open 759: house party (compleded)

[RedPanda]

Hey everyone! I'm replacing bittersweet.

[RedPanda]

Looking at the mechanic, This is what I believe we should do- Isolate the strongest town reads. In my mafia experience, It's easier to find townies than scum because some townies behave like scum and some of them lurk and post fluff which doesn't help at all. Let me read up now.

[RedPanda]

Thoughts on the first page.

There are three people that have given me decent reads and I want to thank skygazer for it.

There are three interpretations you can get from it. He's either joking or its scum trying to waste such a powerful mechanic(although that's a stretch) or its a reaction test and skygazers next few posts show that he knows what the best move for town is and he was looking for people not calling him out for the first post. But I'm not going to give him a town read for this. This could be a scum gambit. Skygazer is null slightly leaning town and his read will change based on how he scumhunts in the future. He's already given me info on his play so if he starts fluffing and failing at scumhunting then my read will change.

People all around, you gotta (Come geddit) ♪ ♫
From the left to the right, make noise ♪ ♫

Anyway, TRT, I'm actually gonna disagree with you there - 410's entrance felt more like good-natured joking from town than anything else. What makes it scummy is the way he doubled back and called attention to it in 14.

I have a slight town read on schiavatto for this. This post is risky for scum to do cause it can backfire. Although I don't fully agree with his sentiments, that could be a way a townie would perceive Skygazer.

Skygazer seems to want attention. Talking about mech over reads early is scummy, and saying I'm scummy for not calling her scummy is scummy, but moving from not wanting to talk about mech to immediately talking about mech is. . . maybe townie?

Every choice we make is a gamble. But even so, we still gamble. For we enjoy the risk.

HEAL: Mary Saotome
HEAL: Kirari Momobami

I have a slight town read on kirari for this. Although I am guilty for the same reason, Scum would try to infiltrate by trying to act in the best interests for town. But I don't think that applies to skygazer. he's either scum pulling a cheeky gambit or townie who wants to lead people to lynch scum.

And speaking of using talking about mechanic to appear town. Uncle bob is the one in my gut who I feel is scum trying to act townie.

[RedPanda]

what are the odds that PP/Mary interaction was SvS

strong town read on renais for this.

you can only add people and they never get removed

WHATTTT? Although I still think adding strong town reads is better because most townies are bad being townies. I think we should only add 3 of our strongest town reads into the party. I'm not good at figuring out the optimal number so I'm going to defer to someone else but the logic is to lynch from the bigger pool unless there is a kill in the smaller pool.

The way I see it, we should manage the party and the lynch using separate rules - we lynch people who are likely to be mafia, but we don't necessarily send people who are likely to be town to the party. Mmm, I think any plan that involves trying to send townie people in is flawed.

Why??? Not liking this post at all, feels like you're writing a paper and trying to get your word count up

VOTE: yumeko

Completely agree with this.

I have a slight gut town read on michael scott for post58.

What about putting no one into the party for day 1 and we try to play day 1 normally and go about it after we get a flip? That way we have much more information to work with

I don't agree with this at all. We either lose one of our strong townies and can narrow the mafia down or we keep our strong townies safe. The other way is just asking to lose one of our strong townies.

[RedPanda]

Vote: Yumeko

Her plan is unhelpful.

nice bob!

@Mr. Mifflin - Yes, that's who I was referring to. I'm glad I'm not the only one who finds issue with that aspect of it - jokes are jokes, and the fact that people chose to treat the comment as a joke rather than a scumtell doesn't warrant as much suspicion as Sky seems to have invested in it.

The way I see it, we should manage the party and the lynch using separate rules - we lynch people who are likely to be mafia, but we don't necessarily send people who are likely to be town to the party. Mmm, I think any plan that involves trying to send townie people in is flawed.

Why??? Not liking this post at all, feels like you're writing a paper and trying to get your word count up

This is a weird response given posts 60-64 from you.

I work at a school and this week's been weird in terms of coverage/workload so I hope you'll forgive me for being scarce. Will follow up in-depth tonight.

I don't agree at at all. Skygazer is hunting for scum(I still have the same read though cause I don't want to make a decision on a strong player.) Yumeko is not.

her entrance is essentially exactly the same as her entrance in a past game where she was scum and I have other spicy reasons to think that she's scum

ok.... go on? Because otherwise this seems pretty opportunistic coming from you

HEAL: Mary Saotome, Yumeko Jabami, Kirari Momobami, PenguinPower, SkyGazer

VOTE: Hellknight

HEAL: Mary Saotome, Yumeko Jabami, Kirari Momobami, PenguinPower, SkyGazer

VOTE: Hellknight

Skygazer and Hellknight are switchable for me

Don't like Uncle Bob in post 80... why does my plan being unhelpful even mean I get voted? I don't like the reasoning, or lack of connections between voting for scum and voting because you disagree (it seems scummy)

If we know 5 town right now, we don't need the party mechanic to win anyway - that's a flawed argument. We don't need to win twice as hard, we need to not lose momentum twice as hard by both being wrong on the lynch and thereby being wrong on who is town in the party

Seriously though, if you can name 5 town right now, and everyone agrees, and they're all town.... we win without the party mechanic. Needless to say that's easier said than done

I'll explain it to you. The party mechanic can be used two ways. either like a mass doctor to protect town reads from scum even if a scum manages to sneak into the group or narrows down the scum. Adding too many members to the party is not in the best interests for town. And scum would want to ruin the mechanic by adding more members which would make the intel we get confusing. I'm not liking your posts at all even more now.

[RedPanda]

if you all think that mary is scum then fine, let's treat this like the 'dog house' strategy and put the three of us in the dog house and then just lynch one of the lurkers

this is the opposite of a setup where deepwolf hunting is a priority, just kill an unreadable slot and go on from there.

This guy is town.

[RedPanda]

I agree with Mary. lynching lurkers on the first day is a bad idea. It just helps mafia.

Also someone please tell me who RC is.

I have a slight town read on duppin for post 249

I'm just gonna skim through the next few pages.


