Starcraft Mafia: 2 -- Game Over!


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Post Post #1225 (ISO) » Sun Jan 13, 2019 6:01 am

Post by Kokichi Oma »

In post 1184, Almost Chara wrote:it wasn't a pressure wagon. it was PoE. it's true that i think i'm good at recognizing town Kokichi, but did you forget the game we played where you were scum and i misread you? why would you expect me to blindly keep treating you exactly the same way? i'm not a robot.
~Chara
Lie. You always choose to wait on me even through PoE. You're just scum going for an easy lynch like you tried to in dangan maf.
How do you expect to find the culprit when you're all worried about each other's feelings? If you're planning to expose a liar, then you have to corner them psychologically.
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Post Post #1226 (ISO) » Sun Jan 13, 2019 6:04 am

Post by Mephistophanes 39 »

In post 1222, ProFlavor wrote:
In post 1221, Mephistophanes 39 wrote:Does no one have anything to say about post 1195?
I could link the friends game Gamma talked about and say Nico lurking can go either way tbh
Please do, that would be extremely helpful.
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Post Post #1227 (ISO) » Sun Jan 13, 2019 6:06 am

Post by Mephistophanes 39 »

In post 1224, Alchemist21 wrote:
In post 432, NicoRobin wrote:Baa, baa, black shiiiipppp
In post 912, Krazy wrote:NicoRobin is being replaced. Nico can remain in the game if they post game-advancing content before a replacement is found. (Last prodge does not adhere to rule for prodges, which must include some game advancing content)
In post 969, NicoRobin wrote:VOTE: Shoshin
@Mephistophanes, I think they just voted the leading wagon at the time as a prod dodge, not as an actual read.
Maybe but they she doesn have to vote as a prodge. She never did on Labrynth on D1.
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Post Post #1228 (ISO) » Sun Jan 13, 2019 6:07 am

Post by Mephistophanes 39 »

In post 1225, Kokichi Oma wrote:
In post 1184, Almost Chara wrote:it wasn't a pressure wagon. it was PoE. it's true that i think i'm good at recognizing town Kokichi, but did you forget the game we played where you were scum and i misread you? why would you expect me to blindly keep treating you exactly the same way? i'm not a robot.
~Chara
Lie. You always choose to wait on me even through PoE. You're just scum going for an easy lynch like you tried to in dangan maf.
Have you read their ISO? They are like super obvtown here.
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Post Post #1229 (ISO) » Sun Jan 13, 2019 6:11 am

Post by Mephistophanes 39 »

In post 1223, Alchemist21 wrote:
In post 1190, Michael Scott wrote:I'm comfortable with my vote on Nico. I think a scum flip there would be useful anyway, given we have associatives already WRT who's trying to lead away from her lynch, and such.

Is there anyone convincingly scum at this point? I'm not seeing scum!STW how Varsoon is.
Mewtaph is scum.
Yeah, when a slot’s playstyle is radically different either concurrently or subsequently, chances are, that slot is a different alignment - scum, especially if it’s for the worse.

Mew asking Gamma, if he should townread her, was my fave. :lol:
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Post Post #1230 (ISO) » Sun Jan 13, 2019 6:27 am

Post by Varsoon »

In post 1200, Tibor and Lumia wrote:
In post 567, Shoshin the worst wrote:
In post 543, Varsoon wrote:Just gonna bring this into overdrive, actually, and go for the dunk.
Day Vig: Shoshin the Worst
Actually lack of flavour is likely fake
So stw, why didn’t you state you thought this when I asked?
-MC Gamma
Looking back at this, the blatant flavor-fishing is disgusting.
Please lynch STW.

