Mini Normal 2132 [Game Over]

[Morning Tweet]

hi hectic hi cat hi bob hi cakez !!

VOTE: Hectic

[Morning Tweet]

hi hectic hi cat hi bob hi cakez !!

VOTE: Hectic

That's 4 greeting tells all in one post. Welcome to the

Field of Suspects

.

That said; hello again!

Aha! don't you realize that two greeting tells cancel each other out? ive got u now >:)

also ily (^ ω ^*)

[Morning Tweet]

So, of course it's a reach, but do we have any hard info on meta-tells on any of these people?

this is a wacky thing to say. do you usually commence the metadiving within the first couple of dozen posts?

[Morning Tweet]

[quote="In Aha! don't you realize that two greeting tells cancel each other out? ive got u now >:)

also ily (^ ω ^*)

You win this one, Morning Tweet, but only because you have emoji-indicative tells and ily2

I'm sure you what's coming if you don't cooperate though ʢ• ͡•ʡ

(; ﹏ ; )

i hope

it's not

what i think it is

[Morning Tweet]

also ty for the context dave

[Morning Tweet]

So, of course it's a reach, but do we have any hard info on meta-tells on any of these people?

this is a wacky thing to say. do you usually commence the metadiving within the first couple of dozen posts?

I think it's a reference back to the 50p that Wake modded where metadiving was a very big thing.

I've seen/read though like 6 Wake games, but they were all town. I may or may not have gained some knowledge while impersonating him in the 50 player large for a bit. Wake, have you rolled scum in the last year?

if waka hasnt rolled scum this year

gambler's fallacy here i come

VOTE: waka

hey at least you're honest about it!

[Morning Tweet]

NOT AGAAAIIINN

how will i possibly ever live this down

Hectic, what is it you want from me? it's yours! just not another game of this!

[Morning Tweet]

day 1 is my favourite. except when the first 20 pages are me getting bullied by certain animal pictures

it happens somewhat surprisingly often!

[Morning Tweet]

does that mean i can consider it animal cruelty if someone tries to extort me this game

pedit:

OH NO

[Morning Tweet]

I've been to LYLO twice ever, it is NOT my cup of tea.

ok-- im going to rank them in order of cuteness:

{Alpaca} I think they're super cute and fluffy. I like the evenness of their coat, whereas Llamas usually have really wild looking fur

{Llama} many similarities to alpaca. they look really cute when they're lying down and just look like a mound of fluft coming off the ground. but would probably ne less soft to pet, so im putting them just below alpaca

{Elephant} mildly scared of being trampled if i came near one, negative points there. i hear theyre afraid of mice, though, so i have a fairly deep personal connection there. in terms of cuteness, definitiely below the above fluffy boys. in terms of relatability, however, i definitely can feel a somewhat borderline spiritual connection on some fronts.

[Morning Tweet]

pls no hurt（／ ω ＼）

[Morning Tweet]

Not bad. My ordering would be Llama>Alpaca>Elephant. I expected you to place Elephants higher because of the mouse bias so I'm pleasantly surprised. You're off the hook for now.

The wildness of Llama's coats is exactly what makes them fantastic! Tell me this guy isn't fabulous:

Spoiler:

I love him! It was really close between Llamas/Alpacas.

@Holden there are many worse animals in terms of cleanliness!

[Morning Tweet]

i'm not big on non-llama steak

[Morning Tweet]

hey!!!!!! this is a blatant misrep! scum!

[Morning Tweet]

What's up with the recycle?

What do you mean?

HoldenGolden and Morning Tweet on the hit list for eating my poor llamas.

sniff

;(

[Morning Tweet]

Good work bob.

[Morning Tweet]

don't answer that i beg you

[Morning Tweet]

don't answer that i beg you

What do you have a problem with the burger industry? You know many burger workers are going broken right now? No you didnt. So what if they want to grill a hand cut thick, juicy slab of llama insides?! Are you fucking burgerist? Is that it?!

UNVOTE:
VOTE: Morning Tweet

i reeeally don't want to be pressured into eating one of Hectic's precious llamas

:C

also, EW

[Morning Tweet]

Hectic - my lord and saviour and the towniest of towns
Wake88 - lean town
Bob - bob.
Holden - evil. If not scum, definitely at least commiting several counts of animal cruelty

i had a theory about Wake’s 14 entrance being kind of weird and zany for maybe fake towncred, but after being given backstory from dave I realize that is really unlikely. I do like the idea of giving out people’s metas to make them nervous and act weird, although I’m not really sure if I’d be able to interpret any of that personally

Anyone who excessively jokes about being scum at the beginning makes me think they’re higher than rand% to be scum (Holden’s 25 34?? 54). Although I guess that’s just his character

pedit: Yay cakes!

VOTE: Holden

[Morning Tweet]

don't answer that i beg you

What do you have a problem with the burger industry? You know many burger workers are going broken right now? No you didnt. So what if they want to grill a hand cut thick, juicy slab of llama insides?! Are you fucking burgerist? Is that it?!

UNVOTE:
VOTE: Morning Tweet

i reeeally don't want to be pressured into eating one of Hectic's precious llamas

:C

also, EW

I'm sorry. I understand that I have taken it too farz and that you are not indeed a burgerist. Please accept my peace offering

Spoiler:

Sike you Burgerist! I got his Alpacas on the grill now too!

playing with my emotions ;'(

[Morning Tweet]

Morning Tweet has one of the best readlists I've ever seen in my life.

(/ω＼*) oh stahp

For example, I dont like MT explanation of their vote on me. The joking about being scum I can understand somewhat, but I am skeptical about the last bit about my character. Its sounds put there to give a reason to backpedal out of it as need be, especially since theoretically MT could ask Hectic since I've made it clear I've played with him.

The timing initially pinged me as well, but then I noticed the p edit at the end.

I always find people joking about being scum to be a tad scum indictative, but it's weakened a bit since you strike me as the kind of guy to do that often

Heres my logic on joking about being scum at start of game being somewhat scum indicative:

A lot of scum probably consider whether or not to make scummy jokes about themself as a WIFOM tactic. For town it either pops into their head or it doesn't, more sporadically and probably without thinking too much about it. I think it's slightly more likely that a scum meister thinks "Yeah I'll do that because obviously scum wouldn't claim scum!" than just the random chance a townie does it. foolproof I know

[Morning Tweet]

At first when he proposed doing meta dives out of the blue, i starting having a slight crackpot theory that scum!Wake wanted to gain town cred in a way that sticks out really well

Someone (you i think actually) asked him for an explanation of why he would want to out metas before people have a chance to even display them (which was a good point).

His answer of wanting to make people nervous and change their playstyles from the outted meta rather than simply observe whether their meta was the same seemed like a pretty good idea to me actually. And then dave answered my question of why he was so eager on the proposition. Overall I like him doing it as town better

[Morning Tweet]

So, of course it's a reach, but do we have any hard info on meta-tells on any of these people?

this is a wacky thing to say. do you usually commence the metadiving within the first couple of dozen posts?

How early is too early to start scumhunting and figuring out the game in your opinion, Morning Tweet?

There isn't really a "too early", although I was more concerned with getting out meta-tells in specific. Getting meta-tells out in the open before people have had a chance to make them seems ineffective at first but i like your explanation in 20

Weird that Wake went for meta instead of declaring his hatred for day 1. Town points there I think

You probably shouldn't dish out Town points that easily. Just my opinion.

I like dishing out town points a bunch on day one, even if its really small things. Anything that gives someone above random% chance of being scum helps

[Morning Tweet]

I think it was pretty clear SirCakes "protown" comment wasn't towards himself on ending RVS

@Cat I started talking myself out of the "acting scummy on purpose", since Holden seems like a consistent joker. But when cake voted him for separate reasoning of his own I couldnt resist

[Morning Tweet]

Cakez and Alo feel towny

Cakez is a qt pie for sure-- but why alo?

[Morning Tweet]

I'm drawing a blank on what qt stands for other than cutie

pedit: ya

[Morning Tweet]

Were you testing for my ability to know what a quick topic is?

[Morning Tweet]

Were you testing for my ability to know what a quick topic is?

Nope. Checking if you were hinting at anything.

Lul, sorry, Dave. Guess we now know Morning Tweet wasn't crumbing PT Cop there.

dave, if you thought I might be crumbing a PR, why would you ask me about it?

[Morning Tweet]

towny boys//
pretty good - {Wake}
good - {Hectic}
slightly lesser good - {SirCakes}
weakly - {Aloratom}

Wake - i think it goes something like: if it barks like a dog, walks like a dog, and looks like this: ₍ᐢ•ﻌ•ᐢ₎, it’s probably a townie.

Hectic - mentioned liking sircakes around same time I started liking him. His answering my question for me in 216 seems like something he might not send as scum, more of a “stream of consciousness” thing as townie imo. TR me at one point, which always me makes me feel good. Oh also i have a crush on him

SirCakez - Suspected Holden at an adjacent time to me, although for a different reason. Lean town comes from response to Alo’s interpretation of his “protown” comment in 194

Aloratom - Interpreted Sircakes “protown” comment as a way of giving himself towncred for ending RVS. Not really how I saw it at all, but +points for reevaluating and having a consistent thought process is something i think is townie. 50% of his posts are bob related which make me laugh too

[Morning Tweet]

MT why drop a readslist so early?

Locating town is my #1 goal on day one, and I like to be fairly open book on who I'm digging at the moment. Generating content from reactions is a plus as well

[Morning Tweet]

Morning Tweet has the greatest readlists in the known universe.

stop it!! (* >ω<)

Aloratom - Interpreted Sircakes “protown” comment as a way of giving himself towncred for ending RVS. Not really how I saw it at all, but

+points for reevaluating

and having a consistent thought process is something i think is townie. 50% of his posts are bob related which make me laugh too

Hey that sounds familiar.

Do you have a read on me?

first and foremost I get an overload of positive feelings from the cat gifs, but im going to have to set those aside

In hindsight I understand the point you and Holden brought up about my vote. And later, you have convinced me on your point about Alo being towny but I haven't really constituted a read on you in specific

@dave

what more explanation could Alo have really given about 97? (in 268)

[Morning Tweet]

VOTE: Gamma Emerald

[Morning Tweet]

Spoiler:

I didn't realize bob was here. Definite scum.

VOTE: bob

Determining Bob's alignment wasn't the initial goal

What was the goal of 97 if not to determine Bob's alignment?

I had no goal in mind on page 4.

@dave what more explanation could Alo have really given about 97

Potential town reasons for 97: delayed RVS, joke, actual scumread, reaction test.
If it were a delayed RVS or joke (which are kinda the same thing) just say so.
If it's an actual scumread, it's hella suspicious but explain why.
If it's a reaction test, expect some reactions.

If there are additional town reasons I haven't thought of, the towny thing is to explain when asked.

i feel like it's a bit of a reach to say Alo was overly vague or didn't explain everything.

"I had no goal in mind" made me think he was claiming it was a joke, but i wanted to wait for his answer first

[Morning Tweet]

I don't recall getting an answer from Aloratom.

VOTE: Aloratom

What makes you think Alo not answering the question is a scum move?

I don't know whether it makes Hectic town or scum that he ignored my comment about him not inspiring confidence.

Evading a question, to me, is not Townish whatsoever.

It's Scummy behavior.

Spoiler: Comment in question

Hectic's recent posts are not inspiring confidence.

It was not so much a question, as just a call to attention that there may be something off about Hectic's posting. Still, do you think it is alignment-indicative to ignore a remark like this?

[Morning Tweet]

at first galnce i woudl say alorat seems different from his scum game. There he was say x and y was scum without any reason.

Aloratom:

What are your thoughts on Bobman's 223 and 228?

Bob told me to get a life. I thought that was funny. And appropriate. As far as my scum meta goes, he may be right. I don't know. There's not much of a sample to work with there.

I kinda like how Alo doesn't comment on own scum meta. At the very least, I'm glad he doesn't make any claims about his play this game being different from how he plays scum.

[Morning Tweet]

did you see my question in 312, wake?

[Morning Tweet]

I think the case against Alo is not built very strong, but I don't think that in itself is scum indictative. Especially when that's in line with Wake making aggressive pushes

i still want to hear more about 304

[Morning Tweet]

Alirotam can you explain 138 please?

Nothing wrong with ending RVS, but usually it's done organically.

I didn't see anything strained about Holden's posts.

You slammed on the brakes, saying stopping RVS was always pro-Town. Saying that Holden's posts were strained raised one of my eyebrows.

Making a point of saying that you're pro-Town raised both

.

I dont like this for the last part since in Cakes response to my post during the time he revealed he was making a general statement about ending RVS is protown. I agree the wording was a bit ambiguous at first (I thought he was saying that I thought he wasnt protown for doing it myself first time around), but it doesnt change the fact by the time this post came out it was clear what cake meant.

Spoiler: Posts in question

@sircake did I ever say it wasnt? Regardless of how pro town it is, that doesnt change the fact I want to see the thought process you put into it. I have an rough idea over the games I've played on how scum vs town approaches my playstyle. I do find the way you done it to be more of the latter, but I needed to understand what lead you there a bit more

I think you misunderstood my post. I was saying in general to the thread to move out of RVS is protown, it wasn't specifically directed at you.
I'm not sure what else to add to my description of my thought process here. I think 118 and 120 cover it.
I will agree that MT's vote reasoning was weird

Alirotam can you explain 138 please?

You slammed on the brakes, saying stopping RVS was always pro-Town. Saying that Holden's posts were strained raised one of my eyebrows. Making a point of saying that you're pro-Town raised both.

I think it's likely that Alo was explaining why he felt that way at the time of 138, rather than stating that's how he still felt.

[Morning Tweet]

Wake vs Alo may be TvS

Based on your questions back towards Wake you think wake is the scum in this exchange. I'm I correct in this? Or have you change from when you raised the counterpoint about playstyles and dodging questions?

"Wake vs All may be TvS" implies that he thinks I'm Town and Alo's Scum. However, if that's incorrect I'd like Cakez to clarify that.

See I would agree with that if it wasn't for the responses about your interactions with Alo. Given those, I'm curious about which side seems scummy to him.

What responses do you mean? Cakes followup in 342 makes it pretty clear to me that he means he feels one is scum but not sure which.

[Morning Tweet]

I don't think Alo responds like this as scum
Hectic you can't have the meat

what consensus that wake is town?

