Starcraft Mafia: 2 -- Game Over!

[Varsoon]

I'm with you on it probably being Mewtaph.

[Michael Scott]

From our Discord channel:

Volxen:

viewtopic.php?p=10683209#p10683209
Pint shades Jjh some more
viewtopic.php?p=10683916#p10683916
Jjh shades Pint some more (a lot of mutual shading/distancing between them)
viewtopic.php?p=10684623#p10684623
Creature had both Mewtaph and Jjh in his "can go" (be lynched) pile, so it makes sense that a Pint/Mewtaph/Jjh scumteam would view Creature as a good lynch.
viewtopic.php?p=10684624#p10684624
Creature called out {Michael Scott, Mewtaph, Jjh} as a scumteam, so he clearly had strong feelings about Mewtaph and Jjh being scum.
viewtopic.php?p=10689038#p10689038
Jjh shades both Mewtaph and Pint here -- calls the scumteam as Brass/Mewtaph/Pint
viewtopic.php?p=10689261#p10689261
Pint accuses us of trying to bus Jjh before he has even been flipped
viewtopic.php?p=10689266#p10689266
Pint admits he was on both the STW and creature mislynch wagon while shading us, and doesn't justify being on either wagon beyond saying "sorry" and that his biggest townreads are still alive. He still up to this point in the game never explained or justified why he was scumreading either STW or Creature or why he was on either of their wagons.

Volxen:

viewtopic.php?p=10689439#p10689439
viewtopic.php?p=10689444#p10689444
viewtopic.php?p=10689449#p10689449
viewtopic.php?p=10689455#p10689455
So on day one Mewtaph talks about "shredding his Taly townread", and then you call him out on why didn't he join the Creature wagon. He says he would have "hard defended Creature if Taly were still in that slot", and then you point out this is a direct contradiction of what he said previously on day one (that he was shredding his Taly townread).
He then uses this convienient excuse to justify 1) townreading Taly (and Creature by extension) and 2) Doing absolutely nothing on day two to stop the Creature wagon despite townreading Taly (I guess he took back his "shredding" of his Taly townread):

"Understand that read progression got my head nearly cut off so was pretty tentative to make any moves that would give scum any reason to throw shade on my slot.

The way that wagon formed wasn't good.

I can have thoughts out of thread, just because I only made a few posts on D2 doesn't mean that I ceased having thoughts during that time."

So basically he is claiming that on day two he reevaluated his read on Taly/Creature and came to the conclusion that the slot is town (so first he Townread Taly, then he shredded that townread, and apparently went back to townreading the slot again), but claims that he was having "thoughts out of the thread", and didn't want to share those thoughts or object to the Creature wagon because he took a lot of heat on day one and he didn't want to "make any moves that would give scum any reason to throw shade on my slot"
So basically, him not making any moves that could supposedly allow scum to shade him was more important than him stepping in to stop his townread (Creature) from getting lynched -- and this was after STW had already been mislynched on day one.
But he doesn't care, because him getting shaded was more of a concern to him than stopping a second mislynch.
A 100% scummy mindset.

Volxen:

viewtopic.php?p=10691082#p10691082
viewtopic.php?p=10691094#p10691094
This would also be a very easy fakeclaim from Mewtaph, because Alchemist had already claimed that he was a town Mutalisk that could move anywhere, but didn't because he thought it was pointless to do so.
So Mew knew Alch already claimed to have not have moved, and he knew from the playerlist that Alch was at the very bottom -- so it would just be easy for him to say that he "dragged Alch below" to explain why he was the second-to-last person at the bottom of the playerlist, right above Alch. Also notice how Mewtaph claims to be able to do everything Alchemist claimed to be able to do (move anywhere in the playerlist) plus more (drag a player with him) -- Alchemist's role seems more plausible here.


Volxen:

viewtopic.php?p=10693993#p10693993
Pint shades Jjh again, says we should lynch him rather than vig kill him. If he figures that Jjh is going down either way, this work out better for him because it gives him the opportunity to bus Jjh for towncredit. If Varsoon simply vig kills Jjh, Pint cannot benefit from it.
viewtopic.php?p=10694019#p10694019
Again Pint doubles down on this stance of suggesting lynching Jjh is better than having him vig killed.
viewtopic.php?p=10694029#p10694029
Pint tries to tie our alignment to Jjh's alignment, by suggesting that a Jjh scum flip proves that we are scum. So bussing Jjh is good for Pint because he 1) Seems Jjh as expendable anyways and 2) It helps him to try and scumpaint us
viewtopic.php?p=10694051#p10694051
Pint continues to push Jjh -- he clearly decided early on day 3 that he wanted to bus Jjh, but make it look like WE are the ones bussing Jjh rather than him.
viewtopic.php?p=10694076#p10694076
viewtopic.php?p=10694076#p10694076
So ProFlavor is supposedly one of Pint's top scumreads, but then he talks about our "next move "being a mislynch on ProFlavor. Why would he expect our "next move" to be to mislynch someone that he supposedly highly suspects of being scum?
viewtopic.php?p=10694404#p10694404
Pint places that vote which puts him as the third voter on the Jjh wagon. This is arguably the ideal place to be on the wagon -- right in the middle. Because Pint can try to frame us as driving the wagon to hard bus Jjh, and whoever the hammer voter was (in this case ProFlavor) ends up potentially looking bad -- like they are jumping on the wagon at the last moment to bus for towncredit.
I think this was Pint's long term plan, to scumpaint us as hard bussing Jjh because we were the ones to start the wagon -- and then he got really lucky when ProFlavor placed the hammer vote on Jjh, because it helped him to establish this narrative where one of {Michael Scott, ProFlavor} HAS to be one of Jjh's scumbuddies. So that's why Pint neither wanted to drive the wagon as the first voter nor be the hammer voter -- he purposefully wanted to be right smack in the middle of Jjh's wagon.
viewtopic.php?p=10694438#p10694438
Once again he tries to tie Mew's alignment to ProFlavor's alignment. First it was that they were both town on day one, but now he is entertaining that they could both be scum. But he is still maintaining that they are the same alignment. If he ever had to bus Mewtaph, or if Mewtaph simply got lynched, this would help him to setup a future ProFlavor mislynch via his line of reasoning that they have to be the same alignment.