I'm gonna once again echo not sending anyone to party is a terrible strategy and sending too many is also a terrible strategy. If you are town get your head out of your ass and start thinking. Stupid isn't a defense. All you're doing is clouding reads.

[RedPanda]

Ok caught up.

To start up I'm gonna tell you a little about myself.

I HATE META ARGUMENTS. STOP USING IT TO CONVINCE ME OF ANYTHING.

Also Playstyle is not equal to alignment.

Now that we got that out of the way.

Vote:Yumeko

HEAL: RedPanda,Skygazer,InbredLannisters

I'm also open to skygazer inbredlannisters and edgar allan foe.

My preference of inbredlannisters over edgar is just because I feel inbredlannister is a stronger player.

Skygazer is a must in the party I feel.

[RedPanda]

I agree with Mary. lynching lurkers on the first day is a bad idea. It just helps mafia.

Also someone please tell me who RC is.

I have a slight town read on duppin for post 249

I'm just gonna skim through the next few pages.


I'm gonna once again echo not sending anyone to party is a terrible strategy and sending too many is also a terrible strategy. If you are town get your head out of your ass and start thinking. Stupid isn't a defense. All you're doing is clouding reads.

RC is a TRT head.

Also, I have a strong beat on who you are already. I'll keep it to myself bro as that's what you'd want.

Your persuasion and strategy skills need work. I'm weakly TRing you though due to these failures.

Who am I? I'm like playing after 4 years and this is my original id.

[RedPanda]

oh wow...another "meta is trash" person.

beacause imo people who are susceptible to meta are weak players whose alignment can be found out with strong mafia play. People who are strong players will abuse meta.

[RedPanda]

Titus HK PP Yumeko

and maybe (

kirari and skygazer

)

two or three scum in the first group.

maybe 1 in the second.

Don't flame me for this. I just want to see if maybe I still got it after 4 years .

[RedPanda]

Strongest to weakest town reads.

Inbred Lannisters
Edgar Allan Foe
duppin
uncle bob

Fus raya and mary

Skygazer(I actually think his play is fully townsided.I'm just being paranoid of scum gambit.) Kirari.

Titus Penguin Power

Hell knight
Yumeko.

[RedPanda]

Ok I'm done cluttering up the thread.

[RedPanda]

We need to decide on who we is going to the party before lynching some1.

[RedPanda]

Noone's doing it at random though

[RedPanda]

Noone's doing it at random though

7-7 random is the only way to eliminate scum influence in pool selection. It creates two unavoidable pools. We can lynch those who argue change. Pretty motherfucking braindead. I get I lost but damn. Insistence on town knowing better than random is why we lose so much. Data is always best. Charisma ok when there's no data.

Hell I play mafia to get better at charisma and reading illogical people.

I'm sorry I'm playing mafia here not some random shit.

The thing that loses town the most games is that mafia will kill off the strongest players early and this mechanic helps us avoid that. I'm not even asking for us isolate strong town reads. I'm asking us to isolate our strongest players.

[RedPanda]

And I think 3 is a good number so unless someone's run the numbers to convince me otherwise we shouldn't add anymore.

[RedPanda]

Random party kinda throws the whole idea out the window and ruins the chance to see who wanted who in the party because we all did 'random' It's kinda the same thing with doing 'no one' but worse.

In te short term yes but long term every motherfucking kill is info

Listen I'm not denying this. I think your strategy is good but only if all the players in the game are really good. But that like never happens. Mafia mostly win because they kill off all the strong town players early. With your strat there will most probably be a 2 1 split and mafia will mostly kill in the group that only has one of them so we need to shoot in 1/6 with 2 scum who will be working on leading us away from their partner until the numbers in the 1/6 group are safe enough for them. Here later the game goes the easier it is for scum to win and then there is the scenario where mafia actually kills in the 2/6 group to throw us off.

[RedPanda]

Skygazer is a must in the party I feel.

I feel you're town; but I'm not able to understand this part. Can you elaborate on why Sky's town? I don't feel she's done much towny stuff.
Also talk to me about Yumeko: I admit I was actually excited to play with them (I followed one of their previous games and loved the posting style) but they seem... lackluster this game. I don't know if that's a reason to scumread them though - can you tell me why they're your strongest scumread?

I have a null leaning town read on him. I just think he is a strong player with a play style that causes people to not be able to accurately judge alignment. So isolating him in a 3 man group with 2 obv and strong townies will help our town in the future when he is forced to reveal himself if he's scum.

As for Yumeko, Well in my games I always town hunt because I believe even though most townies also try to be careful about what they post sometimes they post something genuine and my gut is what decides that. And I count the number of genuine posts they make in the off chance that a scum manages to get one that pings me. None of Yumekos posts have given me a genuine vibe. And she's a vote over others because I feel her strategy to send 5 of the strongest town reads is like the worst of them all and she even acknowledges the same in that post that it's easier said than done.

[RedPanda]

How are you people happy with Hell Knight's posts? This is a

bad

post reflective of zero thought towards what's going on in the game. I'll go so far as to say that scum realizes that having multiple votes for a heal makes it much likelier to get picked (squared probabilities); healing "nobody" when almost all the players agree it's a crap strategy without any elaboration at all is

very

scummy. Also add the lack of engagement (hasn't responded to my questions), lack of detailing reads, the inconsistency wrt the read on my slot ("scumlean for early shitposts, you've been much townier since then, but still scumlean"), and (idk for angleshooty-ness) activity elsewhere.

VOTE: Hell Knight

I'm not at all but hellknight wagon is easy and he will def be lynched in the future. My vote will move to hellknight only if yumeko posts something to change my mind or this wagon goes nowhere.

[RedPanda]

Townies try to be careful about what they post...?

I mean....wut?

I mean it doesn't sound right but its definitely true.

[RedPanda]

Err mod that isn't a vote for hellknight. I just failed at copying the quotes.

unvote vote yumeko

[RedPanda]

You're not going to get 6 people to coalition you and dup in the next 20 hours and continuing to try to send townreads into the house party is playing against wincon because it's really looking like we won't get a consensus at all. If the send is randomized it should be exclusively composed of scumreads or lynchbait poes.

