Micro 877: Liars and Millers

[Ircher]

Wait when did this game start?

Claim not miller.

[Ircher]

VOTE: Suadade

[Ircher]

wait why am I scum?

I haven't really been paying attention to this thread.....

[Ircher]

: D

So how come is no one rvs'ing? I'm pretty sure my vote was the only one to this point.

[Ircher]

Oh wow thats 5 millers?

So let's string one of them up!

[Ircher]

Fine I'm seriously not a miller.

Is this the truth and 100% the truth?

[Ircher]

also, let's face it: the cop is gonna claim miller or not miller as well because 1) they can and 2) they don't want to be outted. So one group will have five because it will include the cop.

[Ircher]

You've ruined my beautiful name and turned it into a shit american junk food piece of shite

the worst and Suadade for scum?

[Ircher]

Ur scum too

Ircher and duck for scum

2/2 page 2 solve quote me later at game end

Out of 3?? Did godfather claim miller like an idiot?

So far I'm liking Saudade for town and probably won't want to lynch them today.

Say what???

[Ircher]

Ur scum too

Ircher and duck for scum

2/2 page 2 solve quote me later at game end

Out of 3?? Did godfather claim miller like an idiot?

So far I'm liking Saudade for town and probably won't want to lynch them today.

is this mostly tonal or are you seeing something deeper than I am?

It's a tone read. They seem confident.

I don't see how confidence makes one town. If anything, it makes one scum.

[Ircher]

Ircher lmk when you've caught up and had a cup of coffee

I don't drink coffee plus it's nighttime for me.

the worst and Suadade may be scum rn.
Senate maybe as well.

Everyone else is pretty much null. Maybe Cheeky town for the way they claimed and then went back on it.

[Ircher]

@the worst no not really; still think you/Suadade is a good possibility. I might reread tomorrow.

Pedit: I'd give it say +3% towniness.

[Ircher]

Ur scum too

Ircher and duck for scum

2/2 page 2 solve quote me later at game end

Out of 3?? Did godfather claim miller like an idiot?

So far I'm liking Saudade for town and probably won't want to lynch them today.

is this mostly tonal or are you seeing something deeper than I am?

It's a tone read. They seem confident.

I don't see how confidence makes one town. If anything, it makes one scum.

Confidence makes one town because it shows that you're willing to put your voice out there and give reads.

The way I see it, confidence is indicative of scum who knows more than everyone else. I guess I'm stepping into WIFOM territory at this point though.

[Ircher]

@the worst no not really; still think you/Suadade is a good possibility. I might reread tomorrow.

Pedit: I'd give it say +3% towniness.

Talk me through how a saud/tw team approaches this game?

I'm really unfamiliar with Suadade in terms of game meta.

But basically, I feel y'all are a bit too out there, too focused on having a good time (not that y'all shouldn't be) and not quite as focused on finding scum. Your recent posts are sorta changing my mind, but it still remains my top read(s) atm.

[Ircher]

probably not a bad idea.

[Ircher]

oh wait now I see

Yeah, the worst is right; there's a very low chance he's scum with Suadade.

[Ircher]

Ircher I can prove 100% beyond doubt that saudade and I are not scum together. how do you feel abt that

That's a false statement nonetheless. I wouldn't put it past scum to do a fakeclaim gambit.

[Ircher]

Are you serious the worst?

[Ircher]

Very.

(Wow!)

Basically it goes like this:

Mafia both claim miller in the hopes that 1) there aren't 6 miller claims (remember, the cop can claim either one) and two) town attempts to lynch one from each pool.

I guess that kinda rules you/Suadade out since y'all claimed early, but it's still possible for some of the people who claimed later.

[Ircher]

That's a really good point.

[Ircher]

Scaring doesn't work; relax your breathing and heart rate.

[Ircher]

*Inhale* *Exhale* *Inhale* *Exhale*

[Ircher]

teh worst may actually be town, so I'm fine with my vote.

[Ircher]

gotta work on that scumgame duckie

Why is duckling scum?

[Ircher]

Leaning skyg>saud~=nsg in the miller pool atm

That's town to scum?

@Suadade - Try again.
Pedit: Is he now?
Pedit2: Idk.

[Ircher]

How am I trying to appear town?

protip #1 to playing as scum:
stop being so reactionary

How is that a scum trait? Or is this specific to duckling?
Pedit: ??? He said the opposite?

[Ircher]

don't u dare say

Spoiler: correct tag because ircher uses mac and I respect his feelings

miller

I use PC actually, but I also post on my phone a lot.

