open 759: house party (compleded)

[schadd_]

Spoiler:

Vote count 2a.3

party vote

PARTY MEMBERS (4):

duppin, Edgar Allan Foe, Fuscosco, Inbred Lannisters

Golden RASpberry (5):

Inbred Lannisters, Skygazer, Golden RASpberry, RedPanda, CheekyTeeky

nobody (2):

Fuscosco, Titus

not voting (5):

Edgar Allan Foe, PenguinPower, duppin, Yumeko Jabami, Uncle Bob

Edgar Allan Foe (4):

Golden RASpberry, CheekyTeeky, Fuscosco, Skygazer

PenguinPower (2):

RedPanda, Yumeko Jabami

not voting (6):

Edgar Allan Foe, Titus, PenguinPower, Uncle Bob, Inbred Lannisters, duppin

with 12 alive, it takes 7 to choose a group. the group phase ends june 13th at 22:40 central US time; in (expired on 2019-06-13 22:40:00)

mod notes

• prodding uncle bob

[/area]

[Fuscosco]

Fusc clearly expected Kirai to be the NK and that pings me especially

excuse me. iirc YOU stopped kirari from being added to the party vote.

[Fuscosco]

Then we shouldnt add anyone to the hood.

So long as you can say you currently SR or suspect a party player, you cannot add another player to that. We hunt the outside scum and force them to out themselves.

Scum tend to win mountainous games. The party is what we have to balance that.

it is proscum to let obvtown die

. How many times do I need to keep repeating this?

~T

This is why scum win so often. Its is proscum to play fast and loose with the mechanics and your reads.

[Fuscosco]

I kind of want foe in for sure.
Im psure kirari is a good NK for scum and is reasonably town to me.

still want kirari

Fusco panda and sky where are you all on hk?

Town

OH LOOK I CALLED THE OBVIOUSLY TOWN SLOT TOWN/

[Fuscosco]

I kind of want foe in for sure.
Im psure kirari is a good NK for scum and is reasonably town to me.

Explain townread on Foe.
Yea Kirari is both of those things. Still don't want to send him, because of the deepwolf equity. Don't want to explain that rn

AND OHH LOOK. THE SAME INBRED WHO CALLED HK SCUM FUCKED UP ADDING KIRARI TOO

[Fuscosco]

Dont come at me with your crap IL, You are all responsible for your collective bad play. And you continue the tradition.

[Fuscosco]

This is why scum win so often. Its is proscum to play fast and loose with the mechanics and your reads.

Im done with this particular fight. I seem to have lost it one way or another.

[Skygazer]

newbie winrate has gone up w shorter games

mayb playing fast and loose is the solution

[Skygazer]

*shorter deadlines

[Titus]

VLA until Tuesday minimum. Still drained after quitting my job up north.

[Golden RASpberry]

You've not been really committed to an EAF read: your spoilered progression shows him starting at null-town, and then multiple statements that you're not really sure what to read on EAF, needing him to "start playing". You mention then in 1926 that he looks like he was merely intending to get into the party, and that it's not a great read.
After RAS joins the hydra, this turns into... a 100% confident read? Which would make slightly more sense to me if it was largely RAS-led, but RAS mentions that the read was Duck-led. The progression looks icky. What happened to your Duppin read?

Just to clarify: that middle null tier was explicitly not tiered or layered. I hadn't even started looking at EAF seriously, I'd just seen a few of his posts out of the corner of my eye and not really been sure how to take him. When I did start reading him, his activity concerned me. It wasn't a very good read in that all I'd done was flicked through some parts of the thread and gone "oh maybe this guy is evil". When I read his ISO a lot of his posting concerned me. I invited RAS to tag team this and he promptly agreed that EAF is very likely scum. It usually takes a lot for me to scumcase virtually anyone; if you need more oomph I'm happy to talk to you about it. Imo your perceived issues with my trajectory are down to a lot of semantics and misconceptions about my posting, I hope this clears it up a bit.

On the contrary I'd challenge you back: this guy was townread enough to get into the party d1. Yet nobody can give me a reason they think he's town. I appreciate that it randed but it had four votes. If you can tell me why you tangibly disagree with my read or why you think he's town I think we can crack this open a bit faster.

