Micro 842: Lynchpin 8p (Game Over)

[Donempire]

VOTE: The great Wall for being a hydra with 4 accounts
That will surely make for an interesting iso

[Donempire]

So fill me in on this, do we go for the lynchpin or the scum? I'm not familiar with this, so i think i'll be better off with a clear goal in mind.

[Donempire]

So fill me in on this, do we go for the lynchpin or the scum? I'm not familiar with this, so i think i'll be better off with a clear goal in mind.

If the lynchpin is obvious we go for them, but we shouldn't just hang townies for the sake of it. We should focus on scumhunting, and if all the scum randomly defends one person, then we hang that person. But we don't hang townies just on suspicion.

This weirded me out a bit. What does it mean not hanging townies out of suspicion? Do you mean suspicion of being lynchpin, which even they dont know? And again, how do we know they arent scum anyways? Its not like its revealed that they are townie and we have to decide if theyre lynchpin or not, we dont know what they are. This post raised more questions than answers to me.
And again, why would the scum vehemently defend the lynchpin if its gonna make it apparent that its the lynchpin? I figure they'd have more class than just abruptly saying dont lynch that person. I understand you simplified it a bit but i still am confused about what you even mean.

[Donempire]

So fill me in on this, do we go for the lynchpin or the scum? I'm not familiar with this, so i think i'll be better off with a clear goal in mind.

If the lynchpin is obvious we go for them, but we shouldn't just hang townies for the sake of it. We should focus on scumhunting, and if all the scum randomly defends one person, then we hang that person. But we don't hang townies just on suspicion.

If two players are blatantly defending someone, isn't it more benefitial to go after them over the person they're defending that could easily be non-lynchpain being framed as one?

yeah this is what i tried to say thanks

[Donempire]

Trying to hit the lynchpin on day 1 is a valid strategy in this setup. If we look at the numbers here, there is a much higher probability of hitting the lynchpin on day 1 than there is of hitting both scum in back-to-back lynches on day 1 and day 2:

Day 1: The probability of lynching scum on day 1 is 2/8 (1/4)

Day 2: If we lynch scum on day 1, the probability of lynching the other scum on day 2 is 1/6

So the probability of us lynching both scum in back-to-back lynches on day 1 and day 2 is 1/4 * 1/6 = 1/24 (about 4.17%)

Whereas the probability of lynching the lynchpin on day 1, which outright wins town the game, is 1/8 (12.5%)

And in this setup, because the town:scum ratio is 6:2 rather than 7:2, town can only afford to have ONE mislynch and loses on the second mislynch. For example:

Day 1: 5 non-lynchpin VT’s, 1 lynchpin VT, 2 mafia unlynchers

If we mislynch a non-lynchpin VT on day 1, then day 2 is:

Day 2: 3 non-lynchpin VT’s, 1 lynchpin VT, 2 mafia unlynchers

So if we mislynch a second non-lynchpin VT on day 2, then town loses.

So it’s a good strategy here to identify which players are obvtown, and narrow down from that pool which players are more likely to have been chosen by scum to be the lynchpin.

- Volxen

I'm with town, so the chance of lynching scum back to back increases to %100, but lynchpin we have to guess. It doesnt matter who is obvtown anyways, as the lynchpin was selected pregame, yes? I think its counterintuitive to do it now, so lets just focus on scumhunting normally. Lynchpin is just a bonus and wifom potential in my eyes right now, so im going to play this like a normal game with one less townie.

[Donempire]

I just arrived

[Donempire]

Hi ceejay

VOTE: Not_Mafia
Why not jumpstart the discussion a bit and spice the game too? L-1

[Donempire]

If you admit he's probably not the lynchpin, why do we have this wagon again?

Thought you said this:

So fill me in on this, do we go for the lynchpin or the scum? I'm not familiar with this, so i think i'll be better off with a clear goal in mind.

If the lynchpin is obvious we go for them, but we shouldn't just hang townies for the sake of it. We should focus on scumhunting, and if all the scum randomly defends one person, then we hang that person. But we don't hang townies just on suspicion.

What made you change your mind from going scumhunting first? Its obvious we are pressuring NM because we suspect him of being mafia, its not random

[Donempire]

Gamma Emerald

Creature
Allomancer
Dongempire

ceejayvinoya
Apollo Khione

Not_Mafia

The Great Wall

Game should actually be pretty simple, leaning Apollo and Great Wall rn

Whats this all about?

[Donempire]

I am perfectly fine with scumhunting. However, discuussion of lynching him started well before NM posted, making it suspicious that there could be scumreads on him. Also, someone being unlikely to be lynchpin as compared to everyone else makes them a suboptimal lynch in general, because it lowers our chances of getting lucky and lynching the lynchpin.

