Micro 857: Burden of Proficiency Mafia

Enter · Fri Mar 15, 2019 4:23 pm

In post 1339, u r a person 2 wrote:
In post 1338, Enter wrote:Correct, but pretend RC is town and it becomes obvious who the pair is
so you're saying that I should be voting Michael Scott again, ya?

I'm saying you're pretty close to fence-sitting and I need you to sit tight for a little bit while we sort things to make sure we get optimal lynch.

Associatives are vital this game. If you want to stop playing and just prodge for a bit until we need your vote for real or we have questions for you, though, I'm good with that. I'd really liked it if you went REALLy in depth on why shoshin is town, but I understand why you wouldn't want to do that

Enter · Fri Mar 15, 2019 4:24 pm

In post 1343, u r a person 2 wrote:UNVOTE:

Explain.

Enter · Fri Mar 15, 2019 4:28 pm

Ok, I thought so I just wanted to check.

Enter · Fri Mar 15, 2019 4:44 pm

RC are you interested in sorting shoshin?

Enter · Fri Mar 15, 2019 4:55 pm

Do you think her opening posts this game come from town?

Enter · Fri Mar 15, 2019 5:01 pm

I also didn't read them as being likely to come from town. Just wanted to put that out there in case that helps at all. That is where a larger portion of the basis for my case against Shoshin begins

Enter · Fri Mar 15, 2019 5:02 pm

None of her play this game makes me feel particularly comfortable, though

Enter · Fri Mar 15, 2019 6:02 pm

Cool. This solves my puzzle.

Shoshin flips MS and then we know who it is based on what alignment he flips

Enter · Fri Mar 15, 2019 6:03 pm

I consider this solved as far as I'm concerned as a paragon so I'm going to back out for a bit, unless people are trying not to flip MS in which case I need to do a bit more hunting

RadiantCowbells wrote:This solves 'your puzzle'

Yes, I understand you still have work to do. I won't impede

Enter · Fri Mar 15, 2019 6:05 pm

I think it's pretty likely, yes.

I also think it's possible that MS/Saudade is a team.

Enter · Fri Mar 15, 2019 6:06 pm

Honestly I have my doubts about Saudade. I can see him flipping either way, so I tried to PoE my way around it.

If you scumread MS that makes it easy on me, because if you flip MS - he flips scum, game solve is MS/Saudade

He flips town, game solve is Shoshin/Urap

Enter · Fri Mar 15, 2019 6:08 pm

In post 1361, Shoshin wrote:Why is Saudade town?

Maybe I'm overthinking this, but I don't think it's as simple as you think. I don't see a huge similarity to his scum game that isn't here in his town game. I guess he isn't being very solv-y here, to be honest, but he does seem to try with his first posts.

I honestly mostly townread him because it makes you guys look at him harder. And because it makes my PoE easier.

Enter · Fri Mar 15, 2019 6:08 pm

In post 1363, Shoshin wrote:We're not playing for your solve so that isn't helpful to me. I'd like to know if there's actual reasons to townread Saudade.

I know. I agree with you here. I'm just saying my wincon is reached, afaik. I don't see a huge point in me investing large sums of time into the game anymore because I can judge based off flip

Enter · Fri Mar 15, 2019 6:12 pm

Honestly Shoshin it's comforting to me that we're at the same place in the game now. Like I'm having the same thoughts you are as far as this game goes. And I would definitely be in the same place as far as the solve.

Maybe I put too much thought into this and it really is as simple as Michael Scott/Saudade.

Enter · Fri Mar 15, 2019 6:15 pm

In post 1370, RadiantCowbells wrote:I still don't scumread Michael Scott.

I'm thinking about Shoshin Saudade right now.

I think Saudade could be buddied with Shoshin...

but I don't think Shoshin could be buddied with Saudade.

Enter · Fri Mar 15, 2019 6:17 pm

In post 1376, RadiantCowbells wrote:
In post 1373, Enter wrote:
In post 1370, RadiantCowbells wrote:I still don't scumread Michael Scott.

I'm thinking about Shoshin Saudade right now.
I think Saudade could be buddied with Shoshin...

but I don't think Shoshin could be buddied with Saudade.
Why?

Shoshin took Saudade off L1

Fair, but Shoshin's posts read like she has no problems flipping him.

Also she only didn't flip him because you wanted to lynch Saudade's buddy, I think

Enter · Fri Mar 15, 2019 6:19 pm

In post 1381, Shoshin wrote:The reason I have doubts about you is because you didn't vote Sau, RC. The fact you're suddenly pushing me/Sau is making it seem like maybe those doubts are right.

This is why she's not buddies with Sau.

Buddied with MS? Sure. Buddied with Urap? Sure.

Sau? never.

Enter · Fri Mar 15, 2019 6:20 pm

I have a townread on urap, BTW

and I'll stick around to try and help you guys get your solve

Enter · Fri Mar 15, 2019 6:20 pm

In post 1384, RadiantCowbells wrote:Enter you're thinking extremely one dimensionally about the game

Ok why is it that the only person she talks about lynching is saudade?

Enter · Fri Mar 15, 2019 6:20 pm

She hasn't really shown any willingness to vote MS, iirc

lemme check actually

Enter · Fri Mar 15, 2019 6:22 pm

In post 144, singletonking wrote:Hi.

Everyone, which of the two lurkers would you rather lynch right now?

In post 145, Shoshin wrote:Michael Scott.

hmm...

Enter · Fri Mar 15, 2019 6:24 pm

In post 1388, RadiantCowbells wrote:Like if you're scum in a situation where I'm probably never being targeted by the paragons you -need- to have really good cross associatives.

Ok why is it that the only person she talks about lynching is saudade?
She also talks about lynching MS

Have you ever heard of white flag gambit

cuz Shoshin definitely strikes me as a gambiter

I agree that if you're not feeling super confident as scum

gambitting is a relatively common way to get town reads.

But her and Saudade... Idk it doesn't look right to me

Enter · Fri Mar 15, 2019 6:25 pm

In post 1390, RadiantCowbells wrote:I'm not saying that anything is anything

But I feel like my alignment shouldn't be in question

I just REALLY STRONGLY doubt that Shoshin and Saudade are scum together

they've taken it too far for it ti be a thing

Enter · Fri Mar 15, 2019 6:26 pm

In post 1392, RadiantCowbells wrote:Ok well in the nomination phase you're free to do your thing

I'm having second thoughts about scum URAP and I still townread MS so...

I feel like I always ahve the inverse of your reads

Enter · Fri Mar 15, 2019 6:26 pm

THat's possible and fair

Enter · Fri Mar 15, 2019 6:29 pm

In post 1399, RadiantCowbells wrote:There's weird things like Shoshin saying that she wanted other people to double check her meta, Shoshin unvoting at L1, still scumreading me even though no matter who my scumbuddy is I have had ample opportunity to have this game long over, etc.

