Booneytoonz IX - Under The Sea -- Game Over!
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I’m not even discrediting the Miller claim. I’ve been in a game with 2 Millers before and was just making sure it’s not impossible in this game. If I was trying to discredit it I wouldn’t have said I’malsoa Miller, I would have counterclaimed and voted FA. Also claiming Miller as scum in the first place is just bad because Millers need to be dealt with before Lylo and there’s no way I’d do it after someone already claimed it.
I think Elsa knows FA and I are both Town and wants 2 easy lynches by saying “well we were wrong on the first, must be the other that was faking,” and didn’t stop to think about how Town needs to feal with both Millers anyway.
VOTE: Elsa Jay- Alchemist21
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You mean like there’s a Cop that checks for Miller or Not Miller?In post 32, Elsa Jay wrote:... Or the VT claims are now the Millers instead.- Alchemist21
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Was it this?In post 124, Creature wrote:Geez I had a fitting song to start this game
What happened? Where did it go?
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I don’t understand it.In post 154, Pink Ball wrote:
You don't see it like... You didn't see my post about her, or you don't understand it?In post 153, Alchemist21 wrote:I still don’t see why you’re voting Maki.- Alchemist21
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He did say he doubted it’s FA though. Also he could be right about scum knowing ahead of time (it could go either way tbh due to it being Miller) but FA would still be Town for claiming first.
viewtopic.php?f=90&t=65683
Something similar happened in the game related to that scum PT where we all had the same fakeclaim. We didn’t get it until people started claiming and we realized everyone had the same flavor role that we had fakeclaims for, and claiming our specific flavor would have been a scumslip. I don’t remember who claimed first in the game thread but I’m pretty sure it was a Town slot and it was quickly followed by other slots claiming the same.
I can imagine scum in this game seeing Miller as their fakeclaim and thinking the mod lost their damn mind. I could also see the mod not hinting because Town’s early claims would make it obvious anyway. I’m still questioning the design choice here but I think there’s have to be some VTs actually mixed in to prevent anyone who didn’t claim Miller from slipping that they’re scum/PR.
I’m going to stop thinking about Miller balance now because it’s making my head spin.- Alchemist21
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Sheep’s doing more game solving than anyone. Fire and Dave reads are based on personal experience with them.In post 252, Creature wrote:
Huh what?In post 171, Alchemist21 wrote:Townreads so far:
Frozen Angel
Sheepsaysmeep
Davesaz
Creature
Firebringer- Alchemist21
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Dave’s is honestly hard to explain but the post where he complained about the noise-signal ratio is what gave me the Townread.
It’s been a while since I played with fire but he always made more serious posts as Town and only made lolposts as scum. Also the super duper secret meta that Fire and I are always the same alignment.- Alchemist21
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Wait how does Kaito Townreading Maki make Maki scum? Maybe Kaito just blindly Townreads them always.In post 437, Wisdom wrote:I remember kaito blindly townreading scum maki when i was scum eith her, which is why im leaning towards the same thing happening here- Alchemist21
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Then why do you think Maki is scum?
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In post 616, Firebringer wrote:@alchemist is it a pleasant noise?
I'm sorry I had to.
p-edit: @Nikk Really none. It seems more a miscommunication than anything AI, but I do have to agree with Elsa that you kept taking focus elsewhere.- Alchemist21
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What would you say is the difference between Town Wisdom and scum Wisdom.In post 627, Creature wrote:
Wisdom feels town so farIn post 433, Alchemist21 wrote:Does anyone have anymore reads to share?- Alchemist21
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All of it, though I was doing other stuff too for parts of it so it's possible I missed something important but I don't think I did.In post 634, davesaz wrote:Alchemist, how much did you actually read?- Alchemist21
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There's the idea that Maki is scum for bringing up the idea that scum were aware of the Millers. I don't think bringing that possibility up makes Maki scum because itIn post 642, davesaz wrote:@alch: Did you catch the prevailing thoughts on Maki?isa possibility (and I linked to a former game that had a similar circumstance). And I don't think Wisdom ever explained why he's scumreading Maki.- Alchemist21
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This is actually really common for me. I'll read through a lot of posts and it's all just NAI to me.In post 658, davesaz wrote:Alchemist says he read all that and got nothing from it. I find that really suspicious.- Alchemist21
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What makes saying it in the thread so bad? Pointing out one possibility doesn't alter the reality of the situation either way.In post 673, Pink Ball wrote:And want to add: speculate about mafia knowing about the millers: ok. Saying it in the thread: not ok.- Alchemist21
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Wouldn't Creature be posting a lot less if he were scum?In post 679, Frozen Angel wrote:
This is absolutelyIn post 676, Creature wrote:I dunno whether you would beg to be townread as town too or not, but I find it worth pushing because it's generally scummy.horrendous bullshitand why you're scum. Plus you post it like it was actually what you were considering all along after me mentioning why it makes you scum.- Alchemist21
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Yes. I’m not the only one who thinks so either.In post 711, Maki Harukawa wrote:
Still can't read me and you'd be townreading me if I was scum. We both know this to be true I also know you townread me when I make posts like this so let's skip the whole part and you unvote me. K? Ok.In post 607, Firebringer wrote:i skimmed through maki iso and i agree with wisdom that it is scummy.