-V
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Post Post #1231 (ISO) » Sun Jan 13, 2019 6:29 am

Post by Varsoon »

In post 1210, Tibor and Lumia wrote:
In post 677, Varsoon wrote:No, seriously, what the fuck
If my kill fails on you, why wouldn't you claim that shit immediately?
So like, stw made reads in response to the vig shot. So I don’t think they’re BP. So either the vig was fake or there’s some other intervention. Varsoon, since you don’t seem to care about what info you leak, does your vig shot not work on ground/air units?
-A very intrigued Emerald
I do care about what I leaked and I specifically addressed this point already.


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Post Post #1232 (ISO) » Sun Jan 13, 2019 6:31 am

Post by Varsoon »

For posterity:
In post 16, Varsoon wrote:Town shouldn't claim ground/air
Chances are that scum abilities can only affect one or the other
Same with position in the list

Anyway that's all on mechanics.
VOTE: Alchemist21
In post 716, Varsoon wrote:Are you something that's not air or ground, then? Like Space or some wild shit?
Not that I expect you'd claim ascetic or BP or 'Space' or anything of the like if you're scum.
I'm just trying to figure this out.

-V
In post 725, Varsoon wrote:
In post 717, Tibor and Lumia wrote:Varsoon, could you claim your flavor, since you are claiming a role?

I'm honestly not super Up to Date with Starcraft having only played a few games of SC2, so I don't know if that will reveal ground or air unit. If it would, I guess I'd be willing to accept that.

-Brass
I won't claim flavor at all and I won't confirm if my flavor does or does not make it obvious that I am ground or air or anything else.
The less info scum have about me, the better.

@STW: I've been paying attention to the thread and responding to other things, too.
I'm sorry that I'm such a headache for you. Please focus outside of me for now, then?
Unless we have a legitimately better candidate for lynch that I actually agree on, I'm going to keep my vote stuck where it is.
It's baffling that my kill failed on you and I'm trying my best not to get really pissed off that I outted myself this early and will die without having done anything.

@AlmostChara: There are definitely units in Starcraft that can only affect air or ground. The Protoss Reaver, for instance, can shoot out scarab bombs across the ground, but it can't hit flying units. Many of the zerg ground units only have claws and can't attack air units. Shuttles that fly can pick up and transport ground units. So on and so forth.

-V
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Post Post #1233 (ISO) » Sun Jan 13, 2019 6:32 am

Post by Varsoon »

It's weird that this is the second time that Tibor and Lumia have, each from a different head, looked to fish my info.


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Post Post #1234 (ISO) » Sun Jan 13, 2019 9:08 am

Post by Shoshin the worst »

o_0

I don't know why you think that was flavour fishing nor why you think that's some kind of smoking gun. "day vig" just looked so different from Kokichi's "there is no cow level" last time.

you've now spent like an irl week being useless Varsoon
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Post Post #1235 (ISO) » Sun Jan 13, 2019 10:18 am

Post by Varsoon »

Hey, man, I know I'm useless.
I'm just trying to steer this ship into the direction I think is right here.
My number is up--I'm outted; scum's going to kill the fucking Vigilante IC.
So I'm doing what I can.

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Post Post #1236 (ISO) » Sun Jan 13, 2019 12:23 pm

Post by Michael Scott »

In post 588, Shoshin the worst wrote:
In post 585, u r a person 2 wrote:
In post 577, Shoshin the worst wrote:I don't understand why you think there's no town motivation in our slot pushing/scumreading you. It's pretty simple. We scumread you.
The fact you can't engage with me about why we shouldn't scumread you or should townread you had me baffled.
I believe that there can be a town motivation for scumreading me. I didn't say town!you town!reads me 100%

We can post game why I'm not into reading myself in the thread. It basically boils down to the wifom/not wifom discussion you're in the middle of and my having no interest in having those types of discussions
The problem we're having here is that you kicked off this rabbit hole discussion by voting us because you believe town!tw should be townreading you, plus the hydra dynamic which for the umpteenth time should not be deemed alignment indicative.

I'm trying to parse how you came to the conclusion that it's scum indicative for us to be scumreading you and pushing you just because the worst and you have history. I still do not understand your rationale here.

