behind his words.

VOTE: Penguin

I think this is a townie post but if penguin is lynched over RC I will replace out.

@EJJ

Can you tell me in dot points. What actions have you have done to further the game and what results have you got out of them?

• I'm playing.

I don't actually care how much I do, because as I said before, I'm not going to force myself to do stuff, cuz it ALWAYS ends up in me getting overworked, worn out, stopping to read the thread just to get some sleep and having to wear myself down even more because of all of the catchups later.
You can look at my latest games in here, cuz I started and then replaced out of A LOT of games lately. I can even give you a few recent examples from the other forum I play on. The reasons I give are almost always the same

I still think I can play, cuz I feel rather good about this game, but do not expect me to go all crazy for contribution and progressing the game. If you want my reads, most of them are in the last few posts I made.
I could elaborate on the other players, but they're mostly null to me rn

So the only thing none fluff a was a scum read on me which can easily be addressed.

Actually Garmr might be scum. The reads in his posts felt kinda as if he put them there “just to have reads”. He doesn’t actually seem to care to interact with the other players to get better reads and most of the interactions I remember are from him yelling at RC. That’s not an entirely confident read, cuz I can see where could his focus on RC be coming from, but I don’t really like the stuff I’ve read from him thus far

-I interacted with IO to get a feel for her.
-I had a whole lot of interactions with RC unfourtantly
-Had some interactions with bujaber
-Talked to penguin power to get a feel for them, if I felt they were scum I would of voted them over rc.
-Just started interacting with walt.
-laid a case on you which caused you to react.

If you look at it on the whole I would argue am the player who has actively seeked out the most interactions with others. I have had interactions with over half the player base.While other players out there only have interactions with one or two other players So you using that as a case Is pretty dumb.

I'm sorting through all the players in my own way.

So this game. so far

Town with solid reasoning-

Io
Buj

Town that should die for the betterment of town-

RC

Gut town

PP

Iffy town read I am second guessing-

The worst- the worst wouldn't say they would want to vig me if they were scum because they know how that will blow up in their face. I feel like they would suck up to me more as scum.

Scum-

Ejjinami

warning you in advance: garmr is scum and he's going to speedduel Ejjinami to make it impossible for town to correctly get a duel on his scumpartners who are in weaker positions and trust in his abusiveness and AtE to keep his slot alive.

speedlynch him when he does.

Why speed duel tomorrow when I can get them lynched today?

Did you ever explain the FaQ read? I haven't seen much of them and they are hard town.

FAQ is the player "the worst" slot and the worst was a meta read on how they treat me depending on the alignment.

Like, before I started calling Garmr/Bujaber town

the votes on me were Nicholas Cage and Shoshin

Neither of them are presently voting me because they reacted to my play and the gamestate

As soon as I started calling Garmr scum, the entire block of people he's townreading for 0 fucking reason (FA_Q2/Bujaber) and the person who I'm not a fan of his interactions with and makes sense as a third buddy that he decided to put at the bottom of the scumpool (Walt) ended up voting me.

That's not an accident.

I been town reading those slots way before they voted you. Bujaber has been explained and I have discussed the worst (which is faq2.)

The way you are portraying the way events happened don't hold up when you actually look into it.

gramr, FAQ, (BuJaber/Penguin/Sho)
My bets on scum team.
Either way I'm voting gramr today or dueling him tomorrow if he avoids the noose.

No offence but that's a pretty bad scum team. Once I lead town to lynching scum you'll change your mind.

If Garmr tries to interfere, you should lynch him and cut FA_Q2 from the lynch order on a scum flip.

You will win the game by lynching {Ejjinami, Walt, FA_Q2}

You and me agree on ejjinami, I'm somewhat mixed on walt and disagree on faq2.

VOTE: Eji

@Faq2
Yeah I noticed something with nic.

All his scum reads so far are previously people who scum read him prior. Also his case is pretty shit yet he has the gull to call my cases bad.

I still want eji to be lynched but I'm willing to shift my vote to nic.

Are you still willing to shift your vote?

I'm reevaluating my read on your slot. IO was suss in the end with their change of heart and how they handled me. I think FAQ2 is town. So I'm trying to judge if it is a TVS or a TVT. Because I think can rule out a SvS because of reasons in my last post and a couple more.

I also think there is scum guaranteed no matter your alignment between Irrelephant11(ejjinami) and Shoshin. Because the early bits of your wagon look town to me (Bujaber and penguin).

