open 759: house party (compleded)

[Kirari Momobami]

VOTE: yumeko jabami

HEAL: yumeko jabami

What is the truth? what is the reality?

They say humans are irrational creatures. let's find out

[Kirari Momobami]

Skygazer seems to want attention. Talking about mech over reads early is scummy, and saying I'm scummy for not calling her scummy is scummy, but moving from not wanting to talk about mech to immediately talking about mech is. . . maybe townie?

Every choice we make is a gamble. But even so, we still gamble. For we enjoy the risk.

HEAL: Mary Saotome
HEAL: Kirari Momobami

[Kirari Momobami]

to do a group with two people, use one heal tag

Schadd you're making it hard to test who is actually paying attention to both the rules and my posts. I'm glad you are though.

[Kirari Momobami]

Now for the next gamble.

HEAL: Yumeko Jabami, Mary Saotome, Kirari Momobami

[Kirari Momobami]

4.6%

[Kirari Momobami]

If you were going off raw statistics, it would be 3.2967%, but I give Mary an extra 1.3% for being Mary Saotome.

[Kirari Momobami]

HEAL: Mary Saotome, Yumeko Jabami, Kirari Momobami, PenguinPower, SkyGazer

VOTE: Hellknight

[Kirari Momobami]

VOTE: Fuscosco

Given we have 4 days remaining, this is not really the time to be prodging.

I have not been a particularly vocal player so far but we do need a greater level of consensus on the party send if we're going to get anywhere.

So far my inclination is to put the people who might want to have fun with this game in the party, and leave everyone who we're okay with dying in the out-of-party. This means if an active player is dying, that we know it is another active player killing them. The exception to this currently is Yumeko who I am including purely for meme value and my own entertainment.

The Renais Twins would be another candidate for an activity-party send but I'm worried that the Renais Twins dying would not be interesting or informative regardless of which side of the party we have them on. Although the argument could be made that putting him in the party could bait one of the active players into killing him which would inform the town that there is in fact a wolf in the active players. So whether or not The Renais Twins should be in the party is something I would like to hear people's thoughts on.

I don't believe this is a flawless strategy but it is my reasoning, which most people have been content to kind of ignore, which makes me think that the current biggest issue with this game is inertia and apathy.

So let me be clear.



My inclination is to scorched earth everyone outside the party until the game includes readable players or something interesting happens. How's that for a gamble?

[Kirari Momobami]

VOTE: Hell Knight

[Kirari Momobami]

Not sure how I feel about Eirika using RC as a shield in 70 given he apparently flaked on the game.

[Kirari Momobami]

To be honest I am confused. I thought RC flaked and Eirika (unknown other head) was only one posting but maybe it's the other way around?

[Kirari Momobami]

Is "Jimothy" usually a passive player?

[Kirari Momobami]

@mod prod status on schiavetto and replacement status on bittersweet?

[Kirari Momobami]

You have permission to speak, Jimothy.

[Kirari Momobami]

Come now, Jimothy. We are playing with Mary Saotome. Let's keep imposters out of this discussion.

170 from Mary presents two problems. First, I believe there is the chance she attributed things I said to things Yumeko said in her mind. Or at least, Yumeko has the thing about gambling in her sig, but I don't think she really said she wanted the lynch to be a gamble. I've been trying to reread the iso of both players to get a better sense of what exactly is going on in Mary's mind, but that was a very distinctive type of red flag for me. If town, I think Mary's head is not in the game. But this is the type of issue I think I see from scum more often. Moreover, I feel somewhat like Mary is approaching Yumeko from a different perspective than she is approaching me, which is probably due to existing meta between the two players but makes me feel like there could also be a strategic point between their interactions that does not reflect an uninformed status toward the entire list. The second part is that the strategy regarding heals feels like rubbish but that's not as big of a problem for me at present as the first bit.

Simply put, I agree that Mary Saotome feels a bit off to me. That does not make her the best scumread, but it does mean she's relatively low in my pool compared to where I'd like her to be for meme reasons.

In terms of how this relates to strategy, I have been thinking about that. Either Mary is scum or risks becoming mislynchbait. In which case, perhaps we should instead of sending the active people, which was my inclination before and still actually my current preference (since I think that is the most amusing strategy), another option would be to make those sent to the party the House Pets. In this scenario, we would send three--exactly three--to the house party, and these would be the town's 3 collective lowest reads outside the day's decided lynch. Thus when there is a kill within the main pool of players, this would ensure that we know that there is a scum outside of the lowest three that we could focus on first.

But I am not at present so confident in my sense that 'Mary is off' that I would say I really want to go with that plan and make her a house pet. But that is something that crossed my mind. One of the infinite possibilities in how we could approach this setup. One of the ways in which we could choose to weigh the odds.

Fusco is no longer a bit scumread for me but I still am bothered that his activity picked up so much after a minor push.

As for TRT... have you said what needs to be said there? I'm looking through your iso and not totally sure I know what you mean about that slot. If it's just 176... I'd like to hear a bit more about what you think of the slot other than that one heal.

[Kirari Momobami]

I think Date Mike reads like town but you Jimothy seem like someone it'd be pretty easy to scumread as town, and it's your head specifically that Mary seems to be scumreading. I'd like to hear Mary's perspective on Date Mike.

[Kirari Momobami]

The biggest gamble of all... is letting Ephraim have his way. Sometimes he falls into traps... We should never forget what happened before Fort Rigwald.

Nonetheless I'm actually fine with this send of house pets, and today I think I am warming up to the House Pet policy. Even though I don't think even with lynching schiavetto we will have all three scum as pets or dead, this will still probably give us the best conditions for day 2.

VOTE: schiavetto

HEAL: PP, TRT, Mary

[Kirari Momobami]

From here, if schiavetto flips red, tomorrow we lynch one and add another pet, if schiavetto flips green we just lynch and add no pets, etc. etc. until scum are forced to kill among the pets.

[Kirari Momobami]

HEAL: no one

Need to see what replacement does before we continue with the composition of House Pets.

[Kirari Momobami]

I was talking about gambles because it’s the main theme of our show. I believe HK was a safe and easy lynch to push at the time (and it still somewhat is) do you disagree? So I was pushing our friend to gamble a little~

I think the way you phrased this made it seem strange to me you were asking her and not me, but I'd be amused by seeing Yumeko make some riskier bets.

