Anime U-Pick: King Size [SEASON FINALE...?]

[mastina]

Chito: @A50, I think I kinda gave up trying to actually make my way through mastina's wallposts but I keep feeling like I should seriously engage with them but there's just so many repeated points.

They're not repeated.
They build off of one another.
They're never irrelevant, either.
If you want to engage with why I'm not scum, there's a huge amount to wade through, sure.

But if you want to see why everyone except for Almost50 and Near x Mello are town--and here is where I

am

repeating myself--you can do it quite simply:

Just two.

Those two posts are all you

really

need.

[mastina]

She's been lying out of her teeth

Oh really.
Then you'd be quite able to share with the class what said lies would be!

[mastina]

Please refrain from using inappropriate words, guys.

Remember when I said the mod warned me and that since then I've been using "(bleeped because bleep the mod)"?

I wasn't (bleeped because bleep the mod) lying.

[Almost50]

so even interactions aside, a combination of {me, almost, Chito} means all scum were in ch5

And this is supposed to be unlikely...

...Why?

...When alignments were generated after people's picks, and people got their first picks pretty much, and their first picks are the flavor which their neighborhood membership are based upon?

Everyone in channel 48 picked a slice of life anime; everyone in other channels has linked flavor based on some other common traits. Those were always picked, no matter what, and alignments were the next thing rolled. So why wouldn't there be all scum in the same neighborhood? That's like saying there wouldn't be all scum in a row in the playerlist--in spite of the mod using explicitly random alignment generation.

Random doesn't mean "this can't happen", it means it is statistically an anomaly to happen, but can in fact happen and does. A mod who rerolled because all scum were in a row on the playerlist would be using (bleeped because bleep the mod) mod interference.
Same argument applies for neighborhoods--a mod who rerolled because all scum were in one neighborhood would be using that very same mod interference. It is (bleeped because bleep the mod) modding all around so if you believe in the competency of Tatsuya as a moderator, you MUST believe as a direct correlation that Tatsuya would stick to their flavor/alignment guns and no shift things on that merit.

Bullshit!

One of the terms they have is 贴脸, I don't know if there is an elegant way to translate this term, but what that means is when somebody makes a statement that comes without logic, is purely emotional. Usually is when somebody bets intangible things like reputation, pride, intelligence, personality and emotions to gain trust. Some example could be like "If I'm not town, I will quit mafia forever.", and "If I flip cop, you go eat shit.", these statements are hugely imbalanced for the game and goes against the game's spirit and it's an unspoken rule that you don't make such statements.

And as far as I'm concerned.
That phrase might as well translate to "Welcome to (bleeped because bleep the mod) mafiascum players".

I can and HAVE seen players made the EXACT type of play you are talking about...as scum.
(bleeped because bleep the mod), back in the day.
When AtE kings ruled the day.
Players like RadiantCowbells were INFAMOUS for it.
If he were alive, he'd be the FIRST to tell you as much, in fact.

That what Almost50 said does

not

make him town, that he is just as equally capable of saying it as scum--and would.
Anything which you can do as town, you can do as scum.
ANYTHING.
There are things that are despicable to do as scum--that doesn't mean they aren't done.
There are things that are despicable to do regardless of alignment (and this is what I classify Almost50's action as)--that doesn't mean that they were done as town.

(I'd put a 99% on it).

Would this faith remain if I linked to multiple cases of people making almost identical posts to Almost50...as scum?
Because I can.

You know WHY I can?

Because on mafiascum.

Home of toxicity.

That kind of play.
Is.
Not.
Uncommon.
From.
Scum.

Anyway, your plays coming into the day by voting Elena is tbh, kinda questionable, given your position on the game.

My position on the game is "(bleeped because bleep the mod) everyone else, I don't (bleeped because bleep the mod) care that she's not scum, I want some (bleeped because bleep the mod) vindication" more or less, when it comes to voting Elena.
My vote is currently on Almost50.
But I would move back to Elena if need be for that one reason alone.
Her townflip proves me right.

