Overkill 2: A Blood-Thirsty Stallone Themed Game

[RCEnigma]

VOTE: Varsoon for scumsposing me in that same game.

[RCEnigma]

Alright, Pinn, let’s work together. You can be my mason buddy if you want this game.

He's scumslipping all over the place.

[RCEnigma]

Let's get to the real question. Why are you so active?

[RCEnigma]

I rolled scum.

You heard him.

[RCEnigma]

Match made in heaven. The best part is town will think this is all a joke.

[RCEnigma]

Let's get to the real question. Why are you so active?

It’ll probably settle down eventually. I just happened to be online doing nothing when the game started.

I haven’t been doing much lately.

Nice setup of using your unbusy schedule for hyper posting and looking towny!

Sassy

[RCEnigma]

False, only 4 on this page.

[RCEnigma]

I think you're a liar Profii.

[RCEnigma]

HOOAHH!

[RCEnigma]

Yes.

[RCEnigma]

We signed up for murder. It was promised.

[RCEnigma]

Seems legit VOTE: Hebichan

[RCEnigma]

Vote Varsoon out of the scum pt.

[RCEnigma]

Ooo cheeky is town already. Verrrrrrrry interesting.

[RCEnigma]

That felt slimy to me.
You should probably sheep this wagon Cheeky.

I came into this game expecting this post to be honest.

[RCEnigma]

I'm mad that Toog took my fake claim...

Anyways, I'm a Jinglebell Jester. If I'm lynched before 3p Lylo, everyone loses and Jingle wins. My wincon is to be lynched in 3p Lylo. Also, I'm Bulletproof, so no shooting me kiddos.

Anyone wanna end the game right now?

[RCEnigma]

That felt slimy to me.
You should probably sheep this wagon Cheeky.

I find this interesting, I think I remember you two going at it in Newbie 1836?

We did indeed. I'm pretending Thor isn't here so I can use it to mourn when he meets his untimely N1 demise.

He was so young

[RCEnigma]

Hmm, I like you now. UNVOTE:

This was a terrible idea.

[RCEnigma]

Non game question, when did Mala evolve?

[RCEnigma]

Oh hai, I was just about to vote you.

[RCEnigma]

VOTE: wisdom

And then I did.

[RCEnigma]

Agreed, it was good the first time.

[RCEnigma]

Why is the jester the towniest person.....besides Cheeky.

[RCEnigma]

Why do you think I took his place.

[RCEnigma]

You can get out when you say nice things about me.

We won't kill you night 1.

Buddies?

[RCEnigma]

We should all just buddy up. The buddy system’s good so none of us get lost.

I'm already lost, care to be my beacon of light in this dark dark world?

Bright is my buddy, he's a very nice fish.

Beat it FL.

[RCEnigma]

This is gonna get spicy real quick like.

[RCEnigma]

Bright, is Wisdom SK?

[RCEnigma]

Oh wow, he is. That was just a guess.

[RCEnigma]

Bright look at all my Archenemies bullying me.

[RCEnigma]

VOTE: Hebichan

Hey punks, who got Rocky?

This was my exact thought upon reading my role pm, and not getting Rocky.

But I don't like this question.

Hedging much?

This was her towny post, guy that asked. Granted Hebichan's statement probably comes from town. It's also a good placeholder for when these two posts become relevant later......probably.

[RCEnigma]

That felt slimy to me.
You should probably sheep this wagon Cheeky.

I find this interesting, I think I remember you two going at it in Newbie 1836?

We did indeed. I'm pretending Thor isn't here so I can use it to mourn when he meets his untimely N1 demise.

He was so young

"Claims town read on Thor while playing avoidance card based off Thor attacking with 'slimey' scum case"

Just saying I'm not getting enough sheep.

That felt slimy to me.
You should probably sheep this wagon Cheeky.

I find this interesting, I think I remember you two going at it in Newbie 1836?

I'm not going to bother to look, but sure, I believe that.
Why does that make anything interesting?

Dying in the night doesn't make you town......dun dun dunnnnnn

[RCEnigma]

This is just a miscommunication in tone because it is a forum setting. And it's redundant already.

Admittedly I didn't look at the Hebi games that we're brought up, I think that's a legitimate read from RR so despite the non-issue between them and bef, RR is town.

[RCEnigma]

So no, you were not acting in RVS with that vote, and it *will* be considered as a significant vote where you failed to provide sufficient reasoning, and apparently lied about your experience with the meta of our slots.

-Cerb

I was still in RVS because I had just started reading the thread. I can't help it you got a 7 hour head start on me and used up your RVS mentality before I had a chance to even dip my toes in.
Also, when did I lie about meta? I said you voted heb

as

scum because it was the first post that came across as scummy to me. I never mentioned anything about meta. I don't where you pulled that from.

Your wording... "you did x as scum" implies that you saw them do x previously in a game where they were scum.

I read it as you did what you did (your action in this game) as scum.

If I were to say "you did what you did and thought you would get away with it", it would be the same thing.

[RCEnigma]

Cheeky, I like it.

[RCEnigma]

So it looks like everyone is still joke posting

Does scum joke post more or less than town?

It depends on the player. It always depends on the player. Why ask this? I'll give you the benefit of the doubt and say you haven't read yet but as a first post. Yikes.

[RCEnigma]

I was super serious about Wisdom being SK btw.

[RCEnigma]

How many scum are we looking at

being towny is overrated

The order is flipped.

Maybe the towny comment is a joke but that felt like there was inspiration from elsewhere. 152 is his first shot at getting into the game so for that I don't like it. Doesn't really help town to speculate on the number of scum day 1. But it does help an SK get a feel for who they should be targeting.

[RCEnigma]

Chickadee Chick-a-day Chick-fil-a .. don't engage the crazy person

Pedit who's Biff?

