Merchant's Daughter [Endgame]


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Post Post #3336 (isolation #400) » Sun Feb 10, 2019 6:13 pm

Post by Ankamius »

In post 3333, RadiantCowbells wrote:
In post 3331, Ankamius wrote:honestly RC, the fact that our reads are aligning like this is making me a lot less paranoid of you
it really, really, really shouldn't
it's not enough to lock you town or anything, but it's enough for me to start trusting that my read was the wrong one over everyone else's
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Post Post #3340 (isolation #401) » Sun Feb 10, 2019 6:17 pm

Post by Ankamius »

honestly RC

we're both widely townread enough that worst case, we would be either intermission killed or dead at 3 pairs left

there's more than enough leeway to push all the much more scummy pairs out first
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Post Post #3345 (isolation #402) » Sun Feb 10, 2019 6:21 pm

Post by Ankamius »

In post 3342, RadiantCowbells wrote:same reason last game i powerlynched to townreads because sakura hana wanted it. and iddn't really push firebringers lynch even though i knew he was scum. it just doesn't matter in the end.
honestly RC

we're both widely townread enough that worst case, we would be either intermission killed or dead at 3 pairs left

there's more than enough leeway to push all the much more scummy pairs out first
why does it matter if we're dead at 3 pairs left
we don't give the town any more equity by being alive or dead at 3 pairs left if we're not an endgame pair
because I think both of us being there would be a lot better for town morale if we push to intermission at least, even at the worst case I think we'd have a good shot at weeding out a deepwolf later if needed
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Post Post #3352 (isolation #403) » Sun Feb 10, 2019 6:27 pm

Post by Ankamius »

In post 3344, RadiantCowbells wrote:if we're not then you'll paranoia kill me at final 6 100% of the time
RC I'm not actually as bad at the game as you usually see me

you stated that I shouldn't be less paranoid of you because we're melding, and yeah that's right in a vacuum

but in a situation where you're almost universally townread and I
independently
am reaching a lot of the same conclusions you are (and there's no evidence that you're specifically pushing them to match mine), that is a lot more telling. This is
almost exactly
how I townread you so easily in FO4 and specifically held on to it despite punreader trying to push me away from that read. Yeah you're a capable scum, but I don't think your specific scum style creates this kind of situation when you're planning on leaving immediately anyways
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Post Post #3354 (isolation #404) » Sun Feb 10, 2019 6:28 pm

Post by Ankamius »

In post 3347, RadiantCowbells wrote:there is no world

where you consider lynching a dann/nd or brie/moment pair in 4 way with me

you speed leave the game

that win equity is imaginary

and i don't need the heartbreak of trying to convince you that i'm town when it's never going to do anything
it depends a lot more on the situation and who the flipped scum are, actually

like I suspect that there's scum in the pool that is shading brie; if that's proven false, then I won't townread her for that anymore, etc.etc.
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Post Post #3363 (isolation #405) » Sun Feb 10, 2019 6:35 pm

Post by Ankamius »

In post 3356, RadiantCowbells wrote:like this isn't a read disagreement

this is a mechanically I think that our time of dying is inconsequential unless there's a world in which we don't die at all
I think I'd only paranoiakill you if you specifically refused to work with anybody for the whole game

otherwise I'd have to get a strong scumread to leave
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Post Post #3365 (isolation #406) » Sun Feb 10, 2019 6:36 pm

Post by Ankamius »

btw, in that reads list I posted earlier

strong scumread means a block lower than I have
anybody
in

so
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Post Post #3374 (isolation #407) » Sun Feb 10, 2019 6:40 pm

Post by Ankamius »

RC I'm not going to leave unless the rest of the town specifically wants it :S
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Post Post #3378 (isolation #408) » Sun Feb 10, 2019 6:43 pm

Post by Ankamius »

Krazy I really think you aren't helping here
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Post Post #3380 (isolation #409) » Sun Feb 10, 2019 6:43 pm

Post by Ankamius »

In post 3376, RadiantCowbells wrote:i think that trying to bring myself to endgame is tempting fate and i think that whether i go at start of dance 1 or some other point is irrelevant. i think my entire game makes complete sense in that approach.
what do I have to do to convince you I'm not going to leave without very good reason to?
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Post Post #3387 (isolation #410) » Sun Feb 10, 2019 6:48 pm

Post by Ankamius »

In post 3384, Krazy wrote:
In post 3378, Ankamius wrote:Krazy I really think you aren't helping here
I chose not to leave the queue despite RC pairing because I thought I could make a good faith effort to maybe play with him

and I chose not to replace out of the game because I yolo replaced out last time

But I do not know at this point why I would continue playing with RC with the way he plays

Maybe it's fine and I'm just pissed off over a disagreement in strategy

But I feel like he came in, bitched about pairings, yolo-paired to suicide, and is making it really fucking complicated for people who want to scumhunt to even do that when we don't even know how many lynches we get in first dance. I guess 1?

It's just really tilting
RC is making an attempt to help push the gamestate forward

yelling at him about the incident happening in the first place isn't going to get anybody anywhere
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Post Post #3390 (isolation #411) » Sun Feb 10, 2019 6:49 pm

Post by Ankamius »

and RC isn't being aggressive at you at all

idk if you're scum trying to stop us from reconciling or if this is just true emotion pouring out, but taking it out on him in the latter case isn't helping
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Post Post #3392 (isolation #412) » Sun Feb 10, 2019 6:51 pm

Post by Ankamius »

In post 3391, RadiantCowbells wrote:i would consider it phenomenally unsafe to have me as an endgame pairing in a game where ankamius was gonna tunnel me and ankamius was the optimal pair option in that position fmpov
In post 3363, Ankamius wrote:
In post 3356, RadiantCowbells wrote:like this isn't a read disagreement

this is a mechanically I think that our time of dying is inconsequential unless there's a world in which we don't die at all
I think I'd only paranoiakill you if you specifically refused to work with anybody for the whole game

otherwise I'd have to get a strong scumread to leave
In post 3374, Ankamius wrote:RC I'm not going to leave unless the rest of the town specifically wants it :S
In post 3380, Ankamius wrote:
In post 3376, RadiantCowbells wrote:i think that trying to bring myself to endgame is tempting fate and i think that whether i go at start of dance 1 or some other point is irrelevant. i think my entire game makes complete sense in that approach.
what do I have to do to convince you I'm not going to leave without very good reason to?
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Post Post #3396 (isolation #413) » Sun Feb 10, 2019 6:52 pm

