BooneyToonz UPick: Boon There, Done That [END]
- The Fonz
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I don't have zero base. I have not much base, what with it being page one and all, and don't get me wrong it was a fun vote coming from a place of love.In post 151, chkflip wrote:He has zero base on that. It's just a thing he said. Fonz is fun like that. The Nacho quote was from a game I didn't counterclaim his doc claim until the next day when the cop cleared me and guiltied his partner. I was railing into him pretty hard that phase. To his credit he almost got a newb to side with him.
VOTE: Kakeguri Addicts
Sheeping the og vote on this wag.
But after the last BT, plus your behaviour in that dead thread, I absolutely do not believe you want to be town in a game with Titus and Nancy (and TSE, though he wasn't there) if you have the chance to influence things otherwise. So I do think you are more likely than random to have made picks that are scum-only or often scum.
Sorry, bro. Guess you better catch scum early if you're town.
Sorry, bro.- The Fonz
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Get well soon, Titus!In post 158, Titus wrote:Not feeling well. Will try to post substantively tmo.- The Fonz
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Leashing seems like a decent idea. If we do that presumably the claimed Miller is a good call for one of the uses.In post 201, Vecna wrote:Anyways, I also have some other more pro-town stuff going on with my role Pm, so id prefer to just play the game instead of getting lynched d1- The Fonz
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Well there are investigative roles that aren't cops. But yeah.In post 223, GeorgeBailey wrote:
He could just target his scum allies I guess.In post 222, Auro wrote:If he was scum who could "cancerously millerize" town and neuter cops, why even claim it?
Which is why the targets should probably be:
1 on Miller. And 1 on the most confirmed Town for D1. Since there's no way to mechanically TR them after that.- The Fonz
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Upicks are inherently non random.In post 246, jjh927 wrote:
Your strong belief is wrong. Undivulged non-randomness is bastard. Alignment is assumed to be randomised.In post 244, The Fonz wrote:@Kakeguri: it is strongly my belief that alignment is not randomised prior to role creation, and that someone who wanted to be scum could influence role allocation by picking scum only roles for the Booneytoonz list, or quotes from players from games where they were scum, etc.- The Fonz
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What happens if someone picks Traitor, Framer, SK as their picks? How can they possibly end up town?In post 250, jjh927 wrote:
UPick ROLES are inherently non-random, but this does not include alignmentIn post 248, The Fonz wrote:
Upicks are inherently non random.In post 246, jjh927 wrote:
Your strong belief is wrong. Undivulged non-randomness is bastard. Alignment is assumed to be randomised.In post 244, The Fonz wrote:@Kakeguri: it is strongly my belief that alignment is not randomised prior to role creation, and that someone who wanted to be scum could influence role allocation by picking scum only roles for the Booneytoonz list, or quotes from players from games where they were scum, etc.- The Fonz
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It's low effort and unlikely to move the game forward. It means you're not picking up on anything happening in thread, which can speak to lack of town motive. *Shrug* I don't really see scum anywhere else yet, mostly people throwing their (presumably) usual playstyles at each other in a way that seems largely boring and NAI to me.In post 303, GeorgeBailey wrote:
That was actually my RVS. I kinda know the guy so I wanted some sort of reaction from him. I switched after nothing really happened with him.In post 247, The Fonz wrote:a presumably policy vote on TSE
Ye, what's wrong with voting people who havent even posted yet? I like to sort people after everyone has atleast posted a few times.In post 247, The Fonz wrote:followed by a vote on someone who's not here- The Fonz
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Eh, if his vote had been premised on everyone else being null at worst, that would be fine, that would be a stance he'd taken. I've done "Most of the active players seem like town with theory disagreement and egos, I suspect a high concentration of lurking scum" before. A naked vote on an inactive is basically the least useful thing a town player can do, so it speaks to a potential lack of town motive. He's also not participated in any form of mech chat.In post 314, Vecna wrote:Thats an odd post Fonz. Youre harping on George for not picking up on anything in the thread, yet he's your only scumread? And you dont see anything elsewhere yourself?
