Anime U-Pick: King Size [SEASON FINALE...?]


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Post Post #1250 (ISO) » Fri Feb 15, 2019 4:37 pm

Post by Reasonably Psychotic »

Operation be so useless and garner just enough suspicious to never be shot at successful.

Drixx:
In post 1057, singletonking wrote:Ok now only 10 pages behind

This game needs some direction so
VOTE: Drixx


I don't think Gamma is scum here; what are the cases on him so far?
In post 1072, Torque wrote:
VOTE: Drixx

In post 1076, Gamma Emerald wrote:VOTE: Drixx
post reads or die, that's where I'm at with you rn
In post 1078, Spike and Jet wrote:VOTE: drixx
you have the lowest post count in the game you dont get to call others inactive
Fulfilling your last willand testament now.

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Post Post #1251 (ISO) » Fri Feb 15, 2019 4:53 pm

Post by Almost50 »

3 of those 4 were ended up on Vedith. Only singleton stayed on Drixx. I can vote the "claimed" Miller (as it obviously could be a scum faking to nullify the Cop on them)

Q: What channel(s) was Drixx in and what did he say in them? I prefer the answer to come from someone who had already declared being a member to certain channels so you don't need to out the whole list of channel members.

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Post Post #1252 (ISO) » Fri Feb 15, 2019 4:55 pm

Post by Gamma Emerald »

I have learned to be useful with what I've got! Fear my power!
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Post Post #1253 (ISO) » Fri Feb 15, 2019 4:58 pm

Post by Reasonably Psychotic »

In post 1251, Almost50 wrote:3 of those 4 were ended up on Vedith. Only singleton stayed on Drixx. I can vote the "claimed" Miller (as it obviously could be a scum faking to nullify the Cop on them)

Q: What channel(s) was Drixx in and what did he say in them? I prefer the answer to come from someone who had already declared being a member to certain channels so you don't need to out the whole list of channel members.
Remember how I said A50 was town? More evidence.

Something I should have said yesterday before end of day but was too dumb to remember: Every night, right before the day start, everyone should be sharing all the information they want publicly available/all the conclusions & thoughts they've had, to maximize the contribution you can make. Discussion before the end of the night is find, but given the understandable fear that scum are lurking in channels, information shared should be restricted to things you're okay with scum knowing.

On a (sorta) related note, everyone should note that scum *do not* have day talk, unless they have an encrypter. Keep both the possibility of coordinated scum action and specifically uncoordinated action in mind until an encrypter flips; that is, do not assume scum are coordinating during the day.

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Post Post #1254 (ISO) » Fri Feb 15, 2019 5:06 pm

Post by Almost50 »

@Yukiteru: I have no idea why the bolded makes me town, but I'll take it all the same. :lol:

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Post Post #1255 (ISO) » Fri Feb 15, 2019 5:09 pm

Post by Dunnstral »

I went back to look at an old anime u-pick: Mafia did not have day talk when it wasn't said in the main thread, so RP is probably right
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Post Post #1256 (ISO) » Fri Feb 15, 2019 5:09 pm

Post by Reasonably Psychotic »

In post 1254, Almost50 wrote:@Yukiteru: I have no idea why the bolded makes me town, but I'll take it all the same. :lol:
Just a pretty clear town sentiment, and something I should have asked given my knowledge of Drixx's tendency to use hoods as safe repositories of information in the event of his death.

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Post Post #1257 (ISO) » Fri Feb 15, 2019 5:52 pm

Post by Reasonably Psychotic »

Let's do some freeform stream of consciousness type review of BNL's play, instead of that post by post bullshit I tend to do, way too much work and tags and

Significant facts known about BNL/BNL's role: Mastina has claimed to be "informed" about BNL's alignment, BNL has claimed miller, and specifically stated that he "investigates unfavorably" to alignment checks, which should mean that trackers and such will return true results on his slot.