It's almost like I've been saying Shoshin is scum for actually forever

Enter · Fri Mar 15, 2019 6:31 pm

When the paranoia gets to you sometimes you just have to push it back down

it's fine we've all been there

I'm doubting my shoshin scumread but I still like it better than a urap scumread

Enter · Fri Mar 15, 2019 6:31 pm

Flipping Sau solves absolutely nothing unless Sau flips scum

so I sure fukcing hope you're right if you're trying to flip Sau right now

Enter · Fri Mar 15, 2019 6:33 pm

RC

who have you seen Michael Scott push? like seriously? He even backtracked on his urap townread

Enter · Fri Mar 15, 2019 6:34 pm

MS isn't trying to reach any final conclusions

Enter · Fri Mar 15, 2019 6:34 pm

In post 1415, RadiantCowbells wrote:
In post 1408, Enter wrote:Flipping Sau solves absolutely nothing unless Sau flips scum

so I sure fukcing hope you're right if you're trying to flip Sau right now
Keep in mind that this concern isn't really important for us.lol

I'm just pointing out that if you lose this game by flipping Sau

you might lose it for us, too

Enter · Fri Mar 15, 2019 6:37 pm

In post 1417, Shoshin wrote:I think most likely partner for Sau is MS. And somehow you're townreading MS more than me, RC? That feels wrong to me.

She has a point

Enter · Fri Mar 15, 2019 6:37 pm

In post 1418, u r a person 2 wrote:
In post 1416, Enter wrote:
In post 1415, RadiantCowbells wrote:
In post 1408, Enter wrote:Flipping Sau solves absolutely nothing unless Sau flips scum

so I sure fukcing hope you're right if you're trying to flip Sau right now
Keep in mind that this concern isn't really important for us.lol
I'm just pointing out that if you lose this game by flipping Sau

you might lose it for us, too
literally not my problem.

It's weird, and it's totally a dick thing to say, but you have an incentive to help us and we have zero incentive to help you.

I have zero incentive to help you at this point, but I am.

Michael Scott is a higher equity lynch.

Enter · Fri Mar 15, 2019 6:38 pm

In post 1420, u r a person 2 wrote:I guess I say this because when you talk about your wincon, it actually gives me an immediate impulse of wanting to do the opposite, and you should probably take that into account while manipulating our votes

Understand that I overcome the same reaction when you talk about your wincon.

But I'm here because gamesolving is fun, working through this shit is fun, and I can get over a little bit of pride to try and figure out what the fuck is actually going on here.

I know where you're coming from. Look at the support for the Saudade wagon. Don't believe me? Have Michael scott be on the Saudade Lynch

Enter · Fri Mar 15, 2019 6:40 pm

Guaran-fucking-tee I'm not pushing anyone's lynch right now

it's more fun working with you, rc, even if I consider game solved

Enter · Fri Mar 15, 2019 6:43 pm

@wincon shit

whatever I don't care honestly about me thinking i've reached my wincon

i enjoy the gamesolvy shit

you're right i'm sorry i shouldn't have asked you to lynch ms for me

i personally think it's a better move to lynch michael scott for you

really at this point the best idea is to be pushing MS and saudade to be giving opinions on each other and pushing against each other

Enter · Fri Mar 15, 2019 6:44 pm

In post 1428, RadiantCowbells wrote:I'm sorry if you're town and I've been making this game unplayable for you

Naw, it's been fun! Hope shit gets better!

In post 1429, Enter wrote:@wincon shit

whatever I don't care honestly about me thinking i've reached my wincon

i enjoy the gamesolvy shit

you're right i'm sorry i shouldn't have asked you to lynch ms for me

i personally think it's a better move to lynch michael scott for you

really at this point the best idea is to be pushing MS and saudade to be giving opinions on each other and pushing against each other

Really this is probably the best way to approach things rn as far as solving goes

Enter · Fri Mar 15, 2019 6:49 pm

In post 1431, Shoshin wrote:If MS flips town, who would you select Enter?

It honestly depends on how the wagon goes down.

It's between urap2 and Saude

and you and urap2

Before I would have said the second statement is far more likely than the first but I honestly doubt MS flips town

and I'm starting to lean less scum on youo

Enter · Fri Mar 15, 2019 8:22 pm

MS do you legitimately believe that Sho/Sau is a solve?

Enter · Fri Mar 15, 2019 8:25 pm

What game was that? Was this the one I was in?

Enter · Fri Mar 15, 2019 9:24 pm

lol.

so does anyone still believe saudade is scum

Enter · Fri Mar 15, 2019 9:25 pm

now that we've all compared sizes to prove we' can vote him

Enter · Fri Mar 15, 2019 9:46 pm

my read on saudade is only getting stronger town

Enter · Fri Mar 15, 2019 9:48 pm

In post 1563, u r a person 2 wrote:
In post 1326, RadiantCowbells wrote:I'm doing my best

Why did you quote this?

I know what it is in response to

But I know of two possible points you can be making

I want to hear it in your words.

Enter · Fri Mar 15, 2019 9:50 pm

In post 1575, Saudade wrote:you have my vote ill give shoshin the benefit of the doubt that she's just senile

you think she's town?

Enter · Fri Mar 15, 2019 9:52 pm

In post 1569, Enter wrote:
In post 1563, u r a person 2 wrote:
In post 1326, RadiantCowbells wrote:I'm doing my best
Why did you quote this?

I know what it is in response to

But I know of two possible points you can be making

I want to hear it in your words.

I do want an answer to this

Enter · Fri Mar 15, 2019 10:07 pm

In post 1580, u r a person 2 wrote:
In post 1569, Enter wrote:
In post 1563, u r a person 2 wrote:
In post 1326, RadiantCowbells wrote:I'm doing my best
Why did you quote this?

I know what it is in response to

But I know of two possible points you can be making

I want to hear it in your words.
because it was going to be my response, and I remembered that he had made the post and I thought it was cheeky

ninja'd

ok... so it was because you think that rc does things that should be read as scum

or that you should be read as town because rc is read as town and he did it

Enter · Fri Mar 15, 2019 10:17 pm

no one should be scumreading saudade right now unless for some reason you are scumreading rc

Enter · Fri Mar 15, 2019 11:15 pm

@RC

In post 1555, Saudade wrote:
In post 1425, u r a person 2 wrote:
In post 1424, RadiantCowbells wrote:Listen

I have RL stuff weighing on me and it doesn't make it any easier to solve the game. It actually makes it a lot harder for me

It would be very helpful if I could trust you guys not to Lynch anyone for a day and the paragons not to encourage lynches for at least a day. Please?

I know that if you guys are town I am by far the weak link right now but I need a break to change that
this is massively too large of an ask
no it isnt shut up keep your dick in your pants for a day and shoot nobody

=====

In post 1574, u r a person 2 wrote:at the risk of being conf!scum in your mind, I'll have to defer until morning. I said I was going to bed an hour ago, and I should have.

The short answer is

RC is town
Shoshin is town or scum with you

consult my iso for more

I actually don't like this response to Saudade's push on him

I expected differently.

Enter · Fri Mar 15, 2019 11:19 pm

Does anyone remember why I might have discounted a Shoshin/MS team? My brain remembers something about it but I can't find it.

