Large Normal 221 - Endgame

[popsofctown]

Kirari why did you pick a deliberately scummy avatar; are you winning too many games on your main? Too boring?

LuckyOtter's positioning with respect to RF indeed looks like a plausible SvS.

[DeasVail]

It wasn't forgetting, it was a false reconstructed memory. The reported occurrence was "placing an unvote on creature with the reasoning that he's town in a different game". The analogue to that would be when you tell a 5 year old every other week that they went to Disneyland when they were 4, usually they'll eventually generate some false memories to match what you tell them. That doesn't happen to townies all the time because it's a rare occurrence in adults and 5 year olds aren't playing mafia.

Yes, as town he would be equally likely to forget when Creature flipped and therefore how useful the lie is... but like that's not what's on trial.

You and DeasVail (and so did RedFlavor but it's a cranial ego self-defense mechanism I'd positive I'd talk myself out of it being a real tell too) keep splitting apart the action "unvoting Creature while considering the fact he's town in a different game" into its component part so that either alignment can forget the order of the opponents. It has to be considered one indivisible action that did or didn't happen.

I am probably wasting threadspace with this because the player I wanted dead is dead and I had extra votes but I really don't get how people don't get it.

Pops, I don’t know if I agree entirely but I get what you’re saying and obviously you were right and I was wrong. Regardless, I can (naturally) totally understand why someone would have a similar reaction to the wagon to what I did.

The main reason for the Montosh placement in my rough reads breakdown is I remember liking them early in the game but they’ve made less of an impression recently (I think it’s common for scum to start strong and fizzle) but I liked them early game for a reason obviously and that might still be valid. When I have time I’ll go through Montosh more specifically paying attention to Red/Creature interactions but I’m more likely to favour Otter-scum here. I completely agree with Kirari re: the Red vote.

Also keen to hear from Vork why they are conftown.

[Kirari Momobami]

I created this account for a game where Yumeko and Mary were playing so we'd have an animu meme trifecta

then I just found it kinda fun to play this character so I decided to keep going

[LuckyOtter]

Hi folks. Recovering from 4th holiday. Hoping to post something of substance tonight

[Not Known 15]

Vote Count 3.1

Not Voting(5)Montosh,LuckyOtter,Kublai Khan,ofrhz,DeasVail,

Montosh(2)Nero Cain,rosterfoster,

LuckyOtter(2)Kirari Momobami,popsofctown,

ofrhz(2)nomnomnom,Jesus Louisus,

BodhiSmith13

DeasVail(2)Alchemist21,Vorkuta,

Jesus Louisus(0)

Vorkuta(0)

rosterfoster(0)

Saudade

Lil Uzi Vert

popsofctown(0)

EvilDeanius

Eyes without a face(0)

Alchemist21(0)

HeWhoSwims

nomnomnom(0)

Nero Cain(0)

Kublai Khan(0)

Kirari Momobami(0)

No Lynch(0)

With 13 alive it is 7 to lynch.

Day 3 will end in (expired on 2019-07-11 13:10:00) or when a lynch has been achieved.

[Montosh]

VOTE: ofrhz

Just sheeping townreads, though not to the point where I'm voting with them since they're voting for me. Well one of them is. Nero I'm not so sure about but he's probably just irritating me. Probably not actually scum though.

[Nero Cain]

what an excellent catchup

[Montosh]

I'm confused that wasn't a catchup?

[Nero Cain]

Why vote when you aren't caught up?

[Nero Cain]

Also, bettlejuice much? 2 minutues is a fast time to respond to my criticism

[Nero Cain]

like you've been sitting here for the last 2 hours and you haven't been giving your thoughts on the tail end of yesterday/today?

[Nero Cain]

can we kill this guy yet?

[LuckyOtter]

DeasVail -- between the DV/LO 1v1 I think I'd do LO first since I liked DV's reads early game, but that feeling has waned a bit. I don't like 708 as much as I did on day 1 since he paired me with creature which is the kind of "let's put my scum townread with a town in case I flip so it's not obvious" thing you see from scum a lot, also so much of the iso is irt LO I'm kinda... hmm

oh by the way for what it's worth the reason I paired you with Creature was because you had both claimed/soft-claimed stuff and my plan was to wait for further info before considering either of you as scum.

