[MAY CHALLENGE]

This forum is for discussion of individual Open Setups, including theoretical balance.
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TemporalLich
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Post Post #8 (isolation #0) » Thu May 09, 2019 5:52 am

Post by TemporalLich »

Dragon Capturer
9 players


1 Dragon

2 Mafia Goons

6 Vanilla Townies


In addition to voting for lynches, the Town must also vote to Capture (jailkeep) a player.

A Capture vote can either use bold e.g.
CAPTURE: TemporalLich
or hurt tags e.g. HURT: TemporalLich

In addition to the factional nightkill, the Mafia may attempt a factional Capture once in the game.

The Dragon is bulletproof, but instantly loses if Captured. The Dragon wins if the game ends before this happens or the Dragon is lynched.

Mafia win when they outnumber Town, equal Town, or the Dragon is Captured with the factional Capture.

Town win when the Mafia are dead or the Dragon is Captured with the Capture vote.

Mafia may privately communicate at any time.
Probably not balanced, and hopefully the Dragon isn't too jestery. Likely will replace this either way.
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Post Post #11 (isolation #1) » Thu May 09, 2019 1:21 pm

Post by TemporalLich »

Not sure if capturing a goon should just deny the Mafia NK outright or not
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Post Post #15 (isolation #2) » Fri May 10, 2019 6:44 am

Post by TemporalLich »

Dragon Capturer v2
11 players


1 Dragon

2 Mafia Goons

8 Vanilla Townies


In addition to voting for lynches, the Town must also vote to Capture a player.

A Capture vote can either use bold e.g.
CAPTURE: TemporalLich
or hurt tags e.g. HURT: TemporalLich

Capturing Town protects the captured townie from being nightkilled.

You can't vote to lynch and Capture the same player.

In addition to the factional nightkill, the Mafia may attempt to Imprison. An imprisoned player can't vote the next day. The imprisoned player knows he is imprisoned, but the fact the imprisoned player is imprisoned is not public knowledge. The same player can't be killed and imprisoned.

The Mafia may not attempt to Imprison on a night where a Mafioso was Captured.

The Dragon instantly loses if Captured or Imprisoned. The Dragon wins if the game ends before this happens or the Dragon dies.

Mafia win when they outnumber Town, equal Town, or the Dragon is Imprisoned.

Town win when the Mafia are dead or the Dragon is Captured.

Mafia may privately communicate at any time.
Some major changes to Dragon Capturer made here:

Two extra VTs added to avoid losing D2 by parity
Capturing a goon now blocks the Mafia's Imprison outright
Mafia's Capture, renamed Imprison, now reduces vote weight to 0 and is unlimited
The Dragon is no longer bulletproof, and wins when nightkilled
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Post Post #24 (isolation #3) » Sat May 11, 2019 10:06 am

Post by TemporalLich »

In post 19, Jingle wrote:
In post 15, TemporalLich wrote:Two extra VTs added to avoid losing D2 by parity
Capturing a goon now blocks the Mafia's Imprison outright
Mafia's Capture, renamed Imprison, now reduces vote weight to 0 and is unlimited
The Dragon is no longer bulletproof, and wins when nightkilled
Imprison might as well be public knowledge, inability to vote is pretty confirmable unless you want arbitrary modkills as part of the setup.

If capture can be hammered before lynch, dragon D1 happens every game.

(Either Dragon is captured D1, or someone else is captured and the Dragon goes "Hey yall, Imma dragon. If you don't lynch me maf imprisons me tonight and the game is over. Peace!"

Both Capture and Imprison are functionally investigative results. Investigative results that can be fucked with, sure, but capture and then imprisonment clears two players. Capture and no imprisonment implies a scum capture, because imprisoning the dragon is probably worth it. It's definitely worth it late game. Also, both investigatives are public.
Alright thanks for breaking Dragon Capturer. Sadly I can't unbreak it this time so expect a new setup from me soon.

I could fix the setup by making both the vote Capture and the Mafia factional Capture a treestumping power, but I'd probably have to make the setup a Large (and force the Lynch to be hammered before the Capture) and I don't see it as a fun setup.
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Post Post #29 (isolation #4) » Sat May 11, 2019 3:41 pm

Post by TemporalLich »

In post 28, Jingle wrote:
Protown, probably. Town only needs to find dragons if they're not finding scum, so the faster the scum is caught the better the odds of a dragon lynch.

Oh, and to solve the issue of :oopsallclears: make imprisonment invisible (no votesteal) and the capture actually a straight up jailkeep. Public jailkeep is pretty weak for town, but the strength after the first scumlynch is amazing. Dragon is probably scumsided inherently. (Town guesses first, Scum has >>info when guessing). You could probably drop the autowin from Maf too and just have it end up being a double kill if they hit dragon.