I resent that, and I'm still ignoring you

[RCEnigma]

In post 228, pinturicchio wrote:
In post 221, RCEnigma wrote:
This is just a miscommunication in tone because it is a forum setting. And it's redundant already.

Admittedly I didn't look at the Hebi games that we're brought up, I think that's a legitimate read from RR so despite the non-issue between them and bef, RR is town.

I second this with violence.

Also, I agree that RR's read on Hebi was the first detectivesque post and not mine. I believe that RR's effort to take us out of RVS is very clear right now, and I like that. And by like it, I mean "I want you to be town" like it.


This post strikes me as pockety.

~Nancy

I thought so too. Let Dva know you guys can pocket me instead.

[RCEnigma]

But you have to 1v1 BeF

[RCEnigma]

That felt slimy to me.
You should probably sheep this wagon Cheeky.

I find this interesting, I think I remember you two going at it in Newbie 1836?

We did indeed. I'm pretending Thor isn't here so I can use it to mourn when he meets his untimely N1 demise.

He was so young

You were not in that game :/

Thor and I? Maybe a different game then. Same situation, don't mind me.

[RCEnigma]

@RC: You're actually serious! The crazy comment was because I thought you were joking.
Think that's a weak case... 152 is basically setup spec which tends to be NAI. I agree it isn't helpful but town do it.. and do it a lot from what I've seen.
139.. I won't claim I know wisdom very well but from my experience he's a bit scummy in general as town.. makes sense coming from him.

I don't think you actually believe this is a case people will be interested in so you're either wasting time or not actually scumhunting.

VOTE: RCEnigma

They may not now. But that's how I felt about it.

Every case is weak. RR had arguably the strongest case on a player so far and even that isn't reliable.

[RCEnigma]

I kinda get that response from him, though.

I’m not necessarily scum reading you, but my vote is serious.

If that makes sense.

There is probably scum on our wagon hoping to force me to claim. I’m not falling for that.

If you’re scum here, I think that would definitely be in your wheelhouse.

Nah, I’d say hammer without claim. I also like baiting flash wagons then tunneling people who jumped on it, though.

Claims mean nothing in a game like this tbh.

Oh FL....so......consistent.

[RCEnigma]

If he's scum why do you care about his read on you?

[RCEnigma]

Drewva what do you think about Hebi and Hebi/FL? @The Nancy head.

[RCEnigma]

I'm not aware of Nancy's meta but on the strength of DVa I'll say it was TvT.

Bujaber was right, I don't believe Wisdom is SK anymore. Ty for curing me doc.

[RCEnigma]

Like the cray shit is
You're in a game with 26 people right
Right
You come in and you see Flavor Leaf has voted Varsoon but just ditched that vote to go somewhere else
Instead of voting anywhere else, you vote Varsoon to drive attention back there, specifically calling out a game that Flavor Leaf was in as well, all while guffawing about it being a vote over me having caught him in that game
Like why
Why that level of manipulative ploy and swipe at making the momentum go back towards me?
It's cus that dude knows I'm the fucking scatman.

I think you're cute too

[RCEnigma]

Profii is your RR read just on tone? Also I'm gonna open a can of worms, why is Thor town?

[RCEnigma]

UNVOTE:

I need my buddy back I don't have anyone to vote.

[RCEnigma]

I'm glad that both RR and RCE had nothing to say in response to me.
Wild.

I called you cute, certainly not nothing.

[RCEnigma]

We still in RVS?

How about you vote for a wagon and we'll see

d'awww

You know, the nice thing about never playing more than one game at a time is that I don't forget what's going on in regards to me or other things I've been keeping tabs on. I'll almost assuredly never vote in this game until I am absolutely sure no voting shenanigans are afoot, and since I'm pretty well useless to the point of nearly being a Tree Stump, I'll likely be around a while. Problem is, the game gets hard to get invested in when you can't vote, so I found myself glazing over the last 3 pages or so and not really giving a fuck.

I'm mostly just curious how many "serious" votes there are out there, and how many are just sheeps and creeps.

Your claim makes it seem like there could be other vote based roles. Double or hidden voters maybe. I wouldn't put it past A50.

[RCEnigma]

This is just a miscommunication in tone because it is a forum setting. And it's redundant already.

Admittedly I didn't look at the Hebi games that we're brought up, I think that's a legitimate read from RR so despite the non-issue between them and bef, RR is town.

Your suit is looking shiny Mr. Knight.

Jealous you don't have a spiffy buddy?

[RCEnigma]

Bujaber - FL made a good point about grabbing attention. The back and forth with Nancy was exactly that, Don't think Wisdom has anything to gain from the exchange. The pressure on Nancy is nice and Wisdom may not have set it in motion but he did jumpstart it. Sad FL called Nancy town so early.

He also shut Varsoon down which was pretty sweet.

[RCEnigma]

Bujaber - FL made a good point about grabbing attention. The back and forth with Nancy was exactly that, Don't think Wisdom has anything to gain from the exchange. The pressure on Nancy is nice and Wisdom may not have set it in motion but he did jumpstart it. Sad FL called Nancy town so early.

He also shut Varsoon down which was pretty sweet.

For the record this is your best post so far

Yeah well you're the only one caring enough to ask why I'm doing what I'm doing. Everyone else is content with Varsooning™ me.

I will make it a thing Varsoon.

So I'm pretty content with keeping this play up.

[RCEnigma]

Lol, there are 9 innings.

[RCEnigma]

Drewva what do you think about Hebi and Hebi/FL? @The Nancy head.

I don’t know what to make of hebi rn. I don’t know why she lied about being lynched D1 but I dunno if it’s scum indicative. I do know she gets wrongly scumread a lot in games. I don’t know whether that’s the case here, so she’s null to me rn.