Why is my plan bad? Simply dismissing me is quite rude you know.

0 people in the party presents the least information for us going into day 2, I think.

Maybe though I just like the idea of you being a house pet so I can put a collar on you and call you kitty?

[Kirari Momobami]

Penguin, would you like to dance?



How do you feel about the Schaivetto wagon?

Do you disagree with being a house pet? I wouldn't mind having a pet Penguin, personally.

[Kirari Momobami]

I mean, two posts yes, but the two posts are somehow worse than Bittersweet's one post... I don't mind seeing a flip on the slot, and if it's town, whatever.

Now, the appeal of being a House Pet is that then you don't get lynched tomorrow, unless for some reason one of the three in your pool dies which seems very unlikely. Instead I get to continue enjoying your posts and seeing your gifs. Effectively I'd be forcing you to still be alive on day 3. That's why I'm inclined to make the House Pets players that risk being mislynches but who I think are fundamentally competent if town, but are otherwise likely scum. I think that having vocal, competent players protected from the nightkill and also off-the-table for tomorrow's lynch, while debating the next day's lynch, will be much more fun.

Plus I get to put a collar on you and call you doggy.... :3

[Kirari Momobami]

Great job making me want to be lynched rather than be alive.

I feel like we're really on the same page now

[Kirari Momobami]

Oh also:

UNVOTE:
HEAL: Nobody

I think this is a towntell because if I replace into a new slot as town, I also prefer to start from scratch and make my own reads, where as I think scum would be more content to just sheep their predecessor.

~T

Does Tyrion head correspond to Jimothy from earlier?

Anyway this is a really weak reason to townread someone, and getting rid of the baggage from TRT is something I think either alignment does here every time if they're familiar with Ephraim

[Kirari Momobami]

People all around, you gotta (Come geddit) ♪ ♫
From the left to the right, make noise ♪ ♫

Anyway, TRT, I'm actually gonna disagree with you there - 410's entrance felt more like good-natured joking from town than anything else. What makes it scummy is the way he doubled back and called attention to it in 14.

Starting out by lightly disagreeing with TRT on a read is not a very compelling entrance, and using it to push a somewhat over-explained scumread on Sky isn't great

@Mr. Mifflin - Yes, that's who I was referring to. I'm glad I'm not the only one who finds issue with that aspect of it - jokes are jokes, and the fact that people chose to treat the comment as a joke rather than a scumtell doesn't warrant as much suspicion as Sky seems to have invested in it.

The way I see it, we should manage the party and the lynch using separate rules - we lynch people who are likely to be mafia, but we don't necessarily send people who are likely to be town to the party. Mmm, I think any plan that involves trying to send townie people in is flawed.

Why??? Not liking this post at all, feels like you're writing a paper and trying to get your word count up

This is a weird response given posts 60-64 from you.

I work at a school and this week's been weird in terms of coverage/workload so I hope you'll forgive me for being scarce. Will follow up in-depth tonight.

Apologizes for scarcity (mitigated somewhat by (impending?) replace out, sure, but whatever), but mostly this is just a continued tunnel on Sky.

Anyway Skygazer's opening was weird, but Schiavetto making Sky the only person she talks about in the first 4 pages isn't really great.

But, end of the day, it's two posts. If the replacement goes fast, maybe it won't be a problem, but I'm also not opposed to moving on with the game.

[Kirari Momobami]

I independently sorta want to townread RC slot for that replace - I think his position in the gamestate was one that he'd want to be in as scum especially when we were voting to send him to the party, laying low and having an excuse for not getting NK'd. He did state his displeasure at the game before, and it makes slightly more sense as a town rep out.

No. The player siteflaked for reasons that have nothing to do with this game and in any case using replacements as alignment indicative is... gambling with angle-shooting and mod intervention. Let's keep the gambles in this game fun, shall we?

[Kirari Momobami]

Is Nancy just going by Nancy or is she also joining in the roleplay?

[Kirari Momobami]

Oh so no lynchproof benefit to it then.

First, Tyrion being Date Mike seems to have really thrown his tone, but that's okay. I've dealt with... people with erratic personalities before.

In any case, I'm slightly surprised you don't understand the principle of the House Pets.

The scum team is three. We send three lynchbait/low ranking players to become House Pets that we're not lynching, lynch the lowest scumread, and then when there is a kill (almost certainly outside the house party) we know that the killer is not one of the House Pets. Strategically, it at that point means that there is more value in attempting to lynch someone who may have made the kill, and then adding another house pet until we force the scum to kill within the house pets.

So it's not a lynch proof anything, it's more a way of maneuvering our PoE so that eventually scum have to start killing other scumread players because (ideally) we will have either lynched or House Petted the entire scum team.

[Kirari Momobami]

I like how you switched the order... makes me feel like Tyrion is roleplaying as Nancy

Or maybe it's that Joffrey is roleplaying as Auro?

[Kirari Momobami]

I'd like to hear Tyrion's read on Fusco when

he finishes catching up.

[Kirari Momobami]

HEAL: Mary, HK, Skygazer, Schiavetto

4-person heal send is actually slightly superior since that gives us flexibility in the post-heal period where we decide which of the four slots we're going to lynch, even though I think we should be more or less mostly decided.

[Kirari Momobami]

HEAL: No one

Might as well see if replacements shake anything up

[Kirari Momobami]

Penguin what do you think about the other proposed pets? Do you have a strong preference on who gets lynched and who gets petted among Hell Knight, Mary Saotome, Schiavetto, and Skygazer?

[Kirari Momobami]

We would have been down to 12 hours without the extension from replacements.

Actually I'm less interested in the amount replacements shake things up looking at the timer.

HEAL: PenguinPower, Skygazer, Shiavetto, Hell Knight

I think I'm least interested in continuing to sort these slots tomorrow. Also the idea of the Penguin in a bow tie fills my icy black heart with a small spark of amusement.

I'd like to get going on this, hitting 8 on the heal send in 2 days seems like a lot of hassle given the amount of apathy in the player list. I'm also more or less fine with Joffrey's send if people strongly prefer -PP+Mary

[Kirari Momobami]

if i was scum then why is no one voting me?

ever think of that ??

Are you aware of the implications of me and Joffrey healing you?

[Kirari Momobami]

it means that im likely never nightkilled because ur in all likelihood leaving at least one scum out with the obvtown/strong town players

Given the current reads on you, you would never be nightkilled anyway, but yes this is correct.