Balance turns into 8v2 with a lategame only town PR, a win mechanic for town, and a 3p with a semibenevolent wincon who slightly townsides.
I like those ideas, perhaps if the Mafia captures the Dragon the Dragon exits the game in a loss and the Mafia gets a 1-shot daykill performed via Mafia PT.
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Post Post #35 (isolation #5) » Mon May 13, 2019 11:42 am

Post by TemporalLich »

Dragon Capturer v3
11 players


1 Dragon

2 Mafia Goons

8 Vanilla Townies


In addition to voting for lynches, the Town must also vote to Capture (jailkeep) a player. Capturing is by plurality vote and is decided when the lynch is decided.

A Capture vote can either use bold e.g.
CAPTURE: TemporalLich
or hurt tags e.g. HURT: TemporalLich

You can't vote to lynch and Capture the same player.

In addition to the factional nightkill, the Mafia may attempt a factional Capture. The mafia may multitask.

If the Mafia Captures the Dragon with the factional Capture, the Dragon exits the game in a loss and the Mafia gets a 1-shot daykill to be used in the Mafia PT.

The Dragon instantly loses if Captured. The Dragon wins if the game ends before this happens or the Dragon dies.

Mafia win when they outnumber Town or equal Town.

Town win when the Mafia are dead or the Dragon is Captured by the Capture vote.

Mafia may privately communicate at any time.
Last edited by TemporalLich on Mon May 13, 2019 4:13 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Post Post #121 (isolation #6) » Thu May 30, 2019 9:23 pm

Post by TemporalLich »

Here is my vote:

Dragon Capturer (TL) - Pure nepotism, like how the Dragon feels chaotic myself.
Chaos vs Order (Relly) - Hmm, an interesting setup. I want to see this played at least once, I can't wait to see what weird strategies come out of this setup.
Undertale Semi-Open (S_S) - A great Mini Theme idea, sparing seems strong though. Pretty faithful to Undertale.
Connections (CFJ) - Kinda feels scumsided, but seems fun and interesting. I like the townreads mattering and scum being able to deepwolf well.
Titanzar Mafia (pops) - I like the idea of a reverse nightless Mafia game leading to a mountainous Mafia game.
The Defender (BNL) - Interesting idea but feels too vanilla.
Coronation Ceremony (Rainn) - Not convinced being an Anarchist is fun, but seems alright.
Will of the People (Ircher) - Pretty sure this just feels like vanilla Nightless.
Wolves (NK15) - I don't understand this setup. It feels wrong to me, and what even is "they cannot be replaced" supposed to mean?
Hidden Reversi Mafia (Jingle) - Scorched Earth on
D1
. Also pretty sure this is broken and swingy.
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Post Post #128 (isolation #7) » Thu Jun 06, 2019 10:27 am

Post by TemporalLich »

As far as I'm aware here are the votes:

1. Undertale Semi-Open | Something_Smart | 1>2>7>3>5>6>10>9>4>8
2. Connections | callforjudgement | 2>3>5>4>1>9>10>8>7>6
3. Chaos VS. Order | Irrelephant11 | 3>1=2=4=5=6=7=8=9=10 (default, no votes)
4. The Defender | BulletAndLynchproof | 4>1=2=3=5=6=7=8=9=10 (default, no votes)
5. Coronation Ceremony | Rainn | 5>1=2=3=4=6=7=8=9=10 (default, no votes)
6. Hidden Reversi Mafia | Jingle | 7>6>10>9>1>2>4>5>3>8
7. Dragon Capturer | TemporalLich | 7>3>1>2>10>4>5>9>8>6
8. Wolves | Not Known 15 | 8>1=2=3=4=5=6=7=9=10 (default, no votes)
9. Will of the People | Ircher | 9>1=2=3=4=5=6=7=8=10 (default, no votes)
10. Titanzar Mafia | popsofctown | 1>5>2>7>10>9>6>4>8>3

And in the appropriate form for the winner calculator (thanks CFJ):

Code: Select all

1,Undertale Semi-Open
2,Connections
3,Chaos VS. Order
4,The Defender
5,Coronation Ceremony
6,Hidden Reversi Mafia
7,Dragon Capturer
8,Wolves
9,Will of the People
10,Titanzar Mafia

1>2>7>3>5>6>10>9>4>8
2>3>5>4>1>9>10>8>7>6
3>1=2=4=5=6=7=8=9=10
4>1=2=3=5=6=7=8=9=10
5>1=2=3=4=6=7=8=9=10
7>6>10>9>1>2>4>5>3>8
7>3>1>2>10>4>5>9>8>6
8>1=2=3=4=5=6=7=9=10
9>1=2=3=4=5=6=7=8=10
1>5>2>7>10>9>6>4>8>3


Undertale Semi-Open
seems to be the weak Condorcet winner.
Last edited by TemporalLich on Thu Jun 06, 2019 10:41 am, edited 1 time in total.
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