This is silly. There's conversation happening, I'm just getting a mixture of NAI and weak town vibes off of it. In that scenario, I vote for someone not doing much. This is also why I'm not actively defending the couple votes on me - as it happens, I'm struggling to get into the game, but "just struggling to get into the game" is a thing that is exhibited by scum >random.How can he pick up on anything if he's the only one doing anything noteworthy scummy according to you? You want him to scumread himself?- The Fonz
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Oooh me too. <3 AmrunIn post 337, Krazy Katz wrote:FYI Amrun works in healthcare and coronavirus means I'm basically in charge of this hydra until further notice.
She liked Conspire for town off early RVS posting but has been too busy to give a lot of updates since then, she's hoping to check in before the thread gets totally out of control but can't guarantee that will be tonight
-K- The Fonz
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Yeah, I actually don't care any more, I just figured the way Upicks are done is give everyone as close as possible to their picks while maintaining balance, and that if that were the case, chkflip is slightly more likely than anyone else to have requested all scum picks. That made it slightly better than random for a first page vote.In post 330, Venus and Mars wrote:
I personaly think alignment came first it would be weird if multiple people send scum roles and hard to balance and role isnt always alignment dependant anywa.In post 325, The Fonz wrote:Boon actively refused to answer the "Which came first, alignments or roles" type question btw, but implied it could be worked out based on in thread information.
~Venus- The Fonz
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Wait,what? Is this aimed at me?In post 348, chkflip wrote:Because I can simply not engage with you at the level you took it in that game. Never did I mention Titus, specifically, that I can recall. If there is a shit ton of ??????? confusion like there was in that game, I'm more likely to just allow someone else to understand and parse instead of repeating myself ad nauseam like we did there. Blaming me for your shit action in a game you also followed the same persons logic is a hilarious attempt at discrediting me out of the gate.- The Fonz
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Ah OK it wasn't attributed and followed my post, and I was also in that game.In post 352, Auro wrote:^No, it's at Nancy.- The Fonz
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Oh God we're going to get into another of those arguments about which specific escalation between "Your reads are wrong" and "I wish actual rl suffering on you and your loved ones" was the one that actually crossed the line. I'mma tap out for 24hrs for the sake of my mental health as I find these things deeply uncomfortable. Hopefully something happens to allow me to get a firmer read on the game on my return.- The Fonz
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Hey, the Boon Shakespeare game was really unpleasant for me mentally, and I make zero apologies for stepping out of this one for the sake of my wellbeing when it looked like it was going that way again. That wasn't a prodge, because I was active prior to it. I was very much actively in the game at that moment and needed to stop being.
As for the second I'm not making up a fucking read just to satisfy you, so go away.- The Fonz
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Nah. Lurker wise I think GB is scummier by some distance, and I'd probably rather do BTE than Conspire as well.In post 848, Auro wrote:@Fonz: Join us on the Conspire wagon?- The Fonz
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Not a lot. It's a vibe, mostly.In post 851, Auro wrote:Is there anything town-indicative you see from Conspire?- The Fonz
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It's a combination of cosmic seeming relaxed, and seeing the game the same way I do. Then the admittedly slightly forced push on chkflip looks like someone trying to get shit done without any strong pings to go off.In post 858, Auro wrote:Would you be able to explain why you get that vibe in some amount of detail?- The Fonz
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Eh, I think this is a reasonable twist on a juvenile delinquent; instead of potentially disabling all cops N1, it slowly removes cop abilities from the thread. And it makes sense for it to be a penalty you can remove, but it costs you a town lynch. It's also possible that certain roles are immune; my own role has a modifier whose in game effect is explicitly unknown, so I'm guessing there may be other unexplained modifiers out there, one of which might confer immunity.- The Fonz
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Relaxation - it's an anti LAMIST kind of vibe. They're not overly concerned with how they come across.In post 927, Auro wrote:
@The FonzIn post 861, Auro wrote:
"Seeming relaxed" - I don't recall the game consensus pushing them, is there a reason not to be relaxed as scum? With no concrete wagons anywhere, this is exactly the kind of gamestate where scum would be relaxed, no?In post 859, The Fonz wrote:It's a combination of cosmic seeming relaxed, and seeing the game the same way I do. Then the admittedly slightly forced push on chkflip looks like someone trying to get shit done without any strong pings to go off.
