911: What's Your Emergency? (Postgame)

[insomnia]

(ftr, i actually tr insomnia and think hes just bad)

I hope you’ll still be alive to see how I carry this sorry lobby OwO

[Enigma]

maria's catchup makes me want to think she is town, but also leaves me head scratching because we have completely different reads. her stance on YM is probably why though

--

I'm also getting bad feels from how vigorously Skitter is defending Insomnia. Possible pocketing of Insomnia actually.

Yeah let's do this.

VOTE: Skitter

this for some reason feels like a bus

--
hi performer and NM. is NM not playing this game tho?
btw nice guess ofrhz on the hydra

enig = the scumread on this slot is largely since his stalling posts as they reminded me of his scum game where he got to the end of ofrhz's hosted game. He's good at messing with people's associatives for the scum team

tbh, i would argue nai. ive been busy. otherwise i agree quite a lot with the read list in that post.

--
incoming post on skitter

[insomnia]

How does lynching lurkers = bad at the game

I bet you the first two people that you’ll lynch will be town

Wanna bet?

[Enigma]

(ftr, i actually tr insomnia and think hes just bad)

I hope you’ll still be alive to see how I carry this sorry lobby OwO

i thought you were prododging?

[Enigma]

How does lynching lurkers = bad at the game

I bet you the first two people that you’ll lynch will be town

Wanna bet?

ive never said im good, im just saying youre bad

[insomnia]

I don’t think we have the same definition of prod dodging

[insomnia]

How does lynching lurkers = bad at the game

I bet you the first two people that you’ll lynch will be town

Wanna bet?

ive never said im good, im just saying youre bad

Give me final reads day two without changing them and we’ll see who’s better

I challenge you at a xiaolin showdown

[Enigma]

offerz help i dont tr skitter either

do tell

hi skitter, i hope you're not scum

anyways
VOTE: skitter

im too lazy to make a proper case atm but here are some things:
1. skitter should be able to read me better, and town!skitter would put more effort in trying to sort me but isnt doing so
2. her posting is rather inoffensive and not probing, like shes just around but not really looking for a scum team (or trying to find my buddies, if she thinks im scum)
3. awkward interactions with people i also sr like rooster/baezu
4. other stuff but im lazy

[Enigma]

rn im feeling lynching between skitter, baezu and maybe rooster

i kinda want to add gl to the scum pool, but cant read him due to not here

[ofrhz]

Yes is probably just town tbh

[MariaR]

I don't really scumread skitter but the only reason I an recultant is because a lot of the stances they have are the same as mine. I guess if they flip town I'm prob on the right track whereas if they're scum I'm awfully wrong so I'm not that sad about the lynch.

[Elbirn]

I really don’t like this post from roster- he’s been tunneling insomnia the whole game if you look at his iso, it’s scummy

Sorry but that family emergency business screwed up the wagon on Insomnia which would have got good reads. I am not comfortable voting someone who has RL issues D1.

also, i wanted to mention:
see the ban announcements thread about this "family emergency business"

This isnt entirely necessary I dont think, better to just let this whole business go away

i just noticed volxen has noticed some of the same things ... i didnt read that until after i posted sorry

rn im feeling lynching between skitter, baezu and maybe rooster

likely other comments incoming as i catch up

Remove Roster I think, but I am currently looking at skitter and bae as today's lynch pool yeah. I'd vote skitter but idk where shes at now that I've hopped off

UNVOTE:

[Elbirn]

Nvm shes now at 4 including me

VOTE: Skitter

[GuiltyLion]

reading up now

[GuiltyLion]

The other 2 reads are fence sitting town reads that he can easily flip back on when GL gets a mislynch and needs to go back on a dif vote.

this is that thing that scum frequently do where they assume that player [x] is scum first and then explain why their behavior

would make sense

if [x] were scum

unfortunately for Maria I'm not so the whole point here is invalid

also in what universe does giving reads on every player and trying to start forming a lynchpool become "posting for the sake of posting"

:squint:
i feel like there's something really wonky with this logic and i'm trying to figure out why

a) i'm not sure that this is something that i've seen scum in particular do? why do you associate doing this with scum? i feel like town scumreading people .... do the exact same thing. they think someone is scum and then explain why their actions make sense coming from scum.
like how do you distinguish between scum positing that player X is scum and then explaining how player X's actions come from scum and town believing player X is scum and then explainign how they think player X's actions come from scum?