If you think TW should >rand be townreading you, we definitely need a better metric against which to measure your towntells, because it means what we are doing at the moment is on the wrong track.

This conversation is pretty important. If you do need to back out of it for
holistic playstyle/meta reasons
we understand but also please try to see that from our perspective, that leaves you joining out wagon late into its formation for almost exactly no reason...
In post 591, pinturicchio wrote:
In post 577, Shoshin the worst wrote:I could give it a go with pintu but I'm not sure it'd get me anywhere.
I'm pocketed without the need of you doing anything <3

@Varsoon, I have a towntell on the duck, on the same line of your "stretch your minds" of Shoshin. I've seen the duck using the
"holistical reads"
as town before and can't recall him doing it as scum.

By the way @duck, why scumreading us? Felt like it came out of nowhere.

-Pin
TW actually used the phrase “holistic playstyle/meta reasons” here, not “holistical reads”. I looked into this, and TW using phrases like “holistic meta” or “holistic read” is definitely not a towntell for him. In fact, he used the phrase “holistic meta” in the first Starcraft game (as scum) four different times. I searched TW’s posts for the phrases “holistic meta”, “holistic read”, “holistic play”, and “holistic playstyle” as this is what I found:

TW has used the phrase “holistic meta” four times in the first Starcraft game as scum (link: viewtopic.php?f=3&t=77970):

Link to the first post where he used “holistic meta”: viewtopic.php?f=3&t=77970&p=10584202&hi ... #p10584202
In post 517, the worst wrote:
In post 278, Varsoon wrote:P-EDIT:
Everything above the pedit is cringe
Everything below the pedit is locktown-irl

Varsoon I think you're really caught up on like holistic meta stuff and I'm like... not all that interested in it.... do you think the reads have been bad? maliciously intended? which ones? why?
Link to the second post where he used “holistic meta”: viewtopic.php?f=3&t=77970&p=10595081&hi ... #p10595081
In post 1594, the worst wrote:But I'm also wary of the fact I'm fucking easily triggered by people using bullshit holistic meta tells so I might be seeing red
Link to the third post where he used “holistic meta”: viewtopic.php?f=3&t=77970&p=10595151&hi ... #p10595151
In post 1638, the worst wrote:since no one is seeing what I'm seeing:
Mewtaph has asked Xtoxm the same question a lot of us have already asked him (which townreads gave him pause)

I think he's already answered that question really well, and I think his answer was town indicative. Mewtaph has ignored his reads and later contribution and comments about playstyle anxiety leading him to freak out about the early townreads. Follow his reads and it's probably pretty clear that he had his own takes, but the Big Bad Townblock was too much for him to like.

Mewtaph thinks he's a mislynch / has not noticed that Xtoxm's initial freak-out about the townreadspam actually kinda checks out, so shades him for not responding and votes him over ellitell

I ask Mewtaph to back the ellitell up with an actual scumcase. He cites the very early part of Xtoxm's contributions. I ask him to go back to his later iso and show me which of Xtoxm's posts are making him still feel that way

Nancy randomly charge-tackles me to the ground and Mewtaph stands there watching us and acting all surprised that I asked him to back up this read.

Like idfk he hasn't warlocked Nancy, she did it of her own volition but I'm fucking done if I'm being shaded for asking someone who's done sweet fuck all to back up a horseshit holistic meta tell with an actual scumcase on a slot I'm townreading
Link to the fourth post where he used “holistic meta”: viewtopic.php?f=3&t=77970&p=10615025&hi ... #p10615025
In post 2977, the worst wrote:
In post 2975, Xtoxm wrote:I have to be able to trust that townies won't make reckless antitown plays like that.
You for real? I think Perf is scum but his hammer is the most defensible part of his ISO. The hell else was he meant to do with like 6 hours remaining? NM was clearly a very viable lynch candidate and imo if he was going to claim at all he would have already done it.

