BooneyToonz Extravaganza: LAST NIGHT TOMORROW


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Post Post #3400 (ISO) » Thu Jan 03, 2019 4:02 am

Post by Ramcius »

In post 3394, DrewVa wrote:
In post 3378, Ramcius wrote:
In post 3375, DrewVa wrote:
In post 3365, Karmeleon wrote:DrewVA, if you had to end the day this instant, who would you lynch?
I don’t want to end the day yet. I haven’t even got a chance to consult with DVa. Why the rush? I guess SS in pinging me, with the calling of outing of power roles but there are other slots acting kind of scummy as well, so I need some more time. It worked out well for us on D1. What ain’t broke . . . :lol:

Who would you lynch rn?
What do you think about Cheeky's quoted Mcueen messages from D1, where he tried fight EFN wagon?
He seemed to be basing it on EFN lurking as town. I dunno, I thought he was pretty towny D1, aside from that.
But you agreed with Alonzo's "EFN lurks as scum" meta and ignored Mcqueen's "EFN lurks as town too" meta?
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Post Post #3401 (ISO) » Thu Jan 03, 2019 4:04 am

Post by Alonzo »

  • Davesaz
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    Karmeleon

    If there is a bullet point,
    that means they have voted
    to end day.
In post 3398, Alonzo wrote:
In post 3393, Xtoxm wrote:lets not kid ourselves the case was flimsy and the lynch was an incompetent last minute scramble
Proof?
Didn't I beg you all fucking day to avoid that situation?
Last edited by Boonskiies on Sun Jan 06, 2019 9:11 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Post Post #3402 (ISO) » Thu Jan 03, 2019 4:08 am

Post by Xtoxm »

In post 3401, Alonzo wrote:
In post 3398, Alonzo wrote:
In post 3393, Xtoxm wrote:lets not kid ourselves the case was flimsy and the lynch was an incompetent last minute scramble
Proof?
Didn't I beg you all fucking day to avoid that situation?
well in other games people have turned up at deadline to make sure a wagon gets organised. it didn't happen here. not many anyway. disappointing lack of effort from some.
but, scum did end up lynched because of it.
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Post Post #3403 (ISO) » Thu Jan 03, 2019 4:09 am

Post by DrewVa »

In post 3377, Xtoxm wrote:NM, what do you think about the idea that scum can pick anyone in the game with that power?
if at some point in the game Ram flips and is town would you agree thats the case?
i just dont see from a mod design perspective why you set up a situation like this for someone to be confscummed on d2
this of course with the caveat that the pattern holds when our sample size increases from 1
are you pushing for ram to be lynched today? or do you want to see another round, i dont think ive seen you say
Yeah, it would seem kind of nuts, from a scum perspective to do that. All Boon actually told us. is scum has the ability to do this, if they choose and scum having a non-BOONus winner rep, just seems on D2, to not really make a whole lot of sense.

@Boon, can scum select only of their own, or anyone of their choosing for Dayrep?
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Post Post #3404 (ISO) » Thu Jan 03, 2019 4:10 am

Post by Xtoxm »

on the plus side i think we got a lot of telling interactions that we wouldnt have got if the day had suddenly ended 24h earlier
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Post Post #3405 (ISO) » Thu Jan 03, 2019 4:13 am

Post by DrewVa »

In post 3400, Ramcius wrote:
In post 3394, DrewVa wrote:
In post 3378, Ramcius wrote:
In post 3375, DrewVa wrote:
In post 3365, Karmeleon wrote:DrewVA, if you had to end the day this instant, who would you lynch?
I don’t want to end the day yet. I haven’t even got a chance to consult with DVa. Why the rush? I guess SS in pinging me, with the calling of outing of power roles but there are other slots acting kind of scummy as well, so I need some more time. It worked out well for us on D1. What ain’t broke . . . :lol:

Who would you lynch rn?
What do you think about Cheeky's quoted Mcueen messages from D1, where he tried fight EFN wagon?
He seemed to be basing it on EFN lurking as town. I dunno, I thought he was pretty towny D1, aside from that.
But you agreed with Alonzo's "EFN lurks as scum" meta and ignored Mcqueen's "EFN lurks as town too" meta?
I disagreed with McQueen, that doesn’t mean I found his counter argument scummy. Once again. EFN’s posting style was completely different as town and scum - not even a single read and those two games were concurrent, so a pretty decent metacase, IMO.
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Post Post #3406 (ISO) » Thu Jan 03, 2019 4:15 am

Post by DrewVa »

In post 3404, Xtoxm wrote:on the plus side i think we got a lot of telling interactions that we wouldnt have got if the day had suddenly ended 24h earlier
Yeah and I don’t understand why the hurry to end the day. I know I am nowhere near ready or solidified on my vote. I don’t understand why votes are being rushed in this setup, when they usually aren’t in other ones?
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Post Post #3407 (ISO) » Thu Jan 03, 2019 4:16 am

Post by Something_Smart »

