Large Normal 217 (Game Over)

[Almost50]

Come on, Gamma.. you know better than to ask about the basic mechanics of common roles!

The answer is OF COURSE the Tracker sees the action, as they are targeting the playing doing the action and not the Commuter/Ascetic themselves. However, a WATCHER targeting the Commuter/Ascetic doesn't see anything because their target is UNTARGETABLE to them.

[Gamma Emerald]

Some mods do it differently

[Almost50]

This is a Normal.

[Gamma Emerald]

Even within normals
Unless they actually standardized it at this point, which I’m not sure

[Almost50]

OK, but the wiki for Ascetic states:

This role modifier is considered Normal on mafiascum.net. An Ascetic role cannot be targeted by anything other than a kill.

A role attempting to target an Ascetic should be seen doing so by Trackers and Motion Detectors

.

This bit is not explicitly mentioned in the wiki for Commuter, although they both sate the role targeting the Ascetic/Commuter is considered "Roleblocked", which goes against the Normal Guidelines for Roleblocker (!!). I'll quote:

Commuter (Normal Guidelines):

Any role that attempts to target a commuting Commuter should be treated as though they are blocked

Ascetic (Top of page):

More precisely, Ascetic reflexively Roleblocks all actions taken against them except kills.

Roleblocker (Normal Version):

When an X-Shot role is blocked, the shot is not refunded; the player still counts as having "paid for" their role use, but the actual role is otherwise considered to not have happened (so, e.g., Trackers and Watchers will not be able to see the blocked role being used).

But if I had to make a judgement I'd take what was explicitly mentioned in the Ascetic wiki page over the interpretation of it being a Roleblock (i.e. Tracker will see the action from the the role targeting the Ascetic).

Perhaps we should contact the mhsmith to make proper amendments to the wiki?

[Persivul]

Persivul youre the only one i trust lemme know what u think

I'm back. You're theory looks good. Gamma calling for massclaim after doing nothing for a long time, and A50 voting for joges after you'd set up the idea of a joges mislynch, are both really scummy. BUT, N_M has been extremely scummy all game as well. I'll be doing some ISOs etc. over the next few days.

[joges]

I think it's this, sue me.

Me, Gamma, Pers = town
Stan = SK/town
A50, N_M = Scum

Stan is either SK or town, either way he can't be lynched today.
Pers is town because fruit and if he managed to be scum and guess right about fruit then he deserves to win.
Gamma is town because she is trying.
N_M is scum because he hasn't done a single thing this entire game.
A50 is scum because there's 2 of them probably.

I've not been right about anything this game, and won't be surprised when I'm completely wrong.

VOTE: N_M

[Persivul]

You think A50 and NM.

Stan thinks A50 and Gamma. BTW, seems like too few kills for a SK.

I think A50 and one of NM/Gamma.

Common factor is A50. Currently I'm favoring his lynch.

@Gamma:

what are your reads?

[Gamma Emerald]

OK, but the wiki for Ascetic states:

This role modifier is considered Normal on mafiascum.net. An Ascetic role cannot be targeted by anything other than a kill.

A role attempting to target an Ascetic should be seen doing so by Trackers and Motion Detectors

.

This bit is not explicitly mentioned in the wiki for Commuter, although they both sate the role targeting the Ascetic/Commuter is considered "Roleblocked", which goes against the Normal Guidelines for Roleblocker (!!). I'll quote:

Commuter (Normal Guidelines):

Any role that attempts to target a commuting Commuter should be treated as though they are blocked

Ascetic (Top of page):

More precisely, Ascetic reflexively Roleblocks all actions taken against them except kills.

Roleblocker (Normal Version):

When an X-Shot role is blocked, the shot is not refunded; the player still counts as having "paid for" their role use, but the actual role is otherwise considered to not have happened (so, e.g., Trackers and Watchers will not be able to see the blocked role being used).

But if I had to make a judgement I'd take what was explicitly mentioned in the Ascetic wiki page over the interpretation of it being a Roleblock (i.e. Tracker will see the action from the the role targeting the Ascetic).

Perhaps we should contact the mhsmith to make proper amendments to the wiki?

