Mini Normal 2119 [game over]

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Let’s VOTE: iconeum for an

iconic

D1 lynch!

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Also

dayvig: Datisi

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Lmaoooooo

Get wrecked dats

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Datisi: *tries to post*
Mena:

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WAIT I DID NOT WATCH UNTIL THE END OF THAT CLIP

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Datisi: *tries to post*
Also datisi:

Ebwop

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So did u roll town this game datisi

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ducky what is the place that I might like in the OP?

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So did u roll town this game datisi

HSHAHAHAHAA

I'M LEGIT WHEEZING

Datisi is laughing at the idea of being town

Scum!tisi confirmed

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No I rolled scum am v sad

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But DW I’ll nk u N1 this time I promise

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Look

Would I lie 2 u

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Haha who would do a thing like that

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A

bad

guy, that’s who

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Spoiler:

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quack

quack?

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would you believe me if i said i literally thought of that song

Maybe

Is that what you’re saying

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I don’t believe u

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This is actually me tho

Spoiler:

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DUCKY YOU HAVE TO TELL ME WHERE THE PLACES I MIGHT LIKE ARE

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@bji yea I’ve played with datisi probably as much as I’ve played with anyone on site I think?

I’m prob better at scum although I have a strong preference for town, and I’m probably still catchable via efforttelling when scum although I am improving on that

@datisi do feel free to go into great depth on why I am a good player tho I am very open to hearing about this. In fact, if anyone wishes to extol my virtues as a player, I have time for it

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@GL sup

Is that a srs vote or RVS?

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I am saving u for night 2 emps don’t worry

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Datisi has been promised the N1 kill so my hands are p tied rn

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@GL sup

Is that a srs vote or RVS?

it's a serious vote in that I think bji is the highest likelihood of scum from the posts so far

it is not a "I have decided that this is the person I want lynched today" level-of-serious vote

Okay why?

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bji is playing the way i usually play when i have a scumread im very confident in

but its also page 3 so uh i dont think he has a scumread at all

Do you think he’s scummy then?

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Datisi has been promised the N1 kill so my hands are p tied rn

haha what a great strategy this is proof that you are an excellent player

please kill me on the night before lylo because i want to play the game but also not die inside because lylo

Okay I’ll reserve you for N3 instead of N2 then cause I’m going for another perfect sweep

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What does everyone else think of my memes btw?

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Yeah I don’t really get your question but I’m willing to roll with it if you want him to discuss it before I explain why

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Explain why I don’t get it that is*

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Oh hey I got post 69

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@emps did you think that was pressuring?

I didn’t really read it as that, but I’m gonna let GL do his thing before I go any more into that

Also, on your last point: you think it’s behaviour more or less likely to come from someone afraid to actively pressure as scum? Less I assume

Actually writing that out kinda answered it for me

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Oh hey I got post 69

haha funny number

Spoiler:

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Depends on how you define it

In games where there are people who can read her (bonjour!) she’s great to have around as town because she’s able to be very obviously town in a way that’s normally beyond her scumgame imo. However, I wouldn’t generally expect her to townlead or force lynches through, although I wouldn’t expect her to be passive either

Whereas as scum she’s p good at fooling people in general, and while I’m good at telling the difference the last game where she beat me while playing scum has made me slightly wary — although that was a joke game so I’m not sure how relevant it is to her general tells as scum

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I liked the prismatic spring ducky

Where’s the mountain?

---

Glacier National Park.

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@dats would u say I am better than average at reading you correctly?

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Right, that’s your answer @bji

Yeah you got me really bad in 1949. Goddamnit if I’d only stuck with getting korina lynched D1 that wouldn’t have fucked up my otherwise perfect newbie record

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Also I don’t really think I’m so far above the typical skill ceiling that only I can read dats, I think dats is one of the players who I am particularly good at reading on site partly because we play together a lot and also she’s the person I talk to the most when not in games

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Yeah you got me really bad in 1949. Goddamnit if I’d only stuck with getting korina lynched D1 that wouldn’t have fucked up my otherwise perfect newbie record

Wait, that's the only Newbie you lost?

Yes *glowers*

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Incidentally are we happy to locktown emps yet?

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Wait nvm I thought he’d posted more

Why is this game so dead

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Not exactly but I don’t wanna say just yet what I’m sorting him by until he does/does not do more of it

Post count is part of it

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I’ll let u know once the case on him is solid one way or another

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Do you have feels on bji yet?

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Yes, I think so

I have feels but I wanna see how things play out between bji/GL before I out

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gang

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[snip]


I don't know anyone here, so I find it interesting/useful to get people to talk about each other. It's less about immediately solving the game and more about getting people to put stuff down in writing, stuff that maybe could be interesting when cross referenced later on. Regarding S/S, why do you think that was my first thought?

If you are asking me, do I think I can solve the game on Day 1 with one line of questioning ... well obviously the answer is no.

Rookie

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So @bji what have you got from your questioning so far then?

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Also, are you saying S/S wasn’t your first thought?

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We can policy UP today if there’s not a better candidate for scum but rn I think they’re fairly null

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Toxic and annoying, but not in a very AI way

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Why did you sign up to play in this game?

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VOTE: looker

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I don’t really wanna explain it yet

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Ceejay do you think plank is scummy?

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I don’t really wanna explain it yet

stop scumclaiming

Whoopsie

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Why did you sign up to play in this game?

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Obviously @plank

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I don’t really wanna explain it yet

stop scumclaiming

Stop scumclaiming

Shut up I'm done interacting with caught scum

This can never come from Town btw

Why are you pushing mislynch bait

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N

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O

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VOTE: looker

why are you voting for a player who townslipped?

Town!icon never says this

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Wait

“This never comes from town!icon”?

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Why do you consider that a townslip?

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Why do you consider that a townslip?

because scum kNow how many scum there are

And this wouldn’t be faked why?

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Why do you consider that a townslip?

because scum kNow how many scum there are

And this wouldn’t be faked why?

I know. Had this exact same discussion with Scumisi already and she pointed out that my read was incorrect.

Okay so why are you still defending it as a townslip when I voted there?

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Ceejay do you think plank is scummy?

Eh tstbs are my thoughts atm

What about it makes it tstbs?

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plank is also playing this completely different compared to his only scumgame on site

He only has one completed game on site

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Okay so why are you still defending it as a townslip when I voted there?

Was wondering if there's something both you and datisi are voting for him that I missed. I don't have any scum indicator on the slot, and you are both voting there after the Plank's passage which is curious?

I voted him because I didn’t like you defending him for something that you’d seen as not a townslip quite recently and I’d seen datisi bring that up and wanted to see if you’d defend him again

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I lean scum more on looker than anyone else so far I think but only very very mildly

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Ceejay do you think plank is scummy?

Eh tstbs are my thoughts atm

What about it makes it tstbs?

