Large Normal 221 - Endgame

[ofrhz]

I am, but that means I'll have to do the legwork of justifying my fears so.....

I don't know what legwork you think would be required of you, but explaining any thought going through your head would help to better sort you at this point.

[Kirari Momobami]

Goddess of the ice cream, how do you feel about Jesus Cain?

[Kublai Khan]

Ugh.. Been reading. I still suspect you all. (prod dodging post as I continue to read.)

[Kirari Momobami]

Who gave Kirari full control of the game state and why are we being coralled?

This is actually a good post!

J/w but why is it a good post when no one seems to want to keep playing this game, I just want to close out the win and it's a lot easier to do that with a vetted townblock of 4 rather than 3

[Not Known 15]

Vote Count 5.2

Not Voting(7)Kirari Momobami,Kublai Khan,LuckyOtter,ofrhz,Vorkuta,Nero Cain,

LuckyOtter(1)DeasVail,

Kirari Momobami(0)

ofrhz(0)

BodhiSmith13

DeasVail(0)

Vorkuta(0)

Nero Cain

Gollum

(0)

Kublai Khan(0)

No Lynch(0)

With 7 alive it is 4 to lynch.

Day 5 ends in (expired on 2019-07-26 20:29:00).

[DeasVail]

Who gave Kirari full control of the game state and why are we being coralled?

This is actually a good post!

J/w but why is it a good post when no one seems to want to keep playing this game, I just want to close out the win and it's a lot easier to do that with a vetted townblock of 4 rather than 3

It feels a bit micro-managey!

Though that also was before this weird silence.

Anyway I've made my vote and I feel pretty comfortable with it? I've had a glance through a couple of times now and Otter just fits imo.

[LuckyOtter]

I'm having a hard time believing Kirari v nom was SvS theater (it's really not impossible but I think there's an easier solution), so at present I'm happy to give her control and keep the game from stalling. And complaining about being corralled but not doing anything to move things in a different direction is fairly suspect imo.


@Kirari I want to say lynch DV over Nero mostly because I don't want to believe I'm wrong about another townread. Partly because it looks like DV is signaling that he's OK with a Vork lynch while adamantly sticking to voting me so that he can look good on a green Vork flip and then gun for my lynch next. There's some earlier play that still doesn't make sense to me as scum but I'll look through it again. And Nero.

[LuckyOtter]

Just looking at vote counts, DV has literally never landed on a major wagon except for mine. I think he's the most obvious candidate for scum trying to stay clean, using his obsession over me to avoid having to take a major stance on anything else in the game. He did land a couple of other votes. Once on Vork and once on pops. But those didn't go anywhere, and could easily have been an attempt to make it look like he's not just plopping a vote on me and avoiding everything else.

[LuckyOtter]

I think my hesitation with DV has been that he's blatantly defended all of the scum, and now that's true of nom as well (assuming he knew they were traitor). I just don't usually expect scum to do such obvious things, but I also didn't expect nom to try to pocket me so hard, so fuck if I know.

Here's a question for everyone. Does anyone see a moment where either HWS or Nom might have signaled their traitor status? Can we reasonably believe that the remaining scum figured out nom was their buddy? I mean, HWS' entrance was so sloppy it caught my attention, but would that be enough?

[LuckyOtter]

Except I think scum might have thought Niko was the traitor, given his entrance. Red and Creature stayed off the wagon, as did DV, but not Nero (and Nero was early on the Niko wagon). Nero was also later on the Creature wagon than I'd expect of scum. So yeah, I think I'm good with DV over Nero.

Vork is still a decent candidate. He missed the Niko wagon, voted early enough on Creature it could have just been distancing. He wasn't voting at the end of D2. Had a useless DV vote all of D3. Plopped a vote on me D4 and left it while town scrambled. And he's been largely absent this game.

So I'm fine with Vork/DV > Nero.

[Kublai Khan]

LuckyOtter - HeWhoSwims/nomnomnom calling him town or lynchbait all game.

Nero Cain - "Random" First vote of HeWhoSwims. nomnomnom never gave a read.

ofrhz - nomnomnom was partial to ofrhz lynch over LuckyOtter lynch.

Vorkuta - Barely mentions Vorkuta.

BodhiSmith13-DeasVail - nomnomnom calls DeasVail town for hesitating on the RedFlavor lynch.

Kirari Momobami - Went from town read to scummy in a sort of self-preservation fashion.

I think Kirari Momobami and ofrhz are off the table for today.

I think a traitor generally tries to signal the groupscum not to kill them, and tries to protect them by calling them town.

So.. I think LuckyOtter is the strongest contender for lynch and failing that, DeasVail for vig-shot. I would strongly reccomend Nero Cain for lynch following that.