Enters thread with the miller claim and votes dunnstral, questions mello the townread they consider giving dunnstral(valid question), townreads clemency based on the way he claimed, didn't dodge my question about his miller but asked for elaboration, scumreads Morality based on entrance, then questions morality questioning his miller claim, notes difference between NxM's posting and expected posting, doesn't find them verbose enough/as willing to explain their reads as town!them, but admits no knowledge of scum!nxm, declares strict townreads on clemency, dunnstral, torque, C&Y, and gamma, questions vedith wagon(which is 3/5 comprised of his town reads, questioning is just asking for information so probably nai?),walks back scumread of morality, explains belief that an entrance based off what someone else has said is scummy(need to check all other players entrances to see if he should have also suspected others for the same reason), also suspected him because the timing of his miller commentary felt like "overjustification"
(ask more?)
, and starts to fear it's a TvT
(why? no reason given for the fear, just an expression of uncertainty that they are scum(which is pretty shitty given that they were willing to vote them off basically nothing, and morality wasn't at risk of being lynched....)
so unvotes, questions mastina on claimed scumread of vedith and pink ball without willingness to vote them, then doubts that voting mastina is a good idea(after people start voting her), explains dunnstral townread goes back to (a suggestion that A50 could just as easily be scum explaining lurking in channels as town trying to prevent town from being stupid as they are inclined to do),notes a decision to ignore my request to confirm or deny mastina's(at this point abandoned) mason claim with him because of a concern that it unnecessarily gives scum information,moves morality to townlead from null(I guess?) based on , agrees with mastina with regards to wisdoms posting being lackluster, disagrees about kokichi head, declares a sheep of townreads on S&J for creatures meta(when in fact people were SCUMREADING S&J for creatures meta),
is a strict "not scum" sort of reads list, elaboration would be nice,
dislikes Drixx, finds Pink Ball more likely town than scum, but doesn't have much an opinion of Vedith or PB, but warns people of voting Vedith because he's always weird, agrees with S&J about fluffiness of my posts, expresses extra dislike of Drixx for disappearing after responding to his post, votes Drixx(starts the push that leads to 4 quick votes), and thinks gamma is unlikely to be scum, asks for cases, indicating a weakness in terms of certainty in his previous list(which showed gamma as not a possible lynch), finds NxM scummy for saying it's fine to lynch Vedith even if he's town(fair, but he WAS defending scum), says Toog's claimed role of dying to any targeting effect N2 seems town(I mean, it's definitely not a scum role, but I don't see it as being outside the realm of possibility for a scum fake claim), finds Drixx not staying and engaging even though he claimed to be "lost" to be scummy, refuses to vote Gamma or Mastina, floats voting NxM, admits to not knowing why they're townreading mastina besides thinking posts were fairly towny
(elaborate?> what makes the posts town?)
, questioned NxM about their assumption that Mastina was lying about NxM's scum meta, rather than just being wrong, questions PB calling gamma's vote a scumclaim and calls vedith's role town, asks for case on mastina, calls out a clear problem with scum!Vedith's claim(if no day talk, almost certainly town indicative...if day talk, NAI), thinks I am possible scum for asking Vedith details about how their role functions(One of which, had they answered, would have given the flipped town doctor STRONG evidence that they needed to counterclaim(which you totally did preemptively but we were short on time so I forgive you Drixx), expresses a SUPER strong townread of gamma, and that mastina is less of a townread than gamma at this point
(why?)


@BNL: Please respond to the concerns that are bolded/in a larger font. Most notably, please elaborate on how your reads list thingie was constructed, and how people so easily moved onto/off it, so I can know whether or not your reads actually mean anything, as well as your gamma read and where the strength in it comes from.

Overall reads like town I would say. No internal inconsistencies, except for the weird decision to unvote morality with no intentions of voting elsewhere/they were not under pressure/with no reason why they had suddenly stopped being a suspect.

Mastina+BnL are extremely unlikely to be scum together.

(I apologize for the disgusting mess of a post I don't think I'll ever do this again it's basically unreadable).

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Post Post #1258 (ISO) » Fri Feb 15, 2019 6:04 pm

Post by Toogeloo »

This is the current list of known users in Channel 5. Vedith/SSBF scumflip caused some users in the channel to claim it to be compromised, but very little has been disclosed in the channel as is.