I'd cry wifom, but i do agree we shouldnt go for the lynchpin anyways.
The great wall seems like a good spot to push still, especially since they post so infrequently for a 4 headed hydra. Their post also seems to be fluff, which i intend to dive into rn

[Donempire]

Why are we still discussing whether we aim for scum or lynchpin?

Because we want to figure it out effectively?
Honestly this type of posting makes me scumread you

This is actually important, since as my other head pointed out, two mislynches and we're done. Even if we want to scumhunt, we'd need to do this by searching for negative associations, so it's irrelevant to lock onto hunting for either -- we simply let the game progress and if we're convinced we found a lynchpin, we lynch there , and if we're convinced we found scum, lynch scum.

The other important factor to keep in mind here is the prior probability of a player to be chosen as lynchpin; early ML bait like presumably Not_Mafia are not going to be likely chosen lynchpins. The optimal lynch would be someone who has decent scum equity, and also decent lynchpin equity if town.

~A

Another useless post clogging the thread.

This post isnt really an usefull post either, is it? In actuality, i'm hindered in solving the game because of these mass posts, compared to great walls moderate tempo. I feel a powerwolf, especially with the dominance thing.

VOTE: Creature

[Donempire]

What do you feel about creatures post? Specifically about their frequency, and their content?

[Donempire]

Sure

[Donempire]

Sure

This is my best example for now: start here.

You can compare to my arguably best scumgame.

thanks, i'll read these later.
Now i gotta sleep, so dont expect a lot of posts for a while from me, new years and all

[Donempire]

2 days until day end

[Donempire]

I would like people to think about when the day started before they start hounding me

Just because you couldn't contribute to picking the lynchpin doesn't mean you can't be scum, Gamma. Only 1 person probably needed to confirm with the Moderator on that. If that's what you mean't, of course.

- Khione

That would be shitty modding if they did that. Honestly not giving extra time anyway was a bad move too

...

[Donempire]

And he's a good mod if he gave extra time for your enjoyment? Fuck that

[Donempire]

So i read 228 and 243. While i am leaning creature still, nothing would make me happier than a gamma lynch. I think instead of counterwagons, both deserve to get lynched. Im not voting gamma rn because of a quickhammer possibility.

[Donempire]

Happy New Years!

[Donempire]

Eh I guess #284 kind of sucks but the rest of his play seems Town

just because it's targeting Gamma?

Come on man

No

It’s waffly on your wagon. I would expect town to take a stance on both. It’s pretty clear this isn’t SvS between gamma and you. And if it’s TvT this is already lost.

So far not a lot to move this game along, so gonna defend my thought process.
I dont know if mafia have daychat. Domt care to check. Point is i see the feud between gamma and creature as staged. Not sure if its lynchpin-scum or just SvS trying to throw us off guard.

[Donempire]

This is why i shaded gamma without moving my vote from creature, i believe that we gain from both lynch either way. Call it waffly if you want

[Donempire]

VOTE: Dongempire

Explain?

I believe there must have scum on my wagon and I'm trying other alternatives so I don't stay on you and Gamma all day.

Why does there have to be scum on your wagon? It takes 5 people. We have seven townies. Only four have been on it I believe.

We actually have six and I definitely wouldn't vote myself, so all town would need to vote me in order to not have any scum in my wagon.

Very unlikely.

You had 3 votes total what the fuck are you on about? You're pretending as if you got lynched. There is a %66 possibility no scum is on your wagon.

[Donempire]

Okay, I'm having a change of heart

I think you and Gamma are town, so that leaves players like Apollo, Dong and Allomancer as bad interactions with my wagon.

I'm feeling better than ever with my vote.
We'll maybe have a rational discussion once you're done OMGUS'ing everyone on your wagon.

[Donempire]

VOTE: Dongempire

Explain?

I believe there must have scum on my wagon and I'm trying other alternatives so I don't stay on you and Gamma all day.

Why does there have to be scum on your wagon? It takes 5 people. We have seven townies. Only four have been on it I believe.

We actually have six and I definitely wouldn't vote myself, so all town would need to vote me in order to not have any scum in my wagon.

Very unlikely.

I suppose that’s actually fair. My brain wasn’t considering you a Townie >_>

It’s unsettling though, because as scum, I just drove a mislynch on Dong last game because he seemed like an easy target. You seem to be just going down the line of people that suspect you.

Hey, i was unfamiliar and gave up halway through that game. It doesnt count.
I tried to get myself lynched all day and still barely got through with it.

[Donempire]

Apollo/Creature team would be one hell of a ride. Dont think so right now, though. The wall is still a possibility with their distanced speech.

[Donempire]

Wait no its not even OMGUS, he just shaded everybody on his wagon and buzzed off
Why is he still not lynched?

[Donempire]

VOTE: Dongempire

Explain?

I believe there must have scum on my wagon and I'm trying other alternatives so I don't stay on you and Gamma all day.

Why does there have to be scum on your wagon? It takes 5 people. We have seven townies. Only four have been on it I believe.