Post by Ankamius »

In post 3394, PvtUrist wrote:
In post 3390, Ankamius wrote:and RC isn't being aggressive at you at all
Again, don't think Krazy ever implied this.
he didn't

but krazy being aggressive with him is unnecessary with that in mind
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Post Post #3403 (isolation #414) » Sun Feb 10, 2019 6:59 pm

Post by Ankamius »

RC am I getting through
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Post Post #3405 (isolation #415) » Sun Feb 10, 2019 7:03 pm

Post by Ankamius »

are you still certain I'm going to leave at 6p
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Post Post #3407 (isolation #416) » Sun Feb 10, 2019 7:06 pm

Post by Ankamius »

well

I tried at least
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Post Post #3409 (isolation #417) » Sun Feb 10, 2019 7:09 pm

Post by Ankamius »

I did, yes
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Post Post #3415 (isolation #418) » Sun Feb 10, 2019 8:53 pm

Post by Ankamius »

Let's just take things one step at a time for now and the OoG stuff can come in after the game is over

It's not impossible that we are in a situation where all this is completely unnecessary and it turns out we kill all 3 scum by the end of first dance or something

Just focus and let the two of us work through what we need to; RC is at least willing to talk to me in a private PT and that's hopefully a good sign that we will be able to get through the rest of the game without imploding
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Post Post #3425 (isolation #419) » Mon Feb 11, 2019 5:01 am

Post by Ankamius »

In post 3420, Taly wrote:
In post 3281, Moment wrote:I would, however, like to know in advance who SS is pairing with. I think he's town, but if people are going to lynch him anyways I would like him paired with a scummier Gent.
If you think
S_S
is town, then why are you OK with a lynch there?

also I'm skimming right now, but I'm a bit sad that people are continuing to say
Me+Krazy
is a bad pairing when I gave multiple opportunities for several people to case a reason, AND an alternative. I also outlined my reasoning for the pairing, and I don't think people have really engaged with that as much as they should, if they feel this doubtful.

I don't think people are being fair here. :(
Tbf the situation changed pretty drastically in the last 12 or so hours
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Post Post #3428 (isolation #420) » Mon Feb 11, 2019 5:50 am

Post by Ankamius »

Well no shit the situation is different

Suddenly it's a real possibility that my pair will survive longer than the start of dance 1, that possibility didn't exist until last night.
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Post Post #3429 (isolation #421) » Mon Feb 11, 2019 5:51 am

Post by Ankamius »

And no I think moment is townier than DT
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Post Post #3433 (isolation #422) » Mon Feb 11, 2019 6:09 am

Post by Ankamius »

In post 3430, Taly wrote:Explain the Moment townread?

Please work with me Ank. I'm getting worked up right now. :/
I believe his reads are coming from a good place, is really it. I don't get the sense that there's an agenda behind what he's been doing since it would be easier to force bad reads than it looks like he is doing here
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Post Post #3504 (isolation #423) » Mon Feb 11, 2019 7:38 am

Post by Ankamius »

Just call me the lamb
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Post Post #3512 (isolation #424) » Mon Feb 11, 2019 7:52 am

Post by Ankamius »

In post 3506, RadiantCowbells wrote:
In post 3504, Ankamius wrote:Just call me the lamb
Thoughts on SS moment?
Did you go into your SS townread at all? I don't remember seeing it and that's the main read we disagree on I think
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Post Post #3513 (isolation #425) » Mon Feb 11, 2019 7:52 am

Post by Ankamius »

To answer the question, I'd prefer a townread with Moment but he's the townread I'm most willing to compromise on too so
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Post Post #3516 (isolation #426) » Mon Feb 11, 2019 8:03 am

Post by Ankamius »

In post 3514, RadiantCowbells wrote:I don't actually wanna compromise on my moment townread
I think we had a miscommunication here somewhere

SS is not a townread but Moment is my townread I'd be most willing to pair with someone that's not one of my townreads
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Post Post #3517 (isolation #427) » Mon Feb 11, 2019 8:04 am

Post by Ankamius »

In post 3515, Taly wrote:I can't focus on gamesolving at the moment. I keep being told that I've been pocketed when I've both defended against that notion and wanted people to expand on an alternative.

I've even made it abundantly clear that pocketing was what I was trying to avoid. I don't feel like people have empathized with me on a cool-headed level, and I still feel that
Krazy
is genuine.

I'm getting angry and sad and it's clouding my judgment and I feel alone right now. :/

I need a breath and help.
I'm shelving it until second dance at least
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Post Post #3523 (isolation #428) » Mon Feb 11, 2019 8:22 am

Post by Ankamius »

In post 3518, RadiantCowbells wrote:I'm not in some immediate rush to kill your pairing
I'll reread SS when I get a chance and get back to you
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Post Post #3526 (isolation #429) » Mon Feb 11, 2019 8:51 am

Post by Ankamius »

In post 3524, Taly wrote:
In post 3517, Ankamius wrote: I'm shelving it until second dance at least
In post 3518, RadiantCowbells wrote:I'm not in some immediate rush to kill your pairing
+1 to both of you. There are advantages to a townread+suspected pair (it's a reason why I claimed my coin count).

But they disintegrate if doubt is placed around the pairing early on.

I'm listening to you guys and that I'm not locktowning
Krazy
, but I feel I currently have a well-reasoned townread there, and so my acceptance to him is valid.

So :) I hope you guys see my POV more here.
<3
I incorporate gamestate, reads, and playstyle into my decision here.

I don't want to speak anymore about this at this stage of the game.
Tbh once you made it clear you weren't locking Krazy town and were going to keep an eye on him, I haven't had much of any issue with it.