Oh I kinda see what you're saying now. Calling it "TvS" still implies to me he's seeing something kinda independent about this interaction that suggests one but not the other is scum without pointing to one directly

[Morning Tweet]

Having to figure out metas makes me sad :C

I read part of the profii + Alora scumteam game. I think I learned more about Flavour Leaf than I did them to be honest

@Hectic

what pings u abt Alo?

[Morning Tweet]

I know what you mean by TvS, Cakes, although I don't see what ur seeing

Wake makes a bunch of aggressive pushes/questions that don't have a lot of substance behind em (i.e. His questioning of Alo about why he said bob is definite scum). But i think it's a good look for wake + the evidence suggests he's more likely to do this as town.

[Morning Tweet]

Onto Hectic!!!

...i don't know how Hectic plays meta-wise either.

I think it's more likely town!Hectic interrupts dave's question/reaction test thingy on me in 216. I also give him a slight town edge for ignoring your comment about not liking him.

I see that you are less fond of him, cakes. Are you familiar with Hectic's playstyle or is he included with your 372 disclaimer about not knowing exact playstyles?

pedit: i wanted to ask first...

[Morning Tweet]

the best I can do finding scum is establishing who I think is town and then picking from who's left over. I'm ok at the first part-- not so much at the second

It's too early for me to call this a town bloc, but I think Wake, SirCakes, and Hectic are town leans at the top

I think the inkling I got about Alo is admittedly very weak, but is better than not having something to examine at all

I don't agree with his dave's view on Alo. But I do like his confused responses to Holden's recent posting which was pretty much my reaction too. I go back and forth about the reaction test question thingy on me, but I'm leaning it's something he'd come up with as town

I need to reread Holden's recent content, although what he mentioned was mostly stemming from a misunderstanding so I didn't get a lot out of it

{Wake}
{SirCake, Hectic}
{Alo, dave}
{everyone else in a confusing, unable to read pool}

Everyone else has posted too little and/or i feel kinda uncomfortable trying to read. For example, I'm interested in Gamma, because the majority of his posts haven't been game-related, but idk if that's just what he does.

[Morning Tweet]

pedit: i wanted to ask first...

oh shit sorry my bad

sniff

its ok

[Morning Tweet]

Thank you wake you are very kind!

I would cop the hardest to read player in the pool of players who hasn't contributed too much yet. Either because they're good at scum or lack an easily accessible meta. Lol I want to say bob just because I haven't been able to read him in the past. but I think i'd probably actually go for Gamma or tictac since I think there's hope I can figure out bob this time around

Vig someone? i don't want to vig someone d1 unless i had a really good reason, a better reason than "can't read" or "doesnt post much". So i'd save it for later, running the risk I lose it but I think that'd be better than accidentally shooting a townie that hasn't done anything wrong

I'd neighbourize hectic, without a doubt. He's the coolest!

[Morning Tweet]

Alright. If you had to vig shoot and protect in {Gamma Emerald, tictac, profii} tonight, who would your targets be, and why?

Is that a possible role?

Multitasking 1-shot vig 1-shot doctor, maybe. Also why does it matter if it's possible?

[Morning Tweet]

(つ﹏< )

Oh come on profii, that wasnt very nice

[Morning Tweet]

Something odd about this game-- I'm pretty new around the site, and I've played exactly 1 Hectic game prior to this.

He's playing very similarly to how he did there. Now some circumstances about that game were weird, the town had to collectively try and hide a spy within the mafia and because of that, posting serious reads wasn't a great idea

However, even then this is pretty much the kind of player I expected Hectic to be in regular games. im not convinced that meming around is a scumtell for Hectic. Unless I'm misinterpreting the case

pedit: really? okay

[Morning Tweet]

> "Hectic, you're not scumhunting!"

> "Here's some examples of me scumhunting"

> "Ah, so you've written all the places with you scumhunting down, just for this moment!"

it's like he's forcing Hectic to be scum. I thought it might be a joke but ig not

VOTE: profii

[Morning Tweet]

Tictac is all fine and dandy-- but what do you guys think about profii?

hia Holden

[Morning Tweet]

What is it with everyone pushing Hectic whilst admitting he isn't that scummy?

[Morning Tweet]

Not really you Holden, more Alo and profii. I think I missed the alt comment

The early readslists and questioning I've been doing on an alt of mine with decent results; trying it out here now! Sir Cakez, why is the progression not there for a readslist? Not all the reads are substanceful/have good reasoning behind them - some are just thoughts and feelings.

I guess you could say that. I've seen Hectic use readslists as part of the jokes before. He wasn't joking this time with this readlist though.

Sure it could be a towncred excuse, but did he really have to justify himself that heavily for something as little as an early readslist? I don't think scum!hectic would feel like he needs to give some kind of alibi for it, so overall kinda NAI

What is it with everyone pushing Hectic whilst admitting he isn't that scummy?

Now then, do you think any of the soft pushes as you see them are scummy and if so why?

Yes, see profii and I's progression on the previous page for more on that

[Morning Tweet]

It's basically just putting out early readlists and being more transparent, Hodlne. The joking is definitely still there.

Since I'm probably never using this alt again: Paragon

OHMYGOD!!!!!

in hindsight, I probably should've realized that when you brought up the.... thingies

[Morning Tweet]

Spoiler: @Holden

3 of us so far think you're not scumhunting.

Pedit @ SirCakez -- no, you're on to something. Joke posting can indeed be cover for fake scumhunting.

That's clearly not all I'm doing though. Dave, why don't you consider 346, 401, 402, or 430 as scumhunting?

Did you look for those posts or do you just have a reference bank of posts to demonstrate your scum hunting prowess

(つ﹏< )

Oh come on profii, that wasnt very nice

It was a genuine question

Something odd about this game-- I'm pretty new around the site, and I've played exactly 1 Hectic game prior to this.

He's playing very similarly to how he did there. Now some circumstances about that game were weird, the town had to collectively try and hide a spy within the mafia and because of that, posting serious reads wasn't a great idea

However, even then this is pretty much the kind of player I expected Hectic to be in regular games. im not convinced that meming around is a scumtell for Hectic. Unless I'm misinterpreting the case

pedit: really? okay

> "Hectic, you're not scumhunting!"

> "Here's some examples of me scumhunting"

> "Ah, so you've written all the places with you scumhunting down, just for this moment!"

it's like he's forcing Hectic to be scum. I thought it might be a joke but ig not

VOTE: profii

I think it's kinda forcing Hectic to be scum no matter what he does. I assumed it was a joke so I just called it "not nice".. but apparently it wasn't

@Hectic

I'm stupid!!

[Morning Tweet]

I legitimately thought you just randomly went through the game, saw that ammo, and spontaneously decided to torture me. To be fair that bit lasted for almost the entirety of the game

You were really fun in Donnie-- I don't know how I didn't connect Paragon, who i've played MORE games with, to you

Pedit: @Alo, why don't you check out his meta for yourself if you would prefer not to trust others on it?

[Morning Tweet]

I feel slightly better about Holden, worse about Alo now

Yeah, and I even asked you to rank 3 animals like I did in Marker lul

Donnie was so much fun, basically a dream setup for me where joking around was

protown

. I don't think I'm ever gonna stop calling Spiffeh Donnie Brasco in random other games. That guy exudes Donnie vibes.

i surprise even myself with how oblivious I am sometimes

[Morning Tweet]

I think it's kinda forcing Hectic to be scum no matter what he does. I assumed it was a joke so I just called it "not nice".. but apparently it wasn't

@Hectic

I'm stupid!!

Why is it forcing Hectic to be scum over just genuinely trying to understand?

Although I'm kinda curious what made profii ask the question in 438 tbh because there were 6 mins between posts 436 and 437 and anyone could've easily read through their own ISO and pick out scumhunt-y posts

Did you look for those posts or do you just have a reference bank of posts to demonstrate your scum hunting prowess

Asking Hectic whether or not he saves all of his scumhunting posts to a single place for easy reference isn't exactly "trying to understand", I was thinking it was more of a joke. but ig not

[Morning Tweet]

I'm not unhappy with these wagons, though. Usually in my games the big wagon(s) get delayed til deadline and everyone panics. I prefer this, I think

I'm leaning voting Chem-tictac because of 515 but I'm gonna hold off for now

pedit: @Alo He's saying that you're a good partner candidate with tictac. Not exactly the same as "lining up mislynches", since if tictac is town it'd kinda diminish the point

[Morning Tweet]

I realized something about the tictac wagon-- I think regardless of tictac's alignment, there's probably scum on it. Okay maybe that's not a super hard deduction to make but bear with me here

If tictac-Chem is scum and Alo is town, it's an easy bus; If tictac-Chem is town and Alo is scum, it's an easy distraction from Alo; If tictac-Chem and Alo are scum together, well.. that'd be kinda agiven

Lucky for me I have a couple townreads on the tictac wagon. Consider my vote on profii to be extra serious now

[Morning Tweet]

If tictac-Chem is scum and Alo is town, it's an easy bus;

Why

easy

bus? Aloratom is an easy counterwagon to push as a mislynch in the case Misty is scum. Why go for the bus over the mislynch?

Okay, I have another important question, Misty. Is that the moon in the background behind you, or your hat? Also, if it is a hat; can I have it if we lynch you? I know it's kind of awkward considering the circumstances, but I'd really appreciate it.

I have a strong feeling that it's more likely scum would bus tictac than try the counterwagon when the counterwagon just feels objectively weaker.

I guess I might be biased, I only think Alo is scummy because of interactions (or lack of) with tictac, and not really independently scummy on his own

[Morning Tweet]

I realized something about the tictac wagon-- I think regardless of tictac's alignment, there's probably scum on it. Okay maybe that's not a super hard deduction to make but bear with me here

If tictac-Chem is scum and Alo is town, it's an easy bus; If tictac-Chem is town and Alo is scum, it's an easy distraction from Alo; If tictac-Chem and Alo are scum together, well.. that'd be kinda agiven

Lucky for me I have a couple townreads on the tictac wagon. Consider my vote on profii to be extra serious now

I agree with the voting logic, I disagree with how it's being constructed.

It was more of an independent thought i was reasoning out, but it ended up lining up with my profii suspicion really well. (^-^*)

[Morning Tweet]

Also if your read is dependent on the alignments of Alo/chem, why are you sticking to profili (unless I miss a change in heart somewhere vote wise)

I understand in most cases they are scum in your eyes given the voting, but why not vote one of alo/chem to make your case stronger, especially since most of town is leaning that way right now?

My case is that there's scum on the tictac-chem wagon regardless of tictac-chem's alignment. I get the feeling scum will target the slot. I feel like that reasoning qualifies as independent of the tictac/alo wagons, not dependent.

Then allow me to force you out of your comfort zone. I'm lazy. You seem energetic. Do you feel anyone else on that wagon is scummy given how they enter on it?

≧ω≦ I have a little bit of energy, I had a nap earlier

Spoiler:

Chemist1422 (5): Gamma Emerald, Cat Scratch Fever, SirCakez, Hectic, profii

------

I doubt voting Gamma while he's v/la will be very productive

I'm down to try this

VOTE: tictac

Would do Holden as well. He seemed to have dropped off the radar after a lot of early shitposting

Cat started this wagon early on, earlier than we had an idea tictac was going to disappear. It's a vote for a lurker as a switch-up from Gamma since Gamma went V/LA. I don't really pull anything AI from this, gun to my head maybe a slight edge to town.

I like this tictac wagon. The inactivity is off-putting.
VOTE: tictac

My SR has somewhat lessened on Hectic; I feel I'm confusing playstyle for scumminess.

SirCakes joins Cat on the very next post, leaving Hectic's wagon in favour of this one. I believe his reevaluation of Hectic is towny, although I don't have anything to say about the entrance to the wagon itself.

<Wake joins the wagon here. He moves to Alo later, though>

tictac's play so far is a stark contrast to their last 3 town games, and fits more with their most recent scumgame.

One
Two
Three
Scumgame - replaced out

In the town games, they have a lot of thoughts, and are straight in there from the start with the solving. Scumgame has less reasoning provided with posts.

In this game, they didn't make any attempts to solve and have only fluff posted, which is the polar opposite of their town meta.

VOTE: Chemist1422 I don't have much time nowadays but hopefully this will flip scum and clear me!

Hectic metareads tictac's replace-out to be scum-indicative, adding tons of fuel to the fire. This is the turning point for me where I think if Alo is scum, scum is going to jump on tictac. If tictac is scum, I also think they'll bus. I've townread Hectic for a long while now, so I'd be hard pressed to see this as scum-motivated.

tictac's play so far is a stark contrast to their last 3 town games, and fits more with their most recent scumgame.

One
Two
Three
Scumgame - replaced out

In the town games, they have a lot of thoughts, and are straight in there from the start with the solving. Scumgame has less reasoning provided with posts.

In this game, they didn't make any attempts to solve and have only fluff posted, which is the polar opposite of their town meta.

VOTE: Chemist1422 I don't have much time nowadays but hopefully this will flip scum and clear me!

Good enough for me

VOTE: Chemist1422

Profii goes with it. I don't really have a comment on this, other than he doesn't seem to care to respond to my posts which makes me feel a lil left out (;﹏;)

please notice me profiiiii

VOTE: Chemist

This

is L-1.

I don't see anywhere Gamma mentions anything about tictac in his ISO past RVS stage, so I'm going to take his second vote as the latest vote, even though he was technically first.

His reasoning given is "It's less bad than the Alo wagon" and "I don't get why people are voting Alo". He puts Chemist at L-1 without saying a single positive thing about the wagon, but I'm gonna assume he read through Hectic's case in 515 and agrees with it or has at least some kind of good reason to vote there. I award him no town points for lack of effort, which is certainly anti-town and leaves him towards the bottom of my reads

Overall I don't find the entrances themselves to be as important as my deduction that there's scum on the wagon combined with my townreads on the wagon

here's my comparison on which members of the wagon I believe most likely to be scum:

Profii>Gamma>Cat>SirCakes>Hectic (>Wake)

[Morning Tweet]

I think I might have just completely misunderstood Aaron here
UNVOTE:
That said I still dislike the preflip associatives but it might not be scum indicative
And Aaron if you were scum lining up lynches in the traditional conception then it's be assumed chemist and Alo were both town

I don't usually do preflip associations but sometimes you see interactions that are too awkward not to point out.