"Same way I do" - which parts, exactly?
"Get shit done" - Sure, if they're town, they're trying to go somewhere without strong pings. If they're scum, they're trying to appear town by making some push. What makes this more likely to come from town?
The lack of posts from the other head must be telling to some extent, no?
Seeing game same way: Not really seeing anything strong at this stage, but trying to push as best they can on the little they can find. I think it's reasonably easy for scum to fake strong stances if they think it's tactically advantangeous. And the missing head thing is a reach, mate. How is not being here at all SI?- The Fonz
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No I'm a nightkill immune Miller vig, isn't that what all the cool mods are calling it these days?In post 936, Krazy Katz wrote:Fonz j/w but if you claimed serial killer day 1 I just want you to know we wouldn't lynch you. So are you serial killer? You can claim it with day 1 safety is what I'm saying
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Yeah, but I'm at work so later.In post 997, Chronos wrote:Actually I don't like jjh's vote there, hmm..
UNVOTE:
Anyone got any hard town read on jjh and wants to fill me with their insight?- The Fonz
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Yep, specifically a modifier that Boon described as being like "Hmm what is this?" It's possible there's secret immunity modifiers. Of course, it's also possible there's secret susceptibility modifiers that might make people die from the virus. It's Boon.In post 1109, Michael Scott wrote:Didn't The Fonz also say there was some hidden/unexplained part in his role?
I basically agree with any "Vecna didn't make this up, and probably wouldn't have claimed it as scum," takes. My one fear is that Vecna is a third party, who wins if everyone gets the virus or something.- The Fonz
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No opinion about them to the point of the quoted post; had they even posted?In post 1120, Michael Scott wrote:The Fonz, what do you think about Mechanic?
A quick ISO reveals that their gripes are similar to mine, and their reads are the same except for me it's JJH rather than Chronos I town read off the early game.- The Fonz
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Right UTD.
I town read JJH, Michael Scott, Vecna, Conspire and will oppose any attempt to wagon those.
Nancy is pretty hard null, that is seems to be hewing so closely to meta that I can't say I have any opinion either way. Don't really want to lynch her because I think she's useful if town and likely to tell later.
I'm mil gut scum reading Titus off play, but idk if she would fakeclaim renegade, or claim it honestly as scum right off the bat.
George, Dave and BTE are definitely not outside my POE at the moment.- The Fonz
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I'll ISO now and post JJH related thoughts all together.In post 1226, Chronos wrote:Fonz, what do you think of jjh now as opposed to early game?- The Fonz
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Yeah JJH is still town. Looks to me like he found a pretty strong scumread in Dave, sat on it, made some effort to flag it up to others, then saw that wasn't flying so just joined in pushes on low content slots to get things going. Currently on George which I think is a decent shout for an actual lynch, still not really seeing any solve minded actions there.- The Fonz
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Part of the problem here is there's like a core of nullness for me in Kakeguri, nom, xtoxm/sore feet, chronos, where I don't necessarily agree with any arguments any of them are forwarding, see them all as plausibly coming from town but not outside the scum range of decent scum. The thing Mechanic talked about where everyone's basing a lot on meta of games I wasn't in is part of this.- The Fonz
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He's just super mediocre and not showing a ton of scumhunting initiative. I don't think there's a much better scumcase on anyone else right now.In post 1235, Chronos wrote:Hmm idk this progression thing reads well for dave. Seems like a perfectly reasonable reaction to make if he doesn't think jjh is making a fair point and using their experience in the wrong way. Why are people scum reading him again?