- Volxen

[Mewtaph]

You're drawing the lines thick and clear.

VOTE: Michael Scott

This is how scum plays lylo. Low interaction. Pushing an agenda. Pushing easy options.

You need to go.

[Varsoon]

Not really, Mew.

[Varsoon]

Also, the fact I'm voting Pintu and scum haven't just quickhammered it indicates that Pintu's just scum, right?

[Mewtaph]

Give it 48 hours.

[Michael Scott]

You're drawing the lines thick and clear.

VOTE: Michael Scott

This is how scum plays lylo. Low interaction. Pushing an agenda. Pushing easy options.

You need to go.

Everyone is universally aware that there is one scum in {Michael Scott, Pint} and one scum in {Alchemist, Mewtaph}.

So Alchemist is 100% confirmed scum from town!Mewtaph's point of view

, but you vote for

US

? Town!Mewtaph would consider the possibility that we are simply wrong about you -- you HAVE, after all, done a ton of scummy/sketchy things throughout this entire game. Town!Mewtaph would consider the possibility of a Pint/Alchemist/Jjh scumteam and wouldn't vote for us.

You just hard claimed scum.

- Volxen

[Mewtaph]

Yeah, I voted for you. You're play comes from scum. I'm going to test a theory. You seem to be disturbed by this development, as expected.

[Mewtaph]

Yeah, I voted for you. You're play comes from scum. I'm going to test a theory. You seem to be disturbed by this development, as expected.

EBWOP
Your*

[Mewtaph]

Super quick to posture towards me being "confirmed" scum. If pinturicchio/Alchemist21 is the scum team then we're going to find out because I will be keeping my vote on you for a long duration of this day phase. It's not that team at this point though.

[Mewtaph]

So show me, do you want to make your partner between pinturicchio and Alchemist21 just a little bit more obvious for me?

[Michael Scott]

I think Mew's vote on us is a scumclaim. I was just starting to get paranoid of Alchemist21's D2+ posts, and I suppose thanks to you for clearing that up.

As far as "pushing an agenda in LyLo" goes, that's a terrible, terrible accusation and I think town!you would've been competent enough to know that; you fail to realize that us pushing the confirmed scum from our perspective IS what we *have* to do as town. "No interaction" when we're producing pages of 1v1 content against confirmed scum to convince the others to vote there, is also a bad accusation. Pushing easy options? Well, sucks for you you made it so easy in the first place, and I don't even know who you're even referring to between you and Pintu, who, as I'll remind you again, is confirmed scum to us. As a matter of fact, "Low interaction" and "pushing an agenda" is exactly what *you* have been doing this LyLo, so you did present a convincing scumcase... for yourself.

~Jimothy

[Michael Scott]

You seem to be disturbed by this development, as expected.

Nah, I'm relieved I don't have to be paranoid about Alchemist21 any more. We're just showing how what you did can't come from a town perspective.

~Jimothy

[Mewtaph]

That's convenient of you to say after you "casually" shit out a transcript of the entire 100+ pages of the game with post links that you definitely had no plans on sharing in the thread at all.

[Mewtaph]

I think you were well aware of the fact that I could have turned on you and that's why you shifted your attention away from me/Alch towards hammering on the simplest narrative to push today. But you've set it up, so it's unsurprising your confident that your plan will succeed in the end.

[Mewtaph]

"Low interaction" and "pushing an agenda" is exactly what *you* have been doing this LyLo, so you did present a convincing scumcase... for yourself.

It would make your life a lot easier if you could push this narrative, but you can't because you're the one pushing the agenda. You have to rely on transcripting the entire game to achieve what you want to reach with extreme conviction. When you shovel bullshit enough times, eventually it becomes true. That was your plan, wasn't it?

[Michael Scott]

Yeah, I voted for you. You're play comes from scum. I'm going to test a theory. You seem to be disturbed by this development, as expected.

I would only be "disturbed" by it if the scumteam were Pint/Alchemist/Jjh, but your scumclaim proves that isn't the case.

