Open 753: Nomination Mafia [Game Over!]

[scum reading]

Hello there, so many new faces in here, let’s see...

VOTE: Shoshin

(This is how I make new friends by the way)

[scum reading]

Hello there, so many new faces in here, let’s see...

VOTE: Shoshin

(This is how I make new friends by the way)

Am I a new face to u

I don’t know anybody in here

[scum reading]

I figured you believed I’m an alt, I’m not, apparently the word “scum” and “reading” in a nickname spell out “alt account” for a lot of people here xD

[scum reading]

Hello there, so many new faces in here, let’s see...

VOTE: Shoshin

(This is how I make new friends by the way)

Am I a new face to u

I don’t know anybody in here

why did you not start in newbie forums? its a good place to pick up the site meta.

I am aware of how this works, I come from other games that have the same setup, I picked up fast on things here

[scum reading]

I figured you believed I’m an alt, I’m not, apparently the word “scum” and “reading” in a nickname spell out “alt account” for a lot of people here xD

For me it was the fact your account is new and you haven’t played newbie games

How do you read FusCostco’s attitude so far

Fuscosco why does early-game bother you?

Pedit: Auro, it’s closer to the latter but your entrance’s to the game we’re part of it too

Pedit2: spciy

Their 16 is what I didn’t understand, but other than that, I get town vibes from Fus

[scum reading]

Auro stoped posting at a convenient time for him, I’ll place my vote on him. I’ll go to sleep and be back tomorrow, please no hammer on this, I want to read what he posts when I wake up

VOTE: Auro

[scum reading]

What’s the :/ for?

[scum reading]

DT feels towny
VOTE: scum reading doesn’t

Not touching RC or Shoshin till they figure each other out more

Why do you think I’m scummy? I felt like Auro stopped talking when he was being pushed, so I just raised the pressure to see how he’d react.

[scum reading]

Oh I’m voting who’s left, nice
Yeah SR still not towny in retrospect. Joining a push on Auro because he disappeared at a “convenient” time?? Lol

Yeah, applying pressure is good for town, we get reactions from people. It’s not like my vote is going to stay there anyway, I just wanted to get a response from Auro, as he wasn’t answering to two people voting him. As a town, I like to be aggressive. Honestly, those accusations between rc and dt filled up with like 6 pages, which I don’t like. It allows for scummies to hide under the radar. If I were up, I would’ve intervined and asked for reads from other people that are not that active, or people that were and then they stopped talking once rc and dt were accusing each other. I’ll be posting my town reads in a bit, looking through people’s iso’s really quick just to make sure I didn’t miss anything relevant

[scum reading]

Town reads :

Fus and irrelephant (I put both of you on the same line because I am strongly townreading you guys.) Reason why they’re here is because elephant gave townreads way early on, several times if I’m not mistaken, overall town behavior. As for fus, I townread him because of his 257, 260 , 261 which I find town-indicative.

DT - this comes next, if this were to be a rainbow read, but I am not that good with forum stuff, so just imagine this is a scale. DT, despite clogging this thread, his accusations were fine and if we are being objective, there’s no discrepancy in what he says and whom he accused. He had good reasoning to push RC.

I’ll be updating this as information comes along, but for now, this is all I’ve got. I don’t town read volxen nor auro at the moment because I’m really skeptic with “I rolled town” posts. Auro’s posting seems townie, but I’m not willing to place my town read on him yet just because his posts look townie.

That being said, I’m interested in Shoshin’s reads at the moment, as well as grand’s because he has just confirmed

[scum reading]

i actively think all of

shoshin, dt, clemency, scum reading are more likely than null to be scum.

everyone else is nul lfor now

I disagree, is my attempt at pressuring regarded as scum? I think as a town we should get as much information as we can. My vote was well-placed at that time and it was used to gain information, not to lead someone to a potential lynch. Hence why I said no hammer until I come back.

UNVOTE:

[scum reading]

My vote was well-placed at that time and it was used to gain information

Auro’s posting seems townie, but I’m not willing to place my town read on him yet just because his posts look townie.

What information did you gain from my reaction(s)?
You find Fus/Irrelephant's posts townie, therefore townread them - why does that not apply to me?
What's the difference in your mind?

Nothing relevant as the push didn't feel like a push at all given the fact that dt and rc clogged 6 pages of the thread, so there wouldn't be a reason for you to feel pressured. I was hoping to see how you'd reply, instead you just acted like nothing happened. So my attempt at pressuring was a failure and with nobody backing it up, can't get information.

The difference is, as I've mentioned, I look at posts like "I rolled town" with skepticism. Call it being closed-minded, but I don't usually buy that stuff. Rarely have I met people that say "I rolled town" in their first post, and you saying "I hope you guys did too!" is making me feel even more skeptical about you being actually town.

As for your vote on DT, do you think he's scum? If so, what indicates towards that? What are your clues on him?

[scum reading]

I responded to your vote, by explaining my then irregular posting.
I identified a bad vote on my wagon (Clemency) and stated it.
The other two votes were RVS. How is my response not adequate?

When I voted you up, you mentioned you were in the airport. I understood your situation, that's not a reaction that I was expecting. Then, when Clemency voted you up for pressure, once again, it was only then when you said you felt Clemency's push was unjustified. Regarding the other "2 rvs votes", the first was indeed an rvs vote without any clues, but by the time Volxen voted you, he was already suspecting you, at least that's what I got from his post saying "let me guess, you flipped scum like you always do 95% of the games", I didn't really take it as an random vote. I took into account what he said and then I proceeded to vote you up to see if you'd react as scum or as town. Volxen claiming he has played games with you before and he was always in your scum games, wouldn't it make sense for me to push you to help him town read you or not? After all, he has the most experience with you. Is my logic flawed?

So - you're skeptical of my RVS post - which I later explained had some background to it (which Volx/Irre can attest to), to such an extent that even though my later posts feel townie to you, you still don't think I deserve a townread. Correct?

Correct. I'll have to analyse voting patterns with you. It will be hard town reading / scum reading you just by your posts. I can't completely disregard your initial post and be claiming you are town with conviction. You're on my radar. As for another reason why I don't town read you yet, I'll explain in the following response...:

Yes, ATM I think he's likely scum - I've explained in part. I'm not able to place his reaction to 91 from a town perspective and it looks inconsistent with his later explanations. His constant misrep of both mine and RC's arguments seems scummy. I don't find his other posts in his exchange with RC towny either, whereas others seem to - which I'm curios to hear about.

DT has addressed that there's no way he would know how town Volxen would posts, because he doesn't know him. Which makes sense, doesn't it? He's pushing people according to their actions in this particular game, and in his point of view, the claiming town early on are scummy. How would he know that town volxen posts like this all the time? Your 91 isn't a solid excuse to get a vote on him. Him and RC have talked a lot until now, don't you think we should vote inactive players / active lurking players? I don't see a reason to vote DT at the moment, I have a town read on them and your accusation on him is his reaction in regards to your 91 post, which I've explained earlier that it makes no sense. Just because Volxen's gameplay is the same as town volxen in other games that DT was not in but you were, does that automatically result in DT being scum because you had access to information that DT didn't have access to? Please explain.

[scum reading]

Reason why they’re here is because elephant gave townreads way early on, several times if I’m not mistaken, overall town behavior.

This isn't townie for Irrel.

I haven’t played with anyone here, but here is the beauty of no-meta, I can read actions of people in this specific game and focus on that, I don’t have to make my brain remember previous encounters with players, remember their alignment and all the actions that they’ve done and match that with their behaviour in this game. Updating a town reads list, in my experience, is something that scum don’t tend to do. Scum usually are active during rvs and then they “passive hunt”, waiting for the perfect opportunity to jump on a wagon or throw an accusation. They don’t contribute to town in any way and they tend to make a lot of scenarios or to distort information and use it to their advantage (when pushing someone, for example) . Irrelephant didn’t do any of those things just yet. That’s why I townread them. (By the way, is it “he” or “she” ? )

[scum reading]

RC already placed me at a nullscum

[scum reading]

I’ll put that at a shallow level of scumread until I get an explanation of why I’m leaning towards scum, just because RC failed to provide it when I asked for one

[scum reading]

Explanations are scummy.

I’ll pretend like this was a joke and ignore it

[scum reading]

@SR: I haven't played with anyone here either, and it's obviously good to develop reads based on gameplay as opposed to meta. I wouldn't accept an argument like "X played like this as scum in games Y and Z therefore X is scum here" uncritically, but I don't discount it either since players do have AI playstyles over time. I don't agree that scum don't update townlists; in fact they should do this in order to steer town into mislynches and gain towncred.

