Open 738: Purgatory | LA FIN

[Eragon]

im akshully very confident in an Irrel!scum here.

on top of not liking their posts this game, from what i have seen...

they do not have the same form of transparant towni-ness that they were fond of in WW.
Like, did anyone ever even scumread them in WW?
they were extremly obvious through thoughts, reads, wagons, etc... and even from a scum perspective i knew that was always going to be town

this game i have seen almost absolutely none of that, im not sure if its b/c different perspectives or what, but i do not see any similarities, and dislike their posts not-meta based either

[Eragon]

If I put my scum read to a side.

Why aren’t we sending TW to heaven today?

because he needs to be sorted first

[the worst]

I got a little paranoid of Relly in WW but for the most part ye I agree. He kinda has low enough content that sneaking in with a stance like the previous page works from either alignment. :/

[Keyser Söze]

I don’t understand all these town reads on you, but no votes on you.

No ‘TW FOR HEAVEN’ campaign. Plus, if I think as neatral looking in, everyone seems to think I flip scum if you flip town... people don’t see us as town-town.


I would be paranoid personally if I were in your shoes.

[the worst]

I've entertained us as t/t a few times but I feel like every time I let my guard down you re-mount a smear campaign.. :/

[the worst]

but considering most of the game thinks there's a wolf in us and we're devoted to sorting each other TO THE DEATH in hell 2 do you think people should be pushing a "TW for heaven" campaign?

and ye I'm very paranoid about pocketing rn, I just can't think that many layers down right now

[Keyser Söze]

im akshully very confident in an Irrel!scum here.

on top of not liking their posts this game, from what i have seen...

they do not have the same form of transparant towni-ness that they were fond of in WW.
Like, did anyone ever even scumread them in WW?
they were extremly obvious through thoughts, reads, wagons, etc... and even from a scum perspective i knew that was always going to be town

this game i have seen almost absolutely none of that, im not sure if its b/c different perspectives or what, but i do not see any similarities, and dislike their posts not-meta based either

Yes, I’m confident too.

I think his readslist was the nail in the coffin for him.

It’s perhaps worth an additional chapter in my scum case on him.

[Keyser Söze]

but considering most of the game thinks there's a wolf in us and we're devoted to sorting each other TO THE DEATH in hell 2 do you think people should be pushing a "TW for heaven" campaign?

and ye I'm very paranoid about pocketing rn, I just can't think that many layers down right now

I’ll be pushing my strongest scum reads tomorrow.

I don’t want the focus to be mainly me versus you.

Then we’ll see who people vote for.

[ManateeDude]

Did you know?

Wildebeest (or gnu's) have one of the highest reproductive rates in the world

Votecount 2.05

volxen (3) - Irrelephant, Eragon, the worst
Dr Jekyll and Mr Hyde (3) - Keyser Söze, volxen, Ausuka
Keyser (1) - Dr Jekyll and Mr Hyde
Not Voting - LabRat01

Time till end of heaven phase 1: (expired on 2018-11-22 15:30:00)

[Keyser Söze]

My comments are in

town blue

. Actually, in

town green

.

First off, you’re bending the facts to fit your story. (

I'm was trying to show my D1 read trajectory on Creature for your benefit. The events are from my perspective. If you think I'm a liar, you think I'm a liar.

)

You said a few times during the game that you “discarded” your meta read on Creature because of TW’s arguments about his scum meta
and right now we were talking about your read on Creature

at the end of hell 1

. So you talking about something you didn’t believe in anymore, may look good on you, but is worthless imo.
(

I adopted hyberbole for effect: TW called my meta defence a joke, so I 'tore' it up in petulance and voted Creature out of spite. But I knew it was wrong to do so, and the vote didn't feel right. Creature was more likely town. That's actually how I felt. Later on, I was in no position or frame of mind to present a strong and passionate defence on Creature. His vote on me actually pissed me off too, we were brothers. But he was weak. Don't blame him though, this playerlist took his soul.

)

And I find it off how you said you presented arguments for “Creat being townie”, when the point of your meta read on him was:
which kinda felt like you were saying that he’s “unreadable”, rather than “townie”.
tbh if that was a TR, it makes the read feel more TMI, but w/e…
(

I believed the very reasons why Creature was being scum read were the very reasons why he should be town read. I have a soft spot for players like that, as I see myself in them. Yes, I wouldn't be shocked if Creature had flipped scum or town, but in no way was he a null read or unreadable. It is very hard to explain.