Might you play like that as scum?

I mean, I probably wouldn’t but how is that relevant

There are scum players who probably would and my point is that I want to know what makes you think that plank doesn’t fall into that group

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plank is also playing this completely different compared to his only scumgame on site

He only has one completed game on site

In which he was scum, and played a LOT more reasonable game then whatever the fuck this is

Yes, but it’s one game and he’s not a newbie which makes that one game pretty worthless imo because there’s no way to bound his range from it

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Okay so why are you still defending it as a townslip when I voted there?

Was wondering if there's something both you and datisi are voting for him that I missed. I don't have any scum indicator on the slot, and you are both voting there after the Plank's passage which is curious?

I voted him because I didn’t like you defending him for something that you’d seen as not a townslip quite recently and I’d seen datisi bring that up and wanted to see if you’d defend him again

Ok I defended him again. What do you make of it?

I think that if we lynch looker today and he flips scum then you have good partner equity

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I don’t think that plank is really playing the game yet so I don’t think what they’ve done is AI really

Like the toxicity and lack of effort is +scum but then the utter lack of caring about relationships is +town

But it’s not really bounded by any sense of expectation on what their play should be like which is why I’m still null there until they actually do something

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I think that if we lynch looker today and he flips scum then you have good partner equity

If we lynch plank today and it flips scum I think both you and datisi have good partner equity

Interesting, why?

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Hmmm

You think dats and I would both coordinate a push on someone else when our buddy wasn’t even under pressure?

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So then why do you think dats + me have increased equity with a plank!red flip?

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No okay that makes more sense

I thought you were saying that specifically a team of dats + me had increased equity on plank!red

If you’re just saying that ur equity would both go up individually it makes sense

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Yoink

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Get fucked, plank

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I changed my mind this can die today

VOTE: plank

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i read emps posts

emps = conftown

Okay but why?

How familiar are you with emps, AFF?

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Looker's been in at least two 13p mini normals, including one that I modded, where he was scum so he should know the ratio of scum to town.

did he try any similar fake townslip plays as scum in the game you modded? what was his entrance like in that game?

I can look again, but none that I recall off the top of my head. They replaced in towards the end of Day 1 and mostly lurked all game.

I would second this assessment of looker from when he played in the mini I modded

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Get fucked, plank

you get fucked

Nah I’m pretty sure you can just absolutely get fucked

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Like fuck off with your attitude and stop being a prick

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Literally all datisi asked you to do was the barest minimum part of playing the game so if you’re not gonna do that then actually just fuck off

I was kinda willing to give it a pass earlier bc I thought you were just trolling and not playing but if this is how you’re gonna be when you’re actually playing then nah, you can get fucked

Leave of your own accord or get lynched

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Seems like you’re the only one having that problem

Maybe fuck off?

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What an obnoxious clique you guys are.

Probably shouldn't play games of mafia together if you're going to just shitpost with in-jokes and unsubstantiated reference each other's meta. Here making it harder for Aaron to question why Iconeum 'conftowns' emps again with vague nonsense. People can barely even play this game without having to deal with the three of you making (a probably unconscious and not that you're all scum) a concerted effort to back one another up.

It's fucking shit.

Pretty clearly a reference to this but okay fail at reading comprehension

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I have no problem playing with anyone nor do I have a clique of people

There’s a few people here who I’ve played with not at all/to a limited extent

None of them have been a toxic fucking dickbag yet

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Maybe be aware that your actions have consequences and stop being a cunt if you don’t want to be told to fuck off?

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What an obnoxious clique you guys are.

Probably shouldn't play games of mafia together if you're going to just shitpost with in-jokes and unsubstantiated reference each other's meta.

Here making it harder for Aaron to question why Iconeum 'conftowns' emps again with vague nonsense

. People can

barely even play this game without having to deal with the three of you making (a probably unconscious and not that you're all scum) a concerted effort to back one another up

.

It's fucking shit.

(1) i mean this is prett obviously untrue

(2) us jamming together and having a good time is a problem for exactly no one other than you, and had you raised concerns about it instead of deciding the best option was to be a wanker things would probably have gone down plenty different

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Just you and Icon, and Dat who doesn't even vote people that he scumreads, just who he dislikes.

Which apparently you also are now doing.

"Not a clique I swear, but we just vote together against people who we dislike instead of looking for scum."

I mean unless the scumteam is the 3 of you then sure, good job so far I'd say.

I mean if you wanna open up with “fuck off” to a reasonable question then yeah I’m gonna take issue with it

But that’s because literally all the way you’re choosing to play this game is going to do is to cause interactions like this one that are going to blow up the thread and give smoke for scum to hide behind

Like I’m not particularly sure you’re scum but at this point removing you so that the thread doesn’t get cluttered and so unpleasant that half of the town checks out or has utter apathy about the game is probably the most pro town option

If you want to stop being so fucking unpleasant and actually talk Mafia then fine w/e I’ll forget about it

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Even when people are being perfectly fine and asking one of you three to elaborate, you start then bringing in unsubstantiated meta to question them.

You aren't even playing this game of mafia, you're just having a circlejerk with your buddies.

Just because I don’t play the same way you do doesn’t mean I’m not playing and the fact that you have no idea what I’m doing is testament to that

Also the game was literally mostly still in RVS for all of that so what exactly is your problem

And again, it is very much

your

problem, not a problem with any of us, as evidenced by only you feeling the need to blow it into a massive thing

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Good job on being a bully Menalque.

I’m not the one who out of the blue started flaming people

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UP: goes on the offensive
UP: gets given it back
UP: OmG uR bUlLyInG mE

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Do you even know what the word gaslighting means

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MÚLTIPLE PEOPLE ARE AWARE OF OUR META IN THIS GAME

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UP: goes on the offensive
UP: gets given it back
UP: OmG uR bUlLyInG mE

Nope, not what happened.

And yes, you were all mocking me as a group together earlier in the game for thinking that Iconeum is scum.

I still think that in the group of you 3, he is a likely scum.

You did about 150 posts (not just the two of you but a lot of it) from when I went to sleep to when I got back

Of which a substantial amount was you just trolling the thread

I didn’t mock you, I called you out as toxic and unpleasant but said it was mostly NAI and was planning to try and ignore it

But if you’re gonna open with “fuck off” to a perfectly reasonable question then I have zero interest in keeping you around

How is anyone meant to read you if you’re just gonna explain when you feel like it or to what you feel like and roll with Fuck off the rest of the time

And not to mention that it was just totally fucking uncalled for to aim that at datisi who had done exactly nothing at that point to deserve a response of that nature

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"manipulate (someone) by psychological means into doubting their own sanity."

Which you are doing by misrepresenting me and acting as if the things I bring up are not legitimate, and that no one else could possibly think or perceive it this way. I've read through it quite a few times and the 3 of you are doing what I just said, were then mocking me for something unrelated as a group.