That would be true in the traditional sense but if I'm scum saying that alo/chem are svs that'd be moot if one of them flipped town.

^^^^^

If I recall correctly, Aaron said that if tictac flips scum then we should look at Alo. So like, not exactly lining up mislynches.

[Morning Tweet]

Is reading bob something that's actually feasible?

[Morning Tweet]

Nono that is absolutely hilarious and perfectly fitting

[Morning Tweet]

Ok so essentially last couple of pages are SirCakes interpreting something of Aaron's being a mislynch line up, but it was a misunderstanding

Alo jumped on the Aaron wagon in hopes it'd get something started. I don't really get what Alo is asking in 636/516. I want to try and get more of an understanding about Alo and his wagon cause it's mostly losing me

I guess Chem is as caught up as she's going to get..? I am not very experienced interpreting claims at L-1, but im fine voting there if that's what it comes down to

profii never noticed me (;﹏;)

[Morning Tweet]

Bob do you think scum is on the Chem wagon if chem is town?

[Morning Tweet]

So far sircake is sure town read of mine. My strongest infact. I think profii is town.

is it possible you could elaborate on why you like profii!town?

[Morning Tweet]

I don't really get what Alo is asking in 636/516.

Are you wondering why I'm asking Bob why he thought my RVS vote was an actual read?

ahh

sorry I was misunderstanding what you were asking

[Morning Tweet]

Morning

Tweet

happy morning noises

[Morning Tweet]

I thought you were leaning it not being SvS? what are the chances both partners got ran up for the entirety of the day?

VOTE: Gamma Emerald

Bussing is right though. i'm inclined to think it's elsewhere than Alo

[Morning Tweet]

I was leaning that way until tictac slot flipped red. I also explained that the flip wouldn't change my read on Aloratom.

How do you feel about bob MT?

I kind of.. had trouble interpeting why he didn't want to lynch Chem. What sticks out in my mind specifically is that he said it was 50/50 chances Chem is scum, which is better than 25/75, but he still didn't want to lynch her.

It's weird, but its bob so I can't say 100%. I'm really curious why he thought dave was a stronger lynch, but i fear if I ask he's just going to say "look back at the case"

I said earlier I didn't have a read on Alora because I didn't know what was playstyle I think

At this point I'll keep it for self-pres though

VOTE: Chemist

^ There's also this weird post from Chemist regarding Alora

By saying "Keep it for self-pres", is Chem trying to say she thought Alo was town ? It's a weird post although i dont think it specifically implies SvS, unless im misunderstanding it

[Morning Tweet]

Morning Tweet, what'd you do last Night?

Knowing what I did, if anything, would not be beneficial to town.

^^^^^
i don't think it'd be helpful for us to discuss what we did during the night

[Morning Tweet]

OK cool, have it your way. Not.

I'm a full Town Watcher.

I watched Hectic Night 1.

Both Morning Tweet and Davesaz targeted him.

Both evaded me when called on it.

(一ω一)

probably because revealing whether you're a PR or not for no reason is anti-town

[Morning Tweet]

Confirm visit.

yup, if it wasn't clear me too (ノ_<)

[Morning Tweet]

! ! ! no more setup / PR speculation beyond this point for the love of god ! ! !

[Morning Tweet]

Kinda thinking it's just bob and Aloratom? That almost feels too easy though.

bob hard defended the chemist wagon near the end of the day while trying to make a push onto davesaz.

Alora hopped on at the end of day presumably to bus for the towncred. I kind of explained everything wrong with his play already.

VOTE: aloratom

Now thats shade.

I hard defended alort wagon. I said i was fine with chemist wagon and that it decent chance of flipping scum ( above random). But as always i want to lynch thr scum the scum dont want to bus

Why do you think if i was scum that i simply wouldnt hard bus chemists slot?

If you're in agreement that Chemist had a high chance of flipping scum (50/50), why would you vote anywhere else?

I don't have an opinion one way or the other on whether you personally would bus or not, but your behaviour at the end of the day was very strange to me.

At this point, I think there's a really high chance that one scum bussed, and the other didn't. I think the busser is likely to be Gamma, and you're in my pool for the non busser due to the end of day counterwagon. Perhaps you A.) were caught not being able to vote Alo due to defending him previously, and B.) didn't want to bus Chem

[Morning Tweet]

Wait,

Heretic had a threesome....and didnt invite me?!?

( ･// ω // ･)

[Morning Tweet]

Do you realy think i would be afraid to bus chemist tweet.

I would bussed tic/chemist from the getgo all the while building up the alort wagon as scum.

Well you telling me you that's what you would do weakens your point a bit, since apparently you're aware of the difference in how town you and scum you would play.

To answer your question, I dont know

[Morning Tweet]

Wait,

Heretic had a threesome....and didnt invite me?!?

Not cool my dude not cool.

Your fault dude, they all just showed up at my house uninvited. Good thing I decided not to active my PGO last night.

Adorable, so you're getting at the fact he wanted to avoid interacting with anyone because a scum lynch between him/Aloratom was already sealed and he didn't want to leave associatives? Or am I misinterpreting your point?

Chemist claimed and then he disappears for 3 days. Why did he not interact with other players and figure out who the scum are rather than giving up? Town should fight for their lynch figuring out who is scum and Chemist disappearing like that this is the kind of play I always find suspicious.

what conclusion are you drawing from Chem leaving, other than it being suspicious?

[Morning Tweet]

Would you eat a cooked llama burger?

What?! She may enjoy the good taste of a thick juicy slab of cooked llama goodness, smothered between a freshly pick sheet of lettuce, hand peeled onions, melted cheese, and two big wholesome wheat buns?

I'm going to propose modding a mini flavored around 101 ways to cook a llama. My gift to you and MT

I would join that game, but only to raise awareness of your horrific actions against humanity and to form a save-the-llamas-coalition. I think lynching naysayers would be more important than lynching scum in that game. Back me up here, Morning.

i will join it if it comes to be, but know that I'm appalled by your imagery and you should feel bad ノ;﹏;ノ

@bob

, what's the conclusion you have from the analysis you're doing?

and adorable, are you saying this points to town!Alo or scum!Alo? I'm sorry if im missing the bottom line of what you're saying. So Chem left to avoid forming any associatives because she thought that her lynch was inevitable. I think this is likely, yes. but are you deducing anything other than just that observation?

[Morning Tweet]

That's kinda why I feel chem intentionally didnt say anything to avoid draw associations one way or another, faking the reading on Alo entirely. The main question now is rather or not it was done to shade alo upon flipping red, or to prevent more analysis linking to two together today.

I

'm kinda feeling like if Chem is scum and Alo is town, he tries to push Alo a little bit more in order to save himself.

Chem didn't really try too hard to save himself so either he thought there was just no point bc he thought he'd get lynched or he felt disassociated enough from his partners that he was fine with going down.

That's my issue. Chem as scum should of at least tried to push something on town!alo rather than laying down and taking the lynch without voicing any concrete reads. Now that I know he can produce content as scum when replacing into an suspicious slot, I am back pondering if the wagons were SvS.

In any case, I feel I am going to ponder this particular point too much and end up circling around in what is speculation of what scum! chem would do. Do you think trying to crack this idea is worthwhile? I've been thinking inbetween writing a paper outline about it and keep coming to some different conclusions.

The lack of progression on Alo reads as scum who's not sure what to do upon replacing in and seeing that him and his partners are both top wagons.

The one point for town!Alo is that if chem is scum, why doesn't he try to townspew Alo? Maybe he thought he couldn't do it without leading an actual lynch onto lylo or maybe he thought it would backfire and he gets lynched anyways?

I feel like you read into Chem's actions (or lack of actions, rather) too much. Chem could have been avoiding interaction with Alo because they're scumpartners, but at the same time it could have been done intentionally to make us think that. Or maybe she didn't do anything intentionally and just didn't want to post

i'm not super familiar with the independent case for Alo!scum. Early on, he was getting voted for basically nothing (Calling bob definite scum), and his responses to all the pressure he received afterwards seemed awkward.

Are there independent tells about Alo that I've missed that cause you to scumread him? I'm doubting the SvS so hard that it makes me inclined to think alo is town here

[Morning Tweet]

Wait MT

i'm not super familiar with the independent case for Alo!scum. Early on, he was getting voted for basically nothing (Calling bob definite scum),

and his responses to all the pressure he received afterwards seemed awkward.

This made me think that you find his play suspicious. Is this an individually read where the circumstance of chem flipping red is making you question, or is there something else?

What do you make of his awkward play.

Awkward ya. I would need more than that to justify voting him over my other reads.

i thought Alo stood a decent chance of being scum yesterday. With the flip, it's led me to believe he's more likely to just be awkward town than have the awkwardness be scum-indictative of him.

Yesterday, Aaron thought SvS was unlikely, but with the flip, he's since reevaluated to find Alo scummy. im curious about this because we seem to have come to opposite conclusions from the same evidence

[Morning Tweet]

{Wake} - obvtown in more ways than one =,=
{Alo} - i feel that the d1 wagons weren't SvS and do not feel great about those pushing that angle today, either
-
{davesaz, Hectic}
{Adorable-Cat, Holden}
-
{bob, Aaron}
{profii}
{Gamma}

notes-
i think it's highly likely we have a busser and a non-busser. the chemist wagon went on for the entire day, didn't really come under heavy resistance except for the one wagon. There's enough people that opposed/agreed but decided Alo was stronger that i think there's scum in them. At the same time, the way tictac/chem responded to pressure makes me inclined to think one scum bussed that at least

Spoiler: on the Chem wagon

Gamma Emerald, Cat Scratch Fever, Hectic, profii, HoldenGolden, Aloratom, SirCakez

Gamma>profii>Holden>Cat>Hectic>Alo

Gamma voted in RVS before there it was known what the wagon would become. He revoted after Hectic's case came, and he recently explained that this is because he didn't realize that tictac and Chem were the same person. --if he didn't know they were the same person, then he didn't vote for the tictac case at all. He now clarifies that he put Chem to L-1 because he found her quietness odd.

Profii is kind of like a lazy dog that went, "Good enough for me," plopped down on the tictac wagon, and went to sleep. Could easily see bus, or maybe just low effort town so I put him below Gamma. I considered his extra push 609 to possibly be something he'd only say as town, but i think now it's possible that at that point in the day scum decided chem was a lost cause. Profii also did something I found suspicious early on but he never engaged with my questioning on it so -m- . I'm interested in what he's saying about Aaron today, I think it'll be telling about both of their alignments. although for me it indirectly makes Aaron look better to me atm

I cant get a read on holden. he's very active, i just can't figure out anything AI. He could be the bussing scum, but i don't have any reason to think him over gamma/profii

i was starting to forget Cat was in this game. The vote on tictac was there with the intent of starting pressure, although it was much before we knew how far the wagon would go. slight town edge overall

Hectic is hectik. slight townlean, but not as sure as yesterday

and Alo i straight up don't think is scum from the nature of the day and only having those two wagons

Gamma and profii could technically be scum together, which could mean that the Aaron push thing by profii is meant as a counterwagon from Gamma

however, i think it's more likely that the remaining scum is outside the Chem wagon. My feelings about this are lesser in comparison to what i have on the wagon

Spoiler: off the Chem wagon

Removing Wake, the pool is {Aaron, bob, dave}.

Aaron defended Chem whilst further pushing Alo. He did not deny the possibility of Chem scum, but gave reason that this could be her town m.o. as well as her scum m.o. Additionally, he's pushing an SvS angle today which i dont agree with.

Bob acted in a confusing matter at the end of d1 but i don't really want to spend more time talking about this than we have to. I don't understand why he voted dave when he admits Chem had a high chance of rolling scum. I haven't read too closely into his posts yet today, but enough to confirm he was saying that Chem had a good chance of being scum yesterday.

No notes for dave that override the other two as of right now

[Morning Tweet]

Gamma seems very detached from this particular game. he pops in asking something that could be answered by reading the thread, a lot. The lack of activity doesn't help him, and I also think he's most likely to have bussed Chem

im not really concerned with your level of activity because im not sure if that's AI for you. i am sad you never engaged with my earlier questions for you though :c

I feel pretty strongly that scum busses tictac-chem here, and it's a matter of finding who is most likely on the wagon. I don't think Alo is scum. Hectic could have done it as a planned bus, but i find that less likely than the other options. profii's "Good enough for me" after hectic made the case does not sit well with me. Cat helped start the pressure, but it was very early on so only minor town points. i dont have a read on holden.

Gamma, amazingly enough, voted both before there was any lynch pressure (in RVS), and then voted again a second time when it felt like the Chem lynch was mostly agiven (thinking he put her to L-1). Holden is a null.

So, therefore, Gamma>profii>Holden>Cat>Hectic>Alo.

If i said, "My two strongest scumreads are the inactives", thatd imply im scumreading them for that reason, which i only partly do in Gammas case.

Also, just above profii and Gamma on my readslist, im considering bob and Aaron as potential chem defending partners. neither of them were inactive at the end of d1

[Morning Tweet]

oh god damn it i checked over it, this whole time i thought i asked you for clarification on the "It's a genuine question" comment you made earlier, and you ignored it, but i never actually got around to asking it so you werent ignoring anything

im sorry im stupid

you explained it further today in 801, in any case

[Morning Tweet]

even if it is SvS, i still expect third scum on tictac-Chem most likely

@Gamma

i never asked you a question. I thought i asked profii but turns out i didnt really

[Morning Tweet]

Don't make me bring out the chinchillas - unless they're like an edge case that you're actually really fond of.

chinchillas?!?! that wont be necessary-! ill elaborate on why it is so likely

Dave, Aaron, Wake, Bob, and myself were off-wagon.

Wake is town
Dave is lean town, no more comments as of yet
Bob tried to defend Chem whilst admitting the wagon is perfectly valid
Aaron defended Chem a bit more than Bob, and now today is advocating for SvS.

Compared to the large pool of voters on wagon, itd be very hard for me to believe theres two scum here, off-wagon. it's likely inside of Aaron and Bob, and i think its unlikely that both partners would defend that particular wagon. The combination of how assured it felt + only one real counterwagon, which was weaker, makes a bus seem so likely.

So tldr; a smaller pool of potential scum off wagon, plus the nature of how that days wagons went, makes me feel it is highly likely 1, possibly 2 scum are on wagon.