Enter · Fri Mar 15, 2019 11:21 pm

In post 1574, u r a person 2 wrote:at the risk of being conf!scum in your mind, I'll have to defer until morning. I said I was going to bed an hour ago, and I should have.

The short answer is

RC is town
Shoshin is town or scum with you

consult my iso for more

I've been staring at this for a while now...

There's two options here: URAP2 realizing he's confbiased into Saudade and he doesn't actually have a legitimate argument right now

or URAP2 is scum and never had a legitimate scum read on Saudade.

Enter · Fri Mar 15, 2019 11:22 pm

In post 1599, Enter wrote:
In post 1574, u r a person 2 wrote:at the risk of being conf!scum in your mind, I'll have to defer until morning. I said I was going to bed an hour ago, and I should have.

The short answer is

RC is town
Shoshin is town or scum with you

consult my iso for more
I've been staring at this for a while now...

There's two options here: URAP2 realizing he's confbiased into Saudade and he doesn't actually have a legitimate argument right now

or URAP2 is scum and never had a legitimate scum read on Saudade.

Posts like this don't come from people who have an argument in mind that they legitimately believe

Enter · Fri Mar 15, 2019 11:58 pm

Right but sometimes it is more believable when you know the alignment of the slot who's making the argument.

Who do you think scum pair is?

Enter · Sat Mar 16, 2019 12:18 am

Hm. OK, I will think about it. You should work through your thoughts on possibilities as much as you can in the thread, especially cuz you were pushing shoshin earlier. The more people can follow your process the easier it will be for people to town read you

Enter · Sat Mar 16, 2019 5:26 am

In post 1610, u r a person 2 wrote:Shoshin is pretty much only ever scum if she is scum with suade because of the dynamics of the meta push

RC is pretty much only ever scum with suade because the above rules out shoshin, plus their 1v1, and RC + MS doesn't make sense because there is no way with the paragon bit coming up that RC has basically let their entire interaction be an unexplained town read onto ms.

which, by extension means MS is basically only ever scum with suade and that suade is scum.

I've only gone through this like half a fucking dozen times, enter.

And if you think that act from suade last night was townie, I'm not sure if there is hope for you.

Nice. I disagree on pretty much every point here, but it doesn't matter because when you flip them it will pretty obvious where you're wrong.

Enter · Sat Mar 16, 2019 5:27 am

If you can't see why Saude is town that's a you problem, I can only help you so much.

Enter · Sat Mar 16, 2019 8:01 am

@anyone but Shoshin

do you think Shoshin has a solid scumgame?
Specifically how does she typically react to people scumreading herr as scum?

Enter · Sat Mar 16, 2019 8:02 am

shsohin you can answer too but it helps me more if i get the perspective from someoneelse

Enter · Sat Mar 16, 2019 9:19 am

Quick Jingle forgot who the scum team was just raise your hand if you are so he can be reminded

Enter · Sat Mar 16, 2019 9:24 pm

In post 1675, RadiantCowbells wrote:oh i wasn't in 1674, i just remember it because of the playerlist and stuff

I was in 1674

In post 1686, Michael Scott wrote:
In post 1677, RadiantCowbells wrote:check post #s lol
That you post high?

No, look at the post number of the post he posts it in

Enter · Sat Mar 16, 2019 9:34 pm

on the list of "most fun mafia games I've been in recently" i would put this game as #2.

Let's see how the climax goes

Enter · Sun Mar 17, 2019 7:08 am

In post 1703, RadiantCowbells wrote:am i?

you don't know what my reads are

i am 100% confident i have one scum

the sole reason i'm doing this is to help the paragons

Thank you.

Enter · Sun Mar 17, 2019 5:04 pm

In post 1809, Shoshin wrote:I could have closed this game out many times on either of Saudade, U2, or MS at this point, so you must realize I'm not scum either?

This is objectively false.
The only player you came close to was Saudade, and even then you would have had to convince URAP to keep his vote there until your partner came online.

Enter · Sun Mar 17, 2019 5:09 pm

In post 1812, Shoshin wrote:I disagree, Enter.

Please quote the posts that put you in a position to do what you claim.

In post 1813, Shoshin wrote:It's also besides the point. I'm not getting lynched.

It's not besides the point, a player getting lynched doesn't end the game, just the day.

Enter · Sun Mar 17, 2019 5:57 pm

In post 1871, Shoshin wrote:
In post 1869, RadiantCowbells wrote:Note that Saudade is currently saying he refuses to vote you and wants to vote URAP. I think if you think it's URAP Shoshin is the likely buddy
Saudade won't vote me? I'm confused at what you're saying.

He was talking to MS.

Enter · Sun Mar 17, 2019 6:09 pm

Can we please stop with :

please don't screw this up

Why are we so bad at this game, RC?

No one here is new to the game. It just makes it harder to read people.

Enter · Sun Mar 17, 2019 6:12 pm

In post 1744, Saudade wrote:
In post 1743, Saudade wrote:
In post 1741, RadiantCowbells wrote:Saudade who do you think both scum are
I think urap2 is scum
and like I've stated before the most reasonable choice for partner would be Scott

but I cant case him nor can I make a case for you & Shoshin to be town at this point so I dont care
Scott because He was the only one not expressing a will to vote me at the time of his move on me

In post 1745, Saudade wrote:Which would make the perfect distancing for him in the eyes of the paragons if you shoshin and he had me lynched

In post 1746, Saudade wrote:But that's like a very weak case so I'm just All-In urap

In post 1751, Saudade wrote:if hes town
im back to shoshin

In post 1752, Saudade wrote:I mean if being a lazy shit player is her meta then I guess shes town too and then its you and Scotty

Enter · Sun Mar 17, 2019 6:13 pm

In post 1894, Michael Scott wrote:"X and Y is my solve but I'm only voting X" is unnatural.

In post 1896, Michael Scott wrote:Saudade. Maintains that URAP+MS is the solve, but said he'd only vote URAP.

No, he didn't. He said he was confident on URAP and doesn't care past that. See quoted posts above. Stop misrepping people.

Enter · Sun Mar 17, 2019 6:14 pm

In post 1900, Shoshin wrote:We might be overthinking things and it's just Saudade.

This post isn't town.

RadiantCowbells wrote:i mean

it can't be
just
saudade

if you get what i'm saying

Agree

Enter · Sun Mar 17, 2019 6:18 pm

In post 1904, Shoshin wrote:
In post 1902, Enter wrote:This post isn't town.
You're so tunneled, man. I've made this exact post as town many times.

Possible, but unlikely. I'm considering URAP as well. The URAP/Saudade case is bad, though. RC is town. MS/Saudade is the only slight possibility, but that seems deeply unlikely. And since you're you, you should know you're unlikely to be scum w/ Saudade.

I can see "it's possible we're overthinking this and it's just MS/Saudade" but to say it's just a single player in this game after RC started hunting for buddies is scum.