You also just called me a cunt and told me to leave the game.

They patently are a personal problem that you have with the three of us born of your issues with icon and the fact that we’re friends with him

I leave it open to others to decide if anything that was said was mocking I think it clearly isn’t

I did do that, yes

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You are a cruel person and a bully.

I can accept that I crossed lines and responded poorly because I found the game environment the three of you created to be very toxic and frustrating to try and play in.

What you are doing right now is very sad.

And so instead of raising that like an in any sense mature adult you decided to troll and flame

Lol okay gtfooh

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I'm not ganging up on you
I don't want you lynched
I think you're Town
I think both of you idiots are Town
I just wanted you to tell me why do you see Looker as Town because I don't

Why do you think UP is town?

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Spoiler:

that's one of the worst possible scumreads I think you can have right now

i'm p much locktowning GL for his play up until now, UltimaPlanna

Of the players that have posted, I think GuiltyLion is the scummiest.

VOTE: GuiltyLion

Given the amount of focus GL had on bji, you'd expect he'd be voting bji at this point

I'm asking because you might not be comfortable talking about your scum partner and that might show through.

is it a useful question if they are not scum together?

VOTE: bji

suck stronk case

VOTE: ultimateplank

Of the players that have posted, I think GuiltyLion is the scummiest.

VOTE: GuiltyLion

Given the amount of focus GL had on bji, you'd expect he'd be voting bji at this point

Did you at the time you made these posts think bji was scummy too or?

that's one of the worst possible scumreads I think you can have right now

i'm p much locktowning GL for his play up until now, UltimaPlanna

What if you're scum though?

Given the amount of focus GL had on bji, you'd expect he'd be voting bji at this point

VOTE: bji

I take it back, GL is probably town.

how does him voting/not voting change your opinion on his actual posts? Because 'his posting' was bad according to you?

VOTE: ultimateplank

VOTE: Iconeum

you think i'm scum?

VOTE: bji

I take it back, GL is probably town.

I don't have much of an opinion on bji yet

why vote bji over anyone else at this point?

VOTE: ultimateplank

VOTE: Iconeum

you think i'm scum?

That or you're dumb for having to even ask me the question I just answered in previous post.

i must be dumb: what question?

Not to mention the quickness with which you townread Looker for their "slip" - could easily just have been Looker trolling.

You have a bad scum game, sry bout dat.

I mean, I think I have a decent scumgame? I think if I have to Judge my own scumgame fairly, I'd say my early game is pretty strong, and it weakens towards endgame.

Can you answer the questions?

We should lynch in bji, iconeum, menalque for day1

Can you elaborate on bji and mena pls

Pedit: holy shit yall let me post

I don't have much of an opinion on bji yet

We should lynch in bji, iconeum, menalque for day1

what changed your read in between these posts?

At no point did I say that bji should be voted over anyone else. You are asking a leading question that has nothing to do with a thing I have said: you are either scum, or impressively stupid.

are you an RC alt? srs question

or impressively stupid.

you can just fuck off now kthxbye

Ok thanks for ignoring me pls don't turn this into a 20 page shitfight thx

VOTE: ultimateplank

i think my work wrt to ultimo is done here

let's see how the rest of the players see this argument shall we?

It's very easy to see that you are twisting my words and asking questions about things I didn't say, but I can't be bothered debating it.

You're either scum or impressively stupid and I have no interest in arguing with either.

I want to engage with you over alleged things you are accusing me of, but only if you take a cooler and stop with the flaming.

Deal?

It's very obvious that I'm town in this interaction. You're just voting who you perceive as more, "toxic" while the scum player twists words and plays smugly.

You're right i don't think you're scum yet necessarily.
VOTE: Looker

But my problem is that a few questions Icon asked was things I wanted a reply to as well. Call me a dumbass too, cool, but getting self-voting and this shit this early isn't helping anyone

I don't have much of an opinion on bji yet

Menalque is very obviously scum with bji

how did you evolve your read like this?

Menalque is very obviously scum with bji

Please help me see the light

WHY DID I JUST GET 5 PEDITS STOP IT

Read the game

I am. You didn't explain it.

can you quote whatever you think/feel I am twisting your words on?

ReAd tHe gAmE

But you are now speaking to me as if you think or know that I'm town.

You're meant to be voting me?

I think there's a possibility ur just trolling/bad town yeah. Trying to figure it out.

It's very easy to see that you are twisting my words and asking questions about things I didn't say, but I can't be bothered debating it.

You're either scum or impressively stupid and I have no interest in arguing with either.

This is the only thing you said about it, and it clearly doesn't show where or what I am twisting.

So please, ISO me and show me where or what?

Ok, can you tell *me* how you went from no opinion on bji to Mena/bji scum when neither of them posted in the meantime?

Pedit:...

Alright, but
Why didn't you say so right away?

I post as I read.

GL's vote was in his first post. Ur lying about this then? Because if you post as you read, you would have seen him voting.

Why should I quote my own ISO for something I've already explained? You are quite clearly not trying to actually understand, just trying to look like you are.

I'm not asking you to quote your own ISO, i'm asking you to quote mine. You say i'm twisting your words, but you don't say where or what.

Quote the post(s) where I'm supposedly doing so. Shouldn't take you more then a couple seconds tbh.

Ultimate, have you considered the possibility you just got triggered by my vote on you and you went into full OMGUS tunnel?

Nope, that's not the case.

Again, speaking how you know that I'm town.

You're clearly scum.

VOTE: bji

I take it back, GL is probably town.

I don't have much of an opinion on bji yet

why vote bji over anyone else at this point?

At no point did I say that bji should be voted over anyone else. You are asking a leading question that has nothing to do with a thing I have said: you are either scum, or impressively stupid.

I asked you why you are voting bji over anyone else at that point, which is objectively true as proven by your vote on him.
I never said anything about you saying bji 'should be voted over anyone else'.

can you at least read my 255 and see that I in fact did not twist your words there?

UP, if I told you I also have no fucking clue what you're talking about, what would your read on me be

Dumb because I have already caught 3 scum.

Your entire scumread on me is based on objectively false information, as demonstrated by my 255.

We can policy UP today if there’s not a better candidate for scum but rn I think they’re fairly null

Toxic and annoying, but not in a very AI way

We can policy UP today if there’s not a better candidate for scum but rn I think they’re fairly null

yeah but they're annulling me

Why did you sign up to play in this game?

Why did you sign up to play in this game?

inb4 'shut up ur caught scum'

Here is

Every post of engagement with UP from datisi, icon, and me from European overnight/morning

I think there are maybe 3 posts that can be considered mocking him in all of this, and none were very near the beginning

So making out that we’ve been doing that at all is just a big fat lie

[Menalque]

You are a cruel person and a bully.