[Morning Tweet]

Gamma could you do a light reread and give a thought on maybe like just one player?

Morning:

Why did you stay on profii for the entirety of yesterday, despite you being the only person not voting for one of the two wagons (Aloratom and tictac). profii clearly wasn't going to happen, so why didn't you pick a side?

Regardless of tictac-Chem's alignment, i felt the case was good enough where scum would jump on if Alo is scum (or its TvT), as a counterwagon, or if tictac is scum, as a bus. additionally, when profii joined it, it gave me a sense of validation on that read.

as for alo, i didnt agree with Dave/Wakes original reason for voting and never got anything from Alo that could possibly override tictac-chem's behaviour coupled with the tictac meta

i probably should've made it more clear, but id have voted to finish off either wagon if it was required, i wasnt expecting profii to be lynched instead or anything like that

[Morning Tweet]

Alright, your explanation for your thought process does sound somewhat reasonable. I just find it interesting how you're focusing so much on scum bussing while being off the wagon yourself.

If you are scum, I think it's almost certainly with someone off wagon in {davesaz, AaronFrost, Waka Waka, bobman}

Morning + AaronFFrost
Morning + Waka Waka
Morning + davesaz
Morning + bobman

AFF is still town based on meta. Waka Waka is quite clearly a town watcher with the way he claimed. So:

Morning + davesaz
Morning + bobman

You and Dave both wouldn't target me as scum PRs. So:

Morning + bobman

bobman interestingly enough, you seem to have labelled a bobman as a "it's weird but it's a bobman" read in 755 and 622. You also called a bobman confusing and possibly defending his buddy in 939 and 942, but you've not asked one bobman any question or attempted to solve the bobman in any way today.

I honestly think that if Morning is scum here, bobman is kinda very likely to be her partner.

This is for post game more than anything at the moment though.

im too intimidated by Bob's scumhunting prowess to question him

the main question i had was pretty much "If Chem was 50/50, why would you not vote her", which i think Aaron if not multiple others asked, and i learned pretty much nothing from his responses. and now today he's mostly doing a pseudo VCA thing that im not sure how to approach asking about

why are you suddenly doing a full on examination of potential scum pairings with me in them? Not to mention, you remove all possible scum partners on the tictac wagon because apparently id be too scared to implicate them..?

i also dont know your aaron meta read, but I think you probably already explained it and i just need to check back on it

[Morning Tweet]

That's idiotic, especially if there's a high chance of Scum being in there.

You should know better, profii.

that was his impression of me.. owch

[Morning Tweet]

high involvement with the Alo wagon, which is pretty meh in hindsight but i put him in my weak town yesterday for the tunneledness. today he mostly has just questioned bob if i recall correctly.

i also believe he's still an advocate for the SvS possibility alongside Aaron. so both dave and Aaron have expressed some amount of favour towards an Alo/Bob/chem scumteam. I dont like the SvS angle

[Morning Tweet]

@Dave Nearing end of d1 i found Hectic to be about second least likely on tictac-Chem wagon to be scum. Admittedly i was considering him very likely, bordering on conf town at one point, although i kinda realize now that he could have planned out a bus on tictac. i still find that to be less likely than other options

Spoiler:

Chemist1422 (5): Gamma Emerald, Cat Scratch Fever, SirCakez, Hectic, profii

------

I doubt voting Gamma while he's v/la will be very productive

I'm down to try this

VOTE: tictac

Would do Holden as well. He seemed to have dropped off the radar after a lot of early shitposting

Cat started this wagon early on, earlier than we had an idea tictac was going to disappear. It's a vote for a lurker as a switch-up from Gamma since Gamma went V/LA. I don't really pull anything AI from this, gun to my head maybe a slight edge to town.

I like this tictac wagon. The inactivity is off-putting.
VOTE: tictac

My SR has somewhat lessened on Hectic; I feel I'm confusing playstyle for scumminess.

SirCakes joins Cat on the very next post, leaving Hectic's wagon in favour of this one. I believe his reevaluation of Hectic is towny, although I don't have anything to say about the entrance to the wagon itself.

<Wake joins the wagon here. He moves to Alo later, though>

tictac's play so far is a stark contrast to their last 3 town games, and fits more with their most recent scumgame.

One
Two
Three
Scumgame - replaced out

In the town games, they have a lot of thoughts, and are straight in there from the start with the solving. Scumgame has less reasoning provided with posts.

In this game, they didn't make any attempts to solve and have only fluff posted, which is the polar opposite of their town meta.

VOTE: Chemist1422 I don't have much time nowadays but hopefully this will flip scum and clear me!

Hectic metareads tictac's replace-out to be scum-indicative, adding tons of fuel to the fire. This is the turning point for me where I think if Alo is scum, scum is going to jump on tictac. If tictac is scum, I also think they'll bus. I've townread Hectic for a long while now, so I'd be hard pressed to see this as scum-motivated.

tictac's play so far is a stark contrast to their last 3 town games, and fits more with their most recent scumgame.

One
Two
Three
Scumgame - replaced out

In the town games, they have a lot of thoughts, and are straight in there from the start with the solving. Scumgame has less reasoning provided with posts.

In this game, they didn't make any attempts to solve and have only fluff posted, which is the polar opposite of their town meta.

VOTE: Chemist1422 I don't have much time nowadays but hopefully this will flip scum and clear me!

Good enough for me

VOTE: Chemist1422

Profii goes with it. I don't really have a comment on this, other than he doesn't seem to care to respond to my posts which makes me feel a lil left out (;﹏;)

please notice me profiiiii

VOTE: Chemist

This

is L-1.

I don't see anywhere Gamma mentions anything about tictac in his ISO past RVS stage, so I'm going to take his second vote as the latest vote, even though he was technically first.

His reasoning given is "It's less bad than the Alo wagon" and "I don't get why people are voting Alo". He puts Chemist at L-1 without saying a single positive thing about the wagon, but I'm gonna assume he read through Hectic's case in 515 and agrees with it or has at least some kind of good reason to vote there. I award him no town points for lack of effort, which is certainly anti-town and leaves him towards the bottom of my reads

Overall I don't find the entrances themselves to be as important as my deduction that there's scum on the wagon combined with my townreads on the wagon

here's my comparison on which members of the wagon I believe most likely to be scum:

Profii>Gamma>Cat>SirCakes>Hectic (>Wake)

Interesting that you consider the possibility of a scum watcher, i pretty much have been writing wake off as conf town. why wouldn't scum!wake just keep those results to himself? plus i independently had him as my strongest TR prior

[Morning Tweet]

My thoughts are that we should leave all 4 of those players alone. (myself, Hectic, Wake, Morning Tweet)
It would not be the first time I've seen multiple PR target the same player. IIRC in one game I saw the same player get targeted by 7 (!!) town PRs the same night.

that was my initial thought, hence the "Stop the setup spec !!" post

but wake and profii are unrelenting

[Morning Tweet]

high involvement with the Alo wagon, which is pretty meh in hindsight but i put him in my weak town yesterday for the tunneledness. today he mostly has just questioned bob if i recall correctly.

i also believe he's still an advocate for the SvS possibility alongside Aaron. so both dave and Aaron have expressed some amount of favour towards an Alo/Bob/chem scumteam. I dont like the SvS angle

MT it's weird to me that you townread dave yet scumread me even though the two of us have pushed the same angles (advocated for Alo yesterday, pushing SvS today). Why the difference in read there?

I have you as more likely scum than dave because you more directly defended chem-- I suppose the argument could be made that ignoring chem completely is scummier.. hm

with your defense of chem taken into account, you voted Alo over her because you believed that Chem's lurk was NAI. It didn't really address the original intent of the wagon, which was tictac's flake, though.

Something I really need to know is more precisely why you and dave scumread Alo. i'll probably need to go over and read that again

additionally, i don't want to focus my sights on {Wake, dave, Hectic}. My gut says not to

Alright I'm all caught up. Can someone lay out the case against Gamma for me?

tldr: I believe that someone bussed chem. Gamma is somewhat unusually uninvested in this game. He voted chem before there was any pressure, and then voted chem AGAIN when there was enough pressure where the lynch seemed very likely.

In 965, i layed out why i think there's a busser. And in 939 and 942, i sorted out who i believe it is.

[Morning Tweet]

I also have feelings to the gamma lynch so far that impacts this somewhat, but I have to check the way the votes have fallen so far to make sure i am reading the wagon dynamic correctly. TLDR on that: The lack of any real directed countermeasure to the gamma lynch concerns me as he is at 4 votes verses the second highest being 1 iirc. That, and that there are multiple 1 vote wagons as well. If gamma is scum, I feel there would be more pressure on one of these other wagons to provide gamma a way out of being lynched.

I think hesitation due to this reason is fair. But we lynched scum yesterday-- their numbers are down and their voices are quieter

so say it's Gamma + one partner. I can very well see that one partner opting not to start a counterwagon or otherwise not being able to, especially depending on who it is. And Gamma doesn't exactly seem invested enough to start one, either.

@Wake

, would you possibly elaborate on how Holden's evaluation of you is unfair?

[Morning Tweet]

Spoiler: TIMELINE OF TICTAC-CHEM VOTES

Hi don't touch me

VOTE: tictac
I'm pretty sure I know where your avatar comes from and I approve

I doubt voting Gamma while he's v/la will be very productive

I'm down to try this

VOTE: tictac

Would do Holden as well. He seemed to have dropped off the radar after a lot of early shitposting

I like this tictac wagon. The inactivity is off-putting.
VOTE: tictac

My SR has somewhat lessened on Hectic; I feel I'm confusing playstyle for scumminess.

More than a few times I've seen a lurker/flake turn out to be Scum.

Could be intimidation or lack of interest or hopelessness. The last game I was Scum I clammed up because it felt hopeless. In my 37:1:6:6 game multiple Mafia weren't posting. I used to think Scum wouldn't shut down, but I know better now.

VOTE: tictac

(WAKE UNVOTE)

I have time to pressure tictac later.

I'd be OK with an Aloratom lynch today.

VOTE: Aloratom

tictac's play so far is a stark contrast to their last 3 town games, and fits more with their most recent scumgame.

One
Two
Three
Scumgame - replaced out

In the town games, they have a lot of thoughts, and are straight in there from the start with the solving. Scumgame has less reasoning provided with posts.

In this game, they didn't make any attempts to solve and have only fluff posted, which is the polar opposite of their town meta.

VOTE: Chemist1422 I don't have much time nowadays but hopefully this will flip scum and clear me!

tictac's play so far is a stark contrast to their last 3 town games, and fits more with their most recent scumgame.

One
Two
Three
Scumgame - replaced out

In the town games, they have a lot of thoughts, and are straight in there from the start with the solving. Scumgame has less reasoning provided with posts.

In this game, they didn't make any attempts to solve and have only fluff posted, which is the polar opposite of their town meta.

VOTE: Chemist1422 I don't have much time nowadays but hopefully this will flip scum and clear me!

Good enough for me


VOTE: Chemist1422

(GAMMA VOTES AGAIN DESPITE ALREADY VOTING)

VOTE: Chemist

This

is L-1.

(SIRCAKES UNVOTE)

I realized something about the tictac wagon-- I think regardless of tictac's alignment, there's probably scum on it. Okay maybe that's not a super hard deduction to make but bear with me here

I agree with this

VOTE: aaron actually
I'm less certain Chemist is scum here and Aaron is not making me feel good about this wagon

Eh, even chemists vote even feels a bit like survival. Bleh.

I'm bit perplexed by the vote by alo into AFF mainly because he can very easily just hop onto the chemist wagon especially since he had justified it earlier. I'm WIFOMing myself over rather or not, if it is SvS, scum busses eachother here. Scum!alo wasnt trying to bus earlier when it was tictac I guess which can explain why he is voting off wagon on Aff.

VOTE: Chemist

I'm fine leaning this way. Worse we lose 1shot jk, best we find scum, and we always clear a question mark for sure.

I said earlier I didn't have a read on Alora because I didn't know what was playstyle I think

At this point I'll keep it for self-pres though

VOTE: Chemist

VOTE: chemist

Gamma -> Cat -> SirCakes -> Wake -> Wake/Unvote -> Hectic -> Profii -> Gammax2 -> SirCakes/Unvote -> Holden -> Aloratom -> SirCakes

I object to voting lynching Gamma Day 2. I was the first to vote tictac. Gamma joined me after that. Gamma stayed on the tictac/Chemist wagon all the way to the end. Unless Gamma is Scum and was doing a hard-bus of his teammate, I don't think Gamma is Scum. WHY are people voting him?

Pretty much not one part of this is true

You didn't vote tictac first, nor did were you the first to suspect him

Gamma did not join you after you voted tictac. You were on alo at the time

Gamma voted tictac-Chem in RVS before there was any pressure, then voted tictac-Chem once the pressure was super high. He admitted it himself he thought he was actually genuinely voting them for the first time with his second vote. You make it sound like he deathtunneled them with a "hard bus". in reality he hopped on when the pressure was very high, after the hectic case and the profii hop on

[Morning Tweet]

Morning Tweet, I'm gonna give you a chance to fix what you just posted.

For starters, in 100 I voted for tictac/Chemist first and then Gamma stayed on there for a long period of time.

Gamma joined me after I voted for tictac, and stayed on him all of Day 1 even after I changed my vote.

From VC 1.04 to 1.09 Gamma stayed on tictac/Chemist until his lynch.

Read. Klick's. ISO.

If you're going to argue with me, I advise you to make sure you have your information correct.

I literally scrubbed through the entire game to find every instance of people voting tictac beyond RVS. All you're doing is reading Klick's ISO.

Hello everyone.

Let the

bloodshed

scumhunting begin.

VOTE: tictac

Hi don't touch me

VOTE: tictac
I'm pretty sure I know where your avatar comes from and I approve

^^^ These are RVS votes ^^^

More than a few times I've seen a lurker/flake turn out to be Scum.

Could be intimidation or lack of interest or hopelessness. The last game I was Scum I clammed up because it felt hopeless. In my 37:1:6:6 game multiple Mafia weren't posting. I used to think Scum wouldn't shut down, but I know better now.

VOTE: tictac

VOTE: Chemist

This

is L-1.