[Ircher]

So this is what my reads are having reread to 199:
​

Spoiler: Reads

Confirmed Town

(From my perspective) (98%-100% Confidence)
Ircher (100%) - Role PM

Likely Town

(85%-97% Confidence)

Leaning Town

(60%-84% Confidence)

Null

(0% - 30% Confidence; No/Very Weak Read)
Pine (0%): He has like one post to this point, so it is really not possible to get read on him at the moment.

northsidegal (-3%): She has not posted enough for me to get a read.

Neutral

(31%-59% Confidence; Mixed Read)
CheekyTeeky (+45%): First of all, the flip in her claim regarding miller struck me (and continues to strike me) as town-indicative as I don't think scum have quite the guts to do that. Aside from that, CheekyTeeky's posts have a somewhat townie!vibe, and I think I'm okay with her contributions to the game so far.

AzoriusSenate (+40%): His read on Saudade feels like it's a genuine read coming from town.

the worst (+34%): It may be just because I'm inexperienced with the worst that I'm not scumreading him that much at this point. While like many of us, he was fooling around in the beginning in the game, later on, he seemed to switch to a more serious mode, and I think he is striking a good balance between having fun and working at solving the game.

Skygazer (-32%): Her posts seemed pretty nullish until I read 199. Considering I'm already scumreading OkaPoka, 199 just feels like scum attempting to give their buddy a free townread. It's very weak, yes, but it is something.

Saudade (-40%): Most of his early posts involve him fooling around with the worst and other people. While this is fine to the extent, when this seems to be the only thing one is doing, it becomes an issue. It's worth noting that despite a strong presence very early in the game, later on (in the 150-199 post range), he seems to kinda drift out of sight.

OkaPoka (-55%): A lot of his early postings (and many of his later ones as well) just feel like scum that is spending too much time on fitting on and not enough time on solving the game.

Leaning Scum

(60%-75% Confidence)

​​

Likely Scum

(76%-100% Confidence)

Spoiler: How to read this reads list

Players are placed in different sections based on my confidence in the read expressed as a percentage. A positive percentage indicates that I leans towards town on a player whereas a negative percentage indicates I lean towards scum on a player. Please note that the Null an Neutral sections contain both townreads and scumreads and you must look a the sign of the percentage in parenthesis to determine which way I lean.

Confidence ratings are rough estimates (and somewhat arbitrary) and are relative to one another. In addition, they tend to be scored on a logarithmic scale versus a linear scale; in other words, the difference between 0% and 30% tends to be greater than ther difference between 30% and 60%.

I will maybe post my notes later if I feel like it/if asked. Some of those notes go into greater detail into the specific things I'm seeing.

[Ircher]

Also:
VOTE: OkaPoka
Start solving please and thank you.

[Ircher]

ircher ur not voting a miller

voting millers is optimal here

plenty of time to pressure non-millers. This post only serves to reinforce my read on you.

[Ircher]

It was zero effort formatting today; it's based off a template I have saved already. Also, I like colored lists.

[Ircher]

more Oka votes please.

[Ircher]

It was zero effort formatting today; it's based off a template I have saved already. Also, I like colored lists.

It seems rather unnecessary. Pretty but like distracting from the point that effectively all your reads are null.

Did you read the second spoiler? That's not how my reads list works.

[Ircher]

Wait was Cheeky being serious about the claim?

[Ircher]

oh wow, yeah that claim wasn't necessary and I kinda suspected as much.

[Ircher]

I wish.......

[Ircher]

​

Spoiler: Reads

Confirmed Town

(From my perspective) (98%-100% Confidence)
Ircher (100%) - Role PM
CheekyTeeky (+98%): First of all, the flip in her claim regarding m____r struck me (and continues to strike me) as town-indicative as I don't think scum have quite the guts to do that. Aside from that, CheekyTeeky's posts have a somewhat townie!vibe, and I think I'm okay with her contributions to the game so far. Barring a counterclaim (which doesn't seem likely), this slot is guaranteed to be the town cop; it definitely explains what happened at the beginning of the game.

Likely Town

(85%-97% Confidence)

Leaning Town

(60%-84% Confidence)

Null

(0% - 30% Confidence; No/Very Weak Read)
Pine (0%): He has like one post to this point, so it is really not possible to get read on him at the moment.

northsidegal (-3%): She has not posted enough for me to get a read.

Neutral

(31%-59% Confidence; Mixed Read)

AzoriusSenate (+40%): His read on Saudade feels like it's a genuine read coming from town.

the worst (+34%): It may be just because I'm inexperienced with the worst that I'm not scumreading him that much at this point. While like many of us, he was fooling around in the beginning in the game, later on, he seemed to switch to a more serious mode, and I think he is striking a good balance between having fun and working at solving the game.