Shoshin: Light Ethos, FA_Q2, BrightEyedFish,
irrelephant11: Garmr,
Garmr:
Light Ethos:
FA_Q2: Nicolas Cage,
BuJaber:
BrightEyedFish: PenguinPower, BuJaber, Irrelephant11, Shoshin,
Nicolas Cage:
PenguinPower:

This is current vote count. FAQ2 and bright eyed shifted at the same time. Something is up that they are on the same wagon again. Shoshin hasn't done anything to be town read but it feels weird a spontaneous wagon sprung up at this point in time and not earlier.

VOTE: BrightEyedFish

Garmr how do you read ele and ele how do you read garmr?

I think ele trusting shoshin and joining the game with that mentality is more indicative of town!sho than it is AI for ele.

I think it's null

but when compared to eji slot I'm not really hard scum reading him as much. Still on my to sort list but a lower priority.

ele trusting shoshin. Is null

[Irrelephant11]

also shoshin are you town? be honest

[Irrelephant11]

oh no shoshin are you scum

[Irrelephant11]

Shoshin
What did RC say to do next I won’t be caring to analyze anything till Monday

[Irrelephant11]

Now I'm assuming we have 4 more lynches for the record, and I intend to direct the lion's share of them. So, here's what I propose.
Tomorrow Io should be the lynch. As much as I think they've been by far the most pleasant player in this game, history shows that generally in games like this it's only the one townie who keeps their cool.

If they flip town, that tells us that scum were indeed the ones hard pushing the PP wagon as opposed to divided between the teams.
And how you deal with that is largely up to you: I would strongly recommend flipping PP at this point to to be 100% sure that me and him was TvT then if he's scum, powerlynch down my wagon and if town, lynch the people that you feel dealt with the wagons in ways that suggest TMI. (I'm looking at you, Bujaber)

If they flip scum (which I expect), great!
You will win the game by lynching {Ejjinami, Walt, FA_Q2}

Me? Dumb
Do I self vote or just vote Walt
I guess I’ll start with VOTE: Walt because deadlines are deadlines here

And that just about settles what I have to give the game.

GL GL

[Irrelephant11]

EBWOP

Now I'm assuming we have 4 more lynches for the record, and I intend to direct the lion's share of them. So, here's what I propose.
Tomorrow Io should be the lynch. As much as I think they've been by far the most pleasant player in this game, history shows that generally in games like this it's only the one townie who keeps their cool.

If they flip town, that tells us that scum were indeed the ones hard pushing the PP wagon as opposed to divided between the teams.
And how you deal with that is largely up to you: I would strongly recommend flipping PP at this point to to be 100% sure that me and him was TvT then if he's scum, powerlynch down my wagon and if town, lynch the people that you feel dealt with the wagons in ways that suggest TMI. (I'm looking at you, Bujaber)

If they flip scum (which I expect), great!
You will win the game by lynching {Ejjinami, Walt, FA_Q2}


And that just about settles what I have to give the game.

GL GL

Me? Dumb
Do I self vote or just vote Walt
I guess I’ll start with VOTE: Walt because deadlines are deadlines here

[Irrelephant11]

Oh
VOTE: LE

[Irrelephant11]

VOTE: FA_Q2
this is silly
none of these duels feel like duels

I think I remember scumreading a couple FAQ2 posts before replace in
With Shoshin and RC slipped I feel comfortable sheeping PP and BuJaber whenever they agree, so

Let me know if I need to effort this game some more

Anyone think Garmr is the lynch here?

[Irrelephant11]

Shoshin & RC flipped*

[Irrelephant11]

did you scumread garmr before this?

[Irrelephant11]

so why are you sure he's a better lynch than you? If he's town, and you're town, and you're more easily mislynchable (and based on others' reads up to this point that's the case) you should probably be the one to go. Is there anything other than the duel that makes you think Garmr is scum?

[Irrelephant11]

Okay so why'd you townread him before now?

[Irrelephant11]

Nothing, it's just that my (admittedly not very effortful) reads AND even FAQ2's pre-duel reads suggest FAQ2 should be the lynch here, and I'm not convinced by FA's "well he dueled me, so that makes him scum"

[Irrelephant11]

FA town!you would do well to either:
-make a strong case as to Garmr's alignment
-give up and sort the playerlist while you can

BuJ where you at? Which duel lynch do you want? RC and Shoshin told us to trust you so I do

[Irrelephant11]

wow for some reason I thought 1034 was not BuJ
I need coffee

[Irrelephant11]

It would be nice if this won the game

[Irrelephant11]

fwiw I think LE/FAQ2 always has a scum (iirc)

[Irrelephant11]

Garmr, this game ends when one more scum dies
FAQ2 is the lynch today and nothing will be changing that imo
If you have reads for if FAQ2 flips town then please share those

[Irrelephant11]

Garmr, this game ends when one more scum dies
FAQ2 is the lynch today and nothing will be changing that imo
If you have reads for if FAQ2 flips town then please share those

hmmm, then what is the point in even posting.