Not much rn, if either one flips scum, I’ll revisit it. Most of it seems to be coming from FL to hebi and not so much, ghe other way around, so possible pocket? I’d guess recruiter but A50 said this game wasn’t bastard. \_0_/

Any particular reason, you’re asking me this question?

Ehh I need to start putting my thoughts down when I'm reading through, there was something FL or Hebi said that made me question if you had ties with one of the slots, plus you making little to no mention of either. It's a large playerlist so part of it is just keeping tabs.

On the other hand I wanted to get an idea of how cohesive the heads are because Profii hit it on the head. I read Dva as light town but I don't get the same vibes when you post. So it's good to know what is coming impulsively from Nancy or Dva and what's probably coordinated.

[RCEnigma]

Bujaber - FL made a good point about grabbing attention. The back and forth with Nancy was exactly that, Don't think Wisdom has anything to gain from the exchange. The pressure on Nancy is nice and Wisdom may not have set it in motion but he did jumpstart it. Sad FL called Nancy town so early.

He also shut Varsoon down which was pretty sweet.

What exactly did Wisdom “jumpstart”?

You do realize that that quote he referenced was taken from Forgotten Hourglass, where he was scum and I was town, right?

I don't know what that has to do with this game. If it's applicable to a meta read about playstyle specifically then past alignment has no bearing.

[RCEnigma]

Bujaber - FL made a good point about grabbing attention. The back and forth with Nancy was exactly that, Don't think Wisdom has anything to gain from the exchange. The pressure on Nancy is nice and Wisdom may not have set it in motion but he did jumpstart it. Sad FL called Nancy town so early.

He also shut Varsoon down which was pretty sweet.

What exactly did Wisdom “jumpstart”?

You do realize that that quote he referenced was taken from Forgotten Hourglass, where he was scum and I was town, right?

Ahh well in your case the slots voting you weren't really meaningfully engaging you until Wisdom.


Interesting.

[RCEnigma]

Not meaningfully, at least to me. In other words not in a way that would generate content and/or create readable information.

Your interactions with wisdom made you both easier to read and sparked commentary from other slots while your interactions with Gamma make Gamma slightly easier to read and little else.

[RCEnigma]

Why does it matter in the context it was used?

[RCEnigma]

Bujaber has something to say about SK reads I would think.

[RCEnigma]

How many games besides the game linked do you two have together? Ballpark estimate.

[RCEnigma]

What weight exactly? Despite most of Varsoons case being based on RVS....still, I can at least see his process. Thor's wagon was literally just RVs from an offhand read.

On my wagon I only see really two votes with Town intentions and one (yours, that may or may not be) that I can see built from my play though you haven't elaborated.

[RCEnigma]

I mean, shit, dude, I'm on RCE.
I'm the lead vote there.
I know I haven't doubled down on it, and my vote may be taken as some RVS nonsense but I haven't wavered for hard reason;
Dude did this wild RVS shit where he put me up onto multiple votes early while giving rationale that I caught scum-him in an earlier game (so why's that make me a good RVS candidate here?)
Dude was complicit with my bold-faced scum claiming asshatery which feels real slippery.
Dude was super eager to flop his vote around early onto obv-town Hebi in a way that doesn't sit right with me
Dude skeeved right off that wagon once it became sub-optimal to stay,
Dude is now on wisdom, who I am pretty sure is town
Dude has an ISO of joke posts and one-sentence skim
Dude where's my car
No really though I should've chosen a different means of referring to the dude.
Anyway.
I dunno how much of this is just personal beef with how that guy interfaces but I really really think I've got a good chance of being right out the woodwork there and nothing else sings to me like that lynch.
It's also gotten other votes so so so easy which feels good.
It just feels good, RR.

Mmk I'm ready to respond now.

Page one vote...whatever

Scum stick together.

Jumped from Varsoon to Hebi as a Varsoon wagon wouldn't stick so no point. Pressure on Hebi was a better idea.

Hebi was still the leading wagon with a lot of slots left to check in. I liked her response about Tails and the disregard of her wagon so, unvote. This point isn't accurate.

Agree wisdom is town, didn't at the time. see: wisdom is SK case

You didn't laugh at any of them and honestly I'm hurt.

Give me something good Varsoon. What do you think about your wagon mates at the moment?

[RCEnigma]

Tails, Fair point 1. Was probably preemptive. Also, BEF is my buddy so, yes.

I read wisdom as town from the interaction and Dva as town from their posts. After further pressing I've come around on the other half of the Hydra. I call ducks ducks.

Yes I have many pockets. You weren't invited.

The order I was answering in got messed up and I can't fix it now.

He posted and I thought "SK" the way Overkill was explained to me I came into the game thinking multiball, lots of vig play, and SKs. I was pleasantly surprised.

I was already voting Wisdom I think before that read developed and there wasn't much incentive to change it anyways.

I like your case the best though, you can be town. I've got a lot of town right now and I don't know how to feel about it.

[RCEnigma]

What weight exactly? Despite most of Varsoons case being based on RVS....still, I can at least see his process. Thor's wagon was literally just RVs from an offhand read.

On my wagon I only see really two votes with Town intentions and one (yours, that may or may not be) that I can see built from my play though you haven't elaborated.

Coming back around to this. You dismissed Varsoon and Thor as RVS. So they can't be the 2 votes with town intentions. So...how are Majiffy and Bujab town intentioned votes? I'm pretty sure Majiffy just naked voted you. And if you do mean Varsoon and Thor, how can their votes be driven by town intentions if they're random and meaningless?

Varsoon and Bujaber are the town votes. I've only played with Varsoon and Thor once each (I replaced out of the game with Thor for reasons).

Varsoon looks like the game I finished with him and I think this is just the way he builds cases. Bujaber hasn't made a solid case but has actively interacted with me in a way that seems like he is trying to figure out my intentions instead of asking questions to make me look worse or paint me as scum. So I like them both.