Saudade (-37%): Most of his early posts involve him fooling around with the worst and other people. While this is fine to the extent, when this seems to be the only thing one is doing, it becomes an issue. It's worth noting that despite a strong presence very early in the game, later on (in the 150-199 post range), he seems to kinda drift out of sight. I think it's possible though that I may have been too quick to judge as he did have some good reads as of 302. His read on the worst is the main one I disagree with.

Skygazer (-39%): Her posts seemed pretty nullish until I read 199. Considering I'm already scumreading OkaPoka, 199 just feels like scum attempting to give their buddy a free townread. It's very weak, yes, but it is something. I'm starting to get scum!vibes from some of Skygazer's later posts, and an OkaPoka/Skygazer team strikes me as a good possibility.

Leaning Scum

(60%-75% Confidence)
OkaPoka (-73%): A lot of his early postings (and many of his later ones as well) just feel like scum that is spending too much time on fitting on and not enough time on solving the game. He is also focusing too much on lynching within the m____rs pool which strikes me as scum trying to use mechanics to avoid being lynched. I'm pretty sure I've played with scum!Oka before, so I need to go double-check that and see if it similar to how he is playing here. Okay, so skimming over his ISO in Newbie 1874 where he was scum with UnaBombaH, and I'm sorta seeing that same emphasis on mechanics. I guess a sample size of 1 isn't very helpful in terms of establishing a meta read, but the possibility of scum!OkaPoka here is around the same, even after consulting that game.

​​

Likely Scum

(76%-100% Confidence)

Spoiler: How to read this reads list

Players are placed in different sections based on my confidence in the read expressed as a percentage. A positive percentage indicates that I leans towards town on a player whereas a negative percentage indicates I lean towards scum on a player. Please note that the Null an Neutral sections contain both townreads and scumreads and you must look a the sign of the percentage in parenthesis to determine which way I lean.

Confidence ratings are rough estimates (and somewhat arbitrary) and are relative to one another. In addition, they tend to be scored on a logarithmic scale versus a linear scale; in other words, the difference between 0% and 30% tends to be greater than ther difference between 30% and 60%.

[Ircher]

(I finished rereading the thread.)

[Ircher]

HURT: OkaPoka
HEAL: the worst

[Ircher]

I really dislike CheekyTeeky at the moment for doing that, seems like a role fishing attempt on d1...

It makes a lot of sense though.

[Ircher]

join me the worst!

[Ircher]

(Vote OkaPoka!)

[Ircher]

[Ircher]

but OkaPoka has >rand chance of scum and cop claimed anyway, so does it matter?

[Ircher]

tw ur top posting by like two times

[Ircher]

on the worst? Why?

[Ircher]

meta

Fair enough.

[Ircher]

then sort the other pool!

[Ircher]

wanna qualify that, Cheeky?

[Ircher]

is it weird that my only confident tr is on the person with 1 post

It is very much so.

Talk to us why this is the case.

[Ircher]

then sort the other pool!

well that's like,,

you/oka/cheeky/pine/azor, right?

i've never played w pine, played very little w cheeky, have never played w azor, and can semi-confidently sort oka

anyways fmpov a pool of five should be way harder to sort than a pool of three but tw feels so off

You don't need to sort Cheeky as she is unCC'd cop.

[Ircher]

is it weird that my only confident tr is on the person with 1 post

It is very much so.

Talk to us why this is the case.

well we mind melded

and through that one post he sees what i see

the optimal path to town victory

Let me rephrase: talk to us about why you lack strong reads on the rest of us.

[Ircher]

is it weird that my only confident tr is on the person with 1 post

It is very much so.

Talk to us why this is the case.

well we mind melded

and through that one post he sees what i see

the optimal path to town victory

Let me rephrase: talk to us about why you lack strong reads on the rest of us.

because anything said by anyone this game could be made by town or scum

nothing has been said that strongly points to one alignment

however me mindmelding with pine makes me feel like he is probs town because same mindset and all

the end

VOTE: OkaPoka

[Ircher]

pagetop

[Ircher]

no!!!

[Ircher]

sky is L-2 if I counted correctly.

Oka, Saudade, and CheekyTeeky rn.

[Ircher]

yes but Oka is by far my stronger read.
pedit2: stop ninja'ing me the worst!

[Ircher]

duck is either tunneling me or scum

if i rebuttle im going to countertunnle

can someone defend my honor

im just a princess

I would like to see this actually.