Well if you're town, you can win while dead. Posting helps us all know what you think about the rest of the players, so we can win despite your death. If you're scum, you cannot win while dead. It feels like you want to live more than it feels like you want town to win, so I'm scumreading you (not to mention you have scummy-looking associatives with Io from his side)

[Irrelephant11]

Wait there's only seven of us alive?
I thought there was nine and my play still didn't matter

mmmm maybe I'll start really trying this game day...

[Irrelephant11]

FAQ2 if I were scum in your spot I would get more fatalistic
This I encourage you to do

[Irrelephant11]

eh not ready to brag yet

[Irrelephant11]

nothing

When you flip town, and I'm re-evaluating based on you being town, and I am looking to sheep your reads, where should my vote go?

[Irrelephant11]

creature please sell me on either FAQ2's towniness or Garmr's scumminess

[Irrelephant11]

so like who's garmr's partner do you think

[Irrelephant11]

FAQ2 when you flip town and then Garmr flips town should I vote creature or LE?

[Irrelephant11]

Yeah hi sorry, forgot to use the V/LA site feature, I was V/LA all weekend

I am annoyed that I'm still here without Shoshin so I've lost some interest (clearly), but I will start putting work into this game by ISOing LE-slot later today

[Irrelephant11]

LE is Walt right

[Irrelephant11]

VOTE: LE

[Irrelephant11]

Garmr and BuJ can have my vote if they want it somewhere else

[Irrelephant11]

Alright BuJ
let's gamesolve

Also I would kill Shoshin, but so would anyone who took seriously that my rep in was extremely town-indicative for Shoshin, so *shrug*

[Irrelephant11]

wish I was playing strongly enough to eat the vengekill tbh
I need to really really step it up there's not very many of us

[Irrelephant11]

If Garmr tries to interfere, you should lynch him and cut FA_Q2 from the lynch order on a scum flip.

Hm.

I really have no clue who the last two scum are but I had been feeling pretty good about neither of them being PP
Garmr why is PP scum?

[Irrelephant11]

wait buj is voting me?

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Yeah Garmr is probably town, RC seemed to scumread him for anger but his anger seemed justified (fhpov anyway). Only concern is the quote I just posted from RC
No experience with him, but I'd rather he was town than scum so he is for now
You're town because it was like the one thing Shoshin and RC both solidly said
Penguin is town because RC was right that multiple players TMI'd Penguin's alignment as town

Leaving creature and LE fmpov
I keep wanting to read things more deeply to have stronger reasons but before FAQ2 flipped I thought it would be easy to win w/o doing so
If it's LE I guess I still feel that way

[Irrelephant11]

creature, bujaber, do you agree with Garmr that LE's only possible partners are Garmr and BuJ?

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I've done next to nothing noticeable this game
I literally came to sheep RC and Shoshin to a town win, and annoyingly we're getting to the point where either LE is scum or I'm the lylo mislynch, so I'm trying to enter the game in case it's not the former

[Irrelephant11]

Yes but if LE flips town, I'm probably the easiest mislynch in lylo (and from an outside perspective I probably would think so too) though maybe I'm just biased because I don't feel like I'm playing very well and I'm just assuming that that's true from scum's perspective too
Well, right, yeah, if LE is town then I'm not playing very well actually so that answers that

[Irrelephant11]

Eh at some point it's kinda fair to say, though I think Garmr said it too early to be accurate
If we're like 2 minutes from deadline anyone on the wagon is not a partner for LE
It gets more vague the further away from deadline you are

Since we both seem to think LE is likely to be scum, where do you suggest I place my sorting attention, Creature?

pedit: yeah Garmr is wrong (if his point is indeed just based on votes), but idk is that scummy of Garmr to say if it's untrue? Feels like not?