During rvs stage though? Maybe d2 and above I’d be more careful when looking at frequently updated town reads, but in rvs I don’t really suspect it

[scum reading]

Scum reading also a fairly good bet for scum

rc's swinging at random

Conftown lol

[scum reading]

Wait, the first quote wasn’t supposed to be there, ignore that

[scum reading]

I’d honestly try to work this out, but I don’t even understand what I’m being accused for, so I’ll sit here and watch town vote themselves off, might as well start voting me, I can’t understand how explanations are scummy

[scum reading]

Won’t follow up any votes that lack logical explanations, are we honestly doing this?

[scum reading]

I'm not lynching you today

If I have my way we kill

VOTE: Clemency

I think that “swinging at random” was an off-hand remark that swept you off your ground, Clemency’s a funny person, I actually laughed when I read what he posted, I didn’t take it as a reason to back his vote up

[scum reading]

And btw the only reason you survive today is that I decide the aggravation of this shitty game isn't worth it

Have you finally decided to play according to your role?

[scum reading]

Listen, if you present a case on Clemency, I’m willing to push with you. You seem town to me, if you play like this when you are scum, then props to you man, got balls

[scum reading]

When I voted you up, you mentioned you were in the airport. I understood your situation, that's not a reaction that I was expecting. Then, when Clemency voted you up for pressure, once again, it was only then when you said you felt Clemency's push was unjustified. Regarding the other "2 rvs votes", the first was indeed an rvs vote without any clues, but by the time Volxen voted you, he was already suspecting you, at least that's what I got from his post saying "let me guess, you flipped scum like you always do 95% of the games", I didn't really take it as an random vote. I took into account what he said and then I proceeded to vote you up to see if you'd react as scum or as town. Volxen claiming he has played games with you before and he was always in your scum games, wouldn't it make sense for me to push you to help him town read you or not? After all, he has the most experience with you. Is my logic flawed?

So, you took my comment about Auro rolling scum 95%+ of the time at literal face value? Come on, I didn't literally mean that he rolls scum that often... no one rolls scum that often. It's an inside joke between Auro and I, because he does seem to roll scum more often than the usual 20%-25%. Auro and I play a lot together, and we hydra together on the Michael Scott account, so I know him well enough to make that kind of a joke. I do find it suspect that you are claiming to have taken my joke vote at face value and decided that me voting for Auro was a good reason for you to hop onto his wagon.

In any case, you are saying you also voted for Auro to see if he would react as scum or town. Do you feel you accomplished that goal?

And if you find it sketchy that Auro said “I rolled town” in his first post, do you also find it sketchy that I said that I hope RadiantCowbells rolled town and that I’ve been wanting to play a game with town!RC for months now?

I do, that’s why I didn’t put a town read on you. You are further supporting my case, you play on the same account with him, so you do have some experience with scum auro. Even though you meant it as a joke, it’s factually true. So why did my vote bother you?

[scum reading]

Listen, if you present a case on Clemency, I’m willing to push with you. You seem town to me, if you play like this when you are scum, then props to you man, got balls

What do you make of Clemency's earlier vote on me, putting me at L-2 inspite of townreading me?
He seems to be riling RC up intentionally now - do you see town motivation for that?

Just because people have different reads, that doesn’t automatically make them scum.

I’ve seen a few games with clemency and he has his own style, I wouldn’t be eager to scum read clemency just based on his remark, even rc admitted he’s known for his charisma, can’t blame.

As for his L-2 on you, despite being weird about it, he stated it would be for pressuring. I’m fine with that, I believe getting information on you early on is good, because we can confirm both you and Volxen as town or one of you as scum, etc, since you guys know each other the most. If you guys were both scum and confirming each other as town, that would be unfortunate, that’s a relative low probability as well though.

[scum reading]

Oh you said inspite, my bad, ignore the first response then.

[scum reading]

Turns out after I checked his ISO he did say he town reads you, good observation, I missed it. I saw his 183 was an explanation, but I don’t know what he meant. Might have to reconsider clemency’s alignment.

[scum reading]

Damn, with all this confusion, I’ll keep in check people that are active lurking. Fus, can you post some reads? By the way, can we get over the rc theatre and try to scum hunt and not engage in stupid conversations, thanks

[scum reading]

Damn, with all this confusion, I’ll keep in check people that are active lurking. Fus, can you post some reads? By the way, can we get over the rc theatre and try to scum hunt and not engage in stupid conversations, thanks

This looks like active lurking.

Call it lurking or trying to look for clues with this clogged thread that legit has no information except that RC is being extra AtE and not helping town. I asked if he finally decided to play his role but it seems like he doesn’t know how his role should be played. I’m asking fus of reads because i townread him by the way, and given this whole theatre, I want to see his view on it and the people that are likely to be scum.

[scum reading]

Damn, with all this confusion, I’ll keep in check people that are active lurking. Fus, can you post some reads? By the way, can we get over the rc theatre and try to scum hunt and not engage in stupid conversations, thanks

This looks like active lurking.

Should I check myself? Give me a second.

I wasn’t implying scums are active lurkers, I just said I’d like to keep everyone on check to hear somebody’s else opinion rather than RC’s (I saw your reads RC, it’s good, you can calm down now)

[scum reading]

On the contrary, I believe a few scums were quite active

[scum reading]

There was an explanation, don’t misrepresent me. I said my vote was there for pressure, I wanted a reaction, but you can’t apply pressure with only one dude on a vote, everyone else took their vote back or ended up on other wagons for no reason when RC and Fus asked why we were voting someone that is “obv town”.

I have conflicting thoughts on who I should vote. I don’t want a mislynch.

[scum reading]

I asked him to explain his SR townread, he said he couldn’t really
He also has offered no reasons for any townreads w/o being asked that I can think of

Do you think he was right about DT/RC having at least one scum? I don’t think so, and therefore the scum motivation to insist that there must be one is kinda obvious to me

I thought explanations “were scummy”, it’s rvs, you act like people’s reads will stay like this for the whole game. You are so inconsistent in your reads, it’s honestly amazing. You townread RC who has been townreading me on guts, but when wazoo does, he’s scum?
You’re just picking your scummies based on guts as well, you just aren’t admitting it.

[scum reading]

Dw SR I will protect you

Not sure if I like this

[scum reading]

I like that you are at least willing to try rn, so I’ll try to get into your reads and see if I suspect any of the people you listed

[scum reading]

I was hinting at you. Now self-defence is regarded as self-conscious => scum, why would I help the people that scum read me with no basis to do so. Still sus on you shoshin, from a town perspective, why would you say explanations are scummy lmao

[scum reading]

Shoshin scum

Rc town

Clemency null-scum after Auro pointed that clemency believed auro was town, so his attempt on pressure wasn’t even an attempt at pressure, just an attempt at stacking up votes

Wazoo null, could be one of the scums catching up to the thread and trying really hard to be active

Volxen probably scum, parks vote on me for what was an attempt at pressuring. He is also being really inactive and doesn’t post reads

That’s all I got, as my name suggests, I scum hunt, I don’t town hunt

[scum reading]

Why would I say explanations are scummy as scum, SR? Explanations are what allows scum to leave a paper trail to defend themselves later in the game.

I think the better question is why would you say explanations are scum as a town. Should we all vote according to our guts? If so, you would’ve been the first to get lynched, except I look at clues and for now, pressuring clemency is better

VOTE: Clemency

[scum reading]

As if he’ll defend himself by releasing the pressure of votes

[scum reading]

I think the better question is why would you say explanations are scum as a town. Should we all vote according to our guts?

What kind of question is this? I say explanations are scummy as town because it's what I think as town.

To be clear, I'm not saying town don't have reasons for their reads/behaviors. They obviously do as a natural result of scumhunting. I'm just saying that town don't explain all their reads/behaviors, whereas scum sometimes explain too much to make sure their reads/behaviors are defensible.

If you're town, do you post all the reasons behind your reads/behaviors? And if you're scum fabricating "townie reasons," wouldn't you want to post those reasons in the thread to make sure your reads/behaviors are defensible?

How do you even determine when someone is “taking it too far”? I do leave a textblock of explanations when I make a case against someone as town. If anything, I’d say scum distort the reality of events and choose to pick on bits of that case to make the case look faulty, when they aren’t really addressing the whole idea of the accusation.