It serves other purposes. It conftowns Pink Ball.
But it mostly serves to prove me right--not just to others. But also to myself, because being proven right helps me more than not being proven wrong ever would. (Spike and Jet as a lynch, for instance, was a case of me not being proven wrong, but I wouldn't actually call it a case of me being proven right. Elena as a lynch, flipping town, WOULD be a case of me being proven right.)
Like I said.
She is in the POE pool. Her lynch proves I'm not partners with her. Her lynch closes a lot of mislynch options. But I still think she's town, so really my only main reason I'd vote her is exactly what I said, for vindication.

And we can in fact do better than that--thus why I'm voting Almost50.

you voting her too, as I said before, I don't believe your justification.

Dude read our (bleeped because bleep the mod) neighborhood.
I literally said in there.
And this is almost verbatim.
"If you're not dead tomorrow, I'm lynching you".
And you know how I am with promises.

I forget what more I want to say. I'm sure there are more things though.

How about my full commentary on people?

It's not like it's a ton of posts.
Just two.
I mean there's a lot more than those two when it comes to why I'm town, but those two are why everyone except for Almost50 and Near x Mello are town.

Horseshit!

Chito: @A50, I think I kinda gave up trying to actually make my way through mastina's wallposts but I keep feeling like I should seriously engage with them but there's just so many repeated points.

They're not repeated.
They build off of one another.
They're never irrelevant, either.
If you want to engage with why I'm not scum, there's a huge amount to wade through, sure.

But if you want to see why everyone except for Almost50 and Near x Mello are town--and here is where I

am

repeating myself--you can do it quite simply:

Just two.

Those two posts are all you

really

need.

Pigshit!

READ MATHBLADE'S ISO IN ANY OF HIS PREVIOUS GAMES. IT WON'T GIVE YOU ANY INSIGHT BECAUSE MATHBLADE ISN'T EVEN PLAYING IN THIS GAME, AND THAT PROVES YOU ARE SCUM.

P.S. You can also apply the same principle to Nero, Varsoon, Titus .. etc.

THIS UNDOUBTED PROOF I'M TOWN AND YOU'RE SCUM. YOU CAN'T COUNTER THAT SHIT BECAUSE IT'S TRUE AND IS SO DAMNING AN EVIDENCE.

P-edit: You mean when you said..

Fuck

this bullshit the mod just

fucking

warned me.

I'm

fucking

done.

?????

[mastina]

@mastina, who is the scum in 2.13 again?

You already know that the first half of the wagon is SOLIDLY town.
We already pretty much know Joan is town.
We know that Pink Ball is town.
What does that tell you?

The only possible scum on the wagon are Near x Mello and Elena Fisher.

You might note both are in my POE pool and I'd lynch either.

Why so few scum on a known town wagon?

Because the wagon was led by (bleeped because bleep the mod) RADIANTCOWBELLS.
RC can make an all town wagon on town by sheer force of personality alone--I don't think he

did

, but I've seen it happen, on multiple occasions; he's gone from having a wagon with nobody voting there to lynching that player in less than 48 hours, on at least three separate occasions that I can think of. (Granted, at least one of said occasions

was

on scum, butstill.)

I don't think the lynchwagon is that productive.
Instead, I'd look elsewhere.

If you paid attention to my posting, you'd also know that I pointed out that Almost50's lack of vote was suspicious-as-(bleeped because bleep the mod). It wasn't a compelling/strong enough point to be included in my Almost50 case, but it

was

one of the things I thought made him scum. I didn't include it in the case because I felt it was a weak point that'd drag the total quality of the case down, but that doesn't mean it isn't a point altogether. Almost50 had

multiple

chances to cast a vote on D2--he chose not to.

You don't find that suspect even remotely?

[Chito and Yuuri]

Almost50 had multiple chances to cast a vote on D2--he chose not to.

Chito: He voted both you and Elena, who you just said is possible scum?

[mastina]

Spoiler: Oh God Please Don't Break

so even interactions aside, a combination of {me, almost, Chito} means all scum were in ch5

And this is supposed to be unlikely...

...Why?

...When alignments were generated after people's picks, and people got their first picks pretty much, and their first picks are the flavor which their neighborhood membership are based upon?

Everyone in channel 48 picked a slice of life anime; everyone in other channels has linked flavor based on some other common traits. Those were always picked, no matter what, and alignments were the next thing rolled. So why wouldn't there be all scum in the same neighborhood? That's like saying there wouldn't be all scum in a row in the playerlist--in spite of the mod using explicitly random alignment generation.