Would you support healing {us, Duppin}?

- Cersei Lannister (Volxen)

I support it.

[RedPanda]

HEAL: duppin lannisters

[RedPanda]

nothing happened to it. I'm okay with sending him too.

[RedPanda]

I don't care about scum killing townies. I care about scum killing strong townies.

[RedPanda]

and strong as in good at mafia if i haven't made it clear from before.

[RedPanda]

you need to reread my read on skygazer.

And deadline is today right for the mechanic. My idea got no backers.

[RedPanda]

and Kirari are you not curious about my opinion about you? I maybe mistaken about this but its the same thing you feel about me.

[RedPanda]

that could be a possibility but his recent posts have just solidified my earlier gut feeling. But if you really feel otherwise, I will listen to you.

[RedPanda]

I'm assuming you're going to say you're paranoid about me because Auro just said he's paranoid about me and right now you're parroting things Auro has said. Since I already know what you're going to say there's no need to ask you about it.

nope. its a different thing sort of similar to skygazer. protown actions which gives me paranoia.

[RedPanda]

Also I have no idea about who you people are. I said I'm playing after 4 years but I'm actually playing after 6.

[RedPanda]

I'm willing to accept you're just going with the flow right now but I'd still like to hear how your read on Sky has changed or hasn't changed since that is probably the most interesting thing about your positions so far. You were insisting she had to be in the send earlier but now you're saying her "protown actions" give you paranoia. What does that actually mean for your read of Skygazer?

that if you are lynching scum accurately my read gets better and if you aren't it gets worse. That's how I deal with play styles like that.

[RedPanda]

kirari you here?

[RedPanda]

Was IBL vote a reaction test or srs?

[RedPanda]

I read what you said later but I still want to know if it was something slightly srs

[RedPanda]

like did you test IBL too?

[RedPanda]

I will answer that after you answer one last question please.

Has IBl done something in this game to concern you? ( I know what you're thinking )

[RedPanda]

ok nvm.

I thought you saw something concerning which was why you wanted to test him a little bit.

IBL given that you didn't know that it would be chosen randomly and how it was being chosen , Can you give me your reasoning to want to add two more to the party?

[RedPanda]

You still kinda didn't answer my question. Are you concerned about IBL? What did you think of Tyrion's reaction to my push?

I promise to answer both questions.

[RedPanda]

what are you srs yumeko? do you think i am dumb or something for thinking you were lynched?

[RedPanda]

and I was asked to explain my read. are you even reading?

[RedPanda]

because u weren't.

[RedPanda]

Why aren't you lynched? Does that answer your question omg.

[RedPanda]

From what i remember I think there were fake hammers and then IBL overreacted and then I read upon the mechanic and then there were unvotes.

[RedPanda]

Hey I can count votes too you know.

[RedPanda]

So we went from "I'm not an idiot, of course I knew it wasn't a hammer" and the reason is because, after it looked like there were 8 votes on me, you went back and looked over the lynch mechanics again, for seemingly no reason, and I was supposed to intuit this somehow. And/or you counted votes (from what point? The start of the game? The last votecount?) and the fake hammers somehow confused you

No. Can you just read exactly what I'm typing.

The fake hammers were before u were at 8. And That was when I counted the votes and then IBL overreacted and that was when i learned abt the mechanic.

and Also your entire premise that I was trying to justify my vote on you after is shot already.Why did you ignore that?

[RedPanda]

VOTE: yumeko

ahaha quickhammered get rekt

VOTE: Yumeko

it was after this.

[RedPanda]

I'm not ignoring anything, we're discussing it right now, no? So the reason you thought I wasn't hammered is because you counted the votes after the votecount in post 450?

And you are ignoring it.

[RedPanda]

Let me ask you a question first.

are you defending yourself or are you attacking me?

[RedPanda]

But what happened to the I was trying to justify my vote premise? have you moved on to why I'm voting for you now?

[RedPanda]

Panda, you sure seem to deflect questions with other questions a lot. Does whether Yumeko is defending herself or attacking you change your answers to her questions?

It doesn't change my answers. I'm trying to read her slot. I want to know if she thinks I'm scum or trying to figure out my reasoning for my vote.

[RedPanda]

Let her answer that.

[RedPanda]

It doesn't change my answers.

I guess I just feel like you're stalling a lot in this exchange, and it also felt like you were stalling with me. I don't know that makes you scum, unless you're maybe a secret alt of the worst. But I think you said you were a main so I think you're town, I think you're just needlessly evasive.

Spoiler:

I also think you're right about fusco and that Joffrey fucked the town with that 4-man but that will probably end up being his problem.

Yumeko is where most of us are voting for. Isn't it time to get engage and get reads? Why do I need to defend against her?

[RedPanda]

Yumeko is where most of us are voting for. Isn't it time to get engage and get reads? Why do I need to defend against her?

That's exactly why I'm wondering why you feel so defensive

huh? Do I come across as defensive? fmpov I'm only engaging her.

[RedPanda]

Yumeko I can admit to you that I misread what you posted.

As for Yumeko, Well in my games I always town hunt because I believe even though most townies also try to be careful about what they post sometimes they post something genuine and my gut is what decides that. And I count the number of genuine posts they make in the off chance that a scum manages to get one that pings me. None of Yumekos posts have given me a genuine vibe. And she's a vote over others because I feel her strategy to send 5 of the strongest town reads is like the worst of them all and she even acknowledges the same in that post that it's easier said than done.

Apart from that is there any fault in the way I scumhunt? Who else do you think I should vote for? And please mention someone other than hellknight.

[RedPanda]

"before I answer that let me ask you a different question" is defensive/evasive and classic stalling

I say that and I think you're town, but you do come off as pretty evasive today

I just want IBL to answer two things before I explain my reasoning for before.

[RedPanda]

Scumhunting is not exactly the reason I give people town reads for.

[RedPanda]

Whats your read on penguinpower and titus with regard to the just right before the heal mechanic locked in?