I can accept that I crossed lines and responded poorly because I found the game environment the three of you created to be very toxic and frustrating to try and play in.

What you are doing right now is very sad.

And so instead of raising that like an in any sense mature adult you decided to troll and flame

Lol okay gtfooh

Right, so you expect that I must be a mature adult and cannot flame.

But if you respond by calling me a cunt, that's okay?

Sure thing, hypocritical bully.

Bite me

Stop trying to act like it wasn’t your own unacceptable behaviour meeting an earned response

[Menalque]

Why do aggressors always feel the need to play the victim as soon as they get a taste of their own medicine

[Menalque]

Why do aggressors always feel the need to play the victim as soon as they get a taste of their own medicine

Referring to yourself or something?

It's quite clear from my posts that I think Iconeum is scum who is deliberately trying to troll/play around what people think more than actually engage and sort the game.

Lmao as if that’s not what you’re doing here

Again, you started this

And you completely failed to make that clear in your early interactions with him

If you’d just fucking said that instead of resorting to “icon is scum read the thread ur all dumb lol” then there probably wouldn’t have been any mocking posts whatsoever

But instead you’re trying to make out you’re the victim of a clique that doesn’t exist who demonstrably from the quotes above were not unpleasant to you at all even as you did everything you could to provoke a reaction

[Menalque]

Fuck off?

Get fucked, plank

Get fucked, plank

you get fucked

Get fucked, plank

you get fucked

Nah I’m pretty sure you can just absolutely get fucked

Like fuck off with your attitude and stop being a prick

What an obnoxious clique you guys are.

Probably shouldn't play games of mafia together if you're going to just shitpost with in-jokes and unsubstantiated reference each other's meta. Here making it harder for Aaron to question why Iconeum 'conftowns' emps again with vague nonsense. People can barely even play this game without having to deal with the three of you making (a probably unconscious and not that you're all scum) a concerted effort to back one another up.

It's fucking shit.

Like fuck off with your attitude and stop being a prick

Then fuck off with your little clique.

UP: I dIdNt SaY aNyTHiNg tO dEseRvE tHAt

[Menalque]

No, Icon still was not reading properly and did nothing but mock and continues to lazily sit on this wagon.

You also did not quote every post, and left out the ones that are mocking.

The lengths you are going to, to try and pretend that you did not just call me a cunt, tell me to leave the game and engage in mocking/question why I even signed up to the game? Wow.

I literally quoted every post in reference to you could you stop lying please

[Menalque]

I openly admitted I called you a cunt

My objection is that you’re acting like you’re an innocent little babby in all this instead of a toxic asshole who got called out on it and immediately started playing the victim

[Menalque]

You didn't quote all of them but anyway.

No, Icon still was not reading properly and did nothing but mock and continues to lazily sit on this wagon.

You also did not quote every post, and left out the ones that are mocking.

The lengths you are going to, to try and pretend that you did not just call me a cunt, tell me to leave the game and engage in mocking/question why I even signed up to the game? Wow.

I literally quoted

every post in reference to you

could you stop lying please

[Menalque]

Go on then, quote the posts that were mocking you that weren’t in the big spoiler at the top of the page

I’ll wait

[Menalque]

I openly admitted I called you a cunt

My objection is that you’re acting like you’re an innocent little babby in all this instead of a toxic asshole who got called out on it and immediately started playing the victim

If someone is being called a cunt and told to leave a game, they have every right to call out the person talking to them as a bully. It is clear-cut bullying.

Admitting you called me a cunt, is different to admitting that it is the wrong thing to do.

Get some thicker skin and get over it

I don’t think it was the wrong thing to do

[Menalque]

Again, you didn't quote every post in reference to me. Lol.

Go on then, quote the posts that were mocking you that weren’t in the big spoiler at the top of the page

I’ll wait

[Menalque]

I will admit I should not have told you to leave the game

[Menalque]

The stop scumclaiming thing was about looker?

And me asking you why you signed up was a genuine question given that you seemed to have zero interest in actually playing vs trolling at that point

[Menalque]

Menalque you are a very cruel person.

I'm going to focus on playing mafia now.

Get over yourself and stop playing the victim

[Menalque]

You can tell me to fuck off as much as you like, leave other people who are being perfectly civil to you out of it when all they’re trying to do is to get you to actually play the game

[Menalque]

Menalque you are a very cruel person.

I'm going to focus on playing mafia now.

Get over yourself and stop playing the victim

Man why do I keep engaging with you when you continuously gaslight like this.

Gaslighting is much closer to what you’re trying to do acting as if you didn’t act like a toxic asshole from the get-go and needlessly insult someone who was nothing but polite to you

[Menalque]

Or rather, I shouldn't have to keep answering to some clique that is constantly doing it to everyone.

Funny how you’re the only one who seems to have a problem with me/icon/dats

[Menalque]

please stop defending me

i wasn't in the right either

You did nothing wrong

[Menalque]

Or rather, I shouldn't have to keep answering to some clique that is constantly doing it to everyone.

Funny how you’re the only one who seems to have a problem with me/icon/dats

Well, I was the one you all jumped on so that would make sense?

HOW DID WE ALL JUMP ONTO YOU

I WASNT EVEN THERE FOR MOST OF IT AND MY FIRST POST WAS “SEEMS TOXIC BUT BASICALLY NULL”

[Menalque]

You can tell me to fuck off as much as you like, leave other people who are being perfectly civil to you out of it when all they’re trying to do is to get you to actually play the game

I was playing the game, I was stating a townread and I don't have to keep answering to every single player's questions constantly just to post my thoughts as I read the game.

Just stating your thoughts and not actually explaining anything is playing the game in the same way hitting a ball against a wall is playing tennis

If you’re not actually working with anyone you’re not playing the game

[Menalque]

Could probably turn this into a case study of how bullies like Menalque look for opportunities to bully people when it fits the social surroundings.

lol

[Menalque]

More Iconeum votes until they actually start reading the game.

Until it* starts reading the game.

Nope.

Nice AtE scum.

Vote Iconeum then.

Lynch me pls.

VOTE: UltimatePlank

Yep, lynch me pls. Then just lynch Iconeum tomorrow.

It's very easy to see that you are twisting my words and asking questions about things I didn't say, but I can't be bothered debating it.

You're either scum or impressively stupid and I have no interest in arguing with either.

I haven't had my coffee yet, it's too early for this shit...

Pedit: oh good self voting love it

Yep.

Play stupid games, win stupid prizes.

It's very obvious that I'm town in this interaction. You're just voting who you perceive as more, "toxic" while the scum player twists words and plays smugly.

More votes on me pls.