[RCEnigma]

Profiis in my head and I don't like it

[RCEnigma]

I'll put a pin in this one for you.

[RCEnigma]

Im not used to it. Generally you have fairly unique angles that make me think about multiple angles. It helps my read on you. I can't really do that if we are already on the same page.

I'll reevaluate it before the day ends.

Also, I do the pocketing around here.

[RCEnigma]

Perspectives* in place of the second "angle".

[RCEnigma]

RCE -

you are right I usually do probably exactly what I've said about BuJ there and come at things from a different perspective - but I think I've mentioned I dont do 26p games so I'm not like super confident with how the site meta of the bigger games plays out - my gut feeling is the scum are probably just lurking and letting us tie ourselves up in knots with all the little mini dramas going on

But because that's the way I am seeing things, I still dont see how I'm in your head.

This wasn't pointing towards a scumread on you I have you as town actually. I'll post examples of what I mean once I'm settled in but the recent one was the fence thing with Tails.

That was pretty much the exact thought I had before he cased me but going back through his Iso and seeing the few townreads he's thrown out they lined up with mine except for like Pint and Thor, I figured I was just omgusing and threw that away.

[RCEnigma]

Short answer I was waiting on Thor. I'm still not sure on him but he has like 5 posts and half of them are "get RCE" so, shrug, don't have a read there yet. Majiffy isn't around but if anyone's scum on my wagon it's probably there.

I don't think I'm an easy sheep now that I've had to defend myself and I'm no longer lynchbait, so that's unfortunate. Or were you asking in a general meta sense?

[RCEnigma]

The shut down comment was about Wisdom with the pocket comment. Not wanting to be pocketed isn't necessarily townie but it was a +1.

[RCEnigma]

As easily as anyone else I suppose, I won't AtE out of pressure though, *subtle jab*

I can't say, he has 3 posts with nothing game related but the vote. While I don't find inactivity alignment indicative, inactive town doesn't need pressure votes since they won't follow up on them. I would probably have been content with "sheeping so and so" I assume that's the case.

[RCEnigma]

Ehh you've only played with Scum!me. I don't play day 1 that way as town so the 'why' regarding pocketing may be more important to me than it is to you.

[RCEnigma]

Do you really think a whole scumteam is gunning for you? Or is it just because they don't like you right now.

[RCEnigma]

My thoughts about this last 8 pages: the tinfoil hat is back, babyyyyyy. Wisdom and DrewVa's drama finishing with both voting the same slot seems staged. But I'll leave the tinfoil hat saved for later.

Addendum: FL are openly flaunting as a scum pair.

[RCEnigma]

My thoughts about this last 8 pages: the tinfoil hat is back, babyyyyyy. Wisdom and DrewVa's drama finishing with both voting the same slot seems staged. But I'll leave the tinfoil hat saved for later.

Addendum: FL and Hebi are openly flaunting as a scum pair.

Ebwop

[RCEnigma]

Possibly.

How did you strengthen his vote? What was his case on Majiffy in the first place?

[RCEnigma]

Possibly.

How did you strengthen his vote? What was his case on Majiffy in the first place?

He never gave any reasons but I have never ever seen Wisdom attempt to discredit a case from.someone who had sheeped him - as any alignment and if I doubted my initial sr on him - due to his Majiffy vote seeming like a decent one to me - his suddenly sr me for it , after apparently tr me for being “moonlogicy” in his mind, makes 0 sense.

In what world, does town ever view questioning him about discrediting my case on

someone HE was voting

, scummy?

When someone they think is scummy jumps on the wagon.

[RCEnigma]

If Amzela cases Thor she'll be my hero.

[RCEnigma]

Creature literally said he had a test today.

Same question for you. Do you think Wisdom is a good candidate to push right now?

Yup. Even more so after the multi/singleball comments.

Why does suggesting singleball make Wisdom more likely scum than town it 3p?

[RCEnigma]

I see, Tails who were your scumreads again? What do you think about the 3p reads on wisdom?

[RCEnigma]

Lol I've got another 3p read for you then. Drewva may just be lyncher here.

[RCEnigma]

You have a vote restriction in your role pm?

Yeah, I'm only allowed to hammer. If I vote and don't hammer, I will be modkilled. ISO me, it's all there.

Oh right, I forgot you made an actual claim between all the fake claims.

Also my opinion of both thor and tails are dropping fast.

Don't think anyone asked about the Thor side of this? Why did he drop fast?

[RCEnigma]

I mean it's a long day. I wasn't sold on the read.

[RCEnigma]

Player or flavor? What's the difference I don't know what you mean.

[RCEnigma]

Oh, hmm ok that changes things. That would probably be pretty rough.

[RCEnigma]

RCE v Varsoon are never buddies here

Why can't we be buddies? Start a wagon on partner, give mostly garbage reasoning that looks surface level ok, say "hmm ok but I'm not sure" when their arguments are countered, jump off the wagon and shade lightly for good measure.

That's....scum distance/buss prep 101. Unless your argument is that Varsoon is more capable as scum. I've only skimmed one Varsoon scum game and I'd agree but simple is fine in a game this large, it looks active even if it's not going anywhere.

[RCEnigma]

Oy Varsoon quick question, how do you feel about RR overall? Also this is the second noisy conflict RR has found themselves in with neither really amounting to anything besides outside intervention to curve it, wanted your take on it.

[RCEnigma]

So RR is a player that I legit do have a ton of issue reading thanks to moderating a TON of their games and seeing them play both sides of the coin.
I'd actually have an absolute scumread on them for the Cerb head taking an experimental/different approach than usual given I recall that kinda being the case when Cerb was in my SaGa Frontier game (hydra'd differently, was third party) but given the town!experimentation with approach in the previous Overkill game, I can't lean too much on that meta point anymore.

I think they're town, especially given the Drixx posts and the general ethos both exude here, though that's more a gut read than something I can articulate very well.

