Mini Normal 2046: Autumn's Farewell [Endgame]

[Varsoon]

@Varsoon: what are your thoughts on Creature?

My thoughts are he's probably scum and if he isn't, then Oka is, and if Oka isn't and Creature isn't, then I lose the game.

[Varsoon]

Kinda wish I got Watcher instead of Voyeur because then I could soft-protect Moongrass tonight and draw the kill to myself.

[Varsoon]

Thought we were lynching Creature today.

But yeah if we hit scum today then I'll check Creature because then I should get no result and there should be a kill.
Scum'll have to kill you since you're follower and would clear someone as town to hit them so Creature can't gambit on a no-kill and only commute if he's scum.
So I'd be aight with that but we really need to hit scum.

[Varsoon]

I'd take Oka before Mbaki or DDL at this point.

[Varsoon]

I'm here.
Who we lynchin, champ?

[Varsoon]

Oka's in more of those solves than Mbaki but whatever
Lay a vote?

[Varsoon]

VOTE: Oka
Aight then

[Varsoon]

Action was not successful.
Since there's only one scum left, this makes Creature town.

[Varsoon]

From each of your perspectives, the 'solve' should be the two other guys.
We need ya'll three to come on a consensus.

[Varsoon]

Obviously, one of you won't agree.

[Varsoon]

Weren't around? I dunno.
I don't think it's you, though.
I think the solve is probably Mbaki/DDL.

[Varsoon]

I think that Oka went hard on me and DDL went strong passive.
I wonder if I called the scumteam of Oka DDL on D1
But then why wasn't I shot?
Wonk.

[Varsoon]

No, no, I mean over rb and over Dunnflor

[Varsoon]

I already expressed my thoughts.
I've been thinking about it and it bothers me.
But I guess I can be wrong twice here before it really screws us.
So /shrugs.

[Varsoon]

Can we get a Votecount?

[Varsoon]

Yeah, it's not KMD.
VOTE: DDL

Pretty sure the DDL Mbaki solve wins it.

[Varsoon]

You can argue for why it's KMD if tomorrow actually does come.

[Varsoon]

Suka's track on KMD came back with no action taken and KMD claimed VT
S'all.

[Varsoon]

UNVOTE:

Yeah actually
Maybe it is just Mbaki then KMD?

What was the defense that Mbaki wasn't scum?

[Varsoon]

What questions/cause?

[Varsoon]

Kmd's felt better to me all game.

I think KMD's most likely town out of you three.

[Varsoon]

Yeah here's the real problem; You've all been super suspicious.

[Varsoon]

You know what's annoying? Whenever I point out someone's play raises suspicion or that some's play could use work, people immediately ad-hom with that 'holier than thou' shit.
I don't think I've played very well this game at all. I just barely came around on Oka and even then I had huge doubts.
In fact, nah, I'm not gonna stand for that kinda shit anymore.
Am I garbage at the game? Maybe
But maybe you shouldn't be eager pidgeonhole and undermine town who's actually trying to figure out the game.
VOTE: mbaki
The burden of towncasing KMD isn't on me.

[Varsoon]

I've been nothing but genuine here and it's legit annoying as fuck when players like you undermine or manipulate me when I am.

[Varsoon]

@Creature: Could be, but then their traitor would have negative interaction with them.
I think it'd be more interesting if last scum is vanilla because then all of town's following roles only interact with other town roles and the kill.

[Varsoon]

Creature hasn't weighed in and OBVIOUSLY the scum's gonna say the other two people are scum and vote in whoever looks likelier to eat the lynch
Wow

[Varsoon]

You aren't going to manipulate me that way, dude, I'm the scatman; I should've never had your respect as a player in the first place.
If you respect me less as a person or as a moderator because I have been legitimately poor at playing this one game, that's your prerogative, I guess.
Just don't be dropping personal appeals like that thinking it's going to make me change my vote or my mind.

[Varsoon]

And you clearly do have words; you just wrote them.

[Varsoon]

Honestly, why don't you pitch who is absolutely gotta be scum so if you eat dirt here and don't flip red, I've got your vote of confidence in where to go next, unless you don't have high confidence in a literal coin-toss odds of picking right

[Varsoon]

Hey, man, I was right about Oka from Day 1
And I was right every lynch I fought
You wanna shit on my play, shit on it, whatever.
Ain't my 'job' as town to do anything but make sure we pull the W eventually. I'm not going to case something I don't have much passion for or drive to do.