[RedPanda]

Whats your read on penguinpower and titus with regard to the just right before the heal mechanic locked in?

Whats your read on their actions right before the heal mechanic locked in?

[RedPanda]

Whats your read on penguinpower and titus with regard to the just right before the heal mechanic locked in?

Whats your read on their actions right before the heal mechanic locked in?

This is directed to you Yumeko btw.

[RedPanda]

ok I was confused about this.

{duppin, Edgar Allan Foe, Fuscosco, Inbred Lannisters} has 4*4 = 16 points; dice roll 1-16
{Hell Knight, PenguinPower, Raya36, Skygazer} has 3*3 = 9 points; dice roll 17-25
{duppin, Inbred Lannisters} has 2*2 = 4 points; dice roll 26-29
{Hell Knight, Mary Saotome, PenguinPower, Skygazer, Titus, Uncle Bob, Yumeko Jabami} has 1 point; dice roll 30
{Uncle Bob} has 1 point; dice roll 31
{Skygazer} has 1 point; dice roll 32
∅ has 1 point; dice roll 33

Original Roll String: 1d33 (STATIC)

1 33-Sided Dice: (10) = 10

Can someone translate this for me?

[RedPanda]

You still kinda didn't answer my question. Are you concerned about IBL? What did you think of Tyrion's reaction to my push?

When the switch happened, something pinged at me, that maybe IBL is not worried about being nightkilled and then my brain automatically started scripting the whole thing. but then I felt him calling you out real and especially this line

Please stop trying to spam post, scum, it's not a good look for you.

Spoiler:

I hope I don’t get banned for posting your rl picture.


But seriously, if you’re actually town here, please stop being an idiot.

But really glad Joffrey objected to you being in party now, because if you’re open wolfing here, it’s beyond freaking obvious what you’re doing

.

felt genuine.

And I assumed you felt the same ping of discomfort when you were doing your test and I wanted to take the opportunity to read your slot cause in my mind if you were actually thinking the same and doing something to test him out, I would have 100% town read you immediately.

[RedPanda]

Joffrey whats your read on penguin?

[RedPanda]

Joffrey whats your read on penguin?

Think I mentioned this before. I'm leaning scum, but I dunno. Nancy however thinks he's obvscum.

-Joff

I want you to ignore your general read and look at the party votes and his last few posts.

[RedPanda]

From the party votes, I'd say it's likelier that Hell Knight is scum over PenguinPower.

Noting that scum wouldn't want to send two of themselves to a party of four, but exactly one - suggests that two scum won't both vote on a heal that contains both of them. I'm also making the weak assumption that scum would not want to send two town to the party either; so Fus willing to send me and Duppin *and* Duppin willing to send me and Fus *and* is slightly town indicative.

This makes sense but If this party is all town, there is the possibility that scum didn't have a better group.

I have more to say about this. But I'd like to hear Yumekos thoughts on the party votes and penguinpower first.

[RedPanda]

This makes sense but If this party is all town, there is the possibility that scum didn't have a better group.

If this party is all town scum should've conceded by now tho.

There's only one way they can win, but that's impossible to pull off and if they ever try it, it'll be a transparent scumclaim.

If there's no conceding, we assume exactly one scum in the party and work from there.

-Joff

right nvm. I'm being stupid.

[RedPanda]

Today is a busy day for me.

I'm unhappy that some of you especially those who have a severe lack of content to get reads out of are not even bothering to gather information out of the party votes. I for one would like explanations for why some of you instead of trying to convince people to follow your strategy or agreeing on a strategy just left it to chance.

[RedPanda]

I don't want to be specific.

[RedPanda]

I for one would like explanations for why some of you instead of trying to convince people to follow your strategy or agreeing on a strategy just left it to chance.

gIVING PROVERN PERCY HIS CHANCE TO NOT BE SCUM



[SIZE=5OO]YOU PING ME BRO[/SIZE]

The ping was good? I'm rethinking your slot in the four now. Maybe kirari was right abt duppin.

[RedPanda]

Weird to ask for explanations you don't actually care about getting.

Are you not getting it? There are people who haven't posted enough content to get reads out of. I'm not being specific because I want to know who is self aware enough to know that. Also I want to know if their reasoning is sound for their votes.

[RedPanda]

Weird to ask for explanations you don't actually care about getting.

Are you not getting it? There are people who haven't posted enough content to get reads out of. I'm not being specific because I want to know who is self aware enough to know that. Also I want to know if their reasoning is sound for their votes.

Seems overly ambiguous. But, you do you.

Do you think you fall in the category?

[RedPanda]

You do Penguin. So I'd like your answer. I want to have this back and forth but unfortunately I'll get punished if I play mafia today.

[RedPanda]

Kirari, You are not good for my life.

[RedPanda]

IBL
Edgar Allan Foe
Duppin Fuscosco

Now for those not in the party.

Kirari
Uncle Bob
Skygazer (
Titus
Raya
Mary
Hellknight
PenguinPower
Yumeko

The reason I'm dropping duppin instead of Edgar is because I'm confident about edgar town. While duppin got most of my town read cause of when he replaced in. Fusco's post I mentioned earlier really did give me some pause and like kirari mentioned this is going to be IBL's problem and he's going to have more information than me to work it out.

I've finally committed to a read on Kirari.
Uncle Bobs early posts gave me a town read it and his vote for the party did not bother me at all.
I have a slight town read on skygazer because of his vote for the party.She should be a concern If she's not lynching scum.
Before I replaced in, I got nothing genuine from reading titus but after I did she felt town. I like that she was not voting in party phase.

Raya is slightly better than Mary because of schiavetto's post(please check my 3rd post) but still these slots have nothing in them to base reads on.
I like that Hellknight went after Penguinpower after post partyphase.
If this is penguinpower playstyle then its like the opposite of kirari and skygazer but it has one thing in common. You can't read him cause you get nothing from all of his posts.
Post party phase I got nothing from Yumeko. I don't like that she isn't going after penguinpower. Here, If she was serious about this list, what is she doing about it? I see nothing apart from going after hellknight who nearly everyone wants to lynch.