It's worth revisiting at some point but there's no real point to right now since I think it'll be easier to tell with him after some flips.
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Post Post #3544 (isolation #430) » Mon Feb 11, 2019 1:11 pm

Post by Ankamius »

In post 3543, Dr Worm wrote: SOMETHING_SHART
You okay there worm buddy?
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Post Post #3563 (isolation #431) » Mon Feb 11, 2019 4:09 pm

Post by Ankamius »

Yeah

Ankleballs best dance pair
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Post Post #3571 (isolation #432) » Mon Feb 11, 2019 5:31 pm

Post by Ankamius »

Good night Taly!!!
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Post Post #3583 (isolation #433) » Tue Feb 12, 2019 6:50 am

Post by Ankamius »

Moments partner is the only one that actually matters tbh
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Post Post #3584 (isolation #434) » Tue Feb 12, 2019 6:51 am

Post by Ankamius »

In post 3582, RadiantCowbells wrote:I keep forgetting gamma was in this game it's probably not a good sign
Gamma has done essentially nothing, I haven't really seen any attempts to get caught up either, it's mostly just fluff
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Post Post #3587 (isolation #435) » Tue Feb 12, 2019 7:13 am

Post by Ankamius »

In post 3585, DoubtingThomas wrote:is gamma a strong player?
I don't have much of an opinion, which means somewhere around average

Gamma doesn't carry games but she doesn't cause her faction to lose either.
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Post Post #3588 (isolation #436) » Tue Feb 12, 2019 7:14 am

Post by Ankamius »

In post 3586, DoubtingThomas wrote:
In post 3583, Ankamius wrote:Moments partner is the only one that actually matters tbh
wtf man i matter too
Other than moment pairing, I'm not seeing the rest of the unpaired lasting very long tbh
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Post Post #3591 (isolation #437) » Tue Feb 12, 2019 7:27 am

Post by Ankamius »

Well okay

That probably won't actually matter since you're a lot more likely to be removed for being less town than for being more scum.
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Post Post #3609 (isolation #438) » Tue Feb 12, 2019 8:48 am

Post by Ankamius »

I'm even more wary of Gamma now
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Post Post #3612 (isolation #439) » Tue Feb 12, 2019 8:51 am

Post by Ankamius »

Because Gammas recent posts aren't town lol
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Post Post #3614 (isolation #440) » Tue Feb 12, 2019 8:53 am

Post by Ankamius »

I actually am reading her recent posting as wanting to sabotage the Moment slot since he's starting to look like a potential threat if he gets a town enough partner. I think scum are reaching a position where they have to be a lot more bold about lessening the possibility as much as they can.
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Post Post #3626 (isolation #441) » Tue Feb 12, 2019 9:09 am

Post by Ankamius »

In post 3622, Nancy Drew 39 wrote:It really sucks that you and me, don’t have more coins. That’s the frustrating thing with this mechanic. So, we have strike to basically strike a balance btween getting the towniest pairings and also make sure no high coin getting gent, doesn’t yolofuck us basically. So Taly is 100% right about all 8 ladies making it to 1st dance, to prevent this from costing us the game.
Do you miss when I had the 8 coins
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Post Post #3628 (isolation #442) » Tue Feb 12, 2019 9:10 am

Post by Ankamius »

Don't answer that, it's inappropriate now that I look at it again

sorry
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Post Post #3630 (isolation #443) » Tue Feb 12, 2019 9:11 am

Post by Ankamius »

I never got around to reading SS

Rip
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Post Post #3634 (isolation #444) » Tue Feb 12, 2019 9:12 am

Post by Ankamius »

In post 3629, Gamma Emerald wrote:Honestly what the fuck do you people want because I've provided reads and tried to read what I could. If it's an engagement thing you can piss off because I'm not to blame for this game exploding.
No I'm scumreading your recent posting because it reads like you're trying to get the most mileage you can out of what little you can get so your team has less of a hill to climb later in the game
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Post Post #3642 (isolation #445) » Tue Feb 12, 2019 9:17 am

Post by Ankamius »

In post 3637, Gamma Emerald wrote:
In post 3634, Ankamius wrote:
In post 3629, Gamma Emerald wrote:Honestly what the fuck do you people want because I've provided reads and tried to read what I could. If it's an engagement thing you can piss off because I'm not to blame for this game exploding.
No I'm scumreading your recent posting because it reads like you're trying to get the most mileage you can out of what little you can get so your team has less of a hill to climb later in the game
It's called I'm trying to form reads after having to skip a ton of the game because you guys couldn't stop bickering for five minutes like a bunch of children.
You essentially called the slot most likely to be compromise lynched scum, and then took the last widely townread unpaired gent and said that you wanted to sort and potentially leave them.

You understand how that looks, right?
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Post Post #3655 (isolation #446) » Tue Feb 12, 2019 9:32 am

Post by Ankamius »

I wish I stole moment for myself now
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Post Post #3670 (isolation #447) » Tue Feb 12, 2019 10:03 am

Post by Ankamius »

In post 3657, Gamma Emerald wrote:
In post 3655, Ankamius wrote:I wish I stole moment for myself now
lol why?
Because I townread him when everyone else hadn't yet and it was a near guarantee we would work well together
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Post Post #3672 (isolation #448) » Tue Feb 12, 2019 10:03 am

Post by Ankamius »

Plus it would fix the problem we have currently
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Post Post #3682 (isolation #449) » Tue Feb 12, 2019 10:48 am

Post by Ankamius »

In post 3680, Gamma Emerald wrote:
In post 3672, Ankamius wrote:Plus it would fix the problem we have currently
...
Okay. What pairings do you want amongst the remaining gents and ladies given you're saying this?
I care who moment is paired with, but I don't have a strong enough townread on any of the remaining ladies to be comfortable with any of them pairing with him.

Every other pairing doesn't matter.
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Post Post #3700 (isolation #450) » Tue Feb 12, 2019 12:14 pm

Post by Ankamius »

In post 3693, Something_Smart wrote:Fun fact, Pink Ball said something earlier that made me think he might have been Alchemist :lol:

I'll be here later tonight if anyone wants to talk to me. I would like Krazy to take a moment and reflect on the possible reasons I might be playing differently from Excalibur, other than my alignment being different.