b) like your logic is mariar posits that your scum and then explains why your actions come from scum, and your'e saying that this entire point doesn't make sense because you're not scum, and therefore it's wrong of her to push that your actions come from scum

but from her pov she doesn't know whether or not you're scum (or, at the very least, she has to say that she doesn't), so like dismissing her argument because from your pov it's invalid is kinda silly.

the thing is she's

assuming

that I'm scum and then making the argument as to why my play makes serves some agenda she made up

town don't do this as naturally because in the back of their minds they're fundamentally unsure most of the time (unless it's like a surefire super confident scumread), so the thought process doesn't go [x] is scum->"this is why their play is scummy", it goes "i feel this is sorta scummy"->maybe [x] is scum. It's subtle but it's definitely distinct. MariaR should know that

if

I'm town and just kinda not sure about my lighter townreads, I'd say exactly what I said. Fundamentally, she's stretching to make an argument that having weaker townreads is "so I can flip on them for later mislynch" instead of just thinking hey, maybe they're what they say on the tin and they're just weaker townreads. There's not really a reason to prioritize the former explanation over the latter if you're looking at it from an uninformed agenda-free mindset.

scum on the other hand tend to fall into the former because the agenda of the argument is decided before they start writing it.

[GuiltyLion]

rn im feeling lynching between skitter, baezu and maybe rooster

i kinda want to add gl to the scum pool, but cant read him due to not here

hi!

I actually think you are town now and have liked a lot of your play in my absence
UNVOTE:

[GuiltyLion]

okay so here's the deal on skitter

every now and then she makes a post that strikes me as too nuanced to come from scum

but when I

really

challenge myself to think "can scum!skitter truly not post that", I come up empty, they're not totally unfakeable. and she's making a lot of good sounding arguments but some of her conclusions (like the tris push/scumread) I strongly disagree with and have to consider that it could be scum-indicative bc I don't see how you could not be townreading tris here.

i'm a little scared I feel she flips town here like 40-50% of the time but she definitely

could

be scum, and a lot of my townreads are voting there and I totally see their reasons for doing so

and if Enigma/Volxen are town then I'm kinda in "too many townreads" world

nyehhhh

[GuiltyLion]

VOTE: skitter

Elbirn/ofrhz/tris is like my never-scum tier here
Enigma/insomnia/invisibility are like likely town and def don't want to visit until we get several flips and things are obviously borked
Volxen/Baezu still haven't done enough but just kinda feel town - mayybe scum here
MariaR couuulldd be town just axiomatically reading the game wrong/differently than me, but I also still feel like fairly good odds of scum, haven't liked anything she's said this game
similar feelings about Yes Mafia

roster... idk I still want to townread him but he's kinda a question mark with my latest game state review. the hop from skitter to tris felt unnatural, I agree with Enigma

[Baezu]

Are we really going to get bogged down in semantics

Yes mafia was popping in to give little content and making questionable votes - ie yes you could call that active lurking

It wasn’t evident at the time that yes mafia would not yield to pressure. in fact, I think yes mafia has become ever so slightly more open about his reads

So has your opinion of him changed?

[Invisibility]

hi gusy nevermidn i probably cant reread today because i have to mow the lawn
but tommorrow is friday!!!
also the skitter wagon is msotly that skitter isnt really being towny enough?

[Baezu]

Ofrhz- do you have a reads list?

From town to scum:

Tris, Elbirn, insomnia
Enigma, GL, roster
volxen, Maria
Vizzy, skitter, yes, baezu

Hm why are volxen and Maria pinging as scummy to you?

[Baezu]

Ofrhz- do you have a reads list?

From town to scum:

Tris, Elbirn, insomnia
Enigma, GL, roster
volxen, Maria
Vizzy, skitter, yes, baezu

Hm why are volxen and Maria pinging as scummy to you?

I'm fairly certain that all four of {GuiltyLion, Elbirn, Ofrhz, and Tris} are town.

L-4 ym

I agree that YM hasn’t done much and has scummy posts, but I don’t like how fast the wagon built on him...

Vote Count 1.5

Yes Mafia (5)

- volxen, Baezu, tris, insomnia, Invisibility

Invisibility (2)

- MariaR, ofrhz

tris (2)

- skitter30, Yes Mafia

Elbirn (1)

- GuiltyLion

insomnia (1)

- rosterfoster

Not Voting (2)

- Enigma, Elbirn

As there are 13 players alive, it takes 7 votes to lynch.