[Irrelephant11]

I just think the only vengekill scum can perform in the game is probably not something they picked haphazardly. It's making me doubt any suspicions I had about the slot

this point feels like it's going somewhere but... where

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this is dumb
why wasn't faq2 scum

also can it just be creature and le because that requires the least re-evaluating fmpov

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okay
please be town
VOTE: creature

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^ good question

Is Creature still voting LE? If so I'll reconsider

Also LE/Garmr and PP/Creature seem to be the two pairings I'm *supposed* to be examining closely and I'm curious if there are other pairings (that don't include me, obvs) that are being taken seriously rn

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RC would have us vote LE here...

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or me, but then it wouldn't be "us"

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idk mannn
Who's his partner?
VOTE: LE

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I just voted LE
did u kno

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Also what do you know about town!me lol
I throw my vote around regardless of alignment (well actually it's slightly town indicative for me but I'm too aware of that at this point to really earn any towncred for it)

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I don't think it could have gotten you lynched? Like hammers still aren't a thing in this setup

What do I mean where?

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I think it's for always? And if I'm wrong about that I 0% would have voted you willy nilly like that

Oh, I voted you because I thought I had okay reasons to townread Garmr/BuJ/PP and there was enough suspicion on your slot from them that I moved my vote to you, mostly to see what would happen/how it would change the gamestate
I dunno I just did what I was told I don't even remember who told me to do it
Imo that's only scummy of me if I'm wrong about hammers

pedit: okay yes good I'm right about plurality
Garmr

[Irrelephant11]

sorry have to go now
there's enough time before deadline to figure this out I think

bye

[Irrelephant11]

As soon as I stir the pot people get active then I get the artificial as fuck scum reads from pp and creature. It's like everyone else was complaisant with LE being the lynch with out considering who his scum partner could be or what they would do if is town.

Okay back to this
VOTE: ele
He's just being sheepy at this point. Plus the shoshin kill and Io interactions.

Creature you just keep getting mad when voted but you don't comment on my cases.

Man, those are pretty scummy.

Could it be Buj + Garmr trying to tie themselves hard to LE?

\
I had this thought but it would make me sad

Look how active Creature and PP get now despite them not really posting much before.

alright there's too many partner options here this is dumb

Also why does being sheepy make me scum
Like the only way I'm scum is if none of the people I'm sheeping my vote onto are scum
Meh I guess you might suggest that as long as my last vote is on town, I'm likely scum, but imo it shows my lack of info
Not loving how BuJ just spent like 72 hours "coming to the realization" that the Shoshin kill means I'm scum - it didn't read like a real progression (the conclusion seemed implied at the start)

[Irrelephant11]

Penguin is never scum btw
I had this thought as I was falling asleep last night because I remembered something
I now forget what it was but it conftowned PP fmpov so I'll never be voting him
I'm gonna ISO myself and PP and see if I can remember what it was

pedit: Garmr what if it's LE/BuJ? Can you talk more about why BuJ has to be town

[Irrelephant11]

this is why PP is never scum
He decides I'm town when he thought the opposite of my pred
Pretty much only because I voted the Io/BEF slot

I don't think scum!PP changes his read on me to a townread because I'm voting his partner
I also don't think we look like partner scum at all here but I'm obv biased

Although...I may be wrong because I like what teh Elephant is pushing as I catchup.

like what specifically do you like

Spoiler: This

I’ve been skimming and will start here
VOTE: BrightEyedFish

I’m not around as much on the weekends so if I need my vote somewhere else I’ll figure that out Monday

idk what NC is but maybe what I bolded is a scumslip, so
Nothing he posted came across as super towny imo
His case on tw was weak and I think the slot was/is green based on tw's posting
So like, from 1-10, 10 being town, he's like a 4
Also whoever said sheeping RC is a bad idea: how familiar are you with RC's meta?

Why can't we lynch Io slot now? Seems like that's what we should do.

Spoiler: Especially This

Also hi I like you too
(o)>
//\ <3
V_/

[Irrelephant11]

well I had to explain why Garmr's vote on Penguin is bad if Garmr is town u kno

Also no I haven't been pocketed, what? If you can refer me to any time a scum changed their read on a townie from scumread to townread because they voted a different scum that would be nice
Until then I'm going to believe that it's a bizarre scumplay and a completely normal townplay and townread him for it
BuJ's slow, soft, then hard and fast shading of me based on Shoshin kill reads like BuJ killed Shoshin imo

So I think you're the one leaning too much on anti-partner-reading a bus play, not me
But also it could still be you and LE I guess in theory, I just think you're slightly townier than BuJ in the moments I've actually been playing the game

pedit: saved the game?

