Micro 882: Public Cop 9P [Game over!]

[Shoshin]

VOTE: Flubber

[Shoshin]

Town, thankfully. I cannot overstate how relieved I was when I saw my PM, RC. I really don't think I could have handled being scum in this group & setup.

[Shoshin]

This is boring.

[Shoshin]

I was really hoping we could scumhunt together without voting each other first but I guess not.

VOTE: RadiantCowbells

[Shoshin]

You could speed it up by voting Flubb instead of me.

[Shoshin]

What are you talking about? I'm voting you, not Flubb.

[Shoshin]

I really don't enjoy starting games with you this way, yet you keep doing it for no reason. My alignment will be obvious before this day's over, so this is entirely unnecessary.

[Shoshin]

And scum you knows voting me would annoy me, so as far as I'm concerned, this is a scum tell.

I didn't ask Zulfy to vote Flubb. I suggested that he could accomplish his purported goals by doing so. It's sort of a reaction test, how do you not realize this?

[Shoshin]

If RC actually pushes my lynch here, he's scum.

[Shoshin]

You're already making up lies about me, lol. Wow.

[Shoshin]

When I die, lynch RC.

He's 100% scum here.

[Shoshin]

I'm not wasting my time on this.

[Shoshin]

It's just the nature of this site that you'll never get lynched D1 over me.

[Shoshin]

It's scum RC, Oversoul.

[Shoshin]

Why are you sheeping RC, LUV?

[Shoshin]

I'll explain why RC's scum later.

[Shoshin]

Shoshin as town would be arguing with the content of my posts (which by the way I went out of my way to express in a way that she would be able to meaningfully answer if she was town) rather than just handwaving everything as 'yeah it's scum RC' without actually arguing the point.

RC's just inventing narratives about me that aren't true.

After 762, it's unlikely that town RC votes me as quickly as he did because of the interactions we had there. It's also unlikely that town RC misrepresents my posts (e.g. saying that I was supporting Flubb wagon after I voted RC when I was just testing Zulfy's reaction). Town RC never misrepresents me, whereas it's the bread-and-butter of scum RC. Scum RC comes into the game knowing I'm his biggest threat & wants to take me out immediately. Town RC wants to leave me alone & give me some space to scumhunt. Town RC doesn't want me to blow up emotionally because it's mean & unnecessary to sort me (and we've talked about this outside the game before). Scum RC wants me to blow up emotionally, and then tries to push my mislynch because I'm actively trying not to let him manipulate me.

This is scum RC, through and through.

[Shoshin]

Why are you sheeping RC, LUV?

Mainly 18. Very weird reaction to his vote.

It's not if you know our history together. He votes me at the start of games a lot, trying to test me so that he can read me. I recently had a conversation with him about this and told him he didn't need to do this because he could read me in other ways, and that it was hurting me emotionally, and he agreed. He said he votes me at the start because it speeds up the process of reading me, but he agreed it was unnecessary and he wouldn't do it. Yet here he is doing it. So I was just intentionally trying to shut it down by not reacting and calling it out as a boring pattern to keep repeating. He should know better than to push my lynch at this point.

[Shoshin]

I'll explain why RC's scum later.

Dunno it's really easy for you as town to just say I'm trying to eliminate you because I'm scared of you. And I think if you were town actually caught in the crossfire you'd give whatever response immediately came to you rather than sitting and thinking about it. You're buying time.

This is a massive misrepresentation of reality. I hate how effective you are at doing this as scum.

[Shoshin]

Town RC knows to treat me differently than he has this game.

[Shoshin]

RC, what's the reason you voted me?

[Shoshin]

The initial reason?

[Shoshin]

Why'd you misrep my reaction testing of Zulfy as "support for Flubb's wagon"?

[Shoshin]

I'm not reacting emotionally because I've learned from mistakes in the past when dealing with scum you, RC.

[Shoshin]

And you're definitely not going to get me to do it this game.

[Shoshin]

And you telling someone to vote Flubber to speed up the game is absolutely you signalling to everyone in the game that it was a pressure vote from you.

This is a scum claim from RC. He's not trying to read me in good faith.

[Shoshin]

Why'd you misrep my reaction testing of Zulfy as "support for Flubb's wagon"?

You told someone to vote someone

And are trying to argue that you didn't show support for that wagon

Are we done here?

I didn't tell him to vote Flubb.

