Open 768: C9++ [GAME OVER]

[Wooper]

LOL

[Wooper]

no chance, friend.

[Wooper]

Deadline: 6 days, 21 hours, 7 minutes

still no wicked towncase
which makes me think no one is actually townreading him

if you are town: please get your vote on wicked immediately or explain why you think he is town. if you think he is bussing me fine we can talk about that on a later phase; help me bus back.

thanks

[Wooper]

can I suggest going back in time and getting a less problematic wincon

[Wooper]

I'm quite a lot more interested in sorting wicked than sorting volpe today :c

[Wooper]

i'm not really confident i can get volpe right rn. he's POE town but (i think the dilemma you're seeing) has a fairly wide scumrange and played disproportionately hard today compared to the rest of the game

[Wooper]

wicked played harder earlier, and has flopped this phase after claiming a guilty - i think he's easier to sort anyway :/

[Wooper]

i mean i can't read his mind but
why wouldn't it be...

[Wooper]

i don't know how to explain why he's fakeclaimed cop guys. you're placing a really weird onus on me to be psychic.

a POE with cop!volpe and cleared!wooper is extremely restrictive if {wicked,ddl,x} is the scumteam - who's the mislynch if he doesn't disrupt cohesion? nor?

[Wooper]

could be a matter of scum power roles? could be a matter of wicked being more willing to take on the audacious task? could be for more ridiculousness?

you're kinda asking me to answer an impossible question here; there's no clear trajectory, just an agenda.

[Wooper]

no apparently i also need to be able to hack the scum pt and lay out their exact plan too lol

[Wooper]

work with a scumteam of {wicked,ddl,mena} for a moment.

skitter30
Wooper
Menalque
Egix96
NorwegianboyEE
Chemist1422
Wickedestjr
DrDolittle

coming into today your poe is probably {wooper, egix}, give or take some
egix is promptly confirmed as doc
i'm promptly inno'd by someone who is indeed very difficult to lynch

scum literally lose if they let those claims stand

[Wooper]

PSA: if volpe scum, wooper is definitely scum, but if wooper scum, volpe could be town (but it will be perfectly revealed). So lynching wooper strictly dominates volpe.

this is so incorrect it's not even funny

wicked and volpe are necessarily opposite alignments

if volpe is scum and wicked is scum, they have claimed opposing results on me and almost guaranteed a lynch between them - it is very unlikely i'm also scum.

if volpe is scum and wicked is town, volpe/me are scum together necessarily.

if volpe is town and wicked is scum, there is no +ev in wicked ccing that claim.

you solve this by working out wicked's alignment, not by policy lynching me based on a solve which doesn't even consider wicked's alignment LOL

[Wooper]

https://www.mafiacolosseum.com/threads/ ... sotis.188/

updated scum meta offsite if anyone is interested
ngl i've been craving a nice scum rand for a whileee

[Wooper]

how is what I'm saying wrong? You just discussed a completely irrelevant case by muting a situation by saying "there is no +ev", when I'm saying its a slim but possible situation. Like pops last game told his partner to just claim mafia in thread. That's not plus ev but he still won.

Is there a world where volpe is scum but you are not? No! because that means wicked is town, and wicked got a guilty

i mean your play the last couple of pages has v literally ignored wicked, who is a very pivotal part of this situation mechanically, so...? how else are you expecting me to reply o.0

[Wooper]

volpe wicked both scum would be so wild

this is like. fmpov transparently more likely than {wicked,me} scumteam

[Wooper]

Me
TOWN
teacher

this is a point in wicked's favor imo
like he'd have to have been planning this since yesterday, saw the real cop claim, and then claim anyways

i don't think pre-planning this and crumbing so late is all that town indicative. :{
vs. chem's instaclaim

[Wooper]

i flip town - if the game doesn't end please plan for that.

pedit: that's such a volpepost

[Wooper]

again: don't think scum!wicked has another choice.

[Wooper]

i seriously don't see any reason not to drop a crumb with that level of vagueness

[Wooper]

he's also like
laid his trap
and is waiting

idk if it's 100% because i'm in the middle of it but the agenda looks really obvious

[Wooper]

also i kinda wnat to trust jingle on wicked

.... but not on me?

[Wooper]

*shrug*
his reads stunk in that case; do what you need

does it help any that nor was nsg's strongest townread along w egix?

[Wooper]

i think nsg's strong townreads are very reliable, and it's been a long ass time since nsg got town!me correct, but i digress

[Wooper]

he promptly turns on me and forces me to out the gambit; he's already explained assuming it was a reaction test, then getting shitty when he realised i was going to push it.

[Wooper]

he's also like
laid his trap
and is waiting

idk if it's 100% because i'm in the middle of it but the agenda looks really obvious

You have this habit of saying things about me that sound bad on the surface but that don't actually have any justification...

AGAINNNNNNNNNNNNN

[Wooper]

I'm gonna let myself have a bit more fun before commenting for real what I think of that claim

Spicy in mafia games is always welcome :')

We should vote teacher btw

if it's any comfort? this makes me feel better about his claim; it looked like he was actually trying to bait my claim and in hindsight made a lot of sense to me as TMI

[Wooper]

it's not - it's a false dichotomy no one is listening to

[Wooper]

sigh

[Wooper]

you're not town

can you stop pretending and just vote me so we can laugh at whoever *is* town and got played postgame

[Wooper]

what if

he was trying to not look like a cop

:0 0: :0

[Wooper]

you're not town

can you stop pretending and just vote me so we can laugh at whoever *is* town and got played postgame

i'm getting kinda close to this, ya

SCUMSLIP

[Wooper]

I feel more right every time wicked posts o.0

[Wooper]

i mean .. you know what i meant so when you post things like this i don't have ~warm and fuzzy feelings~

i'm getting kinda tired so i'm going to finish tom

i think you know that's my sense of humour to a t.