)

I did miss a lot of the later posts, though, so sorry for that. They kind of got lost among all of the other, stronger pushes. :/
The way I remembered the game, except for me, no one seriously tried switching wagons from Creat to anyone else. I kind of expected you to be active about protecting someone you think might be town, especially since I didn’t even remember you saying anything about creat being townie after you discarded your meta read on them, but I guess you do have a point here. Sorry for that
(

Again, I don't know why you are hating on me for not defending Creature enough. Believe you me, if my read was strong my actions would have reflected that intensity (like today). I do not understand how you cannot see this. I do not understand your angle about me being his personal bodyguard either. The playerlist is 9 players. He can defend himself. I needed to defend myself too. I have fought a non-stop fight this game.

)

That’s exactly what I thought was very likely to come from scum. I haven’t played with you before, but I have no doubt that you have way enough experience to know how to make pushes on the players you want to lynch.
It’s obvious that no one will follow you if you just say to “lynch someone for PoE” without any additional information. You doing that instead of pushing a real read, commenting on the situation, or w/e else, made me feel like you didn’t actually care whatever if your push got through or not. And the jokes in the next posts only worsened my feelings towards that.
(

That was just me being light hearted with players from Watchers Wanted. There is no scum motivation there. I scum hunted D1, I defended my town reads where I could, I posted some fluff and memes. My ISO was busy with pushing my reads, but I honestly felt something was up with this wagon dynamics. And I was powerless and mute. At least D2, I think I have communicated better. I think you saying I 'don't actually care' about this game/my push/my read is disingenuous. My WIM may have wavered this game, but I have shown commitment and passion.

)

I’m not going to use that as an argument, but actually, the fact that you said “he should be getting TRs from TRing creat” already makes it a valid scum motivation.
But that’s more of a fun fact than anything
(

Thinking further on this today, when I looked at Eragon's D1 ISO - in my opinion, the nature of Eragon's town read of Creature and subsequent actions in D1 demonstrate he was not interested in town cred / winning town points

)

That’s wrong. I did assume your read on creat was rather weak when analyzing the push.
I did think that being passive, when someone you have a TR on is getting lynched, was scummy, but tbf you were the biggest counterwagon , so I didn’t really put it on par with my other arguments.
Trying to save yourself is more of a scum than town action, but tbh town may to do that as well when stressed, so w/e.

Yes, town want to survive just as much as scum. Different win-con but the words mean the same. I get very defensive and survivalistic.

What I SR the most was the lack of effort and the passive attitude towards the push while trying to CFD 1-2 hour before EoD. It felt weird to me that you’d bother trying to change the lynch when you didn’t bother to defend creat against his attackers or explain why is your push a better lynch.
If you didn’t have strong enough reads to either defend creature or push your wagon and there were a lot other players who had much better reads than you, trying to change the wagon, was sth that felt so incredibly detrimental and REALLY unlikely for a townie to do.

Did you notice I'd fucked off by then? I had no power, no voice, I was the rival wagon... my motivation and self-will was at an all-time low. D1 was either me or Creature: I had no strong scum reads to push. I bet you one thing: If I'd magically appeared right near the end to hard town defend Creature, the Keyser-Creature scum team theories would have only got worse So I left D1 with an AtE reaction test. "incredibly detrimental and REALLY unlikely for a townie to do." - at worst you can call me anti-town, and I'll accept that opinion - but you pushing it as scum alignment indicative is very reachy/suspicious.

[Keyser Söze]

Can. You. Comment. On. The. Stuff. I. Wrote. About. Keyser. A. Few. Posts. Ago?
I don't see how he can flip town here, if you think my read on him is wrong, talk to me about it please.

I've dismantled every reason you're holding to scum read me.

Are there any other reasons why you think I am scum?

[Keyser Söze]

A lot of keyser’s next posts feel like he’s honestly trying to change the townies’ opinions on him, so that he doesn’t get lynched in the next hell phase.

[volxen]

@mod I will be V/LA until 11/20/18 (tomorrow)

[Keyser Söze]

You tell Dr J why Eragon is scum, and i’ll tell Dr J why I think Eragon is town.