S

P

A

M

Is a nutritious meal

zzzzzz why aren't i lynched yet

It's been 5 whole minutes more votes pls

Yeah you were super invested in making yourself readable, clearly

[Menalque]

And again, it’s playing the game in the same way that practising penalties is playing football

Mafia is fundamentally a cooperative team game

If you think you’re just gonna answer what you like when you like and otherwise refuse to make yourself readable while insisting you’re obviously town then you’re trying to play a team game solo which is not playing the game in a meaningful way, especially when requests for you to do so at all are met with flaming

[Menalque]

I think plank is probably town because of how pedantically focused they’ve been on being called a cunt which seems like a really weird thing to obsess over as scum and to make into a major issue

It feels kinda gross reading them off that but can’t really help it

That said, I still want to lynch them so that this can’t be an issue further down the line

If y’all think I’m the fundamental problem here I’m okay with being lynched instead but I strongly suspect that plank will have another 5 page meltdown with someone even if I’m dead seeing as he’s managed two in less than 24 hrs

[Menalque]

But yeah I think probably the most +town thing to do is to lynch one of me/plank today

[Menalque]

Dats and emps are town as well I’m p sure
Also confidentish on GL, bji, icon

[Menalque]

Looker may be scum
Wilky May be scum
Ceejay may be scum

Pine!slot is true null

AFF is giving me weird vibes but I don’t read him that well I think

Whoever else is here that I haven’t mentioned is potentially scum trying not to rock the boat bc I honestly don’t remember them being in the game

[Menalque]

Oh, Bob

Yeah bob could be scum

Probably all the scum in (looker, wilky, ceejay, pine!slot, AFF, Bob)

[Menalque]

let's not advocate for policying of this nature

like

please

I just think this is probably what’s best for the gamestate at this point

[Menalque]

Like I won’t insist on us lynching between the two of us but i sincerely doubt that the last 6(?) pages made anyone wanna play this game more and that’s gonna be fatal for town

There’s enough good players here that I don’t consider my presence vital and I feel quite good about that list having all the scum?

[Menalque]

I mean I know who I normally work with and anyone who I can have a multipage swearing filled blowout with ain’t it

Bob is potentially scum because when I was going through my reads I literally forgot he was here and had to check the PL and I would normally expect him to be more interesting

I’d rather lynch in the first 3 names tho

[Menalque]

Why is bob clearly town or am I just gonna get told to fuck off for having the temerity to ask

[Menalque]

Like I won’t insist on us lynching between the two of us but i sincerely doubt that the last 6(?) pages made anyone wanna play this game more and that’s gonna be fatal for town

so you can kill town morale more by getting a townflip that helps us with absolutely nothing

or you could try to repare what is left

pedit: i think i'd rather go wilky and ceejay actually

What’s shifted your feelings on looker?

[Menalque]

Like I said Bob is potentially scum because I didn’t remember him being in the game

I would say bob is normally a more memorable player than that, so me forgetting him means he hasn’t done anything to stand out or rock the boat which I think aligns much more with the last time I played against scum!him

He’s not a good lynch for today, or at the top of that list, but if (looker, wilky, ceejay, pine) didn’t give all the scum then I think Bob or Aaron would be the most likely to flip scum

[Menalque]

395 is a fair point with wilky!scum but I think 399 is degraded as town!indicatice because that had already been mentioned and I don’t think it’s outside bob’s scumrange to bring up something already touched on as a fake mindmeld

[Menalque]

Yoink

[Menalque]

Hello People!
I am here on behalf of a duck with urgent news!
Please be nice to each other!
Thank you very much

Yes, yes, received

Sorry, ducky

[Menalque]

560

I snorted out loud

[Menalque]

Okay I’m going to sleep now

Don’t lynch anyone while I’m gone (unless their name rhymes with “booker” “bilky” or “beebaybova”)

[Menalque]

Ugh also UNVOTE:

[Menalque]

bob has like some sort of elaborate pyramid scheme for reading posts/catching up and i still dont understand it after reading it like 3 times

It’s v simple to understand really

If u venmo me 5 bucks and get 10 of your friends to venmo me 5 bucks too I’ll explain

[Menalque]

Not caught up, can anyone put anything priority for me in bold right after this post

I have a relatively light day tomorrow so I’ll be here reading in the afternoon and ready to jam then

[Menalque]

what is my alignment in this game?

Wow datisi that’s super helpful thank you so much

[Menalque]

Also did I not already say that you’re town

I thought I did

[Menalque]

sure do.

(Mena, UP, GL, bob)
(Ico, emps)
(Aaron, bji)
(Pine) - null
(ceejay)
(Looker, wilky)

So why do you TR bob?

[Menalque]

sure do.

(Mena, UP, GL, bob)
(Ico, emps)
(Aaron, bji)
(Pine) - null
(ceejay)
(Looker, wilky)

Also this feels like very very similar to my readslist

Idk how I feel about that actually

[Menalque]

Like I should feel good I think, but have our reads normally been that similar when we’ve been town together in the past? Like I feel there’s generally more differential and I do think that you would try to pocket me as scum, especially if you could get me to TR you first

[Menalque]

I also think you’re one of the people who probably would be more capable of pocketing me than most cause reasons

[Menalque]

if i had to make a readslist i think itd look smth like this

datisi
gl, ico
af
like everyone else - null
plank - like null but a confusing null

I’m null for you at this point in the game emps?

Why?

[Menalque]

datisi whats up with the plank tr, bob tr, and wilky sr?

plank is gut town + sticking to his guns as he is wrt reads + that shitfight was prob TvT
bob was mindmeldy, explained earlier
basically bob's and GL's thoughts on wilky are v cloe to my own

Oh I suppose I missed the bob bit earlier then, I’ll ISO for it

[Menalque]

personally it was 395 and 399 being mindmeld-y posts for me
and then GL also came to the same conclusion

and my mind isn't exactly changed on looker but if we're discussing ceejay/wilky i'd rather go wilky

Oh right, this

Okay, explain why this is enough for bob to go into top town

Why do you feel that mindmeld was so strongly town!indicative

[Menalque]

plank is also playing this completely different compared to his only scumgame on site

He only has one completed game on site

In which he was scum, and played a LOT more reasonable game then whatever the fuck this is

And you can even look at stuff like this: pretending that he is trying to sort my slot when he very obviously is not and still keeps his vote there.

I think plank read far too much into whether someone’s vote was on or not or where it was at the time they said something

(1) that’s not particularly useful for sorting alignment it’s often NAI and (2) any decent scum can fake vote/stance consistency

[Menalque]

I think I’m locking tchill as town now actually. That reading way too much into votes and where they are seems to be a consistent thought process in plank, from when he calls out GL as scummy early on, and then explains why I think his reads were bad when being on icon for the same thing. It fits as well with someone who’s a relative newb and who’s read the scumhunting articles on the wiki, bc I remember being at that point myself. His arrogance and complaining about “cliques” that don’t exist was aggravating and I got more worked up than I should have but I don’t see any of that coming from a scum thought process, and I think ultimately icon is probably right that it’s just too different from his existing game to be scum especially if he is a newbie and not an alt (which the overreliance on wiki scumhunting advice suggests to me)

[Menalque]

UltimatePlank has requested replacement.