Who do you think would make a better housepet than yourself?

[Kirari Momobami]

idk, is it necessarily a bad thing to be a housepet is town? i just dont see the validity of the strat even if i wasnt in the party but im wayyyy behind

Yes. The idea of the strat is that we either lynch or housepet all of the scum. So if you are a town, there is a significantly greater likelihood that we do not successfully put all of the scum into the housepets on day 1.

[Kirari Momobami]

andddd um what are the odds that we'd actually get all the scum into the housepets D1

i'd say its p close to zero and basically fucks over the entire party mechanic for a bit

How? Do you have a spicy alternative proposition? Or do you just object to wearing a kitty-collar and being called kitty?

The likelihood of getting all three scum into the house party on day 1 is in fact quite low, you are correct. But we begin here so that the likelihood increases over time.

I believe the random likelihood is .3% so you are correct that we are statistically unlikely to get all three immediately, but this still seems like a better strategy for going into day 2 than any other I can think of.

[Kirari Momobami]

I don't think that forcing scum into the party intentionally is good.

The hood should be used to restrict kills, not sus out theories.

[Kirari Momobami]

Possibly. But let's not focus on who I am, let's focus on what we're doing here.

>wants to remain stealthed
>starts game by making direct reference to something that restricts your possible mains to like 4 people

[Kirari Momobami]

Hi Hell Knight. Which head is posting at the moment?

[Kirari Momobami]

This is part of why I think HK is town. This isn't because of anything they did but no one is protecting him.

Why do you think scum would defend other scum on day 1 with 3 members in a mountainous?

[Kirari Momobami]

-Raya +Mary? What you think Lannisters?

[Kirari Momobami]

Paranoid about Kirari

Since when has this been the case?

[Kirari Momobami]

The problem with going with the heal-town route is that it limits our play much more going into day 3. The appeal of healing scumreads is that we can heal someone and lynch someone each day until the scum are forced to kill inside the party. If we go with the healing route then we have no way of knowing the overall quality of the healed party and thus there's no reason to continue healing on day 2, which just is a bit more boring and I feel less informative way of playing the setup.

[Kirari Momobami]

VC is inaccurate, I'm healing 4 as of 330. But I'm changing anyway.

HEAL: Hell Knight, PenguinPower, Mary Saotome, Skygazer

VOTE: Hell Knight

[Kirari Momobami]

If we're playing for coalition victory, and are just protecting strongest townreads, then I wouldn't want to commit to all 4 today. I'd rather do something like me and Lannisters, get a two man block, see the flip and the nightkill, and then prioritize solidifying townreads on slots in day 2 for the second heal so we could try to get our 4-man townblock at that point.

Honestly the lurker slots have been replaced by some decent players, there's a lot of pretty townie players but my tier two of townreads (Raya, fusco, dob, edgar) I'm not so confident in that I'd want to bet the game on in the next 24 hours.

It's possible (probable?) there's multiple 4 man winning coalitions among those 4 in addition to me+lan but I just don't feel super strongly about any of them based on what we have so far.

[Kirari Momobami]

Kirari, how would you feel about a party of {Inbred Lannisters, Fus, Edgar, Duppin} to start with? Or a party of three towny players that would consist of us along with two out of {Fus, Edgar, Duppin}?

I'm fine with Joffrey being nervous about me, I'm less thrilled with him having stronger reads of three other slots that, while likely town, I have a hard time solidifying.

If we're doing a coalition victory, then we don't "start with" the townblocked send. Four town in the house party is the coalition victory wincon, but to do that I would want to be stronger on Fus, Edgar, or Duppin. I feel like Joffrey wanted to townblock Edgar's slot for some extremely poor reasoning earlier and while the slot is still perhaps likely town, I haven't really put any effort into picking apart the quality of that read yet.

It is possible that coalition victory is the more reliable wincon despite my misgivings (and the very high amount of roleplay pleasure I get from the house pets plan). Partly my problem here is that raya and red panda at this point aren't significantly lower for me than fus, edgar, or duppin, so having one 'likely town' player die is not a particularly severe problem for me. I think the only player other than myself that would be a major inconvenience would be your slot.

I feel like I'm shading those slots here and that's really not the intention. I like Edgar, Duppin, Raya, and Red's slots--I just haven't really had a lot of time to mull them over because most of them are replacements from relatively late in the day. Fus I still have just some minor misgivings about early game which I didn't really like his play in, even if he's basically been fine since the little poke earlier.

So if we do want to play for a coalition victory, I'd much rather only pair you and me. I don't know if the rest of the game would get on board with that heal plan, and I also still really like the makeshift flavor of the house pets idea, although it does mean that scum probably kill one of the two of us (probably you) given the high likelihood we don't get all three scum on the initial go.

In this regard, only using the house party to gate the kill away from high-order townreads does hold an appeal, I just don't want to commit to all 4 when we have the lowest amount of information.

[Kirari Momobami]

I've rubbished the RC townread from replacement long ago

This is what I was referring to.

Well we can see if the town will get on board, although this is definitely the less lulzy approach than House Pets.

HEAL: Kirari, The Lannisters

I'll reread fusco tomorrow.

[Kirari Momobami]

Yeah I don't know why people are still doing that since Raya started posting. That's not going through, although I think House Pets send of PP/Sky/HK/Mary is fine if we go that way.

[Kirari Momobami]

Fusco what happened to your hk read between 120 and 125? Or what did you mean in 120 I guess

[Kirari Momobami]

And I assumed the account was a gimmick alt, which Im less than enthused about in general. hate. hate. hate most gimmick alts.

Clearly a scumclaim

Aye so lets kill Titus, Bobert, Sky, And maaaaybe mary. I remember disliking them but not for any specific post.

Decent send but I once again am left wondering what happened to the HK read.

Idk Joffrey, Titus push is decent, like some of the sends, I'm fine leaning town on the slot but I'm not sure what pushes you into "obvtown territory" here over the others. I'm having a hard time following certain reads (hk, duppin)

[Kirari Momobami]

duppin is townblocking fusco because fusco makes short posts. That's not a good reason to townread someone. I think duppin is mostly fine as a townlean but unfortunately I think his wall catchup is probably mostly from before he replaced in. I don't scumread the slot but I'm not committing him to a coalition victory yet. If we were actually playing coalition, maybe. But I'd like to see more.