Deal?

We have 3 days.


Eragon can even chip in too.

Love triangle.

you go first, i literally have nowhere near enough energy to case Era rn

(We have around 3 days left (?)... if you’re not talking about Dr J/Volxen...)

Have you started this scum case on Eragon yet?

I would prefer to know if one of my town reads has evil intent or not.

Irrelphant limped into the thread and attempted a case on Eragon but I was simply not convinced.

Your turn x

[Ausuka]

hi, sorry for disappearing for a bit. i've not really been feeling that well.

VOTE: Jekyll

i thought volxen's posts recently were towny and i don't scumread him anymore but he doesn't want heaven and neither does keyser so...

keyser, are you totally sure about this? i don't see anything exactly wrong with following that scumteam for now since the players you scumread are pretty likely to be scum but it's very difficult to nail the exact scumteam right now and I think you should be somewhat open to the possibility that you've gone wrong somewhere in the future; it might not be a good idea to base your decisions on your current theory throughout this entire game.

elaborate on your reads please, why do you think the team is me/irre/TW?

there, necessarily, has to be 3 scum in {eragon, jekyll, volxen, labrat, worst, keyser, irre}
i've always felt that jekyll and keyser are town; both feel genuine to me. i don't see keyser really behaving like this as scum and again he feels genuine in his convictions. i don't really see korina writing 300k words as scum either; even if the whole thing was mostly quotes i feel like it shows that they were going back and reading through the game in a very detailed way that probably doesn't come from scum.
volxen was less so but I kind of like the insistence that he shouldn't go to heaven despite lots of people thinking that he should and 1432 is towny also.
that leaves {worst, lab, irre, era} as the main pool i'm looking at and honestly that's enough for me to support a scumteam of 3 of them. irre feels shallower than i'd expect from him normally, worst has done some suspect stuff like saying he'd never begin a honest sentence with honestly and later doing that + the volxen thing may have been TMI, and labrat's push on keyser doesn't really feel genuine, like they're trying to throw as many things out there as possible just so the theory is really hard to totally disprove.

[Irrelephant11]

And in Newbie 1894, Irrelephant was skeptical of my slot all the way until lylo, when my lack of quickhammering proved that I was town. And I don't think I am more super obvious town in this game compared to either of those other games, so something doesn't add up here because the town!TW and town!Irrelephant that I know don't give out such strong townreads so easily and so early on in the game.

1) I get why you'd think I was unsure about you in the newbie, because I kept some of my reads close to my chest (so scum would have a harder time sheeping me/would have to come to an original read on you), but there was actually only ever about 2% doubt about your towniness in that game fmpov. Sorry if this is insulting, but I find your scum/town games to be day and night, especially now that I've played with both. I have the exact same feeling about you as I did that game, and everyone is throwing shade my way about it while simultaneously agreeing you're town?? Feels more like scum see you as both unlynchable and malleable than anything else
2) Town!Irrelephant 100% gives out strong townreads early, that's like all I'm good at D1

ew keyser what
what is the AtE on this and last page
do you *want* to get lynched
honestly right now the case labrat is making on keyser is all basically true about eragon except eragon has basically none of the towny moments keyser has, and I think there are worlds here where keyser is town
feels like eragon is only itt when asked, and hoping to just gather little enough attention to survive the day phase.
idk keyser is not my strongest scumread and if lab+creature are the wagon I think I'll probably pass for now
creature has done next to nothing all day, still fine with his lynch

DrJ where's your head at
Ausuka you should place a vote

Eww
IF you think my case on keyser makes sense, then why not answer it instead of placing it on another player? Why not talk about keyser with me? I mean, you did say that my read does make sense, but for another player, right?
C’mon, you’re not the type to avoid conversation like this.
I really doubt that I’m wrong about keyser rn, but unless I am, I’d like you to get lynched next.