Chito and Yurri
Near x Mello
Robert2424
Toogeloo
Vedith / SSBF


If RP is correct that Scum don't have day chat, assuming there are no other scum in Channel 5, then it's likely that anything said in that channel never made it to the remaining scum.
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Post Post #1259 (ISO) » Fri Feb 15, 2019 6:11 pm

Post by Dunnstral »

In post 1156, Drixx wrote:
In post 1152, Gamma Emerald wrote:
In post 1130, singletonking wrote:Vedith role seems town
Agreed.
I have reason to doubt Vedith’s claim. It’s possible, but if he’s being honest, be scared of what kind of setup needs my role /and/ that role.

As for Cerb’s questions... that’s NAI. There’s no world where Cerb doesn’t ask those questions, regardless of alignment.


Given that I’m counterclaiming a ramping doctor role, you all should definitely look at the shit wagon that tried to go on me 24 hours ago after I’m dead.

I would prefer Martina but that’s not gonna till I don’t think so...

VOTE: Vedith
Probably the reason Drixx died
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Post Post #1260 (ISO) » Fri Feb 15, 2019 6:17 pm

Post by Reasonably Psychotic »

In post 1258, Toogeloo wrote:This is the current list of known users in Channel 5. Vedith/SSBF scumflip caused some users in the channel to claim it to be compromised, but very little has been disclosed in the channel as is.

Chito and Yurri
Near x Mello
Robert2424
Toogeloo
Vedith / SSBF


If RP is correct that Scum don't have day chat, assuming there are no other scum in Channel 5, then it's likely that anything said in that channel never made it to the remaining scum.
I mean, Vediths role includes this line: "- You have [REDACTED] as your fellow Copystrikers. You all share a Factional PT where you can talk with your teammates during nights and pregame.
Your Factional PT is locked during day phases.
"

So, it is explicitly known that scum can not use their factional PT to communicate barring another role that allows it.
In post 1259, Dunnstral wrote:
In post 1156, Drixx wrote:
In post 1152, Gamma Emerald wrote:
In post 1130, singletonking wrote:Vedith role seems town
Agreed.
I have reason to doubt Vedith’s claim. It’s possible, but if he’s being honest, be scared of what kind of setup needs my role /and/ that role.

As for Cerb’s questions... that’s NAI. There’s no world where Cerb doesn’t ask those questions, regardless of alignment.


Given that I’m counterclaiming a ramping doctor role, you all should definitely look at the shit wagon that tried to go on me 24 hours ago after I’m dead.

I would prefer Martina but that’s not gonna till I don’t think so...

VOTE: Vedith
Probably the reason Drixx died
Yeah. :(I don't think it was necessary, but I do understand why he did it.

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Post Post #1261 (ISO) » Fri Feb 15, 2019 7:11 pm

Post by mastina »

Btw my channel was incredibly active last night, got lots of content hashed out.

My current readslist:
Torque
Spike and Jet
Asking for a friend/Pink Ball
Clemency
Elena Fisher
Chito and Yuuri
singletonking
Gamma Emerald
Morality
Robert2424
Joan of Arc
Dunnstral
Almost50
Near x Mello
Toogeloo
Reasonably Psychotic

VOTE: Reasonably Psychotic.

Not sure where to begin on neighborhood content, but if not Reasonably Psychotic, best vote is Near/Mello (since it's easy enough to test Toogeloo's fragile-N2 claim).
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Post Post #1262 (ISO) » Fri Feb 15, 2019 7:15 pm

Post by mastina »

Also.
In post 1258, Toogeloo wrote:Chito and Yurri
Near x Mello
Robert2424
Toogeloo
Vedith / SSBF
Literally the only member of that channel I wouldn't lynch is Chito/Yuuri. Wouldn't lynch Robert except as a last-resort, but I would because he's one of those "just...kinda......
there
" reads which usually contain
some
scum, thus willingness to do so. (So basically, not a scumread, but not untouchable, either.)
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Post Post #1263 (ISO) » Fri Feb 15, 2019 7:17 pm