Well hopefully this'll make the game more readable.

I'm not gonna slap a read on either Mena or UP for their interactions on recent pages but it's probably not s/s unless it's some really well planned theater, but the replace-out disproves this.

Actually yeah definitely not s/s

Why don’t you wanna use it to inform your read? Like I get not wanting to overly rely on AtE or anything along those lines but this just seems like you’re looking for an excuse to avoid participating or having to give an analysis which is AI for both of us

[Menalque]

This game is a thing. I am semi-VLA right now. Go on with D1, I'll catch up.

This is Pine’s only post?

I know you’re VLA but like you need to do more than this

You also used a legitimate VLA to avoid contributing in our first ever scumgame together, so I want at least some skimming of content even if it’s just skimming ISOs

[Menalque]

UNVOTE: UltimatePlank

I'm very glad to see UltimatePlank go.

The entire fight between UP and Menalque was very hard to read and very, very anti-town. It is about what I expected to happen eventually which is why I did not want to play with UP. I am glad that we got this out of the way early in the game though. But to be clear, this is not praise for Menalque for making it happen. Pages of his bile-filled comments are bad for the game and bad for town.

Unfortunately, just reading all of that and taking notes took up almost all of the limited time I had for mafia today. I apologize and will try to find more time to post tomorrow.

I don’t love this. You say it’s anti-town and I can see where you’re coming from in terms of it making the thread unpleasant and making people less likely to play. But you’re putting excessive emphasis on that by saying “very, very anti-town” when by the end we were cooperating even if we didn’t like each other, and I think it produced a lot of AI content from both of us.

Also why are you trying to single me out here? That was a two-way street and we both said unpleasant things. Also don’t like that this is basically void of any analysis of why that was “anti-town” and I want you to touch on my points here about the production of AI content when you come back.

[Menalque]

mena/GL/emps all town

datisi not giving me any reason to scumread her

Is there a distinction in your feelings on datisi vs on me/GL/emps?

What do you think of my points on plank!slot town?

Also, what about ceejay did you think was buddying?

[Menalque]

VOTE: wilky

Also, why did you vote wilky here?

[Menalque]

Okay my phone is at 2% battery rn so I’m gonna finish later

[Menalque]

VOTE: bugs

[Menalque]

Sorry, can’t resist a spicy lolhammer

Were you scum bugs?

[Menalque]

Don’t feel bad if you were this is a p stacked playerlist and ur still p new

I can give you feedback postgame if you like

[Menalque]

bugs i know you're online

[Menalque]

In fairness I actually can’t see this forum from main page rn so maybe they don’t realise they’re lynched?

[Menalque]

I’m about a mile behind but on the flip side I had a p amazing weekend so there’s that

I may catch up tonight but also I’m worried that’s gonna mean that I stay up til 3 when I wanted to get to bed early, so more likely I’ll do it tomorrow as I’m no longer going skiing

[Menalque]

Also UNVOTE: as I assume that my fakehammer gambit did not result in bugs outing themself as scum or day would be over

[Menalque]

Hi chem

Also

VOTE: bob

[Menalque]

Ehh actually i guess i should reserve this vote for once I read through chronologically instead of ISO

[Menalque]

I think bob is significantly above average to flip scum tho and I think that may mean we don’t have a wagon on scum atm

UNVOTE:

[Menalque]

Ugh wait no we have like less than 24 hrs

Can we get more votes here please?

VOTE: bob

I think bob is consistently pushing slots that look scummy rather than that necessarily are scummy and I’m reminded quite a lot from ISO skimming him of his ISO in tris’ mini normal

[Menalque]

Counterwagon is Wilky, though, Chem, so you might be fucked.

Interesting attempt to frame yourself as not being the counterwagon when you are

[Menalque]

Okay I’m not letting myself get sucked in here or I’ll be here forever

Pls vote bob while I sleep and I’ll make the deal that you’ll retroactively appreciate why your vote was good after I explain more tomorrow?

[Menalque]

Yo I’m kind of here now

I don’t think chem flips scum at this point because there’s we’ve been stalling out in that direction for days and I would expect his partners to be doing something, even if that something was hard bussing, rather than just letting the lynch default there while not even getting credit — the corollary to this and also scummy given the reaction to chem repping in is if chem is scum that scum were on super early (icon, GL, bji) at a glance, and so were gonna get credit without needing to push later

I think that the reaction from bob in particular and also but less so from icon/looker is concerning in that there seems to be a late push to make sure that chem gets flipped which makes me think of scum worried they’re losing their D1 mislynch — which is, let’s not forget, fundamentally a lurker lynch — due to a player repping in who may actually obvtown. Which means that continuing to push the lynch later would look really bad or would mean having to give up on lynching a slot they did a bunch of groundwork on

[Menalque]

I’m gonna be catching up but working on masters applications so I may be a little spotty in my presence here but ping me questions as I go

[Menalque]

@GL from skimming this page are you townreading bob? If so why?

[Menalque]

Pine's going to have to be replaced. How quickly you rush into accusations when not everyone's even playing.
I don't keep up with whatever ratio whatever mod wants to put in whatever game. It's weird that you're exploiting such a simple question.

Spoiler:

Looker (3):

Datisi, Menalque, AaronFrost

UltimatePlank (4):

Iconeum, UltimatePlank, bji, wilky,

Datisi (1):

emps

bji (1):

Looker

ceejayvinoya (1):

GuiltyLion

wilky (1):

bob3141

not voting (2):

ceejayvinoya, Pine
13 alive, 7 to lynch

Opportunism abounds, and I don't trust it.
VOTE: bji

what's with the bji vote here, looker?

why did you never follow this up icon and what exactly is your looker read? adding as I read: you also interact with him the page after where he hasn't answered you or commented on you calling out the him/dats exchange

because you seem to have gone from "he townslipped" to "yeah he doesn't look great here" and asking him to explain stuff back to suggesting that voting him is scummy in the late hours of today

[Menalque]

ngl, that's a pretty scummy entrance bugsy

although I do agree with this, bugs!entrance was worse than anything that ceejay produced

[Menalque]

I don’t think chem flips scum at this point because there’s we’ve been stalling out in that direction for days

yeah the wagon has been stalling for days

and the moment chemist reps in

the wagon clears and looper wagon grew faster then you could say 'wowzers'

i'm not sure how you townread that exactly

I mean I don't want to lynch looker I want to lynch bob, although looker is in my "concerning" pile of people

and this isn't really what I'm saying: I'm saying that the stalling out on chem!slot indicates town I think. the wagon clearing on him is NAI

but I think chemist is a relatively easy read and I don't know why you want to commit to lynching him so hard when he's likely to be readable in a few days and there are other equally scummy slots (again, such as bob, who I'll get to once I finish catch up)

unless you think that chem!slot is miles scummier than anyone else in which case why?