Why, whacha think? Hard slot to parse or something else?

I think there's a game plan there that I'm not putting together yet, I'll call it consistent for now.

It is a hard slot to parse but there are three slots I'm holding to a different standard so I'm putting them in a separate box. That isn't to say I think less of anyone elses game but your slot, Thor, and RR go in that box for now.

RR for what I've seen in this game already.
You and Thor for previous games played and knowing these are extremely capable players as either alignment.

I don't really want to be heavily influenced by any of these slots until I have a better understanding of their alignment. However RR said you are really the only player in this list that can really pin his meta.

Unless the playstyle change is specifically tailored to you I don't think it's scum motivated.

[RCEnigma]

VOTE: Dripping Goofball
this wagon has people I like.

Chickadee I haven't played with scum creature but I know having a couple posts and then going potato is possible from him as town. If you've played with him more is he more likely to disappear as scum?

[RCEnigma]

Fwiw I didn't believe the dayvig was a thing, but that kind of solidifies my townread on Varsoon. The play started with his vote on Profii so if you look for reactions start there and not the actual shot.

[RCEnigma]

Whoops thought you voted Profii and the shot thing was a separate post.

[RCEnigma]

My thoughts when I voted. Did not stop me from voting.

[RCEnigma]

You guys really do enjoy meta reads.

[RCEnigma]

So Chickadee, I see you're voting creature for lack of presence. Why his lack of presence specifically? And not say, Drip, or majiffy, or thor.

P.edit:

Or Mala who I forgot was in this game.

[RCEnigma]

So Chickadee, I see you're voting creature for lack of presence. Why his lack of presence specifically? And not say, Drip, or majiffy, or thor.

You don't have to respond to this until after Chick responds to (or even at all I guess since I'm not exactly asking a question), but I'm surprised that out of all the questions you could ask anyone about anything, you've chosen to ask Chickadee this question.

-DV

Should I not engage chickadee?

[RCEnigma]

Chick, when you’re able, what is your read on Toog and why?

So Chickadee, I see you're voting creature for lack of presence. Why his lack of presence specifically? And not say, Drip, or majiffy, or thor.

You don't have to respond to this until after Chick responds to (or even at all I guess since I'm not exactly asking a question), but I'm surprised that out of all the questions you could ask anyone about anything, you've chosen to ask Chickadee this question.

-DV

Should I not engage chickadee?

The reason for my surprise was that the answer to your question seemed fairly clear from what Chickadee had already posted.

She explained why she thought creature could be scum, unless he posted. But not why that can't apply to any other slots.

I was just curious why wagons based on lack of activity formed on DGB and Majiffy but other slots with the same behavior are being shielded or avoided. Like Thor and Creature.

[RCEnigma]

Yes, everyone's my partner Buj....

[RCEnigma]

Keep going but say stop when you're done, I'll TLDR it for the rest.

[RCEnigma]

Also, join micros? Maybe?

[RCEnigma]

Dunno if I was the only one that expected a large amount of posts in a 26 player game.

[RCEnigma]

Also I'll soon give comments on the entire playerlist at one post (after I finish reading a page and watch some minutes of Netflix)

[RCEnigma]

Don't worry it's a theme in a theme.

[RCEnigma]

So in conclusion? If one half of the read is null (either alignment) and the other most likely a town tell (though not present this game) it results in a positive net gain for scum equity.

Cheeky dropped in my list for a bit but she's made her way back up to be one of my most solid reads. I think I want to park my vote on Majiffy or Thor but for anyone that knows. Is Majiffy a similar player to Thor? Would the smartass thing apply to him as well?

[RCEnigma]

I agree it's town creature here. Do you scumread Creature because of the wisdom goggles?

[RCEnigma]

Mala's ISO is pretty empty, but hebichan is even worse. There's barely any analysis here. Even when posting a case she seems to give herself an out by offering an argument for why they could be wrong.

This is probably the best reason to scumread her and is exactly how Varsoon pegged my scumgame. Gives a convenient defense when X flips as a mislynch when they can point back to a post the argued the counterpoints in.

Could you post a few examples from where you got that read?
Also I don't mind flipping Majiffy either he's practically a DGB copy at this point with more sarcasm peppered in.

The only thing stopping me from flipping wagons is that I agree with Majiffy, Chickadee has scum equity. If DGB flips scum chickadee probably does too.

[RCEnigma]

Feel like chickadee is scummy on her own, don't remember what connection I made. It had to do with the vanity vote on creature in relation to the Majiffy/DGB wagons.

Also I'm looking moreso at the connections that aren't there and who is defending who's wagon. Not necessarily who townreads or scumreads who.

[RCEnigma]

On second thought that's a bad approach. There are too many slots with ISOs that amount to piles of nothing.

[RCEnigma]

There are three good wagons available and we're doing Majiffy?

Sir yes sir
VOTE: Chickadee

O captain my captain VOTE: Chickadee

[RCEnigma]

Dave put it pretty well. To boil it down there isn't an effort to scum or townhunt from Chickadee. Even the parameters she used to scumread Creature ONLY applied to creature and none of the other slots that fit in the same category.

[RCEnigma]

So vote Chickadee.

[RCEnigma]

I want to say he's at least not scum, with bad scumreads except for the point on Hebi. Umm he has some weird logic, like his flip on Majiffy which may come from just putting thoughts down as he writes. It tends to happen to me a fair bit even if it makes sense in my head.

I don't know Bujaber and I haven't followed any of his games but the incongruities in his logic don't necessarily serve scum well, at least in the posts I noticed it in.

[RCEnigma]

We found scum.

[RCEnigma]

I'm being facetious, what do you think of chickadees play? I don't know how caught up you are.