[scum reading]

i am not really pleased with the over-the-top defense of 'i thought explaining myself looks scummy' by scum reading. that kinda shit is >rand scum imo

What even is this >rand scum thing

[scum reading]

VOTE: radiantcowbells

Explain?

[scum reading]

I'm liking GrandWazoo for town.

Volxen, what's your read on me?

For now, I townread you. You are more familiar with me than anyone here, and if I think if you were scum, you would probably try to capitalize on the fact that I haven't posted much to try and scumpaint me. For example, you might have linked to Newbie 1900 (Robocalypse), and used meta from that game to try and make a case for scum!Volxen. The fact that you haven't jumped at the opportunity to shade me over not posting a lot yet is at least somewhat town-indicative for you.

By the way, what are your thoughts on scum reading? I disagree with RC on him being "locktown". I still think it was shady how he followed me onto your wagon just because I said "Auro rolls scum 95%+ of the time", and I find his reasoning that he wanted to "pressure" you suspect.

Are you still stuck on that? I made a case on it, you have already addressed it. If you are town and people say you’re good at playing town, stop tunneling me for something that makes a lot of sense.

[scum reading]

Scum reading babe help me show everyone else you're town

I honestly don’t know if I’m fine with you pocketing me at the moment, I will not be manipulated and then thrown under the bus by you so you keep on living. I don’t agree with your read on wazoo. I was fine with your clemency push. Just a question, what information would wazoo reveal in the eventuality he flips scum? What if he flips town? How would that flip help town, given they were likely manipulated by you into voting him and then you just accuse townies that were on your wagon?

[scum reading]

I asked what if he flipped town?

[scum reading]

I asked what if he flipped town?

Who would be the next push if that happened?

[scum reading]

Clemency?

But I'm good enough that when I say he's scum he's scum

Alright, I’m bought then, I agree with Clemency scum

UNVOTE:

VOTE: Wazoo

[scum reading]

Because after I flip town people will respond accordingly.

Even if we mislynch, it’s not like we can not regain majority. I believe town RC, I just don’t like his pocketing me this hard, but I’m flattered. He’s the only one who’s trying to game solve at the moment and scum hunting. Why would we lynch RC, just because of his AtE?

[scum reading]

Mislynch means it'll be 4v3 D3.

RC has committed every scumtell in the book SR. AtE is the least of them actually.

Are you trying to get me on your side by misinforming me? Scum.

[scum reading]

dw i'll charisma my way out of any lynch

VOTE: Clemency

[scum reading]

He’ll most likely not be nominated for a lynch, Clemency gets lynched day 3 regardless.

UNVOTE:

VOTE: Wazoo

It was meant as a joke, but you’re still getting lynched day 3 clem

[scum reading]

I'm sorry but I can't deal with this.

Don’t leave us captain, listen to some spicy asmr, take a break for now, and then come back when you’re feeling more at peace

[scum reading]

why the fuck does everyone on mafiascum thinks they are fucking late game vladimir or something

'i am playing like ass early game, but i do much better mid-late game so you are scum for scum reading me early game!!!'

fuck off kids this is not fucking league of legends.

play to your heart's extent and stop blaming others for playing shit or expect others to do certain things when it's not warranted because you are playing like shit

0/8 vayne at 15 minutes
"dw we got late"

Who even plays league anymore

[scum reading]

I don’t know how I should read RC’s sub out after he held the game hostage until we lynched wazoo. Now I’m debating what would be the best lynch, truth is it could be a wifom and one of them is scum or all of them are town and really good players and scums are afraid of them. Given that volxen didn’t provide much information, I’m fine with his lynch. Irrelephant isn’t getting lynched. Choice is between Shoshin and Volxen, obviously

[scum reading]

With shoshin being active and her being an asset to town up to this point, I’d go for a volxen lynch. Any thoughts on this?

[scum reading]

With shoshin being active and her being an asset to town up to this point, I’d go for a volxen lynch. Any thoughts on this?

Asset to town - can you describe in more detail, please?

Looking at her ISO, she’s trying to get conversations started and share reads with people, her and irrelephant scum read me and she has talked with him about my slot. She is trying to get everyone’s reactions on slots like mine and she isn’t hardcore pushing me as well, her entire iso on day one was revolved around scum hunting and generating discussions, she has been asking good questions and didn’t seem scummy doing it, I don’t see why there would be a reason to vote Shoshin.

As for Irrelephant, same thing, I have him as locked-town for constantly updating his reads and trying to get conversations started, sharing opinions on scum slots ( when you and irrelephant discussed town reads and scum reads) Besides, half of day 1 was this trio that were scum hunting and having control over everything -> Irrelephant, Shoshin and RC. They were all game solving and I believe scum wouldn’t want to be in the spotlight so much. Most of my reasoning for my town reads is based on gur as well, I usually scum read easily, but I didn’t get any scum tells from either one of them, so of course that would leave Volxen as the safest lynch because of his lack of contribution to town.

[scum reading]

By you I meant shoshin

[scum reading]

Why is Irrelephant town, Auro? What the fuck is up with these townreads on Irrel?

Now that I presented my case, I’d be interested to get your view on irrelephant as well, I didn’t spot anything scummy, why do you believe she’s not town?

[scum reading]

I'm just glad I can't be Lynched today \o/

Confscum, got him

[scum reading]

I’ll refute your whole case with this. I mentioned the trio from day one. Two of them are now on the lynch. If not because they’re a threat to scum, then what for? Do you think it is a wifom this early in the game? I’d rather have volxen lynched for lack of activity because if he’s scum, he’ll be hard to read given the fact that there’s no information on him. Having both of them alive, with their activity we’ll eventually be able to scum tell if they are scum, but you can’t with volxen.

[scum reading]

I'm just glad I can't be Lynched today \o/

Confscum, got him

I'll kill you tonight!

VOTE: Volxen

[scum reading]

Didn’t mean to quote lol

[scum reading]

Didn’t mean to quote lol

I just took it as I scared you into voting there.
Why Volxen?

1511 1537

[scum reading]

And 1510

[scum reading]

we aren't rioing volx, thats lazy and he and rcslot are my townbloc

So you'd rather go for other 2 townies that provide info as well? I see, weird judgement, I'd rather have game solving than silence.

[scum reading]

So, I (a player that took a fair amount of heat on day one) am nomimated alongside two heavily townread players (Shoshin and Irrelephant). It's obvious to me what's going on here: scum wants me out of the game this day phase. That's why I am being forced to "compete" against two heavily townread players, to force me specifically out of the game.

These even-numbered day phases are alternatives to night phases in a standard game. Just like scum doesn't want a red flip during night phases, they don't want a red flip during even-numbered day phases, because this is there opportunity to force a green flip. If they are going to bus they are going to do it during an odd-numbered day when anyone can be lynched, they aren't going to waste an even-numbered day to bus when that should be used to guarantee a green flip. If someone votes for me because they think all three of {Shoshin, Irrelephant, Volxen} are town that’s one thing, but the notion of town-Shoshin, town-Irrelpehant, and scum-Volxen is illogical because its bad scum play to bus on an even-numbered day. It's even worse than giving up a nightkill in a standard game. It only makes sense for scum to nominate one of their own if said scum is already heavily townread and unlikely to be lynched among the three nominees in the first place. I was not heavily townread on day one, so it wouldn't make sense for scum!me to be nominated alongside two of the most heavily townread players, if Shoshin and Irrelephant are both in fact town.

Normally, there are three major reasons for nightkilling someone: 1) because they are suspected of being a town power role, and/or 2) because they are obvtown, and/or 3) because they have accurate reads. There are no town power roles in this game, I clearly did not establish myself as obvtown on day one, and I didn't have any scumreads that I confidently pushed on day one (I got scum vibes from Scumreading but I wasn't extremely confident of him being scum). So why was I nominated alongside two heavily townread players, as opposed to having three heavily townread players being the nominees?

Because someone very familiar with me and my meta is on the scumteam

. If the nominees were chosen based on their day one play alone, it makes zero sense for me to be chosen, because a more optimal use of today would be to force one of the heavily townread players (Shoshin, Irrelephant, Auro, or Alonzo/RadiantCowbells) out of the game. If all three members of the scumteam were unfamiliar with me and my meta, then I think that they would have chosen three out of those four listed players to guarantee that one of the strongest townread players is taken out of the game today.

