Team Mafia 2020: Open Setup - Game Over

[Pine]

So my neighbor is Town. Good stuff!

[Pine]

But like titus explain to me the value of outting all the neighborhoods

She’s saying that the Doc is more valuable as an Innocent Child than as a Doctor. I’m not sure I agree, but there’s merit in the suggestion

[Pine]

I think it’s a solid D2/D3 strategy, not an RVS one

[Pine]

An IC is outed by definition. I don’t know what you’re talking about

[Pine]

Okay, let's look at it a different way I suppose.

12 of us have neighborhoods, so 6 in total. 3 scum, 1 in each neighborhood. 3/6.

There's 50/50 chance right now your partner has of being scum. Act on it IN YOUR NEIGHBORHOOD guys. Use the mechanic to help solve.

Don't just make it so scum can kill the Doctor free of charge, because that kill wouldn't even give us info from the hoods and the possibility of a scum killing their neighbor.

Exactly - that’s why revealing the IC is a D2/D3 strategy. I regret even mentioning that I had a neighbor, that was careless

[Pine]

Indecisive Doc is a weak role, and Phone Operator is almost meaningless except to catch obvious lies...which is also pretty meaningless.

A D2 or D3 Innocent Child, however, is very strong.

[Pine]

Well, I’ve already outed myself as a Neighbor, which was a careless mistake, but I won’t be outing my Neighbor. I suggest we table it until at least D2, and at the start of each day ask ourselves, “Do we need an IC today?”

PE: We don’t get to choose who the IC is. It’s the Doctor.

[Pine]

It’s an open setup ffs

Read the setup

[Pine]

The Doc is revealed because they’re the only one without a Neighbor. All scum are Neighbors. The Doc is functionally an IC

[Pine]

The Doc is functionally an IC

I mean, so is the phone operator, so long as they claim before LYLO.

No it isn’t. The Phone Operator can be fake!counterclaimed, the Doc can’t. Any Mafia Neighbor who tries will have their Town Neighbor blow up the claim, and then we have TWO ICs

[Pine]

I'm interested in why Pine thinks Titus's plan has any merit whatsoever when S_S literally presented a better plan

Because nuance, OkaPoka. S_S’s plan is where we should start, until we decide we want to blow the setup open.

Titus’s plan is bad for D1, but has merit later in the game

[Pine]

The Phone Operator can be fake!counterclaimed, the Doc can’t.

That's why I said before LYLO, so we have the opportunity to lynch both if there is a counterclaim.

There are few situations where a counterclaim would be optimal, especially since the phone operator has the possibility to confirm themself via their results.

I think you and I are more or less on the same page, just using different words?

[Pine]

I'm interested in why Pine thinks Titus's plan has any merit whatsoever when S_S literally presented a better plan

Because nuance, OkaPoka. S_S’s plan is where we should start, until we decide we want to blow the setup open.

Titus’s plan is bad for D1, but has merit later in the game

okay but claiming d2/d3 although still suboptimal is not titus's plan

like i feel like your are giving credit to titus when she deserves none

I think you’re ascribing malice to what is more likely carelessness. I’m not giving any credit to Titus beyond pointing out that the Doc could be used as an IC, an important note that I didn’t even think of until she suggested it

[Pine]

Oh snap.

Now I get it. There’s only one Phone Operator, we know they’re Town, so a non-cced Phone Operator is functionally another IC.

I feel like we should stop any voting and claiming and whatnot and actually discuss this setup. It might be semi-breakable.

[Pine]

This happens anyway though, if we force whoever we lynch to out their neighbor before they die.

but when does town ever play optimally, ss?

Right the fuck now, when every single one of us has three voices of reason in our heads.

I propose each and every one of us engage our partners in breaking this setup. 12 Town players x 4 person teams, that’s 48 Town minds to a mere dozen scumzors. We can solve this mechanically

[Pine]

I feel like we should stop any voting and claiming and whatnot and actually discuss this setup. It might be semi-breakable.

Probably not. Did you have anything in mind?