[Ircher]

me town
pine town
azorious town

ircher scum

When did Senate become town for you?

[Ircher]

okay listen can you just tactically replace out

Please don't make comments like that. Please see the stickied thread related to threats/demands to replace out.

[Ircher]

Votecount

OkaPoka: Ircher,
Saudade:
northsidegal: AzoriusSenate, CheekyTeeky, Skygazer
Pine:
the worst:
AzoriusSenate:
Skygazer:
Ircher: northsidegal, OkaPoka

Not Voting: Pine, the worst, Saudade

With 9 alive, it takes 5 to lynch. Day 1 will end on June 21 at 7pm EST.

This votecount is only psyche-certified if it goes unedited for a full five minutes.

What even is this vc......................

[Ircher]

Yeah I'm not sold. I think I'd trust her read on sky as either alignment I just can't see why she'd WK sky here hopefully time will tell.

Ircher I scum read because he pretty much made me claim with his fishing. I don't know why town out the too many millers thing. I don't know why scum do either tbh.

What??? Point to where I was fishing you!

[Ircher]

That's not an attempt to fish. That's me stating how the cop would claim mechanically.

[Ircher]

Because all of you were claiming that someone messed up with five miller claims. I made the comment because I didn't want us to lynch in a pool wrongly.

[Ircher]

Out of 3?? Did godfather claim miller like an idiot?

ok looks like we are just lynching millers for the rest of this game lolllll

Out of 3?? Did godfather claim miller like an idiot?

I THINK SO

whoever fucked up just out urself plz

after we win we can demand a reroll

Posts like these to be specific.

[Ircher]

[Ircher]

ircher who is scum in the millers

Skygazer (-39%): Her posts seemed pretty nullish until I read 199. Considering I'm already scumreading OkaPoka, 199 just feels like scum attempting to give their buddy a free townread. It's very weak, yes, but it is something. I'm starting to get scum!vibes from some of Skygazer's later posts, and an OkaPoka/Skygazer team strikes me as a good possibility.

[Ircher]

(I'm still here. Sometimes, it is better to interact. Other times, it is better to sit back and observe the thread. I have been doing the latter the last two days.)

Also, can Saudade, Skygazer, and northsidegal towncase themselves? I'd appreciate it. (the worst could as well, but I'm pretty confident in town!duckling right now.)

[Ircher]

Oka, if you are town, do stuff.

[Ircher]

(If you are scum, you can continue doing nothing and allow yourself to be lynched. Your choice.)

Pedit: A reads list would be a good starting point. Doesn't have to be in-depth--one-liners suffice for each read.

[Ircher]

A genuine reads list mind you, not one that basically amounts to "I'm town from my point of view and everyone else has rand% chance of being scum."

[Ircher]

Who said you were done?

I find your Saudade read pretty interesting... I did some research on Saudade and found that he's pretty loud and obnoxious regardless of alignment (no offense intended). He seems more than capable of tunneling people both as town and as scum. While I can't say I townread him rn (my townreads do, so I'll take them at their word for now), I also haven't seen anything that seems particularly scum-motivated. Can you go into more depth on what you see in Saudade's ISO that makes him your strongest scumread?

Also, w/ regards of my read on you--the meta part was more of a sanity check rather than the primary part of my read on you. I am well aware that a sample size of 1 is practically useless to make any useful observations other than getting a feel for playstyle. I apologize if I made you think otherwise; I guess it did take up a lot of space in my reads list compared to the rest of my read. That said, your focus on mechanics throughout the day still stands as a major part as why I'm scumreading you. Some other aspects include the fact that up until now, you have done nothing useful this game (which combined with your focus on "don't lynch me cuz of mechanics" looks really bad) as well as the way you reacted when others and I questioned you earlier in the game.

[Ircher]

Remind me, is there a particular reason you want to lynch Skygazer first?

[Ircher]

Hmmm... How long will it take for you to be sober?

[Ircher]

ah that's too long; go ahead.

[Ircher]

Oh, I figured the spam would at least have content.

[Ircher]

You're so rude. That's the nice way of phrasing it.

[Ircher]

I'm sorry I'm not a paragon scum hunter like you.

[Ircher]

So I'll ask again:

Tell me why you are so insistent on lynching Skygazer today despite obviously having a scumread on OkaPoka when objectively speaking, OkaPoka has done far less than Skygazer and in my opinion, OkaPoka is by far scummier than Skygazer.