In post 1906, Michael Scott wrote:
In post 1693, Saudade wrote:Not to have my previous words misrepresented, i wont be voting michael.
Urap is the man for me
He dressed it that he's confident enough in URAP and doesn't care, but at its core, it's the same thing.

No, he didn't. You're taking things out of context.

Enter · Sun Mar 17, 2019 6:19 pm

Sorry "No, he didn't" should have been "No, it's not."

Enter · Sun Mar 17, 2019 6:22 pm

In post 1911, RadiantCowbells wrote:i think urap/saudade is pretty plausible

Possibly, but I'm not a fan of the cases presented.

I think MS/Shoshin is more likely.

I don't want to scumread MS, and Shoshin has made quite a few posts that make me doubt her, but when I walk myself through their actions I see them as scum.

The MS post that was most recently made about URAP gave me pause until I actually read it. I don't know. It's possible I'm wrong, and you're definitely better and more experienced than I am. I'm just not sure URAP/Saudade makes all that much sense.

Enter · Sun Mar 17, 2019 6:23 pm

In post 1914, Shoshin wrote:Don't worry, Aubrey. Enter's embarrassing himself. It'll be pretty funny after the game.

How necessary was this?

How necessary was it for you to appeal to RC earlier?

Enter · Sun Mar 17, 2019 6:24 pm

Actually, in what way was that necessary at all?

If I'm wrong, I'm wrong on a day 1 scum read with no way to actually know for certain any alignments and no flips to reveal anything at all. How is that embarrassing?

Enter · Sun Mar 17, 2019 6:25 pm

I'm actually doing my very best to win this game and I'm working hard to try and keep my biases out of it. You should see the paragon thread. Please keep this kind of stuff to yourself for now.

Whatever, I'm sensitive and insecure. I'm sorry. I'll back off.

Enter · Sun Mar 17, 2019 6:33 pm

I don't feel like you respond to the things directly, and that makes my read on you worse.

In post 1922, RadiantCowbells wrote:tbh i don't ever vote you. don't have the willpower to.

This is why it's particularly hard for me to town read you: You're getting defensive and it's not you who's being pushed to lynch. I don't think at any point this game have you been the one to be pushed to lynch except in the opener. So what reason do you have to be defensive?

Enter · Sun Mar 17, 2019 6:36 pm

Posts where Shoshin talks about me indirectly instead of directly addressing points made against her:

In post 1270, Shoshin wrote:I could care less if Enter loses.

In post 577, Shoshin wrote:I'm taking a small amount of joy in knowing that Enter thinks I'm this good as scum.

In post 526, Shoshin wrote:I'm so glad I don't have to sort Enter this game.

In post 516, Shoshin wrote:It feels like paragons want RC lynched so they don't have to sort him. I don't see Enter's analysis coming from a genuine attempt to sort the game.

At this point I'm not sure if this is even AI, so I'm not pushing this as anything, I'm just trying to help.

Enter · Sun Mar 17, 2019 6:37 pm

I'm going to take a break for a bit and go eat and then come back when my head has cleared.

Enter · Sun Mar 17, 2019 7:13 pm

Alright. I overreacted and was far too sensitive. I apologize.

In addition, my phrasing could have been better, and it's probably better to address the thread with concerns in place of statements. However, the post you quoted was not meant to give you concerns to deal with, but to maintain a sort of balance. Almost half the town is scum in this game, which means there is a larger proportion of intentional misinformation from informed players to genuine thought process in this game than there is in a typical game, taking only the mafia and town players into account. My thought process is guaranteed genuine and uncorrupted, so I'm trying to maintain it so people can look at my thought process and use it to keep a baseline for their own thoughts. If I am posting thoughts in agreement with their own, it is possible people disagreeing with them are scum, trying to feed them disinformation, if mine disagrees with theirs, it's a good reason to consider whether or not I may be just making poor decisions with my thinking or maybe the player should reconsider their own thoughts on that slot. I'm not trying to tell you I'm scum, I'm trying to show people like RC what I think is scummy about you so he can decide if I'm dumb or I have something legitimate worth listening to.

Enter · Sun Mar 17, 2019 7:31 pm

At risk of reaching point of apathy I'll reread with new eyes tomorrow and try and case everyone.

Enter · Sun Mar 17, 2019 7:58 pm

Urap, if you would read and respond to his wall post, that would help.

Enter · Sun Mar 17, 2019 8:16 pm

In post 1947, RadiantCowbells wrote:I could Lynch saudade

I actually just said in paragon thread that I think this might make the most sense for you guys right now, but I was afraid to share because I don't want to influence you that direction when he has no obvious partners. This isn't necessarily a case of me trying to play to my wincon (although it certainly influenced my decision a little), my major fear is that if EVERYONE wants Saudade lynched, doesn't that mean he's town? I also believe he has a pattern of getting mislynched as town because I don't see large differences in the game I linked you and here. Perhaps I'm wrong, however, and I've decided to share and let you decide for yourself.

Enter · Sun Mar 17, 2019 8:19 pm

In post 1945, Michael Scott wrote:
In post 1943, u r a person 2 wrote:yeah, that's all you said. my bad. i inferred it - correctly tho, so not sure why it matters
Almost like you... Planned that comment with him, and predicted that I would eventually say this.

Wondering what trajectory you would've taken if I had said that, but huh.

This seems a bit far fetched...

Enter · Sun Mar 17, 2019 8:34 pm

In post 1963, RadiantCowbells wrote:I can't do this anymore I'm going nuts trying to solve

I know the feeling.

Enter · Sun Mar 17, 2019 8:34 pm

In post 1966, Enter wrote:
In post 1963, RadiantCowbells wrote:I can't do this anymore I'm going nuts trying to solve
I know the feeling.

Because I've been experiencing it all game.

Enter · Sun Mar 17, 2019 8:37 pm

I will keep my paranoia about the Saudade lynch outside of this thread, but I'm letting you all know it's there so that I take no responsibility either way. If he flips scum, I'm just dumb and I get no credit for his lynch. If he flips town, I also take no responsibility for his lynch.

Enter · Sun Mar 17, 2019 8:38 pm

It was four minutes.

FTR I'm also paranoid about Shoshin flipping town, so maybe just ignore everything I'm doing.

Enter · Sun Mar 17, 2019 9:19 pm

In post 1989, RadiantCowbells wrote:Let's do it for the homies

I'm hammering

P sure the homies are scum, but that's just me. :3

Enter · Sun Mar 17, 2019 9:34 pm

I have now become overcome with stress with the amount of work I have ahead of me.

48 hours, eh? Probably 48 hours from the flip. I'll probably put this off until tomorrow morning and then get to work.

Enter · Sun Mar 17, 2019 9:34 pm

In post 2001, Enter wrote:I have now become overcome with stress with the amount of work I have ahead of me.

48 hours, eh? Probably 48 hours from the flip. I'll probably put this off until tomorrow morning and then get to work.

I'm half joking here, BTW. Don't worry about me, I'm fine.