Duppin any update on your read of raya?

[Kirari Momobami]

I think the problem that Lannisters is feeling is that while the House Pets strategy is basically fine, we're not being aggressive enough with it.

The situation we have right now is:
-we have a lot of low activity mislynchbait
-we have a fairly large pool of lightly townread players that are not effectively eliminated from being deepwolves
-we have a very small pool of high tier townreads and even those are not universally shared

With that in mind, I'm thinking the House Pet strategy as a core is fine, and the reason it's getting so much pushback is because we are not including enough people. We can actually be aggressive in sending to the party, because our core goal is just to get all the mislynchbait and scum all into the same pool, since if we end up with something like only 4 town in the main block we win.

So let's go this way

HEAL: Titus
Hell Knight
PenguinPower
Mary Saotome
Yumeko Jabami
Uncle Bob
Skygazer

I'm actually indifferent to a yumeko lynch at this point even though I'd prefer HK.

We can put 7 in the party and even though this means we're guaranteed to put at least 4 town in, that means that if there is a nightkill in the main pool of 7 that it's that much more informative for us going into d2.

This also fits with the initial arguments that we should have a larger pool of players partied d1.

[Kirari Momobami]

Bear in mind we have 21 hours to reach a consensus on the heal, and that our baseline strategies need to be resolved. We don't want heal votes split between the House Pet and Coalition Win strategies since if it is randomized that means the randomization will be very bad.

[Kirari Momobami]

I feel like some people haven't really updated their Raya reads, I'm fine with +Raya -Bob if there's a compelling argument for that, but I think we want to get some level of consensus going here

[Kirari Momobami]

Yeah but with a 1-2 split, which is the scenario that's more likely, then we have 7 in the main pool; scum kills 1, we lynch one and remove one, and then we have 4 = 4 man townblock *after* we have more information. A 1-2 split is not a huge problem, only a 2-1 split would be which I don't think it is.

[Kirari Momobami]

I mean sure, the 2-man coalition send is probably the higher winrate approach but I'm seeing 0 support for it in this game. Duppin is probtown but I wouldn't coalition him today and we need to be working toward some sort of consensus for the send. A 7-man send that includes pretty much all the mislynchbait and probscum leaves us with 7 in the main town pool. A 1-2 split is not a huge issue; if scum kill in the house party then it's 2-3 lynch rate in the house party and if we don't suck we should be able to hit scum day 2. If scum kill in the expanded town then it's 6 in the expanded town, and day 2 we lynch one and house party another, and end up with 4 town in the expanded townblock. If we still have a scum in the townblock at that point then we were probably going to have a scum in the 4 man townblock anyway.

[Kirari Momobami]

Each move scum makes gives info. In a 7-7 scum have to shoot to protect their weaker players, rather than playing to their strongest. Bussing for cred is a much less viable strategy.

Pretty much none of this is true

[Kirari Momobami]

HEAL: Titus
Hell Knight
PenguinPower
Mary Saotome
Yumeko Jabami
Uncle Bob
Skygazer

If you don't think this includes all three scum then say who should be in it

[Kirari Momobami]

if a mafia goon that isn't in the Party tries to kill someone that is in the Party

(or vice versa)

[Kirari Momobami]

Yes, I agree that a Kirari/Lannister send is probably the best play for day 1, but right now I'm seeing 0 support for that plan and I don't want us waiting to the last minute and getting some garbage randomized send.

Who supports a Kirari/Lannister heal for day 1?

Who supports a 7-man house pet send?

Who has other serious proposals that isn't "let mod decide" lolcatting?

[Kirari Momobami]

Okay then you're wasting our time. Why are you talking about a send that no one is going to support?

[Kirari Momobami]

You're not going to get 6 people to coalition you and dup in the next 20 hours and continuing to try to send townreads into the house party is playing against wincon because it's really looking like we won't get a consensus at all. If the send is randomized it should be exclusively composed of scumreads or lynchbait poes.

[Kirari Momobami]

Nope

[Kirari Momobami]

What happened to your read of Edgar?

[Kirari Momobami]

and you're also okay with scum killing him?

[Kirari Momobami]

Skygazer is a must in the party I feel.

You've also moved away from this, which was based on the fact that you thought Skygazer's push on Yumeko meant that Skygazer was "really scumhunting"? What changed your mind about Sky?

[Kirari Momobami]

OK. Why are you townleaning duppin for stating the reads he likely made before replacing in?

[Kirari Momobami]

I'm assuming you're going to say you're paranoid about me because Auro just said he's paranoid about me and right now you're parroting things Auro has said. Since I already know what you're going to say there's no need to ask you about it.

[Kirari Momobami]

I'm willing to accept you're just going with the flow right now but I'd still like to hear how your read on Sky has changed or hasn't changed since that is probably the most interesting thing about your positions so far. You were insisting she had to be in the send earlier but now you're saying her "protown actions" give you paranoia. What does that actually mean for your read of Skygazer?

[Kirari Momobami]

I am Kirari Mombami



Student Council President!

[Kirari Momobami]

Momobami

Top 10 Anime Typos

[Kirari Momobami]

Glad to see we went with the house pets strategy, now the actual game can begin.

VOTE: Inbred Lannisters

[Kirari Momobami]

I actually think this is great, we have the deepwolf isolated to 4 slots, so we can start lynching in them while feeding more into the house pets to create an actual townblock.

[Kirari Momobami]

I wasn't chosen for the party...thought that was somewhat obvious.

You're in the party with two wolves that there's no reason to lynch inside rather than the party with one wolf, so that's nice.

[Kirari Momobami]

Please stop trying to spam post, scum, it's not a good look for you.

[Kirari Momobami]

Actually, Cersei just told me, our party won, so heavily leaning Kirai wolf now. Scum can’t kill us tonight without being outed, so why not kill our biggest threat, one way or the other?

Exactly why scum wanted to control the party formation and go with the fake townblock, so that there could be a lazy explanation for why the slot isn't nightkilled.

[Kirari Momobami]

I'm not sure if this is scum, really bad town, or if my illness made me delusional.

Do you have all four of the slots in that party as locktown?

[Kirari Momobami]

Oh? Who are the two wolves, you think we’re in a party with? Oh keep up that open wolfing.