Hell Knight, PenguinPower, Raya36, Skygazer (3): Yumeko Jabami, PenguinPower, Hell Knight

Based on this I don't think Penguinpower and hell knight are a team anymore. Scum would have really fucked themselves over if they were and this party got locked in and I don't think anybody would have questioned a vote shift.

[RedPanda]

Kirari, You are not good for my life.

what did this mean anyway?

You made me trust and you are going to scar me if you flip scum.

[RedPanda]

Hoppy Cake

Thanks. It was yesterday for me.

[RedPanda]

In post 871, RedPanda wrote:
Whats your read on penguinpower and titus with regard to the just right before the heal mechanic locked in?



Whats your read on their actions right before the heal mechanic locked in?

You mean letting the party be random? There's nothing wrong with that at all, they're fine.

What about PP? Have you ever played with PP before?

[RedPanda]

Fusco panda and sky where are you all on hk?

I hate when people replace out when they're under heat and I especially hate this self vote and replace out talk because it sounds townie and I personally would never pull off gambits like that as scum to help a replacement. But I don't know if hellknight is principled like that. My head tells me to go for the penguinpower flip as the best option to read hellknight.

[RedPanda]

I apologise.

IBL
Edgar Allan Foe
Duppin Fuscosco

The reason I'm dropping duppin instead of Edgar is because I'm confident about edgar town. While duppin got most of my town read cause of when he replaced in. Fusco's post I mentioned earlier really did give me some pause and like kirari mentioned this is going to be IBL's problem and he's going to have more information than me to work it out.

Can you elaborate on this? You put IBL over Edgar, does that simply mean he is a stronger town read?
And why did your read on me change? You seem to be calling Fus out for a specific thing yet you put me next to him so I assume you find me suspicious as well but you haven't really explained it, so what exactly is your current read on me?

Yes IBL is my strongest town read in the party.
I townread both prior slots of IBL and Edgar and I only townread your slot. I'm just not sure about your slot anymore because when you voted for fusc and IBL for the town party something did ping me and I ignored it and then when fusco phrased that post about me, I felt the way he phrased it was very townie which made me rethink as to whether I'm just townreading you based on your starting posts. This is just me operating on limited information right now, I'm definitely not going to commit to a hard read on the party slots until I have more info or It's going to be someone else's problem.

[RedPanda]

In post 871, RedPanda wrote:
Whats your read on penguinpower and titus with regard to the just right before the heal mechanic locked in?



Whats your read on their actions right before the heal mechanic locked in?

You mean letting the party be random? There's nothing wrong with that at all, they're fine.

What about PP? Have you ever played with PP before?

Yumeko? Can you please answer this?

[RedPanda]

Vote Hellknight

IBL don't scumread fusco because of hellknight. I understand him.

[RedPanda]

HEAL: nobody

Vote penguinpower.

[RedPanda]

y?

[RedPanda]

objectively would you read your iso and come to the same conclusion?

[RedPanda]

"HK!wagon is gross/obvtown - panda's cool though."

waht does this mean? are you saying i declared hk town?

[RedPanda]

oh hi

p-edit

from which perspective?

from anyone who does not have access to your role pm.

[RedPanda]

oh hi

p-edit

from which perspective?

from anyone who does not have access to your role pm.

Great...what conclusion?

I'm asking you if you can objectively infer that you're town based on your iso?

[RedPanda]

But I know my meta pretty well.

If you know it, What stops you from using it on your scum games?


Penguinpower, You have got to do better than hiding behind meta. If you really are town, You aren't helping out. Kirari SR you. I'm Sring you and both of us have different playstyles.

[RedPanda]

Tw is town skygazer is town. Fusco is also town. Duppin was obvtown for me in his first few posts but apart frm that he's been dropping.
Cheeky seems town but my read is not as strong as tw or sky.
Titus and bob are slight town reads.

So can we just lynch Yumeko or Penguin?

[RedPanda]

HEAL: theworst

[RedPanda]

Also if there was any doubt to IBL being town, trying to make an addition to party should dispel that

[RedPanda]

Also I see that the meta players have overpopulated this site. I am

[RedPanda]

Also I see that the meta players have overpopulated this site. I am

Come off it m8y.

Meta is a tool
So is VCA


Tools are useful, and they have their places in a game.

only a tool to judge playstyle but people use it to judge alignment most of the time which only works against bad players imo.

[RedPanda]

im keeping my tw heal and gonna stop fighting this and let other ppl decide

Why is the purpose of adding?

#sideeye

If I had a slight doubt to my tw read, I would be against adding too. Tw is not going to get lynched and scum will 100% nk because of that.

[RedPanda]

You should read tw iso. If you don't see him as obv town, you can vote nooone. Fmpov the only move scum will make tonight is kill tw.

[RedPanda]

IbL You shouldn't add anymore unless I'm here to quality control it or if there's only 1 scum left in the game.

[RedPanda]

Fmpov the only move scum will make tonight is kill tw.

We dont have a scum flip. We dont even have a good consensus on who even is scum

Is it Yumeko or Sky, piss or PP? What about Uncle Bob?

It's yumeko and pp. gun to my head I would vote duppin as third scum.

[RedPanda]

Fmpov the only move scum will make tonight is kill tw.

We dont have a scum flip. We dont even have a good consensus on who even is scum

Is it Yumeko or Sky, piss or PP? What about Uncle Bob?

It's yumeko and pp. gun to my head I would vote duppin as third scum.

So why add tw and give dupin cover

Cause I see tw getting nightkilled and that would give me no information. I'm not opposed to a vote noone at all. I completely agree with all your points and in fact it benefits me if tw is not added.

[RedPanda]

RP why are you SRing duppin again

Duppin early and duppin later are not the same. I got a scum ping when duppin voted fusco and ibl into party instead of himself and IBL. But I ignored it but his posts later did not give me the same early game vibes. I'm not completely confident on this but I think people who are obvtowning him should reassess later in the game.

[RedPanda]

You should read tw iso. If you don't see him as obv town, you can vote nooone. Fmpov the only move scum will make tonight is kill tw.