Interesting note: It seemed to me that in the past few days the public opinion on me has shifted significantly. Whether or not that's actually the case, the thread created that impression with multiple influential people pretty much simultaneously saying either they townread me or they were reevaluating their scumread on me. It's almost a foregone conclusion that scum would have expected me to be mislynched at some point in time, so I expected that scum might push back against me being townread.

The two people who have done this are Gamma and Krazy.
Am I naive for townreading this post

I kinda feel like this is the type of post I townread regardless of what alignment it comes from
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Post Post #3702 (isolation #451) » Tue Feb 12, 2019 12:18 pm

Post by Ankamius »

But am I naive for townreading that specific one
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Post Post #3704 (isolation #452) » Tue Feb 12, 2019 12:23 pm

Post by Ankamius »

Ok

That slot is redeeming for me then
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Post Post #3707 (isolation #453) » Tue Feb 12, 2019 12:37 pm

Post by Ankamius »

We have roughly 2 days Nancy
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Post Post #3743 (isolation #454) » Tue Feb 12, 2019 4:25 pm

Post by Ankamius »

I will read through SS' ISO momentarily
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Post Post #3744 (isolation #455) » Tue Feb 12, 2019 4:36 pm

Post by Ankamius »

Yup I agree with RC, this is town.

I don't see anyone playing the way he's approached this entire game from without having a plan to draw from, and the actual words he's putting out doesn't indicate that he is specifically pushing for any one outcome.

It makes a lot more sense as town than scum.
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Post Post #3745 (isolation #456) » Tue Feb 12, 2019 4:37 pm

Post by Ankamius »

I approve of Moment/S_S

I believe Urist should be left out.

The other 2 pairings I don't care either way.
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Post Post #3746 (isolation #457) » Tue Feb 12, 2019 4:42 pm

Post by Ankamius »

Allo/Gamma
Thomas/Brie

I feel like Thomas is a lot more likely to do whatever he wants with his tons of votes than Allo is
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Post Post #3749 (isolation #458) » Tue Feb 12, 2019 5:23 pm

Post by Ankamius »

Good night Taly

see you tomorrow
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Post Post #3769 (isolation #459) » Tue Feb 12, 2019 7:15 pm

Post by Ankamius »

In post 3743, Ankamius wrote:I will read through SS' ISO momentarily
In post 3744, Ankamius wrote:Yup I agree with RC, this is town.

I don't see anyone playing the way he's approached this entire game from without having a plan to draw from, and the actual words he's putting out doesn't indicate that he is specifically pushing for any one outcome.

It makes a lot more sense as town than scum.
Moment what do you think of this?
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Post Post #3813 (isolation #460) » Tue Feb 12, 2019 8:18 pm

Post by Ankamius »

RC let's just get through pre-dance and then try to mindmeld in our PT during first dance

I think no matter what pairings we have, something's going to be iffy about it
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Post Post #3853 (isolation #461) » Wed Feb 13, 2019 3:58 am

Post by Ankamius »

Because you are the one slot in this entire game that I never seem to notice is talking when you are talking

You have a good amount of posts but none of them are memorable.
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Post Post #3856 (isolation #462) » Wed Feb 13, 2019 4:12 am

Post by Ankamius »

Actually you know what

I think I would be happiest with a DT+SS pairing while Allo, Urist, and Gamma are all left out.
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Post Post #3857 (isolation #463) » Wed Feb 13, 2019 4:13 am

Post by Ankamius »

Easiest way to handle Gammas 6 coins and there isn't any gentlemen that really neeeeeeds to be kept around in the unpaired regardless
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Post Post #3859 (isolation #464) » Wed Feb 13, 2019 4:17 am

Post by Ankamius »

Vedith will make the game a shitshow the exact same way if he wants to regardless of whether we leave 1 person out or 3. I see that as a concern only if we are specifically planning on skipping first dance entirely.
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Post Post #3862 (isolation #465) » Wed Feb 13, 2019 4:23 am

Post by Ankamius »

Who's the scum that are paired in that way then.

You and fire, Pink Ball and Dr Worm are the only slots that fit that kind of mold (RC + Me are both widely townread so the only real difference in us pairing is that we don't get OTHER strong town pairings). Nancy, Taly, and Brie had pairings that were widely discussed for a long time now.

So either you are saying that scum are in those two pairings that I mentioned before, or you think scum have worked to pocket town... in which case I am already operating under that assumption and my reads are based on that, sooooooo
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Post Post #3863 (isolation #466) » Wed Feb 13, 2019 4:23 am

Post by Ankamius »

In post 3861, Vedith wrote:
In post 3859, Ankamius wrote:Vedith will make the game a shitshow the exact same way if he wants to regardless of whether we leave 1 person out or 3. I see that as a concern only if we are specifically planning on skipping first dance entirely.
I'll make it a shitshow regardless?
If you're going to make it a shitshow, it's impossible to stop without a full set of pairings and skipping first dance.
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Post Post #3865 (isolation #467) » Wed Feb 13, 2019 4:53 am

Post by Ankamius »

I'm not saying you will or will not

I'm saying that if you want to, there isn't really anything we can do to stop it other than full pairing and skipping the first dance entirely.
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Post Post #3885 (isolation #468) » Wed Feb 13, 2019 8:24 am

Post by Ankamius »

Why do you want Urist to have the votes
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Post Post #3892 (isolation #469) » Wed Feb 13, 2019 10:19 am

Post by Ankamius »

In post 3890, Krazy wrote:Ank what did you do to you beautiful avi? :o
stuff
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Post Post #3899 (isolation #470) » Wed Feb 13, 2019 10:30 am

Post by Ankamius »

In post 3894, Krazy wrote:
In post 3892, Ankamius wrote:stuff
well now you've piqued my curiosity :lol:
That's all I can say about it lol
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Post Post #3936 (isolation #471) » Wed Feb 13, 2019 11:24 am

Post by Ankamius »