[Shoshin]

You could speed it up by voting Flubb instead of me.

This isn't me telling Zulfy to vote Flubb. It's me testing the internal logic of Zulfy's behavior.

RC takes this post & portrays it as me supporting a wagon on Flubb. He then uses this characterization of my post to argue that I'm scum. This is precisely how scum RC plays. He distorts the meaning of my posts, and then uses that to push my lynch.

Town RC in almost all cases would realize that this post was a test of Zulfy's behavior, or at least ask me about it, before doubling down on voting me. The fact he's still pushing this misrep is definitive proof he's scum.

When I have time later, I'll bring up meta examples of scum RC doing this to me in multiple games, and examples of how town RC reacts to similar reaction tests from me in other games.

[Shoshin]

You could speed it up by voting Flubb instead of me.

This is close enough that even if you disagree that that's exactly what you were doing you would never make it a hill to die on that that isn't what you were doing if you were arguing in good faith.

It's so annoying to deal with scum you because of posts like this.

[Shoshin]

And I think it's super obvious from your point of view that refusing to unvote flubbernugget alone is going to bait a negative response from me. In 761 you never placed any extraneous votes because I was asking the lobby not to place extraneous votes. How does town you not expect me to react in at least a similar way to this as town?

I don't believe town you would vote me for doing something you disagree with.

[Shoshin]

It's so annoying to deal with scum you because of posts like this.

Because I post obviously true statements that you're engaging me in bad faith?

You know what you're doing here, and I don't need to tell you for you to know.

[Shoshin]

You don't?

How can you possibly think that's not true when you were my top townread in our last game and I told everyone to lynch you if you didn't conform to my lynch order?

That's not what you said. You said to lynch me if I didn't lynch scum by LYLO. There's a difference.

We have lots of disagreements in our town games together, yet rarely vote me for them. You've usually voted me for things that you agreed with me about in the past.

[Shoshin]

And putting someone at L-2 isn't putting Flubb anywhere close to a quickhammer when I'm around to unvote.

[Shoshin]

I like to start games by creating wagons, and Flubb was a juicy wagon waiting to happen. I wasn't going to unvote just because RC asked me to. This isn't scummy, and RC acting like it is should be a clear sign that something is off about him.

[Shoshin]

LUV, are you townreading RC?

[Shoshin]

Oversoul, vote RC instead of yourself please.

[Shoshin]

Okay, RC. Talk to me about Oversoul/Commie?

[Shoshin]

Notably I thought none of your responses would be what they were but here we are. Though I do know Katy significantly better than I know you.

This feels like you're trying to underplay how well you know me for when I flip town.

[Shoshin]

You know Katy better than me but can't read Katy, RC? I'm very confused by this.

[Shoshin]

This feels like you're trying to underplay how well you know me for when I flip town.

But I'm not voting you. So...

You unvoted me in Fire too, despite planning to lynch or kill me ASAP...

[Shoshin]

I feel like someone should be able to back me up that they've seen scum react to big spats in the same way that Oversoul did, by asking questions that don't directly solve the situation?

I've seen town do it too so I dunno this seems like a bad reason to vote Oversoul.

[Shoshin]

Oversoul was throwing in questions in a way that was pretty safe and common for scum to do, perpetual gather info mode without taking a meaningful stance. Not lockscum but definitely +scum.

Katyusha simultaneously said that we were SvT (profiteering off of our spat assuming that you are in fact town but also probably bad if you aren't) then told us to stop yelling at each other. Not only that but the stuff that giggles said was about 'reading me correctly' and idk. On a simple level it makes sense as scum trying to have their cake and eat it too by calling us SvT and trying to look Towny for splitting up a TvT but on a deeper level I just don't think that's what Katy would say to me in that situation.

Notably I thought none of your responses would be what they were but here we are. Though I do know Katy significantly better than I know you.

The context in this post seems to refer to knowing Katy better in mafia specifically, not outside of mafia. Like, what's the point of even saying you know Katy better than me if you're not talking about mafia? This feels like you're trying to leave a paper trail to argue you don't know how to read me after you lynch me.

Why shouldn't I be scumreading you here?

[Shoshin]

I don't feel like you're really answering my concern, RC. Why mention that you know Katy better than me in that post? What's the point of that?

[Shoshin]

Katy's approach to this reminds me of how town GiF approached some interactions in Fire (i.e. saying it was SvT but leaving it alone until later). So I don't really see what's weird about that, RC?