[Ircher]

its literally not worth my time to write a nice case on saudade if everyone else trs him

like when i write cases on people who some people scumread in other games, maybe a few people read it

and it takes me a lot of time

so yeah

have fun

Again, where are you getting the notion everyone townreads Saudade. Besides, the opinions of dead townies matter, sometimes more so than people give them credit. As town, you want to maximize town's chances of winning, and the only way to do that is to give good, informed opinions. If you never articulate clearly why you feel a certain way, no one will ever remember your reads even if they are correct.

It's not a matter of escaping a lynch. It's a matter of giving town useful information regardless of whether or not you get lynched.

[Ircher]

So I'll ask again:

Tell me why you are so insistent on lynching Skygazer today despite obviously having a scumread on OkaPoka when objectively speaking, OkaPoka has done far less than Skygazer and in my opinion, OkaPoka is by far scummier than Skygazer.

Because mathematics.

I am in the miller pool and I townread myself,
If we assume the theworst is town too and its an easy assumption I have a 50/50 chance of being right in the millers.

I dont have that kind of confidence in the vts and the margin of error and risk of getting outplayed/misreading oka is greater there

I guess that's esp. true from your pov. And I can accept the assumption the worst is town, so it works out from my point of view as well.

I still think though that OkaPoka has a lot higher chance to flip scum than Skygazer, but maybe I don't have enough experience with OkaPoka to differentiate scummy town!OkaPoka from scum!OkaPoka.

[Ircher]

Seriously Azor just scum slipped but we stay in Millers.

I dunno if that was a scumslip, but it certainly caught my attention.

[Ircher]

Thats all really simple why did I have to chew it out for you

Because everyone is playing from a different perspective; you cannot assume everyone is making the same assumptions as you.

[Ircher]

lol i dont think i can recall the last time a dead vt had their opinion seriously considered

other than vca purposes

anyways i believe that eventually saudade is going to be sr

he did this in ddu and it took until lylo b4 it was seriously considered

im going to go hide in the bushes until im vindicated btw

Lemme put it this way then: You can say "I told you so, and no one listened" post-game if you write your case and we lose to scum!Saudade.

[Ircher]

(and you are town ofc.)

[Ircher]

link the game at least?

[Ircher]

Thats all really simple why did I have to chew it out for you

Because everyone is playing from a different perspective; you cannot assume everyone is making the same assumptions as you.

Well until the day you'll be able to put yourself into someone elses shoes you are gonna have a bad time

That's not at all what I meant.

[Ircher]

i was scum too that game !

just fwiw

That game was quite some time ago


Want me to post a recent game wherr I hard tunnelled all day everyday 4 scum in a row?

please do and towncase yourself, thanks.

[Ircher]

VOTE: Saudade

[Ircher]

Also, I noted that you stated in double day unlimited that townies don't use bad logic, and I would like to point out that's an unsound assumption.

[Ircher]

so between your top scumread okapoka and your other scumread skygazer
you decided that, nah,
its Saudade

okapoka is still top.

You and Skygazer have been about even tbh for quite awhile, Skygazer a bit more of a scumread than you (mainly cuz the worst and someone ekse townreads you pretty heavily). I also think your play here resembles double day more than Jazz, but I do admit I was skimming your ISOs.

[Ircher]

What criteria would YOU use to determine if you were town, Saudade if from a year from now, you reread an old game of yours without checking your alignment beforehand.

[Ircher]

so between your top scumread okapoka and your other scumread skygazer
you decided that, nah,
its Saudade

okapoka is still top.

You and Skygazer have been about even tbh for quite awhile, Skygazer a bit more of a scumread than you (mainly cuz the worst and someone ekse townreads you pretty heavily). I also think your play here resembles double day more than Jazz, but I do admit I was skimming your ISOs.

I should clarify: I skimmed the first 100 or so posts of your ISO in both games.

[Ircher]

so between your top scumread okapoka and your other scumread skygazer
you decided that, nah,
its Saudade

okapoka is still top.

You and Skygazer have been about even tbh for quite awhile, Skygazer a bit more of a scumread than you (mainly cuz the worst and someone ekse townreads you pretty heavily). I also think your play here resembles double day more than Jazz, but I do admit I was skimming your ISOs.

Do you believe in your intelligence Ircher?

Why yes, actually I do, but that doesn't mean I'm necessarily good at mafia. My wiki page has quite some useful info for you to check out.

[Ircher]

Not everyone reacts the same to pressure. It is a fallacy to believe otherwise.

[Ircher]

Also, if Skygazer is scum, I'd give OkaPoka >85% chance of being scum.
The converse is not necessarily true.

[Ircher]

Who do we think will be killed N2... Hmmm......