IL apparently can't even keep track of which town they think they townblocked with and now think Penguin is in their party, ok

[Kirari Momobami]

Policy lynch KM?

First partner/white knight right here

[Kirari Momobami]

VOTE: Titus

Now we can lynch here

[Kirari Momobami]

You're acting like a wolf on the outside of 4 townies...

You just white knighted a slot you weren't even townreading who advocated and executed a plan that went in opposition to your strategy in the game. Your first thought in reaction to me pushing their slot is "policy lynch" which means you're either a truly awful player or scum, and I'll give you the benefit of the doubt here and say you're just scum.

[Kirari Momobami]

But really glad Joffrey objected to you being in party now, because if you’re open wolfing here, it’s beyond freaking obvious what you’re doing.

Yes I totally believe that Nancy Drew 39 and Volxen were willing to sheep Auro on his read of me without fighting about it in thread at all. Please continue posting wolf .jpgs.

[Kirari Momobami]

I’m leaning scum only because scum knows they can’t kill us, so it makes sense they’d try to kill us one way or another.

If I was scum I'd have my goon kill you not try to lynch you, and if there was no goon in your party then I'd have already conceded the game.

[Kirari Momobami]

Wow! you’re such a genius.

I am and if you're not scum you probably need to be lynched so that town has a chance in endgame since your reads are likely awful.

[Kirari Momobami]

Lannister's intent has obvtown all over it.

OK then who is scum? If you say me then you're getting lynched today.

[Kirari Momobami]

Cool Titus is town

[Kirari Momobami]

Test is over Nancy you can go back to your corner, thanks for playing along.

[Kirari Momobami]

House Pets
Inbred Lannisters (volxen, Auro, Nancy Drew 39)
Edgar Allan Foe
duppin
Fuscosco

Fun Party Party
Titus
RedPanda
Skygazer
Uncle Bob
Raya36
Yumeko Jabami
Mary Saotome
Hell Knight
PenguinPower

Probably want to actually go here for now

VOTE: Penguin Power

[Kirari Momobami]

Nancy stop playing like it's 5 minutes ago lol

[Kirari Momobami]

It's Momobami, not Monobami, thanks

[Kirari Momobami]

Penguin, if your idea was to sheep my house pet strategy, why did you not adjust your list after your initial grouping or react to the other discussions under proposal?

[Kirari Momobami]

Spoiler:

VC is inaccurate, I'm healing 4 as of 330. But I'm changing anyway.

HEAL: Hell Knight, PenguinPower, Mary Saotome, Skygazer

VOTE: Hell Knight

I think the problem that Lannisters is feeling is that while the House Pets strategy is basically fine, we're not being aggressive enough with it.

The situation we have right now is:
-we have a lot of low activity mislynchbait
-we have a fairly large pool of lightly townread players that are not effectively eliminated from being deepwolves
-we have a very small pool of high tier townreads and even those are not universally shared

With that in mind, I'm thinking the House Pet strategy as a core is fine, and the reason it's getting so much pushback is because we are not including enough people. We can actually be aggressive in sending to the party, because our core goal is just to get all the mislynchbait and scum all into the same pool, since if we end up with something like only 4 town in the main block we win.

So let's go this way

HEAL: Titus
Hell Knight
PenguinPower
Mary Saotome
Yumeko Jabami
Uncle Bob
Skygazer

I'm actually indifferent to a yumeko lynch at this point even though I'd prefer HK.

We can put 7 in the party and even though this means we're guaranteed to put at least 4 town in, that means that if there is a nightkill in the main pool of 7 that it's that much more informative for us going into d2.

This also fits with the initial arguments that we should have a larger pool of players partied d1.

You were in both of my alternate sends. One was -raya +Mary, the other was a 7-group send. You had no reaction to either one, and you were included in both alternates

[Kirari Momobami]

Hi...it's almost like the more people who vote for a send, the greater chance it has of being chosen. Leaving the one I was one to entertain your other proposals when it had no traction would decrease that (hence the second quote).

Amazing.

The send that had no traction was the one that had both you and Hell Knight voting for yourselves to be sent as House Pets.

[Kirari Momobami]

Joffrey or Cersei will have to address this. I still haven’t read the entire game.

The question was at Penguin, Tyrion.

[Kirari Momobami]

Yeah, the #2 wagon was the house pets group I created pre-replacements, and none of the people who supported my pre-replacement house pet group would adjust or reevaluate after the replacements joined the game which is ???

Then again HK has been scummy all game but Penguin reassessing nothing after like three replacements is extremely suspect to me even if he wanted to roleplay his way into a house pet party

[Kirari Momobami]

I also want to townread Kirari. I wasn't really a fan of her first posts, but I thought #211 was a good post.

Kirari - scummy most of the way, but 211 looked better

I know 211 was a good post but uhm, have you been copying someone else's homework here mister?

You know that's not acceptable in this school.

[Kirari Momobami]

I think you underestimate my commitment.

Well at least you're in the cool party with me even if you're scum

[Kirari Momobami]

What's up, Forest Raccoon?

[Kirari Momobami]

I feel like you wouldn't be asking that if you were caught up?

[Kirari Momobami]

It was something I did and IL reacted, but I more wanted IL to push me to see the reasoning of people in reaction to our fight (i.e. Titus).

Why? Do you have concerns about IL?

[Kirari Momobami]

Define "concern." I'm concerned that Joffrey has bad reads and a poor strategy. Those are both concerning to town winning this game.

[Kirari Momobami]

You still kinda didn't answer my question. Are you concerned about IBL? What did you think of Tyrion's reaction to my push?

[Kirari Momobami]

idk, I think one medium strength townread out of a slot that previously was nullscum is better results than I see people get out of longer reaction tests. I also think there's really only so much patience people have for reaction tests and if you push them too long they're going to lose objectivity for a prolonged period of time.

Anyway, what's your read of Titus, Edgar?

[Kirari Momobami]

I actually think it's a legitimate question. I kind of don't understand why people acknowledged that Yumeko was at 8 votes but never bothered to push people to unvote until after the heal was resolved. If people knew that the lynch didn't resolve until the heal resolved, why was no one bothering to ask people to unvote so we didn't lose the second seven days of cycle 1?

[Kirari Momobami]

I actually think it's a legitimate question. I kind of don't understand why people acknowledged that Yumeko was at 8 votes but never bothered to push people to unvote until after the heal was resolved. If people knew that the lynch didn't resolve until the heal resolved, why was no one bothering to ask people to unvote so we didn't lose the second seven days of cycle 1?