We actually have six and I definitely wouldn't vote myself, so all town would need to vote me in order to not have any scum in my wagon.

Very unlikely.

You had 3 votes total what the fuck are you on about? You're pretending as if you got lynched. There is a %66 possibility no scum is on your wagon.

I got to actual four votes until Allomancer unvoted me because I told someone should do.

Okay
Doesnt change the fact that much tbh

[Donempire]

I think any game I'm heavily pressured as town I tend to get a pretty high postcount while the inverse happens when I'm scum.

Thought you said it was your playstyle, and it was NAI?

[Donempire]

1 vote is surely enough to put me to rest

[Donempire]

Dont see how its relevant

[Donempire]

So you are omgusing your wagon pushers, while trying to get a counterwagon on someone else.
Gammas wagon died. Your point is still moot as ever.

[Donempire]

@mod im going to be v/la until 6th of january.

[Donempire]

I threw that game. Stop bringing it up.
So why is preventing a quickhammer when we have days worth of discussion left a bad thing? I wanted to have a flawless lynch, and while i was fine with both lynches, no read is confirm read, and i waited if creature would post something that made me change my mind. More on that when i get on pc, a few hours from now.
NM isnt a fake read. At first i thought inactivity could be a plausible reason and tried pressuring him. He didnt budge, so i didnt push a dead end . Would you rather have me pinging someone every post that clearly doesnt give a fuck?
Give me 5 hours. I think i got something on my mind.

[Donempire]

yeah i feel pretty alright about this after reviewing

Make a case. Would give me something to go on aswell. You're empty.

[Donempire]

If you mean 593, i responded to it. What are you implying?

[Donempire]

The more i read into the debate between creature and the great wall, the more i am confused. He is flip floppy on the wall, but since its a hydra i suppose that is a given.

However one thing i dont get about you is this: If you are instantly suspicious of most people on your wagon as town due to previous experiences, why have you silenced your concern against me, dont vote GW and dont suspect allomancer? By my thought, the two person that pushed this wagon should be your priority, if what you say about your experience with scum on your wagon is to be believed.

So why let your wagon off the hook? If you are town, and all your past wagons had mostly scum in them, then why let us go? I understand you've been mainly concerned with responding to wall, but its mostly repeating the same sentences anyways, so i thought you'd give a damn about actually pressuring people you say would be scum.

[Donempire]

@Apollo what do you see in creature that makes him locktown in your eyes?

[Donempire]

Who do you suspect most? I'm assuming GW, and then who would you have as his scumpartner if so?

[Donempire]

If you mean 593, i responded to it. What are you implying?

Okay.
So why did you want a flawless lynch? What’s wrong with letting scum bus?

I just got out of a game that i thought i had practically solved. We lynched scum D1, so i thought we could go with PoE. But it was a really quick lynch, so i couldnt make reads off of it. Scum was someone i didnt suspect. Thats why.

[Donempire]

If you mean 593, i responded to it. What are you implying?

Okay.
So why did you want a flawless lynch? What’s wrong with letting scum bus?

I just got out of a game that i thought i had practically solved. We lynched scum D1, so i thought we could go with PoE. But it was a really quick lynch, so i couldnt make reads off of it. Scum was someone i didnt suspect. Thats why.

I also played a game fairly recently with a quick D1 lynch and that wagon was readable. Maybe actually try instead of throwing your hands up?

Whats the point of my original post compared to what you are saying?
I said that i want a flawless lynch and i want to examine everything i can to make sure we dont mislynch,
you say something unrelated. Now whats the point of insulting me there? Actually, whats wrong with trying to get a perfect lynch with a readable wagon and a scum lynch? Thats what im wondering.

[Donempire]

Press it, but know what you are even pressing. You are making unrelated points. My standart for a perfect lynch is a scum lynch with a readable wagon. Creature didnt have that if we lynched him right there and now.
I am not making excuses, but you are acting as if i do.
Same goes for you, i responded to your argument yet you keep pressing on unneeded and unnecessary details. Then when you dont get what you wanted as your answer, you make ridicilous posts. Just have a look at what you posted, please

[Donempire]

Creature didnt have that if we lynched him right there and now.

Am I still scum?

Right now, no, since i'm sure ruby is scum and i cant think of a meaniningfull association of him with you.

RR doesnt give a fuck about his posts, so that means he slipped up a lot. Its been a time coming.