Yes, most likely. Kirai NK showed exactly what scum’s plan is.

What do you make from the Fusc/Titus resistance?

Fusc clearly expected Kirai to be the NK and that pings me especially, because it’s not protown to be chill with likely obvtown dying.

Titus is less clear because she could be being moonlogicky.

~T

I think they're both town. I think the move is controversial enough that it would be a town vs town battle. I think scum are more likely to watch it happen from the sidelines and maybe one of them takes on the role of slowly guiding the votes to whichever side benefits them the most. And Titus's concern about adding someone giving cover to an existing deep wolf does have merit but I think she plays the game too safe and too much for the late game.

[RedPanda]

Fmpov the only move scum will make tonight is kill tw.

We dont have a scum flip. We dont even have a good consensus on who even is scum

Is it Yumeko or Sky, piss or PP? What about Uncle Bob?

It's yumeko and pp. gun to my head I would vote duppin as third scum.

I still don’t really understand the duppin scumreads?

True, his OMGUS tw vote was terrible but other than that, I’m not following?

Because scum can easily get tw killed by just resisting his being added to party. So why does scum!duppin go out of his way to draw that kind of negative attention by voting tw?

I’ve never played with duppin but anyone who has keeps saying how good he apparently is at scum, right? So, him voting tw is obviously not a clever move if scum, imo.

~T

Its not a strong scumread. It's only if the assumption is that scum sneaked in and I'm still operating under that.

My biggest issue with duppin is this

Well I guess we are trying to put town in the party.

I'll do this then:

HEAL: Inbred and fus

This lack of confidence in voting for himself pings me.

[RedPanda]

Fmpov the only move scum will make tonight is kill tw.

We dont have a scum flip. We dont even have a good consensus on who even is scum

Is it Yumeko or Sky, piss or PP? What about Uncle Bob?

It's yumeko and pp. gun to my head I would vote duppin as third scum.

So why add tw and give dupin cover

Cause I see tw getting nightkilled and that would give me no information. I'm not opposed to a vote noone at all. I completely agree with all your points and in fact it benefits me if tw is not added.

How does it benefit you if tw is not added?

~T

Because I think I'm next in line for the shot.

[RedPanda]

Our scumreads don't align at all goldenras. I will reread EAF based on what you said but I would recommend that you don't try to push a lynch within the party. Let's lynch outside and find who's more accurate with the flip and then even if we're both dead, people can reread and use our reads to help them.

[RedPanda]

Spoiler: Day1

IBL
Edgar Allan Foe
Duppin Fuscosco

Now for those not in the party.

Kirari
Uncle Bob
Skygazer (
Titus
Raya
Mary
Hellknight
PenguinPower
Yumeko

The reason I'm dropping duppin instead of Edgar is because I'm confident about edgar town. While duppin got most of my town read cause of when he replaced in. Fusco's post I mentioned earlier really did give me some pause and like kirari mentioned this is going to be IBL's problem and he's going to have more information than me to work it out.

I've finally committed to a read on Kirari.
Uncle Bobs early posts gave me a town read it and his vote for the party did not bother me at all.
I have a slight town read on skygazer because of his vote for the party.She should be a concern If she's not lynching scum.
Before I replaced in, I got nothing genuine from reading titus but after I did she felt town. I like that she was not voting in party phase.

Raya is slightly better than Mary because of schiavetto's post(please check my 3rd post) but still these slots have nothing in them to base reads on.
I like that Hellknight went after Penguinpower after post partyphase.
If this is penguinpower playstyle then its like the opposite of kirari and skygazer but it has one thing in common. You can't read him cause you get nothing from all of his posts.
Post party phase I got nothing from Yumeko. I don't like that she isn't going after penguinpower. Here, If she was serious about this list, what is she doing about it? I see nothing apart from going after hellknight who nearly everyone wants to lynch.

Hell Knight, PenguinPower, Raya36, Skygazer (3): Yumeko Jabami, PenguinPower, Hell Knight

Based on this I don't think Penguinpower and hell knight are a team anymore. Scum would have really fucked themselves over if they were and this party got locked in and I don't think anybody would have questioned a vote shift.

Spoiler: day2

Tw is town skygazer is town. Fusco is also town. Duppin was obvtown for me in his first few posts but apart frm that he's been dropping.
Cheeky seems town but my read is not as strong as tw or sky.
Titus and bob are slight town reads.

So can we just lynch Yumeko or Penguin?

[RedPanda]

In party
IBL
EAF
FUS
Duppin

TW
Skygazer
Cheeky
Titus
Bob
Yumeko
Penguin

My yumeko read is only above penguin because kirari townread her. Maybe she saw something I missed.

[RedPanda]

For the record this is where we're at. You've spoken about being a townhunting-heavy player which is convenient, because I am too. I think your townreads are probably mostly correct i.e. {IBL, Fus, us, skyg, cheeky}.
I've just been having a quick look through your ISO and from what I can tell:
1) The Yumeko read is due to a change in posting levels from a previous game / because she feels lacklustre. She's not high in my townpile either, but I actually don't mind her posting.
2) From what I can tell you're not gleaning a lot from PenguinPower's posts; are you looking for a toneread there? It's pretty hard to get a confident toneread on Penguin as either alignment unless he posts pretty frantically.

I think that you've more or less got the clear townies worked out, but the pile which contains 2-3 scum of {Titus, Bob, Yumeko, Penguin} is probably closer to containing 4 nullreads/"not townreads" rather than two nulls and two scum. Do you think that's fair?

I find townhunting to be a better strategy because townies also exhibit scummy behaviour. They lie, selfdestruct, play too careful, lurk etc..
I am Poeing scum from my reads too and even if someone pings something in me that I deem to be scummy, I just slightly take a note of it. Penguinpower is a null read and so is yumeko. I can tell this is PP's playstyle but this playstyle is so dangerous and antitown because scum will never nk him and town can never read him. I would say unclebob is closer to the null pile than titus and If you'd like, I will spoiler the posts of unclebob and titus which gave me something more than the other two later.

wrt EAF, I think that's the read I want to talk to you about the most. Going by your 1101, you townread him but it appears to already be an established read. I've had a quick look through your ISO and I won't quote every time you've said Edgar or EAF or anything, but I'm not really sure how you came to the read.