^^^These are your actual votes on the tictac wagon.^^^

Gamma did not death tunnel tictac as a hard bus, if that's what you're getting at. Again, his first vote on the slot is here, as an agreement to Hectic's casing. It has nothing to do with your RVS vote

[Morning Tweet]

Morning Tweet, I'm gonna give you a chance to fix what you just posted.

From VC 1.04 to 1.09 Gamma stayed on tictac/Chemist until his lynch.

Read. Klick's. ISO.

If you're going to argue with me, I advise you to make sure you have your information correct.

Like, i have my information correct man. please don't try to make me feel like i'm being ignorant, i've spent the greater part of the game analyzing this. If you want to disagree with me on Gamma, that's fine and we should discuss, but this:

I object to voting lynching Gamma Day 2. I was the first to vote tictac. Gamma joined me after that. Gamma stayed on the tictac/Chemist wagon all the way to the end. Unless Gamma is Scum and was doing a hard-bus of his teammate, I don't think Gamma is Scum. WHY are people voting him?

is a fundamentally completely different understanding of the wagon to what i have. And i don't really get what's making you think this.

Hi don't touch me

VOTE: tictac
I'm pretty sure I know where your avatar comes from and I approve

VOTE: Chemist

This

is L-1.

What was 534, Gamma?

@adorable Do you have any reads?

534 was me not realizing Chemist replaced tictac but I was fine leaving it unmentioned when I did that.

^^ Here's why I don't consider his RVS vote the beginning of a deathtunnel on tictac, btw

[Morning Tweet]

Unless Gamma is Scum and was doing a hard-bus of his teammate, I don't think Gamma is Scum.

You said that the only way Gamma is scum is if he hard-bussed tictac. Which I'm trying to tell you isn't the case

I object to voting lynching Gamma Day 2. I was the first to vote tictac. Gamma joined me after that.

You said his vote came after yours, which it didn't. I see now that you were referring to RVS votes, instead of your more recent votes. i don't get why you refer to those instead of your actual tictac wagon votes

Hi don't touch me

VOTE: tictac
I'm pretty sure I know where your avatar comes from and I approve

VOTE: Chemist

This

is L-1.

What was 534, Gamma?

@adorable Do you have any reads?

534 was me not realizing Chemist replaced tictac but I was fine leaving it unmentioned when I did that.

Gamma reveals here that he thought he was placing a new vote when he voted Chem, thereby disproving that he meant to vote the slot for all day

am i keeping everything in context enough?

[Morning Tweet]

Explain to me

exactly

what you don't understand about this.

I see now that you're viewing Gamma's vote here:

Hi don't touch me

VOTE: tictac
I'm pretty sure I know where your avatar comes from and I approve

As his actual contribution to the tictac wagon.

The wagon was initially started by Cat and Sircakes, though. This happened after Gamma's RVS on tictac. He didn't join, nor did he make any comments on it.

The wagon was then given greater fire by Hectic's case. Profii joined..

AND THEN gamma joined, here:

VOTE: Chemist

This

is L-1.

[Morning Tweet]

I never said the only way Gamma could be Scum is if he was hard-bussing tictac. I said it's a possibility that he could be doing that as Scum, but it's unlikely, but still possible. Why? Because in a past game Scum hard-bussed Day 1 and I completely fell for it. That's WHY I'm more cautious.

Do you understand why i interpreted it that way? You said this:

Gamma stayed on the tictac/Chemist wagon all the way to the end. Unless Gamma is Scum and was doing a hard-bus of his teammate, I don't think Gamma is Scum. WHY are people voting him?

i am NOT twisting your words. To me, this sounds like "Gamma is likely town, because if he were scum, he'd have to be hard bussing his teammate".

IT DID come after my vote. LOOK AT the VCs. I don't have time to comb through every post, but I do have time to look at the patterns among each and every VC post. That's my metric, and that's good enough for me.

we are not talking about the same votes. i keep saying this.

Spoiler: The votes im talking about

I doubt voting Gamma while he's v/la will be very productive

I'm down to try this

VOTE: tictac

Would do Holden as well. He seemed to have dropped off the radar after a lot of early shitposting

I like this tictac wagon. The inactivity is off-putting.
VOTE: tictac

My SR has somewhat lessened on Hectic; I feel I'm confusing playstyle for scumminess.

More than a few times I've seen a lurker/flake turn out to be Scum.

Could be intimidation or lack of interest or hopelessness. The last game I was Scum I clammed up because it felt hopeless. In my 37:1:6:6 game multiple Mafia weren't posting. I used to think Scum wouldn't shut down, but I know better now.

VOTE: tictac

(WAKE UNVOTE)

I have time to pressure tictac later.

I'd be OK with an Aloratom lynch today.

VOTE: Aloratom

tictac's play so far is a stark contrast to their last 3 town games, and fits more with their most recent scumgame.

One
Two
Three
Scumgame - replaced out

In the town games, they have a lot of thoughts, and are straight in there from the start with the solving. Scumgame has less reasoning provided with posts.

In this game, they didn't make any attempts to solve and have only fluff posted, which is the polar opposite of their town meta.

VOTE: Chemist1422 I don't have much time nowadays but hopefully this will flip scum and clear me!

tictac's play so far is a stark contrast to their last 3 town games, and fits more with their most recent scumgame.

One
Two
Three
Scumgame - replaced out

In the town games, they have a lot of thoughts, and are straight in there from the start with the solving. Scumgame has less reasoning provided with posts.

In this game, they didn't make any attempts to solve and have only fluff posted, which is the polar opposite of their town meta.

VOTE: Chemist1422 I don't have much time nowadays but hopefully this will flip scum and clear me!

Good enough for me


VOTE: Chemist1422

(GAMMA VOTES AGAIN DESPITE ALREADY VOTING. HE ADMITS LATER THAT HE DIDN'T EVEN KNOW HE WAS ALREADY VOTING)

VOTE: Chemist

This

is L-1.

(SIRCAKES UNVOTE)

I realized something about the tictac wagon-- I think regardless of tictac's alignment, there's probably scum on it. Okay maybe that's not a super hard deduction to make but bear with me here

I agree with this

VOTE: aaron actually
I'm less certain Chemist is scum here and Aaron is not making me feel good about this wagon

Eh, even chemists vote even feels a bit like survival. Bleh.

I'm bit perplexed by the vote by alo into AFF mainly because he can very easily just hop onto the chemist wagon especially since he had justified it earlier. I'm WIFOMing myself over rather or not, if it is SvS, scum busses eachother here. Scum!alo wasnt trying to bus earlier when it was tictac I guess which can explain why he is voting off wagon on Aff.

VOTE: Chemist

I'm fine leaning this way. Worse we lose 1shot jk, best we find scum, and we always clear a question mark for sure.

I said earlier I didn't have a read on Alora because I didn't know what was playstyle I think

At this point I'll keep it for self-pres though

VOTE: Chemist

VOTE: chemist

Spoiler: The votes you're talking about

Hello everyone.

Let the

bloodshed

scumhunting begin.

VOTE: tictac

Hi don't touch me

VOTE: tictac
I'm pretty sure I know where your avatar comes from and I approve

Pedit:

Okay. I think we're getting there. That was not a fake-vote. Gamma reveals that here:

Hi don't touch me

VOTE: tictac
I'm pretty sure I know where your avatar comes from and I approve

VOTE: Chemist

This

is L-1.

What was 534, Gamma?

@adorable Do you have any reads?

534 was me not realizing Chemist replaced tictac but I was fine leaving it unmentioned when I did that.

[Morning Tweet]

I understand what you're saying now. I disagree with the notion Gamma is likely town for it. I treat Gamma's second vote on tictac as his actual contribution to the wagon. He thought that his "L-1" vote on Chem was his true vote. It wasn't a reaction test, he legitimately thought that was his vote

Evidence to support this: He admits it himself. He never talks about tictac in his ISO, at all. as far as I can see. It's literally a jump from voting tictac in RVS, to talking about unrelated stuff, to voting Chem in an attempt to put her at L-1.

This reads like he hastily voted chem, as if he just felt like he needed to. So hasty and without any thought that he didn't even realize he was already voting her prior. Which kinda reveals he wasn't trying to evaluate tictac, at all, since he didn't even remember he was voting him

Additionally, i have townreads on some of the different members of the wagon, and i feel strongly there is a busser. It all comes together

[Morning Tweet]

Maybe Gamma is Scum. I don't know. I'm trying to make accurate judgments based on the evidence and player patterns I currently have.

So if Gamma is Scum then he was bussing Chemist. If I were Scum I would want avoid bussing at all costs unless it was necessary.

We do know tictac slot was on Aloratom from VC 1.02 all the way to lynch. Davesaz was on Aloratom from VC 1.04 to lynch.

How would you evaluate that? Scum was on Aloratom for much of Day 1.

I think your statement that "If I were scum, I'd avoid bussing" is not a valid reason to dismiss bussing. The wagon was very strong since there was essentially no defense from Hectic's case. I outline why i think someone bussed in 965

I think you make a fair point that both Dave and tictac-Chem were on Alo, although tictac's vote as just left over from RVS, so i'm not as concerned as i would be

I do not think that all remaining scum were on the Alo wagon. I think, at most, there is only 1 scum there. However, I feel it is extremely likely there is 1 (maybe 2, in an edge case) on tictac-Chem, and 1 off wagon somewhere. I am leaning Aaron/Bob for the off-wagon scum, and Gamma/profii on-wagon.

[Morning Tweet]

I object to voting lynching Gamma Day 2. I was the first to vote tictac. Gamma joined me after that. Gamma stayed on the tictac/Chemist wagon all the way to the end. Unless Gamma is Scum and was doing a hard-bus of his teammate, I don't think Gamma is Scum. WHY are people voting him?

I also tuned out around Page 12 so leshrug
Like Morning Tweet is right that I was in a bad place to unvote if I was Chemist’s buddy

The main issue with your statement is the term “hard-bussing”. I wasn’t active for a lot of D1 so it’s hard to call my actions hard-anything. I don’t think you’re scum but you do seem to be arguing a case with a sizable hole in it

Why are you siding against yourself?

[Morning Tweet]

I think profii is town. On #526 he broke the tie on the Chemist/Aloratom wagon and if profii was scum I think he would have voted Aloratom instead of voting Chemist.

I think this analysis, while vote-wise is probably technically correct, doesn't take enough information into account. Profii joined the tictac-Chem wagon as it got heated up. It wasn't really a tie at that point in the game, even if the votes were similar-- the Alo wagon was more or less stagnated, whereas the tictac-Chem one was gaining a lot of traciton

what do you make of my analysis of the wagons and who i think is likely scum in 939 and 942 ?

[Morning Tweet]

Spoiler: Holden's Gamma post

Starting my catch up with Gamma considering we have a lynch relatively soon and they are leading it.

Gamma overall feels very underwelling, but it seems various RL things have impacted their ability to play as well as self-admitted apathy. Yet, I think there are some key points that do push gamma more as town than scum. One of those is the posts made after them pushing Chemist to L1

Spoiler: posts

The PR claim doesn't really change anything for me. Sorry :c

Btw, I still scumread Gamma: Any particular reason you're struggling to get into this game, Gamma? Why the Misty vote, and do you have any other reads to share?

Misty, is it bad that I just realised your shirt pocket is actually a thumbs up?

I’m more just not trying at all rn, not bored enough yet but I think I might be able to convert some pent up energy into fuel to propel me through this game
The vote is because I think the wagon is less bad rn
I don’t get why A-Tom is being voted

Why are people voting A-Tom?

I realized something about the tictac wagon-- I think regardless of tictac's alignment, there's probably scum on it. Okay maybe that's not a super hard deduction to make but bear with me here

I agree with this

VOTE: aaron actually
I'm less certain Chemist is scum here and Aaron is not making me feel good about this wagon

Cake your here. Why does chemist feel less scummy to you?

He seems just lost and confused. Also that would be a weird choice of fakeclaim imo.
I feel scum would be freaking out more

The claim may not necessarily be fake, he could just be a scum 1-shot jailkeeper. I think I want to leave that claim alone for today though.

Also I disagree with that last sentence, I think more often than not scum try to maintain their composure when under pressure.

My take is a 1-Shot PR is a good option for a safe scum fakeclaim. I have tried it myself, though I fucked up the execution with too many bells and whistles. I don’t see anything indicating Chemist is fakeclaiming but I don’t think his claim is in itself a point for his survival.

While we do not know alo's alignment, we do know chemist's. I find the stance gamma takes here quite interesting due to how much it would force the scum team to lock in a bus. I don't think it is a stretch to say that scum was planning to bus around then, but Gamma's posts fully locks down any potential of him helping his partner chem. Gamma's criticism of the jk claim hardly helps scum since the claim was one of the relatively few things keeping chemist afloat. I don't think scum ever expects chem to make it pass day 2, but getting an mislynching in fixes the cost of scum losing a member.

While it is possible scum!gamma stayed on the chemist wagon while the other member left themselves open to an Alo wagon (assuming Alo is town), I find it equally puzzling of why gamma was picked to have the more advantageous spot post flip considering how lackluster they were in everyone's eyes. If anything, I would expect scum!gamma to be the one to leave the door open to try and get more value out of their partner dying.

Gamma, Aloratom, if neither of you want to be lynched Day 2 I would ask that you please join me in lynching davesaz if you aren't already.

Any logic besides the idea he (and AaronFFrost) we’re voting A-Tom as a counterwagon? I don’t find that idea particularly conclusive.

Although slightly weaker due to Gamma flipping on this after an ISO dive (vote on aaron), I think the rebutted against Wake's forced survival statement/threat by not caving in is also pointing to a town gamma. Furthermore, the fact Gamma picked AaronFFrost and not Dave to park his vote on also reinforces this as AFF was not in Wake's direct focus of lynching into the PR pool. I think if scum!gamma was trying to come onto a wagon to attempt to survive this phase, it aligns himself with the person he knows will help carry it by pleasing Wake (since Wake's play-style is aggressive and opinionated enough to not cave in if he feels he is right).

There is also the point that I brought up about how the wagons have progressed and not much has changed really about it. Hectic defined it as stagnation which I agree with. However, the wagon of gamma is stagnating with only mild resistance unlike when it stalled day 1 when both chem and alo were tired and it was a slog to push over that bump. I didn't see anybody's reads who is on the wagon as them sowing the seeds for another lynch day 3, but if Wake is town and this push to get the PR pool lynched is town driven, then why does scum necessary need to do any doubt planting? The answer is they dont. I do think the logic is edging onto WIFOM territory since we have to make assumptions about Wake, but it does show a world where it makes sense for the stagnation to occur and gamma is town.