Chronos, do you believe that all role info put into the thread so far is probably genuine?- The Fonz
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It's more that town makes more effort to post in thread even when it's personally inconvenient, especially if they feel their solving skills are needed. Most memorably embodied by Yosarian2 posting in a lylo as town the morning after his wedding.In post 1240, Conspire wrote:Really? I've always been the reverse. Feels dirty to use irl as an excuse when scum.
-Cosmic
I find it's less about specifically making excuses as to how much focus someone puts on using their limited time to sort/place key votes/etc. Like if someone is being asked to claim, and posts to say they don't have time to claim and it's unfair, they're almost certainly scum.- The Fonz
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Yes.In post 1247, Chronos wrote:
I skipped all of them because it gives me a migraine and I suck with mechanics anyway.In post 1237, The Fonz wrote:Chronos, do you believe that all role info put into the thread so far is probably genuine?
Want my newb takes anyway?- The Fonz
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Vecna's claim, Titus' claim, KK claiming Miller, my modifier of unknown effect?In post 1259, Chronos wrote:Ok, specifically what am I supposed to comment on? Vecna's claim?- The Fonz
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Players playing to meta are null. I haven't to the best of my recollection seen your scum game, but I have more respect for you than to think you'd behave so differently from your town game to town read you just for having a similar tone to prior games before I start getting flips and analyzing wagon dynamics.In post 1333, Venus and Mars wrote: @Fonz and @chk? How tf am I a null to both of you here? What have I been doing that is even remotely different here than in the last game?- The Fonz
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Unvote, vote Davesaz
Timing of that is SUPER suspect, Dave. You've had all game to vote Vecna based off his claim, and now you're doing it at a point when the anti Vecna sentiment is swelling based on lacklustre recent play? Without actually being willing to call that play scummy? In fact distancing yourself from your vote in the same paragraph you make it by claiming that it's for information and you're not committed to lynching him.- The Fonz
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Nah. You were here a few days ago when he first claimed. It's not like you haven't made posts since then.In post 1366, davesaz wrote:Are you having difficulty understanding that I'm only actually here the few minutes around each time I post?
Of course the timing is "now" because "now" is when I'm here.
Here's the thing. None of your justification is new, it was all available immediately after he claimed.
What's changed? KK and a couple others expressing willingness to lynch the guy. Based on new developments, ie Vecna not contributing much lately. But that doesn't play into your claimed reasoning.- The Fonz
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I'm OK with the game millerizing. I suspect the game is balanced such that it will ultimately not matter too much, and that a single mislynch is more costly.In post 1371, chkflip wrote:So you're 100% okay with the game millerizing if he's being honest and losing to some strange cult-like 3rd party bullshit we won't be able to get ahead of if he's lying?
I'm just curious where your line is, Fonz.- The Fonz
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Yeah, I think you're wrong, but I can live with people who are eitherIn post 1378, sore feet wrote:my stance is that lynching a low power/neg utility/possible 3p role d1 is still a good outcome town. its a boon game and its role madness, avoiding a lynch on a strong role leaves town better off.
particularly when the player in the slot:
- is putting zero effort into finding an alternative lynch to itself
- not engaging wrt use of its role
- not someone i trust vote correctly in lylo
not to speak for BTE.
A) Willing to openly policy lynch
B) Willing to put their neck on the line and say its a scum gambit.
My problem is with players who:
C) Say they agree with me that they think it's a trap role, designed to bait town into a harmful mislynch, but are OK with doing that mislynch anyway
D) Decide to vote the player after others express suspicion, when the reason they give for the vote was truebeforeanyone else expressed suspicion.- The Fonz
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This role was claimed six days ago? Why didn't you react like this at the time?In post 1402, nomnomnom wrote:apparently from what I've seen there's a massive role that can fuck everyone over so it's preferable to policy lynch there? Why aren't we doing that- The Fonz
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This is bad reasoning.In post 1823, Venus and Mars wrote:We are not unvoting RCE his vote is blood atrocious, replacing a twice lurking slot is icing in the cake for the lynch.