[Donempire]

i'm pretty sure i had some lockscum read or something but i genuinely can't remember if it was apollo or the great wall

maybe both?

yeah i think it was probs GW? really i wasn't a fan of either of the hydras having the people that i can read very easily not posting (clem and auro)

not like that was some specific move at me though obviously

meh i'm somewhat willing to believe that TGW is town for now given auro's contributions. don't like wagons pushing creature but might be able to look past it

auro if you are town i need you to prioritize this game a little more so that i can know whether or not you're locktown

nm has decent scum equity actually

Maybe try to scumhunt? You know, that's what you're supposed to do? It's not helping anyone that half this town is inactive.

towny

yeah lynch this shit

look through his ISO and tell me that his reads are real (they're not)

What made you change your mind from going scumhunting first? Its obvious we are pressuring NM because we suspect him of being mafia, its not random

"it's obvious we suspect NM of being mafia" - never brings up NM again, never says any reason why he's scum. that's a fucking fake read

This post isnt really an usefull post either, is it? In actuality, i'm hindered in solving the game because of these mass posts, compared to great walls moderate tempo. I feel a powerwolf, especially with the dominance thing.

basically the only reason i can find why he thinks creature is scum, so lol

So i read 228 and 243. While i am leaning creature still, nothing would make me happier than a gamma lynch. I think instead of counterwagons, both deserve to get lynched. Im not voting gamma rn because of a quickhammer possibility.

"i'm leaning creature, but i would love a gamma lynch even more. that being said, i won't vote my top scumread, because... he could get quickhammered."

i mean i don't remember this kind of play being in his towngame, not that i actually read that lovers game that much

feel free to chime in anyone else who was in that game

i wonder if my slot actually might be lynchpin

that'd be sick

I threw that game. Stop bringing it up.

this is the first time i've brought it up so i don't know what you're on

and sorry but i'm gonna be bringing it up more to make my point

creature if you want me to help with this day not ending in your lynch you need to help me in actually sorting slots

what do you think of empire

how convinced are you on GE and if it's strongly what can you point me to that'll convince me

NM isnt a fake read. At first i thought inactivity could be a plausible reason and tried pressuring him. He didnt budge, so i didnt push a dead end . Would you rather have me pinging someone every post that clearly doesnt give a fuck?

could be a plausible reason for what?

he didn't budge? dude, if you think someone is scum and they don't answer any of your questions... that's not a fucking reason to stop pushing them.

The fact he admits to throwing that game is also horrible.

also i think this is a misinterpretation, i don't think he meant he intentionally did it, more of a "my play was akin to throwing the game"

i can't make other people be readable through just by posting myself

i can poke at them but they still need to actually fucking post, and guess what? that's not really happening.

{empire, nm, apollo, gamma} contains both scum.

i dropped the push on you because auro made some towny posts. it had nothing to do with the push on creature.

oh fuck off mate, im preparing a case. you all are too eager to jump on shit wagons, i need time to prepare myself. Just have some patience, instead of hopping onto the nearing wagon. Now, if you'll excuse me.

[Donempire]

jesus fucking christ why did i bother

[Donempire]

Well, that was a fiasco.

@mod can you spoiler 708? sorry for that

I normally don't change the content of a player's post unless it has broken tags or is an exact duplicate of another post (or unless it needs to be redacted due to a rules breach) — callforjudgement

So lets dive in. I cant make flavor text for this. I'm ill again.

Spoiler: zooweemama long

i'm pretty sure i had some lockscum read or something but i genuinely can't remember if it was apollo or the great wall

maybe both?

Nice shade throwing right as you enter the game. This kind of thing is awesome, and easy to read, and i love it. Thank you.

yeah i think it was probs GW? really i wasn't a fan of either of the hydras having the people that i can read very easily not posting (clem and auro)

not like that was some specific move at me though obviously

Okay. Why is this post posted? You gave nothing except said you suspected either of the hydras, then proceeded to not vote them. I know i cant get a meaningfull reply from you without putting in effort myself first, but there really is nothing to analyze here. You're just throwing shade. These two posts really stink.

nm has decent scum equity actually

Alright. Explain then. You're giving baseless reads and then getting away with not pressuring them. This will come up later.

Maybe try to scumhunt? You know, that's what you're supposed to do? It's not helping anyone that half this town is inactive.

towny

Same thing, different color. Literally. Townreading someone without explaining it is almost as bad as shading someone. Have a little respect for everyone else reading your posts.

yeah lynch this shit

look through his ISO and tell me that his reads are real (they're not)

What made you change your mind from going scumhunting first? Its obvious we are pressuring NM because we suspect him of being mafia, its not random

"it's obvious we suspect NM of being mafia" - never brings up NM again, never says any reason why he's scum. that's a fucking fake read

This post isnt really an usefull post either, is it? In actuality, i'm hindered in solving the game because of these mass posts, compared to great walls moderate tempo. I feel a powerwolf, especially with the dominance thing.

basically the only reason i can find why he thinks creature is scum, so lol

So i read 228 and 243. While i am leaning creature still, nothing would make me happier than a gamma lynch. I think instead of counterwagons, both deserve to get lynched. Im not voting gamma rn because of a quickhammer possibility.

"i'm leaning creature, but i would love a gamma lynch even more. that being said, i won't vote my top scumread, because... he could get quickhammered."