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Penguin is never scum btw
I had this thought as I was falling asleep last night because I remembered something
I now forget what it was but it conftowned PP fmpov so I'll never be voting him
I'm gonna ISO myself and PP and see if I can remember what it was

pedit: Garmr what if it's LE/BuJ? Can you talk more about why BuJ has to be town

Hmm I don't want it to be LE/Buj tbh. Buj doesn't make sense with IO before Io was the confirmed wagon She placed her vote on Bujab. The interactions seems like she was trying to set up a mislynch by buddying up to rc.

Creature do you think this is a good reason to townread BuJ

[Irrelephant11]

Because it goes against his wincon in multiple ways if he is scum
-it encourages me to lynch his scum buddy
-it makes it harder to mislynch me, someone most people were scumreading (and I didn't do a ton to work to save the slot)

No one needs a lecture here on how white flag makes each scum life more valuable but I don't think PP decides the life of his scumbuddy is worth giving up to pocket me, and even if he does I don't think he's done like *anything else* to try to pocket me really
I think you and creature maybe have (the case could be made that neither of you should be townreading me but you are anyway), but not PP

[Irrelephant11]

Personally I'm waiting for BuJ to come back or LE's replacement to show up

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yes his AtE is working on me and on Garmr (I don't think I've seen anything from PP to indicate AtE is working on him)
Does that mean you are townreading Garmr and I and scumreading creature? Because otherwise "your AtE is working on everyone" doesn't make sense to say

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I still contend that's a weird thing for town!you to say about your scumreads
Like "your partner sure is being pulled in by your scummy AtE" makes no sense and whichever of us you think is scum with Creature that's kinda what you said if you're town

Game is getting confusing I agree
Because one of you should not be defending LE

Why is Garmr town fypov?

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I've decided it's BuJ/LE

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I don't think the shoshin kill excludes creature hence the earlier vote. But I do think it excludes LE

Personally I think the Shoshin kill is indicative of BuJ being scum
It's easy to pin on me, BuJ knew Shoshin was telling the truth when she said my presence would make her play a lot better/harder, and it lets towny-looking-BuJ "clear" scummy-looking-LE by saying he doesn't think LE would make that kill
BuJ himself has said he as scum messes with associatives, so I would expect him to be on Io wagon (obviously can't do that now, though, as it would lead to LE lynch and endgame)
I was mostly sheeping Shoshin to arrive at town!BuJ (and RC who said "if BuJ is scum we can lynch both his partners" which is still true), but I think Shoshin's read was a lazy one based on BuJ "making sense", which is sometimes pretty scum indicative, as townies forget/change their minds, while scum have a narrative they try to present coherently

Obviously if LE is scum BuJ is like his only likely partner, too... and LE has done nothing worth defending except that he maybe wouldn't kill Shoshin
Only hesitation is it doesn't feel like BuJ has much urgency here and LE is currently the lynch, and honestly no one is expressing much urgency so hmmm

[Irrelephant11]

Is it something weird like BuJ and Creature

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Okay, Garmr and BuJ, if neither of you are scum and you're both feeling strongly that LE is unlikely scum, sell me on scum!PP & scum!creature, because they're vouching for each other pretty hard

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Creature how did you arrive at town!me

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Creature how did you arrive at town!me

What do you think about my post?

I haven't decided yet, and want to continue this conversation with all of us here before I settle & share my thoughts on it

[Irrelephant11]

hrm I find that believable because iirc you started acting like I was definitely town right around then but also I wanted something deeper....

BuJ's point that he would mess with associatives more re:LE is like sorta true but also at this point it's harder to mess with associatives without letting your partner get lynched

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I think from no one's pov it should be either two scum in {me, PP, Irre} or {BuJ, Garmr, LE}

so maybe we could lynch from one group then lynch from the other group

I was just about to rule out the possibility that you were on a scumteam with BuJ or Garmr and then you post this...

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Yeah I guess I still don't really *believe* he's scum with either of you
It just pinged me in isolation as something that makes me think I should examine him/you him/buj more closely

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If we lynch LE and he flips town who would you duel?

Garmr I don’t find your case super compelling, btw
Though I’ll definitely let you pick the duel next game day if LE is town

Mod are we getting a deadline extension for the replacement?

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I'm basically here to sort Shoshin for y'all and then sheep her and RC to victory
Seemed like a fun and easy way to get a town win which is why I signed up even though I'm overgamed

yay