[Ircher]

I wish skitter30 was here to carry me so I wouldnt have to post this much

I will say this: if we DO lynch Skygazer today, I think it's immense towncredit for Saudade if they flip town, regardless of Saudade's actual alignment.

No. Why?

[Ircher]

Why are Oka/Sky svs?

Skygazer'sread reversal from way back really stuck out as implying that if skygazer is scum, okapoka is as well. There are other things, but that is the most notable imo.

[Ircher]

VOTE: OkaPoka

[Ircher]

Prod dodge. 59 pages is fucking nuts. I've been distracted by a rough week at work and home, and sinking attention into the SUPP.

This becomes my top priority starting tomorrow, but I probably won't be reading much of the last 50 or so pages.

What's important? Claims, etc?

CheekyTeeky claimed cop. Saudade counterclaimed really late, but we'll resolve that later.

Paty particular attention to OkaPoka and Skygazer.

[Ircher]

I'm not anyway inclined about him. Why are we lynching outside the millers?

Because Oka's scummier and fypov, it shouldn't matter as it's 25% chance either way.

[Ircher]

No idea where votes are at but I want the skygazer hammer pls

Why?

i mean look at my position; im being tunneled by two very loud players in a 53 page (after 4 days btw) micro that i cant keep up with and getting accused of lurking shit out for my absence when in any other game id probs be posting a perfectly normal and average amount

and im being accused of like associative shit w a player that im not 100% sold on being scum for not SRing them lol when i think you know that if oka were scum id bus him in a heartbeat bc im good at association shit generally

so im just like ??? i dont rlly feel like theres anything i can even do at this point even after massively spewing myself as town in what i thought was twilight and even after i made a huge effort to try and catch up last night im still being tunneled

and i feel like my solves are just being absolutely 100% ignored which is fucking horrible bc fmpov this very much feels like its goin down the road of a town loss

Even if no one else does, I will remember the words of dead townies.

You actually did towntell towards the end but I trusted in the king

HOW ARE YOU TOWNREADING THIS TW

You have a good point. AzoriusSenate is really starting to draw my attention, and not in a good way.

[Ircher]

Ircher do you not understand how weird it is for a miller not wanting to lynch in millers?
From their PoV there's 1 in 3.
If I'm covering for a cop in the nonmillers it's better if we don't lynch there.

If Oka was cop, they would have already counterclaimed by now. OkaPoka has not counterclaimed you yet. Therefore, OkaPoka is not the cop.

[Ircher]

Senate if town also apparently gamethrows because he thinks it's funny so :shrug:

Will also lynch oka

We'll worry about Senate on a OkaPoka green!flip. Stick to OkaPoka.

Senate if town also apparently gamethrows because he thinks it's funny so :shrug:

Will also lynch oka

Explain how I'm gamethrowing compared to Saudade

let's see.... voting someone who towntelled sounds like a gamethrow. Tunneling town as an aggressive player sounds like just obnoxious behavior, not gamethrowing....

Senate is not scum

It better not be Saudade/Senate.

In simple english. Stick with the plan.

Anyone who is a miller should be wanting to lynch a miller claim because it's 1 in 3. It's not rocket science.

Yes, but mafia also requires compromise. We really don't have to lynch in millers. We can lynch OkaPoka who has enough scum equity to be worth the % decrease in success for millers. Furthermore, OkaPoka has been fairly useless this entire game whereas Skygazer has at least responded to some points in a useful manner. town!Skygazer is much more useful than town!OkaPoka, and scum!Skygazer is less likely than scum!OkaPoka.

Well done you. You realise that scum aren't going to shoot the miller claims right? Think a little bit ahead.

They will if we lynch in non-millers. (Well, they'll kill Cop!Cheeky N1, but then chances just become equal to a spectator and is only biased by one's own alignment.) And if they don't, it's net positive for us.

[Ircher]

There's about as much info (a little more, yes, but not significant enough to matter) in northsidegal as there is in Pine. And Pine promises to start catching up tomorrow.

[Ircher]

probably pine maybe senate

[Ircher]

And Saudade shouldn't be locktown; they are more than competent as scum.

[Ircher]

I'm obviously not lynching myself! And Cheeky is right that we should choose a group and stick to it.

[Ircher]

Of all people, why Pine?

[Ircher]

cop should claim result.

[Ircher]

As you wish duckling.

pedit: Cop was non-miller pool. If they were miller, this game is basically autowin.

[Ircher]

Also, the fact you already have a reason for the N1 kill is very suspicious.

[Ircher]

(Not that I disagree with the reason.)