Right this minute I’m not sure. At my in-laws watching a very good movie. This is the sort of thing I need a legal pad, some coffee, and an hour to really explore.

[Pine]

I’m going to go out on a limb and say S_S is Town here, which means Jingle et al are as well. Hi Jingle et al!

[Pine]

Works for me. I wanted to stay the fuck away from White Flag because it’s got a 75%+ scum winrate, so I’ll take a Townsided setup in its place.

Just because it’s probably +Town EV doesn’t mean it’s guaranteed, we need to do our due diligence

PE: this is a new setup suggested by someone after the process began (I forget who). It hasn’t been stress-tested

[Pine]

Works for me. I wanted to stay the fuck away from White Flag because it’s got a 75%+ scum winrate, so I’ll take a Townsided setup in its place.

Just because it’s probably +Town EV doesn’t mean it’s guaranteed, we need to do our due diligence

PE: this is a new setup suggested by someone after the process began (I forget who). It hasn’t been stress-tested

The fuck did that skull come from.

[Pine]

actually there is literally no reason to ever massclaim dude unless you are looking for team solves/ruling out partners

just claim at intent or nk

I feel like scum!OkaPoka isn’t this stubborn and disagreeable here

whats ur 2 cents on titus krazy

She's town but we should be sticking to "strategy A" until there's a town consensus to switch to "strategy B"

Strategy A: Hoods aren't revealed until L-1 with intent to protect the doc
Strategy B: All hoods are revealed to guarantee the production of ICs upon redflips

We can always switch to B, but we can't go back to A once we go B.

I feel I'm outvoted but this is agreeable for now.

...and I worry that Town!Titus isn’t this agreeable umm ever

[Pine]

krazy's entrance posts are kinda bad tbh

Agree

inb4 someone says wow elsa townslipped

Nah, Elsa could fabricate that. I don't think he necessarily did, but I've got too high an opinion of his scumgame to give him the benefit of the doubt.

[Pine]

I'm going to tackle this in the morning. I have a deep gut feeling that there's either a setup break or at least a mandatory-once-we-see-it strategy in the setup.

[Pine]

krazy's entrance posts are kinda bad tbh

Agree

inb4 someone says wow elsa townslipped

Nah, Elsa could fabricate that. I don't think he necessarily did, but I've got too high an opinion of his scumgame to give him the benefit of the doubt.

Need I remind you how shit I am with names, or ask why I would bother remembering the names of people not in my game?

I'm fine with it not being a towntell, but again, it's an honest thing I would have said, either as town trying to lynch scum or scum trying to make town suspect them.

No no, I get that it was +EV an honest error, but I have respect enough for your game that I think you COULD have fabricated it, and would prefer to ignore it. Null.

[Pine]

Essentially, talented players don’t get credit for Townslips, and get possible scumslips held against them. It’s a higher standard.

It’s a compliment.

[Pine]

Just like the rich, you got to where you are by benefiting from the system in place for those less gifted.

[Pine]

Krazy is so super obvtown it hurts.

Calling it. [Krazy, nancy, one other]

[Pine]

VOTE: Hectic

Nnnnnope. I'm all for gimmicks, but this isn't the set of games, and you comes off more as trolling than anything else.

[Pine]

Stream of consciousness catch-up

Pine have you played with Hectic?

I agree about the "angle" of his particular gimmick this particular game
But if you've played with Hectic I don't think you'd expect him to revere even Team Mafia.

I'm pretty sure I have, but I'm not going to spend half an hour proving it to myself. I'm having a hard enough time keeping up with all the team stuff I need to do.

I don't think scum-bob would have any difficulty making that post?

Especially with a team behind him. They may be branding themselves as newbies, but there's talent in there. Subsequent Bob posts on that page same reaction. Very 'meh' and/or constructed. Slightly suspicious.

Auro doesn’t like Krazy’s opening.

Neither do I. My team has been frustratingly silent on this game, actually. Glass houses and stones, though, I'm struggling to manage the ~100 pages of the last ~two days.