Wrt duppin: as I've said pretty conspicuously I had him as a maybe?wolf read after I caught him hard defending Skygazer for the lols. I'm gonna get rsi if I have to explain this every 5 pages but: he struck me as icky, but someone I needed to spend more time sorting. Just not someone I wanted to forget about. You'll notice that all 3 people I currently scumread were in that "people I haven't looked at" pile. It's kind of inevitable that when I have stronger scumreads, players are gonna move up.

For the record I didn't actually townread duppin until his v. v recent posting but I think there's some serious naivete and paranoia which rings fairly townie, so I've gone off my read there. To an extent I also see that you guys had some serious synergy d1 and I miiiiight trust you to have that right just a tiny bit

[Golden RASpberry]

Actually reading Uncle Bob's ISO doesn't make me go "ahh, the case is totally convincing": there are just 24 posts with a few questions. Am I wrong that RAS goes really specific in his cases?

Should we have to write a 50k word post to get scum lynched? Could you reread that ISO and see if you can find some town motivation in it (if you come back and say "he's asking questions to advance the game" I'll steal your bread btw). There's a lot of townies in this game. Throw me a tiered read list?

[Golden RASpberry]

Agree but also factor in that in EAF's case, he was playing in a looser, relaxed style + did scum-hunt and sort to a reasonable extent post D1 heal.

!!!
Qualify this for me please?

[Golden RASpberry]

Yes, there is a behavioural change in those posts but: I feel like it's not entirely scum-indicative, rather just a lack of real involvement - which is what I mean by activity.

Note he posted roughly as actively, just asking a lot of questions and fluffing a lot more. Is fluffing AI? No. But your defence isn't consistent with his ISO. :/ I get that you don't want to sheep but could you please have another critical read? The second half of his d1 is entirely pocketing...

[Golden RASpberry]

Auro, for the record I don't think Fusco was NK distancing from Kirari. If you lynch everyone who ever reads the n1 kill, you're gonna end up in a bad spot.

[Inbred Lannisters]

On the contrary I'd challenge you back: this guy was townread enough to get into the party d1. Yet nobody can give me a reason they think he's town. I appreciate that it randed but it had four votes. If you can tell me why you tangibly disagree with my read or why you think he's town I think we can crack this open a bit faster.

The "oomph" thing was exclusive to RAS' cases.
It's not that I don't want to be a sheep, but lynching within the party gives me reservation - and I want to be

absolutely sure

that this isn't scumplay from you.

Note he posted roughly as actively, just asking a lot of questions and fluffing a lot more. Is fluffing AI? No. But your defence isn't consistent with his ISO. :/ I get that you don't want to sheep but could you please have another critical read? The second half of his d1 is entirely pocketing...

The quoted "defence" was for D2 play. As far as D1 post-heal, are you referring to the posts between 686 and 710 (where he's discussing reads with my slot) when you say "pocketing"? I actually agree with this observation, as he didn't seem to bother much about others' reads. On the other hand the game did feel stagnant at the time.

Qualify this for me please?

He already stated he was relaxing his usual style this game.
His post-heal D1 play contains reads-lists, explanations for some of the reads - which was arguably more than other slots you townread, IMO.

Auro, for the record I don't think Fusco was NK distancing from Kirari. If you lynch everyone who ever reads the n1 kill, you're gonna end up in a bad spot.

I never said Fusco was NK distancing from Kirari, though? I don't remember saying I want to lynch Fusco O.o
I do find his slot pretty annoying because his posts are like 90% complaints about the previous day and how bad everyone else is yadda yadda, but nah, I'm not really scumreading the slot.

Should we have to write a 50k word post to get scum lynched? Could you reread that ISO and see if you can find some town motivation in it (if you come back and say "he's asking questions to advance the game" I'll steal your bread btw). There's a lot of townies in this game. Throw me a tiered read list?

Too little content to really judge motivation IMO, especially since he seemed to be extremely uninvolved. I get the "not *really* sorting" vibe from Penguin (who has a lot more posts) who you're townreading. Besides, my concern wasn't that it's not convincing enough for me to lynch there -- I actually happily would -- but that it didn't look like the cases RAS usually makes. I don't wanna give a reads list right now.

It sucks that Uncle Bob has flaked and the mod isn't replacing him, while Titus has gone VLA and EAF is nowhere to be seen. Meh. I'll sheep the EAF vote, later in the day.