But it does make sense for me to be nominated if someone who knows me and my meta very well is on the scumteam. There are only two players in this game who are very familiar with me and my meta, and they are

Auro and Irrelephant

. They are both familiar with my playstyle (especially my

town playstyle

), and the fact that I am not always consistent with my posting habits as town, and that when I am town, it often takes me a while to get to the point of being strongly townread or locktown. So if one or both of them is scum, it makes sense that they would nominate me alongside two heavily townread players and try to force me out of the game early on before I have been able to establish myself as locktown or at least strong town. And that is exactly what this nomination list is about, forcing me out of the game before I become unlynchable. And if one or both of them are scum, they both are also aware that the longer that I stay in the game, the more likely that I am to catch onto them.

Here is what I am confident of. There is no way that I would have been nominated alongside Shoshin and Irrelephant if the scumteam was entirely comprised of people unfamiliar with me and my meta.

I am convinced that at least one of {Auro, Irrelephant} is scum based on me being one of the nominees

. Both are very familiar with me and my meta, but out of the two of them Auro has much more firsthand experience with me due to us hydraing together.

VOTE: Irrelephant11

This defence is solid, I'll reconsider my vote.

UNVOTE:

[scum reading]

Volxen just hard claimed double voter.
There is no role and this is an open setup. Scum claim?

Me? I am a level 4 town, levelling is hard tbh, difficult way to get to game master

[scum reading]

Are you town though Vedith?

I will consider who to vote for, I have conflicting thoughts, I don't know whether or not a scum might be on this nomination. I wanted to vote Volxen because my case was that there are 3 towns nominated, so volxen would've been the easiest vote because of his lack of activity, but now I have to consider Volxen's case and figure if this was a wifom or not, the mind games

[scum reading]

I'm so confused.

Why?

[scum reading]

Yeah, I'm really indecisive, this game is at page 70, but I've decided to give my all, I'm sorry for the confusion everyone. Well, it sucks with these nominations, I wanted a Clem push like I've stated, at this point it's either all 3 of you are town / 2 town and 1 scum, there's no way 2 scum would be placed like that in the nominations, for reasons Volxen mentioned. Now I'm thinking of who the scum team would consist of and how they would play, but that's looking for the needle in the haystack since I don't know anyone here. I don't know if there's a scum in that nomination. Originally, I assumed it was an all-town nomination because I townread everyone there, that's why my original vote was for volxen who lacked activity. So I don't know if I should place my vote from the perspective " all 3 are town" or "there are 2 town and 1 scum". From the first, I'd go for volxen for lack of activity, although his posts are really good when he posts. From the second scenario / the choice would be shoshin or irrelephant, obviously. I am trying to look in each of your iso's and determine who would be scum out of the 2 of you.

[scum reading]

Checking Shoshin's ISO, most of the day one interactions were between Shoshin and Irrelephant and they were accusing each other a bit, so whoever placed the nomination knew they'd go at each other, so there must be at least one smart player in the scum team that orchestrated this nomination.

[scum reading]

Well, from my point of view, it's a 50/50 between Irrelephant and Shoshin. If they're both town, then a lynch is guaranteed on town either way, so it doesn't matter who we lynch. All 3 of them are strong players, and if we lynch either Shoshin or Irrelephant, they wouldn't go on each other and focus on scum hunting, currently they're tunneling each other, or at least that's how I see it. If one's scum and one's town, it's a 50/50. I don't think Volxen is scum, so he's not an option for me at the moment.

[scum reading]

I'm never voting you, Irrel.

I said this on D1.

You have also spent your first posts voting irrelephant and when I townread him, you said that's his scum meta to give reads.

[scum reading]

I'm waiting for other people to give opinions on this matter and hopefully we can reach a consensus on what is the most beneficial lynch for town.

[scum reading]

Well, as I said, a 50/50 at best and if not, all 3 of them are town so one has to be lynched regardless, given that all 3 of them are probably the towniest, we take an L for today

VOTE: Shoshin

[scum reading]

You’d rather have Volxen lynched? He’s obvtown

[scum reading]

Shoshin is scummy af, Irrelephant is not and Volxen just made a whole case on how he’s town with this nomination and I buy it, solid case

[scum reading]

Vedith, are you clemency’s replacement?

[scum reading]

SR, unvote while you give me a chance to town case myself.

You’re at L-2, you have time

[scum reading]

The idea of killing the stronger townie instead of the stronger scum among a group of three likely townies doesn't make any sense by the way.

Volxen is the strongest townie, I don’t know him like you, but he’s the only one who presented a really good case and doesn’t say “explanations are scummy” . Are you gonna give me explanations as to why you’re town now?

[scum reading]

Meanwhile, scrolling through Shoshin’s ISO and all I can see is half of her iso being “what do you think about this, RC?” followed by naked votes without explanations

[scum reading]

She’s not scum hunting at all, she’s just relying on RC’s reads and go from there, so I don’t see that scum hunting case you brought up, Auro

[scum reading]

Meanwhile, scrolling through Shoshin’s ISO and all I can see is half of her iso being “what do you think about this, RC?” followed by naked votes without explanations

Also this is generally NAI playstyle from Shoshin
Though I’d like to see her go a little deeper than she has been lately

Yeah, I would like that as well, except she doesn’t do that. I don’t think a Volxen lynch is the greatest one. I would like some reads from shoshin and her view on the situation

[scum reading]

SR, your perception of my posting is wrong. Why are you downplaying my contributions to the game?

Not downplaying, it’s just that I’m not used to your kind of play style. I don’t know how you play and that is making me doubt myself. I’d like if you gave a full reads list, because most of your posts are questions and you aren’t explaining your thought process after you’ve asked those questions, so I’m paying more attention to you right now.I’d like more transparency coming from you

[scum reading]

I am used to townies picking on a person at a time, instead, you are focused way too much to scum hunt from a larger pool. I would narrow it down to a few people and scum hunt from there, but first day you accused Wazoo, Fus, me, DT, Clemency, even RC for a bit, Irrelephant but you didn’t really push someone with full conviction. From my experiences, townies tend to tunnel someone and try to scum hunt them, but you are the exact opposite. I come from a place of doubt since I wasn’t exposed to this kind of play style, but I’m willing to change my mind if you give me reasons to do so. I’d like Volxen to give his opinion on your slot as well, I am townreading him the most at the moment.

[scum reading]

Unvoting until I review the game

UNVOTE:

[scum reading]

Volxen, can you answer my earlier question? Also why the self-vote?

I think he considered this is an all-town nomination and he is willing to lynch himself for the good of the town, I think he made a post on this as well, correct me if I’m wrong.

[scum reading]

Regardless, I’ve included shoshin in my town pool after reviewing her game and she brought a solid case.

[scum reading]

You guys keep getting into WIFOMs. I town read Volxen and Shoshin and Irrelephant by a bit. We take a punch to the face this day, there’s no reason scum would want to be on here (at least that’s what i think) . I already gave my ideas, it’s just my pov, I think it’s too early for wifoms like this. There’s no way any of you that are scum would nominate like this. Imo the one of you who feel like not playing / are not into this game 100%, let us know and we’ll vote you off, we have complete control over scum, this lynch is basically like we’re picking the nightkill, none of our scum reads are on this nomination. My best guess is scum are afraid because of RC’s lock town slot as well as Irrelephant and Shoshin who had complete control over day one, so just vote the most useless townie. You keep digging this wifom hole when it really doesn’t matter who’s going to get lynched, I town read all of you, I don’t know if other people don’t, but to me this is a nightkill rather than a wifom

[scum reading]

Not trying to take your wifom guessing pleasure away or whatever, but this is really boring, pages fill up with the same wifom shit, focus on getting scums, not doing this. It’s just 5 people talking most of the time, you’re doing their jobs for them, wasting time aimlessly and falling into endless wifom when Shoshin should focus on scum and you giving your opinions, focus on other people as well, this is the night kill, give scum reads

[scum reading]

Nobody can be that bad as town right

I can feel RC’s absence in terms of activity

[scum reading]

Why did I quote, my bad

[scum reading]

Scum reading talk to me.
I'd love to have been town with you in this game but I don't see it.

Give me reason to not lynch you tomorrow.

Vadeth friend, share reads with me

[scum reading]

You’re scum reading RC? Anybody would know that after his lynch and his replacement, he is conftown. He was mad that wazoo being a bad townie and so he repped out, it should be obvious. I agree I’m scummy, I’m not as active, mainly because the game is being held hostage at the moment, I can’t push my scum reads because they’re not nominated. For me everyone here is town, there’s no reason for any scum player on that nomination to place themselves in such a dangerous and risky spot. All of them have brains and I don’t see them being that cocky to risk a scum lynch. I told them to figure out who wanted to sacrifice, but they keep on accusing each other while also town reading each other, which is crazy. I’m just waiting for them to decide on a lynch so I can push real scum. As for my activity, shoshin + rc + irrel are enough to fill up 60 pages day one, if I hopped in, this would’ve been like 100 pages. I am usually active as hell when nobody is speaking so I can get things started, but there’s no reason to with 3 people that are posting 10 times more than I would if I played like I usually do.