Pine before I tell you what Ali's read is how well do you think e can read you?

Ali is

fucking awful at reading me

honestly e's usually just paranoid about me. E's never really caught my scumgame iirc, so eis scumdetector is turned up to 11 on me. Sup, Ali!

You, on the other hand, seem to be a lot more level-headed w/r/t me. You were a threat at times in AVP.

Titus claimed Hectic as her neighbour, so maybe she has inside info that can help us better sort him.

I would very much buy Titus/Hectic as T/S neighbors, and I'd love a Hectic!scumflip to give us an innocent Titus. She'd be dangerous as an IC. I feel like I've seen it once but can't remember when.

vote elsa pisskop

Stop trying to drive a lynch on town.

I’m not pisskop but I’ll take that offer anyway.

VOTE: Elsa

Easily the most vote worthy so far

She’s town, trust me on this.

Why is she town?

It would be antitown for me to reveal my reasons.

Big warning signs. I almost

never

see this from Town this early without a mechanical reason, and it's an open setup with no mech clears yet. This looks like scum trying to drum up towncred by whiteknighting a Townie.

i think krazy's posts reads as someone who is trying to but struggling to get a foothold into the game without potentially hurting himself

like up until pine he made a lot of empty posts that don't really lead anywhere but are like weird attempts at interacting with someone that avoids finding scum

and i think the pine push indicates what i suspected, he was just biding his time for something he could jump at

Gamesolving effort

Krazy is also being really active and aggressive which is town indicative for him. I think he is just making a really bad vote because I think Oka is being obvtown here.

He's...kinda not doing either of those things.

He's obviously the Phone Operator.

I CC that

Can we not?

krazy literally a paragon nom

Mastina is biased, so you really can’t put too much stock in that.

Please don't attack people where they can't defend themselves.

krazy literally a paragon nom

Mastina is biased, so you really can’t put too much stock in that.

maybe krazy isn't the greatest town player ever to live but i think getting nominated for paragon indicates a level of competency as a town player

It doesn't. Krazy

is

competent, but using nominations as a basis for that opinion is just...not solid reasoning.

Krazy tried to coast Day 1 in the large normal I played with him and Magical Girls
He did elementally scummy things in AvP we shouldn't have ignored and thats probably a more reliable way to read him than activity, which is probably erratic from Schrodinger's sitequit also.

His okapoka omgus is legitimately unproductive and scummy, that's good reasoning

Bingo. Pops = Town, Krazy = scum

@Krazy, We aren't playing with who can beat us. Anyone can be lynched. If we were, we'd have to vote Nancy because her response is to belittle anyone who suspects her is toxic as fuck. We vote scum.

Pine is pretty surely town. So is Oka.

If I am wrong, I'll suck it up and deal with it then.

I was going to publically apologise to you because it was wrong of me to threaten to pl you but your push on me last night was disgustingly shitty but it’s obviously not against site rules for someone to bully people and be hurtful and tonedeaf.

Please

please

stop equating suspicion in the game with bullying or personal attacks. It is counter-productive.

I'm caught up. I have 3 town reads, 2 scum reads, and a bunch of nulls.

...maybe share them?

Bob seems to be trying very hard to be innocuous, saying as little as possible while remaining active. Like, I see a bunch of words but practically no content. Empty platitudes. I could say I'd solved the game, 10 Town and 3 scum reads, but without sharing it's kind of pointless.

I kinda see a pops and bob team.

Tell me more? I like Pops as Town, but I respect her scumgame enough to recognize that I could be misreading her.

Hi, Nancy, are you related to Doctor Drew?

I'm V/LA until Monday in case you missed that; I was being serious when I said I've only read the first two pages.
I'll come and obvtown my slot real quick when I'm back so you don't need to worry.

Oh

whoops

, I just dropped my

stethoscope

, how clumsy of me! I guess I'll retreat into my

consulting room

, and consult my

Drew

.
(hint hint)

Yeah, Hectic is definitely the lynch today. Gut feeling, he's trying to draw out the real Doc.