[RCEnigma]

Tldr

Wisdom clashes with more slots (Dave, RR, Nero/Majiffy)
Majiffy replaces out (won't comment in this, it's in his iso) Nero Cain takes his spot
Majiffy wagon dies, replaced by Chickadee wagon and Bujaber counterwagon.

[RCEnigma]

So?
There's minimum effort from tons of players and effort=/=alignment.
Seems like low hanging fruit and I wouldn't be surprised if the ease of momentum the wagon has is due to scum hopping on it.

Can't vote them all.

[RCEnigma]

Varsoon do you feel bujabers case on hebichan holds any merit?

[RCEnigma]

I've been confusing this game with another thinking scum only had night chat. Now that I've checked, the wording that "all PTs are open day and night" is a pretty good indicator for multiball.

Hydra PT's would be open regardless right?

[RCEnigma]

I'm in over my head...

[RCEnigma]

It's mafia, only scum is sure.

[RCEnigma]

People have put in their two cents on chickadee already. The wagon is already there I'm sure he can see the VC. He's also probably going to read for himself. I summarized so he can pick what to skip over if he wants. But I'm not going to spoon-feed him reads.

Alchemist is a big boy he can think and decide for himself.

[RCEnigma]

If you don't think it's scummy that her singular scumread was a slot that you could interchange with your slot at the time, DGB, Dave possibly (though the few times he did post I thought were pretty good with bringing content), toog, or like FL then cool that's fair. But keep in mind that DGB and Majiffy(you) were the counterwagon at the time. Two slots that are in the exact same boat as her scumread for the exact same reasons. When I pressed she didn't have any interest in sorting either slot but did try to draw support away from one of those wagons onto creature.

She didn't back away from creature until she started getting attention for it after his catch up. I do find drawing attention away from mounting wagons scummy because it implies a vested interest in keeping one of the two slots (DGB or Majiffy) alive.

You can argue she wasn't and I'll argue she was.

I think that answers bujabers earlier question. Or whoever asked me about the DGB/Chickadee connection.

[RCEnigma]

I do feel like counter wagoning is pretty scummy yeah, but it doesn't follow that DGB has to be scum, since it could be a bus/white knight situation.

Which is why I asked Chickadee about those two slots explicitly. I would be more reserved about my read if chickadee had actually defended either Majiffy or DGB openly but instead passed them over as slots she hasn't sorted or wouldn't sort till later.

Which to me seemed like trying to keep them at a distance while still working to protect one. If the Majiffy/Chickadee thing is true then that makes me double down on chickadee with DGB.

[RCEnigma]

I did get a weird vibe when Fortian interjected himself into my questioning of Chickadee. I'm not really sure why pressure on his scumread would bother him at all.

[RCEnigma]

I feel ok sheeping Gammas Thor read for today. I'll say now that I will at (almost) no point attempt to read Thor in any way shape or form since the end result would be calling him mafia 100% of the time.

[RCEnigma]

@everyone: Yes, my voice is super different in these posts with Varsoon, take that to mean what you will. I know what it means! ^^

-Cerb

Lol I was getting sketched out till you pointed it out.

I don't see that as a partner back and forth and Varsoon is pretty solidly town. I think Bujaber was towny early too though. So pitch me Bujaber scum, RR or Varsoon.

I'll pick some Bujaber related questions out of his iso when I get a chance to focus on the game a bit better.

But truth be told I haven't been paying attention to his slot since the beginning of the day. Or anyone that hasn't really pushed on me.

[RCEnigma]

No, no it won't. But the good news is you probably get shot in the night, so you've got that going for you.

[RCEnigma]

Clem. I doubt he dodges a TK.

[RCEnigma]

So while I think he's still scum I'm fine with consolidating a better Lynch.

[RCEnigma]

There are more than one scum so yes I would argue there can be better lynches and even in the event of a mislynch if it gives town with bad reads better information to make more informed decisions going forward then I'm potentially ok with that. I say potentially because I have no idea how many possible myslynches we have.

I've got the scumread on DGB for the reasons I've stated on the Chickadee connection. I'm not wild on FL or Hebi I have a feeling they aren't the same alignment but it mostly hinges on not being able to read FL this game. So I can't tell if it's scum FL that pocketed Hebi or scum Hebi that took the pocket and ran.

Everyone loves Pint and I've liked some of his reads but that doesn't make him town. Mala has a daypass from me but I don't think she's really too towny. Out of the low activity slots she just hasn't produced anything to read either way, but I feel even when she's inactive as town she's capable of bleeding green so there's that.

[RCEnigma]

I'm also not reading you today because I have a feeling you fall into the same category as Thor, your style is just one I find scummy naturally so I'm going to rely on my town block to sort you and hope someone shoots you at some point. Sorry not sorry.

[RCEnigma]

Because I have to consider the slots around me and the slots that I find to be town. If we can find a lynch that favors them over me then that's fine too, I still have my read and I can build on it if we miss.

They may also be better at finding the outlying scum than I am.

I think you guys are taking it as "I'm fine with not lynching scum" as opposed to "I'm willing to put a pin in my scumread, to look for more scum."

[RCEnigma]

Also Nero I think in your mind there is going to be something scummy to you in everything I post. Or a scum spin at the least, I kinda wanted to ignore you with that in mind.

[RCEnigma]

I was placated by the Majiffy + Chickadee meta read. I don't know either player. I also said I'm not attempting to read you. But I didn't like Majiffy so there's that.

[RCEnigma]

Oh, I hadn't considered that.

[RCEnigma]

That's fair, I just didn't like the way your RVS interactions continued into the day and almost solely revolved around Hebi.

[RCEnigma]

That's fair, I just didn't like the way your RVS interactions continued into the day and almost solely revolved around Hebi.

Piggybacking, i also am top 10 posters in this game, and I was gone for a week, so I think this is a rather shallow statement that is being made.

I agree, I didn't pursue it since it's not particularly a strong reason.

