In post 199, Gamma Emerald wrote:That was poorly stated. Do you have it on record that scum do it more? Could you provide examples if that's the case?
no, i don't have hard data indicating that scum do it at a rate more often than town. (the only scumtell i have hard data for relates to wagon formations.)
consider it as a part of the larger scumtell of "pretending to contribute" or "lackluster scumhunting".
do you often ask for hard data proving that scumtells are valid, or do you simply disagree with my application of it? (also, i hope you realize that me simply linking games in which scum said "what are your reads" wouldn't really prove anything)
In post 11, Alchemist21 wrote:I don’t even know if throwing around lynch votes will be useful until the Coalition is decided on since we can’t lynch before the Coalition is decided.
i think it's still good go throw around votes to show who we suspect and intend to lynch after we decide on the coalition, it'll be useful later on as well when we look back at wagons and potential bussing
also we can still pressure scum with votes which is always good
In post 200, RC most awesomest wrote:do you often ask for hard data proving that scumtells are valid, or do you simply disagree with my application of it? (also, i hope you realize that me simply linking games in which scum said "what are your reads" wouldn't really prove anything)
It's just a one off, because I felt like you were asserting that specific action was scummy. The questioning was because I think it's perfectly possible it comes from either alignment so I wanted data on the trend. As for the actual point it goes into, I disagree that Spangled is pretending to contribute, for why see my wall post I made earlier. I don't think what he's posted is pretend contribution.
<Embrace The Void>
“A flipped coin doesn't always land heads or tails. Sometimes it may never land at all...”
HEAL: RC most awesomest
I think they're town, but moreover I'm trying to fast track a majority coalition because of the deadline, and this is the most common coalition choice I see rn
<Embrace The Void>
“A flipped coin doesn't always land heads or tails. Sometimes it may never land at all...”
In post 123, RadiantCowbells wrote:Oversoul was throwing in questions in a way that was pretty safe and common for scum to do, perpetual gather info mode without taking a meaningful stance. Not lockscum but definitely +scum.
In post 125, Commie Catgirl Coalition wrote:oversoul's questions make perfect sense from a town perspective and i'm struggling to see why you think theyre specifically "safe" questions scum would ask.
.
At any time you may confer with them here.
As a member of the Mafia, you have access to a factional nightkill - at night one of you may kill another player.
You win when the mafia constitutes a majority or nothing can prevent that.
The game thread is here. After reading this, please confirm by responding with your role or by posting in your private thread.
///////
Night 1 begins now and ends in (expired on 2019-08-11 09:21:59). Should all living players agree, I will accelerate the night.
like i know the kind of reads i have that are usually correct but end up getting shit on by towns because they don't have the skillset to see what i see and this is squarely in that alley
you'll forgive me if your very shallow townread on him doesn't exactly faze me or make me want to change my mind
In post 205, Gamma Emerald wrote:As for the actual point it goes into, I disagree that Spangled is pretending to contribute, for why see my wall post I made earlier. I don't think what he's posted is pretend contribution.
if that's all you're going to say you don't leave me a lot of room except to say that i think your intuition in 169 for what's genuine, what you think scum would do, and what actions show town motivation are all wildly off. i would wonder who you scumread this game if you still find spangled's posts to show a town desire to solve upon a close reading. (i would imagine it would be people with less content, but that's just my own speculation)
regardless, if you want to fast track a coalition, i don't think keeping spangled in it is much of a step in the right direction. you don't have to agree with us on the read, but for now i think it's fair to say that from an objective standpoint keeping him in your coalition will only serve to delay a majority consensus.
HURT: Spangled
I still think he's town but I don't feel so strongly about it that I'd keep him in my coalition when he's probably not going to be in the majority one
<Embrace The Void>
“A flipped coin doesn't always land heads or tails. Sometimes it may never land at all...”
this game is 100% a loss if we don't win d1. there is no chance that town doesn't end up turning on us if the coalition fails. we can't afford to have to use precious hours arguing
In post 189, RC most awesomest wrote:if you're ignoring me in forming a read on our slot then what you're doing is focusing on things you find outrageous or things you disagree with and not actually looking for scummy play, and you should take a moment to do some self-reflection on that.
In post 132, Alchemist21 wrote: [...]
RC reads was talked about earlier and it’s based on NSG actually posting.
I was hoping you'd have a bit more to substantiate the read at this point, as scum!nsg could very easily post more. What's your read on the RC head*?
*Note - I find it hard to read hydras. Is it better practice to split the read by head and consolidate later, or approach the read in a holistic manner from the outset?
12 seemed like a typical TownRC post to me but not definitely.
Most people go by reading individual heads if they knows one of the heads well.
since you seem to have experience with town!RC, what about 145 and 149?
In post 193, RC most awesomest wrote:
RC scumread spangled before i did, but i've come around to see where he's coming from. take a look at spangled's pop-in here:
In post 131, EspressoPatronum wrote:@Alchemist, you haven't updated your coalition in a while. Is it still reflective of your current stance?
If yes, can you tell me a bit more about your NC and RCMA reads?
In post 130, EspressoPatronum wrote:I'm liking Hectic's content and reads, but the difference in his playstyle is really nagging at me. It's almost like he's too good to be true now that he's playing normally, and I'm seeing that as a possible scum tactic.