As for scum reads, {Chennisden, DT} Chennisden because he’s clem’s replacement and he was horrible on that auro vote as well as the RC push. DT because he went from a super active player to now popping in at random times, basically just shooting for a participation trophy. I do believe this lack of activity comes also from his feud with RC and he wants to slip under the radar after accusing a slot that eventually became conftown.

Vedith, get your reads up, they are yikes

[scum reading]

I would’ve placed myself in your scum not scum scum, scum scum def chennisden. Replace Alonzo from your scum scum before I put you on my scumdar

[scum reading]

I don’t like the votes on shoshin, 2 of my scum reads are on there. Why are you guys voting shoshin?

[scum reading]

VOTE: Irrelephant

Shoshin’s town, all the people on her wagon are suspicious for trying to get rid of the most active townie. RC is in the clear, high chance of her wagon containing at least 2 scum.

[scum reading]

I still think all of them are, which is why I’m not voting shoshin, she’s the strongest town read and the most active one. I agree with her scum reads, they make perfect sense, there’s no reason for me to vote her and rc shouldn’t be on that wagon either.

[scum reading]

I'm frankly much more likely to sus a player who quietly votes or doesnt than one who is upfront and vocal

So why are you on Shoshin?

[scum reading]

Yeah, willing to take a 1v1, nothing to lose on my part. You’re either scum or you want to believe I’m scum and you hope I eventully flip scum so it’ll stroke your ego. You have scum reads amongst {Clem, Fus, DT}from me, irrelephant (who flipped town btw) and shoshin and you’re pushing the one who wasn’t scum read by anyone here.

Interested to hear why is your gut telling you I’m scum tho

VOTE: Vedith

[scum reading]

I scum read his slot and wanted this lynch since day 2

VOTE: Chennisden

[scum reading]

Lynch Vedith.

If he's town, lynch SR tomorrow.

I'm starting to doubt my town read on you with this post...

[scum reading]

It seems your just trying to survive with this post. I don't like it.

[scum reading]

you're* yikes

[scum reading]

Probably going to end up voting her. Why?

Her latest posts have been horrible. She has lost faith in her reads and when she's starting to get scum read, she makes a post like that.

[scum reading]

I'm not sure how you go from such a solid town read to scum from those posts

Just like she did. We were given a roadmap to victory from irrelephant. The main reason I was tring shoshin was because she promised she'd stick with it, but when we have the opportunity to lynch chennis, she starts accusing you and after hardcore defending me, she doubts her reads so you town read her.

So it just makes me believe both her and chennis are most likely scum.

[scum reading]

Why volxen?

[scum reading]

Fuck it, I'm done with this game.

I'll stick around to sheep Auro since he's the only person making sense.

You have just changed one of your strongest town reads to a scum read like it's nothing. Do you believe you're making sense?

Of course I get paranoid of your alignment if you are willing to throw me as bait like that. It seemed like you just wanted to do anything to survive.

[scum reading]

What the fuck are you talking about?

This

Lynch Vedith.

If he's town, lynch SR tomorrow.

[scum reading]

You're a shit cook

That accusation is RAWWW!!!

Just like that meat you were supposed to cook, you're a shit cook

[scum reading]

What the fuck are you talking about?

This

Lynch Vedith.

If he's town, lynch SR tomorrow.

How is that a Scum read?
Scum reading trying to take opportunity here to save Chen I think.

I voted him after 2 people have voted for him

[scum reading]

Are you drunk?

[scum reading]

Vedith, you're just swinging at everything you can to get me lynched. Other than me coasting shoshin (which has been refuted with my vote) you have nothing on me.

Get to lynching real scummies, because you're plain wrong about my alignment.

[scum reading]

If Scum reading was town here he would be in the pool with me and someone like Auro or DT.

Volxen has already been in the pool and is under majority of radars.

Chen being in the pool with me and Shoshin as town makes sense.
Me and Shoshin argue the day, one of us gets lynched and Chen gets credit for being in a pool.

I originally wondered if Shoshin was going to push me for the hammer today but that didn't happen so overall 2 Scum in the pool with me makes little sense.

You're accusing based on WIFOM...

She didn't push you because you're the one leading her lynch. She backed off and started going by your reads. Isn't that pinging to you as trying to survive, especially with her defending me so hard and town reading me?

[scum reading]

I originally wondered if Shoshin was going to push me for the hammer today but that didn't happen so overall 2 Scum in the pool with me makes little sense

Her vote is on you and she advocated to lynch you.

This game's fun, ngl

[scum reading]

What the fuck are you talking about?

This

Lynch Vedith.

If he's town, lynch SR tomorrow.

Why are you assuming that Vedith is town, SR? What the fuck?

Because of the post you made. It makes sense if you're scum to make a post like that. You're the informed minority. You DO know Vedith is town and so you just set up my next mislynch.

And then, I ask, why do you think I am SCUM when you have defended me so hard up until this moment where you got hard pushed and panicked and made a post like that.

[scum reading]

??? Does my post baffle you or what? I don't get it

[scum reading]

I believe it's really simple and you're just distorting it

[scum reading]

Scum reading, how do you feel about rainbow reads?

I'm an old-fashioned man, I like the parentheses reads

[scum reading]

??? Does my post baffle you or what? I don't get it

You're saying Vedith is town when he hasn't flipped yet???

My whole point of view is that you are scum that said "Lynch vedith and if he flips town, lynch sr next". If I believe you are scum, you are the informed minority, so, as an informed minority scum, you say lynch vedith, he will flip town and then you'll follow my lynch through.

This whole case comes from my paranoia because you gave up your strongest town read, which was a lazy tr by the way, since it's true, I've been a lurker this game, and it looks like you took me with you up to this point and then you just throw me like bait. I'm the easiest bait because of my lack of content. I just don't get why you'd say that, I've townread you up until you post that shit, we had the same scum reads and all, why do you post something like that if not as an attempt to try and survive when being pushed?

[scum reading]

I believe I have stated numerous times that I didn't want you lynched and you are town. I have town read you, until this point.

[scum reading]

Well, you just fucked up all of my reads, not going to lie with those shady ass posts

[scum reading]

You are interpreting my words in the wrong way. I was paranoid at you, because it looked like you were planning on setting a lot more mislynches to get yourself out of a lynch. That's all.

[scum reading]

As for reads {me,Alonzo,Volxen,Auro,Shoshin,DT,Vedith,Chennis}

Towniest -> scummiest

This is where I'm at for now, reads will most likely change post-flip.

[scum reading]

Fus/Chennis/??

post = after. After you get a role, reads changed based on the people that have pushed that role and other factors. You've lost me after your 2517 and 2518, I can't actually see what you want from me. I don't understand 2517 at all and I don't know what you're trying to say in your 2518 either..

[scum reading]

Elaborate so I can respond to whatever you want from me

[scum reading]

That quote was addressing your spoiler, ignore it.

[scum reading]

I am saying reads will change post-flip regardless of who we lynch. Not specifically you, if that's what you meant.

[scum reading]

This is in regards to your request, Shoshin:

Spoiler:

You were townreading me because I promised to stick with Irrelephant's road map to victory? Please reference the posts where Irrelephant provides such a map, the posts where I promise to stick with it after Irrelephant's death, and the posts where you townread me as a result.

Irrelephant's road to victory was her saying we should sheep your vote. I agreed with that, and the town read wasn't based on you accepting to follow irrelephant's plan, but rather because of your mutual scum read which was Fus and your town case. Me saying you will stick to irrelephant's plan was a bit inaccurate, you haven't stated it, but from town!shoshin pov, that's what you would've done. And you did, you voted off fus.

I'm done efforting in this game until I know whether I survive. You have the road map to victory, that's all you need.

Fus/Chennis/??

I don’t care who gets lynched at this rate
Everyone take your pick tbh
I’ll work hard to follow through with Shoshin’s plan if she flips town
I’m fine being lynched here
Volxen kinda didn’t respond to a few questions people asked him I think but idk

Fus first
Yeah nvm about activity tell

Everyone on my wagon, sheep shoshin in my honor thank u

What townread did I change to a scumread like it was nothing? I'm here saying to lynch Vedith, the guy who keeps scumreading you. What do you think that means about my read on you?