And nice shade there You weren’t even SRing me, so how is me being on the wagon influencing your choice of not wanting to vote keyser?
Do you disagree with my read on keyser?
No?
if so, then wtf was that about

Don’t say that creature being on the wagon JUST TO SAVE HIS OWN ASS AND BECAUSE I ASKED HIM TO DO IT, influenced your read on keyser in any way
Do you think he wouldn’t bus there?
Why?
Like, c’mon, I remembered you as more thoughtful than that. That argument makes no sense and rn it kind of feels like you just wanted to have as many arguments as possible NOT to lynch your scummate. Like, c'mon it's just bad

I would have been fine with a Keyser lynch tbh, I just thought eragon was scummier and tried to see if I could get momentum there instead. My lynch preference order D1 was eragon -> creature -> keyser and I have to believe that I was right about one of them, at least
I was not shading you, I had no read on you (I've found you very hard to read all game, especially with the paranoia that you can take advantage of knowing my playstyle without me being able to compare you to anything) + it seemed like Creature was obv!scum based on how my townreads read him (and based on the difference between his play here and my last t/t game with him, Epic Duel)

I don’t think I should be the D1 lynch guys.

But if I’m your strongest scum read, then ok then. My playstyle doesn’t work on this site anymore.


Bye guys been fun last few games. See you in couple years

Let’s counter

VOTE: Dr J

I’m really, really tempted to read this as a town-spew.

A lot of keyser’s next posts feel like he’s honestly trying to change the townies’ opinions on him, so that he doesn’t get lynched in the next hell phase.
There’s no way scum!Keyser would pick his teammate as the heaven push in a situation like that imo.
If keyser is scum (I'm really confident he is), DrJ should be town

Yeah I think scum is trying to take towncred for sending DrJ to Heaven more than anything. Trying to imagine a world where DrJ is scum, and it's hard to make sense of the universal townreads (including my own). Honestly I think scum might just be trying to get to judgment day ASAP, and send their favorite townie to Heaven, since I think volxen & DrJ are both probably town

No please vote Dr. J, I want to stay to endgame.

No please vote Dr. J, I want to stay to endgame.

No please vote Dr. J, I want to stay to endgame.

No please vote Dr. J, I want to stay to endgame.

No please vote Dr. J, I want to stay to endgame.

VOTE: volxen

VOTE: volxen
Sick as a dog now, I'll be aroundish but kind of feverish and trying to sleep.

VOTE: volx

voting DrJ would be a total waste of reads imo. I really do like volx's latest content and there's no reason to get rid of lock-townies (DrJ) during the first heaven phase imo.
Satisfied with this lynch for today, prob not gonna switch unless someone manages to make me seriously paranoid that volx is scum

lol what is this crap. Literally the post numbers show that volxen hadn't posted that yet??? Can we just have another hell phase now for keyser please

No please vote Dr. J, I want to stay to endgame.

No please vote Dr. J, I want to stay to endgame.

No please vote Dr. J, I want to stay to endgame.

No please vote Dr. J, I want to stay to endgame.

No please vote Dr. J, I want to stay to endgame.

VOTE: volxen

VOTE: volxen
Sick as a dog now, I'll be aroundish but kind of feverish and trying to sleep.

VOTE: volx

voting DrJ would be a total waste of reads imo. I really do like volx's latest content and there's no reason to get rid of lock-townies (DrJ) during the first heaven phase imo.
Satisfied with this lynch for today, prob not gonna switch unless someone manages to make me seriously paranoid that volx is scum

this is just pure shade
I was the only one who voted after Volx said he doesn’t want to go to heaven and even if I didn’t, you’re strongly TRing Volx, so how does that even matter?

yes, thank you
the way keyser and others (ausuka?) are like "it's terrible and scummy that you three would try to put a townie in Heaven!!! It can only ever be this other townie!! and also you three are therefore the team" is actually a joke.

Meaning I don't think Irrelephant is the sole scum on his wagon.

I'm not ruling out the possibility of scum!Irrelephant, but if he is scum then there were most likely multiple scum on Creature's wagon.

Can you elaborate on your read on irre?

do you not think irrel is scum?

I asked the question, because I don’t understand the point he was trying to make

And yeah, I do have a SR on him rn. Not anything amazing, but there’ll still be time to polish that imo

wtf
I was literally v/la Friday-Sunday, I come back, and everyone, townreads and scumreads alike, think I'm scum.
If anyone would like to present a case that's more in-depth than
1) Irrelephant townreads volxen (who I agree is town)
2) Irrelephant isn't posting much (and I'll just ignore the v/la banner next to his name)

I would love to hear it. Till then everyone scumreading me? You're wrong
and also making me actually angry

Me and Eragon aren’t going to hell.