TLDR: I see Gamma as town despite the low amount of posts. Their play does not align with what I think gamma's scum motivation would of been both during day 1 and now. Rather, they feel as disinterested town. I do not like a lynch there today. Not only does it not provide much info in all honesty, but I doubt the slot is scum.

Your analysis that Gamma pretty much locked himself into bussing is right. However, the wagon was feeling like it was so heavily favoured that it wouldn't make sense for scum to try and defend it. I think at that point in time on the wagon, it made a lot of sense for scum to bus that. And if its Gamma!scum, unable to go too deeply into a read or post on the thread, that's probably what he'd do

You mention that Gamma being the one to bus for "extra towncred" doesn't seem right, since he already isn't having a very favourable game. I can see this, but at the same time, it could easily be the other way around. Like they'd put the more favourable slot in the disadvantageous defending Chem and/or voting Alo position, and have Gamma try to secure extra towncred.

the wagon stagnating thing i already talked abt

Those are the main points i picked out. i feel like they're coming from a town mindset, but i don't think they clear gamma either. If i have to switch wagons today, i'd want to be aaron/bob.

[Morning Tweet]

do you still think my claim is necessary wake?

[Morning Tweet]

Nobody has had any trouble understanding it.

Understanding Gamma's post or your response?

If the latter, then yes, I very much have trouble understanding your resort to intimidation there, so feel free to use your mental powers to explain yourself. You have no clue who I am going to vote for, but fear it is you. So instead of responding to my case and letting it stand, you directly attempt to demoralize me by threatening a P-lynch on me if I keep going.

So if I want to lynch wake should I be plynched because he is claimed watcher? Should I plynch you for wanting to lynch claimed watcher?

Gamma implied I didn't claim.
I don't think anyone had trouble understanding the claim.

Nobody lynches a protective. Ever.
Not intimidation. Simple common sense.
I have a very hard time understanding most of the people in this game. It's like they're not even speaking English or something.

I'm inclined to think this is dave's actual belief that, because he claimed protective, it is inherently scummy to push him. And i think he's town for it. Kinda gut and as Hectic said could be AtE i guess, but i dont think so

Im not interested into getting into a shitshow to clog the game like I said. I do think I am quite fuckable, but I rather not test that theory and preserve the little amounts of anal virginity I have left.

i

ok

do you still think my claim is necessary wake?

I absolutely do.

can i pretty please not have to?

[Morning Tweet]

1 day, 18 hours, 9 minutes.

dave, pretend wake weren't in the game for a sec. who would you vote instead

I haven't properly read through the last few pages but wanted to point out:

Dave has a lot more value as potential doc since he has a pool of 2 outed PRs to protect in [Waka and Morning]. I think it's better to leave him around for mech reasons.

again, who says I wanted to lynch him?

That's my current problem. He responds to my read, yet gives me this ultimatum that if dare to keep pushing him i'll get lynched.

Let's work pass that then, why do you think dave's reaction is townie? Or is the town read on something else?

I don't know actually;

sometimes I'm a sucker for AtE. I still haven't read the last few pages properly. I'll report back tomorrow.

Jesus Christ Hectic

I suck at AtE analysis as well so I was hoping you had more insight.

Your point about having Gamma defend tictac-Chem instead of the other partner is fair. but i wonder.. could mafia coordinate something like that with each other? do we actually know if there's day chat or not? And if they do have a day chat, wouldn't gamma have gone dark for a while both in the game thread and the mafia thread? i can feasibly see the other partner deciding to be the one to defend tictac-chem if gamma weren't there at the time

[Morning Tweet]

I dunno, like the focus right now is gamma because it's a viable lynch and the deadline approaches

I'm kinda not convinced he is scum because I dont feel apathy is AI for gamma. But the wagon has totally stalled so I'm teetering on the edge of voting for him.

I dont like the idea of Dave being a doc, being able to protect wake who can watch Dave to give us a guilty should scum try and kill him. Seems kinda massively town sided to the point I think someone is lying

But lynching a doc is obviously stupid

Adorable made a weird post about me being town for breaking the tie between Alo and Chemist yesterday- it kinda implies that she knows Alo is town so that's bothering me.

Maybe I should just vote gamma and see what new PR info we get

what do you make of my reasons for voting Gamma other than activity level? In essence, his vote onto Chem seems like scum who joined the thread, hasn't really been paying a lot of attention to the game state, sees that his partner is under fire for seemingly pretty solid reasons, and then he joins it for the towncred.

I also know he joined without having much of another thought (on reflex), because he was actually already voting tictac-Chem but he legitimately thought it was his first vote

[Morning Tweet]

I believe that on the premise of *not voting early on the partner* is basically something that is making me feel good about Wake and Gamma right now.

Sigh

They're both RVS votes. gamma went very inactive after the vote, and then revoted tictac-Chem to L-1, forgetting he already voted the slot

[Morning Tweet]

Also yes it is a bus

\(≧▽≦)/

So i take it you dont find it to be SvS like aaron did?

[Morning Tweet]

Hang on just a moment Holden i havent gotten a chance to read all of it just yet

[Morning Tweet]

Pedit: then provide us with info. You seem to hold hectic in townie regards given you asking him if posts looked like dodging, care to explain the town read? How much have you read of the game?

I want to know if tictac (or was it Chemist?) seemed to be dodging interactions with Hectic

they dodged interactions with almost every slot i think, wouldn't be able to point one out specifically

I also think Aloratom is town and the reason is somewhere in my ISO

yay!

pedit: :O

[Morning Tweet]

am i gonna be able to persuade both of you to join gamma or is that a fruitless quest? i have more to read but i dont want you guys to have to wait for me either

[Morning Tweet]

Can we get some votes for Creature (the Aaron slot)? I feel like Creature’s current approach is a scum one, trying to avoid making waves

I agree with this actually. This has felt like scum!Creature so far since replacing in.

VOTE: Creature

oh my god is this another meta thing

[Morning Tweet]

I'm not sure im confident enough in myself to change the lynch anyway. Creatures entrance actually looked kinda good to me, but i cant really disprove it coming from a good scum player, and i dont know this meta case. that and aaron is on my off-wagon scum list

[Morning Tweet]

Votecount 1.03

Hectic (2): AaronFrost, bob3141
HoldenGolden (2): SirCakez, Morning Tweet
tictac (2): Wake88, Gamma Emerald
bob3141 (2): Aloratom, Hectic
Morning Tweet (2): HoldenGolden, Cat Scratch Fever
Aloratom (1): tictac
AaronFrost (1): profii
Cat Scratch Fever (0):
profii (0):
Wake88 (0):
Gamma Emerald (0):
davesaz (0):
SirCakez (0):

Not Voting: davesaz

With

13

alive, it takes

7

to lynch.

The day will end in (expired on 2020-04-20 11:30:00).

Quick note: Gamma was the second to vote tictac(Chemist), do we believe he would've bussed his partner here that early in a game with 13 players ?

I don't think so.

*screaming*

[Morning Tweet]

I think if Creatures play has been inherently scummy and theres something about it that im unable to see meta-wise, then im fine with it. I would very much prefer a Gamma lynch, but i also dont have creature-Aaron in my town block + others have their own reasonings. Although I think everyone (except Holden's) reasoning for defending Gamma "He voted early!" is not a reason to clear him

i have to leave again, im finished reading now. i might not be able to be online for a few hours, so good luck

[Morning Tweet]

VOTE: Wake
I don’t think Watcher + Doctor + Role Cop passes as balanced and out of the remaining roles I’m more inclined to doubt the second investigative role.

Is it unheard of for there to be multiple investigatives? By their play alone I am inclined to vote dave. I don't think this is a strong argument

Why does scum!Wake out both me and dave rather than just kill us? it's a lot of unnecessary, extra WIFOM risk.

It outweighs the double investigative thing for me.

[Morning Tweet]

Bob's hop on to Creature yesterday feels really bad to me. That combined with his day one does not inspire confidence.

[Morning Tweet]

I believe you're definitely right Wake

I'd neighbourize hectic, without a doubt. He's the coolest!

Can confirm Hectic is, in fact, the coolest

[Morning Tweet]

I wasn't killed, which means Wake is town. Scum killing protective is high priority unless that kill will result in a guilty. Scum believed the watcher would get a guilty. Wake wasn't killed, which means scum thought I would protect him. Kill priority would be investigative over protective, unless protected. I assert that this implies I have to be town protective, though I will be generous and try not to sling insults if people don't get it.

You would insult me if i had the idea that this isnt the case? You arent confirmed just because you and wake survived..? Unless im missing what you're saying

[Morning Tweet]

I'd neighbourize hectic, without a doubt. He's the coolest!

Wait who is this in response to?

that's my neighbourizer crumb

That post was a response to Hectic asking me what id do with a cop, vig, n neighbourizer shot

[Morning Tweet]

I'd neighbourize hectic, without a doubt. He's the coolest!

Wait who is this in response to?

that's my neighbourizer crumb

That post was a response to Hectic asking me what id do with a cop, vig, n neighbourizer shot

I figured that but I myself have used that question as a general one to the entire playerlist to break the ice twice so it was interesting to me

i didnt see your following post somehow >-<

i need to take a break

Btw is there a particular reason you never claimed D2 MT?

There is indeed! I generally felt like enough people in the thread had pieced it together (Hectic knew obviously, Holden did, profii i think alluded to it?) so there was no real good reason to out it officially. If scum hadnt already figured it out, then it should stay that way. Telling Wake wasn't really worth it because im not worth watching (except as a WIFOM ig)

[Morning Tweet]

If we consider the scenario in which all PRs are TPRs, I believe that the game ends with Gamma> Bob> Profii. However, I find it difficult that none of the remaining scums tried to incorporate one of the important roles, as this apathy would eventually lead to systematic elimination between VTs and premature defeat.

This is where i'm at rn. This + Gamma's claim makes me think we have it PoE'd

great likelihood of a scum bussing tictac-Chem + The d2 pivot to Aaron-Creature + Gamma's claim!! causes me to feel very strongly feel gamma is scum here, both readswise and mechanically

Gamma's recent posting causes me paranoia that i could have the setup balance wrong here though

Watcher + Babysitter + Rolecop + Neighbourizer + Neighbourizer Enabler fits as far as i know. Babysitter explains how watcher and a protective can coexist. Dave's role completed the setup in a way that seems like it wouldve been hard to come up with

If instead Wake or dave-Lucky IS actually scum in the PRs, i'd say dave because Wake's gambit makes 0 sense for a scum player to do outside of WIFOM. But i find this unlikely because of dave's anger and his weird stance on
being unlynchable solely on the grounds that he is a protective. My prior townread on Wake was pretty huge from d1

Gamma's sudden reaction to Lucky still concerns me. AtE is something im not strong reading

I think you, Lucky, MT and Wake are Town, our of these I feel least strongly on Wake just because it’s pretty much just because of the role

I don’t have any leads on who is scum but I can probably figure it out through a mix of PoE and scumhunting at this point

I just need to actually do that

Please do, it'd be really helpful

[Morning Tweet]

@Gamma, was there supposed to be a follow-up to 1529 ?

My plan is to break this up across a few days, tomorrow I will do profii and Bob, and the next day I will do Hectic. I’m doing this so I don’t have a burnout.

[Morning Tweet]

It's less "Ascetic town doesn't exist", more "There is not an ascetic town in this game"

[Morning Tweet]

Gamma where'd you go ;(

[Morning Tweet]

(;﹏;) hectic..

Spoiler: the game

TOWN BLOCK //
Clidd

TOWN LEAN //
Hectic

ROLE CLAIMS //
Wake - Voted Alo D1, Voted Creature D2, (considered Lucky D3)
Lucky/Dave - Voted Alo D1, Voted Creature D2, (considered Wake D3)

VT CLAIMS //
Profii - Voted Chem D1, Voted Creature D2, (considered Wake D3 and Lucky D2)
Bob - Voted Dave D1, Voted Creature D2
Adorable/Cat - Voted Chem D1, Voted Gamma D2

-==================-

Spoiler: Clidd

I would be highly surprised if clidd-Alo is scum this game. It’s highly unlikely that the only two wagons with any semblence of pressure on day 1 are both on scum.

Additionally since the replace-in, i’ve found myself agreeing with clidd for the most part. His reads in 1341 are similar to my own reads prior to Gamma flip

Clidd also does somewhat of a slip in 1493 where he uses a post from his personal PT that has broken post links. it’s technically possible clidd went through the effort of creating one as scum just to do that, but i think it’s vastly more likely clidd is just town here

Spoiler: Hectic

Hectic created the original case on tictac at a time when tictac could have survived if Alo was pushed harder. I feel hectic is more likely to be town than a hard busser. However, that doesn't clear him like it does for clidd. I can see a world where scum hard busses a teammate far more easily than a world where the only 2 d1 suspects are scum

Hectic and I downplayed our townreads on each other as a tactic to survive longer and then surprise scum later. I originally wrote that with the intention of downplaying his towniness. My actual townread on Hectic was quite strong. I think the lack of scum daytalk means Hectic couldn't have coordinated that bus with tictac. That, and he has been really helpful in my hood. I'll use this to post Hectic's last thoughts instead.

I shared a bunch of this analysis i've been making with him last night. Originally i didn't even consider the thought of both Wake and Lucky being town. Hectic believed it was most likely that there's two scum in profii/adorable/bob. Wake and Lucky can both be town since Gamma and sircake's roles are negative utility. He also agreed with my analysis on Wake being town.

he made a reminder for later, check out how Wake played his previous scum game.

He said that he'll spend more time trying to solve this game if he is alive tomorrow.

sniff

And finally, when i asked him not to leave me, he said he wasn't planning on it. The last thing he posted was an ascii art of mario holding a bat

-==================-

Spoiler: Wake

If wake is scum, why would he out davesaz and I in the main thread? And then he begins to push davesaz (or me as an alternative). After either of our flips, he’d look bad, but he’d probably then push the other PR. Even best-case scenario and Wake manages to mislynch both dave and I, was it worth the unnecessary risk? This is a negative gambit for scum!Wake unless it’s for WIFOM.