[Wooper]

Still think volpe's reaction to my claim was TMIey and felt like it most likely came from a cop

[Wooper]

Wooper i just think all your play around the “ would wicked do that” questions has been scummy

Like, you’ve been saying it’s not fair for to ask you but I think it’s perfectly fair to ask what you think the most likely explanation for it is? And instead you’ve been trying to get people to think about all the possible ways in which it

could

be fake without actually giving reasons for why any of those is

likely

like if you are town you should probably check the definition of uninformed. luckily in this case I'm p sure you're just scum so please feel free to continue to shade

[Wooper]

only real consideration is that I'm town. I think I'm a p easy read aorn and I think wicked is pushing an agenda the size of a small planet up a very small hill. but I also don't care a wholeeeeeee lot this phase, so :shrug: do your worst. worst case scenario it's one for the textbooks on how to spot scum pushing bullshit at endgame.

having said that town!nor and scum!wicked are like. kinda the only reads I'm attached to here. also given how consistently bad flipped town scumreads have been this has been a solid stomp.

[Wooper]

wp scum, someone should nom this for goodfellas. I've never enjoyed xylo of a game as little as I enjoyed xylo here.

literally in awe that DDL and skitter were town

[Wooper]

little bit angleshooty but volpe referencing his replace out itt and then NOPEing out because he didn't get his way was like intensely wolfy and killed what was left of my wim. I didn't think actively pushing a volpe/wicked scumteam would have really changed anyone's mind.

[Wooper]

Thanks for your input. Town lost because scum played a very good gambit, and nobody was paying attention to the zepellin-sized shadow of scum agenda looming over our good town.

but thanks for your input!

[Wooper]

fair bit then
lynching his inno
rather than lynching into a mech dichotomy that had 1-2 scum in it
was the stupid thing they did

[Wooper]

Nor - do you think you could have seen wicked/volpe?

[Wooper]

The polarising gambit did a v v good job of dividing out the towncore.

[Wooper]

It's ok; I felt like a lot of the work you did in the last phase was narrative pushing to steer the lynch onto me and off wicked/volpeslot so I'm not sure I had the capacity to engage in better faith by the end

I did mean what I said tho, I think this is a good one for the textbooks wrt spotting scum agenda. Scumteam makes the most sense given wicked cc'd at all. Wicked was kinda obviously scum in like all of his d3 posts, and that still didn't clear volpe nor confirm my alignment. trying to not be salty: I think doing this backwards by trying to find 1 town cop and one mafia in {wicked,volpe} was p much the main part where you went wrong imo because it lead to inevitable confirmation bias.

compared to e.g. ddl who basically just ate the entire scum gambit with a side of fries you actually played this fairly well

I know I have a kind of unique position here bc I had a literal guilty on wicked and basically lost my townreads on everyone except Nor because there was v v obviously gambiting going on...so not saying I played this well either. I was privileged to by gamestate.


pedit: @skit

[Wooper]

also if anyone scumread Nor on d3 they should feel very very silly!! very silly!!

volpe I hate that this game makes me love you even more. >:/

[Wooper]

tbf my argument for cop!you was "maybe he was doing X?" not "he was clearly a cop and town because X" - it did take some brainstretching but it was more likely than noms sending the wrong result to wicked and not owning up to the mod error lmao

[Wooper]

And it also threw me off that you kept hard insisting volpe was town, which was ... not obvious to me either

hmm fair. fmpov proving that wicked was scum was like the d3 plan of attack because he was confirmed to me - I wasn't kinda... finding your points against volpe super convincing particularly vs. the last 20-30 posts of wicked's iso

So you had one piece of the puzzle but i kinda had to start from scratch, i feel like, and consider all angles

exactly, yeah
I think my frustration ingame came from my like long legacy of respecting and being in awe of your reads particularly lategame; I know that you weren't going in with a specified agenda with your sorting but it did feel like you were leaning into the simpler solution of t!wicked / w!volpe and fmpov even if volpe was lynched d3 I was probably lynched d4 :<

[Wooper]

And it also threw me off that you kept hard insisting volpe was town,

@Wooper was just biased towards town!Volpe because Volpe was claiming him to be town. He got played like all of us.

unfortunately yeah. a lot came down to probabilities, like

ddl was de facto scum this game
mena was scummy and should have been sortable but was lower priority
wicked was guiltied to me
I was super paranoid about skitter because there was annoying afoot and it felt like she was confbiased towards town!wicked (this would have been awesome if the game didn't promptly end)

Egix and you were the only towny ones and volpe in d3 looked less wolfy than ddl/mena/wicked & maybe skitter

pedit: oof chem

[Wooper]

i'm kinda tentatively picturing you as a pirate, wicked as dean learner (but under the mask is maurice moss), volpe as a mahou shoujo and chemist as a spooky ghost but we can work on these

pedit: ... EVEN BETTER

[Wooper]

right back atcha nor, you were very fun.

[Wooper]

a50 is always a good time.

[Wooper]

lmao wicked <3

[Wooper]

Aha see I'm actually very capable, I just have an incredible talent for hiding it!

And thank you <3