This post is actual trash. Let me get into it.
I didnt bring NM up again, because as i said, he didnt budge. If i continued to harrass him it would do nothing, and i wouldnt want to do that. Because i want to find scum. More on that later. Same reasoning applies for another post i'm going to reference, so this part is brief.
And about me on my scumread on creature, while it dissapated now, i had still conversed with him and tried to determine his alignment,
argued with, and gave my thoughts about his actions.

And your response to 284 is just as bland and useless. What point are you trying to make? Quickhammers dont help us at all, especially if NM does that, since then its NAI. I didnt want that, instead i wanted to reach a consensus and vote without random interference. How is that scummy? You didnt make a point there, you just put what i said in brackets. Very, very poor.

I threw that game. Stop bringing it up.

this is the first time i've brought it up so i don't know what you're on

and sorry but i'm gonna be bringing it up more to make my point

It wasnt directed at you but to anyone else who was in that game. I wasnt able to play that game very well, and it doesnt represent my meta as a whole.

creature if you want me to help with this day not ending in your lynch you need to help me in actually sorting slots

what do you think of empire

how convinced are you on GE and if it's strongly what can you point me to that'll convince me

Buddying creature are we? Like the intention, not the way you went about doing it. Which takes me to that you didnt genuinely care about your intention, because you're scum.
I dont really like that you dont try to sort through posts yourself and have creature do it for you. Especially since you just came in and should be reading and making deductions yourself, instead of posting irrelevant stuff that i mostly didnt respond to. You barely make a case or push anyone, yet you expect creature to do it for you. One scum point for ruby red.

NM isnt a fake read. At first i thought inactivity could be a plausible reason and tried pressuring him. He didnt budge, so i didnt push a dead end . Would you rather have me pinging someone every post that clearly doesnt give a fuck?

could be a plausible reason for what?

he didn't budge? dude, if you think someone is scum and they don't answer any of your questions... that's not a fucking reason to stop pushing them.

...for scumreading him? I didnt know NM's meta that well before this game, and truthfully still dont if he is normally active. At first i thought this was abnormal and tried to push him. Then i realized he wouldnt respond, and i backed off.
It is a reason. Why would i keep pushing someone who was deliberately avoiding playing the game and didnt answer anything i asked? At that point its a policy lynch. And you're taking things out of context as well, i had stopped scumreading him as soon as i realized he was doing this to anyone, simply not playing the game, and then i let off. I really dont get your point about NM.
So about your post 590... why dont you push NM? You think he has scum equity, yet you never did another post talking about him. How does this not apply to you when it comes around? In reality, i did more pushing of NM than you ever did. So its your turn now.

The fact he admits to throwing that game is also horrible.

also i think this is a misinterpretation, i don't think he meant he intentionally did it, more of a "my play was akin to throwing the game"

thank you

i can't make other people be readable through just by posting myself

i can poke at them but they still need to actually fucking post, and guess what? that's not really happening.

You do this after 2 pages of posts and enough content to analyze? You're just making excuses now, you could do anything you wanted with the material you had, yet you still rely on creature and the hydras to feed you reads. You're scum, theres no way around it, or you give less than 0 fucks about this game. I've made up my mind on what you are.

{empire, nm, apollo, gamma} contains both scum.

No explanations, no... nothing. Yet you say you contribute. Sure man, the only fake reads is the ones i have, of course, things you post without any thought are MUCH better.

In conclusion, i believe that either RR is holding back very much on actually analyzing the game, or he is scum and wants to be breastfed reads to get through this day once and for all.

This is the final vote of the day. I'm %100 sure about this, and i hope i was able to communicate this with the state i am.

VOTE: Ruby Red

[Donempire]

Yeah personal attacks on gamma and saying im shit, its obvious you are panicking. Just admit it red, 1 day left and you cant come up with a witty, let alone proper comeback? Know when to back down.

[Donempire]

Read rubys posts everyone, this isnt someone who wants to find scum but wants to deflect the attention immediatly. Its painfully obvious.

[Donempire]

@mod use my deadline extension

Looks like we still might make something out of this. Looking forward to NMs replacement

[Donempire]

You've given up even trying

[Donempire]

Ok

[Donempire]

That was for rubys 799

[Donempire]

She was panicking . It doesnt prove anything.

Ca n we get over these slips by now? Everyone knows they prove jackshit

[Donempire]

How drunk are you

[Donempire]

Also, just something I noticed, following 712 Dongempire's effort level dropped significantly.

It has.

I made my thoughts clear on ruby, she responded in a bland, shitty way that i can respond to, but will solve nothing. So i passed on it. Really, her response opened up more holes but im more invested in moving this game than circlejerking.

LW is drunk rambling, i didnt see his last posts but i'll check.

Hawk is null for me,

You only pop in to criticize my posts,

Apollo and Creature post frequently when they come, but nothing that i can move further.