[Shoshin]

Did you read the post where I said that the 'objective reason' (ie that) wasn't something I actually put a great deal of stock in and was just something I was throwing in to sweeten the pot for people who won't take 'RC reads this as that's as an answer?

I don't understand what you're saying here. Please clarify.

[Shoshin]

I'm still confused by your play, RC. But I'm going to take a break & come back later with a clearer head. I'd hate to mislynch you but I also feel like if you're scum I have to push you today or you will just win. This is a very difficult thing to grapple with.

[Shoshin]

What's your read on LUV?

[Shoshin]

I'm town, RC. Why can't you see this already?

[Shoshin]

VOTE: Zulfy

[Shoshin]

Are you talking to me?

[Shoshin]

Why am I obliged to sort you and not the other way around? I just have to move on from all that absolute trash you said about my play

Why am I obliged to play around Katy's way of reading me and not the other way around

Why am I the one who is inevitably going to be held responsible if I lynched you and was wrong when you did the same to me

It's double standards out the ass

Do you not see the problem with you having expectations of something but not giving it in return?

This isn't double standards, RC.

For starters, we're different players. It's a known scum strategy for you to push my lynch ASAP by distorting my meaning to fit your scum narratives. But that isn't what I do as scum, and never have. I just locktown you so that you don't lynch me D1, & then I kill you N1 to not deal with you at LYLO. And I think you would know this.

You're responsible for mislynching me because you've never done it as town, and I don't believe you would, given what you know about me. In contrast, you consistently push my mislynch as scum.

If I were to mislynch you, I think town should hold me responsible. This isn't a double standard.

[Shoshin]

Lynching RC will get me to stop talking to or about RC.

[Shoshin]

Are you really still pushing that Shoshin

Pushing what?

[Shoshin]

To be clear, I have no intention of not talking to or about you, RC.

[Shoshin]

Shoshin what actions must I perform to get you to stop saying anything about or to RC

Lynching RC will get me to stop talking to or about RC.

I don't get how you interpret this as me pushing you, RC. It's very clearly just a response to Zulfy, and one that suggests the opposite of lynching you, since presumably Zulfy isn't going to vote you because I tell him to.

[Shoshin]

You should unvote me then and put the kettle on for tea.

Who's voting you?

[Shoshin]

I don't get how you expect me to see it any other way

I just explained the context. Are you fucking kidding me?

[Shoshin]

I can't tell if this is town you fucking with me or scum you fucking with me.

[Shoshin]

How do you expect that to not be my immediate response?

It was an echo of the earlier post I made to Zulfy. And this time, it was very clearly not ever going to get Zulfy to vote you because he just said he wasn't ever going to vote you. Like, how are you not reading the context of this?

[Shoshin]

RC's voting for Oversoul. I don't think he needs to tell you this?

[Shoshin]

Okay but you expect me to take who you are into account and you know how I feel about stuff like that so...

The post wasn't directed to you, it was to Zulfy, and very obviously not ever going to lead to a vote on you. The intent clearly wasn't to push you, it was to push Zulfy, the guy I'm voting. I feel like you're ignoring the context & obvious motivation here to push a false narrative about me, and it's making it very difficult for me to townread you.

And for the record, I was liking your recent play before this.

[Shoshin]

I don't get why people like Zulfy even play mafia.

[Shoshin]

Lovely game.

[Shoshin]

Yes.

[Shoshin]

75% is super good, RC. More than enough.

I think realistically win rate depends on whether one of us is cop, which I won't say anything about.

[Shoshin]

I think if you're town and cop doesn't waste on you, then we likely win this 95% of time.

[Shoshin]

Small chance for scum always, of course.

[Shoshin]

I mean, it's fairly obvious that cop shouldn't be used on RC if he's town.

The more relevant question is whether to cop RC if he's scum. I'd say no in a different list of players, but with a bunch of RC sheep, it might be necessary to lynch him.

[Shoshin]

UNVOTE:

[Shoshin]

Schadd feels town.

[Shoshin]

403 felt town to me in the abstract.

What reads confuse you?

[Shoshin]

Yeah I agree on Zulfy. He's my top townread atm.

[Shoshin]

I don't like CCC's townread on Oversoul/Dunn but everything else seems fine to me. I thought the way they interacted with us earlier comes from town more often than scum.