Kinda feel like this also goes for Mary tbh

[Kirari Momobami]

Panda, you sure seem to deflect questions with other questions a lot. Does whether Yumeko is defending herself or attacking you change your answers to her questions?

[Kirari Momobami]

I don't think it's heavily implied, I think it's near certain that all of the vote counts that were edited were due to the mod mislabeling my vote. I think there may have actually been one other mislabeled vote as well even? For some reason I thought I saw the vote count at 8 for Yumeko at one point which means two would have had to be removed.

[Kirari Momobami]

It doesn't change my answers.

I guess I just feel like you're stalling a lot in this exchange, and it also felt like you were stalling with me. I don't know that makes you scum, unless you're maybe a secret alt of the worst. But I think you said you were a main so I think you're town, I think you're just needlessly evasive.

Spoiler:

I also think you're right about fusco and that Joffrey fucked the town with that 4-man but that will probably end up being his problem.

[Kirari Momobami]

Yumeko is where most of us are voting for. Isn't it time to get engage and get reads? Why do I need to defend against her?

That's exactly why I'm wondering why you feel so defensive

[Kirari Momobami]

Oh Sky actually unvoted, so my vote label was the only mod mistake

[Kirari Momobami]

"before I answer that let me ask you a different question" is defensive/evasive and classic stalling

I say that and I think you're town, but you do come off as pretty evasive today

[Kirari Momobami]

What's HK at right now?

[Kirari Momobami]

I suppose. You're right that IL focusing on their own survival was wifomy garbage. Tyrion calling one slot that isn't obvtown and Joffrey insisting that fusco is townie when he's just not that townie means town is in a rather messy position now, given that we can't be certain there is only one scum in the party.

But if I really wanted to reaction test IL, I would have waited for Cersei to be online. Tyrion omgusing me with images is pretty NAI for that player. It had been concerning that Tyrion dropped her read of me at the drop of a hat, but that also explains to me why Tyrion would not have argued with Joffrey about including me in the coalition, which was one of the biggest things that was bothering me about the slot. You've seen how aggressive Tyrion can be about her reads now, so why would she just let Auro dictate who is or isn't in the coalition? But seeing Tyrion flip his read like that basically answered the question for me--Tyrion didn't really have that strong of a read on me, or at least not as strong as some of the other heads seemed to imply.

So it wasn't really a reaction test designed for IL (if I wanted to reaction test any of the heads, it would certainly be Cersei), but it did answer one of my questions about the slot anyway.

I think they're town, I just still think they're more than likely to end up costing us the game at this point (in addition to making the rest of the game a lot less fun).

[Kirari Momobami]

Kirari, which reads of mine concern you (apart from the Fus read, which is less relevant now)?

Really only need the one to lose the game. Mostly though I think putting in three non-consensus null/leantowns was a huge oversight and that the housepet strategy was significantly better on a variety of fronts. Given scum haven't conceded yet, you've almost certainly included one, so I think your reads being bad are at this point functionally self-evident.

[Kirari Momobami]

How does that inform your lynch pool?

huh? you being bad does not really affect my reads much

[Kirari Momobami]

I'm also making the weak assumption that scum would not want to send two town to the party either; so Fus willing to send me and Duppin *and* Duppin willing to send me and Fus *and* is slightly town indicative.

smells like moonlogic

[Kirari Momobami]

It's not really irrelevant when it's now much more likely that you will at some point have to choose which of the three people you insisted go into the party is scum. It's a conversation that can wait but it's not a conversation that can wait if you want to have it while I'm still alive, given you decided to ask scum to kill me.

[Kirari Momobami]

Do you imagine a stage where we'd Lynch out of the party? Ergo a NK in the party?

I mean, I certainly hope we don't lose before we reach that point LOL

Be pretty sad if we lost at 7s

[Kirari Momobami]

I'm not going to pre-flip fusco if that's what you're asking.

[Kirari Momobami]

I'm not going to pre-flip Fusco and I also don't buy your moonlogic about the order of votes so yeah, I'm basically ignoring that entire argument.

[Kirari Momobami]

Aww, did doggo get some good reads from the heal votes. Good boy!

[Kirari Momobami]

VOTE: hk

[Kirari Momobami]

Upside down beast

[Kirari Momobami]

[Kirari Momobami]

I don't mind if you get punished so long as I get to watch :3

[Kirari Momobami]

Spoiler:

vote count 1b.1

lynch

Hell Knight (4):

Yumeko Jabami, duppin, Edgar Allan Foe, Inbred Lannisters

Yumeko Jabami (3):

Uncle Bob, RedPanda, Mary Saotome

PenguinPower (2):

Kirari Momobami, Hell Knight

not voting (5):

Raya36, Skygazer, PenguinPower, Titus, Fuscosco

with 14 alive, it takes 8 to lynch. day 1 ends june 6th at 12:20 central US time; in (expired on 2019-06-06 12:20:00)

mod notes

• titus is VLA
  
• kind of forgot about this for abt 3 hours

If nance thinks he’s obvscum and we think he’s scum, let’s vote here

Why does Nancy's view strengthen yours?

I think he was buddying us when he proposed us for the party

I literally copy/pasted Kirari's suggestion...

Like...wut?

And I fell for it

Fake fake fake fake.

VOTE: Hell Knight

VOTE: hk

VOTE: HK

I may change this if I feel better later.

think that's L-1?

Fine with HK going but it's time for reads lists from anyone who thinks they're townread outside the party

[Kirari Momobami]

House Pets
Inbred Lannisters (volxen, Auro, Nancy Drew 39)

Edgar Allan Foe - duppin

Fuscosco


Fun Party
Titus - Yumeko Jabami - RedPanda

Uncle Bob - Raya36 / Skygazer
Mary Saotome
PenguinPower

Hell Knight

HK red flip might adjust my read of Penguin but probably not by much?

Even if I pre-flip fusco I don't think fusco/hk/PP is a solid solve, doesn't smell right

I feel like Uncle Bob/Raya/Sky is my null line, but I kinda don't feel like Uncle Bob and Raya are null in the same way as Sky for me. Sky is more a "I think one thing makes her town, but if I'm wrong on that one thing then she's very likely scum" -- don't want to go into more on this cause I don't think it helps anyone other than me keep track of my thoughts. I was actually townleaning Raya from her entrance but her inability to sustain has that kinda slipping back to null for me. Bob, having no content, could easily go either way.