I'm kinda flashing back to something someone said to me pretty recently but if scum always made reckless antitown moves and town never did mafia would be like.. obscenely easier than it is. do you have reasoning other than an holistic meta dislike of hammers on unclaimed slots?

TW used the phrases “holistic meta” and “holistic gamestate read” one time each in Newbie 1866 as town (link: viewtopic.php?f=50&t=76047)

Link to the post where he used “holistic meta”: viewtopic.php?f=50&t=76047&p=10178131&h ... #p10178131

Link to the post where he used “holistic gamestate read”: viewtopic.php?f=50&t=76047&p=10201152&h ... #p10201152


TW used the phrase “holistic readthrough” one time In Newbie 1870 as town (link: viewtopic.php?f=50&t=76282)

Link to the post where he used “holistic readthrough”: viewtopic.php?f=50&t=76282&p=10264643&h ... #p10264643


TW used the phrase “holistic read” one time in Open 737 as town (link: viewtopic.php?f=51&t=77146)

Link to the post where he used “holistic read”: viewtopic.php?f=51&t=77146&p=10453007&h ... #p10453007

No results came up for “holistic play” or “holistic playstyle” when searching TW’s posts.

Granted, TW has used phrases like “holistic read” or something along those lines as town, but in this game the exact phrase he used in post was “holistic playstyle/meta reasons”, and he has used “holistic meta” four times as much as scum than he has as town. In any case, TW frequently uses the word “holistic” in general (there are 41 results for just the word “holistic” when searching TW’s posts), so at best him using the phrase “holistic playstyle/meta reasons” is NAI for him. So
@Pinturicchio
, why were you so quick to label this as a “towntell” for TW when it clearly isn’t?

And
@The Worst
, what are your thoughts on Pinturicchio incorrectly applying this as a “towntell” for your slot?

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Post Post #1237 (ISO) » Sun Jan 13, 2019 12:29 pm

Post by ProFlavor »

That’s a lot of words for what could have been

TW used the word holistic 41 times over a certain time period / X as town / Y as scum so it’s NAI
Then ask why point disagreed


Why use 100 words when you can use 10 eh


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Post Post #1238 (ISO) » Sun Jan 13, 2019 12:37 pm

Post by Almost Chara »

In post 1225, Kokichi Oma wrote:Lie. You always choose to wait on me even through PoE. You're just scum going for an easy lynch like you tried to in dangan maf.
in danganronpa mafia i defended you heavily until finally botching a hammer on you. the two situations are not remotrly similar.
and in the worst idea mafia, i scumread you until you were nightkilled. i've said in a few games in the past that i know how to read you and so would usually like to wait and see what you do. this isn't the case anymore and thinking it is is incredibly shallow
fix your play here or get lynched. who's scum?

i'm voting Nico.
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Post Post #1239 (ISO) » Sun Jan 13, 2019 12:38 pm

Post by Almost Chara »

In post 1186, Shoshin the worst wrote:Regardless I feel like Chara has 50 times the clout you do in this list... If you think it's scum and wanna do something about it let's see whatcha got
how are you reading Kokichi for this?
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Post Post #1240 (ISO) » Sun Jan 13, 2019 12:42 pm

Post by Almost Chara »

In post 1219, ProFlavor wrote:
In post 1217, Shoshin the worst wrote:
In post 1201, ProFlavor wrote:I thought it was fairly obvious and didn’t warrant a specific answer - no ones really going pocketing what? So I’ll leave it at that

The walking away bit might have been coincidental

The breaking out into 2 heads was the most interesting though
What do you mean about breaking into 2 heads? and what about it interests you?
I’m interested to see if the rest of the group find this note worthy so I’ll come back to this in a couple pages time
i don't find it noteworthy. i think it's an NAI result of two people trying to act as one. that's hard to do.
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Post Post #1241 (ISO) » Sun Jan 13, 2019 12:44 pm