I'm concerned about Oversoul/Dunn atm.

[Shoshin]

RC, did you instantly scumread Shoshin or was it a pressure thing that evolved into a scumread?

Why did you avoid answering this, RC?

I don't like this from Oversoul.

[Shoshin]

What changed on Oversoul?

[Shoshin]

I had the opposite trajectory. I didn't see any of the town stuff I was waiting for, and rereading I don't get the sense he was trying to sort us at all. Plus the question in 292.

[Shoshin]

What're your other reads?

[Shoshin]

CCC/Flubb is your guess? Why Flubb?

[Shoshin]

Why CCC?

[Shoshin]

Is this you saying an OS/Dunn scum team because if you think I’d bus in a game with a public cop and RC... well... that seems like a suicidal wish.

I have no idea what this means.

[Shoshin]

I mean as a question sure

But you were leading somewhere with me softballing you that hasn't happened, and "so Shoshin is town now" also feels like you're trying to attack me rather than learn my Shoshin read.

Yeah I doubt this is how you actually think this went down. I made a claim, you said it was false, I needed to figure out why. That's not an attack. How would that be an attack? What the hell? That makes no sense.

It looks bad that you can play very aggressively to get the game going, but once the town seems directionless you stop doing that. It's like you want to play into that kind of a gamestate.

RC taking a breather when he thinks he's found scum (as it seems here) is usually town RC. Not outside his scum range but not scummy.

[Shoshin]

Jesus your posting is so bad

I stopped reading Zulfy's posts, if it makes you feel any better.

[Shoshin]

Schadd/Zulfy are town.

RC's maybe town, depends on something. Not worth lynching today either way.

Scum in Oversoul/Dunn/LUV/CCC/Flubb.

[Shoshin]

I'm skimming your posts, just not stopping to think about them.

[Shoshin]

Oh fuck you two pre inned together. This is like a whole thing for you two fuck.

This kind of post rarely comes from scum.

[Shoshin]

Vote stays over 527

I don't understand why you're voting RC, please explain this.

[Shoshin]

The thing I don't get is why Flubb's still voting you after backing away from meta.

[Shoshin]

I don't get it, Flubb. Why are you still voting RC when he's addressed most of your concerns, he's actively doing stuff, and you just said the rest of the game isn't doing anything? Like, this is a situation where you change your vote. You were a lot more fluid about reads in Mini 2080.

[Shoshin]

I'm wrong, Zulfy?

[Shoshin]

in a game where I had more posts than anyone else and almost certainly more content in those posts than anyone else and probably more content than every other player -combined- you called me scum for not forcing a frenzied pace 100% of the time.
but when I call you scum for being inactive, you start arguing that it objectively can't be a towntell to underperform. even ignoring that that's a massive misrepresentation of my scumread on you.

I disagree you had more content than me.

[Shoshin]

I've been more concise than you but I don't think that means I've given less reasoning, RC.

[Shoshin]

I don't get it, Flubb. Why are you still voting RC when he's addressed most of your concerns, he's actively doing stuff, and you just said the rest of the game isn't doing anything? Like, this is a situation where you change your vote. You were a lot more fluid about reads in Mini 2080.

Gimme a better vote then

Anyone in my potential scum pile is a better vote.

[Shoshin]

VOTE: zulfy

I literally just pointed you to a massive town tell from Zulfy.

[Shoshin]

VOTE: Flubber

[Shoshin]

Maybe I'm underestimating Schadd but his posts feel very towny to me. Carefree in ways that are difficult to fake. Clear thought process. Solid vote on Dunn. What don't you like him from him?

Are you townreading anyone?

[Shoshin]

Oh fuck you two pre inned together. This is like a whole thing for you two fuck.

This kind of post rarely comes from scum.

This?

Pffft

Yea shinsho tbh I don´t see how that´s a towntell.

I think it's rare that scum check the sign up thread for information about players, shows some sort of internal thought process aimed at sorting alignments. I can say empirically this type of almost always comes from town, at least I've never seen it come from scum.

[Shoshin]

Why Oversoul, RC? I've been getting scummy vibes from him.

[Shoshin]

Dunn isn't a solid vote. He's not even someone you'd vote apparently

Dunn's at the top of my suspect list. He's playing exactly like he did in another game where he was scum, making some setup comments, saying nothing about alignments.