Enter · Mon Mar 18, 2019 5:05 am

In post 2016, u r a person 2 wrote:I think I'd go with either Shoshin + MS

nope that's the one

If I were a paragon I'd go with Shoshin + MS

In post 2017, u r a person 2 wrote:3:1 odds say paragons get this wrong by voting RC

As the person who pushed Shoshin MS for half the game thread I guarantee I'd rather be wrong and it's not shoshin MS than be wrong because I second guessed myself and said RC

Enter · Mon Mar 18, 2019 5:12 am

Oh look it's 2019

Enter · Mon Mar 18, 2019 5:22 am

In post 2021, u r a person 2 wrote:this is one instance where I would gladly be wrong!

*squints eyes*

Enter · Mon Mar 18, 2019 5:24 am

In post 2021, u r a person 2 wrote:this is one instance where I would gladly be wrong!

I'm not trying to influence the paragon's guess, I swear!

Lol I will actually jump up and down three times in frustration if it is you and RC.

Enter · Mon Mar 18, 2019 5:26 am

Ok I trust you but just this once and also because if RC is scum we've already lost

Enter · Mon Mar 18, 2019 5:35 am

I hate that urap was a town read for me but I can't ignore the fact that influencing the paragons is a scum motivated action...

Enter · Mon Mar 18, 2019 7:01 am

Yes. Don't do it.

Enter · Mon Mar 18, 2019 7:02 am

Eh, whatever, I'm not uptight. Sure do whatever you want.

Enter · Mon Mar 18, 2019 8:48 am

game starts and ends w/ drama between rc and shoshin

w/ urap egging them on...

what a narrative

Enter · Mon Mar 18, 2019 8:49 am

ms ur honorary paragon rn

Enter · Mon Mar 18, 2019 8:50 am

In post 2123, u r a person 2 wrote:yikes

ms is scum for sure mate

just because he's honorary paragon doesn't mean he's not scum

just means i wanna hear more of his thoughts

Enter · Mon Mar 18, 2019 1:09 pm

That makes sense

You wanna be the honorary paragon? StK isn't here.

Enter · Mon Mar 18, 2019 1:16 pm

I'm really trying to decide between URAP and MS...

I probably should have pushed URAP more during the day

Enter · Mon Mar 18, 2019 6:30 pm

In post 2157, Shoshin wrote:Even paragons had no paranoia about him.

Every time you guys say something like what our thoughts are, I laugh to myself. Y'all are in for a surprise when you read the paragon thread.

Enter · Mon Mar 18, 2019 6:34 pm

Not the whole game. I'm very confident in you at some points. I'm just scared, RC. When I ISO Shoshin I'm seeing some stuff that pings me hard and other stuff that looks very very townie. I hate not understanding people, RC. I hate reading people wrong and I really don't wanna make anyone mad.

Enter · Mon Mar 18, 2019 6:35 pm

It's always right before the lynch I doubt myself the most and we are right before the lynch right now so I'm doing my very best to not let my feelings control my decision making. I'm going through the possible scum teams and the ISOs tomorrow and seeing who I can guarantee rule out and then we will come to a decision.

Enter · Mon Mar 18, 2019 6:46 pm

I wouldn't ...

I don't think you're a legitimate consideration right now, RC. I'm just sharing that I'm paranoid. If you're scum I think you've already won, honestly, and deserve the win, because the only thing you've done so far this game is play to a town WINCON, with the possible exceptions of pushing to find out who the second scum is to help us out at the end. It defies all logic to lynch someone for playing to the town win condition to the best of their ability just because you're scared of them and that's not the kind of person I am. I try to play with my head, not my heart, when making decisions like that, because this way I can reach conclusions that make sense to me (like that one). Aubrey is convinced you're town, too, so if you're scum you can as good as claim, you've won.

Enter · Mon Mar 18, 2019 6:49 pm

In post 2168, Michael Scott wrote:
In post 2162, Enter wrote:
In post 2157, Shoshin wrote:Even paragons had no paranoia about him.
Every time you guys say something like what our thoughts are, I laugh to myself. Y'all are in for a surprise when you read the paragon thread.
Oh interesting. So you considered the scum!RC world seriously throughout the game, but intentionally played as though you townread him?

Yes. It's something I'm trying out. I don't know if it works very well, but I think there are some people that will be easier to read if you just town read them until you don't. Allowing people to see your growing suspicions might cause them to not do scummy things before they're caught - that's my theory anyways. Especially since I have a tendency to be afraid of everyone, picking a few people to say that I hold as town reads as a basis for logically working through the player base just makes the game that much easier, anyways.

Enter · Mon Mar 18, 2019 7:14 pm

In post 2172, Shoshin wrote:
In post 2169, Enter wrote:the only thing you've done so far this game is play to a town WINCON
I don't know how you come up with this stuff, Enter.

Lynching Saudade was anything but.

If this is the only point you can come up with against him I don't particularly see how what I've come up with is anything particularly dismissable. Sausage lynch was bad, sure, but it's easy to say that in hindsight.

Enter · Mon Mar 18, 2019 7:20 pm

Damn it. Saudades play wasn't anything particularly townie and you know that. You were scumreading him for pretty much as far as I can tell. I didn't agree with the Saudade lynch, sure, but my reads are legitimately bad sometimes and I was doubting myself right before anyways. I disagree that the saudade lynch itself is enough reason to call someone scum, I think it's pretty similar to pushing someone's lynch over a disagreement.

Michael Scott wrote:
In post 2174, Enter wrote:Sausage lynch
I love autocorrect.

Yeah, now you don't know if I'm talking about Saudade or the wurst.

Enter · Mon Mar 18, 2019 7:24 pm

Right? Am I crazy? Is it really bad for me to think a Saudade lynch is NAI?

Enter · Mon Mar 18, 2019 7:27 pm

It could be URAP + MS.

No. It couldn't be. They both pushed each other. A lot.

It could be URAP + Shoshin, but it couldn't really be that, either, because Shoshin seems to have legitimate concerns about URAPs alignment. Which is indicative of town. Is it possible that Shoshin just played a damn good scum game with URAP?

I think the simplest explanation is MS/Shoshin.

Enter · Mon Mar 18, 2019 7:39 pm

I'm so incentivized to make the wrong decision right now. Trust me I want to just put it through. But MS' post game play is not indicative of playing to a scum wincon, especially for a player who knows I very much suspect it is you and him.

Enter · Mon Mar 18, 2019 7:43 pm

I'm going to rule out MS completely based solely off of the refusal to try and screw with my reads when he has every reason to try to do so. Someone tell me I'm completely mad if this is the case.

Enter · Mon Mar 18, 2019 7:51 pm

Nothing is implausible about RC/U2, that's what scares me. The fact that that team made the most sense to me on page 1 of the paragon thread when Jingle asked us who the scum team was is the reason I don't know. I get caught up in the idea of something. The possibility that something could be one way, but far too often it isn't. I miss the small details somewhere. There's no way urap/rc open wolf so hard where rc comes at you and urap hard town reads him. It can't be that simple. And Aubrey is convinced it isn't RC.