I can take this explanation
@Persivul I think it’s probably not joges is pretty much all I’m sure of
I was thinking about it and honestly I feel like there’s a fair amount of town investigative power with joges being town, it’s not overpowered like I was feeling earlier

[Not_Mafia]

Told you guys to lynch Persivul

[stan1ey]

both NM and A50 tried to lynch outside of the 1v1 yesterday, i think we should lynch gamma

[Persivul]

Told you guys to lynch Persivul

Who else is scum?

[Persivul]

both NM and A50 tried to lynch outside of the 1v1 yesterday, i think we should lynch gamma

A50 was taking potshots anywhere. He wasn't "trying to lynch" anyone in particular.

[Not_Mafia]

Told you guys to lynch Persivul

Who else is scum?

I never said you were scum

[Almost50]

Told you guys to lynch Persivul

Who else is scum?

I never said you were scum

Did he say "W@60n0m1x"? If he did I'll vote him on principle.

[Persivul]

Told you guys to lynch Persivul

Who else is scum?

I never said you were scum

Er, OK, then...who do you think the scum are?

[joges]

You think A50 and NM.

Stan thinks A50 and Gamma. BTW, seems like too few kills for a SK.

I think A50 and one of NM/Gamma.

Common factor is A50. Currently I'm favoring his lynch.

@Gamma:

what are your reads?

My theory is:

N1: Stan kills A50, but A50 is protected by Clem. Stan is killed by mafia but is BP.
N2: Both mafia and SK went for fruit vendor.
D3: A50 mentions a vig
N3: Two kills.
D4: I bring up SK
N4: One kill

If someone wants to claim Vig then I will change my mind. Either way Stan is confirmed third party or town.

[stan1ey]

How?? apart from me not dying which if you think hard enough about you'll understand that logic can be applied to any other player?

[stan1ey]

I mean i didnt wanna say how many shots i used but i guess it's pretty obvious i usrd one night 1

[Persivul]

Vote Count #2.2 (FINAL):

0verki11: Not_Mafia, joges, Almost50, Clemency, Springtrap, UnaBombaH, Xtoxm (7)

Xtoxm:

Gamma Emerald, Persivul, Chateau Lobby, stan1ey, GuyInFreezer (5)

Not Voting:

0verki11

With 13 players alive, it takes 7 to lynch.

V/LA:

None.

Deadline:

(expired on 2018-12-25 21:35:00)

Gamma was on xtoxm here when most people wanted overkill.

So, can we lynch either A50 or NM today?

[Rob14]

@Rob14: If an action targeted a Commuter/Ascetic, would a tracker see it?

If a Tracker targeted an Ascetic or Commuter, they would receive a result of "No result". If a Tracker targeted someone who targeted an Ascetic, they would receive a typical result, due to the explicit note regarding Normal guidelines on the MafiaWiki page for Ascetic. If a Tracker targeted someone who targeted a Commuter, they would receive a result of

"No result"

"Playername did not visit", due to the note regarding Normal guidelines on the MafiaWiki page for Commuter stating to treat those who target a Commuter as if they have been roleblocked.

I agree there is an apparent contradiction in the current Normal guidelines for Ascetic and will be referring that to the List Mod, but the above is how I have/will process these roles in this game.

[Rob14]

Vote Count #5.2:

joges:

Almost50 (1)

Gamma Emerald:

stan1ey (1)

Not_Mafia:

joges (1)

Not Voting:

Not_Mafia, Persivul, Gamma Emerald

With 6 players alive, it takes 4 to lynch.

V/LA:

None.

Deadline:

(expired on 2019-01-10 00:15:00)

[Rob14]

Because the inactivity in this game over the past two days may have been a result of waiting for my ruling on that, I'm issuing an "informal" prod to everyone. Apologies I was gone for the New Year; I didn't expect to be quite as unavailable as I was until it was too late to arrange for a backup.

If anyone still hasn't posted in 24 hours after the "informal" prod, I'll send out a real prod.

[Almost50]

SORRY! I didn't realize it's been that long since I last posted.

[Gamma Emerald]

Wait what
I asked a question, got an answer but answer raised an even bigger question
How the fuck does that chain-roleblock the tracker
In any case that indicates Stanley did not commute I think
VOTE: Stanley