You have

(expired on 2019-04-16 23:24:30)

until the deadline.

I think there is at least one scum between volxen, tris and invisibility. Of these, which do you think is the scum?

You quoted the vote count here and said that at least one of {Volxen, Tris, Invisibility} has to be scum, so I assume you are saying this primarily because all three of us were voting for Yes_Mafia. Insomnia was also voting for Yes_Mafia here, so why was he excluded from your "at least one of these players has to be scum" list? I'm especially curious about this because you previously listed Tris and I as townreads, and yet you excluded Insomnia from this list:

Elbirn- town town town

Enigma- yikes! Now I see what insomnia was talking about...this post is scary (among others)

Ah shit, I think Enigma might be scum

nahhh im not, sorry

VOTE: insomnia
here for now is good

Why?

Do you have any other scumreads?

VOTE: enigma

yes mafia (i.e. not_mafia) is lynch bait and people are voting him because of his terrible play style rather than motive in this game

insomnia
1. i dont tr him and i dislike the ym wagon
2. his hammer threat is meh ... you claim or i vote you wahh wahh is not helpful for town, especially against a player who is playing like yes mafia
3. i agree with rooster's argument on him
4. fundamentally disagree with him on the voting "mislynch bait" d1 is townie

Guilty lion- town

Insomnia- he’s a great player and I totally thought he was town...am I misreading or misinterpreting that post? I know you were trying to explain it to me but I didn’t understand the explanation...

Invisibility- again, it feels like I’m missing something...nothing she does seems particularly townie to me

Maria is one that I can usually tell right away when she’s town and I’m not getting that vibe this game...

Ofthz is town

I really don’t like this post from roster- he’s been tunneling insomnia the whole game if you look at his iso, it’s scummy

It is town’s job to get rid of the scummiest town and it is scum’s job to get rid of the towniest.

Eh. I kind of wished that early wagon on you had stayed, but whatever. Imma just pretend the whole family emergency business didn't happen.

[vote[Insomnia[/vote]

Skitter - town

Tris- town

Volxen- town

YM - I initially put my vote on them to get some response and get them talking then the wagon formed and it felt like it might be heading towards a mislynch. They haven’t provided much content but they’re null to me at this point

;tl/dr

In no particular order

Town- {

volxen, tris

, skitter, ofrhz, Elbirn, GL}
Null- {invis, YM}
Scum - {enigma,

Maria,

roster}

VOTE: enigma

Also, in that above post you listed Maria as a scumread, and then you went on to agree with Yes Mafia that she should be the #1 protective target:

Maria needs to be protective target #1

I agree

Have you reversed your previous scumread of Maria? If not, then why do you think she should be protected?

Yes I fully admit I’ve been flip flopping..I’m having a hard time telling who the scum are. Every slot has said scummy things and towny things...I think I need to witness more interactions and get more information

[MariaR]

What is Skitter at? L2 or L1?

[tris]

lion = seriously doesn't look like town, called mari & I scum and I know I'm definitely town

This reasoning is just OMGUS.

roster = tone & poe to be honest. This scumread I'm less confident on, compared to say, enigma, skitter, lion

What don't you like about roster's tone?

I'm fairly certain that all four of {GuiltyLion, Elbirn, Ofrhz, and Tris} are town.

This plus insomnia for me.

Yeah I still feel good with my vote

What did you think of the reads list Yes posted?

--------------------------------------------------

I'm feeling good about this wagon. I need to sort through some of the other players though. I don't have time right now, but maybe later tonight.

[skitter30]

idk if i particularly have it in me rn to fight this, but i want to make my reads as clear as possible so that you lot know exactly where i think scum is along the way

i like the people on my wagon in the following order:

ofrhz - i can understand why she's scumreading me; she's used to town!me having a ~presence~ and i haven't really been like that in this game; i've been having trouble kinda getting ~into~ it and idk why. she's been pushing this read pretty aggressively and trying to get people to wagon me with her; i've specced a couple of her scumgames and i don't think that she's particularly capable of faking a prolonged/protracted push like this; also i don't think that scum!her tries to mislynch me .... like ever really; it would be a lot easier to just throw a townread on me and call it a day i think.