[Ircher]

Skygazer, what's your take on the night kill? Same as duckling's?

[Ircher]

Sane question to Iconeum and Saudade when they notice the day has started.

[Ircher]

Possibly, but I still think you are the most likely town out of the millers.

I'm more concerned about Saudade tbh.
Pedit: That's fine.

[Ircher]

@Senate -- While I think the worst is town for the time being, I'd be careful around that slot.

[Ircher]

My chief concern is I get the feeling you are trying to pocket me the worst. Your latest posts just have the wrong vibe of having an ulterior motive.

[Ircher]

Preferred lynching order rn is Saudade --> the worst --> Skygazer or Iconeum.

That ensures we don't end up with both Saudade and the worst in lylo as that would be a nightmare.

[Ircher]

the worst, give me some games where you were scum and a teammate of yours got lynched before you did.

[Ircher]

Ah, why did you try to hammer Skygazer last day phase the worst.

You said you were working on something big (not sure if you ever posted it) and to delay the phase until you finished. Then you seemed to randomly vote Skygazer thinking it was a hammer. It seems rather strange.

[Ircher]

Why are you already voting Cheeky? And it's Iconeum now.

[Ircher]

I thought Skygazer was hammered already. I didn't like.... hate the lynch? But as I said like 9001 times yday I had other preferences.

But if she was already hammered, why would you need to move your vote to ensure she was hammered? And you were totally onboard with a Skygazer lynch at that point even if you expressed a scumread on OkaPoka.

[Ircher]

@Senate

@Cheeky

Your thoughts on the matter? Relevant post is 1142.

[Ircher]

dunno about that reads list Iconeum. It lacks a certain depth.

[Ircher]

Not killing cheekyteeky only makes sense from skygazers point of view

How come?

Azo lynch Oka don't bother trying to reason someone might call you unpleasant.

Cheeky probably town for this post alone

did you night kill pine because you didnt know cheeky claimed cop?

Good point. That kill makes a lot of sense from that point of view.

do you think the godfather would be bussing Sky like that?

Ummm.... Oka wasn't bussing Sky.......

OkaPoka's game in summary was this :

"I think SAUDADE is SCUM but NOBODY believes ME so I am going to vote SKYGAZER even though I dont think she's scum"

that's not a buss really, its distancing

You really think I haven't read this game? Priceless.

This entire post is a misrep

I agree with Saudade here actually.

[Ircher]

I didn't know Cheeky claimed cop. So? It's a long game, I don't promise to have comprehensively read every post.

What I do know is that Oka BARELY mentioned you, let alone push you Saudude. Do you want me to showcase the difference in Oka pushing Sky vs you?

That's again false. OkaPoka barely did anything this game, and when he finally did do something, it was basically tunnel on Saudade.

VOTE: Saudade

Ico's entrance/doubling down on saudade doesnt really feel optimal coming from scum so im not seeing it as a scum play

Except there's the fact Iconeum is getting a lot of details wrong....

The only worrying scenario is if scum claimed not-miller here

The probability is next to zero.

I had hammer on Skygazer ico
and I didnt hammer
thats all you need to know

That's a good point, but what was that about? Why didn't you hammer when you thought it was clearly optimal to lynch Skygazer?

[Ircher]

Oka/Sky doesn't make sense either, based on Oka voting his partner there while he has a perfect option on you.

??? Oka/Sky still makes a lot of sense.

One more time

Why does a scum!Oka set up Sky to be his scumread for the rest of the game if they are buddies? You realize this is a bad long-game strategy as scum, right?


pedit* no i know you townread my slot.

BECAUSE OKAPOKA NEVER DID!!! He basically gave up on fighting his lynch and Skygazer's lynch.

When I had hammer on Skygazer I decided not to hammer because it will end the day prematurely and we might miss out on some reads

Fair enough.

i have like a near perfect read rate on spyconeum we got this

Good!

Did you spot my emphasis on forcing OkaPoka to talk about Skyg? Like I might be giving myself too much credit but I think I more or less forced him to make that post

I agree.

[Ircher]

cheeky, ico is probs my strongest TR here just based on how mechanically incorrect their posts are :c

also since this is my last game i wanna have a three way lylo w tw/sausage/me

yes that requires us to lynch a confirmed town and also hope ico is town but it'd be worth it, right?

No no no!

One of the worst and Saudade cannot make it to 3p lylo. That would be just too bad of an experience. And let's not lose when we have a 75% chance of winning.

I need everyone in the nonmiller pool to confirm they ride or die townread me before I'm willing to chain lynch the rest of the millers. Will towncase self if necessary.