1276 - Wake would prefer to lynch dave/Morning but will compromise on Creature

Wake is convinced at this point in the game that either dave or I am scum and finds it unlikely we’re all three town. This is odd, but i think Wake does this simply because he thinks there’s a limited amount of PRs from his personal setup spec.


1346 - Wake claims that he watched davesaz be visited by HoldenGolden


1352 - Wake rebukes dave’s post saying that Wake is town because dave survived. Wake reminds dave that dave is not confirmed town

I think that post by dave looks bad now and Wake is correct here


1380 - Wake proposes finding scum by checking who refused to join the tictac/chemist wagon and also joined the creature wagon. Wake thinks davesaz-Lucky is scum. He has lesser suspicions on Hectic, Morning, and Gamma. He votes davesaz

Again, this tunnel on dave seems like it’d be a bad move as scum. Just as revealing dave and I would be a bad move as scum


1385 - Wake asks dave if he needs time formulating a full claim

Babysitter was a claim that made a lot of sense. Dave did wait to claim it, which in hindsight could be because he was uncomfortable with fake claiming. I did not really think that was a possibility at the time though, Wake seems to have an eye for this thing apparently. That or he’s just scum making stuff up


1386 - Wake calls dave’s rage fake

It didn’t really come across as fake to me. Again, Wake saw dave’s likelihood of being scum as high before most of the game. I wonder if this is due to an ulterior motive, but like, it doesn’t seem like a good play if Wake is scum. But then again, Wake revealing 2 PRs wasn’t a good play as town either.

Overall I heavily lean on Wake being town. Unless i unearth a previous scumgame of wake pulling a WIFOM tactic like this

Spoiler: Lucky

I think setup-wise, lucky is more likely to be scum. Watcher can somewhat fulfill the role of a town protective.

Actually reading through this, all Lucky did was death tunnel push Gamma. Not really scummy on its own but seems a bit narrowminded. He seems to justify this as he believes that gamma is 100% scum and he’s going to get nightkilled


1435/1453/1457/1462 - Lucky seems pretty convinced already that Gamma is scum

This is how i felt yesterday as well. But i had a huge case built up from previous days. Lucky had just replaced in. it’s odd that he already felt so strongly about Gamma, but i originally chalked it up to him thinking that he'd die at night due to his role and that'd be it


1474/1485/1489 - Lucky spends many posts inquiring why Morning is town in this setup.

In the event that lucky is scum, this makes sense. I’d expect the scum of Lucky/Wake to push one of the other PRs. Wake is pushing Lucky, while Lucky is pushing me. Wake has consistently been suspicious of dave since d2. For Wake i actually see it as more of a town thing though. if wake is scum, it'd look bad if he immediately got a town PR lynched


1501 - Lucky feels clidd accidentally confirmed himself as town

I tend to agree here. Clidd is 95% town


1514 - Lucky tells Gamma that he hasn’t read his play. He’s just following the votes

Does Lucky always solely rely on VCA? telling Gamma he hasn’t even read his posts is a bit of a slap in the face for gamma lol. I could see this potentially being an easy pass for scum!Lucky to vote Gamma without having to justify it so much.


1533 - Lucky basically says “that’s it?” to Gamma

Yeah pretty much.

Both dave and Wake were off-wagon d1. Out of the VTs minus clidd, profii and Adorable were on-wagon and bob was off-wagon d1

I think it is most likely one of the PR claims is scum + one in bob/profii/adorable.

Between Wake and dave, i feel its dave simply because Wake scum sounds so unlikely given his gambit. However, my issue with this is that dave’s AtE on day 2 felt real. Why would he get so mad as scum as opposed to frustrated town? Dave seemed towny from his reaction. Another problem that arises is Lucky’s behaviour on D3. He pretty much just seemed fine tunneling Gamma and “getting nightkilled”. Would Lucky have done this after entering the thread upon receiving a scum role PM?

it is possible that there is 2 scum within profii/bob/Adorable. Gamma’s role was a negative town utility, as was SirCake’s. The setup could still be balanced with Babysitter/Rolecop/Watcher/Enabled Neighbourizer + --Enabler --Ascetic Townie. I assume scum would have at least one strong PR to combat this however.

This leaves room for 4 VTs. That’s not very many compared to the PRs, so it’d make the setup very unconventional compared to the other games of this size i've read. It makes me think i’m more likely to be wrong on Wake/dave and there is only 1 scum in adorable/profii/bob.

Another argument for 1 scum being in Wake/dave is actually the VT claims. If we have a town rolecop/babysitter/watcher/neighbourizer, wouldn’t a scum PR claim a role other than VT to make it so it's impossible to decipher who the scum PR is? Admittedly this is the point im least sure about, they might just claim VT

Conclusion: I think overall the most likely scenario is one of Lucky/Wake is scum with one of profii/bob/adorable. I believe it is Lucky since Wake has such a high likelihood of not being scum.
HOWEVER: it is possible for two scum to be in profii/bob/adorable if the setup has an unusually low number of VTs and scum has some strong PR power to balance it. im not sure if this is a thing that happens however. That's 4 VTs.

I am going to look further into profii/bob/adorable before doing anything else. There's 1 if not 2 scum in there and i haven't reread them

[Morning Tweet]

Spoiler: Profii

1414 - Profii theorizes the scumteam is {Wake, Hectic}
those are my two of my highest townreads man!

1426 - Profii questions why the N2 wasn't blocked.
I'm unsure what he means by this. Is this surprise that there was a death N2?

1494/1498 - Profii considers scum neighbourizer being in the setup to grant scum a way to have daytalk
At first, i didn't think much of this. But now that i'm considering it more, that sounds like a weird way to design a setup.

additionally, I do not like the suspicion on Hectic that he creates with this theory. It both requires a scum neighbourizer being in the setup (which isn't here), AND it requires that the scum neighbourizer recruits scum. from town!profii PoV, that'd be a large stretch to suspect hectic

Overall i feel like trying to incorporate hectic into the lynchpool looks forced. Hectic back and forth on his profii read quite a bit, but last night he decided that in profii/bob/adorable, profii is most likely. We didn't get down to discussing it but im starting to see why he thought that

1536 - "I said to myself I'd tunnel Wake for most of the day and my continued survival would be a sign that scum want me to continue to do so and I'm wrong but I'm already bored of that strategy."

I am really confused why profii is going after Wake in the first place. But not only that, profii is considering that his continuing to be alive could be intentional in order for him to attack Wake.

i feel like this might be a way for him to comfortably tunnel Wake but also sound like he was having an internal struggle over it if wake is lynched/dies. What causes town!profii to think he would die if Wake is scum?

@profii, in 1426 were you talking about the nightkill?

Also @profii, Do you still feel the same way you did in 1536? I.e. suspecting Wake but also worried that scum is intentionally letting you attack Wake

[Morning Tweet]

@Bob

Why are you so confident that scum will target a PR claim? If there's scum in Wake/Lucky, i wouldn't expect scum to hit a PR claim

Additionally, if all PR claims are town, scum still might not target them as a WIFOM tactic

[Morning Tweet]

Normally a mini normal has 4 pr and I think once in a while there will be 5 pr but normally it's 4. I listed the pr claims we have seen and heard and there are 6. Three pr are dead and three are alive. Figuring out which pr is scum will be tough.

Neighborizer Enabler
Rolecop
Ascetic
Babysitter
Neighborizer
Watcher

The fact you woudl seven suggest 6 town pr leaves me thinking you are trying to force a 1v1v1 between them today.

As at teh most one can be scum. Thus at least one scum must be else where.

And if watch and babysitter are town then scum has to risk killing one at night. Why would anyone want to lynch there while we still have one mislycnh to spare.


VOTE: Adorable

Profii (1575) and I (1570) have also placed heavy suspicion upon the PR pool today. Why aren't you suspicious of us forcing a 1v1v1?

Again you are certain that scum is going to strike the babysitter/watcher. But if wake/lucky are scum, striking the other would make no sense. why do you not consider this?

[Morning Tweet]

Another argument for 1 scum being in Wake/dave is actually the VT claims. If we have a town rolecop/babysitter/watcher/neighbourizer, wouldn’t a scum PR claim a role other than VT to make it so it's impossible to decipher who the scum PR is? Admittedly this is the point im least sure about, they might just claim VT

i have more on this now. If the setup is:

Town Watcher (+)
Town Babysitter (+)
Town Rolecop (+)
Town Neighbourizer (+)
Town Neighbourizer Enabler (-)
Town Ascetic (-)
4 VT

Our PR strength would be less than 4. More of a 3-3.5 range probably

But if scum don't have strong roles, say they have:

Scum 1-shot JK
<something weak or goon>
Mafia Goon

then that'd explain why our PR strength is weak. It's weak not because we only have a few PRs, but weak because our PRs are overall not that strong

And then this would also explain why there's no extra claim coming from the VT pool of clidd/bob/adorable/profii. They wouldn't have a role to claim other than something bad like the "Ascetic town" claim was

[Morning Tweet]

@Bob

Why are you so confident that scum will target a PR claim? If there's scum in Wake/Lucky, i wouldn't expect scum to hit a PR claim

Additionally, if all PR claims are town, scum still might not target them as a WIFOM tactic

What im sayng is that i infact think scum have not targeted the town pr to be able to WIFOM push them.

Tweet what do you think of town pr balance if either the watcher is scum or

lucky is scum with another pr.

Your role if town is just to weak to plug any of those holes.

neighbourizer with an enabler is in effect similar to a 2-3 shot neighbourizer.

enabler is use to nerf town roles.

I agree that the setup looks off if the watcher is scum. If Lucky is scum, i think the setup is still possible since watcher can perform a pseudo protective role. What do you mean by the bolded?

Also @profii, Do you still feel the same way you did in 1536? I.e. suspecting Wake but also worried that scum is intentionally letting you attack Wake

2nd post. Surely we are lynching a PR claim today. Need to think which one

are you still entertaining Wake being scum? This post makes me think you find all PR claims are equally likely candidates

Normally a mini normal has 4 pr and I think once in a while there will be 5 pr but normally it's 4. I listed the pr claims we have seen and heard and there are 6. Three pr are dead and three are alive. Figuring out which pr is scum will be tough.

Same goes to you. Are you entertaining all PR claims being scum equally?

[Morning Tweet]

What do you make of Lucky opting to try and target scum rather than a nightkill target, bob?

[Morning Tweet]

ROLE CLAIMS //
Wake - Voted Alo D1, Voted Creature D2, (considered Lucky D3)
Lucky/Dave - Voted Alo D1, Voted Creature D2, (considered Wake D3)

VT CLAIMS //
Profii - Voted Chem D1, Voted Creature D2, (considered Wake D3 and Lucky D2)
Bob - Voted Dave D1, Voted Creature D2
Adorable/Cat - Voted Chem D1, Voted Gamma D2

If the scumteam is Lucky/bob, then that'd mean there were actually 0 bussers D1. Lucky-dave voted for Alo-clidd, and bob voted for Lucky-dave (??)

im actually leaning towards it being Lucky + Adorable/profii. I am almost certain scum bussed tictac-Chem, and profii/Adorable fit that bill well

Bob has some weird behaviour: Voting dave over Chem D1, Refusing to vote Gamma and instead hopping on Creature D2 but then easily voting Gamma D3. Still, it's not outside of believability that he's town

Profii and Adorable-Cat, on the other hand, readily bussed Chem D1. Cat was on the wagon early, while profii hopped on after Hectic's case. Profii was on Creature D2, while Adorable was on Gamma D2

[Morning Tweet]

I'm still around, btw. This catchup is going to be a while, but it'll be worth it.

oo i'm already getting excited!

[Morning Tweet]

What do you make of Lucky opting to try and target scum rather than a nightkill target, bob?

that lucky is using the slot like vig

Ah i was referring to a point i have in my memory that you made

It was something like, if the babysitter claim is fake, then he's going to claim to have targeted someone scummy instead of towny and that's why he couldn't save the NK

Not really conclusive evidence. I could see doing that myself as a babysitter. but i do find it interesting that is in fact what he was he ended up doing

[Morning Tweet]

Did you expect scum to attack the PR claims?

Also, if you've gotten a chance to see it, what do you make of bob's case for both scum being in the VTs?

[Morning Tweet]

Oh i believe i've been misinterpreting him. He thinks that Wake is mechanically town, not the other PRs.

1580 / 1581 / 1582

That should be a condensed version by him, i think.

And in 1626 he claims the scumteam is likely profii/Adorable

[Morning Tweet]

it's probable that either A.) bob is scum with lucky or B.) adorable is scum with profii.

what do you think of the possibility both scum is in the VTs, clidd? If so, i think that makes bob town

[Morning Tweet]

This mechanical stuff is becoming a drag to read through

let's say Lucky-dave is scum. Who is the most likely partner? I'd like to pose this question to those advocating for Lucky's lynch specifically.

And for Lucky, who would you pick to lynch first out of {Bob, Profii, Adorable}?

[Morning Tweet]

I don't like Lucky's insistence on the jailkeeper point. Especially when we're not really trying to be overly concerned with mechanics. Except bob, who is speaking purely in mechanics

If we flip Lucky and he's red, we'll win. His partner is likely bob, or maybe profii I guess. We get two lynches in the event it isn't bob, but i think we'd just win after lynching bob

If we flip Lucky and he's green, and I assume Wake is green, then scum is in the VTs minus clidd: bob/adorb/profii. I don't

think

there's any way Wake is scum this game, same with clidd. With 2 scum in VTs, Bob vs. Adorable is way more likely TvS instead of theater. Therefore, if the team is just VTs, it's {bob/Adorable} + {profii}.

We have two lynches, so the only way this lynch strategy fails is if my Wake or clidd reads are wrong. Is there anyone who still thinks either of them could be scum?

[Morning Tweet]

Well, lets see:

If profii flips red, i'd lynch you next. Mayyybe bob, but his behaviour regarding the VTs makes me lean not him in that scenario. Either way, it's a win since we get multiple lynches

If profii flips green, then that would confirm Lucky/bob in my mind. there might be a fringe case for Lucky/adorable, but i think Lucky's partner should be bob based on today's behaviour from the two of them.