It was the scum read on me. I misconstrued it that way, being a scum read on me, I only now get your intentions. It was the heat of the moment for me to believe you had bad intentions, since you were getting heavily scum read.

You're the one who went from townreading me to suddenly scumreading me based on actually nothing. Why are you projecting your own behaviors onto me? Why are you assuming that Vedith will flip town when reading my alignment? And don't say you're not assuming Vedith is town, because the only way it makes sense for you to scumread me is if you say that I'm setting up a chain mislynch, which assumes that Vedith is town, something I never did.

I've explained this above, I do recognise my faulty logic, again, it was the spur of the moment.

Why are you trying to refute Vedith's case on you by scumreadnig me? Based on this, do you think it's reasonable for me to conclude that the reason you scumread me is for survival?

Vedith doesn't even really have a case on me. I voted you based on the above explanation, and by that I wanted to prove him that his accusation on me was worthless. It is reasonable for you to conclude it was an attempt at survival as well, I don't blame you for it, but, again, this was all based on my self-doubt and lack of confidence in my reads. I do have a tendency to trust other people because I think my reads suck. An example of this is in Dinner Donner Party, where I kept pushing a lynch on a scum on day two, but nobody chose to back me up on my case and as a result, I followed the counter-wagon that my scum read has started because townies were on it. Everyone doubted my reads, and so have I. That's why I haven't really made a case this whole game, I'm actually confused on potential scum targets. I'm not that sure on anyone other than chennisden at the moment.

[scum reading]

Here's what I think. How about we lynch the dude that didn't post any game-relevant content this whole game and that repped in a slot that flaked and voted for pressure on someone who thought was town.

If he flips scum, we vote Vedith because he ended up town reading chennis after he scum read him and he's trying to split votes.

If he flips town, we're voting DT because other than his 1v1 with rc, everything else was fluff. These last few days I don't remember him saying anything that's actually game-relevant.

[scum reading]

That + he places an attempt to hammer after parking his vote on shoshin hoping a vanity wagon becomes a legit wagon. even though he gave no opinion on any slot from the nominee list.

[scum reading]

Got it big chief

[scum reading]

Wanna talk with me, I'm feeling kind of lonely

[scum reading]

Ok, I just got back from school, let me re-read everything.

Alonzo, can you unvote before scum quickhammers me? As far as I can see, we're at LyLo.

[scum reading]

I'll post thoughts as I go skimming the thread

[scum reading]

Ok, so vedith got bandwagoned in 7 minutes with Vedith self-hammering, cool

Now, listen to me. I've been trying to lynch chennisden since day 2 and when we have the opportunity, scum go for the dude who had me and shoshin marked down as scum. Is nobody going to question how chennisden never got hammered, but Vedith who had 2 scum reads on Shoshin and scum reading, the dude who doesn't post as much, got counterwagoned in 7 minutes?

I'm not allowing my mislynch in LyLo, please unvote until scum get online and end this game

If you wish to vote me, be 100% I'm scum, don't vote prematurely, especially at this stage in the game.

[scum reading]

I voted them so at this point your lynch options are me or SR. If one of us is town, the game's over.

Scum slip? Oopsies, thought you were town. At least from your own pov.

Guess I’m the dedicated mislynch that Volxen was talking about

VOTE: Shoshin

She didn’t follow through with the chennis lynch to mislynch me. If Vedith wouldn’t have flipped, you guys wouldn’t have pushed me.

Now Shoshin has a reason to push as well.

With the people that townread me being dead, this mislynch is the easiest for her (RC repped out and Irrelephant died)

[scum reading]

Yeah. It's a calculated risk - I wondered if it's safe to, reasoned that in a 1v1 between them I'd go for SR - are you seriously considering the possibility of Shoshin scum and SR town?

Lack of quickhammer should suggest he's scum by now, no?

You're trying to manipulate players into mislynching me quickly.

I will make a scum case as well, but I want to start with Vedith's read on me.

Vedith, although has not mentioned it, scum read me because of my lack of activity. I am an usual shitfest in my games and have 500 posts per game. The reason I wasn't this active this game is because I've had a stressful week and I couldn't play on my PC to make scum cases and all that. I had a lot of school work.

Most of my posts were done while I was on mobile and it already is hard as it is, which is why I didn't contribute a lot towards game solving. Volxen was making a lot of solid posts and I thought I've found my town block and so my contribution to the game was my voting. From my perspective, I wasn't so active because the scum reads aligned for me and so I didn't have to make a lot of scum cases, because my town block was already suspicious of the same people I've scum read.

I've suspected fus and the other lynches were mostly all town nominations. I've followed shoshin because I trusted her. Yet, here we are, in LyLo, and I'm the last mislynch.

The reason I was more of a sheep, is because this setup is new to me as well and I can tell how much paranoia comes from this setup. When people are on the nominee list, accusations that wouldn't have appeared solid at all do seem acceptable, due to this setup and the nominee list.

That's the reason I couldn't produce any scum cases, my reads would constantly change and I'd fall down this rabbit hole of WIFOM.

What I know now for sure is that this is LyLo and this is where it's easiest to scum hunt. The people that are pushing my mislynch are the scummies. Their third team mate is either afk or is afraid to lynch / is waiting for a town to hop on the wagon so he can quick hammer.

[scum reading]

Volx, please place your vote on SR to prove that he's scum.

How does volxen placing a vote prove I'm scum? You're trying to get townies on my wagon so your afk member, probably DT, is going to hammer me?

[scum reading]

From your perspective, I'm town who is voting scum SR or I'm scum who is bussing. Either way, vote SR please.

It needs to happen before Alonzo stupidly votes me & allows the scum to win.

We're on a clock.

I've lost multiple games because townies didn't vote the scum quickly enough at LYLO.

Please don't let that happen this game.

Look who's worried the mislynch dedicated target might escape a lynch today. How cute.

No townies vote me please, I do have some time available in my hands and can post.

[scum reading]

Best reason for lynching Volx today: to prevent Auro's mislynch later.

Here, Shoshin is already defending Auro. I do have to admit it's a bold move.

SR's locktown.
The scum are within DT, Clem, Vedith, and Fusco.

Pay attention to her words.

If DT's town, he's letting a personal grudge get in the way of this game.

In this post, her tendency is to believe DT is scum, but she didn't really push this idea throughout the game.

DT pushing my lynch because says he can't work with me is pretty scummy.

She pointed this out, but has never pushed DT, at all.

Sorry I'm lynching you Irrel if you're town, I'm just paranoid because you townread Fusco.

This is a bad reasoning, also, you said this after this:

I'm never voting you, Irrel.

I said this on D1.

Yet, you voted because you didn't agree on a scum read?

Auro, where's your vote on Fusco?

Here, she's pushing the first mislynch and gets Auro in to vote with her because the majority of people were already scum reading Fus, so this is a smart move, not necessarily risky.

How am I scummier than Vedith/Chenn?

Now with this, I remember the nomination list. This was perfect for Shoshin, as she was being town read by town. In retrospect, that lynch list advantages Shoshin in every way. Chennisden is an easy mislynch bait because of him being a lurker, just like me. Now, watch what happens next:

Vedith, please explain in greater detail why you're scumreading SR.

She's still town reading me for her own reasons that she never mentioned.

I've lost motivation to play mafia in general.

At this moment, she was being voted and pressured by a lot of people. This is AtE and she used it to escape a lynch.

How do you know SR is scum?

She's still town reading me...

It's possible that SR's scum but I'm not going to get there is nobody gives strong reasons for the read. "Coasting" isn't sufficient when that's half the game.

Now, watch this progression. An 8 post difference in between theses 2 post. This reading progression is really off. She was already preparing my mislynch for today in this moment, because of my lurkiness. She needed me alive because I sheeped her for a large portion of the game.

Lynch Vedith.
If he's town, lynch SR tomorrow.

This is where that whole case was debated. Of course I was paranoid, again, this seemed like she was preparing my mislynch. And it looks like it happened.

Town Vedith doesn't keep making this argument that I mislynched Irrel when I townread the guy.

According to my earlier posts, you lynched Irrel because "Sorry irrel, you townreading Fus is making me paranoid" after saying Irrel would never be a lynch for you. What a weak reasoning to escape a nominee list in which you've placed yourself.

I still think it's the DT/Chen/Vedith team. It's the least complicated solve. And they gave us a nice gift by nominating themselves to help us test it during even phase.