Enter · Mon Mar 18, 2019 7:52 pm

In post 2188, Shoshin wrote:I think RC/U2 wins this game, Enter. I know you're going to select me, and I wish there was something I could do to change your mind but whatever.

If it helps your recent posting is helping me work through this better. I've ruled you + MS out completely.

Enter · Mon Mar 18, 2019 9:50 pm

I have now stressed to the point of apathy.

Enter · Mon Mar 18, 2019 9:51 pm

Is shoshin urap a thing?

Everyone is happy so I'm wrong somewhere

Enter · Mon Mar 18, 2019 9:52 pm

I hate myself every time I decide something my gut reaction is to immediately go back on it

Enter · Mon Mar 18, 2019 9:53 pm

I'm unlocking MS from not being scum

Enter · Mon Mar 18, 2019 9:54 pm

In post 51, Shoshin wrote:If you're actually town, I'm replacing out of this RC.

Is this a scum post?

Enter · Mon Mar 18, 2019 9:54 pm

In post 11, Shoshin wrote:Hey U2, why are you trusting obvscum RC?

Is this a town post?

Enter · Mon Mar 18, 2019 9:56 pm

In post 38, RadiantCowbells wrote:bullshit bullshit bullshit bullshit bullshit

"hey rc you're super cute i love you lets team up"

"ok (your partner) is super scum we're lynching them"

"ummm. . . . ."

Is this you responding to urap?

Enter · Mon Mar 18, 2019 9:56 pm

No it's you saying shoshin wouldn't buddy you cuz that would be dumb

Enter · Mon Mar 18, 2019 9:56 pm

OK, got it.

Enter · Mon Mar 18, 2019 9:58 pm

Does it scare you at all that Shoshin doesn't seem particularly interested in finding reasons to talk about why she's not scum now that I don't think MS is scum?

Enter · Mon Mar 18, 2019 9:59 pm

Enter · Mon Mar 18, 2019 10:00 pm

You think URAP buddies you hard as an opener to this game?

PEdit: yeah. You're right. Sorry, I'll go back to paragon hideout

Enter · Mon Mar 18, 2019 11:07 pm

I mean. I'm also confirmed town. So is Aubrey. Your thoughts without the why aren't very helpful

Enter · Tue Mar 19, 2019 12:17 am

Thanks, this helps.

Enter · Tue Mar 19, 2019 1:53 am

I've locked it in.

Enter · Tue Mar 19, 2019 1:53 am

In post 2230, Aubrey wrote:
In post 2227, Saudade wrote:God bless Aubrey the guy probably havent read half the game

To be fair, the game went to 90 pages in less than a week.

Enter · Tue Mar 19, 2019 1:59 am

You and Shoshin.

I know, I know. I'm really dumb. I explained it in the Paragon thread.

Enter · Tue Mar 19, 2019 2:01 am

Basically I used your logic for reading URAP - both RC and Shoshin were townreading URAP until the end
Post game they were both scumreading him, makes sense for it to happen if he's town because one will be a paranoia read and the other will be because they want us to pick wrong
In addition, after I said I'd locktowned you, Shoshin stopped posting or showing interest in proving herself town.

Enter · Tue Mar 19, 2019 2:01 am

In post 2238, Aubrey wrote:God dammit enter I just realized we should have faked claimed a lock in.

Now I will actually feel terrible regardless of the outcome of this game

because I could have played it smarter. Darn!

Enter · Tue Mar 19, 2019 2:02 am

LOL if it's RC and URAP I swear

Enter · Tue Mar 19, 2019 2:10 am

In post 2244, Auro wrote:So now that it's over, for what reasons did you think I was independently scummy? :O

I didn't see you ever really try to sort players

Or rather, I saw effort, not results.

Enter · Tue Mar 19, 2019 2:16 am

In post 2246, Auro wrote:
In post 2245, Enter wrote:
In post 2244, Auro wrote:So now that it's over, for what reasons did you think I was independently scummy? :O
I didn't see you ever really try to sort players

Or rather, I saw effort, not results.
I think you misconstrue results for emotion.
Did you read my other games?

No, I don't think I do.

When I was trying to solve this, I was trying to work through it logically: Who makes sense w/ whom, etc. But in order for me to do that, I had to start somewhere, make assumptions to move forward, etc.

You didn't do any of this. I didn't see you say anything like "I assume RC is town because of this, therefore =>" and then follow through with that thought process very much at all.

Enter · Tue Mar 19, 2019 2:20 am

The Saude lynch did not help us at all.

Saudade was my strongest town read, so as far as sorting who the scum were, allowing him to get lynched really hurt me significantly. (I say that as if I really had much control over the lynch)

Auro wrote:
In post 2250, Enter wrote:You didn't do any of this. I didn't see you say anything like "I assume RC is town because of this, therefore =>" and then follow through with that thought process very much at all.
Just because I don't detail out the entirety of my thought process doesn't mean it doesn't exist, hahaha.
When Volxen made the wall post you guys liked it - but I brought up many of the points within the wall at different parts of time before that, for example.

Yes but also because you don't post your thought process, I can't read your thought process, hence scum reads.

Enter · Tue Mar 19, 2019 2:21 am

In post 2253, Auro wrote:
In post 2250, Enter wrote:You didn't do any of this. I didn't see you say anything like "I assume RC is town because of this, therefore =>" and then follow through with that thought process very much at all.
Just because I don't detail out the entirety of my thought process doesn't mean it doesn't exist, hahaha.
When Volxen made the wall post you guys liked it - but I brought up many of the points within the wall at different parts of time before that, for example.

I didn't like your wall post, actually, I contested it when it was brought up. It didn't help me really, especially since the lynch was pushed particularly quickly afterwards, and single player pushes only help me eliminate partner pairs, and since I already believed you two weren't paired, the case was pretty much useless

Enter · Tue Mar 19, 2019 2:23 am

In post 2256, Auro wrote:
In post 2253, Auro wrote:
In post 2250, Enter wrote:You didn't do any of this. I didn't see you say anything like "I assume RC is town because of this, therefore =>" and then follow through with that thought process very much at all.
Just because I don't detail out the entirety of my thought process doesn't mean it doesn't exist, hahaha.
When Volxen made the wall post you guys liked it - but I brought up many of the points within the wall at different parts of time before that, for example.
Also, I'll touch upon this later, but I do feel a slight bit that you play on a kinda textbookish level, no offense - it's very easy to manipulate.

That's fair, but to be honest, I had literally nothing I could work with. I can't vote you. I can't control the game in any form or fashion, really, other than making players think that I had reads on them that I didn't (which is something that I did do throughout various points in the game). If you have constructive criticism, I'll take it.

In post 2257, Auro wrote:
In post 2255, Enter wrote:Yes but also because you don't post your thought process, I can't read your thought process, hence scum reads.
Ask and you'll get.

I think I did, but maybe I didn't?

Enter · Tue Mar 19, 2019 2:23 am

In post 2259, Auro wrote:You contested it? I don't remember engaging with your slot much, lol.