[Menalque]

I don't like your unwillingness to re-evaluate chem!slot based on game state icon, but I'm vining with you pretty hard on page 27

[Menalque]

vibing* goddamnit

[Menalque]

Scum theatrics and AtE.

@looker - why the vote on bji, specifically? If we're looking at UP voters...

We're not.

if your opportunism comment was about your own voters, why vote someone on another wagon?

Because I don't know who's scum. Some people are just horrific players.

It's a toss-up between bji and GuiltyLion for me.

this is just my dumb tinfoil brain before i actually do smart analyis but
VOTE: looker kinda feels lowkey lamist in a bad way and also different from the micro noormal where we mislynched thsi player

Different how?

---

And if we're referencing past games of mine that people have modded, why don't you check the dead threads where I asked the same question about scum-to-town ratio? Just like here, no one would give me a straight answer (or even a link to the formula).

• It's highly possible I might have to replace as well.

Datisi is boring and hapless, but that doesn't always mean scum. Saying that you would fake a townslip doesn't mean that I would. I'm in several games, and most mods put the ratio in the rules post and the 13 alive/7 to lynch stat in the votecount. The effortlessness of the research required and the fact that it wasn't accomplished is disheartening. It makes me question trying.

• I'm also reconciling the fact that as cool and as level-headed as people come across as mods is not always how they come across as players. I don't know if it's on purpose or not, but either way, it's disheartening.

Spoiler:

wilky (2):

bob3141, GuiltyLion,

Looker (3):

Datisi, AaronFrost, bugspray

Datisi (2):

emps, UltimatePlank

UltimatePlank (1):

wilky

bji (1):

Looker

bugspray (1):

Iconeum

not voting (3)

: Pine, Menalque, bji
13 alive, 7 to lynch!

SCUM {GuiltyLion/bji | bugspray/UltimatePlank | datisi/wilky} TOWN
Just so I can remember who I've looked at.

icon what is your take specifically on this post?

@looker 2 things

(1) if you wanna address me then address me directly, I don't mind

(2) 3 scum in a 13 player is an assumed standard and would only be worth reevaluating if confirmed!power role strength was very high for town which might indicate a traitor

[Menalque]

and this isn't really what I'm saying: I'm saying that the stalling out on chem!slot indicates town I think. the wagon clearing on him is NAI

i disagree on this, I think the stalling out usually indicates a scummy slot where town disagrees on and scum obviously isn't gonna help push

if chem is scum, and scum was on wagon, this was a great time for them to evacuate the buss on hop on looker

ofcourse nothing was stopping them from doing so earlier, i'm not very sure hmmm

I disagree, I think stalling out is slightly +town because it shows that scum are probably okay with that lynch happening and they know that if they just wait it out the top wagon is fairly likely to go through under deadline pressure so they have very little incentive to expose themselves by pushing that lynch when that makes them look worse in endgame

but admittedly, that does depend on a level of sophistication from scum players and the ability to resist pushing an easy mislynch

and yeah, I think your final point is good analysis, why don't scum create a counter wagon earlier or try to divert?

[Menalque]

I don't like your unwillingness to re-evaluate chem!slot based on game state icon, but I'm vining with you pretty hard on page 27

it's not that i'm unwilling to re-evaluate chemist

i said that his catchup feels very survivalistic and i don't like it

the fact that looker wagon grew so fast after his own wagon got stalled feels scum indicative

you mean scum!indicative for chem right?

@menal, i'll have that done in the next 24 hours as well as your prev question wrt bji

in the meanwhile, can you reread chemist iso and see what i mean about him being survivalistic and not really diggin into why looper is scum? it's literally 'oh hey looper opening post is scummy', and how he referred to bugs 'good job on your vote there' that feels very off tonally

dude I'm about 400 posts or something behind, I'm just trying to catch up chronologically

if I can I'll look at chem's ISO as well but rn my priority is trying to be informed on what everyone has been doing the last 3-4 days while I haven't been here

[Menalque]

@wilky, regarding 673 when are you normally around to jam?

I kind of like wilky for town off've this?

I think him v bob is unlikely to be SvS

I think the way bji phrased his question has been made into more than it should have been and is NAI, although I think what he was doing was +town -- trying to make datisi and I take hardish stances on each other for reading later game esp if one of us flips

I also kind of like the questioning the looker TR on him? I hesitate to TR this too much bc I do that as scum, but looking at their topics and based on what wilky is saying in this post, it seems like they haven't played a lot recently, so that combined with them being aware of their lack of presence makes it more likely that they would just take a TR rather than feel the need to poke into it

[Menalque]

i just checked

if ur about 400 posts behind, you haven't read the 'good stuff' wrt chemist i'm talking about yet

that stuff doesn't start until post 1000 +.

We can have this conversation after you read him

yeah okay this works, I'm hoping to get that far today

[Menalque]

like rn I'm still trying to read with commentary but I gtg do RL work soon in which case I may try to just read later and then jam in real time

[Menalque]

Still think the UP slot is scum for the earlier flip flopping.

GL is town, menalque is town. BJI i'm thinking town.

I'm gonna reread datisi in a bit but I do like their post casing looker.
From above makes me lean scum on looker.

Still gotta sort everyone else will also give that a go later.

can you talk to me about UP!scum? do you still think this?

[Menalque]

Wilky woudl you describe your answers as defensive?

Also wilky when you say you get better as you go on. Are you infect not simply setting up an excuse for why your on mislynches? As you infact dodged the question. I was asking are you sayign you get better as lynching as teh days goes on? and why shoudl we not think your simply setting up an excuse for reads that turn out bad?

Wilky whey do you think my question to ico was answered? Why did you feel the need to comment on it in a post that had no relevance to it? Are you scum reading me for it? as you voted for ulti in it.

Do you agree with what players are sayign about your posts?