-Joff

[Golden RASpberry]

The "oomph" thing was exclusive to RAS' cases.
It's not that I don't want to be a sheep, but lynching within the party gives me reservation - and I want to be absolutely sure that this isn't scumplay from you.

I talked a bit about this. If you have massive concerns with our slot, lynch EAF and add someone else to the party. We're not married to being in the party. We're married to lynching the scum in the party.

[Golden RASpberry]

He already stated he was relaxing his usual style this game.
His post-heal D1 play contains reads-lists, explanations for some of the reads - which was arguably more than other slots you townread, IMO.

Amount of content =/= town. Have a think about his reads in the context of his ISO. I spent some time ranting to RAS about how wolfy I found his read list.

[Golden RASpberry]

Yeah otherwise that's cool. I just wanted to weigh back in not to get paranoid/unduly annoyed at Fuscosco. Who do you want added to the party?

[Inbred Lannisters]

Yeah otherwise that's cool. I just wanted to weigh back in not to get paranoid/unduly annoyed at Fuscosco. Who do you want added to the party?

Nah I'm not concerned about him. I'm cool with you guys being added, too.

I think whoever else we add to the party could be optimized on basis of your scucmread confidence - you're 100% on EAF, how about Uncle Bob and Titus? What are your townread confidence rates?

-Joff

[RedPanda]

You should read tw iso. If you don't see him as obv town, you can vote nooone. Fmpov the only move scum will make tonight is kill tw.

Yes, most likely. Kirai NK showed exactly what scum’s plan is.

What do you make from the Fusc/Titus resistance?

Fusc clearly expected Kirai to be the NK and that pings me especially, because it’s not protown to be chill with likely obvtown dying.

Titus is less clear because she could be being moonlogicky.

~T

I think they're both town. I think the move is controversial enough that it would be a town vs town battle. I think scum are more likely to watch it happen from the sidelines and maybe one of them takes on the role of slowly guiding the votes to whichever side benefits them the most. And Titus's concern about adding someone giving cover to an existing deep wolf does have merit but I think she plays the game too safe and too much for the late game.

[RedPanda]

Fmpov the only move scum will make tonight is kill tw.

We dont have a scum flip. We dont even have a good consensus on who even is scum

Is it Yumeko or Sky, piss or PP? What about Uncle Bob?

It's yumeko and pp. gun to my head I would vote duppin as third scum.

I still don’t really understand the duppin scumreads?

True, his OMGUS tw vote was terrible but other than that, I’m not following?

Because scum can easily get tw killed by just resisting his being added to party. So why does scum!duppin go out of his way to draw that kind of negative attention by voting tw?

I’ve never played with duppin but anyone who has keeps saying how good he apparently is at scum, right? So, him voting tw is obviously not a clever move if scum, imo.

~T

Its not a strong scumread. It's only if the assumption is that scum sneaked in and I'm still operating under that.

My biggest issue with duppin is this

Well I guess we are trying to put town in the party.

I'll do this then:

HEAL: Inbred and fus

This lack of confidence in voting for himself pings me.

[RedPanda]

Fmpov the only move scum will make tonight is kill tw.

We dont have a scum flip. We dont even have a good consensus on who even is scum

Is it Yumeko or Sky, piss or PP? What about Uncle Bob?

It's yumeko and pp. gun to my head I would vote duppin as third scum.

So why add tw and give dupin cover

Cause I see tw getting nightkilled and that would give me no information. I'm not opposed to a vote noone at all. I completely agree with all your points and in fact it benefits me if tw is not added.

How does it benefit you if tw is not added?

~T

Because I think I'm next in line for the shot.

[RedPanda]

Our scumreads don't align at all goldenras. I will reread EAF based on what you said but I would recommend that you don't try to push a lynch within the party. Let's lynch outside and find who's more accurate with the flip and then even if we're both dead, people can reread and use our reads to help them.

[Golden RASpberry]

Throw me a tiered readlist or talk to me if you want to calibrate a bit. I think EAF is really poignantly scummy.

Wrt Titus/Bob--I don't have a % confidence but I'm comfortable looking at each other slot at some level of towniness. From IL as intensely obvtown to probably Penguin/anime person as my personal weakest townreads.

So via POE, >80% confidence. Any green flips in {EAL, Titus, Bob} will legitimately surprise me.