[Vorkuta]

VOTE: LuckyOtter

[ofrhz]

Goddess of the ice cream, how do you feel about Jesus Cain?

I think he's town, and with four townreads that I feel pretty good about, this game should be autowin.

Given that, it doesn't matter who we lynch in Otter/DV/Vorkuta, but I kind of want to lynch the last scum today for uhhh style points. I will try to finish rereading nom's ISO tonight.

[ofrhz]

If that townblock is correct, then the Niko and Montosh wagons were all town lolllll

[DeasVail]

LuckyOtter - HeWhoSwims/nomnomnom calling him town or lynchbait all game.

Nero Cain - "Random" First vote of HeWhoSwims. nomnomnom never gave a read.

ofrhz - nomnomnom was partial to ofrhz lynch over LuckyOtter lynch.

Vorkuta - Barely mentions Vorkuta.

BodhiSmith13-DeasVail - nomnomnom calls DeasVail town for hesitating on the RedFlavor lynch.

Kirari Momobami - Went from town read to scummy in a sort of self-preservation fashion.

I think Kirari Momobami and ofrhz are off the table for today.

I think a traitor generally tries to signal the groupscum not to kill them, and tries to protect them by calling them town.

So.. I think LuckyOtter is the strongest contender for lynch and failing that, DeasVail for vig-shot. I would strongly reccomend Nero Cain for lynch following that.

Reading through nom’s ISO, I felt as if they were getting ready to change to a “scumread” on me, but hopefully it doesn’t need to come to that.

[Kublai Khan]

LuckyOtter - HeWhoSwims/nomnomnom calling him town or lynchbait all game.

Nero Cain - "Random" First vote of HeWhoSwims. nomnomnom never gave a read.

ofrhz - nomnomnom was partial to ofrhz lynch over LuckyOtter lynch.

Vorkuta - Barely mentions Vorkuta.

BodhiSmith13-DeasVail - nomnomnom calls DeasVail town for hesitating on the RedFlavor lynch.

Kirari Momobami - Went from town read to scummy in a sort of self-preservation fashion.

I think Kirari Momobami and ofrhz are off the table for today.

I think a traitor generally tries to signal the groupscum not to kill them, and tries to protect them by calling them town.

So.. I think LuckyOtter is the strongest contender for lynch and failing that, DeasVail for vig-shot. I would strongly reccomend Nero Cain for lynch following that.

Reading through nom’s ISO, I felt as if they were getting ready to change to a “scumread” on me, but hopefully it doesn’t need to come to that.

Well...

1) feelings aren't evidence.
2) Why would you iso nomnomnom for how it might make you look scummy if you're town?

[DeasVail]

I read through nom’s ISO after the flip and found their progression on me interesting?

[Kublai Khan]

Yeah, okay. I think you got a scum role and were checking to see if nomnomnom outed you.

VOTE: DeasVail

[DeasVail]

Why wouldn’t I be looking at nom’s ISO after the flip? This just seems bizarre.

[Kublai Khan]

Are you deliberately trying not to understand?

Looking through nomnomnom's ISO to find scum is a very town move.
Looking through nomnomnom's ISO to check to see if you can spin yourself as town is a very scummy move.

I did the first one.
You did the second one.

Therefore, you are scum.

[Kirari Momobami]

If that townblock is correct, then the Niko and Montosh wagons were all town lolllll

I've been certain niko included at most 1 scum for a long time lol

[Kirari Momobami]

I think reading to towncase yourself after being propsed as a vig shot isn't intrinsically scummy

It would help if he was saying he was towncasing himself tho, ya

[ofrhz]

@Kirari you seriously think Otter is town and that I'm scum?

I'm leaning that way rn yeah

If I am traitor and that Otter is town explain to me why I do not hammer him here and buy my groupscum more ground, and instead go to the length of defending Otter and saying he is lynchbait.

I'd love to hear an answer to that one.

psyduck

[ofrhz]

Otter at L-1

Spoiler:

Vote Count 4.3

LuckyOtter(4)DeasVail,popsofctown,Vorkuta,Kirari Momobami,

ofrhz(3)LuckyOtter,nomnomnom,Jesus Louisus,

Not Voting(1)ofrhz,

Jesus Louisus(1)Nero Cain,

Vorkuta(1)Kublai Khan,

Nero Cain(0)

BodhiSmith13

DeasVail(0)

Saudade

Lil Uzi Vert

popsofctown(0)

HeWhoSwims

nomnomnom(0)

Kublai Khan(0)

Kirari Momobami(0)

No Lynch(0)

With 10 alive it is 6 to lynch.

Day 3 will end in (expired on 2019-07-17 18:43:00) or when a lynch has been achieved.

Otter is lynchbait calling it now.