UNVOTE:

Hectic is town. Get your votes off of him.

Uhhh, again, I see no reason to think that, nor any explanation of why you think so.

I literally have never read a post of Hectic’s, ever, that I don’t find to be scummy.

I thought Hectic was towny in Crown on the Ground (where he was town).

I don't think he's towny here, but I also think he intentionally decided to troll this game.

Crown on the Ground was an unusual game, in that the scumteam was more or less caught D1. Easy to TR Townies in that environment.

[Pine]

Reads in no particular order or degree of strength. Just c/ped my notes from the catchup readthrough

Scum
Krazy - Bad entrance and followups. Reminds me of AVP
Nancy - Unjustifiable certainty too early w/r/t several slots (Krazy, Elsa esp)
Hectic - Bad off-topic/trolling posts, counter-productivity
bob - Maybe? Weak vibes

Town
Pops - Positive read, making a lot of sense
Elsa - Interactions from Nancy
Titus - Positive read, counterpoint to Hectic
Amrun - Very positive read
OkaPoka - I don't see the setup spec coming from scum? Setup-solving, gamesolving
pisskop - Obvious scumhunting effort
NaCl - vague positive read

Insufficient information
DDL (Please stop calling him Eddie Murphy, very confusing)
Eddie
S_S

[Pine]

I’d forgotten the Seeking Masons shenanigans. Yeah, that’d do it. Given my own lapse in recollection, I wouldn’t attribute it to anything more sinister. That’s prime confbias territory. Not saying you’re wrong, just saying I don’t see it yet.

[Pine]

@Pine: How am I drawing out a doctor claim when it's been confirmed that I'm a neighbour?

Right here:

Oh

whoops

, I just dropped my

stethoscope

, how clumsy of me! I guess I'll retreat into my

consulting room

, and consult my

Drew

.
(hint hint)

Here, obviously. The "hint hint" especially has no function from a Town perspective, but could very easily be intended to draw out a Doctor who isn't close-reading to say "aha! I counterclaim!"

Just because it's clumsy doesn't make it not scummy. And if you're Town just dicking around, then you should be ashamed of yourself and knock it the fuck off. This is Team Mafia, not some random Mini you joined on a lark.

[Pine]

She's gamesolvy, has made a number of parallel observations that I've also seen, general positive scumhunting vibe, she's the only one of you Mastina is willing to endorse as Town so far (she thinks pisskop is scum though)

Why is she scum?

[Pine]

Okay, that's bothering me. Gamesolve-y.

[Pine]

Amrun, ank wants to know skitters specific thoughts on Pops please.

She wrote it all out in detail for me to share here since this question was asked.

Here’s the gist of it:

1) she doesn’t like that pops sided with NaCl on his poor Eddie vote when SS was bickering about it. SS made a valid point about Eddie being on vacation so it was essentially an empty vote anyway.

2) Pops voted SS for how he engaged w/ bob’s pressure, but SS was correct in his argument with bob and whatever pressure he was receiving she felt he acted in accordance with town behavior for him.

3) She doesn’t like the vague meta reasons pops is using.

In addition, after the vote response, she doesn’t like the reaction and how pops is trying to say she only came in because I needed help, which I didn’t.

I agree with all those reasons and I specifically noted 2) prior myself re: SS being correct on bob.

pops

, skitter would like game references and preferably post references from games that show S S scum game is similar or especially that his town game is dissimilar.

Nvm, I skipped 630 to 640 while writing a "your mom" joke in response to 627 which I thought better of. I see your reasoning, I guess? I don't agree with it.

[Pine]

For what reason(s) do you disagree, though?

Central premise? I don’t think those actions are inconsistent.

[Pine]

Not central premise. Conclusion. Need coffee.

[Pine]

I know at least one person who won’t be getting a paragon nom next year. Did you guess you? And you will always be the very LAST person on this site, I will ever be accepting criticisms wrt to my behaviour.

Can we not

No, Pine seems to feel he has some God given right to pass moral judgement on me and lecture me all over this goddamned forum and I’m frankly sick of it.