[Shoshin]

I think Dunn's just a lazy old fuck

I don't disagree but having just played with both town & scum Dunn, this feels a lot more like Dunn's scum game so far. As lazy as he is, he had a lot more presence as town than this.

[Shoshin]

My scumreads are Zulfy Oversoul Schadd in that order

Zulfy's a scumread for putting your top scumread of Oversoul at L-1? How does this compute?

[Shoshin]

I'm so lost

Sheeping me is always an option!

[Shoshin]

Why is LUV town, Schadd?

[Shoshin]

I have this gnawing gut feeling about something that I don't really want to talk about until tomorrow.

[Shoshin]

raybells assume im town for a bit

I'm going to assume this for you.

[Shoshin]

Do you have any reads, LUV?

[Shoshin]

I'm around.

[Shoshin]

I agree with those reads, any others?

[Shoshin]

you don't trust me?

I didn't say that. I'm waiting to see who you push for a lynch today.

[Shoshin]

are we going back to the not responding to me?

I'm responding to you, just also having a conversation with LUV while I have him here.

[Shoshin]

and if you don't like the answer you're gonna call me scum?

I didn't say that. This question you're asking reminds me of scum you, though.

[Shoshin]

do you still think dunn is scum?

I think there's a chance.

[Shoshin]

shouldn't.

I feel like you ask me the same type of questions as scum. Am I wrong about that?

[Shoshin]

The question feels very manipulative in the way you play scum. Your alignment isn't clear yet, and I think it becomes much clearer based on who you push for a lynch, why you push them, and their flip. This doesn't mean I'm going to scumread you if you push town, but it does mean I'm going to interrogate your reasoning quite closely.

[Shoshin]

Statements like that are what make me think this could be your scum game, RC.

[Shoshin]

Why should I townread you already?

[Shoshin]

Not when you're scum.

[Shoshin]

like on the basis of me being town should my thoughts on your capabilities reading me not be changed by the way that this game has gone?

It's D1, RC. I've never said I have 100% ability to read you immediately based on your first post in a game. There's been games where I called you town after a couple posts, and games where it took me a lot longer. The point is that you play different every game, and I've experienced your scum game enough to know I shouldn't be so quick to townread you. What I'm confident about is that eventually I'll get a correct read on you.

I think there's towny aspects of your play & scummy aspects. Your push on me earlier was awful and completely distorted my language and intent. I think the way you've been pushing certain players & backing off is something you do as both town/scum. I'm not seeing the specific town tells I look for from you yet, so I'm waiting to see who you push at end of day, why you push them, and how they flip.

I don't like that you're questioning this approach or my capabilities because that's what you did in the Open game as scum.

[Shoshin]

I don't want to waste time talking about your alignment today.

[Shoshin]

You townread Dunn?

[Shoshin]

Can you point me to the posts from Schadd that ping you?

[Shoshin]

Which posts, RC?

[Shoshin]

I guess he could be scum. I don't like his complaints about the game, 872 in particular.

[Shoshin]

I think scum complain about games a lot more than town, especially when it's a player who prefers town.

[Shoshin]

It's actually a pretty big scum tell.

[Shoshin]

I guess he could be scum. I don't like his complaints about the game, 872 in particular.

idk what youre referring to exactly. there are several people in this game that i am very close with and/or have played with a lot such that its hard for me to do most normal scumhunting things - im finding it difficult to think of "is this a wolfy / towny thing" rather than "ohh hohh how does this fit with my EXPECTATION of the person" and "ohh hhh what if i am WRONG"

I feel like townies tend to doubly enjoy games with players they're "close" whereas it's the opposite for scum, you doubly hate the experience.

[Shoshin]

Maybe I'm misreading 872.

[Shoshin]

872 feels like you were saying you weren't enjoying the game. It's the general sense I got from reading all your posts together.

[Shoshin]

im not like not enjoying the game but

Is this what someone who likes the game says?

[Shoshin]

do you scumread me for this as well because this should apply to me...? i feel like at least half my posting is bitching abt something

i dont really strongly prefer either alignment though unlike schadd

This feels towny to me.

[Shoshin]

VOTE: Oversoul

[Shoshin]

LUV's locktown.

[Shoshin]

I think CCC looks pretty town in retrospect as well.