So are you willing to vote profii, Adorable? Same goes for bob. If we had to lynch profii right now, would you

[Morning Tweet]

Yeah, there's no way bob/ador is tvt and I don't read it as scum theatre either. Since clidd and tweet seem to be locktowns, that leaves the remaining scum in wake/LL. From gut, I honestly can't discern between bob and ador, but I think LL is scum over wake.

i notice you came to pretty much the same conclusions as your predecessor. I think your assessment of Bob/Adorb being TvS is correct. If Lucky is scum, bob is the most likely partner based on his voting pattern. Today Bob has come out not wanting to vote for a PR, but instead inside the VTs (profii/Adorbs).

however, if Lucky isn't scum, which is what i was leaning going into today, then the scumteam is profii-midway + {Bob/Adorable}.

Spoiler: reads

Wake
clidd

possible teams //

Lucky/Bob
profii/Bob
profii/Adorable

less likely options //

Lucky/Adorable
Lucky/profii

extremely unlikely //
Bob/Adorable

Dave's emotional outburst before repping out really make me townlean hard on him. But Lucky's insistence on the jailkeeper point doesn't sit great with me. But then again, Lucky's apathetic behaviour towards the end of D3 made sense for a town slot who thought they were going to die. And the jailkeeper thing I can still feasibly still see town bringing up. Overall I lean town still

Both Bob and Adorable have stated they're willing to vote profii-midway. I would prefer if they voted profii-midway over each other. If I'm right about Lucky, clidd, and Wake, then profii-midway has to be scum.

VOTE: midway

Unless I can convince myself of Lucky!scum, midway-profii has a much greater chance of flipping red.

@Wake

What do you think of dave's actions right before he replaced out? How he handled the claim basically

[Morning Tweet]

I don't like treating people as clear just because it might make sense "mechanically"

Apparently tweet and clidd are locktowns for an unknown reason I'll choose to believe
like clidd said before LL vs Wake and bob vs adorable are both not tvt arguments(and they don't read like svs either)
I SR LL and you more than Wake and adorable

Why do you have me as locktown then? Clidd is a half-mechanical, half-obvtown thing too.

Essentially, there were literally only two wagons D1. Clidd and Chem(scum). Also, i independently townread clidd. Also i think he sort of townslipped in 1493 where he linked posts from a PT notes thread

[Morning Tweet]

well there's my clidd reasoning that i suspect at least a few people share. You'd have to ask bob why Wake/Morning is locktown. Oh yeah, you're voting bob

If bob is scum, i think it's more likely that his partner is Lucky than not, but im still entertaining midway-profii/bob as well. Today Lucky and Bob have gone against the grain and claimed that all of the PRs should be locktown for the most part, and therefore scum is inside {midway-profii/Adorable/bob}. If bob is scum with a VT claim, i think its more likely that bob is partners with profii as compared to adorable. Their exchanges don't feel like theatre

I'd be more comfortable voting Lucky if it came down to it, rather than bob. Lucky's flip would tell me a lot more. Bob flipping green/red could mean multiple things, but Lucky flipping red would more or less confirm Lucky/bob as the team.

[Morning Tweet]

Lucky, why does the jailkeeper have no purpose if only one in Wake/Lucky is town? Why doesnt JKer just exist so that mafia can role block any claimed power role?

Also off what Bob said sorta, if mafia had a role blocker instead of jailkeeper, then the rolecop would suspect them more. They could be a jailkeeper since JK is more of a towny sounding role than rolecop, therefore that's some kind of buff to the scumteam.

i dont think the existence of JKer confirms you, unless im missing something from your argument

[Morning Tweet]

UNVOTE:

Ok then. I do not get why midway says they will follow my vote, even when im voting them right now. It doesnt make a lot of sense from scum!midway perspective

Lynching Lucky, green!flip -> midway, red!flip -> Bob wins it. So long as clidd and wake are town, and Adorable/bob is not SvS.

I am going to ensure all of my assumptions are correct before recasting my vote. ill do that on my PC tonight prolly.

[Morning Tweet]

Spoiler: midway saying stuff

yo what up
morning sorta controls my vote too ngl

Yeah, I admit that I haven’t really tried to actively scumhunt. I’m just more focused with looking towny, so I don’t get voted. I said that adora is possibly scum too

both of your isos seem fine

they don't jump out as scummy

I find it really hard to believe scum talks like this

I had a townlean on Lucky going into today, so it's tricky. But I think it's more likely that my read is wrong, I have a tendency to townread too much and I don't want to throw by being unwilling to adjust my reads. I have a tendency to get 1 or 2 wrong, and in this scenario, I do not think i have Wake/clidd wrong

I think the way Lucky has reacted to pressure lately hasnt been explicitly towny. Rather than focus on why midway is scum, he's more focused on why he's mechanically town. Which several players arent interested in, either

I was going to make a post last night abt Wake/clidd being town and Bob/Adorbs not being SvS but i didn't get to it. So if anyone has any qualms about either of those i can do the analysis on that if you want but we're running out of time

[Morning Tweet]

MT, does the order at which you lynch me and midway matter for your PoE? If not, let's lynch Midway first since he said he's going to sheep your vote and hasn't read anything prior to D4, nor intends to. I'd like to see how he plays this out when the person he agreed to sheep leads a wagon against him.

If the scumteam is Lucky/Adorable rather than Lucky/Bob, lynching midway first would lose us the game I think

Spoiler: scenario

Lynch midway(town), Wake dies

Lucky, Morning, Adorable, Bob, clidd

Lynch Lucky(scum), Morning dies

Adorable, Bob, clidd

I think we likely lynch Bob in that LYLO. Is it possible that Lucky is scum with Adorable, though? I can still kind of see that possibility. I don't want to allow that possibility to win, but it can't be stopped if we lynch midway first

[Morning Tweet]

Spoiler: Chem, Bob, and Dave-Lucky's votes

Chem D1 >> Aloratom wagon

Bob D1 >> Counter-wagon on dave (?)
Bob D2 >> Won't vote Gamma, willing to vote Creature
Bob D3 >> Suddenly wants Gamma now
Bob D4 >> Lucky is mech town, vote midway

Dave D1 >> Aloratom wagon
Dave D2 >> Creature wagon
Lucky D3 >> Gamma wagon
Lucky D4 >> Lucky is mech town, vote midway

I have convinced myself to vote Lucky. I think it's most likely Lucky/bob, with some variance in the partner, but likely bob.

Even if I'm incorrect, i think a mislynch on Lucky will give more info than a mislynch on midway would.

I don't think I can see voting midway today

VOTE: Lucky

[Morning Tweet]

Spoiler: midway saying stuff

yo what up
morning sorta controls my vote too ngl

Yeah, I admit that I haven’t really tried to actively scumhunt. I’m just more focused with looking towny, so I don’t get voted. I said that adora is possibly scum too

both of your isos seem fine

they don't jump out as scummy

I find it really hard to believe scum talks like this

I had a townlean on Lucky going into today, so it's tricky. But I think it's more likely that my read is wrong, I have a tendency to townread too much and I don't want to throw by being unwilling to adjust my reads. I have a tendency to get 1 or 2 wrong, and in this scenario, I do not think i have Wake/clidd wrong

I think the way Lucky has reacted to pressure lately hasnt been explicitly towny. Rather than focus on why midway is scum, he's more focused on why he's mechanically town. Which several players arent interested in, either

I was going to make a post last night abt Wake/clidd being town and Bob/Adorbs not being SvS but i didn't get to it. So if anyone has any qualms about either of those i can do the analysis on that if you want but we're running out of time

Does he look invested.

See how he says his focus is on being town read. So all he is going to do is try and not look like scum. While at the same time not investing time in game thats liekly doomed.

What makes you think he even looked at adora and my iso. He makes they look fine next to no time after sayign he will look at them. After he said he hasnt read much of teh game.

What does that remind you of. No other than chemist

My argument is not that midway seems invested. Cause he doesn't. At all. You're attacking an argument that isn't mine

My gut says that scum!midway wouldn't take the "Yeah i dont really know what's going on but these two are confirmed town and uhuh im just trying to look towny so VOTE". I find it kind of hard to believe. Additionally, mislynching town!midway in a Lucky!scum scenario gives scum a shot at winning. I'm not convinced that you are Lucky's partner, but I'd pick you.

If I'm wrong and we mislynch town!midway -> lynch scum!lucky -> mislynch town!bob, then we just lost the game for no reason. It makes more sense to lynch Lucky first, because it gives me more info so that we won't make that mistake

[Morning Tweet]

I need help seeing bob as strongly town as you do, Lucky. At the moment I'm really only entertaining midway/Adorable and midway/Bob. Cause I think Adorable and Bob weren't theatering and clidd/wake are on locktown

at the moment, I would be willing to bet the game on midway. He kept Wake in the lynchpool today, because if he didn't, he'd be force to vote himself tomorrow, I guess (?) He commented that even if you're town, we still win (??) even though I made it clear midway was the other option. I interpreted him as too scummy to be scum today. He said he would sheep me while I was voting him. He openly admits he's more interested in seeming town than finding scum

From what you've researched Lucky, is there any reason to lynch Adorable/bob over midway?

[Morning Tweet]

If you are town, you deserve to lose. So does Wake. So does anyone else who believes that the jailkeeper existed

for no fucking reason

.

Thanks dude. I didnt get the argument for JKer confirming you. I'm sorry that you feel we should lose over it

Pedit: If midway and you are both town this game is just over. I don't think it's likely at all though

Pedit2: It's alright. I've never really been any good at flame wars, though. If we win this, does that make it up to you that I fucked up today

[Morning Tweet]

pls nobody vote yet as clidd said -- I'd like to take some time today, theres no reason to rush ≧ω≦

I would like to be properly sure of this lynch, and reasonably sure of the next one

[Morning Tweet]

that same argument is pretty much why you're scum in my eyes. I'm more concerned with your partner today than anything. I'm thinking most likely Adorable as well, but there's also the chance that you're scum with Bob so that's why he voted Adorable first the other day

If it's actually Bob/Adorable, i dont even know what to say to that. I'll still explore the option since I wrote it off quickly and i have a tendency to not go back over reads ive already made

[Morning Tweet]

boi if MT isn't scum, then you/ador are scum

Okay, so the bob/Lucky and profii/Lucky team are crossed out, bob/profii are also probably crossed out, which leaves left for me are bob/MT and profii/MT.

Both of your arguments boil down to "Well, I'm town, so Morning is scum". It's like you're backed into a corner and you have no choice but to pull the "Well it's not me so it's you" card. But you dont have anything else to say, probably because you don't actually scumread me

if either of you is town, please think about the argument you're making and the argument the other person is making. If one of you is town and theres scum in {Bob, clidd}, likely bob, then this game is just lost if you dont reconsider that mindset. Actually try to find the scum and show why they're scum. and then i can find you ! (*≧∀≦*)

[Morning Tweet]

VOTE: mid

[Morning Tweet]

YES!!!!ADORBS IM SOFCUKJINGH APPPY

[Morning Tweet]

That was an emotional rollercoaster of a game for me. i am exhausted (；一ω一||)

ill give all my thoughts out later today!

[Morning Tweet]

oh where do i start. sorry for getting so excited there

I am not built to play scum. my heart cannot handle the stress!! I got voted twice on day one (one was by my partner =,=) and already began panicking. I guess it didn't show up in the main thread too much, but I was always open about how I was feeling in the scum chat (￣ω￣〃) it's embarrassing

i can't blame Chem for losing motivation. The pressure on them grew until it was pretty much insurmountable. After they were lynched and I lost Cat as well, the stress while playing actually went away pretty much entirely. If my partner dies, I'm not going to be able to kill and we lose. If I die, I'm gonna give clear every player in my neighbourhood as innocent. There's not a lot of hope right now, so i can just try and have fun. So I neighbourized Hectic and told him he's my mason buddy!!

Accidentally killed the player cursing me to neighbourize -- that was lucky. Accidentally killed the rolecop who would have confirmed Lucky as town -- that was even luckier. One really bad quickhammer later and we did it! Somehow.

For a while I assumed that after Lucky/dave was killed, i'd come next. I figured I was the expendable part of the team. Many non-lucky/dave lynches later, and it ended up not being that way. I had to take an active role, and it was scary at times

Holden totally tricked me with the way he responded to the PR claims. I thought profii was the most likely final PR because he suspected Wake so hard. My PR pool was {profii, bob, Holden}. I wasn't gunning for the PR in specific because I figured that'd start a war between Wake, dave, and I. But of course he was a rolecop with the ability to clear Dave!!!!! What a lucky kill. Avenged all the llamas too

Bob is the #1 player in the game who caused me the most panicking. His logic for Wake/Lucky/Me being town and final scum being within clidd/profii/Adorable was rock solid (besides the me being town part), and it made me feel like I was going to have to go along with it and bus Adorbs / lynch profii. He would have had a perfect solve if he had realized that a scum neighbourizer would make the town neighbourizer enabler not negative. I ended up not having to bus adorbs because the majority of the game just felt like a PR had to be scum. Had we left Hectic alive it mightve been a different story

Lucky is second place on the panic charts. I thought he was really obviously town. I ended up just writing things that I townread him for and calling them scumreads. Dave's exit from the game I felt also screamed town. But when I finally came to realize that the thread trusted me, Lucky -> midway was the path with least resistance. All I had to do was bs a case on Lucky. And it wasn't good

Since we're still chatting, care to explain why midway --> Lucky --> bob was losing if Lucky --> midway --> bob is winning?

Right before Lucky died, he caught one of the random lies I used to make my reasoning for lynching him first sound genuine. I had no idea how to answer him here. He was onto me!

[Morning Tweet]

Adorbs was essential to us winning. I was all over the place emotionally. Bob posts about this n that -> I freak out about it -> Adorbs tells me to chill. Probably happened multiple times. she was a very good at counteracting how volatile i was sometimes. She did a good job of keeping bob on the radar too, which was crucial after they 1v1'd. She also talked me into killing Hectic, which was definitely the right choice it was just difficult for me. I couldn't ask for a better scumpartner !

pedit: it's all good Cat!

[Morning Tweet]

The problem I had with Bob is that I couldn't feel confident in what he was saying. There was a period when he did a mechanical spam that I honestly found incomprehensible.

Thats fair -- I was definitely freaking out internally because I knew he was on the right track. in hindsight though, it was easier for me to get his points because I had some insider knowledge

Hope you all had fun! This was my first time modding in at least five years, and although I fell behind at times I feel like it went alright. Good game!

the modding was great, no problems. thank you Klick!