Likewise Mary isn't really a scumlean even, I more just feel like I should be townleaning her by now and I'm not and that level of underwhelming puts her slightly below null for me.

Penguin has seemed slightly more townish since starting his push on HK but I don't know that I can rule out S/S there quite yet. If I'm not dead tomorrow I'll need to reevaluate Penguin and see how I feel about his slot.

In terms of the towns, Titus I still feel reacted in a relatively townish manner to my push but sometimes my realtime reaction tests are not as reliable as I'd like. I think the slot is town but I don't fault those who are not convinced. Red Panda feels very town to me but I think he has a real playstyle conflict and I find his evasiveness distracting and when he starts hedging I second guess my read. Yumeko's catchup in response to her near-lynch feels pretty town.

[Kirari Momobami]

I'm actually pretty okay with day ending with an HK lynch at this point. I'd like to see day-end lists from Yumeko and Red Panda, but I don't want that so much I'd stall the day unless they actually wanted to do lists.

[Kirari Momobami]

In case the structure of my house pets list is unclear, I'm not null reading fusco

Lannisters - town

Clegane and Qyburn - null

fusco - scum

[Kirari Momobami]

I have not investigated your meta whatsoever, a lot of your posts just feel fake to me.

That being said I don't have HK's flip yet. If HK does flip red, this should be revisited:

I also want to townread Kirari. I wasn't really a fan of her first posts, but I thought #211 was a good post.

Kirari - scummy most of the way, but 211 looked better

I know 211 was a good post but uhm, have you been copying someone else's homework here mister?

You know that's not acceptable in this school.

[Kirari Momobami]

If there's not much meta to your account, why would people townread you for your scum game being outside your townrange or whatever word salad you just said? Either it's alignment indicative or it's not

[Kirari Momobami]

Spoiler:

Howdy

VC please

HEAL: Random half of the village

big off.

OFF

VOTE: titus

Titus is a noplay here.

Titus has the time to play, she chooses not to. Hell knight at least gave a read or two.

I haven't really sorted this game. Ill look today or tomorrow.

I don't think that forcing scum into the party intentionally is good.

I dont think putting 'popular' players into the party is good.

I dont think putting 5 players that you cant 100 read or lynch without social dramahs is good

The hood should be used to restrict kills, not sus out theories.

I don't want titus, kirari, fuscosco, or lannisters in the party.

Nobody has tried to add these.

I feel cheated for not having gotten credit for wrangling myself into the party

I convinced people who didnt locktown me to locktown me.

Im really wary of all this focus on

1: the hood composition post-formation
2: Assuming theres a deepwolf post-formation
3: Pushing a lurker wagon like its a civic duty


its really shit

Actually your push to include me in the healblock was kinda decent at a glance, I suppose there is a chance you're town. I haven't really put a lot of thought into sorting the bottom three of the house party and I wouldn't really be shocked if edgar or duppin flipped scum while you flipped town.

I think you focusing so much on Titus for about 1/3rd of your iso is a bit suspect given this is a wide open mountainous; I can see scum maybe feeling like they want to have someone in particular to talk about until they're in a good position

863/864 was pretty gross and needless wifom if you are town

914 was lamist iioa.

Don't like your defense of HK, also don't like the first ~12 posts about your iso.

Most of the things that make you look town are things you said about my slot; that's why Lannisters townread you and it's possible you doubled down since apparently townreading me gives you townpoints in Joffrey's book, even though he himself is paranoid of me. So it's plausible you would push to have me in the healblock but not push *hard*

Still if HK flips scum there's a chance I'd lynch duppin over you in the scenario where Lannisters is nightkilled at some point.

[Kirari Momobami]

I mostly haven't thought about duppin/edgar that much since Joffrey made such a big point that he wanted sorting you three to be his problem and not anyone else's given his insistence on making a 4-man house party block on day 1.

Given Edgar is very forgettable there's no real reason to think he couldn't be scum here, especially if it's some random brassherald alt or something. (Not actually saying it's a brassherald alt, just saying *for example* that there are some scum that would coast on a stealth alt as scum if they thought they could get away with it and had replaced in to a +town equity slot)

[Kirari Momobami]

Hey scum, if there's no scum in the house party can you just concede the game and not replace out?

[Kirari Momobami]

Wait not allowed to comment on replacements.

Revise that to:

Hey scum if there's no scum in the house party can you just concede the game please?

[Kirari Momobami]

Kirari, You are not good for my life.

[Kirari Momobami]

Kirari, You are not good for my life.

what did this mean anyway?

[Kirari Momobami]

iso 2?

[Kirari Momobami]

I didn't say sorting the other three is my problem.

You didn't say that with your words, you chose for that to be the case with your party construction. Although if it's not your problem you'll be dead, and I guess that's a likely enough scenario, so maybe it won't be your problem after all.

[Kirari Momobami]

You made me trust and you are going to scar me if you flip scum.

I mean... I don't mind scarring you even if I'm town :3

[Kirari Momobami]

HEAL: Mary Saotome, Yumeko Jabami, Kirari Momobami, PenguinPower, SkyGazer

this is not the heal you're talking about?

[Kirari Momobami]

Interesting. Penguin you were the first one to lay that heal vote; what rationale for including those team members?

he was sheeping me, that group was the pre-replacement house pets send that I created before we got Raya and co.

[Kirari Momobami]

You're right, Yumeko's heal included Mary, she didn't join on the 4-man house pet group.

I guess that is a mod error then, although I don't think it changes the dice roll

[Kirari Momobami]

tbf considering Yumeko healed at the beginning of the game and was way more focused on the lynch vote on her, I actually don't find it shocking that she missed the 1-off mod error on her heal send, although I guess that is just very slightly concerning

schadd has been a naughty boy this game, making mod errors... maybe he needs some punishment? :3 :3 :3

[Kirari Momobami]

schadd has been a naughty boy this game, making mod errors... maybe he needs some punishment? :3 :3 :3

im just editing this gif out. stop doing this

[Kirari Momobami]

I think you're missing the point of playing on a stealth alt.

[Kirari Momobami]

You know you really didn't need to out me to Nancy when I'm about to die like 60% of the time tonight.