This vendetta you think I have against you does not exist. I’m getting a little tired of it. This is a game of social deduction, positioning, and assessment. Game-related posts are not universally condemnations of your ability or intelligence, and I would please like you to stop misconstruing them that way.

or rather, why so many people are townreading nacl

I'm not lately.

[Pine]

What part of "focus on the players in this game" do I have to keep repeating for it to finally stick?

I came to play with you guys, not the other 30 something people as well. If I wanted that I would've taken the large.

I mean, I

want

to agree with this, but you're railing against the central conceit of Team Mafia.

[Pine]

Mastina and xtoxm are both scumreading pisskop, actually. Kuribo is sick and hasn’t had an opinion yet

[Pine]

Ironically, pine, we have talked about you quite a bit as well.

[Pine]

{Nancy, bob}
{pisskop, Titus, Hectic, Oka}
{Pine}
{Eddie, Elsa, Amrun, NaCl, Krazy} - null
{pops, DDL}

Town to scum or scum to town?

Labels, people, ffs

[Pine]

Hm. Eh. We are not very synced at all.

I’m in the awkward position of defending pisskop in our PT to two people whose opinion and objectivity I trust. It’s weird

[Pine]

Town to scum or scum to town?

Labels, people, ffs

I want to say maybe once in my life I've seen a readlist listed scum to town, and it was clearly labeled as such.

Town is at the top. Town is always at the top.

I’ve seen it scum on top more than once, but I thought it was Town -> Scum

In that case...what the

fuck

are you smoking? Your list is upside down my dude.

[Pine]

Calling it now, Pine is either on crack or scum, depending on Mastina read.

Why would Mastina have anything to do with it?

[Pine]

{Nancy, bob}
{pisskop, Titus, Hectic, Oka}
{Pine}
{Eddie, Elsa, Amrun, NaCl, Krazy} - null
{pops, DDL}

Town to scum or scum to town?

Labels, people, ffs

You ask for clarification on teh order of his read list. But what do you think of his reads and if you disagree on the placement of players. And why do you feel that way?

I've already given my reads - they are pretty much the opposite of his. I've explained myself as thoroughly as early game hunches can be.

I feel like if somebody coded a robot to play mafia it would sound like Bob

Mafia would be a great tool for the Turing test.

town block

Town blocs fail because people call attention to them. Town blocs form naturally, with an unspoken understanding between the players. You dont vote for a town bloc. They just -are-

See, posts like this are why I'm feeling pisskop Town in spite of my team disagreeing. There's just no +EV to this kind of infrastructural work as scum.

[Pine]

Nancy you always have an expectation of people treating you as obvtown and I'm hoping that if even your teammates can't explain why you are obvtown you will stop beating our heads over not locking you town.

Idk what to say nacl if you don't like what I've had to say then unlucky

Fine. VOTE: Okapoka Farkran says your posting doesn't have any depth to it ( mostly agree) and whenever I try and get a better grip on your thought process you clearly don't want to help me with that.

@NACL why aren't you voting? Too salty? (Sorry couldn't resist the pun.)

See my previous response to Krazy, same thing.

this is very good actually

i want

<elsa,nacl,ddl,bob,amrun> to take sides and comment on this

Okay, so pops vs Eddie, I don't think outing the neighborhood makes Eddie scum. Like, I get that Eddie can do it if he's careless scum but pops' argument doesn't make sense since he can also do it if he's annoyed town and I don't see why pops is reading into it in that way. It feels forced.
I initially liked pops for her earlier play because it didn't feel like it was scum-her and I think I actually know how she is as scum, unlike most people here. But the vote on Eddie feels like a reach.


Regarding the Hectic wagon, I'm not super opposed to it, but I disagree with the reasoning behind it. Mostly for Nancy's issue. Because from what I'm reading from Hectic's posts, he doesn't seem to understand the issue with the question he was asking. Nancy, do you think he's faking that he doesn't understand? I think it would be easier for scum to just say, "oops, I didn't realize" and then stop pushing on it instead of continuing to try talking to you.

