Mini Normal 2071 (Game Over!)

[High Risk Gamble]

Hey, HRG, welcome to the game!
Any other general thoughts 8 pages in?
A general readlist?

{Asuka, CDB, URA}
{Garmr, Egix, Exlion}

{Bob's, RuiRui, Inferno}

{Sash}
{Skitter}

Skitter just really pings me with their posting and just feels like a lot of empty posting.

[High Risk Gamble]

I'm going to eat then read the last 10 pages.

[Egix96]

Yep, I can dig this.

VOTE: Rui

It reads as you have this slot an null or at a post scum lean, correct me if I'm wrong?
Is this really the strongest read you have to go with at this stage?

I generally find forming townreads to be easier than forming scumreads. Normally on Day 1 of a game I end up having a good number of townreads but rarely any strong scumreads, only leans in that direction.

So yes, at this point RuiRui is the closest thing I have to a full scumread.

[Egix96]

Skitter just really pings me with their posting and just feels like a lot of empty posting.

Now that's a spicy read.

[High Risk Gamble]

So this is where I'm at after the catch up fully.

URA is obvious town right now and the fact his wagon started is really bad.
I'm feel less like Sash scum with the VT claim and even though VT lynch / scum lynch isn't a bad choice day 1 I don't think Sash flips scum here.

I don't think that URA's wagon was all town either so Skitter, Inferno or RuiRui have 1-2 scum.

The current RuiRui wagon looks all town other than Skitter. Skitter is just looking for a lynch rather scum hunting and their voting patterns/reasons show this.

If it comes to it I'll vote RuiRui over Sash and URA but I think Skitter is just out right scum and it doesn't look like bussing.

VOTE: Skitter

[High Risk Gamble]

I'm going to be here tonight if anyone wants to discuss back and forth to why I'm wrong or why you're right.

[Exilon]

Honestly, I would rather a Sash flip than a Rui one. I think we get a lot more info off the Sash flip than anything else [...]

I share this opinion.

Honestly, I would rather a Sash flip than a Rui one. I think we get a lot more info off the Sash flip than anything else atp except maybe UR2.

P-edit: Yah a legit scum read cause it’s made by legit scum

Lol what ever.

What's this about? I feel like I missed something that would justify this type of reply

well now i'm getting spooked that you're suggesting this wagon too so

Skitter what

[bob3141]

Been a bit bust today. Will get caught up tommorrow

[bob3141]

*busy

[Garmr]

Honestly, I would rather a Sash flip than a Rui one. I think we get a lot more info off the Sash flip than anything else atp except maybe UR2.

P-edit: Yah a legit scum read cause it’s made by legit scum

Lol what ever.

What's this about? I feel like I missed something that would justify this type of reply

/quote]
Just getting under my skin.

[Exilon]

@URAP2 and Sash

Just want to straighten this out you guys think rui rui is scum if sash is town right?

I think it's pretty much the opposite. A scum Rui rui has had all day to jump on the sash wagon if sash was town. I also doubt a scum rui would actively oppose the counter wagon to their wagon. They haven't relaly done much but they could of saved their own skin earlier and the sash lynch would of gone through.

So that leaves them in two circumstances town that actually think sash is town or scum with sash and not willing to bus for reasons.


So I don't understand why Rui rui is the counter wagon if you think sash is town?

I want to share a different hypothesis:
Why would scum!RuiRui jump on a wagon already populated by scum (or about to be) and with people willing to go for it?
If she had got on the Sash wagon I think it would've been damning.

FYI, I'm going to be limited to phoneposting until Sunday evening.

Those squeamish about the Sash wagon should come hang out on the infinitely more wholesome RuiRui wagon, which grows more righteous with every passing minute since her last (awful) post.

ok actually I'm ok with this

VOTE: RuiRui

This ones even worse since your attraction hasn't been any where near RuiRui. What made you feel that this is solid reasoning as scummy here?

huh?

[Garmr]

So this is where I'm at after the catch up fully.

URA is obvious town right now and the fact his wagon started is really bad.
I'm feel less like Sash scum with the VT claim and even though VT lynch / scum lynch isn't a bad choice day 1 I don't think Sash flips scum here.

I don't think that URA's wagon was all town either so Skitter, Inferno or RuiRui have 1-2 scum.