Post by Almost Chara »

In post 998, Alchemist21 wrote:Taly’s vote seemed more like a pressure vote to get a response from me. Mewtaph’s reason for keeping his was sketchy.
i see later that you confidently state Mewtaph is scum, and also note this as the only reason. i'm not sure if it convinces me, but Mewtaph's also in our PoE so i find myself not caring too much.
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Post Post #1242 (ISO) » Sun Jan 13, 2019 12:54 pm

Post by Alchemist21 »

In post 1241, Almost Chara wrote:
In post 998, Alchemist21 wrote:Taly’s vote seemed more like a pressure vote to get a response from me. Mewtaph’s reason for keeping his was sketchy.
i see later that you confidently state Mewtaph is scum, and also note this as the only reason. i'm not sure if it convinces me, but Mewtaph's also in our PoE so i find myself not caring too much.
~Chara
Keep going though. He tried to explain it and it was hilarious. That later post is what sealed my confidence on Mewtaph scum.
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Post Post #1243 (ISO) » Sun Jan 13, 2019 12:59 pm

Post by Varsoon »

In post 1237, ProFlavor wrote:That’s a lot of words for what could have been

TW used the word holistic 41 times over a certain time period / X as town / Y as scum so it’s NAI
Then ask why point disagreed


Why use 100 words when you can use 10 eh


~ woof
I can make it easier
4 words

VOTE: STW ; They're scum.
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Post Post #1244 (ISO) » Sun Jan 13, 2019 2:20 pm

Post by Krazy »

Votecount 1.12


u r a person 2(2)
~ (60), (45)
Shoshin the worst(2)
~ (6), (157)
pinturicchio(2)
~ (89), (116)
NicoRobin(2)
~ (59), (83)
Almost Chara(1)
~ (14)
Alchemist21(1)
~ (7)


Not Voting (0):

With 14 alive it takes 8 to lynch.

Day 1 deadline is in (expired on 2019-01-16 22:05:01)


MOD REMINDERSNicoRobin needs a prod. The last post was at: 1/11/2019 5:41:00 AM which was 2 days 13 hours 37 minutes 30 seconds ago.

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Happy birthday Gamma!
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Post Post #1245 (ISO) » Sun Jan 13, 2019 2:30 pm

Post by u r a person 2 »

Yikes

I'm not a huge fan of our vote count with 3 days left

I don't want to be presumptuous, but how about people start thinking about what compromise lynch they might be willing to consolidate onto

or make a better case for the vote you've got
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Post Post #1246 (ISO) » Sun Jan 13, 2019 2:41 pm

Post by Varsoon »

It ain't about compromise
The fucking confirmed-town vigilante shot someone
That person did not die
That person has been very scummy
And that person has no excuse for not dying

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Post Post #1247 (ISO) » Sun Jan 13, 2019 3:57 pm

Post by Almost Chara »

it's not happening today, Varsoon. the most i can promise is that i'm keeping an eye on STW, as i said. who else are you willing to lynch?
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Post Post #1248 (ISO) » Sun Jan 13, 2019 4:01 pm

Post by Almost Chara »

even if STW is scum i think the likelihood of the shot failing or being stopped somehow due to how far away you two are on the list is very high.
so that leaves them being your scumread. you've been trying all day and the lynch isn't happening right now.
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Post Post #1249 (ISO) » Sun Jan 13, 2019 4:20 pm

Post by Shoshin the worst »

In post 1236, Michael Scott wrote:And @The Worst, what are your thoughts on Pinturicchio incorrectly applying this as a “towntell” for your slot?
...idk? I don't like that kind of read anyway (it's angleshooty and stupid) so I mostly ignored it. I just like the concept of retaining a level of holism wrt gamestate & how myself and others are viewing the game so I didn't think it was AI either but like I don't pay enough attention to know if I do it more as one alignment or the other
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