Random doesn't mean "this can't happen", it means it is statistically an anomaly to happen, but can in fact happen and does. A mod who rerolled because all scum were in a row on the playerlist would be using (bleeped because bleep the mod) mod interference.
Same argument applies for neighborhoods--a mod who rerolled because all scum were in one neighborhood would be using that very same mod interference. It is (bleeped because bleep the mod) modding all around so if you believe in the competency of Tatsuya as a moderator, you MUST believe as a direct correlation that Tatsuya would stick to their flavor/alignment guns and no shift things on that merit.

Bullshit!

Oh do tell. Point out what's wrong.
Because my point's pretty damn right.
I am telling you that not as a player.
But as a (bleeped because bleep the mod) moderator.
I'd frankly blacklist a mod who, seeing all the scumteam in a spot, decided "welp that's unacceptable, let's reroll".
And this game being reviewed by mhsmith and Varsoon, I can be confident that even IF Tatsuya WERE that kind of a mod, they would encourage him to not do so, to leave it as-is.

Spoiler: PLEASE DON'T BREAK SITE

One of the terms they have is 贴脸, I don't know if there is an elegant way to translate this term, but what that means is when somebody makes a statement that comes without logic, is purely emotional. Usually is when somebody bets intangible things like reputation, pride, intelligence, personality and emotions to gain trust. Some example could be like "If I'm not town, I will quit mafia forever.", and "If I flip cop, you go eat shit.", these statements are hugely imbalanced for the game and goes against the game's spirit and it's an unspoken rule that you don't make such statements.

And as far as I'm concerned.
That phrase might as well translate to "Welcome to (bleeped because bleep the mod) mafiascum players".

I can and HAVE seen players made the EXACT type of play you are talking about...as scum.
(bleeped because bleep the mod), back in the day.
When AtE kings ruled the day.
Players like RadiantCowbells were INFAMOUS for it.
If he were alive, he'd be the FIRST to tell you as much, in fact.

That what Almost50 said does

not

make him town, that he is just as equally capable of saying it as scum--and would.
Anything which you can do as town, you can do as scum.
ANYTHING.
There are things that are despicable to do as scum--that doesn't mean they aren't done.
There are things that are despicable to do regardless of alignment (and this is what I classify Almost50's action as)--that doesn't mean that they were done as town.

(I'd put a 99% on it).

Would this faith remain if I linked to multiple cases of people making almost identical posts to Almost50...as scum?
Because I can.

You know WHY I can?

Because on mafiascum.

Home of toxicity.

That kind of play.
Is.
Not.
Uncommon.
From.
Scum.

Anyway, your plays coming into the day by voting Elena is tbh, kinda questionable, given your position on the game.

My position on the game is "(bleeped because bleep the mod) everyone else, I don't (bleeped because bleep the mod) care that she's not scum, I want some (bleeped because bleep the mod) vindication" more or less, when it comes to voting Elena.
My vote is currently on Almost50.
But I would move back to Elena if need be for that one reason alone.
Her townflip proves me right.

It serves other purposes. It conftowns Pink Ball.
But it mostly serves to prove me right--not just to others. But also to myself, because being proven right helps me more than not being proven wrong ever would. (Spike and Jet as a lynch, for instance, was a case of me not being proven wrong, but I wouldn't actually call it a case of me being proven right. Elena as a lynch, flipping town, WOULD be a case of me being proven right.)
Like I said.
She is in the POE pool. Her lynch proves I'm not partners with her. Her lynch closes a lot of mislynch options. But I still think she's town, so really my only main reason I'd vote her is exactly what I said, for vindication.

And we can in fact do better than that--thus why I'm voting Almost50.

you voting her too, as I said before, I don't believe your justification.

Dude read our (bleeped because bleep the mod) neighborhood.
I literally said in there.
And this is almost verbatim.
"If you're not dead tomorrow, I'm lynching you".
And you know how I am with promises.

I forget what more I want to say. I'm sure there are more things though.

How about my full commentary on people?