This whoooole post sets off alarms. Salt is undermining a near-universally Townread player while weakly affirming the wagon (that that player) is on. There's a whole lot of unnatural solviness (yes I just made up a word) there. "I don't disagree with your vote, but let me now try to build a case against one of the people on that wagon" is a classic scum misdirect-while-hedging play.

[Pine]

shite. thats a good team too.

Equally likely that kuribo or mastina is saying this

Xtoxm and Mastina both say you're scum. I don't agree. Kuribo is dealing with some health issues, he doesn't have time to read this game for right now.

[Pine]

Oh my damn, I was wrong, it's just Xtoxm. He just said so twice while Mastina was posting about Pops!Town (which I

do

agree with). Essentially his case amounts to a meta kop's-not-playing-his-Towngame argument.

[Pine]

Nancy, I have been a little unhappy irl recently. I try not to let real life affect my emotions here, but maybe it leaked into my interaction with you? I'm not sure how though because I was just trying to stay level headed and reasonable. My lack of engagement before was because I hadn't read the game until yesterday.
But since you've somehow gauged that and are scumreading me for it, please don't. I'm not asking you to townread me for this, I just want you to consider it NAI. Also, vote Pine with me if you scumread him too.

I've realised I shouldn't force myself to play if I'm feeling down so I'll be back tomorrow after hopefully a good night of sleep.

Why did you make that fake doc post? And yeah, I am definitely considering that as a possibility because it seems like Pine isn’t reading my posts or anything anyone is saying about me. Here’s the thing, both DDL and Pine were in Marked for Death. Pine was my buddy in that and DDL tr me here while Pine is locksr me, so something isn’t adding up.

I'm reading everything you post, and I don't lockscum you. There are shades of gray in the world. I don't respond to you because I'm trying to keep my head in the game.

As a matter of fact, I'm coming around to a Hectic + {NaCL, Krazy, Bob} solve right now.

[Pine]

Bizarrely, Nancy, I think we are suddenly on the same page with most things except Krazy. I'm still not convinced you're Town, but I have bigger fish to fry and your reads line up with mine for the most part.

[Pine]

VOTE: Hectic

Seems like this is a popular wagon.

Consider this my birthday surprise.

REAL L1

Damn, thought I got to quickhammer.

Page 41 after almost a week is not quickhammer.

REAL L1

Why are we here already.

Gay Mafia 1 was already done for five pages by now.

But it doesn't really seem like a good idea to policy lynch someone in one third of the allotted time.

This is not a policy lynch, you're just having cold feet.

Your comment on the wagon happening quickly makes sense but how is Hectic a policy lynch?

Given that he's trolled a lot and nobody's stated any reasons for actually thinking he's scum, it's a pretty reasonable assumption.

A) That

is

a reason to think he's scum
B) That's not the only reason

Aside from the doc crumb thing which was clearly bullshit.

Disagree

ftr i dont particularly SR S_S right now.

Neither do I. >Avg Town

just one more vote for heck plz

You want me to revote him right now?

I mean, if you do I intend to hammer the moment we get a new vote on them.

Oh, well as SS pointed out, we still have 9 days, so I’m not in any rush. He is still my preferred wagon unless something changes in the next 9 days.

But I do think there’s something to consider wrt the speed of that wagon, so I’m fine waiting.

Having time is not really a good reason to spend it fruitlessly. There's a fairly strong correlation lately between long games and scum wins. Waste not, want not.

I'm ready for a flip.

[Pine]

He who? I don’t have a problem waiting for something specific, I just don’t support open-ended indecisiveness.

[Pine]

He Hectic? If he’s got real content to contribute, like a detailed reads list, I’ll look at it

[Pine]

I don’t really have a you read, but it’s 2:25 AM so you’re just going to have to be happy for now with Mastina and I agreeing strongly on that count. Ask me when it’s not stupid o’clock and I’ll elaborate, but I tend to forget stuff like this.

[Pine]

I mean...that readslist is pretty blatant jury manipulation

[Pine]

What does that mean? It's the people who came to mind.