We voted for Pint right off the bat in lylo because we had

100% confirmation that he was scum

via ProFlavor's flip and the fact that a Mewtaph/Alchemist/Jjh scumteam was impossible (and the fact that Varsoon is confirmed town). You don't have that level of confirmation regarding our slot, because the only person who is 100% confirmed scum from town!Mewtaph's point of view is Alchemist.

If you were town you would literally be

gamethrowing

right now by voting for us instead of voting for the person who is 100% confirmed scum from your point of view (Alchemist), and I know that town!you wouldn't do that.

- Volxen

[Michael Scott]

I dunno, seems pretty simple to me.

Players A,B,C: We 100% know A is scum, 90% on B.
We push A. Saying we aren't solving for B,C (Here you/Alch) is false, that's what made us release the transcripts - to show that we indeed were solving between you the entire time.

I mean of course we thought you might turn on us - I figure optimal scumplay for you in this situation would've been to bus Pintu (since he's losing the 1v1 anyway) and play upon my paranoia of Alchemist being scum; you turning on us in this fashion I didn't expect but makes life easier.

[Michael Scott]

"Low interaction" and "pushing an agenda" is exactly what *you* have been doing this LyLo, so you did present a convincing scumcase... for yourself.

It would make your life a lot easier if you could push this narrative, but you can't because you're the one pushing the agenda. You have to rely on transcripting the entire game to achieve what you want to reach with extreme conviction. When you shovel bullshit enough times, eventually it becomes true. That was your plan, wasn't it?

Mew: "Michael Scott is scum for pushing easy options"
Also Mew: "You could push this narrative a lot easier, but you can't because agenda"

[Mewtaph]

You're failing to realise that two correct lynches on scum need to pass for town to win the game. This is just a straight fact that you've chosen to omit when constructing your perfect lylo narrative. There are two explanations for why you're playing this way as scum: you're hardbussing pinturicchio as scum/scum in which case the game is lost if I wait to act. Or the scenario is MS/Alchemist21 and I need to cover my backside before you win the game by default by outputting enough noise thread which you have shown you are more than capable of emitting extremely conclusion-focused "analysis" of previous pages.

[Mewtaph]

The thing is, you can't realise this because you're scum and need to restrict play in this way to achieve your scum victory condition. Oh well.

[Michael Scott]

Now, let's talk "agenda".

We nail the scumteam, are winning in a 1v1 with Pintu, so Mewtaph - who was lurking in the sidelines while hoping we'd lose 1v1 pops back when Varsoon appears and sides with us. In desperation, he votes for us "to test a theory", in a last-ditch attempt to shift the vote to us somehow.

Pedit: Obviously we know town needs two correct lynches. We already had one 100% correct lynch (Pintu), we were deliberating on the other - but now we're sure.

Also "noise" lol

[Mewtaph]

The theory is quite simple, the theory is simply that you are scum. Seems like a pretty sound theory to test with a vote in lylo, no? That's kind of what a vote in lylo is supposed to do. Soon it will be mechanically confirmed that you or I are scum due to lack of a quickhammer or the game will end. It's very simple. You making it out to be a mechanical "mistake" is what you need to push here so that when it does become clear that is the case, your plan is not completely ruined (ie. the lynch turns right back onto you).

[Michael Scott]

You're failing to realise that two correct lynches on scum need to pass for town to win the game. This is just a straight fact that you've chosen to omit when constructing your perfect lylo narrative. There are two explanations for why you're playing this way as scum: you're hardbussing pinturicchio as scum/scum in which case the game is lost if I wait to act. Or the scenario is MS/Alchemist21 and I need to cover my backside before you win the game by default by outputting enough noise thread which you have shown you are more than capable of emitting extremely conclusion-focused "analysis" of previous pages.

It's already been proven that there are two scum ground units and one scum air unit, so don't be ridiculous in suggesting a MS/Pint/Jjh scumteam. And town!you realistically

KNOWS

that the scumteam is not MS/Pint/Jjh, because if we were scum together with Pint we could have

VERY

easily pushed for your mislynch today. Like Alchemist pointed out earlier (see: post 3320), there would be no reason for Pint and us to try and bus each other today only to push for your mislynch tomorrow, when we could just go ahead and push for your mislynch today.

The only possible scumteam combinations from town!Mewtaph's perspective are MS/Alchemist/Jjh or Pint/Alchemist/Jjh. That's a 100% FACT.

- Volxen

[Mewtaph]

The only "confirmed" thing from my point of view is that there are three possible scum teams from my point of view. My vote should eliminate one of them (pinturicchio-Alchemist21) or end the game immediately if I am wrong.

Pint-Mew is the simplest narrative you could possibly create, and safely push on with ease.

As long as one of those two is town, it doesn't matter what happens as long as you fit the shoe on and get one town member securely locked into your palm with this narrative you're gleefully leaning into in lylo. The rest is irrelevant.

Nothing is "proven" yet until every possible scum team has been eliminated via absence of quickhammer after they've had plenty of time to prey on the opportunity.

I could try to lean into game-flavour solves but flavour game solves should never be and aren't 100% absolutes. Simple.