Gamma is gone.

What should i have been doing again? I made my case, its your turn to recognize it. Lych ruby. The fact its this hard to lynch her compared to the wagons on Creature and Gamma tells that shes most likely mafia or lynchpin. So, your turn, town.

[Donempire]

We cant extend this day any further. Get off your asses and vote ruby for me?

[Donempire]

I'm up for that. Just as long as you actually follow through with my lead

[Donempire]

Ruby red is lynchpin.

[Donempire]

I dont see even mafia being this hard to lynch. Whatever he is, it is more beneficial for us to lynch him. Which if correct, means allo isnt scum. Alright, so a Gamma/Apollo team is looking really likely.
Allo is town. He is fairly new, and his mistakes are exaggarated. Probably at least, since i dont see ruby NOT being lynchpin in this.

[Donempire]

I... actually agree with Allo...

Your appeal to the lynchpin reads more like fear-mongering than analysis.

Nope. I know we cant change to an Apollo/Gamma lynch at this point, and i dont want to go into mylo with town blood in my hands. At this point, a ruby red lynch is not my priority, but its a much better lynch than allo.

Pedit lol

[Donempire]

Allo cant be lynchpin. Just take off your horse goggles and look for a momemt, hiw much resistance was there for an allo wagon? It practically formed in a fortnight. I've been trying to get this ruby lynch for half a week. Who seems more likely to be lynchpin in this moment?
You'll be lynching town that has only wifom potential to be lynchpin, while ruby red meets all criteria for that. Wake up.

[Donempire]

You are aware a fortnight is 2 weeks right

...no

[Donempire]

And you dont know what your point is. I WANT to lynch scum. Problem is, i CANT. As it stands, the two lead wagons are town. With less than 12 hours remaining, i cant possibly make the town change to you or gamma. My play here then us to lynch the lynchpin.

Allo isnt scum. Ruby probably isnt scum. Then what do we do? If im to follow your advice, i should park my vote in you as the only vote. Would that be any better?

No, there is no alternative. The wagons are made and we have to hurry. If someone uses their extension however, you can bet i'll come after you with all my strength.

[Donempire]

Well well. Look at that.
Its up to you, creature and wall. Either lynch the lynchpin, or let a town member die. Apollo just admitted his guilt so you have to sort it out and WIN already. We need all of town to coordinate if this is going to happen.

[Donempire]

Huh, you still dont get it do you? Doesnt matter. The 4 heads and creature will see things through. They have to, or we go to mylo for no reason.

Doesnt matter. My point is not that you missed me using my extension. I'll leave you to it to figure it out.

Good night. When you wake up, dont be surprised at the sight of a town victory.

[Donempire]

Didnt know you were creature and the great wall respectively.

[Donempire]

Sure, is this gonna be your biggest contribution?

[Donempire]

Creature please. You will be lynching town. We should be going for ruby here. Listen to reason

[Donempire]

Theres 1 hour left. Alo isnt here. Please, just listen to what i said.

[Donempire]

VOTE: Apollo Khione
Going to sleep, just checking in to vote.
Also, its interesting that GW wasnt killed. I wagered they'd be the obvious target.

[Donempire]

First off:

Extend Deadline

Second off: I guess "Lynching the Lynchpin" was a load of shit, right? Because you instead switch it up to me noe instead of sticking with Ruby.

VOTE: DongEmpire

We should have focused on scum from the get-go.

- Khione

You dont understand the fucking circumstances. I told you to extend the deadline one day ago. You held off on it. Thats why we lost a townie.

I didnt want to lynch in lynchpin suspects, yet i had to because we had no time to create another counterwagon. My play there is to then try to lynch the lynchpin, which was Ruby.

That is my only wincon in that position.

You say that as if its just a blink of the eye to change the wagon to scum. It might be, but

YOU

didnt extend the deadline,

YOU

forced us into a TvT wagon and

YOU

inevitably made the allo lynch happen.
I know who the scumteam is. Its just a matter of proving it thats left. I dont want to lynch Ruby now,

Because i dont have to anymore.

Now i lynch scum. Is that clear? I can give you a million posts of me saying i dont want to lynch the lynchpin, yet i had no choice.
Now take that vote off. Its embarrasing.

[Donempire]

VOTE: Apollo Khione
Going to sleep, just checking in to vote.
Also, its interesting that GW wasnt killed. I wagered they'd be the obvious target.

First you were 100% sure that Ruby was scum. Now you're saying that Ruby is the lynchpin. You can use the excuse before that you switched your vote because your vote on Ruby wasn't going to get him lynched and you wanted to move the game along, but voting for Apollo at the start of the second day? I don't like this at all, but there's not enough evidence for me to put a second vote on you because of what GW said. Speaking of what he said...