[RCEnigma]

Siri, add Tails to my lynch list.

[RCEnigma]

Siri, add Tails to my lynch list.

Why?

For strike 2.

[RCEnigma]

He had a bad push on me for meh reasons, they were the best of the bunch fwiw. This is his second bad push for equally bad reasons. It reads very disingenuous which makes his initial read to start that interaction pretty ironic.

I could see scum doing this together but I think Cheeky had a town tell.

[RCEnigma]

Lol I retract that read, you jump-started the wagon on Chickadee, Dave kind of summed it up but I think we came to the same conclusion beforehand.

[RCEnigma]

Is Alonzo scum that's blatantly not doing anything or one of those new age players that are all like "I'm going to be scummy and useless for reasons"

Sure, why not. If he doesn't think I'm a threat, and doesn't want to Lynch me, great!

not really what I was getting at but ok...

I didn't feel qualified to answer this but it's still been left in the air so.

I've only seen Alonzo as town, iirc he hasn't rolled scum in like a year or something absurd like that. However he does appear...eh....trolly? On day 1s and when repping into slots. From what I've seen he hits a switch late game and can easily bleed town. Based on that I'm sure he can replicate his town game. But that's all I've got.

[RCEnigma]

Lol I'd vig Gamma for that alone.

[RCEnigma]

Can we get chickadee today and DGB tomorrow? If I need the puppy dog eyes ok but...

[RCEnigma]

@Nancy, check in with me real fast in the PT - D

I like how this was probably to consult on who Tails main is.

[RCEnigma]

Read Dva like a book.....a really towny book.

[RCEnigma]

Who do you think are the scumbuddies who tried to to weigh down the DGB wagon to shift it off their buddy?
Tails has a very reasonable point against you even if you don't agree with it.

This is actually an interesting take, but would be better look into post flips rather than before. Less room for wifom.

[RCEnigma]

Tails scumread Nancy.
Nancy said it was based on nothing.
Nancy added 3 games as a meta read to scumread Tails.
Tails said it's wrong.

All I've gathered but to be fair I've turned out of Drewva's head to heads at this point.

[RCEnigma]

Wondering the same.

[RCEnigma]

Lol I'd vig Gamma for that alone.

Flavor care to enlighten this poor fool?

Oh no I'm aware of the reference lol.

[RCEnigma]

Can we get chickadee today and DGB tomorrow? If I need the puppy dog eyes ok but...

No.
Chick/Clem seems to be a LHF push based on activity

You didn't read any of the cases. Clemency then came in and had even worse interactions under the threat of pressure. He gave himself a 48 hour window but I expect it to be much more of the same poor defense of his slot despite stating he was read up at the time. His only read was also on Chickadee...his slot.

Don't know either of these players, Clemency feels like scum with limited range (no offense, personally my scum range is very limited as well).

[RCEnigma]

Because it's a line I would unironically vig you for.

[RCEnigma]

I have my own thoughts about it, waiting to see what comes of it. Didn't mind hearing Thor's thoughts on it. Any input from Thor is helpful to determine his alignment at the very least, it destroys the early scumreads on his slot that we're based on activity and lack of contribution.

[RCEnigma]

Ok, explain to me why town plays like that then. Also explain to me why telling you I would shoot you for it is scummy.

[RCEnigma]

Youre pretty entertaining, I like you. Not enough to not Lynch you though. Sorry.

[RCEnigma]

usually suboptimal since other players could give you a biased stance of what happened, and the best way to have an unbiased read is well... Doing it yourself. RCE did a good job tho; Thor, not so much.

You are incorrect - i did a better job because I offered opinions upon the facts.
RCE avoided doing so.
Lrn2scumhunt

If he's town, it's his job to scumhunt for himself, not yours. That's what I meant. As I said, I agree with your opinion in that subject, but I don't think what he needed was an opinion

I agree it's his job to scumhunt.
The only way he's scumhunting by asking that question is to get people to offer views.
So I helped his useless behavior become scumhunting for everyone.
RCE did nothing and added to the post count of the game.
Gamma basically did nothing and added to the post count of the game.
I provided scumhunting.

But if you think people re-quoting other people's posts (which would be the theory 'best' answer to Gamma's question by your stated assessment here, or the secondary possibility of telling someone to go read who is providing us clear evidence they don't care to go read) then I submit you're doing it wrong.

What's your take on Tails v. DrewVa?
Not a description of it, but an opinion upon it.

Note this is a recurring theme in Gammas iso.

[RCEnigma]

Clemency what are your reads? What do you think about anything in the game other than your slot?

[RCEnigma]

Gamma I would have switched to DGB if I thought there was enough time to lynch that slot but it seems futile. Why don't you like the clem wagon?

What changed from the time DGB was one of the leading wagons to now? There was absolutely a chance to wagon DGB and it fell apart pretty quickly.

[RCEnigma]

Just checking in to see if Chick is lynched yet.

Nero you have this tendency to talk people away from your viewpoints. I don't know if it's a tone thing or what.

[RCEnigma]

Ride or die with Pint, Dave, and Fortian. That is all.

[RCEnigma]

Say the words pretty please? It's not often I'm right.

[RCEnigma]

We can try. Still think DGB is the partner here. If not it's Nero but I kinda like his late flip.

[RCEnigma]

Clemency is already hammered.

[RCEnigma]

Say the words pretty please? It's not often I'm right.

Yeah say em!

Somebody needs to protect my buddy RCE tonight. I think scum is afraid of him and I'll need him around tomorrow

Lol I'm going into the night fully prepared to die

[RCEnigma]

I'm aware. I'm not ok with it.

[RCEnigma]

No. It's not a test of anything. The only test of his claim is him actually voting someone prior to hammer, which he won't do.

-Cerb

This all the way. We arent gambling on toogs alignment like that.