She didn't really talk about DT too much. Look at this list of scum reads and then look at the nominee list from yesterday. Does that ring any bells? Why isn't she pushing chennisden today? Because she abuses Vedith's meta read on me, even though he didn't even discuss it. She's pushing a scum agenda on me based on meta that she hasn't read.

This is where I'm at for now, reads will most likely change post-flip.

Why are you scumreading me for saying my reads might change post-flip?

This is where I'm at for now, reads will most likely change post-flip.

The phrase "reads will most likely change post-flip" implies an informed perspective about the flip. Do you realize that?

These two posts were distorted and she tried to portray me as scum, when, in reality, what I've said made perfect sense.

VOTE: chennisden

VOTE: Chennisden
Let's just get on with this.

She's pushing her alleged "scum read". If you think about it, the nominee list, in retrospect, after Vedith's flip,was heavily in her favor. She needed to vote whoever and she'd be fine.

VOTE: Vedith

This proves my point above.

VOTE: DoubtingThomas

This is the weirdest vote and it is a huge bluff. She has always mentioned DT is scum, yet she throws a vote this late in the stage for WIFOM, and then immediately votes for me. She didn't say anything regarding her DT vote.

VOTE: scum reading

[scum reading]

>Bad push on Irre's excitement and refusal to answer my questions asking why
>Refusal to explain stances
>"I'm not scum, I'm disappointed in you"
>"If you want to push my lynch I'll push a lynch on you"
>"It's absurd you think I'm scum"

Also:

When I beat you as scum, RC, I'm going to be so town that you're going to be telling everyone never to lynch me as I lead your mislynch.

I get the feeling she's deliberately not putting in effort to look towny from this quote, and for some reason thinks that should get her townread?

Trusting RC + I'm fine with a DT lynch independently anyway.

Why are you trusting RC? What're your independent reasons to lynch DT? What's your preferred lynch?

Hey DT, you're not going to get RC lynched today so why don't you vote someone else?

DT's scum. He shouldn't be scumreading me at this point.

I'm locktown on Auro but otherwise okay reads.

Shoshin, I'd like for you to respond to my earlier question re: when I became locktown for you.

While rereading, post 122.

SR's locktown.

The scum are within DT, Clem, Vedith, and Fusco.

Irrel, or Auro, or Alonzo, or someone, please ask DT what his reads are. It appears he has none.

Fuck it, I'm done with this game.

I'll stick around to sheep Auro since he's the only person making sense.

SR is scum, Volx. There's no getting around that simple fact.

I voted them so at this point your lynch options are me or SR. If one of us is town, the game's over.

Look at all these posts. Notice all the commentary on DT's slot, yet she never pushed him.

Shoshin also locktowns auro and claims she'll sheep his vote and lately they've distanced from each other when in comparison with the early game.

Shoshin's claiming that I'm scum, yet her scum team was DT/Chenn/Fus, but she's never pushed DT. Which makes sense. DT is lurking as he is, if it boils down to a moment where shoshin / auro are pressured, DT is an easy bus. That's why she didn't push him yet.

[scum reading]

So you don't think Auro's scum?

[scum reading]

i think no more than 2 scums in the 4 that voted vedith

And which would those be? auro/shoshin?

[scum reading]

And who's the third, if not you? By your PoE, it should be you, because you tr both me and chennisden and you're the only one that's off-wagon besides me and him.

@chennisden What's your opinion on all this?

[scum reading]

I'd like volxen to be up right now and sort this out with me. I'm not getting mislynched today boys, nuh huh

[scum reading]

that's why i think there are only 2 scums in that group max

"That group" is Vedith's wagon. The other 3 people out of the group are me, you and chennis who voted for somebody else.

chennisden/scumreading are unlikely to be team

So that leaves you off the vedith wagon. Realise your mistake in logic? You said 2 scum max on vedith's wagon, and there were 3 people off his wagon. You cleared 2 of those people. You remain as the last one.

[scum reading]

You're lucky shoshin is the one pushing my mislynch, otherwise you'd be dead right now. You'll be a lynch right after. Your scum team will fall like dominos.

[scum reading]

Yet you didn't push for him.

So, who's your third scum read after all?

[scum reading]

You claim you're lynchproof? Doubting (it), Thomas.

How so? Her ISO and her actions suggest otherwise? My case suggests otherwise as well. You can definitely be scum together.

[scum reading]

auro

[scum reading]

Auro and Shoshin are on my wagon and somehow I'm not quickhammered. Which means that they are the 2 scums waiting for a townie to place their vote so the third one can quickhammer.

[scum reading]

the third scum* just to clarify

[scum reading]

You aren't voting her, do you really scum read her that much?

You do know my meta, maybe you can tell the people how I play. If you pushed against me that would've been nuts considering you know my playstyle.

Also, I believe chennisden was a dedicated mislynch on the Shoshin nomination and the wagon on vedith built up way too quickly. Shoshin needed Vedith dead as he was pushing her as well and he was also scum reading me. So she can now push his scum agenda. Chennisden, at this point, I think everyone realised that he was a town mislynch as well and Shoshin could've voted for each one of them, as I've proved in my case. She switched votes in between them when the situation fit best.

I have no reason to tr you, you're scum reading someone yet your vote isn't on them. Words don't mean anything without actions.

[scum reading]

And remember what happened when people didn't follow me?

Poof sk wins

[scum reading]

Yeah. It's a calculated risk - I wondered if it's safe to, reasoned that in a 1v1 between them I'd go for SR - are you seriously considering the possibility of Shoshin scum and SR town?

Lack of quickhammer should suggest he's scum by now, no?

See this.

To be safe,

I declare intent to L-1 Scum Reading.

I’ve explained this, chennis.

Of course she was the one forcing this battle, she forgot vedith’s agenda was shoshin gets lynched first.

BoP suggests she’s scum. She voted Vedith over you because his reads were heavily accusing me for no reason, he said “meta” but he didn’t explain it. It’s a confbias and you shouldn’t be fooled.

There’s no way this is a bus. Scum!shoshin isn’t that dumb to bus in this position. If she’s lynched, her team mates are fairly obvious. And I’ve pointed it out.

Keep in mind she didn’t touch on my case at all and is talking you into lynching me. I’m not talking you into lynching her, it’s ultimately your choice. Notice the pressure on her, she has to mislynch quickly and I’m her only shot at winning this.

[scum reading]

I'd also rather not talk too much about who SR's partners are because I don't want to give anything away when it comes to nominating for tomorrow.

Even this post is scummy as it is, she’s not saying anything because she doesn’t want to give any clues.

She’s forcing you into lynching me although “my scum mates” are never going to be mentioned because we’ll be endgamed.

This post is trying to make you feel reassured that she’s got further reads, when in reality, if you place your vote on me, I’m getting hammered by 3rd scum.

[scum reading]

And we’re all going home and this ends.

[scum reading]

Okay, Volx. I have to deal with your errant mind yet again. Okay.

For starters, when you start making assumptions about behaviors, please make the least # of assumptions possible & choose assumptions that are most likely to apply with the highest probability. Don't make assumptions about things based on lots of speculation & low probabilities. I agree with you that Alonzo's very likely to be town, that's fine. But you shouldn't assume that me & Auro wouldn't bus. We're as likely to bus as not bus in this type of situation & it's impossible for you to know with high probability what's happening from a town perspective either way.

There's better assumptions to be made about this game that will help you solve with higher probability & less speculation. Let's go over these:

1. It's very unlikely for scum to nominate themselves because the risk is unnecessary & far outweighs the potential reward.

2. It's very unlikely for scum to self-nominate a member twice in a row after she almost got lynched the first time, especially when taking that risk is unnecessary to win.

3. In a 1v1 at LYLO, if scum haven't hammered one of the players after everyone has had a chance to post, one of the players in the 1v1 is very likely to be scum.

These assumptions are significantly higher probability than your speculations about bussing. What happens when you apply these assumptions to the game? They point to SR as scum 100% of the time.

I'll apply the assumptions for you so that I don't leave anything to your errant mind:

1. There's at least one scum between myself & SR because of the 1v1 at LYLO.

2. I'm very likely to be town because I was nominated twice in a row.

3. Therefore, SR is scum.

That's the analysis you should apply today because it's the highest percentage lynch. It doesn't require any speculation about bussing. It doesn't even require assumptions about Alonzo's alignment even though we obviously agree on that.

That said, let's talk about why your analysis fails even when applying your bussing assumptions. You say that scum Auro aligned with SR pushes DT or Chenn today. This is untrue because I forced the issue by voting SR. Auro had no choice but to vote between myself & SR, and given the fact that he could hammer me in the event that a townie votes me, he faces no risk whatsoever by placing a vote on SR while waiting to see what happens. Auro isn't clear.