Read my post history thus far. It matches everything. I know, because i know what my agenda is right now and im playing to it. I dont need to explain any further.
Point being, i dont want to lynch town ruby, i was cornered and it was my only wincon in that position. You chose allo. That page is closed now. Now we lynch Apollo, who is undoubtibly scum.

[Donempire]

Who's Apollo Khione's scumbuddy?

~Auro

Hawk

[Donempire]

My play there is to then try to lynch the lynchpin, which was Ruby. That is my only wincon in that position.

Weren't you "100%" scumreading Ruby Red?

I'm kinda uncomfortable with how that seems to have progressed to "compromise lynchpin lynch" and now AK just for not extending the deadline.

Also I can see mild scum motivation in your wanting AK to use up the extension early -- I'll argue that the extension from his PoV (as he believed Allo was likely scum) was equally, if not more useful in D2 since this day matters a LOT in case D1 was a ML.

~Auro

I want to level with you.
His extension would've been much better D1 because we wouldnt have lynched a townie. The fact he was so hesitant to use it means he wanted to shut allo's casket shut and get a ML over with.
And reads change. I was %100 scumreading but with the amount of resistance she must be lynchpin. I dont want to lynch her because i dont want to lynch town. Thanks for coming to my TED talk. Am i understood?

I think Clem's lack of posting is a big red flag, I'll take time and properly evaluate that slot.

Dong, apologies if you've already stated this but - read on Gamma Emerald?

~Auro

None, i was scumreading him a bit a millenium ago but i gotta reread him now.

[Donempire]

And you dont know what your point is. I WANT to lynch scum. Problem is, i CANT. As it stands, the two lead wagons are town. With less than 12 hours remaining, i cant possibly make the town change to you or gamma. My play here then us to lynch the lynchpin.

Allo isnt scum. Ruby probably isnt scum. Then what do we do? If im to follow your advice, i should park my vote in you as the only vote. Would that be any better?

No, there is no alternative. The wagons are made and we have to hurry. If someone uses their extension however, you can bet i'll come after you with all my strength.

I... actually agree with Allo...

Your appeal to the lynchpin reads more like fear-mongering than analysis.

Nope. I know we cant change to an Apollo/Gamma lynch at this point, and i dont want to go into mylo with town blood in my hands. At this point, a ruby red lynch is not my priority, but its a much better lynch than allo.

Pedit lol

For everyones pleasure, i havent contradicted myself

[Donempire]

Why is this day extended you may wonder? Its to give apollo more time to wiggle out of his lynch. End paraghraph, close the book, Credits roll.

[Donempire]

@Ding you scumread me a bit? You were dead certain the team was me and Apollo yesterday? Why are you rebuking your past reads?

I scumread you a lot before, now i dont as much. I gave a bit of thought to it. I dont want to dwell on it further without giving post examples. Remind me if i forget.

[Donempire]

THATS CAUSE APOLLO WASNT FUCKING EXTENDING THE DAY

[Donempire]

You think you're clever? Let me hit you with this then:

ALLO
ISNT
FUCKING
LYNCHPIN
can you understand that?
Then you understand my whole reasoning.

[Donempire]

That was for ruby.

[Donempire]

@Ding you scumread me a bit? You were dead certain the team was me and Apollo yesterday? Why are you rebuking your past reads?

I scumread you a lot before, now i dont as much. I gave a bit of thought to it. I dont want to dwell on it further without giving post examples. Remind me if i forget.

My point here is that you said “a bit” when you were pretty confident before. That tells me you want to distance yourself from that read. I don’t really get why Town!you would do that.

I didnt realize that then sorry

[Donempire]

oh god

[Donempire]

alright, i dont want to lynch lynchpin.
i want to go for scum.
I think this is my 200000000000th post saying this.
So am i clear now?

[Donempire]

Why the heck do you bring up the idea that me saving my deadline vote is scummy? Are you fricken forgetting Allo had one too?

If he wanted to save himself he'd have used it. Walking into today with only hawk and Gamma having extensions, particularly if scum decided to kill one of them to not let us extend the deadline anymore? We'd be fucked right now.

- Khione

Allo was lynched precisely because he had an extension. Its his fault that he didnt use it to wiggle out of that. There is no comparing you to him.
I dont know why creature was killed. I think its to cast suspicion on the people with the remaining extensions,

HOWEVER,

i still believe most scum is within the people with extensions still remaining, so i dont want to cross them off the list, especially considering you used it just now.

[Donempire]

You already contradicted yourself by going for the Lynchpin anyway. Do you understand that?

This is a waste of time.

Lets play a game. There are two wagons. One is town and one is lynchpin. You have to hop on one wagon because there is no time to make another wagon and scum being scum wont use their extension.
Do you lynch the town or the lynchpin?
The facepalm emotes arent enough in this situation. Bring this up again and i will stop responding to you. Anyone with an atom of a braincell can understand this. Which makes you scum. Shut up and die already, so we can go to D3.