VOTE: makiIn post 620, Creature wrote:Maki is also boring
Get better loser <3In post 629, Frozen Angel wrote:I have a fever and very likely a cold and I've been sick all day plus I had a lot of stuff to do irl hence my absence today.
Its very likely similar tomorrow unless if I feel better
sovla for like 48 hours
I find it hard to believe through that whole read. What to me was if not the most telling pages yet. You thought it was all noise?In post 638, Alchemist21 wrote:
All of it, though I was doing other stuff too for parts of it so it's possible I missed something important but I don't think I did.In post 634, davesaz wrote:Alchemist, how much did you actually read?
Maybe it’s AI for some of you specifically but I think the arguments could have come from either side. I don’t care how serious you were being, if it’s null to me then it’s null to me.In post 712, Clemency wrote:^
i swear i'm getting a soft scumlean on anyone who tried to claim the past 10 pages or so were noise
thats exactly when we started getting real- Alchemist21
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I see. And can you explain your Maki vote more? Was it purely for an informational lynch or did you have reasons to scumread Maki? I don't really see your reason for the vote beyond this quote:
In post 524, Nikk wrote:Here's where I am at now...
1. Wisdom appears to just be this way, and focusing on players who always act suspicious is bad town play
2. IF Maki flips town there is a decent reason to circle back to Wisdom and perhaps even Chara at that time.
3. IF Maki flips scum Elsa Jay is a decent next run.
I don't see us learning as much from flipping Wisdom. It just seems more flimsy then what we learn from a Maki push.
VOTE: Maki- Alchemist21
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Ok. I think you're Town here since I don't think I've seen scum push for purely informational lynches like that.
p-edit: This was at Nikk.
@Pink Ball, I disagree. There are times when a Town collectively doesn't see or know why their reasoning for Townreading a slot doesn't hold up and it results in giving a scum slot a strong position in the game. I think challenging a Town's assumptions is a good thing because it helps keep faulty reads in check.- Alchemist21
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Even Maki's own posts were calling FA Towny.In post 763, Pink Ball wrote:
The thing is, even if I knew that mafia knew about the millers beforehand, I would still think that Frozen Angel's claim was townie. It's not about conftowning someone for the whole game, it's leaving a slot for later resolution, which is useful in a Large where you can't concentrate in every slot. I mean, I can't, is not easy. I can't sort Elsa right now so I'm leaving her for later, for example.In post 762, davesaz wrote:
It is far more dangerous for town to conftown someone who doesn't deserve it, than it is to mislynch one person over another due to WIFOM.In post 760, Pink Ball wrote:@Alch: the difference between posting or not posting the posibility of the mafia knowing about the millers beforehand is that you are throwing WIFOM in the thread for town who could haven't thought about that posibility, and mess up legitimate reads because of that. It's like saying "you're townreading this slot for the wrong reason because you're not considering this", and I think that's more scum motivated than town motivated.
It is always better for town to consider possibilities and rule them out via explicitly reading people than it is to make assumptions and ignore slots.
And as I said in my initial post, is about *how* Maki threw that info into the thread. If she posted it like you're saying it right now it would've been different I think.
In post 62, Maki Harukawa wrote:At least 1 of the millers is fake but I doubt it's FA or alch
I don't see how the way it was brought up is scummy.In post 63, Maki Harukawa wrote:Is it too big a stretch to think mafia could be informed about the millers? Most likely I'll leave it be for now- Alchemist21
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I’m not sure; could be one of two things:In post 769, Chara wrote:
<3 for this vote, but why do you think he hesitates voting me, but not Maki and Wisdom?In post 766, Alchemist21 wrote:You know I'm looking back at who was on the Maki wagon I don't like Kaito's posts. He threw down votes on Maki and Wisdom no problem but keeps dancing around voting Chara. There's some kind of scum hesitation there.
VOTE: Kaito
1) You’re both scum and he’s distancing.
2) He wants to sheep wagons instead of pushing one of his own to avoid negative attention.
Leaning more towards option 2 right now since an actual early vote on you would have helped it look better if he was trying to distance.- Alchemist21
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Yeah ISO Kaito and see how he’s been dancing around the idea of voting Chara without committing to it.In post 800, sheepsaysmeep wrote:not goign to catch up by reading the thread im too far behind
are there any people i should iso first- Alchemist21
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Why are you interested in the weakest Townreads?In post 819, davesaz wrote:Work started, so the unusually high posting volume from me will go down.