RC don't respond to this yet
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Post Post #3942 (isolation #472) » Wed Feb 13, 2019 2:08 pm

Post by Ankamius »

You aren't going to reply to SS, Krazy?
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Post Post #3944 (isolation #473) » Wed Feb 13, 2019 2:13 pm

Post by Ankamius »

In post 3943, PvtUrist wrote:Krazy don't respond to this yet
Ok are you scum or just not understanding that there is a point to this?
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Post Post #3946 (isolation #474) » Wed Feb 13, 2019 2:16 pm

Post by Ankamius »

So is it A or B
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Post Post #3952 (isolation #475) » Wed Feb 13, 2019 2:29 pm

Post by Ankamius »

That's not a town response, Krazy.
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Post Post #3957 (isolation #476) » Wed Feb 13, 2019 2:37 pm

Post by Ankamius »

RC is locktown now

No touchy, not ever.
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Post Post #3964 (isolation #477) » Wed Feb 13, 2019 2:46 pm

Post by Ankamius »

In post 3958, PvtUrist wrote:
In post 3957, Ankamius wrote:RC is locktown now
You shall be held responsible it RC rolled scum
Can we seriously just leave this slot out?
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Post Post #3983 (isolation #478) » Wed Feb 13, 2019 3:39 pm

Post by Ankamius »

3934 has a much simpler flaw in it, Taly

Krazy not even humoring it is why I'm pretty certain he's town now
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Post Post #3985 (isolation #479) » Wed Feb 13, 2019 3:40 pm

Post by Ankamius »

Scum*

I've talked too much about townreads lately
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Post Post #3986 (isolation #480) » Wed Feb 13, 2019 3:41 pm

Post by Ankamius »

In post 3984, Dannflor wrote:
In post 3981, Taly wrote:someone shoot me

i didnt want to go strong on any reads in Pre-Dance or talk so much in the last 2 days of Pre-Dance and im violating both shamelessly

i need to hide ASAP
no you are good Taly <3

I wanted to echo that I really enjoy this playerlist and setup as well even though that was from your post 9 pages ago but whatever I just read it so that's what really counts

Also, I found your PvT case interesting, but it just kinda compounds the conundrum of
why
scum in his position would do that. Like, it seems like rather illogical play regardless of alignment, and imo town is more likely to just have games where they're obviously playing illogically or poorly.
With the way town have gone about this, any scum not pocketing is pretty much doomed this game
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Post Post #3990 (isolation #481) » Wed Feb 13, 2019 3:47 pm

Post by Ankamius »

In post 3987, Dannflor wrote:
In post 3986, Ankamius wrote:With the way town have gone about this, any scum not pocketing is pretty much doomed this game
I agree but I'm not sure the relation to my post
I'm just saying

Scum that aren't pocketing just need to not out their partners
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Post Post #3991 (isolation #482) » Wed Feb 13, 2019 3:47 pm

Post by Ankamius »

Krazy is a strong scumread, Taly
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Post Post #3993 (isolation #483) » Wed Feb 13, 2019 3:49 pm

Post by Ankamius »

I think ultimately it doesn't matter what we choose

I suspect that whoever his partners are, they're either Dannflor or not teaching endgame regardless of what happens
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Post Post #3995 (isolation #484) » Wed Feb 13, 2019 3:50 pm

Post by Ankamius »

Reaching

I hate my phone
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Post Post #3998 (isolation #485) » Wed Feb 13, 2019 3:52 pm

Post by Ankamius »

I'm probably going to get overruled

So I'll just say that I want Urist to flip sooner rather than later no matter what the pairings are
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Post Post #4003 (isolation #486) » Wed Feb 13, 2019 3:55 pm

Post by Ankamius »

I think you are town yes

I don't really care which, tbh, I just don't think urist will be a lot harder to lynch if matched with you or Gamma
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Post Post #4006 (isolation #487) » Wed Feb 13, 2019 3:57 pm

Post by Ankamius »

In post 4002, Nancy Drew 39 wrote:
In post 3993, Ankamius wrote:I think ultimately it doesn't matter what we choose

I suspect that whoever his partners are, they're either Dannflor or not teaching endgame regardless of what happens
Why is Dann his partner?
He's the only slot that makes sense to me as a second slot that night be pocketing town, it's not necessarily a scumread unless there's a point where there aren't very many other choices left
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Post Post #4008 (isolation #488) » Wed Feb 13, 2019 3:58 pm

Post by Ankamius »

In post 4001, PvtUrist wrote:I see you've been asking for reasons of why I'm being townread for like half of the game now.

So why the scumread on me, Ank?
Your actions a few pages ago is a mindset I see far more often from scum than town
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Post Post #4015 (isolation #489) » Wed Feb 13, 2019 4:02 pm

Post by Ankamius »

Btw RC on the offchance you were waiting for me, you're OK again

I mostly wanted to see what Krazy had to say before you responded to SS
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Post Post #4018 (isolation #490) » Wed Feb 13, 2019 4:03 pm

Post by Ankamius »

In post 4012, Nancy Drew 39 wrote:
In post 4006, Ankamius wrote:
In post 4002, Nancy Drew 39 wrote:
In post 3993, Ankamius wrote:I think ultimately it doesn't matter what we choose

I suspect that whoever his partners are, they're either Dannflor or not teaching endgame regardless of what happens
Why is Dann his partner?
He's the only slot that makes sense to me as a second slot that night be pocketing town, it's not necessarily a scumread unless there's a point where there aren't very many other choices left
Who is the first? Krazy?