I agree that the mechanics don't allow me to send you both to hell this phase or next. But we've got time.

okay actually a few thoughts before I go because the game isn't playable without all slots talking:

I still think tw is probably town, I just didn't feel good post-creature flip about his strong push there. But otoh the intensity of his push rang towny (not sure tw gets that intense against a friend just for a d1 mislynch), and imo creature was playing scummy anyway. Eh I still have bad feelings here, but the game makes more sense to me if he's town
Ausuka made some good points about volxen's play that, especially depending on who volxen is scum with, bring volxen back toward possible-scum, even though I still lean town for him too. Ausuka is also very bold if scum, challenging commonly held ideas.
Keyser/eragon always has a scum, possibly two. Keyser seems overeager to throw shade, eragon seem undereager to solve, both have strong scumgames and I wouldn't put it past them to manage to both be offwagon
I have literally no clue what to do with labrat because I've seen p much nothing from the slot d2 and only remember the keyser push from d1

Hot take: DrJ is the townie with the worst reads so far, which is why he is easy to wagon this game phase. Paranoid about the very popular push to Heaven them, but maybe scum are just looking to lynch townies in every phase idk.

Something like:
{me}
{the worst}
{volxen, ausuka, DrJ}
{labrat} - null
{keyser, eragon}

ausuka should maybe be a scumread, I haven't had time to analyze trajectory, just getting town from the bold play
I'm mentally on page 51, so do with this what you will

“Eragon seems under-eager to solve”

Let’s see.. shall we?

Who is the only person(other than maybe keyser?) That correctly read creature

Who actually MADE A CASE on volxen being town that’s not “Oh ThEiR fIrSt FiVe PoStS mAkE tHeM oBv ToWn On MeTa”

Who has been reconsidering reads
Who has 40 more posts than you and joined at the end of D1
Who has acually been in thread for the majority of time active?

So stop this bullshiting of yours


You call Ausuka either town or very bold scum for going against the trend?
WHAT ABOUT ME TOWNREADING CREATURE?
Do you have like, selective amnesia or some shit?

“Doc J is town with terrible reads”

Great doubtcastig you have there
Before you do crap like this actually make detailed reads of your own, or, you know, like actually make reads that aren’t sheeping TW and that you can explain yourself?

I think the only slot really not talking is you?

Lab has been very active
I’m here
Keyser is here
Ausuka is intermittent
Doc J is here
TW has presence
volxen has picked up a lot in d2

Yeah, I'm the only one not present??? "Definitely scum!" great reads, there, eragon. I'm impressed. You caught me: I sent out a storm warning on Thursday evening to the entire Western NY area so I could actively avoid going to work where I play Mafia on Friday, and months ago I began a long pattern of being v/la Saturday/Sunday so that you wouldn't catch me out this game.
This is level one surface level crap. You don't scumread me. You find me an easy and defenseless target (won't last long, sorry to say)

Also ahhhh there's the "give me towncred for townreading Creature!!" I've been waiting for

im akshully very confident in an Irrel!scum here.

on top of not liking their posts this game, from what i have seen...

they do not have the same form of transparant towni-ness that they were fond of in WW.
Like, did anyone ever even scumread them in WW?
they were extremly obvious through thoughts, reads, wagons, etc... and even from a scum perspective i knew that was always going to be town

this game i have seen almost absolutely none of that, im not sure if its b/c different perspectives or what, but i do not see any similarities, and dislike their posts not-meta based either

I got a little paranoid of Relly in WW but for the most part ye I agree. He kinda has low enough content that sneaking in with a stance like the previous page works from either alignment. :/

1)WW is my best towngame ever, probably. I have a much harder time earning townreads as town most games, especially because for whatever reason scum often find me an easy target (they're wrong, which is why my town win rate remains high).
2) Literally no one was scumreading me until I went v/la anyway

I would like eragon to be the first to scumcase me. Fire away.

[LabRat01]

I don’t have a lot of time, so just a few quick posts

[Irrelephant11]

we should send volxen to heaven, in spite of himself

[LabRat01]

Can we please call bullshit on all these TW top town reads...


Why don't Irrelephant and LabRat want to send TW to heaven today?