@ LuckyOtter, nomnomnom, Jesus Louisus - Is there anything outside of ofrhz's reaction to popsofctown's RedFlavor catch that signals scum to you guys?

That wasn't really the reason I scumread Of, I think you misread my argument.
I think Of has a "going under the radar" feel to her. A lot of what she says are fencesitting opinions. Hell, even if you go and look back on her "defense" of Red it was not even a proper defense, it was a fencesit, which is why I consider that infinitely more scummy than say, deasvail coming in to defend the slot even though he was extremely wrong.

There is no impact from that slot. She misread that as "not posting and being away for a while" but that's not what I meant by no impact. She posts a bunch of nothing. No strong opinions and a lot of fluff. I think she's scum and trying to redirect the heat somewhere else constantly. She's also signalled going a bunch of places like my slot ("I think nom is scum") without doing anything about it which signals a player that is ready to just sheep and sheep and sheep. I think this is just scum that is trying to extend the game as much as possible.

I'd still like a list from you nom

A readslist?
I don't feel the need to do it but I guess I can do it later.

Vote Count 4.4

LuckyOtter(5)DeasVail,popsofctown,Vorkuta,Kirari Momobami,Nero Cain,

ofrhz(3)LuckyOtter,nomnomnom,Jesus Louisus,

Not Voting(1)ofrhz,

Vorkuta(1)Kublai Khan,

Jesus Louisus(0)

Nero Cain(0)

BodhiSmith13

DeasVail(0)

Saudade

Lil Uzi Vert

popsofctown(0)

HeWhoSwims

nomnomnom(0)

Kublai Khan(0)

Kirari Momobami(0)

No Lynch(0)

With 10 alive it is 6 to lynch.

Day 3 will end in (expired on 2019-07-17 18:43:00) or when a lynch has been achieved.

I just think she's traitor not killing scum.

I was on RF's wagon and you guys insisted to get Montosh lynched without a proper case for it and you blame me?

I wasn't blaming anyone to be on that wagon for what it's worth, just that singling me out for things that happened is weird as fuck.

Kirari is just forcing her read on me really hard with things that, again, are verified to not be true. And it's not the first time she's done it, and she herself admitted that she wanted to get a reaction out of me with what she said even though she clearly isn't that kind of player.

I want her slot lynched at LYLO-1 if it ever comes to it, but now Of is just the better lynch. Otter reeks of lynchbait.

Later in the day

Spoiler:

also ergh, would be sad we end with an Otter lynch because I think he's making really good points about the game, he's pretty much playing the same as in the micro I played with him. Nothing too different.

if we mislynch him he can still use his power role, his power role is VT and we can deadsheep him for being awesome and I think correctly reading Jesus sooner than I was able to for instance which on its own should autowin the game with him being in the vt group in massclaim

if we mislynch ofhrz who has been playing passive enough to have a power role.. although kinda too passive to have a good one I think sometimes... anyway we don't have as many data points in massclaim and the PR doesn't get fired

Meeeeeeeeeeh

End of day

I don't want a no lynch but I'd feel horrible voting otter here just to get there.

VOTE: Kirari

Perhaps this is going to lead somewhere.

Deas feels like a gamble.

I feel way more comfortable voting Of, Kirari. Maybe Jesus. Maybe Vork.

Actually let me perhaps put Vork before jesus before Vork feels like he gives his vote very loosely and perhaps again we're all losing our time screaming at each other (as in the top posters).

But redirecting there feels sooooooo bad.

How is he a gamble?

because I have a slight townread on the guy, so I would feel bad voting there.

@Kirari how do you feel about Vork again? I remember you bringing him up.

I'm basically unable to post again from now until deadline.

Maybe very briefly for a hammer in almost exactly 2 hours but can't guarantee.

Nom's response to pressure has been decent. I still dislike her random townreads on vork and otter because I think as scum she likes to create unexplained and random townreads on people she wants in lylo. Nero thinks her reasoning there is fine and I strongly disagree.

Otter I moved off largely because the traitor thing, and his engagement after the pressure moved off him hasn't been that bad.

If this has been a bunch of tvts then jesus has been doing jack shit to break any of them up.

Vork could easily flip scum but he's also unclaimed so risky to do another claim when we already have 3 vts claimed.

Not sure what we do here tbh

I never said I townread vork for the record. I said "we're not lynching there". But I honestly thought that people would have followed me on Of by now lol.

With that said he's more of a nullslot because of his lack of posts.

Last-minute vote points strongly to Kirari town

I think nom was gearing for a last minute redirection onto Vork before the Jesus flashwagon, and that's probably enough to take Vork out of the pool today.

DV/Otter for the lynch/vig?

[ofrhz]

Shit I meant to spoiler that