Well, I look forward to our PT in any case.
Yes
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Post Post #4020 (isolation #491) » Wed Feb 13, 2019 4:03 pm

Post by Ankamius »

In post 4013, Taly wrote:blegh, i still think
krazy
confident town a good bit
ank


i also dont see scum-
krazy
following through with a vote on NLing First Dance because it doesnt benefit scum much at all

>: imma be sad if im pocketed this game

there is a time where im going to more critically evaluate
krazy
and now is not it

p-edit


can we not do the whole
"if X flips Y alignment, then im suspecting Z"
pre-any flip rn?

you guys talk about having strong townreads but then obviously generate paranoia from your lack of withholding non-constructive sentiments

k ty
Gamestate reads, Taly lol
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Post Post #4024 (isolation #492) » Wed Feb 13, 2019 4:05 pm

Post by Ankamius »

I'm kinda at the stage where my reads can't progress without flip feedback on my reads tbh
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Post Post #4037 (isolation #493) » Wed Feb 13, 2019 4:13 pm

Post by Ankamius »

In post 4027, Taly wrote:
i wrote a poem about my feelingz,
ankle


poor me

woe is me

im a frageel townie who is

so obvtown but not as accurate

destined to be in scummies pockets

(but honestly tho... this isnt inaccurate)
Krazy is something I'll specifically be looking to discuss with RC once predance starts

Like I've been having this really bad feeling about him coming into the game with an agenda and him outright saying he was willing to humor RC and I suiciding for "RC's plan" pinged like hell

It absolutely doesn't help my read that the time he tries to specifically tilt RC is when we are finally reconciling and getting out feet on the ground as dance partners, two of the slots that had a scumread on him and afaik the only slots with known scumreads on him.

I can't buy that he's town that easily when there's just something fundamentally off with how he's approached this game and continued throughout, I'm sorry.

I think you fell into his trap, because I think the coins were a diversion to set up scum being able to pocket themselves into parties with dance partners that are too town for the rest of town to lynch and will be willing to shield them.
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Post Post #4039 (isolation #494) » Wed Feb 13, 2019 4:14 pm

Post by Ankamius »

Yeah you two should pair
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Post Post #4044 (isolation #495) » Wed Feb 13, 2019 4:17 pm

Post by Ankamius »

Just a few hours ago
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Post Post #4047 (isolation #496) » Wed Feb 13, 2019 4:18 pm

Post by Ankamius »

That's it? That's what you have?
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Post Post #4052 (isolation #497) » Wed Feb 13, 2019 4:22 pm

Post by Ankamius »

The scenario I'm suspecting is you specifically not denying it so that SS has a much better chance of hanging on to that idea of forcing our pair to leave first
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Post Post #4056 (isolation #498) » Wed Feb 13, 2019 4:23 pm

Post by Ankamius »

And how am I supposed to interpret "Your suggestion is noted" if it's not humoring it?
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Post Post #4067 (isolation #499) » Wed Feb 13, 2019 4:29 pm

Post by Ankamius »

Just ask SS, Thomas
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Post Post #4071 (isolation #500) » Wed Feb 13, 2019 4:30 pm

Post by Ankamius »

In post 4065, Something_Smart wrote:
In post 4039, Ankamius wrote:Yeah you two should pair
How confident are you Thomas is town?
If I'm on a good wavelength, then Thomas is most likely town

Allo is more of a wildcard
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Post Post #4080 (isolation #501) » Wed Feb 13, 2019 4:38 pm

Post by Ankamius »

I mean I disagree with the reasoning behind it but I also think it barely matters in the first place
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Post Post #4096 (isolation #502) » Wed Feb 13, 2019 4:50 pm

Post by Ankamius »

I've got nothing else to say then tbh

I think I'll stop posting until I have a PT
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Post Post #4205 (isolation #503) » Wed Feb 13, 2019 6:10 pm

Post by Ankamius »

don't sheep him while he's alive

sheep us while we're alive
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Post Post #4239 (isolation #504) » Wed Feb 13, 2019 6:29 pm

Post by Ankamius »

In post 4235, Something_Smart wrote:
In post 4230, Nancy Drew 39 wrote:I’m honestly perplexed by this. You either agree with RC’s reads or you don’t. How does him being dead, have jack to do with anything?
I only partly agree with his reads, but that's irrelevant. What matters is that I trust that, if town, his reads are right. But I can't be sure that he's town until he's flipped, and I can't read him, and I have only limited faith in the ability of anyone to read him.

Ank townreading him does count for a fair amount. But I don't know enough about Ank's experience with him to say for sure that he couldn't fool her.
I think I have more games reading RC correctly than incorrectly, but I don't think I'm skilled enough at reading him to be worth blind-sheeping or anything tbh

like generally I think I would be able to pin down his alignment, but it could take quite a while
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Post Post #4243 (isolation #505) » Wed Feb 13, 2019 6:31 pm

Post by Ankamius »

just as an example, my last two times playing with RC before this game were

a. correctly locktowning him within 10-20 pages
b. not having really any read of him in the time he was in the game; his successor was a townread until the slot was confscummed though
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Post Post #4248 (isolation #506) » Wed Feb 13, 2019 6:34 pm

Post by Ankamius »

In post 4247, Gamma Emerald wrote:
In post 4243, Ankamius wrote:just as an example, my last two times playing with RC before this game were

a. correctly locktowning him within 10-20 pages
b. not having really any read of him in the time he was in the game; his successor was a townread until the slot was confscummed though
I assume b is Lynch the Wolves
a was fallout 4
b was lynch the wolves
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Post Post #4261 (isolation #507) » Wed Feb 13, 2019 6:43 pm

Post by Ankamius »

I think we move to first dance once FakeGod sees now

we'll see
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Post Post #4268 (isolation #508) » Wed Feb 13, 2019 6:49 pm

Post by Ankamius »

In post 4263, Pink Ball wrote:So Allomancer is left out. Could someone talented enough write a por about him?

Pretty happy with the pairings, we got this in the bag guys
I can try but I'm not going to be rhyming it or anything
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Post Post #4275 (isolation #509) » Wed Feb 13, 2019 6:52 pm

Post by Ankamius »

In post 4273, Something_Smart wrote:
In post 4262, Nancy Drew 39 wrote:who really cares what SS thinks right?
Not going to say it's not justified here, but this mentality has cost town many games.
I'd say this but I have my ways of being persuasive
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Post Post #5518 (isolation #510) » Wed Feb 20, 2019 7:15 pm

Post by Ankamius »

Guys chill

The gamestate was heavily stacked against town going into the second dance and tbh this is roughly what RC and I both predicted as soon as we saw the Urist IC

One thing nobody caught that stood out to me was Gamma suddenly becoming much more active and posting wildly different reads than everybody else, despite the fact that her loudest critic (me) was dead, her partner was suddenly proven town, and town were already pretty split in the beginning of the second dance. This immediately made me think that Urist was given the IC to give scum-Gamma the room to sow as much discord into the game as possible with a shield to protect what otherwise would have been scum in one of the sketchiest pairings.