[Varsoon]

Like cool you asked me to do some shit I never cared to do a half-dozen times when I'd already said my piece there.
I'm sorry I don't have some huge fucking deluge of observations or info to just win a game with, my guy, but I'm not going to go full-tilt work into something I don't believe in all because some dude who I think may be scum can point at it and make the same excuses anyone else would like "Well TOWN said this, so..."

Look at how much ya'll have been bawking about 'Moongrass said this' or 'Suka said that'. It's dishonest AF.

P-EDIT:
It's just a read I feel more right about than not. Goddamn, I don't have to write a fucking thesis on why I like Mint Chocolate Chip more than Vanilla when I order it, do I?

[Varsoon]

Already did.

Suka came right out and said I took no action before I claimed. That would have been a lie that would have been exposed had I taken an action. There's actually a world where someone could see no action as a townie action, although I'd disagree. That could easily be scum who didn't kill that night. Point is, claiming I took no action is risking a lie being exposed. I don't see it the other way around.

This line of logic is what I was saying was good.

KMD's town 'cus I like him. Also, he didn't act when scum only had two people acting and they knew this setup had stuff like Voyeur in it so like
I think scum's more likely in someone who would feel comfortable acting

@Oka: Keep lying--I wanted to go last, with Creature right before me. You insisted otherwise. I still resent you for that.

But you know what?
Fuck it
VOTE: KMD

If this flips town, lynch Mbaki tomorrow and don't let that piece of shit AtE you out of anything else.

[Varsoon]

The play you've been laying down here is annoying as fuck.

[Varsoon]

Thing that actually made me go back and vote KMD there was when I went back through my ISO and went "In retrospect, KMD's excuse for not having committed the kill here makes plenty of sense if Oka was his partner claiming having killed and ascetic."

Mbaki, you gotta not get some personal and amped in like that. It's really frustrating to deal with and makes me not wanna engage.

Also, yeah, Oka went really all in with both the ascetic claim and the casing against me.

[Varsoon]

Like KMD's VT claim and what I quoted from my ISO
It was a bit too insightful given KMD's recent posts and I was like "Wait this is something scum might say to get townpoints"

Sorry for being such a pain to deal with.

[Varsoon]

Was I right about scum only keeping me alive because they wanted me to ML DDL down the line or...?

[Varsoon]

imo u weren't just much of a kill that mattered because u were lynchable and u weren't in a position to do anything to threaten us

Oh cool then my play re: role worked 'cus I pretty much cleared myself and Creature there at the end.

[Varsoon]

@Mbaki : Nothin' taken personally, I know how frustrating it gets to be in game and really invested like that. It's actually why I sloughed away from scumreading you earlier on and even on the last day phase I was thinking, "This aggro is real, how many times have I been wrong when I pushed up against someone like this and how many times have I been the aggro player in this situation. Hm."

On the whole traitor leaving fake crumbs, I think that's a great tactic and in the future as traitor I think I'm gonna have to fake-crumb traitor to strong-town if I ever end up rolling traitor.

[Varsoon]

Thanks for the game, NSG. It was really vanilla by the standards I typically play/mod, but I think it was a neat setup and your moderation was on-point.
I enjoyed it.

[Varsoon]

I actually really like the idea of a Traitor with the scumteam having a Loyal Neighborizer and might swipe that for a game I run eventually.

[Varsoon]

Yeah I legit disbelieved every claim of X-shot because I thought it'd be such a bum move to inherit a used-up role.
That said, you could 'mitigate' roleswing by making every vanilla townie a different priority Universal Backup in a game that has only x-shot roles, so if players holster and get shot, the backups can still use the role.
Hm.


@Xtoxm: Yeah, I'm usually against multiball because it's a fundamentally different game, though having an informed traitor or doing white flag is often a way to give scum an 'extra' player while not beefing their power up too much.

@NSG: Why not make the traitor Bulletproof? At least then if the kill fails on them, scum's just down one night but not out a kill and a team mate. Traitor should always be used as a .5 member anyway, not as a full member.

[Varsoon]

That does give me the idea of an interesting setup:
A game where role cards don't get flipped (alignment does, but nothing else) and everyone is a Universal Backup with various priorities. Would that work? I'm curious.
Hm...
Probably not given it'd conf-town people unless scum forced 1v1s.
Though you could go flipless entirely and it'd be interesting
though at that point
It's kinda not mafia.