It's not like it's a ton of posts.
Just two.
I mean there's a lot more than those two when it comes to why I'm town, but those two are why everyone except for Almost50 and Near x Mello are town.

Horseshit!

Again, do tell. I can (and in some cases, have) backed my argument up; where's your rebuttal?

READ MATHBLADE'S ISO IN ANY OF HIS PREVIOUS GAMES. IT WON'T GIVE YOU ANY INSIGHT BECAUSE MATHBLADE ISN'T EVEN PLAYING IN THIS GAME, AND THAT PROVES YOU ARE SCUM.

The difference is I've cited actual game evidence that is relevant and pertinent.
Yes, quite a bit of it is in self-defense, but everything I link checks out and has game-relevance to the points I raise.

Except for that one time where I was up late and was rambling.
That one time, sure, yeah, didn't have game relevance, although I later managed to make some from it anyway.
But aside from that one ramble where I went on, everything has had relevance to the points being raised. I gave clear evidence and clear counters and clear cases.

You pretending that they're irrelevant doesn't make them so.

P-edit: You mean when you said..

Fuck

this bullshit the mod just

fucking

warned me.I'm

fucking

done.

?????

Correct. That did happen, in the same tone that Tatsuya posted publicly just now.

[mastina]

Almost50 had multiple chances to cast a vote on D2--he chose not to.

Chito: He voted both you and Elena, who you just said is possible scum?

I was referring to after his unvote.

He had multiple chances to put that vote back on.

He chose not to.

He chose to remain Not Voting at that critical juncture in the game.

That's what I found suspect.

[Almost50]

VOTE MASTINA NOW

mastina flipping scum confirms me, so scum will have to shoot me tonight, and I won't have to spend another week under this #@$% post-restriction. It's damn too frustrating not to be able to vent it out ANYWHERE. At least I'd have the dead thread to throw up in.

[mastina]

He left himself Not Voting there--where he stayed throughout the day.
Why no vote here?
Or here?
Or here?
Here?
When Spike/Jet was being wagoned, why didn't he fight it?
Why didn't he insist that Spike/Jet was town?
Why, when on D1 to counter the Vedith wagon he voted...
...Did he not vote?

On D1, when there was a player he townread (Vedith), Almost50 tried to counterwagon them, and admitted as much.
On D2, a player he townread, Almost50...did nothing for.
The difference between the two is Vedith was scum and Spike/Jet wasn't.

This was my original point. You read this, yes?
So you should know what I mean by it.
Like I said, it didn't make the cut for being a strong compelling point to include in my Almost50 case, but it still resonates AS a valid point.

[Chito and Yuuri]

Chito: Mastina, your arguments for A50 scum kinda ignore the things that make him town. One thing that I know you're not aware of since we haven't really talked about it is that A50 was starting to push Ankamius the same night that scum were nightkilling her (which we know since Gamma vigged RC right) in Channel 5. Just for reference, I have never seen scum push someone in a PT the same night that they are nightkilling that slot.

Feb 26 post A50 post from Channel 5:
"I told you guys Clemency was scum. Ank started by stating ooba not saying much upon his replacement was scummy, but look at where she has him ob the read list. She initially put singleton on the same level as me/Toog but then decided to move them up a notch."

This is the post of someone who is submitting a nightkill on Ank within the next 18 hours of that post? Like... I don't think so.

[mastina]

Chito: Mastina, your arguments for A50 scum kinda ignore the things that make him town.

I've countered those, too, albeit admittedly not as well as I should.

One thing that I know you're not aware of since we haven't really talked about it is that A50 was starting to push Ankamius the same night that scum were nightkilling her (which we know since Gamma vigged RC right) in Channel 5. Just for reference, I have never seen scum push someone in a PT the same night that they are nightkilling that slot.
This is the post of someone who is submitting a nightkill on Ank within the next 18 hours of that post? Like... I don't think so.

Yes?

Like.

It's called.

Using the (bleeped because bleep the mod) neighborhood for cheap-ass towncred.

It's literally a basic bitch move.

Neighborhoods are

ridiculously

easy to manipulate.
You want proof of this?
Look at the list of Large Theme games featuring games that have literally everyone in a neighborhood.

Look at how many of them are town wins.