--

As for where I'm at from a quick glance through,

Town: Pops, Kublai, roster, Alch
Less Town: Nero Cain, Kirari, ofrhz
Less Scum: Montosh, nomnom, Jesus
Scum: Vorkuta, Otter

My first thought is that I kinda townread the twilight posting from Kirari and ofrhz?
In the case of Kirari, the vote on Red after he was obviously hammered is pretty weird from scum and seems more jokey than anything else.
And with ofrhz, my expectation is that she would realise her buddy was hammered and avoid doing some weird waffly pseudo-defense.
Buttt I'm going to think these through more when I'm not about to sleep because my usual approach to townreading people has not really held up so far here.

I do generally disagree with the blanket wagon clearing also. I think that the way that someone votes a person (and the situation) can be pretty town-indicative, but the Creature wagon in particular is not something I believe scum would have necessarily avoided. In particular my Vorkuta concern is that they were cheerleading that wagon without actually contributing to it.

I'll be giving this more thought tomorrow morning.

Why is Jesus so low on your list? Red threw around some useless votes this game including on Creature but seemed pretty intent on getting Jesus lynched.

[LuckyOtter]

Is the skitter thing the only reason people are wanting to clear Montosh? I can see scum faking that.

[Nero Cain]

kirari is arguing that 90 doesn't come from scum. I really don't know what others are doing. This game is a prodge fest now.

[Nero Cain]

tinfoil: montosh is the last team scum and Kirari is the SK that's trying to keep him alive so we hunt team scum and not the sk

[Nero Cain]

and

Yeah you've got it wrong. I do legit scumread Creature. To be fair, I always scumread Creature a bit.

Hedging on Creature

makes some sense to me

[popsofctown]

Why would an SK claim on day 1.... oh wait I see how that works

[LuckyOtter]

Vote Count 1.9

Kop

Niko(5)Kirari Momobami,Eyes without a face,ofrhz,Nero Cain,Kublai Khan,

Vorkuta(4)Montosh,pisskop,Niko,RedFlavor,

Creature(3)Vorkuta,Jesus Louisus,Alchemist21,

HeWhoSwims(2)LuckyOtter,rosterfoster,

Jesus Louisus(1)Lil Uzi Vert,

Not Voting(1)DeasVail,

Nero Cain(1)HeWhoSwims,

RedFlavor(1)Creature,

Saudade

Lil Uzi Vert(0)

EvilDeanius

Eyes without a face(0)

rosterfoster(0)

pisskop(0)

Montosh(0)

LuckyOtter(0)

ofrhz(0)

Alchemist21(0)

BodhiSmith13

DeasVail(0)

Kublai Khan(0)

Kirari Momobami(0)

No Lynch(0)

With 18 alive it is 10 to lynch.

Day 1 ends in (expired on 2019-06-26 13:21:00)

As the Niko wagon is growing here, Red is voting Vork, which makes me pretty confident they are not scum together. I'd also bet that there's already scum on the Niko wagon at this point and Red is trying to sit elsewhere. This actually makes me think he's not scum with Montosh.

I'm looking at either Kirari or ofrhz. Kublai is still kinda null for me and Nero is solid town.

[LuckyOtter]

If Red and Montosh are scum together, why wouldn't Red just jump on the Niko wagon there?

[LuckyOtter]

VOTE: Vorkuta

VOTE: HWS

VOTE: RedFlavor

Creature pretty much always does some low-grade bussing/distancing day 1 as scum right?

These all feel pretty low-impact to me, even if the HWS vote got some traction

@nomnom what do you think of vork and red?

Really the only thing that looks like it might not be Kirari. This doesn't really put Red in that much danger but it's drawing unnecessary attention to a slot that is not going to benefit from having attention drawn to it.

[Kirari Momobami]

If Red and Montosh are scum together, why wouldn't Red just jump on the Niko wagon there?

why would he?

[popsofctown]

If Red and Montosh are scum together, why wouldn't Red just jump on the Niko wagon there?

Your question is backwards. If scum!Montosh part of the 5 votes then it's more likely that Nikomislynch is at risk of not truly occurring because a high number of mistaken townies is needed. Since scum!Montosh actually wasn't part of the five votes it is more likely that RedFlavor could keep his hands clean of the mislynch whilst the mislynch still occurs.


Fun tinfoil hat thought: the it's 3 scum + a traitor and they scum are informed that a traitor is in the game, so nobody in the scumteam wanted to vote Niko because they interpreted the scumclaim entrance to the game as a traitor claim.

[popsofctown]

I don't actually think Not Known 15 works as the mod for that though from what I know of him so far would just leave the scumteam in the dark on it.

[LuckyOtter]

If Red and Montosh are scum together, why wouldn't Red just jump on the Niko wagon there?

why would he?

Keep pressure away from Creature