Post by Gamma Emerald »

Why is Near X Mello scum?
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Post Post #1264 (ISO) » Fri Feb 15, 2019 7:27 pm

Post by mastina »

To give some thoughts:
hard-spews many players. It spews Toogeloo as a scum partner to me (I got disagreement there), spews BNL/singleton as town, weakly Joan as town (not a strong as BNL/singleton town), and weakly Reasonably Psychotic as scum (not as strongly as Toogeloo).

hard-clears Almost50 as town (whoops, forgot to move him up on my readslist :oops: ), and is blatantly scum bussing.

General consensus is that is incredibly towndriven, especially everyone from Drixx and earlier. The one name looking like a bus is Near/Mello. We did some more math/debating on VCA beyond that, with my analysis differing from Torque's; my thought was scum in the lesser, more vanityesque wagons, more than on the counterwagon. Or more specifically, my thought was "if you combine identically-sized wagons--including not voting--you get wagons sized at six, and thar be scum", pretty much.

For instance, in VC 11:
TWOWAGONS - 6 (Toogeloo, Pink Ball, Elena Fisher, Dunnstral, singletonking, Reasonably Psychotic)
^I said 1-2 scum in there, with Pink Ball as hard town and singletonking as decently town.

Also, was blatantly an attempt from Toogeloo to save his scumbuddy.

Went into some details on Reasonably Psychotic beyond that, but for now, want to hold back on those somewhat.

As a start.
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Post Post #1265 (ISO) » Fri Feb 15, 2019 7:28 pm

Post by mastina »

In post 1263, Gamma Emerald wrote:Why is Near X Mello scum?
Aside from this being their scumplay?
Their play is blatantly that of a Vedith scumbuddy.
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Post Post #1266 (ISO) » Fri Feb 15, 2019 7:30 pm

Post by mastina »

Torque
Spike and Jet
Asking for a friend/Pink Ball
Chito and Yuuri
Clemency
singletonking
Elena Fisher
Almost50
Gamma Emerald
Joan of Arc
Morality
Robert2424
Dunnstral
Near x Mello
Toogeloo
Reasonably Psychotic

This is probably a more accurate readslist. Note that Robert is much lower on this one--but that's more an accurate reflection of my real read there, I feel.

Everyone from Joan above, I have some rather compelling reasons to not lynch. While from about Elena down these reasons aren't as strong as I prefer, they
exist
, enough that I have a fairly small lynchpool that I am highly confident contains the scum.
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Post Post #1267 (ISO) » Fri Feb 15, 2019 7:37 pm

Post by mastina »

In post 1266, mastina wrote:Torque
Spike and Jet
Asking for a friend/Pink Ball
Chito and Yuuri

Clemency
singletonking
Elena Fisher

Almost50
Gamma Emerald
Joan of Arc

Morality
Robert2424
Dunnstral

Near x Mello
Toogeloo
Reasonably Psychotic
Heck now I can actually give tiers to my readslist and not feel shitty about it. Top-tier is townbloc; locktown reads that are never scum this game, ever. (Pink Ball, I typed out in a PM to the mod--which I paraphrased and posted to the PT once N1 hit--for why my push on you was one gigantic reaction test; you passed, Vedith more or less failed. More complicated than that, but that's the short version of it.)

Second tier are strong townreads, who
could
be scum but are incredibly unlikely to be.

Third tier are townreads that have good backing to them, moderate strength, but aren't infallible altogether.

Fourth tier's "this is the group of meh players--I'm not scumreading them, but these probably contain a scum (or maybe two) statistically speaking".

And fifth tier's my actual scumreads--where there's probably a misread (or two) in there, but otherwise contains solidly scum players who I am HARD scumreading.