Would you mind giving a quick summary (maybe like a couple of sentences or half a paragraph or something) on why you think his approach to the game is town indicative? For reference, our synopsis on why he's scum:

Yes, it was an established read. I townread TRT and EAF and two different players on the same slot giving me townreads is something I take seriously. I will reread EAF today based on what you said and I will spoiler the posts that both these slots made that gave me a townread.

[RedPanda]

Also lynching in the pool with two scum is better than lynching in the pool with 1 because it's not even guaranteed that the pool has one scum. Let there be a kill in the party before we even attempt to lynch.

[RedPanda]

Alright, I have to tell you though that I'm afraid of titus making fun of me post game for calling her a safe player.

[RedPanda]

I've reread EAF and TRT and I'm convinced the slot is town. I even disagree with the point that he isn't trying to sort anyone out.

Ah. I was looking for something more substantial but you're forgiven given vacation.

I mean - it's not just the vacation. I get a lot of my reads based on how slots treat me. RedPanda doesn't know me so I don't really see a problem with how he's treating me. Fusco has seen how I play, so I don't really get his read on me.

That said, I was sus of Kirari for similar reasons so it's not 100% accurate. But, it helps me.

Don't give me a pass because of vacation-mode.

And what do you make of MY treatment of you?

This is him trying to read PP slot. Even ignoring the EAF slot, TRT is def town.

[RedPanda]

Spoiler: TRTpoststhatpingedtown

what are the odds that PP/Mary interaction was SvS

What about putting no one into the party for day 1 and we try to play day 1 normally and go about it after we get a flip? That way we have much more information to work with

by information you mean 'well RC hydra died n1'

Good one!

is that... not why you're advocating for it? so that you don't have to read me?

idrc if we lose because town scumread me but i'll be damned if i lose cuz scum got away with scumreading me.

if you all think that mary is scum then fine, let's treat this like the 'dog house' strategy and put the three of us in the dog house and then just lynch one of the lurkers

this is the opposite of a setup where deepwolf hunting is a priority, just kill an unreadable slot and go on from there.

i think calling this game so far mafia is insulting to the game of mafia

I will do EAF next

[RedPanda]

omg we are so on opposite sides of this and I still don't totally understand your read sorry if I get really confusing really quick. what do you make of his most recent post?

I think TRT was extremely scummy btw

One could argue that he's trying to emulate hellknight but one could also argue that that's too obvious. I prefer just ignoring that post.

[RedPanda]

Spoiler: EAFpoststhatreadtown

Yeah, Titus you're a setup breaker. Both calling to go random AND shutting down discussions on the alternates?

Scum, or Dunce Cap?

I think scum.

VOTE: Titus

Much engage, such wow, Titus.

Where's the stone cold lawyer who tells the cop off for pulling her over for a light out? You'd normally salivate being directly challenged on effectively being accused of dragging your heels.

Did she die with the color green?

I prefer the 4-block.

HEAL: Inbred Lannisters, duppin, Fuscosco, Edgar Allen Foe

I have slightly nudges about this, but it's better than the other options on the table.

People are welcome to sheep this one or the two-block. Just please don't do nothing, lest RNJESUS fuck us over for the lulz?

We have three and a half hours. Since we won't hit a supermajority I'm gonna pick my favorite and if I gotta swap last second? I'll be around.

My town tiers from most to least are something like this right now? Ish? My feelings fluctuate like Trump's net worth.

{Inbred Lannisters, duppin}
~GAP~
{Fus, Penguin, RedPanda}
~GAP~
{Titus, Kirari}
~LINE OF LYNCHABILITY TODAY~

Strongly doubt my top line is wrong. Possibility of me being tricked well by the middle line. Not super solid on the third line.

I feel there's good odds of hitting scum among the lurkmass that's s(h)itting around. I would like to lynch from that pool unless I see a compelling argument otherwise.

why

Well; you've got about 46 minutes to come up with something better; and get multiple players on board with you. Or you can intentionally piss away the only thing separating us from a 33% EV.


Even if you don't like that grouping, sheeping one of the ones that is out there and not "no one" or "random" is ideal at this point.

HEAL: PenguinPower, Skygazer, Raya36, Hell Knight

If I have to wear a bowtie, I'm rocking the cane, monocle, and tophat as well.



My first party...I'm so excited.

Penguin?

Unless you literally think this is the best use of the party, in which case, 'splain yoself

Okay work picking up so this is the cliffnotes but:

A: The effort made to pick up game pacing. This is very protown because at that point apathy was likely to remain allowable.
B: The reaction (notable lack thereof) to Penguin delcaring him obvtown and instead working forward
C: Some of the shit you mentioned, I guess.

Well that was interesting.

My set of emotions went from

"Wow that was lynch this sucks"
to
"Maybe it's not the worst target I guess?"
to
"Oh, okay, somebody rewound time"
and now to
"jeez that REALLY could have been explained to us better to clear up all the uncertainty"

VOTE: Hell Knight
This is where i found myself wishing the final wagon had been; Baaaaaaahbaaaaaah

P.S. bastard game, fus is a doublevoter apparently.

I actually think this is great, we have the deepwolf isolated to 4 slots, so we can start lynching in them while feeding more into the house pets to create an actual townblock.

I'm not sure if this is scum, really bad town, or if my illness made me delusional.

Yes

Fusco is probably scum but I doubt I can garner support on that nor have the desire to really try and push it.

I'm not seeing it, but i'd be remiss to not listen. Pretend this is a super dazzling encouragement post.

this is now reddit's Change my View

Fusco is probably scum but I doubt I can garner support on that nor have the desire to really try and push it.

I'm not seeing it, but i'd be remiss to not listen. Pretend this is a super dazzling encouragement post.

this is now reddit's Change my View

Did I miss you breaking this down? It's a day two post!