Plus, if Gamma gets lynched first, that scumflip is reasonable evidence that the other two scum are probably in a fairly good spot, since if the scum weren't doing very well, then I suspect there would have been a lot more pushing on breaking up the townblock that was forming throughout first dance.
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Post Post #5520 (isolation #511) » Wed Feb 20, 2019 7:15 pm

Post by Ankamius »

And maybe someday I'll catch Nancy and be listened to >_>
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Post Post #5523 (isolation #512) » Wed Feb 20, 2019 7:19 pm

Post by Ankamius »

Oh, huh.

I think I had a dream that Nancy was scum in the first one iirc? That is surreal to think about
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Post Post #5526 (isolation #513) » Wed Feb 20, 2019 7:20 pm

Post by Ankamius »

One more note: I SPENT ALL THAT TIME WRITING A POEM FOR YOU FUCKS AND YOU SENT US FROM PREDANCE INTO INTERMISSION BEFORE I COULD POST IT

Ok that's all I got
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Post Post #5530 (isolation #514) » Wed Feb 20, 2019 7:22 pm

Post by Ankamius »

Uhhhhh

Welp
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Post Post #5539 (isolation #515) » Wed Feb 20, 2019 7:30 pm

Post by Ankamius »

duckling did you really dare to roll scum against me
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Post Post #5540 (isolation #516) » Wed Feb 20, 2019 7:31 pm

Post by Ankamius »

again
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Post Post #5545 (isolation #517) » Wed Feb 20, 2019 7:34 pm

Post by Ankamius »

eh

I'd say the setup should use a bit more tweaking, the setup was interesting and gave us a lot to try to work our heads around, but I'm not entirely sure it works in practice?
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Post Post #5547 (isolation #518) » Wed Feb 20, 2019 7:34 pm

Post by Ankamius »

it's definitely complicated enough that at least three different opinions were constantly at war with each other for how to play the setup though, so there's that for a plus on making an at least interesting setup
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Post Post #5549 (isolation #519) » Wed Feb 20, 2019 7:35 pm

Post by Ankamius »

In post 5546, Dannflor wrote:Blah, it doesn't feel great, but I'm not bent out of shape about it. I think I should have had the ability to recognize scum!Nancy replacement request or no replacement request and I just didn't play well enough.
if I'm in the game, just sheep my read :P
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Post Post #5557 (isolation #520) » Wed Feb 20, 2019 7:44 pm

Post by Ankamius »

I learned a lot from this game
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Post Post #5564 (isolation #521) » Wed Feb 20, 2019 7:58 pm

Post by Ankamius »

In post 5562, Dannflor wrote:I'm gonna go hit myself with a shovel for a while and think about what I've done

goodnight all
that's what I did when I got my PT and the first thing I saw was RC going essentially "HEY YOU IDIOT YOU'RE AN IDIOT"

and all I could say was "yeah I'm an idiot sorry"
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Post Post #5627 (isolation #522) » Thu Feb 21, 2019 5:02 am

Post by Ankamius »

So essentially this setup is a test of town's ability to scumhunt
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Post Post #5631 (isolation #523) » Thu Feb 21, 2019 5:07 am

Post by Ankamius »

In post 5628, Dannflor wrote:Moral of the story

Shoulda listened to Ank
Eh, I kinda feel like the wrong things would've been sheeped if I was sheeped

I was correct on nearly every read that I had reasonable confidence behind (I think Krazy was the only incorrect read in that category), but the reads I was less confident in were the ones I was more vocal about in the end, and those were the incorrect ones.
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Post Post #5635 (isolation #524) » Thu Feb 21, 2019 5:12 am

Post by Ankamius »

we focused so much on the coin mechanic and countering it that we left the door wide open for scum to pocket town to endgame.

That is the real threat of the setup since the only pairings that matter are the most townread ones. The rest will all be eliminated before them.
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Post Post #5638 (isolation #525) » Thu Feb 21, 2019 5:14 am

Post by Ankamius »

Scum 8 coin gentleman can instalynch the most town pairing and immediately nightkill the second most town pairing.

That is absolutely huge and is well worth a single scum life if the rest of scum aren't in a terrible spot already.
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Post Post #5639 (isolation #526) » Thu Feb 21, 2019 5:16 am

Post by Ankamius »

In post 5637, Firebringer wrote:
In post 5635, Ankamius wrote:we focused so much on the coin mechanic and countering it that we left the door wide open for scum to pocket town to endgame.

That is the real threat of the setup since the only pairings that matter are the most townread ones. The rest will all be eliminated before them.
and that would be a good critique of mech play. you get so focused on irrelevant thigns that you forget to focus on scum. fite me ank.
Well that's the problem

I stopped fighting the no lynch day 1 thing because I figured that trying to stop it would be more trouble than just scorched earthing the pairings that would be killed first dance first thing second dance

Then RC and I died and that path got completely forgotten as town immediately started fracturing at the start of second dance.

It's a damned if you do, damned if you don't, because just fighting the plan in of itself would've fractured town too, just earlier.
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Post Post #5640 (isolation #527) » Thu Feb 21, 2019 5:20 am

Post by Ankamius »

I mean... other than Vedith and Pink Ball leaving, that's essentially how it happened, but it still took 5-6 days to reach that result when it was the best play for town to eliminate them to help sort out the mess of associatives at the end of first dance.