[Shoshin]

after rc's posts probably not so much but it's a possibility that a scum partner would at least want to give them time to like fakeclaim cop at the last minute or something

This is correct, I hammered Oversoul specifically to prevent him from claiming cop, in case that wasn't obvious. In a recent game where I was cop, I was in the unfortunate position of having to out when scum fake claimed to prevent being lynched, so I'm pretty sensitive to this sort of thing.

[Shoshin]

But who's scum?

I dunno, I'm rereading with scum Oversoul & town RC in mind. I'm also trying to figure who in this list kills RC instead of trying to hit cop.

What're your current reads?

[Shoshin]

I missed his VT claim, then.

[Shoshin]

VOTE: Zulfy

[Shoshin]

Because you thought RC was 100% cleared at end of day, and because you include yourself in pool of potential scum.

[Shoshin]

RC wasn't locktown.

Zulfy thinking he was is a massive scum-tell.

[Shoshin]

Where'd Oversoul claim VT? I didn't see that.

[Shoshin]

I had already decided to vote him at that point.

[Shoshin]

This type of thing is not scummy for me, I skim a lot in all my games.

[Shoshin]

I didn't even see RC's vote until just now.

[Shoshin]

Zulfy's distorting my words.

I never said anything about "muffling" Zulfy.

I never said it was "inconceivable" to think RC was locktown. I said it's more likely to come from scum.

I never said I didn't read RC's posts. I said I skimmed stuff & didn't see Oversoul's claim or RC's vote. I decided to vote Oversoul much earlier than these posts. This isn't scummy, it's just how I play, especially when I'm low on time.

[Shoshin]

More votes on Zulfy please!

[Shoshin]

That wasn't a lie.

But even if it were, lying isn't scummy.

[Shoshin]

Why are you insisting it's a lie, Zulfy?

[Shoshin]

then "scumreading" me with reasons that she completely walks back

What reasons did I "walk back"? And why are you saying I'm still scumreading you for these reasons that I supposedly walked back?

[Shoshin]

You calling it a lie doesn't make it so.

I thought it was a hammer. Me being wrong doesn't make this a lie. Why do you think being wrong about this makes it a lie?

[Shoshin]

See post 1311.

This is your post, not mine. I've seen no indication of me walking back my reasons for scumreading you. Why are you trying to characterize my play in this incorrect manner?

[Shoshin]

Zulfy, I lie in almost all my town games. Why are you calling me scum for lying when lying is a town-tell for me?

[Shoshin]

U prolly lie in all ur town games (ughhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh btw) so u can lie in ur scum games like u did here.

I don't lie as scum. I just lurk until I get lynched. Or get replaced. I hate being scum.

[Shoshin]

Page 49 (not 52 whoops), when you would have voted it would have been the latest page. In what universe do you scroll down to the reply box knowing that Oversoul is L1 but NOT that he's claimed VT? It would be incompetence on a scale hitherto unheard of.

I get called incompetent like this all the time. I really could care less what you think at this point.

[Shoshin]

You're saying only someone who sucks worse than you could imagine could play the way I do, Zulfy. That's an insult, however you want to spin it. I get these insults every game so I'm used to it at this point.

You've effectively equated "this person is bad at mafia" to "this person is scum." Very typical of how scum push mislynches.

[Shoshin]

Ma'am if you start trust telling you better also quote ur PM and argue that you did not quote it.

Let me just nip this in the bud. I'm not trust telling & never have. I've played out all my scum games to the best of my ability & always will. I just suck at scum to a degree that makes me obvscum. To be clear, I don't have a 0% win rate as scum because I've intentionally lost.

[Shoshin]

U prolly lie in all ur town games (ughhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh btw) so u can lie in ur scum games like u did here.

It's amazing how you do everything you can to distort the evidence to fit your narrative that I'm scum.

[Shoshin]

I thought Oversoul was scum. I saw him put to L-1. I voted him.

[Shoshin]

It's amazing how you do everything you can to distort the evidence to fit your narrative that I'm scum.

What am I distorting here tho? I don't know ur meta. First time I've even seen this name. Member how I thought you were "Katy"?

Whenever I present you with exculpatory evidence, you immediately look for ways to interpret it as scummy or unethical. You've been engaging this pattern the entirety of D2.

[Shoshin]

Why Flubber?

[Shoshin]

Zulfy keeps calling me scummy for stuff that isn't scummy...

[Shoshin]

Why is anyone townreading Zulfy?

[Shoshin]

i would like to hear from Shoshin about.... the concerns.

What are your concerns?