Ah. I was looking for something more substantial but you're forgiven given vacation.

I mean - it's not just the vacation. I get a lot of my reads based on how slots treat me. RedPanda doesn't know me so I don't really see a problem with how he's treating me. Fusco has seen how I play, so I don't really get his read on me.

That said, I was sus of Kirari for similar reasons so it's not 100% accurate. But, it helps me.

Don't give me a pass because of vacation-mode.

And what do you make of MY treatment of you?

[RedPanda]

EAF is clearly trying to read PP day 2 imo.

[RedPanda]

Gras. I did not even reread the slots so that I could see why i town read them at first. I looked at your reasons for calling the slot scum. the discussion about mechanics was something that four or five of us were involved in and It's not alignment indicative. EAF also made a tierlist of reads and his logic about why he thought I was town was also sound. Day2 I could see that he was trying to read PP. As for the switch between day 1 and day 2, I see no issue with it. I myself did not post the first 24 hrs after day 2 began and also slowed my posts down the next 24hrs on purpose so I doubt it's an alignment tell.

[RedPanda]

Let's wait one more day, then maybe I can convince you that he's town.

[RedPanda]

Ah but I was thinking about your last post and while your logic is sound, I've been burned by town too much to completely ignore my town read. I was going to stop defending him to avoid tainting my own slot with wifom but then I thought of something but I need at least a day before reveal.

[RedPanda]

I did not want to write this before hearing from yumeko and duppin but since EAF is at L-1, I have no choice.

This is being rushed too much and you guys are missing something obvious.

EAF flipping scum is autowin for town so EAF being suicidal fucks over his partners too. Scum would do everything to protect the scumslot in the party and the only person defending EAF is me.

[RedPanda]

ugh okay. I hope I'm wrong about EAF.

Just give me 10 minutes to make a list.

[RedPanda]

If EAF flips scum, I think you guys know the obv order.

If EAF flips town, Don't lynch Vengaboys. They are town.

[RedPanda]

Who is lynching vengaboys on a town flip?

I feel like skygazer is the townie that scum can mislynch.

[RedPanda]

Cause Vengaboys attempted to push it to penguinpower.

[RedPanda]

Yeah that's why I said if EAF flips town, the are town as well.

[RedPanda]

I don't really think my slot is in danger of being lynched considering the combined ability of GRASS to correctly read my predecessor. I also very much did not try to push today to PenguinPower, I was just taking a peek because I'm not entirely satisfied with the 3/3 solve and my predecessor seemed to think there was something there to take a look at.

I think you are town regardless. But If EAF flips scum, it doesn't even matter since everyone outside the party should be lynched for autowin.

[RedPanda]

vote EAF

hope I'm wrong.

[RedPanda]

Vote titus

sorry ras for being frustrating day 2. I still can't believe scum would sacrifice deepwolf without a fight.

[RedPanda]

titus unless you think there's another scum in party, this is autowin.

[RedPanda]

VOTE: Golden Raspberry

Nice bus, pal.

-Joffrey

Let's delete everyone outside party first. If there's still scum remaining then its obviously gras.

[RedPanda]

VOTE: Golden Raspberry

Nice bus, pal.

-Joffrey

Let's delete everyone outside party first. If there's still scum remaining then its obviously gras.

Wasn't it you that said if no scum were in the party they'd ff?

how do I make them ff? I only said it's autowin if there's no scum in party.

[RedPanda]

VOTE: Golden Raspberry

Nice bus, pal.

-Joffrey

Let's delete everyone outside party first. If there's still scum remaining then its obviously gras.

Wasn't it you that said if no scum were in the party they'd ff?

how do I make them ff? I only said it's autowin if there's no scum in party.

But if it's autowin, wouldn't scum ff?

How would I know? Do you think it's not auto?

[RedPanda]

If RAS is scum, we're still in auto.
Town is never going to lynch in the party unless there's a NK there.

-IL (Heh)

CheekyTeeky has been killed! she was a

vanilla townie!

GR, you promised the game would end.

I wasn’t expecting that.

Well, EOF red flip means us/Duppin/Fuscosco, all clear. How is the game not over if party is alltown? Because if there’s ever a death in the party and we don’t find out who’s responsible, GR can be the only suspect but why would GR bus? That doesn’t really make sense either.

~Tyrion

GRas bus to ensure scum in the party is lock clear? Harder route to achieve. Nothing makes sense though.

I get the reaction test but when you highlighted Gras scum I figured worth a shot to investigate. Maybe it's wrong, maybe it's right. He should respond to the theory.

What is the scum motivation to pretty much townlock everyone other than him in the party? Because EOF flip towncleared us/D/F so it would be suicide unless GR is town. Scum!GR would have bussed OUTSIDE of the party, so scum has real chutzpah.

~T

[RedPanda]

HEAL: nobody

[RedPanda]

If RAS is scum, we're still in auto.
Town is never going to lynch in the party unless there's a NK there.

-IL (Heh)

Explain how this is auto if RAS scum plz.

Okay, so you’re telling me that scum!GR who is a hydra compromised of NOT imbecilic players, somehow decided that it was a proscum wincon, to confitown everyone else in the party other than them?





~T

If Gras is scum, we're looking at a 1 - 1 while everyone thinks it's a 0-2. Gras can then coast off that to victory as long as he doesn't flip his partner.

We are deleting everyone outside party. Scum can't touch inside. how will gras be able to survive against dupp ibl and fusc?

[RedPanda]

We are deleting everyone outside party. Scum can't touch inside. how will gras be able to survive against dupp ibl and fusc?

Three mislynches in house, NK in party, scum win

thanks. I was gonna go full I don't care.

[RedPanda]

Titus do you not think EAF flip helps duppin fusc and ibl against gras?

[RedPanda]

RAS/tw damn. Just hop in and 3/3 solve.

[RedPanda]

[RedPanda]

It's okay RedPanda, our Panda/animegirl friendship will transcend the bounds of shitty cheaters

I have to say, You made me google your character day 1. And you are too nice unlike your char .