I don't believe those reads lists one bit. They're just tactically tiered. All bull shit.


I want both my top 2 town reads in heaven today.
I simply don't buy the sincerity of the read.

You do not vote your nullish/blue read to heaven. We send our fucking town reads.

Why is no one else calling out this bullshit?

This is ridiculous, IF you thought that sending unsure town to heaven is such an obviously scummy, anti-town action, then WHY didn’t you say anything when people were discussing that earlier?

this is what i feel needs to happen for heaven phase

Heaven 1: send the towniest person we can spare(basically mislynch bait)
Hell 1: hopefully scum, but if town its ok
Heaven 2: this is when it gets interesting with this amount of players, ESPECIALLY if we put town into both heaven and hell phase 1.
IF we send another mislynch bait we can spare to heaven, then thats 3 townies down and puts us into judgement day, with the experienced players left and only the inexperienced ones to solve in judgement day, where the thread is closed.
IF we send a super towny experienced player(im not naming any names but Irrelephant for example) they will do better in judgement day, but we will have a mislynch bait player in the thread maybe? but hopefully we feel good enough with it how it is.

IF we lynch town to hell Phase 1, i suggest putting experienced player to heaven
IF we lynch scum to hell Phase 1, i suggest putting towny/spareable player to heaven and continuing from there.

this is what i feel needs to happen for heaven phase

Heaven 1: send the towniest person we can spare(basically mislynch bait)

Kind of agree, but don’t go overboard with it
everyone’s got different reads anyway, so honestly, any kind of townie-looking lynch except the super confident/helpful ones will be plenty good

P.Edit
About the heaven lynch, I think I’d be fine with volx after all
That’s not personally my strong SR, but if he really is scum (I'm kind of tempted to believe in the TRs on him, but meh), that’s a very valuable flip to get (even if it’s a heaven lynch imo)
I really doubt that scum would just remain idle if they got such a wonderful opportunity to get rid of one of them to heaven and only 2 people (as far as I remember) seemed to strongly push them being town

P.Edit
About the heaven lynch, I think I’d be fine with volx after all
That’s not personally my strong TR, but if he really is scum (I'm kind of tempted to believe in the TRs on him, but meh), that’s a very valuable flip to get (even if it’s a heaven lynch imo)
I really doubt that scum would just remain idle if they got such a wonderful opportunity to get rid of one of them to heaven and only 2 people (as far as I remember) seemed to strongly push them being town

1 - this comment about sending volxen to heaven even if scum is pinging me. Do you personally think he'll flip scum? Do you think using heaven lynches to sort is a good strategy in this setup?

No, I don’t think volx is likely to flip scum rn. His later posts were better and he’s strongly TR by my strong TR, which kinda makes me less confident in my previous read. He’s still a person I’m struggling to get a read on, but I feel that I should sort him as soon as possible, because he gives a lot of spicy interactions

Yeah, I do think sending not-obv town to heaven it is a valid strategy. A bit more in a 15p than in a 9p, but still it makes a lot more sense to do that than to simply send the most townie player there
You’d be basically wasting a cop check and a full day of discussion

VOTE: volx

voting DrJ would be a total waste of reads imo. I really do like volx's latest content and there's no reason to get rid of lock-townies (DrJ) during the first heaven phase imo.
Satisfied with this lynch for today, prob not gonna switch unless someone manages to make me seriously paranoid that volx is scum

1 - this comment about sending volxen to heaven even if scum is pinging me. Do you personally think he'll flip scum?

tbh, if Volxen did flip scum in heaven I would look at you (you are a type of scum-player to white-knight his scum teammates to high heaven and not bus) :cool:

You even answered the read and I scum-read you for it later, so don’t tell me you just forgot about that now

Why didn’t you even mention anything about it being scummy back then if you’re so confident in it being “bulshit” rn?
And how is me wanting to lynch for PoE to heaven more scummy than you wanting to PoE a shitter to hell?
Don’t push me for something you didn’t even bother to analyze. You’re treating me as if I were confirmed scum and as if you “don’t even need to think if the stuff doing is scummy” which is just wrong