I didn't contest you directly, I brought it up to URAP and others because I didn't believe it and I wanted their thoughts.

Enter · Tue Mar 19, 2019 2:24 am

In post 2261, Auro wrote:You were asking the others to contest it, as I recall - and Paragons *were* playing to a different win-con.

I asked if people really believed your case, and I specifically didn't. Maybe my post about not believing it was in the paragon thread, I don't remember. The thread moved really fast that night.

Enter · Tue Mar 19, 2019 2:28 am

In post 2264, Auro wrote:
In post 2260, Enter wrote:That's fair, but to be honest, I had literally nothing I could work with. I can't vote you. I can't control the game in any form or fashion, really, other than making players think that I had reads on them that I didn't (which is something that I did do throughout various points in the game). If you have constructive criticism, I'll take it.
Well, I often did notice you scumreading things I'd find NAI, or townreading things I'd definitely find NAI.
You said RC was town for "progressing a town win-con", for example, could you go into that?

Yes. He held the game relatively steady and didn't lynch immediately. I would have townread him for lynching earlier when URAP was pushing him for a lynch, he didn't, which looks like he was dragging out day because he wanted to be sure on the lynch.

In post 2265, Auro wrote:
In post 2263, Enter wrote:
In post 2261, Auro wrote:You were asking the others to contest it, as I recall - and Paragons *were* playing to a different win-con.
I asked if people really believed your case, and I specifically didn't. Maybe my post about not believing it was in the paragon thread, I don't remember. The thread moved really fast that night.
I would've happily engaged, for the record xD

My bad. Maybe it was your avatar that made me want to talk to someone else.

Enter · Tue Mar 19, 2019 2:32 am

In post 2271, Auro wrote:
In post 2268, Enter wrote:Yes. He held the game relatively steady and didn't lynch immediately. I would have townread him for lynching earlier when URAP was pushing him for a lynch, he didn't, which looks like he was dragging out day because he wanted to be sure on the lynch.
Oh, this for example.
The first observation is that RC was in a position of power, and controlled the lynch - there was no threat of the lynch turning onto him because of the universal townreads and the other 4 slots going at each other's necks.
If he was scum, he's aware that ending the game slower makes him more prone to paranoia paragon guess,
therefore won't close it early on a mislynch.

Therefore, this in itself fails to be a towntell
.

Wait I agreed with you, all the way up until bold

Slower game = more prone to paranoia mislynch => he should end game early to prevent that as scum, but he didn't => town.

Enter · Tue Mar 19, 2019 2:34 am

Also I was so ridiculously ok with losing the game if it meant the game was more fun for everyone else just because we let RC be town.

Enter · Tue Mar 19, 2019 2:38 am

In post 2276, Auro wrote:
In post 2274, Enter wrote:Slower game = more prone to paranoia mislynch => he should end game early to prevent that as scum, but he didn't => town.
There's a careful balance between paranoia mislynch and paranoia paragon guess.

RC's a player who would take on a 1v1 as scum if town were to suddenly start paranoia'ing him.

There was never any sign of multiple players turning onto him, which enabled him to.

You're implying he's not afraid of a paranoia paragon guess?
I'd argue very greatly the opposite.

Enter · Tue Mar 19, 2019 2:41 am

In post 2278, Auro wrote:
In post 2277, Enter wrote:You're implying he's not afraid of a paranoia paragon guess?
I'd argue very greatly the opposite.
No, I'm saying that he is exactly *very* afraid of a paragon guess, and that gives him greater incentive to stretch the game at the cost of having the game dynamics change - a much smaller risk to take on.

I think the longer the game goes the more likely we are to start getting paranoid about RC => dragging it out longer is dumb because it will lead us to pick him => he's town because he doesn't care, he just wants to lynch the right person

Enter · Tue Mar 19, 2019 2:46 am

In post 2280, Auro wrote:
In post 2279, Enter wrote:
I think the longer the game goes the more likely we are to start getting paranoid about RC
=> dragging it out longer is dumb because it will lead us to pick him => he's town because he doesn't care, he just wants to lynch the right person
Oh, our thought processes differ here then, on the bolded part.
One of the best scumhunters on the site closing out a mislynch
quickly
would induce paranoia for me.

Ah. If I have good reads I want to close on them fast because if I wait too long I will overthink them and go back on them => I imagine a good scumhunter would be afraid of the same (also the possibility that a wagon would fall apart on their scum read, this has also happened to me numerous times and getting the wagon back together can be rough) => I assume the best scumhunter on site would be ok with lynching someone early if they felt they had a solid read. This is why I didn't really scumread RC for Saudade's mislynch, I assumed that he had a solid read and wanted to close down on it immediately.

Enter · Tue Mar 19, 2019 2:50 am

In post 2283, Michael Scott wrote:
In post 2282, Enter wrote:If I have good reads I want to close on them fast because if I wait too long I will overthink them and go back on them
Haha, but you never know if said reads are *actually* good.
I hate the paranoia that comes with it.
Like in SC2, I was beginning to think a slot was scum while we maintained that another slot was 99% scum, I began casing my slot but the game ended because the slot we claimed to be sure on thought we were scum for it. Sigh.

You do after the game when it hurts you the most!

Enter · Tue Mar 19, 2019 2:52 am

In post 2285, Michael Scott wrote:
In post 2284, Enter wrote:You do after the game when it hurts you the most!
Starcraft Mafia 2 was a really painful game.
Volxen and I obvtowned, and had a lynchpool of 4, with 1 in each two pairs - giving us a 75% chance of winning.
Yet, we botched it up

I've heard many stories

Enter · Tue Mar 19, 2019 2:52 am

SC2 is rather infamous. Maybe I'll read it someday when I'm finished reading my own big game.

Enter · Tue Mar 19, 2019 6:09 am

Wait, really?

Enter · Tue Mar 19, 2019 6:10 am

I don't believe you rn

Enter · Tue Mar 19, 2019 6:10 am

If you're fucking with me that's just cruel

Enter · Tue Mar 19, 2019 6:19 am

In post 102, Enter wrote:Shoshone is making up her case on Saude

In post 104, Aubrey wrote:I don’t think scum overly urges people to double check them though.

In post 105, Enter wrote:
In post 103, Aubrey wrote:Oh, give the juicy deets dude.
I talked about it in the main thread. Her argument is changing.
In post 104, Aubrey wrote:I don’t think scum overly urges people to double check them though.
This is NAI.

In post 107, Aubrey wrote:eh. I think it’s a bit more townie in this instance.

In post 108, Enter wrote:
In post 107, Aubrey wrote:eh. I think it’s a bit more townie in this instance.
I disagree

Who is going to call her on it?

In post 106, Shoshin wrote:I can't believe Enter is actually checking the meta.

@Aubrey

Enter · Tue Mar 19, 2019 6:32 am

In post 148, volxen wrote:Enter is a major problem, though. He has mentioned "MS+Shoshin" as the scumteam consistently all throughout the game, and he is clearly the dominant one among the three Paragons. Our short-term goal is to get one of URAP2 or Saudade lynched, but we also need Enter to believe that whichever one wasn't lynched is partnered with either us or Shoshin.