I will try to get something more thorough up on bob later but I think this is a good example of what I don't like from him this game:

I think he's deliberately trying to frame things in a certain way and not approaching wilky in good faith here. Like the suggestion is being made through asking the question that wilky is being defensive "excuse me sir have you stopped beating your wife?" it's the same idea

and then also suggesting that he's dodging questions and is scum setting up excuses. rather than looking at that and taking it for what it is which is pretty NAI -- lots of players don't actually get better as the game goes on, but they believe they do as they do hit scum more often due to there simply being a higher chance of rand!voting scum. I think wilky was also quite a mislynchable slot here due to low content, and I think scum!bob is trying to take advantage of that

I also think this is reminiscent of his spam questioning from here and general lack of commitment to stuff

[Menalque]

menal you could just read chemist iso real quick

it's not that long

yes, I could, but me doing that precludes me from reading the rest of the game which is more useful for me overall

like I know that you would like me to do that one particular thing and I get why, but I'm going shortly to do some other work as I've already mentioned and that's not where I'm focussing my attention yet

[Menalque]

flip-flopping basically meaning that he kept switching his thoughts quite drastically and quickly at the beginning.

this is actually town indicative and a not scum indicative if you aks me

ftr I think it's NAI when looked at in a general sense

[Menalque]

Still think the UP slot is scum for the earlier flip flopping.

GL is town, menalque is town. BJI i'm thinking town.

I'm gonna reread datisi in a bit but I do like their post casing looker.
From above makes me lean scum on looker.

Still gotta sort everyone else will also give that a go later.

how did you coem to conclusion of menal being town. All i can see in regards to menal is you asking someone else about his meta. You even say it was to help sort menal but at no point have you directly tried to sort menal. Yet you all ready decide he is town


You give much more progression BJI but next to none on menal. All you come up with is he didnt need to get involved in a conversation. First why do you think sscum would not of got involved like menal. And why do you feel that it is making you feel strongly about town menal

also dislike this: I don't think direct interaction is necessary to form a read on someone. the fact that the read being referred to is on me is immaterial

like instead of just openly approaching wilky on the read and trying to get him to expand on where it comes from --which he does also do tbf-- he focuses on how it's like the read comes out of nowhere and paints that as a scummy thing to do, when there's no evidence for the read having come out of nowhere, just that it's unstated. it's stretching to keep painting wilky as scummy

[Menalque]

@wilky thoughts on 874 please

[Menalque]

If you dont agree with my assessment of your progression on menal it would be very enlightening to see what your porgression on menal was in your opinion. As well as how strongly you town read menal.

I don't understand what you're saying here? Where did I say I didn't agree with it? You asked me to clarify my town read.

I actually just went back and ISO'd menalque there weren't any specific quotes I grabbed as I don't think any actually standout individually but I do still have the townread on him. I guess partly its gut but I also like his progression throughout the game so far.

@Menalque what is your read on Iconeum?

town but this is pending flips. the dragon has fooled me before but I think I normally read him pretty well, and I sometimes end up SR stuff that he does that's just him being mislynch baity

as already mentioned, if looker flips scum/chem flips town then I think his scum equity goes up a lot

[Menalque]

Wilky if you dont think your answers were defensive how would you describe the nature of your questions. not about whetehr you answer questiosn or not.

What are you asking here? Which questions specifically? And what do my questions I ask people have to do with the answers I give to questions asked to me?

You're fixed on a tunnel on me, its clouding your judgement and in your last couple posts you're actually twisting things in a way that either don't make sense or aren't true. Take 5 then come back with a clear head, come out of the tunnel and actually read my answers, not what you want to read.

this is townposting. I don't really see scum taking the approach of "chill out and come back to thread to read me" I think they probably ignore or they push back, and certainly if they're rusty on playing I think that this approach (which I think is also very good faith) is town

[Menalque]

largly null for most players. most havent said enough to get a read on the game of the game as a hole.

Although for now i think i got the info i need from this line of questioning.


Guilitylion what do you think of wilkys answers to my questions. Your also voting for wilky and said you agreeed on one of my questions i put to wilky. With you making deliberation on the post i was asking wilky about.

I think bob has been avoiding giving reads throughout because it's much easier to fake a tunnel and to avoid engaging with the rest of the thread than it is to convincingly have fake reads on the entire PL and to keep track of how you're meant to be reading each person and what your progression should be

[Menalque]

So then why are you not voting looker then?

If you think he is scum. Do you not want to be on chemist counter wagon? Is that reason you want your vote to be somewhere else.


menal dont forget you have never read me right once. In fact most players have poor read rate against me.

because I think you're more likely to be scum than looker and the fact that you're voting together on wilky is probably less scum!equity as a team

again, this is horribly bad faith. you're trying to suggest that there's a separate motivation to me having my vote on you other than me scum reading you. you've done the same thing to wilky earlier in the game

I also don't like you trying to coast by on "you haven't read me correctly in the past". unless I'm mistaken, we have 2 completed games together. in one of them, I did have you correctly within my PoE by the end, you were my second top scum read at that point after I'd already voted for 2 scum that game. second game yes, I misread you, but mostly because I was still thinking you weren't my top scum choice in the other game and I identified that there were differences between the two and that you were more likely scum than town because I thought you were town in tris'.

but overall this is just a weak argument? like yes, I haven't read you perfectly in the past, but that's no reason to think I can't read you here especially when the sample is 2 games

[Menalque]

Wilky if you dont think your answers were defensive how would you describe the nature of your questions. not about whetehr you answer questiosn or not.

What are you asking here? Which questions specifically? And what do my questions I ask people have to do with the answers I give to questions asked to me?

You're fixed on a tunnel on me, its clouding your judgement and in your last couple posts you're actually twisting things in a way that either don't make sense or aren't true. Take 5 then come back with a clear head, come out of the tunnel and actually read my answers, not what you want to read.

this is townposting. I don't really see scum taking the approach of "chill out and come back to thread to read me" I think they probably ignore or they push back, and certainly if they're rusty on playing I think that this approach (which I think is also very good faith) is town

So you have given a arguement as to why you think wilky is town. But what does this have to do with your read on me?

Although you quote is something scum can easily manufacturer. Its onyl when you push a little harder is when you find if its manufactured or not

I have literally made multiple comments on why I think this is scum!you referring to your other posts while I've been catching up. why are you addressing this post not the others?

especially when this post is about wilky!tonw not you!scum?

and I have no idea what you're trying to say with the bolded

[Menalque]

largly null for most players. most havent said enough to get a read on the game of the game as a hole.

Although for now i think i got the info i need from this line of questioning.


Guilitylion what do you think of wilkys answers to my questions. Your also voting for wilky and said you agreeed on one of my questions i put to wilky. With you making deliberation on the post i was asking wilky about.

I think bob has been avoiding giving reads throughout because it's much easier to fake a tunnel and to avoid engaging with the rest of the thread than it is to convincingly have fake reads on the entire PL and to keep track of how you're meant to be reading each person and what your progression should be

Thats a sure sign im town menal. It means there is no manipulation at play

it's not and that self-same post explains why. avoiding doing something to avoid the risk of getting caught being manipulative is itself scum behaviour. I don't think town are as worried about giving reads even if they're half formed because they know they can explain them or go into them more later and they don't have to worry about not looking scummy. but scum do, and it's easy to avoid looking scummy when you only have to justify a read on one person

[Menalque]

/you make your entire day about that one person