Short of a cop guilty, I'm never lynching anyone from the third tier and above any time soon, so we've got an effective lynch pool of pretty much six players. Less if you townread someone, more if you really wanna argue I'm townreading someone I shouldn't be, but I do feel I have fairly good reasons for these reads!
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Post Post #1268 (ISO) » Fri Feb 15, 2019 7:41 pm

Post by Dunnstral »

In post 1267, mastina wrote:so we've got an effective lynch pool of pretty much six players.
Correction: You've got an effective lynch pool of six players, the rest of us will do whatever we want
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Post Post #1269 (ISO) » Fri Feb 15, 2019 7:51 pm

Post by mastina »

In post 1268, Dunnstral wrote:
In post 1267, mastina wrote:so we've got an effective lynch pool of pretty much six players.
Correction: You've got an effective lynch pool of six players, the rest of us will do whatever we want
Which will be lynching within those six players because the game was all-but solved from how D1 played out.
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Post Post #1270 (ISO) » Fri Feb 15, 2019 7:55 pm

Post by mastina »

In post 1269, mastina wrote:
In post 1268, Dunnstral wrote:
In post 1267, mastina wrote:so we've got an effective lynch pool of pretty much six players.
Correction: You've got an effective lynch pool of six players, the rest of us will do whatever we want
Which will be lynching within those six players because the game was all-but solved from how D1 played out.
Btw while I have somewhat cased my scumreads already, what I'd find easier to do honestly is the opposite--

One by one, have people ask me about the townreads there and have me walk through them for why they're town, and thus, why the POE pool is those six players (with three as scumreads, three as meh-reads).

Because I can, and will, defend each and every single one of those townreads right now. They all pretty much feel ~right~ to me.
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Post Post #1271 (ISO) » Fri Feb 15, 2019 10:58 pm

Post by Near x Mello »

Elena, Robert, Morality

Thats the result of my reread

VOTE: Elena

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Post Post #1272 (ISO) » Fri Feb 15, 2019 11:00 pm

Post by mastina »

In post 1271, Near x Mello wrote:Elena, Robert, Morality
Thats the result of my reread
VOTE: Elena
~Near
If I were feeling hypocritical, I'd rule of three guess Robert as the scum in there. :shifty:
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Post Post #1273 (ISO) » Fri Feb 15, 2019 11:07 pm

Post by Near x Mello »

Talk to me about why you got Elena so high

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Post Post #1274 (ISO) » Fri Feb 15, 2019 11:23 pm

Post by mastina »

In post 1273, Near x Mello wrote:Talk to me about why you got Elena so high
Sure. That's actually one of the less evidence-based reads, though. I also confess that the meta there is less-than-stellar; my Elena readrate is like 55-60/40-45 range; not much better than random, if that. It is, mostly, very strong gut feelings, and I think it is based on an instinctual residual memory of her meta playstyle from when I had a much higher accuracy rate at reading her. (It keeps going down; it used to be like 90% and has steadily declined over the course of games.)

I can explain where I am coming from, though.

It basically comes from a lack of scum perspective.

Elena is not very active--this could be due to a scum motive of (active) lurking, to avoid the spotlight, avoid making waves, avoid really putting herself in danger of needing to explain herself or something like that...but when I look at what she has given and what she hasn't given, I'm left with the impression she simply isn't aiming for that. It doesn't look deliberate. It doesn't look planned, it doesn't look like her agenda is to try that. It looks like she is simply, genuinely, not high-efforting.

And that is more in line with what I know of her townplay, more or less. When she is scum, she tends to have a little tryhard in her. She places a high priority on looking town, throughout the game. She does whatever she needs to, in order to make herself look like she's town. And that is pretty much absent; there's nothing I see from her which looks forced, which looks like a grab for towncred. She is what she is, and it's nothing more than that.

I suppose you could say she struck the perfect balance of the town zone for her as I expect it to be: enough genuine thoughts and effort that it doesn't look like she's scum active lurking, but also not enough effort and townness that it looks like she's scum trying to grab the towncred. But I'd be lying if I said that this reasoning, this logic, alone would contribute to the strength of the read alone; like I said, the rest of it is mostly gut.

I simply have a strong feeling she's not scum, and I'm not going to revisit that for a long, long, LONG time.
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