The current RuiRui wagon looks all town other than Skitter. Skitter is just looking for a lynch rather scum hunting and their voting patterns/reasons show this.

If it comes to it I'll vote RuiRui over Sash and URA but I think Skitter is just out right scum and it doesn't look like bussing.

VOTE: Skitter

Yeah I can agree with this.

VOTE: Skitter

Don't really have much to add other than I been feeling off about skitter for a while which is why I don't list them as town.

I don't like the fact Skitter ignored my post (663)

So if we really have to compromise on a lynch I think skitter the best one.

[Ausuka]

i don't understand the skitter push. what about her posting is empty?

[Ausuka]

Not so sure that inferno is town now.

can you elaborate on why this is? like he still seems really townie to me.

This post in particular I didn't like:

God I don't want a last minute lynch on a spontaneous wagon.

God I don't want a last minute lynch on a spontaneous wagon.

why not tho

1 sash is going to flip scum.
2.less information than wagons that have been going all day.

Unless you wanna lynch inferno?

Given that the only “spontaneous wagon” going on is UR2, this reads suspiciously like scum worried that his partner is going to get lynched out of nowhere because the wagon he’s been pushing falls apart. Plus saying I should be lynched, especially when widely townread indicates to me that he’s scum that wants to get rid of me.

I think it's scummy for him to tie Garmr and urap together like that because to me it seems like a gross misrepresentation of the situation. Also "saying I should be lynched, especially when widely townread indicates to me that he’s scum that wants to get rid of me" looks OMGUS-y imo.

Ok, I don't agree that inferno wouldn't post stuff like that as town but at least I get where you're coming from now.

[Ausuka]

i don't think this is a wagon on scum
the gamestate is too ~complacent~

it feels like scum are just content to let the clock wind-down and let people vote for their favorite compromise wagon (ie sash, as multiple people have said) and they don't have a problem with that so they're just letting it happen and taking it easy

i don't think i'll vote there today

what do you mean? there's been plenty of counterwagons propped up throughout the day: ruirui, u r a person 2, then back to ruirui. the gamestate doesn't feel like this at all.

Like I mean I get thinking skitter is scum with sasha - I've had that thought too given she's tried to dodge his lynch and propping up the ruirui -> urap -> ruirui counterwagons and this really doesn't feel like a bus gamestate. But I don't think she's really ever scum without sasha given that she's defended him a lot more than I think would be necessary (i get scum giving some defense but it seems like she's really trying to save him) and if Sasha is town scum are/were mostly already on the wagon i'd think considering it reached a maximum mass and then faltered significantly from that point. I think sasha is strictly the superior lynch here.

[Garmr]

@URAP2 and Sash

Just want to straighten this out you guys think rui rui is scum if sash is town right?

I think it's pretty much the opposite. A scum Rui rui has had all day to jump on the sash wagon if sash was town. I also doubt a scum rui would actively oppose the counter wagon to their wagon. They haven't relaly done much but they could of saved their own skin earlier and the sash lynch would of gone through.

So that leaves them in two circumstances town that actually think sash is town or scum with sash and not willing to bus for reasons.


So I don't understand why Rui rui is the counter wagon if you think sash is town?

I want to share a different hypothesis:
Why would scum!RuiRui jump on a wagon already populated by scum (or about to be) and with people willing to go for it?
If she had got on the Sash wagon I think it would've been damning.

That would be funny you said that, because after that vote count you jumped on the wagon. While it's a possibility, the wagon seemed town driven so I think this is the less likely scenario.

[Garmr]

i don't think this is a wagon on scum
the gamestate is too ~complacent~

it feels like scum are just content to let the clock wind-down and let people vote for their favorite compromise wagon (ie sash, as multiple people have said) and they don't have a problem with that so they're just letting it happen and taking it easy

i don't think i'll vote there today

what do you mean? there's been plenty of counterwagons propped up throughout the day: ruirui, u r a person 2, then back to ruirui. the gamestate doesn't feel like this at all.

Like I mean I get thinking skitter is scum with sasha - I've had that thought too given she's tried to dodge his lynch and propping up the ruirui -> urap -> ruirui counterwagons and this really doesn't feel like a bus gamestate. But I don't think she's really ever scum without sasha given that she's defended him a lot more than I think would be necessary (i get scum giving some defense but it seems like she's really trying to save him) and if Sasha is town scum are/were mostly already on the wagon i'd think considering it reached a maximum mass and then faltered significantly from that point. I think sasha is strictly the superior lynch here.