I'm sure if I thought about it hard enough I'd be able to remember one or two, but in spite of this being a REALLY common mechanic, you know how many of them are scum wins?

Almost literally every single one.
Scum won, in part due to neighborhood manipulation.

[Joan of Arc]

Chito: Mastina, your arguments for A50 scum kinda ignore the things that make him town.

N x M's arguments for why mastina's scum kinda ignore the things than make her town, and I don't see anyone calling them out regarding that, except me.

[Joan of Arc]

and mastina herself

[mastina]

Look at the list of Large Theme games featuring games that have literally everyone in a neighborhood.
Look at how many of them are town wins.

This would take me time to compile, but I legit would be willing to, to prove this point.
Biochemistry, scum win; SMITE, scum win; Night and Day, scum win; etc.

Do you want me to find all the large theme games with the every-player-in-a-neighborhood and check which alignment won?

Because disproportionately, you'll find them to be scum wins, I guarantee it.

For that exact reason.

Scum manipulate what they say in the neighborhood to their advantage.

If Almost50 had said that in the game thread, it'd have been a valid point, believe it or not.
But he didn't.
He specifically said it in the NEIGHBORHOOD.
To manipulate his NEIGHBORS.

[mastina]

Chito: Mastina, your arguments for A50 scum kinda ignore the things that make him town.

N x M's arguments for why mastina's scum kinda ignore the things than make her town, and I don't see anyone calling them out regarding that, except me.

This, too.

[mastina]

Look at the list of Large Theme games featuring games that have literally everyone in a neighborhood. Look at how many of them are town wins.

This would take me time to compile, but I legit would be willing to, to prove this point. Biochemistry, scum win; SMITE, scum win; Night and Day, scum win; etc.
Because disproportionately, you'll find them to be scum wins, I guarantee it.
For that exact reason.
Scum manipulate what they say in the neighborhood to their advantage.

(Btw, I don't count Steven Universe as being an example because technically speaking, the neighborhoods were optional. However, if I did, the town win in Steven Universe 2 is counterbalanced by the equal and opposite scum win in Steven Universe original--and, mind you, it should also be noted that the town win in SU2 was in (bleeped because bleep the mod) lylo, and was VERY close, as both Drixx and Cerb will insist on reminding you. They almost won that game, anyway! And had they, it'd only corroborate my point further. Scum manipulate their neighborhoods in precisely the way they need to in order to pocket members of said neighborhood.)

[mastina]

Oh and by the way.
Open offer.
If you want me to give a single-post case for why I am town, fully down for it.

Would take me some time to write up because there are a LOT of strong (bleeped because bleep the mod) points each of which could be backed up extensively, but I could get it to be like...the ten strongest points or so.

[Near x Mello]

cerb, amz, we need you

[Joan of Arc]

cerb, amz, we need you

Don't you dare listen to this Cerb. If you hammer her now, I really won't like you anymore.

[Joan of Arc]

He isn't even trying over and over and over and over again, and expects all of you to follow blindly. If you give in to his demands like this, then you're not as logical as I thought you were.

[Joan of Arc]

He was all over Chito or Elena yesterday, yet as soon as Almost50 came in swinging, he jumped back onto mastina, abandoning his Chito/Elena scumread on the spot. It was as if he was waiting for someone to provide justification why his preferred mislynch was scum, which Almos50 did.

Don't do as scum wishes.

[Pink Ball]

Look at the list of Large Theme games featuring games that have literally everyone in a neighborhood.
Look at how many of them are town wins.

Scum manipulate what they say in the neighborhood to their advantage.

Sounds like what you did with Torque and Elena tbh

[mastina]

He isn't even trying over and over and over and over again, and expects all of you to follow blindly. If you give in to his demands like this, then you're not as logical as I thought you were.

He was all over Chito or Elena yesterday, yet as soon as Almost50 came in swinging, he jumped back onto mastina, abandoning his Chito/Elena scumread on the spot. It was as if he was waiting for someone to provide justification why his preferred mislynch was scum, which Almos50 did.

Don't do as scum wishes.

You know you've been owned when it is JOAN of all people who raises the strong points.

[Near x Mello]

you know someone is scum when theyre trying to exploit joan's issues to their liking