The reason this matters is because it means Auro/SR/Chenn is still plausible. It's plausible enough that rather than vote DT you need to be lynching the highest percentage chance of hitting scum & that's SR in all cases. Again, my analysis requires fewer assumptions with less speculation & higher probability than yours, so please just follow my reasoning instead of allowing your mind to wander itself into making cognitive errors.

There's another thing you're not considering, which is the fact that you're not cleared as town by anyone except yourself. As such, you're not going to convince anyone with your analysis because your analysis assumes you're town, something that none of us know with certainty except you.

For those reasons, you need to be looking at lynching SR today.

So the whole case on me is basically I’m scum and you’re not because you were nominated twice.

[scum reading]

Tht’s what I’ve been saying, I’m the easiest push.

We are on the same page chennis...Why are you making it look like we’re not?

[scum reading]

Today’s lynch is in between me / Shoshin, there’s no reason to start any other duels, this is the lynch with the most information.

Look at xtoxm’s scum team. Auro didn’t give any opinion on my slot other than “you’re active lurking” and it’s the sole reason I’m a push this game. I was not active lurking. I’ve explained the situation.

And now he is convicted I’m scum, only in LyLo and doesn’t doubt shoshin at all. What does that say to you?

Xtoxm also has a scum team in which shoshin isn’t included.

[scum reading]

Tht’s what I’ve been saying, I’m the easiest push.

We are on the same page chennis...Why are you making it look like we’re not?

if she's town she knows FOR SURE you're scum.

And I know she’s scum for sure, my vote is on her

[scum reading]

Chennis, you have info on me and shoshin and how the game went. Getting into a completely new 1v1 and waiting for them to talk is, for one, time consuming

And two, unnecessary

We’ve already spent a few days on our encounter, there’s no reason to start a new one

As you said, 1 scum has to be in between shoshin and I

[scum reading]

Today’s lynch is in between me / Shoshin, there’s no reason to start any other duels, this is the lynch with the most information.

Look at xtoxm’s scum team. Auro didn’t give any opinion on my slot other than “you’re active lurking” and it’s the sole reason I’m a push this game. I was not active lurking. I’ve explained the situation.

And now he is convicted I’m scum, only in LyLo and doesn’t doubt shoshin at all. What does that say to you?

Xtoxm also has a scum team in which shoshin isn’t included.

you realize you will be lynched over shoshin today?

You realise you’re losing the game, right?

If I were scum, I would’ve realised that and pushed a lurkish slot, like you for example

I’m not afraid because this game has been awful for townies

Shoshin’s lockscum and if you can’t see that and choose to vote me over her, that’s your call chief

[scum reading]

That mod post was towards Shoshin btw, from the mod, if you didn’t notice, chennis

Vedith sayd don’t read AtE as town. It’s NAI. She’s manipulating you.

[scum reading]

Fam, shoshin is the one leading my mislynch. She’s obviously scum for that.

There’s no reason for me to vote anyone else.

Her “Lynch Vedith and then scum reading” was enough of a clue to lock me on her.

Why are you trying to make me lynch elsewhere than what you said we should lynch?

[scum reading]

Still AtE

Chennis, you’re never listening to me and remember last time you tunneled me to death and I was town?

Maybe this is a time where you should reconsider everything that’s going on in the game, take a step back, relax, and see how much sense makes for scum!shoshin. Look on the posts made yesterday (in game) as well.

[scum reading]

ate comes from town more often than scum.

It’s totally subjective. I do it more as scum than as town.

Something, yet again, that’s factually wrong.

[scum reading]

You know what chennis, go ahead, place a vote. Not once in my game were you able to game solve, I don’t expect you to do it now.

I’ve made a case on shoshin that she misdirected from and didn’t comment upon at all because it makes sense.

Maybe you should let Volxen and Alonzo say something before you make a horrible mistake that’ll cost you the game.

You’re taking decisions without people giving advices and that is bad, admit your reads can be bad and wait for Volxen and Alonzo to interact.

You’re being forced into my mislynch, that should be obvious to anyone, no matter how intelligent they are. She’s been telling you to vote me and voting carelessly along with Auro who didn’t give his opinion on my slot at all.

[scum reading]

By Bop shoshin should’ve lynched one scum by now

What do you know

[scum reading]

Ate? If anything, Shoshin’s AtEing as well.

I’m stating facts that normally would’ve been obvious if you weren’t confbiasing me.

You read logic as AtE? You wut?

[scum reading]

Shoshin’s Ateing alone* I meant

[scum reading]

The whole point of BoP is stating that if an experienced player doesn’t lynch scum, then they are scum themselves.

How would BoP lead me to lynching xtoxm??????

You see, chennis, when you stop making sense, you gotta take a step back and re-think everything.

[scum reading]

Chenn, please promise me that if SR somehow gets in your head that you will talk to me about it before you vote.

promised

This isn’t confbias?

[scum reading]

There's no case on me because I'm town.

SR's attempts to case me will reflect his rhetorical skill, nothing more.

And luckily, I'm prepared to deal with that & point out how it's entirely rhetorical.

and i am convinced this is why SR hasn't cased you

Like, just look at this.

This is exactly what I’m talking about.

She got into your head. If you check out my ISO, you’d see the case.

But she’s been pressuring you to mislynch me and she makes it as though I’ve never built up a case against her.

Not to mention, scum’s tendency is to point out bits of information that can be distorted so it makes people believe that the person accused is scum.

Which is what Shoshin said she’d do “I’ll point out any rhetorical phrases that don’t make sense”

This game’s hopeless lmao, when scum tell people someone didn’t make a case on them and people believe it without even checking their ISO, the game’s lost already

[scum reading]

The whole point of BoP is stating that if an experienced player doesn’t lynch scum, then they are scum themselves.

How would BoP lead me to lynching xtoxm??????

You see, chennis, when you stop making sense, you gotta take a step back and re-think everything.

how do you NOT SEE how xtoxm is confscum from your pov? BoP -> tunnel xtoxm is very valid

1) xtoxm is confscum
2) you can't lynch shoshin

Can you give me a definition of what BoP is for you?

This post is just plain bad. From my pov, Shoshin is locked scum for preparing a mislynch on me since yesterday and for pushing it today.

[scum reading]

Still AtE

Chennis, you’re never listening to me and remember last time you tunneled me to death and I was town?

Maybe this is a time where you should reconsider everything that’s going on in the game, take a step back, relax, and see how much sense makes for scum!shoshin. Look on the posts made yesterday (in game) as well.

you are the BEST person to case shoshin right now. to point out the scummy things. please do this instead; if you are town you will be the best for this.

Are you fucking kidding me chennisden?

[scum reading]

https://wiki.mafiascum.net/index.php?ti ... roficiency

Exactly what I’ve said, chennis.

You have the wrong concept of BoP.

Either that, or you find me an experienced player, which I’ll take as a compliment lol

[scum reading]

I will post more later on how I think DoubtingThomas is scum regardless of Scumreading's alignment, even if I reduce the number of assumptions that I initially made.

That being said, @Scumreading are you outright refusing to vote for DoubtingThomas today?

Volx, lynching Shoshin is the play here. This IS the safest lynch. Depending on the nominees tomorrow I'll be able to confirm my reads on DT and Auro.

Right now, there's no reason on why I would vote DT. He's done nothing this game phase and it is hard sorting him as it is. I am ten times more confident in a Shoshin lynch and there's no reason to abstain that. This is a SvT and it would make no sense for me to drop this. Shoshin is lockscum and she's the safest lynch, at least for me. I can tell it's hard for people to sort our roles, but the game play until now should give you indications to our alignments. This battle WILL have to take place regardless if we lynch another scum now, but this is, once again, the safest option for me. She's pushing my mislynch today based on Vedith's meta read which was my activity, she doesn't have a case on me, I've made a case on her that she completely disregarded and said I won't comment on it, yet when chennis says "Scum reading, you should make a case on Shoshin", Shoshin said "

If he were to make a case

, I'd point out any rhetorical thoughts", but she didn't. She saw my case . She ignored it and she didn't want to bring the fact that I've made a case on her so that chennis will be inclined to vote me. That's scum af. She's trying to pressure people into voting me, like chennisden, which is the easiest to persuade. She won't try to make you or Alonzo vote me because you guys probably won't and she knows that. She just needs chennis to place his vote and that's gg.