I agree that sasha is the superior lynch (which is being heavily resisted.) but disagree that skitter needs to be town if sasha is town. Skitter gains town cred with some players if sasha flips town and they can start hammering the people on the wagon(or being counter wagoned the next day.) If town is the one majority pushing sasha then scum have bigger chance of hiding away if the people on the lynch start getting picked apart.

[Exilon]

So I reread Sash's ISO with some more attention.

I want to point out what I feel about it and what I'm seeing.

Mostly there's a consisting tone shift from the early part of the game up to when the wagon on Sash formed and moved. Ealier on, up to 145. In this same posts he mentions to have tried sheeping. He sheeps Inferno390. This is consistent as well with what he says later in 186.

From then on, it's possible to denote a clear shift in tone - less pushy, less "agressive", more dialogical. There's interest in egaging here.

261 feels town honest to me too.

This too:

has town!you ever gotten this worked up about being wagoned before?

Very honestly no, this was atypical of myself. It's just that I don't seem to have that kind of problems in minis, only in larges. Plus, I had another game going on that wasn't too pleasant either. And some non-mafia related problems, to think of it. Maybe now I can see better in this one since my two previous things are gone.

The greatest scumread of Sash is Garmr. The lean shows up in #146. About their interactions, there is quite a bit and Garmr seems very intent on Sash being scum. Forcefully, I'd say.


There's something interesting here in hindsight. Notice this exchange:

Person is under pressure to come up with a excuse makes the "I was sheeping town reads." S

ince their actions show no signs of sheeping town reads in fact you look for them saying they were going to do it you can't find it. You find evidence of the opposite.

So by adding all those points you can conclude they were lying about it and it was a rushed excused.

Is this still about me in 90?

Garmr states something demonstrably false. Look above! He even uses the word sheeping in 145, and "I'll follow". It's not incoherent at all!

There's ONE more recent post that I dislike and makes Sash look very scummy:

but actually if sash is scum, skitter might actually be scum here because I don't see it being you and I'd be surprised if my wagon was clean there either

If I'm scum Skitter definitely is compromising herself by defending me so hard. What's the reverse of tunneling?

This should be an element of thought... Would a scum go forward and defend with such vigor a scum lynch on the first day?

We know from a later post Skitter is "solid town" to Sash, after being null for a long while.

Then this:

But I'll bite on the scenario

Say if I'm wrong Sash

Well on my wagon I suspected at some point everyone but LUV and Ausuka. But if you trust your reads, well yeah, it could be a town wagon.
Personally, I'm afraid my scum list has run dry with the extinction of Bob and URAP2 . The wolves are well hidden... Are we 10/3 or 9/4 in this format usually?

Sash never scumread me, quite the opposite. So this is false, amidst a sea of reading consistency from him.


I need to think on this a bit and how it affects my read on Sash. I'm going to a dance class but I'll be back in about 1.5 hours.

[Garmr]

Is this still about me in 90?

Garmr states something demonstrably false. Look above! He even uses the word sheeping in 145, and "I'll follow". It's not incoherent at all!



I need to think on this a bit and how it affects my read on Sash. I'm going to a dance class but I'll be back in about 1.5 hours.[/quote]
Wrong he didn't sheep a town read post refers to skitter being a town read on the wagon and sheeping infernos reasoning.

The greatest scumread of Sash is Garmr.

I don't know if I am their greatest scum read but if I was why vote bob before me and switch to me when I'm starting to get into a debate with inferno??

[High Risk Gamble]

i don't understand the skitter push. what about her posting is empty?

The fact that she isn't scum hunting just voting where looks viable?

[u r a person 2]

skitter isn't happening today.

pick a different wagon

1 day left time for everyone to be thinking about how they can compromise

[Sashaddin]

If I'm scum Skitter definitely is compromising herself by defending me so hard. What's the reverse of tunneling?

If I'm scum

scum!skitter

definitely would be compromising herself.
What I meant.

[Inferno390]

I am more than willing to compromise on Sash.

[tris]

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[tris]

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