-----------------------------------

YES, I do think that lynching “uncertain town” to heaven is a good idea
If you just get rid of all of your strongest TRs, you’ll end up being completely screwed and surrounded by nulls late-game. That’s how it works in normal games, but it makes no god damn sense to aim for that in here, that'll just kill the discussion and harm you in the future
If there’s scum in the strong-ish TRs, they will most likely screw up your reads and whatever interaction analysis you want to make during the game
and if they’re town, they’ll just make you paranoid if they’re left alive till late-game
so while it’s risky, it should be often more beneficial than harmful

The whole point of lynching during the heaven phase is to get rid of town in a way that would help you sort people later. Being afraid of sending scum to haven is good, but it will only harm your reads in the long run.
IF you screw up and place scum among your heaven-lynch-TRs, you’ll have to play it safe and lynch solely based on the confident TRs later, but tbh IF you have scum among the super confident reads and the less confident ones at the same time, it would mean that the town is p much screwed anyways, regardless of how you play.

I do want to lynch volxen to heaven now. He’s someone I think is more likely to flip town than scum, but I’m not confident enough in the read to want him the be here in late-game.
Besides, there were a lot of people who TR him and some who TRd him very strongly since day-start, which was honestly kind of weirding me out. With support like that, if he’s scum, it’s really unlikely that he’ll ever get lynched to hell imo, which might heavily screw with the interaction reads, especially of those players who are TRing him so strongly.
And I really doubt that if he’s scum, the only ones who are TRing him so strongly are the mafia

That’s not as perfect as I would like, but it’s still a lot more helpful than just getting rid of someone I’m absolutely confident that will flip town imo.

[Irrelephant11]

VOTE: labrat

[LabRat01]

Please humour me. Why shouldn't we send TW to heaven today?
He's town right? You and Irrelephant should be trying to make us vote for him and not Volxen :?: you don't even trust Volxen in an end game situation. Why would you vote him over your top town reads?

I don’t want TW in heaven. I have a decent individual read on him rn and my biggest SR flipping scum would make him close to confirmed town. Besides that, he was solving d1 and I kind of want him to be there d2. I have my leans, but I don’t feel confident enough in them to perfectly lynch after that.
You didn’t need me to answer that, you could have figured it out on your own IF you thought about it for a second. You’re just pushing me blindly, without even considering whatever if it’s really scummy or not. Just stop

[Irrelephant11]

labrat what's your read on eragon

[Keyser Söze]

we should send volxen to heaven, in spite of himself

I simply do not believe this is rational town!Irrelephant:-

You want us to send Volxen to heaven... who:

1) You think is possible scum via Ausuka's theory:

bring volxen back toward possible-scum

2) Who you're town reading less than the worst

3) a read who is on the same level as ausuka and DrJ


P.EDIT:

VOTE: labrat

And now you want to send LabRat to heaven, who was a null read a few pages ago?


Please share with us why LabRat is town.

[Keyser Söze]

Can we please call bullshit on all these TW top town reads...


Why don't Irrelephant and LabRat want to send TW to heaven today?

I don't believe those reads lists one bit. They're just tactically tiered. All bull shit.


I want both my top 2 town reads in heaven today.
I simply don't buy the sincerity of the read.

You do not vote your nullish/blue read to heaven. We send our fucking town reads.

Why is no one else calling out this bullshit?

This is ridiculous, IF you thought that sending unsure town to heaven is such an obviously scummy, anti-town action, then WHY didn’t you say anything when people were discussing that earlier?

I have been talking about it constantly.


I don't think Volxen is "unsure" town. He is a top tier town read for me.
It is you/Irrellephant/TW's read of Volxen that is

not compatible of how/when/why I would expect a townie to vote someone to heaven

.

If you town read someone highly you present to us why they are town and why they should be sent to heaven.

That is not what I have seen from you/TW/Irrellephant in regard your reads for eachtother and Volxen. Your reads and votes have frankly been very suspect.

Irrelephant's recent vote for you is the icing on the cake.

None of your votes co-relate to your reads.


Mine do.
Eragon's do.
Ausuka's do.
Volxen's do.
Dr J's do.

[LabRat01]

To support what you just said, tw himself said one reason he's voting volxen is because he thinks I'll lynch correctly later over volxen. :Thinking:

I'm more and more inclined to think I'm wrong on tw and labrat. Particularly labrat.

Ugh, elaborate please
If you think I’m gonna flip scum, talk to me about it, so that I can answer your suspicions