Booneytoonz IX - Under The Sea -- Game Over!

[Clemency]

i'm fully aware of that fact
i become pretty useful once i have an actual argument to latch on to

[Alchemist21]

I see. And can you explain your Maki vote more? Was it purely for an informational lynch or did you have reasons to scumread Maki? I don't really see your reason for the vote beyond this quote:

Here's where I am at now...

1. Wisdom appears to just be this way, and focusing on players who always act suspicious is bad town play
2. IF Maki flips town there is a decent reason to circle back to Wisdom and perhaps even Chara at that time.
3. IF Maki flips scum Elsa Jay is a decent next run.

I don't see us learning as much from flipping Wisdom. It just seems more flimsy then what we learn from a Maki push.

VOTE: Maki

[Clemency]

and besides, i like people thinking i'm weak
makes the opposite alignment underestimate me

[Nikk]

i'm fully aware of that fact
i become pretty useful once i have an actual argument to latch on to

Ah, cool. Thanks for answering my question here.

[davesaz]

If Clemency and Elsa Jay were both scum, would they be confident enough to try to milk the mutual pocketing gag to explain whey they're together?

[Clemency]

i'm fully aware of that fact
i become pretty useful once i have an actual argument to latch on to

Ah, cool. Thanks for answering my question here.

^reason i'm voting this person

[Clemency]

If Clemency and Elsa Jay were both scum, would they be confident enough to try to milk the mutual pocketing gag to explain whey they're together?

absolutely

[Elsa Jay]

If we wanted a garuntee of the same alignment we'd have been a hydra. This is WAY more fun.

[Nikk]

I see. And can you explain your Maki vote more? Was it purely for an informational lynch or did you have reasons to scumread Maki? I don't really see your reason for the vote beyond this quote:

Here's where I am at now...

1. Wisdom appears to just be this way, and focusing on players who always act suspicious is bad town play
2. IF Maki flips town there is a decent reason to circle back to Wisdom and perhaps even Chara at that time.
3. IF Maki flips scum Elsa Jay is a decent next run.

I don't see us learning as much from flipping Wisdom. It just seems more flimsy then what we learn from a Maki push.

VOTE: Maki

Yes, informational. I was null on Maki at that point after the first push. Im still only slightly scumlean and honestly there likely is some bias due to the revenge vote being on me. So lets call it a gentlemens null.

But...the information gained is more there, and the chance of flipping scum is as good as any other (no ones given me a clear scumread as of yet that makes me go THATS OUR SCUM).

[davesaz]

More than what alternative?

[Pink Ball]

@Alch: the difference between posting or not posting the posibility of the mafia knowing about the millers beforehand is that you are throwing WIFOM in the thread for town who could haven't thought about that posibility, and mess up legitimate reads because of that. It's like saying "you're townreading this slot for the wrong reason because you're not considering this", and I think that's more scum motivated than town motivated.

[Nikk]

More than what alternative?

If this is directed at me Wisdom was who my vote was on at the time. You can also toss any of the low volume posters in there as well.

[davesaz]

@Alch: the difference between posting or not posting the posibility of the mafia knowing about the millers beforehand is that you are throwing WIFOM in the thread for town who could haven't thought about that posibility, and mess up legitimate reads because of that. It's like saying "you're townreading this slot for the wrong reason because you're not considering this", and I think that's more scum motivated than town motivated.

It is far more dangerous for town to conftown someone who doesn't deserve it, than it is to mislynch one person over another due to WIFOM.
It is always better for town to consider possibilities and rule them out via explicitly reading people than it is to make assumptions and ignore slots.

[Pink Ball]

@Alch: the difference between posting or not posting the posibility of the mafia knowing about the millers beforehand is that you are throwing WIFOM in the thread for town who could haven't thought about that posibility, and mess up legitimate reads because of that. It's like saying "you're townreading this slot for the wrong reason because you're not considering this", and I think that's more scum motivated than town motivated.

It is far more dangerous for town to conftown someone who doesn't deserve it, than it is to mislynch one person over another due to WIFOM.
It is always better for town to consider possibilities and rule them out via explicitly reading people than it is to make assumptions and ignore slots.

The thing is, even if I knew that mafia knew about the millers beforehand, I would still think that Frozen Angel's claim was townie. It's not about conftowning someone for the whole game, it's leaving a slot for later resolution, which is useful in a Large where you can't concentrate in every slot. I mean, I can't, is not easy. I can't sort Elsa right now so I'm leaving her for later, for example.

And as I said in my initial post, is about *how* Maki threw that info into the thread. If she posted it like you're saying it right now it would've been different I think.

[Alchemist21]

Ok. I think you're Town here since I don't think I've seen scum push for purely informational lynches like that.

p-edit: This was at Nikk.

@Pink Ball, I disagree. There are times when a Town collectively doesn't see or know why their reasoning for Townreading a slot doesn't hold up and it results in giving a scum slot a strong position in the game. I think challenging a Town's assumptions is a good thing because it helps keep faulty reads in check.