Then it would've been a lot easier to root out the remaining scum in the remaining five pairs with 6-7 days left on the clock, which probably would have resulted in the same 4p lylo but at least there would've been a lot higher likelihood to catch Nancy along the way since she would have to out town significantly more pairings.
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Post Post #5642 (isolation #528) » Thu Feb 21, 2019 5:22 am

Post by Ankamius »

Oh the 9 to lynch cutoff was something I actually wasn't aware of

Then yes, coins outright do not matter.
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Post Post #5644 (isolation #529) » Thu Feb 21, 2019 5:23 am

Post by Ankamius »

I don't remember ever seeing it, Fire.
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Post Post #5647 (isolation #530) » Thu Feb 21, 2019 5:25 am

Post by Ankamius »

I was specifically referring to a 7-pairing lynch, Fire.
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Post Post #5649 (isolation #531) » Thu Feb 21, 2019 5:27 am

Post by Ankamius »

Well if it's still 9 to lynch at 14p then that solves the problem that I was worried about in both iterations

I only was so loud about me having 8 coins the first time around because I thought it would be effectively forcing a town loss to have a scum partner
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Post Post #5656 (isolation #532) » Thu Feb 21, 2019 5:39 am

Post by Ankamius »

Just remember Nancy, I've only ever pushed a scumread on you when you were scum. :P

I only let that go because of the replace out WIFOM and constantly being told by so many people that I was wrong about it, and by the time I let it go, you plugged up the hole that I was seeing scumyou from
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Post Post #5660 (isolation #533) » Thu Feb 21, 2019 5:43 am

Post by Ankamius »

I wasn't scumreading Allo like you were :P
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Post Post #5662 (isolation #534) » Thu Feb 21, 2019 5:44 am

Post by Ankamius »

Well don't make it too obvious or we are going to get banned
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Post Post #5666 (isolation #535) » Thu Feb 21, 2019 5:47 am

Post by Ankamius »

rude af

I'm death tunneling you next game JUST LIKE YOY PROMISED TO DO TO ME THIS GAME YOU BUTT
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Post Post #5668 (isolation #536) » Thu Feb 21, 2019 5:48 am

Post by Ankamius »

then take your tunnel like a champ
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Post Post #5674 (isolation #537) » Thu Feb 21, 2019 6:02 am

Post by Ankamius »

I wish I paired with moment :(
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Post Post #5679 (isolation #538) » Thu Feb 21, 2019 6:12 am

Post by Ankamius »

but you're a lady

lady and lady dance partners are not gucci
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Post Post #5682 (isolation #539) » Thu Feb 21, 2019 6:16 am

Post by Ankamius »

laws of the land, not by my hand

Being bi, but not good for the brand
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Post Post #5686 (isolation #540) » Thu Feb 21, 2019 6:33 am

Post by Ankamius »

That's risky, Nancy.

If I end up with a partner I can safely locktown, the game becomes white flag for you.
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Post Post #5689 (isolation #541) » Thu Feb 21, 2019 6:37 am

Post by Ankamius »

I don't think I've ever been called by my full name before
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Post Post #5694 (isolation #542) » Thu Feb 21, 2019 7:13 am

Post by Ankamius »

Adelbert Steiner + the worst + Nancy Drew 39 were scum in the first set
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Post Post #5703 (isolation #543) » Thu Feb 21, 2019 7:41 am

Post by Ankamius »

KRAZY DISCARD ME
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Post Post #5705 (isolation #544) » Thu Feb 21, 2019 7:42 am

Post by Ankamius »

You're peanut butter
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Post Post #5708 (isolation #545) » Thu Feb 21, 2019 8:33 am

Post by Ankamius »

The insinuations of that
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Post Post #5714 (isolation #546) » Thu Feb 21, 2019 10:55 am

Post by Ankamius »

Not even a day old and it already hasn't aged well

What a world we live in
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Post Post #5725 (isolation #547) » Thu Feb 21, 2019 12:08 pm

Post by Ankamius »

In post 5719, Krazy wrote:Unfortunately one frustration of this setup is that read accuracy based on pt interactions cannot be evaluated... really the pts in that regard almost exclusively help scum in pocketing attempts. If you say Nancy is town based on PT interactions, then it is hard to evaluate that objectively. I notice that the town pts tended to have a lot more shitposting, or just nothing, whereas all the scum were highly motivated to appear solvey. I guess the PTs are exclusively there to accelerate and amplify scum pocketing attempts. I think Witches Ball went more smoothly because there was no need to continue solving after the PTs were created.
Tbf

If RC wasn't so sure we were going to be NKed, we probably would have taken the PT much more seriously

I love abusing neighborhoods when I have an opportunity to
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Post Post #5731 (isolation #548) » Thu Feb 21, 2019 1:33 pm

Post by Ankamius »

I am the police now

Hands behind your head FB
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Post Post #5735 (isolation #549) » Thu Feb 21, 2019 1:41 pm

Post by Ankamius »

Put your hands behind your head PB
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Post Post #5738 (isolation #550) » Thu Feb 21, 2019 1:50 pm

Post by Ankamius »

All of you are going downtown with me, watch your head
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Post Post #5748 (isolation #551) » Thu Feb 21, 2019 4:24 pm

Post by Ankamius »

I wish I could be like that
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Post Post #5754 (isolation #552) » Sun Feb 24, 2019 12:21 am

Post by Ankamius »

DT is duckling?
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Post Post #5782 (isolation #553) » Mon Feb 25, 2019 12:53 am

Post by Ankamius »

Oh god this is still going
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Post Post #5794 (isolation #554) » Tue Feb 26, 2019 10:58 am

Post by Ankamius »

Nancy I think you need to take a break from mafia for a while if you are getting this worked up over it.
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Post Post #5802 (isolation #555) » Tue Feb 26, 2019 12:23 pm

Post by Ankamius »

In post 5741, FakeGod wrote:
In post 5726, Firebringer wrote:What even is this
Nancy is angry because she believes that I should have asked her for an explanation in private, and not damage her public image like I did through a public inquiry. In addition, she believes that DT should not have told everyone that she has been banned for similar behavior before, and I shouldn't have approved him afterwards.

I think her argument makes sense. She doesn't want people to know that she is a repeat offender, and she doesn't want her public image to suffer from this. I am of belief that you should always meet your mistakes head on, but I understand her position. Therefore, I apologized.
But... he did.
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