[SETUP] Guns & Roses

This forum is for discussion of individual Open Setups, including theoretical balance.
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Post Post #50 (ISO) » Mon Apr 29, 2019 6:15 pm

Post by Lycanfire »

There's going to be an optimal strategy. The point is to make people fight over what it is in the thread so people can form reads off that, call people scumfucks, threaten to replace out, and tell people not to join games with them again. That's the real reason why mountainous sucks. It's a rehash of baggage contained to that one thread and nothing else to argue over, so you're just having the same argument from page 3 to page XXX.
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Post Post #51 (ISO) » Wed May 01, 2019 1:14 am

Post by FakeGod »

Hmm... I need a way to incentivize roses from picking day 10000.

There has to be a gamble option for picking early day rose. Thoughts?
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Post Post #52 (ISO) » Thu May 02, 2019 2:53 am

Post by callforjudgement »

It's not obvious to me in the current setup why roses have specific days at all.
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Post Post #53 (ISO) » Thu May 02, 2019 3:25 am

Post by FakeGod »

Right. Roses would just pick day infinity to avoid being outed as a rose.

Can you think of anything that would incentivize roses to pick an earlier day?
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Post Post #54 (ISO) » Thu May 02, 2019 3:26 am

Post by FakeGod »

Or maybe just accept it as part of the game?

You pick a night + Gun or rose.
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Post Post #55 (ISO) » Thu May 02, 2019 4:23 am

Post by callforjudgement »

I think either the roses need an additional side-effect, or else to not be night-specific.

The current setup is effectively "town can choose at the start of the game to be a night-n vigilante or a VT; scum win by killing all the VTs". The core mechanic of "power roles don't count towards the town's wincon" is interesting. Getting a working setup built around that can be hard, though.
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Post Post #56 (ISO) » Thu May 02, 2019 4:25 am

Post by callforjudgement »

Oh, and I just realised a trivial way to stop town all picking N1 or whatever: don't reveal gun holders and rose holders, and let scum choose a night on which to be bulletproof. Town probably won't all pick N1 in case scum do.
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Post Post #57 (ISO) » Thu May 02, 2019 2:13 pm

Post by FakeGod »

Hmm, so if rose/gun are not revealed, then mafia needs to solve the game old-fashioned way, which can be ok. Scum being bulletproof will only fix the N1 cheese I guess, since the vig will just tell people that "hey this guy was bulletproof last night - he's mafia".

I think I want to explore some other options though.
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Post Post #58 (ISO) » Thu May 02, 2019 2:21 pm

Post by implosion »

I think there are many, many different directions you can take this idea in that are all very viable.
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Post Post #59 (ISO) » Fri May 03, 2019 1:09 am

Post by FakeGod »

I slept on it, and I think a more elegant solution may be:

NO reveal on rose/gun - only when the player flips, they will be revealed their role
Guns pick a night and can shoot during that night
Rose pick a night and is bulletproof during that night
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Post Post #60 (ISO) » Sat May 04, 2019 5:11 am

Post by FakeGod »

I think the setup is still missing something.

What if I made the number of town roses alive public?
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Post Post #61 (ISO) » Sat May 04, 2019 5:23 am

Post by callforjudgement »

That's probably a good idea for the same reason that people dislike no-reveal games.
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Post Post #62 (ISO) » Mon May 06, 2019 6:30 pm

Post by FakeGod »

Setup


  • 9
    Town players
    vs 2
    Mafia players

  • All players must secretly pick either a
    gun
    or a
    rose
    .
  • All players must also secretly pick a night.
  • A player who picked a
    gun
    is a
    1-shot vigilante
    during his/her
    chosen night
    .
  • A player who picked a
    rose
    is
    immune to night kills
    during his/her
    chosen night
    .
  • Upon
    death
    , it will be revealed whether the
    dead
    player picked a
    rose
    or a
    gun
    .
  • Number of remaining
    Town
    -aligned
    rose
    players will be announced at the
    beginning of each day
    .
  • If there are no
    Town
    -aligned player who picked a rose,
    Mafia
    immediately
    wins
    the game, regardless of whether there are any living
    Mafia
    members in the game.
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Post Post #63 (ISO) » Tue May 07, 2019 3:40 am

Post by callforjudgement »

I like it. It'll be hard to know where the balance lies, because there's so much WIFOM involved, but the core mechanic seems correct now.
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Post Post #64 (ISO) » Tue May 07, 2019 3:51 am

Post by FakeGod »

I can run some EV calculations as soon as I know what kind of assumptions I can make.

I'm testing with low numbers to see the setup in action.
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