You’re throwing up scumreads on controversial people who aren’t going to change their minds on you and trying to appeal to those who might be swayed. I mean, credit for effort, but a successful attempt would include reasoning and maybe a false positive or two. Condemn someone who thinks you’re Town, that sort of thing. A no-effort jury management...nah.

[Pine]

@Pine: what do you think of Hectic as a scum player? Is he competent?

I don't have any scum data on this site unfortunately. I have 1 offsite however.

Ok, thanks for that info - Pine, please change my question to what do you think of Hectic as a player in general? Is he competent?

He’s competent enough that I don’t accept memeing in TM2020 from him.

I need to consult with my team, they think I’m out on a limb here and Hectic’s posting this afternoon has been better.

As for the lack of a counterwagon, that isn’t for lack of trying - there have been pushes on several people so far, they just haven’t taken hold.

[Pine]

Votecount 1.11

Hectic (5) -

Pine, DrDolittle, OkaPoka, Titus, Elsa Jay

OkaPoka (2) -

Krazy, NaCl

DrDolittle (1) -

bob3141

popsofctown (1) -

Amrun

Eddie Cane (1) -

popsofctown

Pine (1) -

Hectic

Not Voting (4) -

Something_Smart, Eddie Cane, pisskop, Nancy Drew 39

With 15 players alive it takes 8 votes to lynch.

The deadline for Day 1 is in (expired on 2020-01-16 22:00:00).

I mean, look at that scummy as fuck wagon on OkaPoka. I maintain that {Krazy, NaCl, Hectic} is an entirely plausible team

[Pine]

Xtoxm is particularly against lynching Hectic, thinks he’s a mislynch. He’s Townreading Amrun, S_S, Hectic, Pops, and “probably” Nancy

PE: Site meta has gotten to the point where scum can pretty easily get away with being transparent for exactly that reason.

Okay. Say we tabled your lynch for now, Hectic. Who should we be voting and why?

[Pine]

He’s competent enough that I don’t accept memeing in TM2020 from him.

I don't follow the logic here. Is memeing and providing content worse than just providing content?

He’s not providing content. He’s got a naked readslist and that’s it. What the fuck content are you talking about?

[Pine]

Hmm

Pine why does two votes on me suggest hectic scum?

It doesn’t on its own. It’s evidence of counterwagoning.

VOTE: NaCl

[Pine]

He’s not providing content.

So that's your real issue, and memeing has nothing to do with it.

Why did you mention memeing as though you thought it was a problem?

Stop being reductive. I can have more than one issue with him

[Pine]

And memeing IS a problem. It’s counterproductive as Town and often used as cover for low content by scum

[Pine]

Xtoxm is particularly against lynching Hectic, thinks he’s a mislynch. He’s Townreading Amrun, S_S, Hectic, Pops, and “probably” Nancy

PE: Site meta has gotten to the point where scum can pretty easily get away with being transparent for exactly that reason.

Okay. Say we tabled your lynch for now, Hectic. Who should we be voting and why?

Could you address my reasons I have for scumreading you? You've just ignored them the whole game.

Other than you, I dislike Titus, DDL, and Eddie off the top of my head. Let me ISO some more and I'll get back to you with an answer.

Afaik you don’t have any reasons beyond OMGUS

[Pine]

@Nancy - Mastina is busy and doesn't have time to do deep dives on everyone in this game. My team is really only commenting on people they think I'm not reading well.

@bob: the worst parts of the Hectic wagon were

Pine

, DDL, and Elsa Jay,

none of whom are on NaCl

. Pine being on NaCl is a big reason I’m voting Pine over NaCl. Pisskop and Oka, who happened to be on the Hectic wagon, are townreads of mine, so I don’t mind them being on NaCl at all.

You can't even write out posts without falsities because it's so postproduced and fake

I did misspeak there, I meant to leave Pine out of that top list since I was talking about him in the next sentence and forgot to change it. Since it’s very clear in that same post that I knew Pine is on NaCl, this is (frankly) just a stupid post.