[Shoshin]

you said you hammered oversoul to prevent them from fakeclaiming, but you also said that you didnt know you were hammering them when you did so, and

i dont see motivation to willfully lie for either of those things

So what's your concern?

[Shoshin]

This feels like you're letting Zulfy distort what I said, Schadd.

I think I've been pretty clear about the fact that I thought I was hammering Oversoul when I hammered on D1.

Then Zulfy said something on D2 that made me think I didn't hammer Oversoul, so for a moment I thought I had made a mistake on D1 in thinking I hammered. It turns out the mistake was on D2 when Zulfy confused me. It's just a misunderstanding that Zulfy's been trying to spin as scummy.

[Shoshin]

I guess I saw RC's vote but forgot about it.

[Shoshin]

I tend to play a lot at night while high or drunk so my memory gets very selective sometimes.

[Shoshin]

It doesn't make sense to me why Zulfy is harping on this & saying I'm lying when I'm not. And he's saying I'm scummy for lying without even asking whether this is a scummy lie or a towny lie or a neutral lie.

As someone who lies a lot as town, I find this approach very scummy. It's always the scum who push me when I lie because it's an easy thing to grab onto. And when I tell Zulfy that I lie in all my town games, instead of taking that as exculpatory meta evidence, he distorts even this to fit his scum narrative: he says I lie as town so that I can lie in my scum games like this one.

I don't feel like he's sorting me in good faith. Why are you townreading him, Schadd?

[Shoshin]

U prolly lie in all ur town games (ughhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh btw) so u can lie in ur scum games like u did here.

I decided to stop engaging Zulfy after this.

Town don't distort meta evidence like this. It's the strongest scum tell in this game by a lot.

[Shoshin]

Keep in mind she refuses, simply refuses to finish the interaction and labels me insisting on her doing so scummy.

This is another distortion of reality.

I never said Zulfy is scummy for "insisting that I finish the interaction." Don't know where that even comes from.

This is why I get confused talking to Zulfy. It's non-stop distortions of what I said & of the gamestate itself.

[Shoshin]

Also you decided to stop engaging cuz you have no alternative

More distortions from Zulfy.

This is obviously untrue.

[Shoshin]

rc locked him town like for kind of a long time as well. he's just like, a high poster and has done a lot of realtiming and follow throughing and stuff

I don't think RC locked him as town, but also RC locks scum as town more often than people realize. You modded that game where NSG was scum & RC locked her town from D1, only reason we didn't lynch her all game.

[Shoshin]

I hope it's Flubber.

[Shoshin]

uh, like, i see what his argument was and, like, the stuff he's claiming / feeling make sense to me? like "scummy or towny lie" seems irrelevant here, it looked like you got basic details wrong about your motivation wrong which is a thing to look for from scum

I disagree about this. I didn't get my motivation wrong at any point. Zulfy is the one who keeps saying that but it's not true.

[Shoshin]

RC said u were scum too lol

I'm pretty sure I was RC's strongest townread by end of D1. And he has a lot of experience with me, enough to read me accurately at this point. He's experienced both my town and scum game multiple times.

[Shoshin]

1402 is asking where I saw Oversoul put to L-1.

The answer is, somewhere.

I don't get what Zulfy is trying to get at. Even if I didn't think Oversoul was at L-1, it's not scummy. I either put Oversoul to L-1, or I hammered him. Neither is scummy.

[Shoshin]

um i think its town indicative and i dont have a reason to be sring him to begin with. i don't remember modding a game where nsg endgamed as scum.

Oh wait, you're right. Different mod, I'm dumb.

I forget which games you mod, sorry.

[Shoshin]

since when do i scumread shoshin

townreads on {rc, zulfy, shoshin}
lower tier townread on {dunnie boi}

everyone else is not a townread

I didn't get my motivation wrong.

I had forgot it was RC who put him at L-1 but that's something else entirely, just my memory sucking. It's also not the kind of mistake that has anything to do with alignment.

[Shoshin]

Oh yeah, about RC. He didn't scumread me, contrary to Zulfy's claim.

[Shoshin]

VOTE: Zulfy

[Shoshin]

Why'd you vote Flubber, Dunn?

[Shoshin]

I need to find some time to reread this. Won't be today.

[Shoshin]

VOTE: Schadd

[Shoshin]

I'm sorry, too.

[Shoshin]

Thanks Ank! My first scum win. I was very, very lucky.