[RCEnigma]

Toog hammering doesn't matter, he can be any role any alignment and hammer.

[RCEnigma]

I'm not familiar with priest.

[RCEnigma]

Hmm not so fast.

[RCEnigma]

Convenient that you come in to discredit someone who actively desires your lynch.

Maybe I secretly desire my lynch.

Can make your mafia dreams come true.

[RCEnigma]

I was expecting a lot more killing when I was invited to this game
VOTE: DGB

[RCEnigma]

The people demand a sacrifice!

[RCEnigma]

I half expected drewva to die in the night and Tails to claim TK.

[RCEnigma]

lol @ underkill though

We were all friends together at school.

[RCEnigma]

Yeah I could go for a toog Lynch.......but I like DGB first.

[RCEnigma]

I half expected drewva to die in the night and Tails to claim TK.

Why? And wtf is TK?

Town killing, so like a town PGO or Vig.

Varsoon it had to do with the wagon shifting which was one of the main reasons I was adamant about the Chickadee Lynch. One of DGB/Majiffy are also scum in my opinion. I'll requote the reason if I go back and look for it at some point.

[RCEnigma]

i'll have to re-read to back up my claims but:
creature is town 100% money back guarantee
DrewVa feels off to me

i still don't see why bujaber is being considered a lynch this game

nero cain is scumleanish

Possible rule of the 3 or rather 4?

These are like the only reads he gave, it wouldn't surprise me if all of his scumteam were slots not mentioned.

[RCEnigma]

I don't think the self hammer ties Toog to scum and don't think that's what RR was getting at. If anything I think it's odd that's what everyone jumped on.

[RCEnigma]

there are definitely some bussing scum in there as well
bef/alchemist/hebi strike me as that the most looking at the wagon

And hebi/Nero makes sense too.
Change BEF for profii and we have a deal.

Take BEF and leave Profii out of it.

If we can't have DGB today I'll happily settle on Nero.

[RCEnigma]

Davesaz is town if you think I'm town.

[RCEnigma]

As an Actor, I can only hammer vote or be mod killed, but as a Director, I get a 1 use Global Doctor ability, which I used last night.



Even the mod got a laugh out of it.

Even if this isn't true......lol brilliant.

[RCEnigma]

I need to be lynched anyway.

...I've been saying this.

[RCEnigma]

Ok I'm caught up and willing to lynch in:

Alchemist
Hebi
RR
Dave
And maybe Nero, BEF or Gamma but still weird on Nero after the towny majiffy rage quit.

I feel like RR/Dave could be SvS on the same team if one flips red I'd lynch the other next.

Fair but I don't think either are on the same team as Chickadee which is where we should be looking given the information we have. I'd still defend Dave as town though, RR not so much.

[RCEnigma]

Similar situation to Profii, just that we are mindmelding a fair bit. The problem with Profii is that we've never really been on the same page like this game and I'm reading it weird.

Also his position on the Chickadee wagon plus his reasoning which echoed parts of my reasoning. He had some posts early in day 1 based around me that pinged me as town because he didn't use it to pocket or interact with me really in any way.

[RCEnigma]

I'm also paranoid of Varsoon now, I had him as town day 1 but J think he TMI'd today. So I don't have a problem looking into the Clem wagon but feel like Varsoon may be paired with stronger players he feels comfortable with.

[RCEnigma]

Ones both on the Clem wagon and that also opposed Toog voting I should say. I would fall into this category except for the strong player portion for example.

[RCEnigma]

Hey Bujaber you can throw a townread my way, I'll protect you from Varsoon he's just a meanie

[RCEnigma]

You win when you've eliminated all competition and subdued the Town.

Non flavor hint as well.

[RCEnigma]

List of people I want to shoot this second:
DGB
Nero
FL (or Hebi)

People I want to shoot but not this second:
RR
Varsoon

[RCEnigma]

Lol VOTE: Nero

[RCEnigma]

I'd argue I don't really have to actively push my partners Lynch in a 26 person game. Especially in multiball where even scum can scumhunt...

I also explained that read cheeky so meh, you were town to me and remained town most of the day.

[RCEnigma]

Something something hunting for SK is scummy.

[RCEnigma]

For those that don't think there are clear associations between Clemency/chickadee and DGB or Nero/Majiffy can you explain to me why chickadee trying to move the wagons away from one of those slots indicates they are town?

Because it makes sense to me why the goon specifically would make that play and not any of the other scum roles. Especially since it looked like from Chickadees perspective she could have gotten support for a creature wagon. There were plenty of slots upset with the way Creature was approaching the game.

It only blew up on her because she was the one trying to push it forward instead of letting one of the other slots take the lead.

[RCEnigma]

Get where you are coming from RR, however. Your play was predetermined coming into the day with only the information from the Clemency flip. We gained more information with the lack of flips and Toogs subsequent claim of global doctor. I feel like that wasn't taken into consideration or considered when you continued arguing for his confirmation. Maybe it's hindsight speaking but that was much more plausible than multiple protective roles in this specific setup, nevermind that in theory multiple protectives would have had to hit perfect saves for a no kill night. Then you consider Toogs claim which doesn't make sense to me as scum utility. Which leaves town or 3p, neither of which would need resolving TODAY.

[RCEnigma]

I do think it was good that Toog took the initiative and voted to confirm early instead of withholding his vote so we wouldn't spend the bulk of the day speculating on his alignment.

[RCEnigma]

I do think it was good that Toog took the initiative and voted to confirm early instead of withholding his vote so we wouldn't spend the bulk of the day speculating on his alignment.

Why? We have to spend the day speculating on someone else’s. He could have put a rest to the speculation by hammering as opposed to feeling pushed to get himself modkilled.:/

Hammering still doesn't confirm his role, it just means he has fingers. I think he does but won't assume.

[RCEnigma]

My new favorite interaction this game.