I don't think Ircher has considered the ramifications of his suggested lynch order for example so for the time being I'd rather just win d2 and have fun doing it.

It's posts like this that make me suspicious of you duckling, jsyk.

CheekyTeeky COP
AzoriusSenate NOT MILLER
Ircher NOT MILLER

Saudade MILLER
Iconeum MILLER
the worst MILLER
Skygazer MILLER

Scum in Saud/Sky/Azorius (in order)

Ummm.... How about no? Azorius is clearly not scum.

how the hell is Azo (or any non-miller claim) conf town?

the worst and I discussed this day 1 already. The chances of a fakeclaim are zero because either town has to be stupid or scum gets outted real quick.

cheeky, ico is probs my strongest TR here just based on how mechanically incorrect their posts are :c

I'm not so sure, but if the worst can read Iconeum well, I'll trust his read.

[Ircher]

man remember when i got the page 69 pagetop that was great

Having fun is great and all, but you still have to play the game.

If sky flips town I am not moving off of Saud next day

That seems fair.

can we just lynch sausage first pretty please?

I think my updated preference is now:

Skygazer --> Saudade --> the worst/Iconeum.

I don't think lynching Saudade today is a good idea.

like i seriously don't see any sort of difference between saudade's MO in my micro and his play here

he's loud and trying to force through mislynches

His play is also very similar in his scumgames.

Let's see what happens if you guys have your way:

Lynch Sky
NK on Cheeky/Ircher

Lynch Ico
NK on Cheeky/Ircher

LYLO with tw/saud/Azorius <----- this pretty much means Azorius is kingmaker and has to chose between TW who got the godfather lynched, or the universally townread dude

Why do you think I have a good chance of being killed? If anything, I think it's the opposite.

[Ircher]

I'm still serious about force-feeding the rope to saudude. I see ya'll townreading him but I don't see it.

-He was not on the lynch wagon yet claiming to be the one solving this game
-Flipped scum had every incentive and opportunity to vote him but didn't. Instead choose to vote Sky.
-Is actively trying to degrade gamestate which only ever serves scum
-Refuses to discuss any and all points directed at him

1) While maybe worthy of an FoS, Saudade did express multiple times that he thought it was Skygazer/OkaPoka but wanted to lynch Skygazer first. It's not indicative of scum Saudade.
2) A similar yet very different argument can be made for Skygazer as scum.
3) Not a scum tell for Saudade.
4) Not really a scum tell for Saudade.

worst's 1821 shows me he's not gonna change his mind on Saud so i'm literally stuck here.

If ya'll want to proceed lynching Sky i'll not stand in the way any longer...

This pings me some.

VOTE: Sky

Why are you voting Skygazer if you think Saudade is final scum?

When you reread a game you miss out on the atmosphere and the pacing, please don't continue scumhunting off wagonomics.
its really terrible without a context

I agree here.

if I was scum with Oka I'd probably just hammer Skygazer simply because of my weak partner

Yeah, I could buy that.

[Ircher]

I'm willing to lynch Skygazer here BUT if we are wrong, one of the worst and Saudade must go D3.

[Ircher]

I mean, I think that Ico has higher chance than you or the worst, but LyLo is too stressful to decide b/tw you two imo.

[Ircher]

If I don't make it to lylo, then I guess we can save you/the worst for LyLo.

[Ircher]

ya, I guess so.

[Ircher]

Azorius, do you have any qualms with a Skygazer lynch?

[Ircher]

Just double-checking.

[Ircher]

VOTE: Skygazer

[Ircher]

:/ Iconeum or Saudade for final scum?

[Ircher]

@Mod: Can we get some kind of night acceleration if all living players agree and the game does not end?

[Ircher]

Thinking it's 60% Skygazer, 30% Iconeum, 8% Saudade, and 2% the worst rn.

[Ircher]

Because I really don't think he's scum here. He's apparently bad at scum for starters. And he really feels town this game.

[Ircher]

I also think this setup was insane. Having like 4 confimed town D2 is rough.

That's because we lynched scum day 1. I think the setup's balanced and we can always try to calculate the EV.

[Ircher]

why doesn't skygazer make the final post she knows her role

#LazyMod

[Ircher]

Lol

[Ircher]

awestfie does have a good point in that last pm though.

[Ircher]

Skygazer has been lynched. She was a Mafia Goon.

The town wins! Flawless victory.

Votecount here eventually.

YAY!!!!

[Ircher]

Was there a mafia and dead thread?

[Ircher]

Mafia PT?

[Ircher]

Mafia PT was an interesting read.