No, it's

not

a stupid post, because it shows you're not retracing a thought process you actually had, you are making it up afterwards.
From your posting you "scumread" Pine more emphatically than DDL or Elsa Jay, that's not the one you'd forget.

Ehhhh, I think it's pretty NAI. I know a lot of people, myself included, who postproduce and revise posts on the fly and sometimes include errors like that.

Wow, my reads are changing a lot.

@Hectic idr who your team is but area they falling this game

@SS Your reads are very different to mine so I need an update with some reasons please

@Pine If you are, stop

@Nancy and I mean this nicely, I have seen you be 100% Sure scum is town, as town. And town is not what my team necessarily reads you as, though it is trending a bit that way. Do you have a consistent track record reading Krazy? Because some members of my team disagree with that read, as well as your Pops one. You have done some things my team thinks is very townie and some very scummy, so I need more.

@Hectic you said most of my content is good other than my pops response. Can you expan do that? The way you are sheeping Pops is not ever a S/S interaction I believe, and I do not like the content from either of you. I am talking to Pops a lot in the hood, but I need to find you in thread if you're town. And more importantly, I need you to not be a potential mislynch vote on me because I really don't like getting lynhched.

@Oka I need you to do a reads list please. Losing faith.

Yeah, I need to take a break from this game. I'm getting confused and crossing wires.

I think I can get whoevers town in {SS, Oka, DDL, maybe Nancy, maybe Titus, Pisskop, and my team thinks Pine} to vote with me when I start tryharding. At best, that's exactly 8, adn odds thats all town are astronomically low. I think I could realistically get mislynched in this lobby which is why I'm tryin to content a bit and gambit a bit less.

I can say I've finally got a TR on you, so we can do business on this. I frankly have more respect for your Towngame than my own, and I'm close to enough Townreads to start a POE list. That might actually be the most productive thing I can do here.

I don’t really have a you read, but it’s 2:25 AM so you’re just going to have to be happy for now with Mastina and I agreeing strongly on that count. Ask me when it’s not stupid o’clock and I’ll elaborate, but I tend to forget stuff like this.

VOTE: Pine

1063 and Mastina can’t be arsed to have a read on me yet? Something isn’t right about this. When is Mastina ever not vocal about reading me. Ank is another one, who I’m also wondering about. Both of them should have definitely had something to say about me by now but Mastina especially.

I think you're wildly overvaluing how much Mastina is invested in both you and this game. She's hardly discussed it at all, and is more focused on her own game. Xtoxm is really the only one talking about this one regularly.

[Pine]

Okay, I'm back from taking a break from this game. It's top priority for this evening, but damn, you all have doubled the size in the last 2-3 days.

[Pine]

Why were you taking a break from this game?

Because I'd lost my cool and started to question a number of my reads. Hectic turning out Towny and the missteps surrounding nearly lynching him got me way off-balance. Eddie suggested I take a break from the game and I thought it was a good idea. I'm fresh and ready to catch up with a clear head.

My team has been keeping up to various degrees. Kuribo in particular wrote a page and a half, but I skimmed over it because I don't want it to influence me too much until I read myself. Then I'll try to summarize kuribo, mastina, and xtoxm's thoughts.

[Pine]

Why were you taking a break from this game?

Because I'd lost my cool and started to question a number of my reads. Hectic turning out Towny and the missteps surrounding nearly lynching him got me way off-balance. Eddie suggested I take a break from the game and I thought it was a good idea. I'm fresh and ready to catch up with a clear head.

My team has been keeping up to various degrees. Kuribo in particular wrote a page and a half, but I skimmed over it because I don't want it to influence me too much until I read myself. Then I'll try to summarize kuribo, mastina, and xtoxm's thoughts.

Have fun bro, hopefully you help me kill pops and krazy and dont fall into their shitty pockets

Last I checked, Pops was Town and Krazy was scum, so I'm on board for 50% of that.

I'm setting aside a couple of hours after dinner (cooking now) so we'll see after that.