[Kirari Momobami]

Whenever Yumeko decides whether she's doing a list or not I'm fine with a hammer

[Kirari Momobami]

Wow, you thought I was Ali? What a compliment, thanks man!

Anyway, I hope you guys are still on good terms. I hate to see people I like upset with each other.

???

[Kirari Momobami]

This conversation is probably super boring for everyone else tho

[Kirari Momobami]

I was more wondering if your scumreads had moved at all after interacting with people

But yeah, someone just hammer whenever

[Kirari Momobami]

Fusco panda and sky where are you all on hk?

[Kirari Momobami]

This plausibly flips town but for me the bigger question is persi. The play here is within Baezu's townrange but I am less certain that this is what town persi looks like. I kinda just a little don't buy him forgetting he was in this game for a week for one. Still fine with seeing a flip here.

[Kirari Momobami]

My thought would be that he probably didn't like playing scum, although I guess you're right that he might have actually been out of town for a few days. I thought he said he just forgot he was in the game

[Kirari Momobami]

Due to some miscommunication and a VLA, I didn't even know this game was going on until this morning. Will catch up today/tomorrow.

- Pers

Yeah, I guess he was out of town in addition to this?

[Kirari Momobami]

But if he was just out of town why wouldn't he just say he was out of town?

[Kirari Momobami]

It's hard to self-hammer when you're not at l-1

[Kirari Momobami]

UNVOTE:

[Kirari Momobami]

Now l2! Guess we're waiting for replacements so that they can give reads before we hammer hk slot anyway

[Kirari Momobami]

realistically it's more likely one scum is in the house pets, scum feel fine and are on cue to win and this entire conversation is absurd

I'd take a concession tho given this game has turned dull

[Kirari Momobami]

Oh no, scum have replaced out this game for sure, I just don't think scum replacing out means they are actually doing so because of the desire to concede (although it'd be nice)

my comment earlier was just seeing mary voluntary and raya-slot getting replaced for the second time, and HK can easily be a scum replace out too, but there's probably at least one scum that isn't basically dead in the water

[Kirari Momobami]

oh ok are we bored yet

VOTE: hk

[Kirari Momobami]

The heal mechanic was real but the phase of the game where it was relevant is now over; it probably will not be used tomorrow.

The game is in two blocks, the housepet block of Lannisters, duppin, fusco, and Edgar Allen Foe; and then the main block of everyone else. Scum cannot kill across blocks without being revealed as scum.

By the way, this is a point where if you are scum, and you do not have any scum in the 4-man block of Lann/duppin//fusco/Foe, you should concede the game since we will not be lynching in there until there is a kill within the housepet block and we won't be adding more people in.

Anyway, Hell Knight is at l-1 if you would like to have two nights to catch up and two flips to read the game with you are more than welcome to hammer.

[Kirari Momobami]

Hell Knight was lynched. He/she/they was/were Mafia Goon.

During night 1, Kirari Momobami was killed. She was VT.

It is now Day 2.

[Kirari Momobami]

wow if hell knight is town skygayzer is very scum scum

VOTE: Saudade

;;; Mod note -- this vote does not count as Kirari Momobami is dead and no longer in the game.

Spoiler:

;;; Player note -- the above mod note is a joke and I am not actually impersonating the mod

[Kirari Momobami]

@Kirari, in case you are nightkilled tonight, what are all of your reads at this point? Are any of your reads contingent on HK flipping town or scum?

- Cersei Lannister (Volxen)

In all seriousness I kinda don't think 1287 was a real thought process from Saudade, although his replace in is so fresh that I don't have a strong read on him yet over Mary.

Beyond that:

Fun Party Party
Titus
RedPanda
Skygazer
Uncle Bob
Raya36
Yumeko Jabami
Mary Saotome
Hell Knight
PenguinPower

Red maybe over Titus, Raya maybe below Yumeko?

Wouldn't mind lynching inside Penguin or Mary tomorrow but that's pre-flip reasoning, if there is a red on HK I think that *might* change my feelings toward Penguin, but probably not nearly as much as you seem to want to

Green flip on HK and I just keep going up the line, maybe Saudade/Mary over Penguin based on 1287

[Kirari Momobami]

The lannistwr hydra is stupid and theres someone voting me because i suspect the person who got prodded thus clearly not reading just hammered

Every day I wake up, every day I wake up alone

just kill me

I mean, Sky could be scum sure, but I don't see why you'd say "if HK flips town" -- if HK flips red then maybe Sky decided HK was going down and it was time for a bus

hence why your reaction there reads as fake to me, the pre-flip on HK as a reason to read Sky seems unlike you

[Kirari Momobami]

I would tear you apart over this but im honestly not invested in this in the slightest

I'd really much rather have you kill me than bother lynching you tomorrow, this game is kinda a snoozefest at this point and lynching you probably would not be all that interesting.

[Kirari Momobami]

How is this ever a “housepet block”?

Well it's because I put a collar on you and now your name is kitty :3

[Kirari Momobami]

cool alt idea btw

Yeah, I agree, seems like a great alt!

[Kirari Momobami]

omg schadd that Applebee's tweet is amazing

[Kirari Momobami]

Spoiler:

Glad to see we went with the house pets strategy, now the actual game can begin.

VOTE: Inbred Lannisters

I wasn't chosen for the party...thought that was somewhat obvious.

You're in the party with two wolves that there's no reason to lynch inside rather than the party with one wolf, so that's nice.

Oh? Who are the two wolves, you think we’re in a party with? Oh keep up that open wolfing.

Policy lynch KM?

VOTE: Titus

Now we can lynch here

You're acting like a wolf on the outside of 4 townies...

You just white knighted a slot you weren't even townreading who advocated and executed a plan that went in opposition to your strategy in the game. Your first thought in reaction to me pushing their slot is "policy lynch" which means you're either a truly awful player or scum, and I'll give you the benefit of the doubt here and say you're just scum.

Cool Titus is town

*sigh*

>does reaction test
>scum does exactly what I think they will do in reaction test
>somehow... I end up townreading them?

Why Kirari, why?

Didn't really look at the Titus stuff in last few pages, hope everyone's doing okay, was just annoyed at myself for reading Titus wrong here

[Kirari Momobami]

gg all

[Kirari Momobami]

It's okay RedPanda, our Panda/animegirl friendship will transcend the bounds of shitty cheaters