That's a lot of townreads. Are they all equal strength? I'm mostly interested in which the weakest few might be.- Alchemist21
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Yeah I said it was just noise and people got mad, and it was just funny to me that he would say that nobody called me on not addressing stuff in the previous pages when that’s what already happened.In post 833, Chara wrote:
what is this referring to?In post 806, Alchemist21 wrote:Hoo boy. Not sure if you genuinely don't know or if you're trying to poke the bear on that one.
you also said you didn't find some recent pages to be more than noise.- Alchemist21
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He didn’t push Maki & Wisdom though. He blindly sheeped onto their wagons without adding any input.In post 840, Pink Ball wrote:
Yeah of course I can! Kaito's progression has been one of the best so far. He first voted Maki with a naked vote when I naked voted Maki and Maki naked voted me, so it was funny in context and called Maki out at the same time. Then went for Wisdom because Wisdom was being Wisdom and that's ok, and now he's on you because that's what he believes since the begining: that you're the Miller who fakeclaimed. Pushing both Maki and Wisdom would be a risky move for scum!Kaito when both of those players know his meta; it would be much more suitable to go under the radar (for example, that's another thing I recall Maki doing: not providing a read on Kaito when she was asked. I could say she's trying not to call Kaito's attention). Pushing you seems to have lack of scum motivation too.In post 837, Chara wrote:Pink, can you explain your Kaito townread, pretty please?
Also as a sidenote, he called out Nikk for being scummy at some point iirc.- Alchemist21
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Oh there it is. Idk how I missed it.In post 772, Kaito Momota wrote:
This feels like a leading question, I don't appreciate itIn post 409, Chara wrote:Kaito, what's your read on Maki and when did it change?
I honestly don't care enough, sorry if this seems aggressive (it is though)In post 416, Chara wrote:yeah Maki, sorry that wasn't clear.
Kaito: ignoring my questions and dancing around voting me back is a bad look. square up.
In post 416, Chara wrote:yeah Maki, sorry that wasn't clear.
Kaito: ignoring my questions and dancing around voting me back is a bad look. square up.
down boyIn post 424, Firebringer wrote:
ohhhIn post 406, Chara wrote:Dunn is Dunnstral, in this game Kaito.
i have no interest in voting Wisdom for being Wisdom. his meta is not that he does more as town, and less as scum. Kaito said it was, but has yet to back it up.
i do think that if he's town he needs to try coming out with more than one read.
is chara town.
Jury still in deliberation but they really liked this.
Here you go, just so you can shut up about it:In post 436, Chara wrote:and also Kaito has been trying to shade me without committing to a vote, and he's on Wisdom for meta he refuses to actually back up.
never mind that he's sort of just refused to interact with me since our one conversation earlier. i think it's because he doesn't want to get into it with me and distract from Wisdom wagon/make Chara vs. Kaito an actual thing.
VOTE: Chara
I'll read the rest of the game tomorrow where I'm at I'm very happy with this vote- Alchemist21
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- Pronoun: He/Him
- Location: North Carolina
I already did.In post 846, Kaito Momota wrote:
Are you going to ever explain this or no?In post 806, Alchemist21 wrote:Hoo boy. Not sure if you genuinely don't know or if you're trying to poke the bear on that one.
[citation needed]Chara wrote:Kaito has played with me a lot. i don't expect him to know every little thing about my meta, but iknowhe's aware of the big things.
i towntell when i heavily engage. i always towntell. he doesn't want to heavily engage with me, and is trying to use humour/his attitude to pretend like he doesn't care enough to. it's just a facade.
the only way Kaito is town here is if he's being so lazy he hasn't actually attempted to read me, but that "not going to be happy until Chara is dead" post pretty much discounts that.- Alchemist21
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Alchemist21 He/HimJack of All Trades
- Alchemist21
He/Him- Jack of All Trades
- Jack of All Trades
- Posts: 8801
- Joined: September 5, 2014
- Pronoun: He/Him
- Location: North Carolina
- Alchemist21
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Alchemist21 He/HimJack of All Trades
- Alchemist21
He/Him- Jack of All Trades
- Jack of All Trades
- Posts: 8801
- Joined: September 5, 2014
- Pronoun: He/Him
- Location: North Carolina
- Alchemist21
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Alchemist21 He/HimJack of All Trades
- Alchemist21
He/Him- Jack of All Trades
- Jack of All Trades
- Posts: 8801
- Joined: September 5, 2014
- Pronoun: He/Him
- Location: North Carolina
- Alchemist21
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Alchemist21 He/HimJack of All Trades
- Alchemist21
He/Him- Jack of All Trades
- Jack of All Trades
- Posts: 8801
- Joined: September 5, 2014
- Pronoun: He/Him
- Location: North Carolina
- Alchemist21
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Alchemist21 He/HimJack of All Trades
- Alchemist21
He/Him- Jack of All Trades
- Jack of All Trades
- Posts: 8801
- Joined: September 5, 2014
- Pronoun: He/Him
- Location: North Carolina
- Alchemist21
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Alchemist21 He/HimJack of All Trades
- Alchemist21
He/Him- Jack of All Trades
- Jack of All Trades
- Posts: 8801
- Joined: September 5, 2014
- Pronoun: He/Him
- Location: North Carolina
That’s why I sent a PM.In post 865, Pink Ball wrote:I think the one who should be prodded is the mod.- Alchemist21
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Alchemist21 He/HimJack of All Trades
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