In post 3397, DrewVa wrote:
In post 3395, Something_Smart wrote:Question. Which head of DrewVa was the one bashing me for outing minor investigatives?
Why don’t you explain how it doesn’t help scum find targets? Especially, once they’ve gotten the loyal modifiers added to them?
It does create a target for scum, but that's a target that wouldn't have been a target before because scum would have no reason to kill that person. But even if they do get killed (unlikely because I'm sure we have protectives), town isn't worse off than they'd have been if the loyal never went to a good target.
It's always the same. When you fire that first shot, no matter how right you feel, you have no idea who's going to die. You don't know whose children are going to scream and burn. How many hearts will be broken. How many lives shattered. How much blood will spill, until everybody does what they're always going to have to do from the very beginning... SIT DOWN AND TALK!
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Post Post #3408 (ISO) » Thu Jan 03, 2019 4:17 am

Post by Ramcius »

In post 3405, DrewVa wrote:I disagreed with McQueen, that doesn’t mean I found his counter argument scummy. Once again. EFN’s posting style was completely different as town and scum - not even a single read and those two games were concurrent, so a pretty decent metacase, IMO.
So bad meta case at end of day in attempt to save lynched scum isn't enough reason to scumread someone?
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Post Post #3409 (ISO) » Thu Jan 03, 2019 4:18 am

Post by DrewVa »

In post 3402, Xtoxm wrote:
In post 3401, Alonzo wrote:
In post 3398, Alonzo wrote:
In post 3393, Xtoxm wrote:lets not kid ourselves the case was flimsy and the lynch was an incompetent last minute scramble
Proof?
Didn't I beg you all fucking day to avoid that situation?
well in other games people have turned up at deadline to make sure a wagon gets organised. it didn't happen here. not many anyway. disappointing lack of effort from some.
but, scum did end up lynched because of it.
Tbf, without some clear method of categorizing and organizing it, how can you even tell how anyone is really voting? Why is TLK no longer doing VCs?
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Post Post #3410 (ISO) » Thu Jan 03, 2019 4:26 am

Post by Xtoxm »

"oh shit i like profiis claim, im gonna vote EFN now"
"yeah i can go with EFN"
"alright yeah lets do EFN, 2 hours left"

and then you have a wagon
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Post Post #3411 (ISO) » Thu Jan 03, 2019 4:26 am

Post by DrewVa »

In post 3408, Ramcius wrote:
In post 3405, DrewVa wrote:I disagreed with McQueen, that doesn’t mean I found his counter argument scummy. Once again. EFN’s posting style was completely different as town and scum - not even a single read and those two games were concurrent, so a pretty decent metacase, IMO.
So bad meta case at end of day in attempt to save lynched scum isn't enough reason to scumread someone?
You’re assuming he thought they were flipping scum? I’m not convinced of that. In Forgotten Hourglass, I was sure we were mislynching lhf lurker and I was wrong. I defended them, mistakenly believing they’d flip town. Is being wrong necessarily scummy?
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Post Post #3412 (ISO) » Thu Jan 03, 2019 4:29 am

Post by Xtoxm »

ya know what
if we're getting someone to do them ourselves anyway

@Boon, would you be able to host fake VCs for us in thread?
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Post Post #3413 (ISO) » Thu Jan 03, 2019 4:29 am

Post by DrewVa »

In post 3410, Xtoxm wrote:"oh shit i like profiis claim, im gonna vote EFN now"
"yeah i can go with EFN"
"alright yeah lets do EFN, 2 hours left"

and then you have a wagon
My vote was solely based on Alonzo’s metacase, so I can’t speak for anyone’s vote other than ours. At any rate, they flipped scum, so I don’t understand why you’re even making such an issue of this? If it had resulted in a mislynch, it’d be very different.
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Post Post #3414 (ISO) » Thu Jan 03, 2019 4:30 am

Post by DrewVa »

In post 3412, Xtoxm wrote:ya know what
if we're getting someone to do them ourselves anyway

@Boon, would you be able to host fake VCs for us in thread?
:lol:
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Post Post #3415 (ISO) » Thu Jan 03, 2019 4:31 am

Post by Xtoxm »

im not making an issue of anything, im responding to questions asked directly to me
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Post Post #3416 (ISO) » Thu Jan 03, 2019 4:31 am

Post by Ramcius »

In post 3411, DrewVa wrote:
In post 3408, Ramcius wrote:
In post 3405, DrewVa wrote:I disagreed with McQueen, that doesn’t mean I found his counter argument scummy. Once again. EFN’s posting style was completely different as town and scum - not even a single read and those two games were concurrent, so a pretty decent metacase, IMO.
So bad meta case at end of day in attempt to save lynched scum isn't enough reason to scumread someone?
You’re assuming he thought they were flipping scum?
I’m not convinced of that. In Forgotten Hourglass, I was sure we were mislynching lhf lurker and I was wrong. I defended them, mistakenly believing they’d flip town. Is being wrong necessarily scummy?
What? I'm assuming they both scum, so ofc Mc knew EFN was scum...
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Post Post #3417 (ISO) » Thu Jan 03, 2019 4:33 am

Post by DrewVa »