~Venus
Even if I didn't dislike this lazy "Multiple replace = scum" meme that seems to be a thing now (Krazy was town in TBONTB, lol) the first replace being caused by the player being site banned for toxic behavior makes it difficult to think that was alignment relevant.- The Fonz
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They quoted me saying I was taking time out of the game for mental health reasons to ask me if I'd responded to people calling me underwhelming. I was obviously not going to respond because... I was taking time out for MH reasons, so it looked kinda fake.
It's also unclear how anyone can usefully respond to people calling them underwhelming. Like, I can absolutely see why people thought that, I was having trouble getting reads. The only way to change that is to get more into the game. Am I supposed to turn around and lie and say that I'm not having trouble getting into the game? Am I supposed to OMGUS people for not unreasonable reads? It feels like a trap question.
Also, if you read their justification, it's not "I feel Fonz is underwhelming." It's "Other people are saying Fonz is underwhelming." Which has that "Hiding behind other people's reasoning" aspect to it.- The Fonz
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This looks like a town thought process tbhIn post 1969, RCEnigma wrote:I'll give minor points since two people had already claimed to receive Barb's and you didn't read them at all. Which town!Nancy would do and I'm not sure if scum!Nancy would or wouldn't miss that information.- The Fonz
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I don't want anything to do with the chk vs Nancy argument. I think I it's most likely TvT, but I'm more confident in chk town, and if forced to pick between them I will. I agree that basically everything chk brings up is really unpleasant to play with in terms of the defensiveness, the need to be TR, the accusing any disagreement of being awful play. I just think that's Nancy. At least, Nancy in current headspace. The only bit I think might be AI is the bit near the end about Vecna.
chk simply doesn't lay his ass on the line like that if he ain't town.
@Titus, would you strongly object to being passed a barb? I clarified with Boon that me being passed it wasn't it being used on me, and me passing it isn't me using it either. I feel there's some town utility in testing your role, and you may (do not comment here on whether you can or not) be able to make it loyal, disloyal or desperate in a way that helps confirm alignment down the road. I don't want you not to receive anything, and I don't want Nancy to have to declare where she's sending.
OTOH there is a risk that passing the barb might mean one or other of us gets pricked in the handover.- The Fonz
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The Fonz Jack of All Trades
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I atted you, I'd appreciate if you could give it a quick peek.In post 2179, Titus wrote:Is there anything urgent I need to read in the explosion of posts last night? I just want to play with poisonous inactivated barbs. What could go wrong?- The Fonz
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Nancy, you're making me super uncomfortable, and if me pointing that out makes you feel hurt, c'est la vie.
You figuratively bit my fucking head off for daring tonullread you.
I feel like you try to make people feel deficient on a human level, whether intellectually or morally, for opposing you on an in game level.
On an in game level, it seems actually bizarre to me that you genuinely think claiming to be essentially an inventor, not a town only role, in a UPICK, makes you basically conftown. I say if it were to come down to lynching you or chk, I'd rather lynch you, and you point out that isn't the scenario rn. I agree. That isn't the choice atm, and I don't want it to be. That shoulda been clear.
But it is possible for someone to both be intelligent and playing in good faith, and not townread you here.- The Fonz
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She can see this as obvious, but it's not from a neutral perspective, and emphasising "I'm a hardclaimed power role!" when everyone is presumably a power role is of no value. Anyway I just really don't want to talk about Nancy; it makes me unhappy and I don't think she's particularly scummy. My game related thoughts basically boil down to "Nancy is probably town, but scum are probably claiming to TR her because why would you release the almighty power of her OMGUS when you don't have to?"In post 2328, Michael Scott wrote:@Fonzie: She picked literally the same role as in a previous game and got it, and it's also a +town role if she gets her picks right. It's totally plausible she sees this as obvious town.- The Fonz
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I think I'm conflicted on SF, though to be honest I don't really remember what that's based on, and I want to go play DND instead of mafia rn.In post 2331, Michael Scott wrote:Sure. You wanna join on SF? Or do you townread them? - The Fonz
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