gl - don't really understand a lot of the scumreads/paranoia here. his rvs/just-after-rvs game was like transparently townie to the point that i'm kinda confused how people didn't see it?

elbirn - think he's been pretty townie for him; after prey + anuket i feel like i have a fairly decent sense of his towngame and this kinda matches it. his gl vote/spat earlygame was meh in a vaccuum but the frustration felt kinda townie; i've seen him get frustrated over not understanding other people's pov/pushes (like with ank in anuket) and i'm not sure that scum!him can fake that level of vehemence. his vote on me was ok; i think 534 (specifically the 'i'm going to join the wagon while it's cool!' bit) belies a certain lack of self-consciousness that i would imagine scum would have bandwagoning someone they literally never mentioned or interacted with before.

enigma - i feel like most of his reasons for voting me aren't entirely fair or accurate; i've been sorting him by pointing out the things that i don't like in his play, and even voted him over them; i also think it's a little bit unreasonable to ding me at this stage for not trying to find a scumteam when we don't have any flips yet; i don't even believe in day1 pre-flip associatves and try not to scumhunt that way day1

tris - don't understand the townreads here at all. her vote/unvote/revote on yes mafia was oppurtunistic (@ofhrz i know you don't think so, but i strongly disagree); she basically used the excuse of a pressure vote to hop on the wagon on someone that was pretty clearly not reacting to any sort pressure at that time. her trajectory on me was also quite atrocious; she went from townreading me the page before to voting me as soon as someone else did without me, like, posting in between. overall i think she's pushing oppurtunistic wagons.

==

everyone else:

insomnia - still think that his push on yes mafia comes from town; he utterly doesn't care about the optics of the push and i think that he truly believes the philosophy he's espousing (namely, getting rid of difficult/lurking/useless players early is +ev to town) and his actions make sense in coming from that thought process; the one thing i'm slightly doubting is that yes mafia has been a bit less useless in the past couple of pages and that doesn't seem to have impacted his determination to make that wagon happen, but other than that i think they've been town; also all the people pushing him (specifically enigma, vizzy, and roster) are people that i'm suspicious of so

mariar - generally feels pretty townie to me; i like her catchup. idk if scum!her here repeatedly tries to get wagons started on people that clearly aren't getting lynched today; i feel like there's probably easier people for her to push than the universal townreads if she's scum. i like her approach to reading yes mafia too.

yes mafia - honeslty upon reflection most of what i disliked about them can be traced back to the gimmick alt and i feel like once the gimmick was kinda over after the alt-slip performer's been a lot more forthcoming with his reads and stances. i don't really like ~townread~ him but i don't really scumread him either.

vizzy - doesn't really feel like the town!vizzy that i'm used to; town!him's posts have a certain level of like non-chalant trolling-ness that feel very stream-of-conscious-y and through them and express exactly what he's thinking about the game. here, he feels a lot more shallow than i'm used to; like despite the troll posts i can usually track his thought process and understand the transition from one read or vote to the next but here i'm not really seeing that; in contrast, his hops on and off the yes mafia wagon were generally just ???? to me

roster - dislike that he's basically pushing insomina for having a different mafia philosphy than him; i kinda feel like he's using his dislike for insomnia's push on yes mafia to justify voting there while ignoring how insomnia's push makes sense *from insomnia's pov on the correct way to play mafia*; also dislike that after the enigma/insomnia spat he was willing to vote either; it's fence-sitty and opportunistic in that it's taking advantage of a conflict to give himself permission to vote either side.

beazu - the things she's saying and pushing don't really match the things she *does*. like after she voted insomnia she uses his read on enigma to push enigma herself, and she called out roster for voteparking on town!insomnia while voting insomnia herself; it doesn't really feel like her insomnia vote actually came from a read she really *believed* or *felt* since like her other reads and pushes don't really make sense when taken in conjunction with her stated scumread. i don't really feel like she scumreads insomnia so much as she used the existing wagon to find a place to slap down her vote with the most lamist of justifications. also i think she was buddyign elbirn in 184, that doesn't feel like a real thought that someone would actually, like, say

volxen - literally no thoughts on them. his townread on gl was decent but like not unfakeable and they haven't really been present enough for me to get a particularly good read on them; he just kinda is

==

i don't think this is gaining traction like at all today but i still think this is scum so
VOTE: tris

idk if anyone wants to ask me something go for it