@anyone else who has played with him, what are your thoughts on his behaviour? Do you think the change in his posting style is AI? Why/why not?
He has played every game differently, as far as I’m aware, from my occasional readings of newbie games, each with a different gimmick. It is true that he lacks a gimmick this time... but I don’t know if he’s been scum before or anything about that so...
In post 132, Alchemist21 wrote:If I did change it I would just take out NC and Gamma. I’d rather wait until having names to replace them with before taking them out though.
RC reads was talked about earlier and it’s based on NSG actually posting.
Whoops, ignore that quote up the top.
In post 132, Alchemist21 wrote:If I did change it I would just take out NC and Gamma. I’d rather wait until having names to replace them with before taking them out though.
RC reads was talked about earlier and it’s based on NSG actually posting.
Why would you take out NC and Gamma? Is it just the lack of a townread, or is there a more substantial reason?
In post 132, Alchemist21 wrote:If I did change it I would just take out NC and Gamma. I’d rather wait until having names to replace them with before taking them out though.
RC reads was talked about earlier and it’s based on NSG actually posting.
Whoops, ignore that quote up the top.
In post 132, Alchemist21 wrote:If I did change it I would just take out NC and Gamma. I’d rather wait until having names to replace them with before taking them out though.
RC reads was talked about earlier and it’s based on NSG actually posting.
Why would you take out NC and Gamma? Is it just the lack of a townread, or is there a more substantial reason?
Oh wow I did it again
i don't think there's any actual sorting or even attempt at game-solving in those posts (no offense to spangled). rather, it seems to me like going through posts and just finding things to respond to, perhaps one of the most consistently scum-indicative tells that i've ever encountered. if you believe that our slot has few reads, we should still look like a library compared to spangled's ISO.
here's another thing about me (in addition to the hanging back) that i mentioned in the last coalition setup i completed – i dislike it when people ask the generic question "what are your reads" without any seeming deeper purpose. and when you actually look through spangled's iso – i mean
actually really read it
– i noticed that there really wasn't much of any solving that i could see beyond that generic question, and i also noticed how often it came up.
Okay, a few things to talk about here... I can kinda see where you’re coming from as regarding me finding things to respond to, but not responding to them very meaningfully.
Reading my ISO, I can see that. I tend not be very good at forming reads or putting them out there, but I like to think that I do, eventually, find scum with them. I do think I’ve occasionally expressed stances on certain topics... but if you’d like what I think I have at least hinted at summarised, here are some things I can remember off the top of my head:
I reckon RCMA’s town; that meta seems very conclusive as regards, at the very least, nsg’s alignment
I feel like EP is town; so far his reads have seemed genuine and fairly well thought out.
Gamma, actually, doesn’t really feel the same to me as the last game we were in; tonally they actually feel a bit weirdly different from how I remember them.
Hectic being unhectic — I don’t feel like it’s conclusive, but I feel like it’s a kind of point that would be a clincher in a much larger case against them. Their answer to that question about their un-hectic-ness felt a little off to me, but I really don’t know; I don’t have any past experiences of their tone and so I’m hesitant to commit to that.
As as regard that rather generic question I keep on asking — I would normally really not ask it that much, but I keep getting very non-commital or meaningless answers to those questions — Clemency’s in 121 is the only one I can remember, but I’m pretty sure there have been other answers that haven’t let me see get any kind of glimpse into the game states or any associatives etc., like I’ve used them fairly well in some newbie games.
Something went weird there; sorry, but I think y’all will figure it out.
As regards me being ‘incredibly easy to townread’...
I have, before now, kind of instinctively recoiled from people who self-meta, but I think I see the usefulness of it now, so I’m going to try and use it.
My scum game sucks. Very, very badly. I’ve had two scumgames — first one, I was enormously passive all of D1, and in D2 MyLo (because of a modkill) counterclaimed JK against a cop who had a red on my partner. We lost. Now this was about six months ago, but it’s still valuable meta.
Second game — most recent game — I immediately drew attention to myself with some wolfy RQS questions, and then reacted extremely defensively, digging myself into a hole for the rest of D1. I ended up lynched, and my partner was lynched D2, largely on the strength of my interactions with them, and the fact that there were some very clever masons.
For me to jump so easily from that extraordinary defensiveness to being ‘incredibly easy to townread’... I really can’t see that happening.
First one: viewtopic.php?f=50&t=7959
Second one: viewtopic.php?f=11&t=80577
In post 215, RC most awesomest wrote:this game is 100% a loss if we don't win d1. there is no chance that town doesn't end up turning on us if the coalition fails. we can't afford to have to use precious hours arguing
You are the widest townread right now, mostly for meta that is pretty convincing, but not for nothing besides that. We’re not going to lose if we don’t win D1... plenty of towns win 9p mountainous, and we have extra info.
Or will have extra info even if our coalition isn’t right, whoops.
Also, Clemency, your remark about freezing up as scum seems remarkably similar to what you’re doing here... anything you’d like to give a perspective on, any reads, etc?
Now I think I’m just spamming out thoughts, but I felt the need to respond to that question about what a UTR was because it was being asked because of somewhere I had used the acronym. I responded to it without fully reading all of what had occurred while I’d been offline, so I didn’t see others’ responses to it. I really don’t see why you bring it up, Hectic.