[Donempire]

Like really, you're just stalling and its so obvious. You wont wiggle out of this by OMGUS'ing. I stated my reasons a million times already and yet you jump between "DURR RUBY %100 SCUM??" and "YOU WERE LYNCHING LYNCHPIN WUT HAPPEN?" whenever i debunk the other one.
Just die please? Its been 1 hour since i've been up yet i have enough headache to last a week.

[Donempire]

I dont know why creature was killed. I think its to cast suspicion on the people with the remaining extensions, HOWEVER, i still believe most scum is within the people with extensions still remaining

You say this, and yet your major reason for voting Apollo Khione is his not having used the extension...

~A

thats for D1, not now

[Donempire]

im taking a break to clear off my head. You can circlejerk all you want.

[Donempire]

its not a sudden shift

Like i dont get it, why are you saying its a sudden shift, all my post history says i suspected apollo, what fucking kind of shift is there

[Donempire]

Until you explain that Auro, im not taking you seriously. My agenda so far has been uncontradictory and its this: Im stuck in a TvT wagon, i try to go for the lynchpin. It doesnt work, next day i lynch actual scum. Look at my post history, literally everything backs this up. There is no sudden shift.

[Donempire]

Maybe you forgot to mention that by "we" in "were all suspecting dong" are only you and apollo himself, which are done in OMGUS, so its scummy af.
Though cant say it matters that much, seeing as you are both scum and already know whats going on.

[Donempire]

Maybe you forgot to mention that by "we" in "were all suspecting dong" are only you and apollo himself, which are done in OMGUS, so its scummy af.
Though cant say it matters that much, seeing as you are both scum and already know whats going on.

Okay I shouldn't say that we're all suspecting you, but the majority of us were questioning your decisions and your vote. It does feel like you're tunnelling down this narrative you've created that involves you knowing with pretty good certainty who both scum are. This may just be how you play though.

If i hit something i think is worth pursuing, then i will pursue it. I have seen nothing that makes me reevaluate or question tunnelling the two of you so far. I like to think that i caught scum, so until anything meaningful comes that makes me more suspicious of someone else/less suspicious of you two then i see no reason to drop this line of voting.

[Donempire]

yeah it's dong
i read everything before asking, i just wanted to see how you see these events

You can drop the act now

[Donempire]

Dong, just answer why you think Ruby was lynchpin day 1, and why you think I'm Apollo's scumbuddy. This ain't it, chief

Sorry, just seeing this

Ruby was lynchpin because she got enormous resistance in her wagon and then a counterwagon was immediatly formed as soon as it was up and going. Which kind of makes me suspect mafia, but seeing she did little and most of it was apollo it makes me lean lynchpin. While her actions are scummy, an allo wagon coming out of the ground the moment fingers are pointed at ruby and allo getting lynched makes me believe she is a wincon, rather than just ordinary mafia. If it was a toe to toe battle between the two wagons, then i would be certain she was mafia. She still could be, but its unlikely compared to a lynchpin Ruby, so this is the truth im choosing to believe now.

And the reason why i think you are Apollo's scumbuddy...
I dont. The way you responded doesnt make any sense as scum, especially when Apollo is shitting bricks as i am accusing him. Nor do you make sense in a Ruby Red lynchpin scenario, seeing as you were the second vote and the second driving force naturally. I said that to get Auro off my back as i had to use my time sparingly. Oh and yeah, reaction test, got em, etcetera, it comes with the turf of WIFOM.
I iso'd you to make sure i wasnt making a mistake, yet you seem to be consistent all around. Though i felt that your post quality dropped after i accused you, it seemed to recover after a while. I dont know. I'm inclined to trust you and go with Apolloscum.
Searching for partners, i think we'll do best if we look at the Allo wagon. I can see both scum there. If we say Ruby isnt scum, then that leaves a GW/Apollo/Gamma as the possible remaining scum. Analyzing their behaviour and comparing their interactions, especially allo's with the other two should theoretically hand us the remaining scum. I'll try to do that tomorrow. Gotta sleep

[Donempire]

Yeah apollo
The other two is gamma and wall, rest of allos wagon basically

[Donempire]

Apollo is conf scum but ok

[Donempire]

Good one hawk. I never guessed i'd be wrong after this, but it doesnt matter. You got it right in the end

[Donempire]

This was a rollercoaster indeed. Sorry for letting you on hawk, i thought at least i'd let you have some sense of relief after trying this hard to hardcarry town. Although we lost, i believe you did the best out of everyone else and you couldve got scum if town was cooperating. Dont let it get you, this was a game that thrilled me start to finish, at least, until everyone went afk and there was a prod dodge every 12 hours, but ok that doesnt count.

I feel like the most fun part of the game was discussing it with Elsa and the mod in the dead thread. Knowing the context gives it much more meaning and they are just nice people to get along with imo. The game got stale by D3 so circlejerking in the dead thread was all we had.