In post 295, Auro wrote:WIFOM is the way to go, Enter is easily manipulated. But natural sounding WIFOM though

Ow. Little did you know, I know that I'm easily manipulated. That's one of the reasons I went back to my original read on you guys.

Enter · Tue Mar 19, 2019 6:37 am

In post 5, Jingle wrote:FWIW, I disagree with the idea that Paragons should lynch RC. They're VASTLY more likely to win if they lynch town D1.

Why do you think this?

Enter · Tue Mar 19, 2019 6:43 am

In post 2300, Michael Scott wrote:Sorry, Enter, I had to behave as though you were bluffing for optimal play.
Good work catching us!

Thanks! I was super disappointed when you said we were wrong, I didn't even let myself hold onto the hope that you were lying because it seemed like such a slim chance.

I do wanna say you and Shoshone played the post game right, URAP and RC had me second guessing myself with how much they seemed to be trying to influence me. In the end I really only chose you because I very often have pretty decent reads in games I'll just get manipulated off of them, and I knew if I didn't pick you I would regret going back on my read on you. There were a lot of other things that went into this process as well, though, so I guess I shouldn't give credit to a single thought least it screw me up in the future.

Enter · Tue Mar 19, 2019 6:44 am

In post 2304, Saudade wrote:Good job Paragons very well played

Thank you.

Enter · Tue Mar 19, 2019 6:48 am

In post 2310, Aubrey wrote:Holy shit we did it enter!

I know! I'm so happy! Thank you so much!

Enter · Tue Mar 19, 2019 6:49 am

In post 2310, Aubrey wrote:Holy shit we did it enter!

You were such a huge help! Also a great player! Augh! Thank you so much for your support! I'm stumbling over my words I can't contain myself!

Enter · Tue Mar 19, 2019 6:50 am

If you weren't there I might have made such a dumb decision lol

Enter · Tue Mar 19, 2019 6:54 am

In post 2314, Michael Scott wrote:
In post 2313, Enter wrote:If you weren't there I might have made such a dumb decision lol
I feel like you would've gone for MS+Shoshin anyway, you were onto us like forever xD

Maybe, have you read the paragon thread yet? I was so so paranoid the whole game and I almost locked in the wrong pair on second guessing myself

Aubrey wrote:

Glad to have Urged you from going after RC. You were a fun pal to work with.

Jingle wrote:Yeah, the scum team, Aubrey and I all agreed the RC was obvtown.

Lol the only reason I called RC maybe scum was because of the way he was talking after the flip.

Even then I went back on it because if RC was scum this game he deserves the win

Enter · Tue Mar 19, 2019 6:55 am

I'm calling it ease of simplicity town read on rc. It made the game a lot simpler to solve if I just counted him as town and I didn't see any huge reasons to go against that

Enter · Tue Mar 19, 2019 6:57 am

In post 2320, Michael Scott wrote:
In post 2318, Enter wrote:I'm calling it ease of simplicity town read on rc. It made the game a lot simpler to solve if I just counted him as town and I didn't see any huge reasons to go against that
I think you would've townread RC in the universe he was scum, too.
*Shrug*

Probably, honestly. Idk, I haven't played with RC scum before.

Enter · Tue Mar 19, 2019 7:01 am

90 page day 1 and no links to events? Hmmmm

Enter · Tue Mar 19, 2019 7:05 am

In post 2325, Aubrey wrote:Ed was town so it was just coming to a decision on who to partner with shoshin. Granted I’d enter really and I mean really felt his RC pair I was have gone with it out of respect for him being here more than myself.

Thanks

Enter · Tue Mar 19, 2019 7:14 am

In post 2328, Aubrey wrote:Again fun game! Twists and turns! Enter you were a great paragon buddy and a trooper. Glad we pulled a victory, especially with your post-game concerns!

Agreed!

My posts that are what sold me as scum on each of the players

In post 82, Enter wrote:i'm frustrated because from anyone else's point of view ms is town

but from ms' point of view ms is scum

In post 102, Enter wrote:Shoshone is making up her case on Saude

Maybe I'm wrong on your tells but I really couldn't get past either of these points.

Enter · Tue Mar 19, 2019 7:15 am

In post 2335, Aubrey wrote:I look forward to reading scum thread. Got to get back to work though!

Thanks again so much for hanging in there with me! You were solid all the way through!

Enter · Tue Mar 19, 2019 7:17 am

In post 2338, Michael Scott wrote:
In post 2336, Enter wrote:Maybe I'm wrong on your tells but I really couldn't get past either of these points.
You were wrong on this one - Read progression, my fake URAP townread was contingent on RC+Shoshin both townreading him, and RC didn't townread him - which invalidates this.

When I brought this up in the game thread, I waffled a bit, but in the end I didn't like your response. I mean, sure, at the end of the game, but if you're pushing for this by end game it doesn't get you anywhere and your post is clearly just a tactic to keep your reads open.

Enter · Tue Mar 19, 2019 7:55 am

In post 2341, RadiantCowbells wrote:Well played though paragons

Thank you.

In post 2342, Auro wrote:That was my initial game strategy, one which would've worked as town too. I stopped pushing it later...

Noted, thanks!

In post 2345, RadiantCowbells wrote:Imo paragons and town should have the same win condition

In post 2346, RadiantCowbells wrote:Paragons help town lynch scum D1
Town help paragons get scum at night

It feels really silly to me to separate our win conditions

Agreed.

Enter · Tue Mar 19, 2019 8:42 am

Thanks for playing, RC! It was so much fun to get to play with you! I have so much respect for you as a player and you have no idea how much ... Nvm!

Enter · Tue Mar 19, 2019 8:45 am

I count it as a you win, if that counts for anything.

Enter · Tue Mar 19, 2019 3:16 pm

In post 2380, volxen wrote:Good job Paragons! Enter, why couldn't you second-guess yourself into a Shoshin+URAP2 solve? Come on man....

I would probably play as a Paragon if RC and Auro sign up as Paragons.

Shoshin URAP2 was the least likely solve to me

Enter · Tue Mar 19, 2019 3:23 pm

In post 2389, volxen wrote:
In post 2388, Enter wrote:
In post 2380, volxen wrote:Good job Paragons! Enter, why couldn't you second-guess yourself into a Shoshin+URAP2 solve? Come on man....

I would probably play as a Paragon if RC and Auro sign up as Paragons.
Shoshin URAP2 was the least likely solve to me
Out of curiosity, how did you rank all of the solves from most likely to least likely?

Before or after flip?

Enter · Tue Mar 19, 2019 3:27 pm

Preflip:

MS/Shoshin
MS/Saudade

and then after that it doesn't matter, but the least likely I think were

URAP/MS
Shoshin/Saudade

Post flip:

Shoshin/MS
URAP/RC
URAP/MS OR Shoshin/RC
URAP/Shoshin

Enter · Tue Mar 19, 2019 3:27 pm

Something like that