In post 3407, Something_Smart wrote:
In post 3397, DrewVa wrote:
In post 3395, Something_Smart wrote:Question. Which head of DrewVa was the one bashing me for outing minor investigatives?
Why don’t you explain how it doesn’t help scum find targets? Especially, once they’ve gotten the loyal modifiers added to them?
It does create a target for scum, but that's a target that wouldn't have been a target before because scum would have no reason to kill that person. But even if they do get killed (unlikely because I'm sure we have protectives), town isn't worse off than they'd have been if the loyal never went to a good target.
I’m not opposed to anyone outting themselves but it should be their decision. Like if I was some weak investigative with a result I’d out, otherwise, I’d probably keep my mouth shut.
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Post Post #3418 (ISO) » Thu Jan 03, 2019 4:34 am

Post by DrewVa »

In post 3415, Xtoxm wrote:im not making an issue of anything, im responding to questions asked directly to me
Alright but some seem to be, which is odd, since we got a scumlynch.
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Post Post #3419 (ISO) » Thu Jan 03, 2019 4:35 am

Post by Alonzo »

[tweet]Vote: Theta[/tweet]
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Post Post #3420 (ISO) » Thu Jan 03, 2019 4:42 am

Post by Xtoxm »

more info in the open is always a benefit to scum and town should only come forward if they have info with immediate value, not to try to coordinate future night actions openly in the presence of scum. setups are designed specifically to make this a poor strategy for town.
SS plan is anti town. he could be pushing this because he really believes it or it could be a scum agenda to expose town roles.
but anti town behaviour is always to more likely come from scum
dismissing anti town behaviour bc "they might be town" creates space for scum to get away with being scummy
i avoid doing it if possible
he is literally rolefishing and needs to stop, and deserves scrutiny for doing it
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Post Post #3421 (ISO) » Thu Jan 03, 2019 4:50 am

Post by DrewVa »

In post 3416, Ramcius wrote:
In post 3411, DrewVa wrote:
In post 3408, Ramcius wrote:
In post 3405, DrewVa wrote:I disagreed with McQueen, that doesn’t mean I found his counter argument scummy. Once again. EFN’s posting style was completely different as town and scum - not even a single read and those two games were concurrent, so a pretty decent metacase, IMO.
So bad meta case at end of day in attempt to save lynched scum isn't enough reason to scumread someone?
You’re assuming he thought they were flipping scum?
I’m not convinced of that. In Forgotten Hourglass, I was sure we were mislynching lhf lurker and I was wrong. I defended them, mistakenly believing they’d flip town. Is being wrong necessarily scummy?
What? I'm assuming they both scum, so ofc Mc knew EFN was scum...
Your missing my point. I’m not necessarily convinced of that as opposed to him just being wrong about it. The example I gave was in wrongly opposing a lynch because I mistakenly thought it would flip town. I’m just asking how you are so sure, he wasn’t doing this? Why the only explanation has to be that he was knowingly defending his buddy? Maybe that is in fact the case and maybe it isn’t. I’m just not beyond convinced it is. He sounded sincere to me. I also take tone into account in making reads and he doesn’t sound tonally off to me.

I voted EFN because Alonzo’s type of metacase yeids better than average accuracy, from my experience but not everyone understands why his case was was compelling. I’ve conversely witnessed thoroughly shitty metacases that sounded totally convoluted.

A really good example of a shitty metacase, would be scum!Thor’s case on town!Gamma in YGM.
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Post Post #3422 (ISO) » Thu Jan 03, 2019 4:54 am

Post by DrewVa »

In post 3420, Xtoxm wrote:more info in the open is always a benefit to scum and town should only come forward if they have info with immediate value, not to try to coordinate future night actions openly in the presence of scum. setups are designed specifically to make this a poor strategy for town.
SS plan is anti town. he could be pushing this because he really believes it or it could be a scum agenda to expose town roles.
but anti town behaviour is always to more likely come from scum
dismissing anti town behaviour bc "they might be town" creates space for scum to get away with being scummy
i avoid doing it if possible
he is literally rolefishing and needs to stop, and deserves scrutiny for doing it
Yes I agree. I also wonder why he thought it at all relevant which of our heads was making that case. The argument is either valid or it’s not and I wasn’t “bashing” him, I was just agreeing with you that I didn’t view it as pro-town.
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Post Post #3423 (ISO) » Thu Jan 03, 2019 5:01 am

Post by profii »

@ Cheeky D

I just looked at your points on McQueen - I can see what you are saying, I have caught scum in exactly the same way - just catching that blatant defence, but I have also ML'd town for doing the exact same thing so IDK. What I don't like is where you ask me did I slip - I assume this is a joke regarding [redacted] and McQueen goes straight in with the vote on me.

So yeah, I think it's a decent vote. I still think S_S is too but I'll go with whatever people wanna do by close of play assuming nothing exciting happens between now and then
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Post Post #3424 (ISO) » Thu Jan 03, 2019 5:06 am

Post by Elsa Jay »

In post 3333, Gamma Emerald wrote:
In post 3274, Cheeky Dancer wrote:Traitor and Miller aren't the same thing. Optimal play for a miller is to claim in your first post...at least before the first night phase...seriously wtf?

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