[Alchemist21]

@Alch: the difference between posting or not posting the posibility of the mafia knowing about the millers beforehand is that you are throwing WIFOM in the thread for town who could haven't thought about that posibility, and mess up legitimate reads because of that. It's like saying "you're townreading this slot for the wrong reason because you're not considering this", and I think that's more scum motivated than town motivated.

It is far more dangerous for town to conftown someone who doesn't deserve it, than it is to mislynch one person over another due to WIFOM.
It is always better for town to consider possibilities and rule them out via explicitly reading people than it is to make assumptions and ignore slots.

The thing is, even if I knew that mafia knew about the millers beforehand, I would still think that Frozen Angel's claim was townie. It's not about conftowning someone for the whole game, it's leaving a slot for later resolution, which is useful in a Large where you can't concentrate in every slot. I mean, I can't, is not easy. I can't sort Elsa right now so I'm leaving her for later, for example.

And as I said in my initial post, is about *how* Maki threw that info into the thread. If she posted it like you're saying it right now it would've been different I think.

Even Maki's own posts were calling FA Towny.

At least 1 of the millers is fake but I doubt it's FA or alch

Is it too big a stretch to think mafia could be informed about the millers? Most likely I'll leave it be for now

I don't see how the way it was brought up is scummy.

[Alchemist21]

You know I'm looking back at who was on the Maki wagon I don't like Kaito's posts. He threw down votes on Maki and Wisdom no problem but keeps dancing around voting Chara. There's some kind of scum hesitation there.

VOTE: Kaito

[Nikk]

Sleep time.
Again, as stated anyone voting for me who has questions feel free to ask. We need more conversation away from the five or so who have been talkative.

Also I will laugh and laugh if FA is scum and just went with something I've done before and claimed miller quick then played as if there can be multiple. Not saying I think that is happening but that I would get a great amount of enjoyment out of someone using a play I had use.

[Pink Ball]

Yessss I agree with that too of course, but think about the scum motivation behind posting that thing. How would a town post about this subject? How would a scum do it?

p-edit: she said I doubt it's FA but interacted with FA about this subject later. About how she brought it up is that, instead of being more confrontational with the people who were townreading FA for being the first one claiming Miller, she just "tested waters". "Is this a stretch?" is not calling out the rest of the playerlist for giving a conftown read on someone when there's a chance of scum being informed; is just throwing the thought to the thread for maybe someone else pick it up and follow that path, and as I have said before, to not give that conftown read on someone I believe is town.

[Chara]

You know I'm looking back at who was on the Maki wagon I don't like Kaito's posts. He threw down votes on Maki and Wisdom no problem but keeps dancing around voting Chara. There's some kind of scum hesitation there.

VOTE: Kaito

<3 for this vote, but why do you think he hesitates voting me, but not Maki and Wisdom?

[Alchemist21]

You know I'm looking back at who was on the Maki wagon I don't like Kaito's posts. He threw down votes on Maki and Wisdom no problem but keeps dancing around voting Chara. There's some kind of scum hesitation there.

VOTE: Kaito

<3 for this vote, but why do you think he hesitates voting me, but not Maki and Wisdom?

I’m not sure; could be one of two things:

1) You’re both scum and he’s distancing.

2) He wants to sheep wagons instead of pushing one of his own to avoid negative attention.

Leaning more towards option 2 right now since an actual early vote on you would have helped it look better if he was trying to distance.

[Wisdom]

@Wisdom Hey I was wrong let's lynch the real scum who's been making us fight half the day.

my vote is never leaving you this is so bad

[Kaito Momota]

Kaito, what's your read on Maki and when did it change?

This feels like a leading question, I don't appreciate it

yeah Maki, sorry that wasn't clear.

Kaito: ignoring my questions and dancing around voting me back is a bad look. square up.

I honestly don't care enough, sorry if this seems aggressive (it is though)

yeah Maki, sorry that wasn't clear.

Kaito: ignoring my questions and dancing around voting me back is a bad look. square up.

Dunn is Dunnstral, in this game Kaito.

i have no interest in voting Wisdom for being Wisdom. his meta is not that he does more as town, and less as scum. Kaito said it was, but has yet to back it up.

i do think that if he's town he needs to try coming out with more than one read.

ohhh
is chara town.

Jury still in deliberation but they really liked this.

down boy

and also Kaito has been trying to shade me without committing to a vote, and he's on Wisdom for meta he refuses to actually back up.
never mind that he's sort of just refused to interact with me since our one conversation earlier. i think it's because he doesn't want to get into it with me and distract from Wisdom wagon/make Chara vs. Kaito an actual thing.

Here you go, just so you can shut up about it:

VOTE: Chara

I'll read the rest of the game tomorrow where I'm at I'm very happy with this vote

[Kaito Momota]

You know I'm looking back at who was on the Maki wagon I don't like Kaito's posts. He threw down votes on Maki and Wisdom no problem but keeps dancing around voting Chara. There's some kind of scum hesitation there.

VOTE: Kaito

You're an idiot

[Chara]

This feels like a leading question, I don't appreciate it

how on earth is asking for your read on Maki at the time and why you unvoted her a leading question?